asked the Minister of Works for what purpose some 5,000 feet super of accommodation in Fanum House, New Coventry Street, London, W.1, has been held under requisition but unused for four months despite repeated requests of owners for its release.

The vacant space was retained to accommodate the British Commonwealth Scientific Office, for which no other suitable accommodation could be found, but alternative premises have now been obtained and the major part of the vacant space is being released to the owners. The remainder is required for Admiralty staffs who will shortly be taking occupation.

As there has already been such a long delay, can the right hon. Gentleman say when this vacant space will be released to the owners?

I think fairly quickly.

asked the Minister of Works if, in view of the continuing public interest in the proceedings of Parliament and the large numbers of people seeking access to the galleries of the House, he will consider the possibility of erecting temporary additional galleries during the Recess at the south end of the present Chamber.

The work involved in constructing temporary galleries would be considerable and there would not be time to carry it out during the Recess. In order to do so it would have been necessary to have all the preparatory work completed so that operations could start as soon as the House adjourned. Moreover, such an erection would provide only a limited number of additional seats and would greatly detract from the amenities of the Chamber.

Is my right hon. Friend aware of the enormous amount of time spent by hon. Members sitting in a queue awaiting tickets for their constituents and others, and will he consult with the authorities of the House to see if there is any way of easing this position?

I am prepared to give due consideration to methods to deal with the matter but the suggestion put forward is not one that would be welcome to the House generally.

In view of the enormous crowds that wait patiently outside, would my right hon. Friend consider cutting through tradition and red tape and making available these galleries which lie vacant about 95 per cent. of the time? Could they not be available to the public if not claimed by 4.30 p.m., or some such time?

It does not lie with me to make that decision.

asked the Minister of Works whether he is aware that the housing programme of the city of Stoke-on-Trent corporation is being disorganised by the inadequate supplies of cement available to the public works department; and what steps are being taken to improve the position, bearing in mind the abnormal requirements arising from mining subsidence.

I am aware that the corporation have not received their requirements in full, but I have arranged for the supply to be increased and my regional officers will continue to give the Corporation all possible assistance.

asked the Minister of Health the total standards of timber imported and produced in this country over the most recent convenient period; and what proportion was allocated to the housing programme.

In the three months April to June, 1947, supplies of imported and home-produced softwood for all essential purposes totalled 197,275 standards. Of this some 84,000 standards were allotted to housing work.

Could the hon. Gentleman tell us how much of that timber was imported from Russia?

Not without notice.

asked the Secretary of State for Foreign Affairs what arrangements are made for the maintenance in Germany of wives of prisoners of war held in this country and the Middle East.

None, Sir.

Is that not an additional argument for sending all prisoners of war home as rapidly as possible?

asked the Secretary of State for Foreign Affairs how many persons are engaged in Germany in dealing with applications for the com passionate release of German prisoners of war; whether these members of the staff of the Control Commission have other duties as well; and whether, owing to the hardship inflicted by the long delay in dealing with cases, he will revise the machinery set up, with the object of making it efficient for its purpose.

This work is very largely in the hands of the German local authorities, and we are endeavouring to speed up their arrangements. The main reason why there is delay, however, is that the quota of 500 a month is filled, so that many have to wait. I am glad to say that this quota will be increased to 1,500 a month in October, and that we shall be sending back 2,000 extra cases in the next three months in order to clear off the backlog.

asked the Minister of Food the amount of milk output in Great Britain in 1938 and 1946, respectively, and the proportions used in each case for liquid consumption, manufactured foodstuffs and other manufactured goods.

One thousand, two hundred and ten million gallons of milk were sold off farms in Great Britain in 1938 and 1,424 million gallons in 1946. Of these quantities 845 million gallons were used for liquid consumption in 1938 and 1,265 million gallons in 1946. Three hundred and sixty-five million gallons were manufactured into food products in 1938 and 159 million gallons in 1946. No whole milk was used for other manufactured goods but some 8 million gallons of skim milk were used before the war in the manufacture of casein for industrial purposes.

Is my right hon. Friend aware of the widespread impression that a great proportion of milk is used today to manufacture such articles as buttons and umbrella handles, as in the case of 1938?

I welcome the opportunity of saying that none is used for such purposes.

Do the figures the Minister has given refer to the quantities used in Great Britain or in the United Kingdom?

I have "Great Britain" on my paper, but I will look into that.

asked the Minister of Food whether he will arrange for compensation to be paid to potato growers in Cornwall whose early potatoes were left unmarketed owing to circumstances over which they had no control.

asked the Minister of Food whether, in view of the losses sustained by the Cornish farmers in relation to their early potato crop, owing to circumstances over which they had no control, he will arrange for adequate compensation.

I cannot agree that any compensation should be paid; most of the early crop has been cleared and there is a local market for the rest, which should be cleared by mid-September.

May I ask the Minister whether or not he has received the letter I sent him, and, if he has received it, will he reconsider this matter in view of the specific details I wrote to him on the subject?

Yes, I have received the hon. Member's letter and the enclosure, but the enclosure is not accurate. We have extended the period in view of the difficult weather conditions we have encountered, of which his correspondent did not seem aware, and in general I think we have met these growers pretty fairly.

asked the Minister of Food if he will give details of the arrangements for grants which have been, or are being, offered to Australia and other Dominions through the Oversea Food Corporation, or otherwise, to finance the expansion of particular types of food production.

None, Sir. His Majesty's Government in the United Kingdom will, however, welcome any further steps which can be taken in other countries of the Commonwealth to secure increased production of the foodstuffs needed by this country, and there have been preliminary discussions between the Ministry of Food and representatives of the Australian Government regarding possible developments. The question how such developments should be financed has not so far been discussed.

Does the answer of the Minister mean that the statement, or message, from a Melbourne correspondent in "The Times" last Wednesday about a £50 million grant for particular purchases of particular goods has any foundation whatever?

I read that despatch with interest, and indeed pleasure to find that our Australian friends were keen, but it was a little premature in view of the fact that the Overseas Food Corporation is not yet set up.

asked the Minister of Food if he is aware that lorry loads of perishable foods such as plums, apples and cauliflowers are being refused in large city markets with the view of keeping up prices; that producers are being compelled to carry tons of these goods back to their warehouses unsold; and if he will take action so that the public will have the opportunity to purchase these foods at open market prices and avoid this waste of transport, labour and produce.

Certainly fruit and vegetables are now in heavy supply, and the only way in which these supplies can be cleared is by rapid and substantial reductions in retail prices. Retail prices have, of course, fallen greatly since the very high levels of last spring. For instance, cauliflowers were selling at is. 3¾d. a lb. in the middle of April, and are now selling at 6d. to 6½d. a lb. which is below last year's controlled price. Similarly cabbage was is. 1¼d. a lb., and is now 4½d. a lb. on average. But, as I recently told a conference of the wholesale and retail trade, even these reductions in price are not enough if they do not suffice to clear the market, and I strongly advised them to reduce prices still further. Moreover, in order to encourage them to do so, I have, as already announced, decided to allow anyone who likes to enter the greengrocery retail trade without need of a licence as from 1st September next, and to the greatest extent practicable to free entry into the wholesale trade also.

Is my right hon. Friend aware that I am very much obliged for the splendid reply he has given to this Question? Is there any possible way to help a producer when he takes a load to Manchester or Sheffield and cannot sell that load on the spot but has to take it back to Cambridgeshire or some other place?

My right hon. Friend raises an important problem, but I think the best way in which we can deal with it quickly today is to open the trade both on the wholesale, and above all, on the retail side to the maximum number of competitors.

May I ask whether the confession that free competition reduces prices should not be followed by other Departments?

It is not a confession. [HON. MEMBERS: "It is a fact."] It is an announcement, which has already been made, that the wartime system—not set up by this Government—by which these trades had to have ring fences put round them so that nobody could get into them, is not a desirable thing, and, in the long run, leads to unpleasant private enterprise monopolies.

Does that mean that by opening the retail trade, when there are allocations these retailers will get the same facilities in regard to imported fruit as he is going to grant in regard to home grown fruit?

Yes, Sir.

Is the Minister at this time importing any of these articles from foreign countries?

I do not know what articles the hon. Member has in mind.

Fruit and vegetables—peaches, and things of that sort?

Some peaches, of course.

Is my right hon. Friend aware that if all producers got together and adopted marketing schemes instead of asking the State to do everything for them they would be better off?

We are getting a bit too wide of the Question.

asked the Minister of Food what proportion of the total out put of eggs produced in Great Britain passes through packing stations licensed by his Department.

About 70 per cent. of the estimated production of eggs from agricultural holdings for the year ended 31st May, 1947, was sent to licensed packing stations.

Is the Minister satisfied that this proportion of 70 per cent. is as high as it should or could be?

We have, of course, to allow for the fact that some eggs are consumed in the households of producers, and that some are used for hatching, but we should like to keep the proportion as high as possible.

asked the Minister of Food in view of the critical situation what steps he is now taking to increase purchases of feedingstuffs in order to stimulate meat, milk and egg production in this country.

We have already succeeded in buying much more feedingstuffs than we were able to get last year. As the House knows this has already enabled my right hon. Friend the Minister of Agriculture to increase the livestock rations. We shall buy more feedingstuffs as they are available. We are also taking very active steps to get the quantities already bought shipped to this country, which has been a difficult matter.

Is the Minister aware that to enable agriculture to respond to the Prime Minister's appeal, it is essential that he should be more successful than in the past in purchasing feedingstuffs or, alternatively, to hand it over to private enterprise?

Can the Minister say whether arrangements have now been made to secure the 500,000 tons of wheat offals from Canada arising from our wheat agreement with her, in that we take so much of it in flour? Has that been secured?

No, Sir. By far the greater part of the wheat under the Canadian wheat contract, comes here in the form of wheat, not flour, and the offals are, therefore, available.

Does the Minister realise that there is urgency in this matter; that the increase announced recently by the Minister of Agriculture does not touch the fringe of the problem, and that much more imports are required before we can get the pigs, bacon and eggs we require to reach the Prime Minister's target?

I am sure that the whole Government realise that there is no more urgent problem for agriculture than this. Fortunately, larger quantities of feedingstuffs are at last becoming available in the world, but the cereal shortage in the world is by no means over. We cannot get as much as we should like by any means.

asked the Minister of Transport if he will state the number of serviceable locomotives in operation on the four main line railways and the number of serviceable wagons, including private owners, available for freight traffic, at the nearest convenient date and in 1944 and 1938; and by what percentages do freight tonnage weekly averages in 1947 compare with 1944 and 1938.

My right hon. Friend is having this information prepared and will arrange for a statement to be circulated in the OFFICIAL REPORT as soon as possible.

Is my hon. Friend aware that railway freight tonnages have dropped by 19 per cent. compared with what they were three years ago, that this has meant a reduced demand for locomotives and railway wagons, and that to that extent the railway transport system has been considerably eased? Is he also aware that an important contributory factor to the transport problem is the present inadequate control of the movement of traffic, which leads to prolonged delays to freight trains and other trains, and thus reduces the efficiency of transport operations? Will my hon. Friend look into that side of the transport problem?

I can assure my hon. Friend that these matters are being looked into very carefully indeed to provide the maximum efficiency in transport services in the coming winter.

asked the Minister of Transport whether he is aware that, owing to the disparity between omnibus and railway fares, many short-distance trains are lightly loaded; and whether he will arrange a more flexible basis of charges so that in appropriate circumstances reduction in the standard railway fares may be applied.

Differences in fares are only one of the factors affecting the distribution of traffic between omnibus and local train services. While there are various types of rail fares designed to meet the needs of different classes of users, including fares below the appropriate standard, local departures from the normal basis of any type of fare create difficulties in relation to other parts of the same railway system. As regards the future system of charges I would refer my hon. Friend to the reply to a Question by the hon. Member for Louth (Mr. Osborne), on 28th July.

While I appreciate the difficulties of arriving at such an arrangement, may I ask my hon. Friend if he does not realise that, while there are queues waiting for buses, many short distance trains are running comparatively lightly loaded; and that it ought not to be an insuperable problem to use both methods of transport in the public interest?

Yes, Sir. I appreciate that, but local variations in train fares are very difficult indeed. The whole problem will, of course, be gone into by the British Transport Commission.

asked the Minister of Transport what steps have recently been taken to obtain the maximum consultation and co-operation between management and staff on day-to-day problems on British railways; and with what results.

Arrangements have been made for meetings, on an area, district, or divisional basis, between representatives of the local departmental committees, the sectional councils, the trade unions and the companies' officers. Difficulties under which the railways are working are discussed and suggestions for dealing with them are considered. It is as yet too early to assess the results but my right hon. Friend is confident that co-operation of this kind between the staff and the management will be of the greatest advantage.

Does my hon. Friend recognise that meetings of this kind are widely welcomed by the staff concerned, and that their use will be invaluable to the transport system and the general economy of the country, if they are fully utilised and the workers brought into consultation on a day-to-day basis?

Yes, Sir.

asked the Minister of Transport the expenditure which is to be incurred in the next two years in improving the railways, detailing in particular the amount of money which will be spent on electrification.

My right hon. Friend is making inquiries and will inform the hon. Member of the result.

Will the hon. Gentleman bear in mind that up to date there is not a single yard of electric railway in Scotland?

asked the Minister of Transport whether he is aware that the transport of herring by rail is now slower than at any time during the war; that it frequently takes over 48 hours for the fish to reach the South markets from Fraserburgh and Peterhead; and whether he is taking any steps to improve matters, in view of the loss of valuable food involved.

My right hon. Friend regrets that it has not been possible to complete his inquiries in the time available but he will communicate with the hon. Member as soon as possible.

Will the hon. Gentleman bear in mind that trains get away from Fraserburgh and Peterhead on time, and usually from Aberdeen? It is only as they approach England that the trouble begins.

On a point of Order. Before this Question is asked I wish to put this to you, Mr. Speaker: I had always understood that the use of epithets in Questions on the Order Paper was out of Order. This Question contains the epithet "hostile propagandists." Surely, that is out of Order, according to that rule?

If such a provocative adjective is used, which I always understood was against your ruling, Mr. Speaker, should not the word "truthful" have been used instead of hostile?

I cannot think that "hostile propagandists" is out of Order. It really explains exactly what the hon. Member means by his Question.

Surely, the word "hostile" does, in fact, imply an insinuation or, indeed a misrepresentation. If it was either an insinuation or a misrepresentation, would it be in Order?

I suppose one might just as well say "opposition propagandists."

Is not that the sole intention of it—to be hostile—and nothing else?

Mr. Driberg.

Question No. 21.

I think that the statement my right hon. Friend made on 5th August in announcing the increase in railway charges sufficiently indicated the true causes of the need for such an increase and it received wide publicity. I will, however, bear my hon. Friend's suggestion in mind.

While disclaiming any intention of being a hostile propagandist, may I ask the hon. Gentleman whether he is aware that as regards reduction in prices there is no difference in principle between a free railway system and a free vegetable market?

Will the hon. Gentleman give an undertaking that public money will not be spent in putting forward the views of the fatuous propagandists on the Government benches? May I have an answer to that question?

Public money will only be spent in putting forward the facts when the public desire to have the facts and it is desirable that they should have them.

Is it not quite clear that this increase is due to the Government's policy of inflation, whether or not that policy is consciously adopted by the Chancellor of the Exchequer?

No, I do not accept that at all.

rose——

Mr. Cooper.

On a point of Order, Mr. Speaker. May I point out that there are only 31 Questions on the Order Paper.

The hon. Member does not know how many Private Notice Questions there may be.

asked the Minister of Supply when he anticipates being able to give a further report on the development of the Tudor I, II and IV aircraft; and when it is anticipated that any of these designs will be ready for delivery to the airways corporations, with a view to them being put into service.

A fully modified Tudor I is expected to be ready for official flight trials about the end of September. If the trials are satisfactory, some Tudor I and Tudor IV aircraft should be ready for final delivery to the operators by the end of the year and Tudor II early in 1948. A Tudor IV aircraft, flown by British South American Airways, has recently returned to this country from a successful proving flight to Jamaica.

Does my right hon. Friend realise the tremendous amount of public interest in the development and design of our new civil aircraft, and could he give more publicity to the development that takes place, as his Department seems to be very impressed at present with the need to keep these things secret?

No, Sir. On the contrary, only last week I had a very representative Press conference to give the fullest information about the very excellent progress being made in civil aviation.

In view of the recent successful proving flight to which the Minister referred, would he now say if British Overseas Airways Corporation are going to have these aeroplanes which they would not take before?

The aeroplane which went to Jamaica is specially designed for the South Atlantic. The Tudor I is a North Atlantic plane.

Would either of these planes come to Perth in any circumstances?

I should think so—and back.

asked the Minister of Supply (1) how many baths have been imported from France; what price they cost; and at what price they were retailed;

It is expected that sufficient baths will be made in this country during the next year to meet essential requirements as estimated by the Ministry of Works. Two thousand three hundred and seventy-nine baths were imported from France, at a cost of £14 each, for the temporary housing programme. Licences have also been issued for the import of 4,000 Hungarian baths.

How can the right hon. Gentleman reconcile the importation of baths at £14 each with the fact that during the six months to June, 1947, we exported 3,000 at £8 each?

The baths at £8 each are low priced baths of good quality produced under Government control. The baths which are being imported are more expensive—they are being sold by private enterprise.

How can the right hon. Gentleman reconcile the importation of these baths with the fact that there is a large quantity of baths in huts and disused aerodromes which could be used, and, in view of the estimate of the Ministry of Works, what is the target for housing?

I have given the number of baths which the Ministry of Works estimate will be necessary to meet essential requirements.

How does my right hon. Friend account for the fact that an allocation of steel for making pressed steel baths has been refused by his Department when, if it was permitted, we could increase our export of baths to a very considerable extent and manufacture far in excess of our own requirements?

We are short of steel. These baths from Hungary help to relieve the shortage of steel as well as to stimulate trade between the two countries.

Will the right hon. Gentleman consult with his colleagues, the Minister of Health and the Minister of Fuel and Power, respectively, to see if we have enough houses in which to put the baths and enough hot water to fill them?

In view of the fact that the Minister of Food has refused extra soap for children under two years of age, would not the Minister consider giving extra baths so that the children can be properly cleaned?

Is the right hon. Gentleman aware that the firm to whom his Department has given authority to import the Hungarian baths have no warehouse and, therefore, how do they propose to distribute the baths when they arrive?

This was the only firm that applied for an import licence.

asked the Minister of Agriculture the amount of the feeding-stuff rations allowed for 100 laying hens in October, 1945, July, 1947, and October, 1947, assuming that the farm qualified for the full basic rates.

The specified fraction of the basic number of poultry eligible for rations and the acreage deduction have varied according to the supplies of feedingstuffs available. The number of birds eligible for rations on any one farm would not be exactly 100 in all the three months mentioned. If the Question means what were the rations in each of the months mentioned for a holding registered as having 100 poultry in 1939, assuming that the holding was not subject to acreage deduction in any of these months, the answer is: October, 1945, and October, 1947, 1 cwt.; July, 1947, 1¼ cwt.

If I may attempt to disentangle that complicated answer, does it mean that in fact the man with 100 birds will get less feedingstuffs in October than he is getting now?

As the hon. Member will appreciate, there was a very serious reduction last year. The new increase which has just been made means that his increased ration for October of this year will be based on one-fifth of the poultry he had in the 1939 period as against one-eighth.

It is still going to be rather less than last time?

No, rather more.

Cutting through that rather unintelligible cackle, is it not a fact that the number of poultry has declined by two million since this Government came into power?

asked the Minister of Agriculture whether he is in a position to announce the increase in agricultural prices; or when the announcement will be made.

My right hon. Friend the Minister expects to make an announcement before the end of August.

Will the Parliamentary Secretary say what farmers are to do with this year's crop of oats, wheat and barley which they have already threshed, before the price is announced?

I am afraid that has nothing whatever to do with the Question which I answered.

Will the hon. Gentleman bear in mind the importance of getting his announcement out early before the end of August, to enable the necessary grassland to be sown for the change-over in production?

Yes, most certainly As the hon. Member will appreciate, there is a meeting pending on 19th August

Can the Parliamentary Secretary say whether the total of these increases is going to equal the total additional cost to the industry, or will this be like last year and only go part of the way?

I think the hon. Gentleman had better await the announcement.

Is the Parliamentary Secretary aware that some of the best farmers in the country have stated to me personally in my own Division that they are quite able to pay the increased wages without any increase on present prices?

asked the Minister of Agriculture whether, in order to increase agricultural production at home, he will issue guidance to his committees that applications to be permitted to remain as civilian farmworkers on holdings in this country from German prisoners of war due for repatriation, shall receive favourable consideration.

The instructions already issued by my Department provide for favourable consideration to be given to applications from billeted German prisoners of war to remain as civilian farm workers in cases where the conditions of the scheme are complied with, and I am not aware that committees are in need of further guidance.

Is it not absolute folly to refuse applications for work on farms at present when we are short of dollars and short of food?

Is the Parliamentary Secretary aware that similar applications made by Italian prisoners of war were not considered until after those men had been repatriated, and would he prevent the same mistake from being made in respect of the Germans.

The existing provisions already allow for that. Wherever a German prisoner of war is billeted, it is open to the farmer to make application for him to be allowed to remain as a civilian.