asked the Minister of Health whether he is aware of the long waiting list for hearing aids; and whether he will exempt from liability to make any payment for hearing aids all those people who have made applications and are still awaiting their supply.

As I mentioned on Second Reading of the National Health Service Bill, it is not proposed to charge for hearing aids.

I am much obliged to the right hon. Gentleman. He will be aware, of course, that the Question was put down before the Second Reading of the Bill, and we are grateful for even that little concession.

asked the Minister of Health the average period of time which now elapses or is expected to elapse between an application for a Medresco hearing aid and its being supplied.

The waiting period varies according to the patient's priority and local circumstances, and an average figure is not calculable.

But is the right hon. Gentleman aware that in Manchester, in spite of the fact that there is a devoted organisation which is extremely helpful about every case I send, there is a long delay—in many cases much more than 12 months—and can he do something about that and also tell us what is happening about the induction hearing aids?

Questions dealing with Manchester ought to be on the Paper. Obviously I cannot carry in my mind what happens in every city in the country. It is quite true that there is considerable delay and there are further Questions about it on the Order Paper today.

Could the right hon. Gentleman say whether many inroads are being made into the waiting list, or is it still keeping to its high figure?

If the right hon. Gentleman looks at the Order Paper, he will see that this also is coming up later.

Can my right hon. Friend say whether he is giving further thought to the possibility of financial aid to deaf people so that they can buy alternative makes of hearing aids?

That again is to be answered today.

asked the Minister of Health if he is aware that there is about two years' delay in the supply of National Health Service hearing aids; that hearing aids at a cost of £41 are immediately available; and if he will take steps to regulate the production and distribution of all hearing aids.

I know that there is still considerable delay in supplying patients with aids under the National Health Service, but the rate of distribution of Medresco aids has been steadily increasing and is now higher than ever before. The answer to the last part of the Question is, "No, Sir."

Arising from this, may I ask a question concerning a business woman who purchased one of these hearing aids two years ago at a cost of £10—she was not able to get one free—and who now finds that she is unable to get any batteries for it and is only offered one of these £41 aids, which is the only alternative choice? She cannot wait two years for a further hearing aid. What steps can she take if she cannot afford £41?

That does not seem to arise out of the Question. The hon. Member has quoted a particular case, and I must ask notice of it.

Did I not send the Minister details of this case only within the last week or two and ask him for information about it?

Could not the individual concerned go to another firm and get another type of hearing aid?

asked the Minister of Health the number of outstanding applications for hearing aids at the time that the National Health Service Bill was presented to the House.

About 94,000.

Now that the Minister has seen fit, due to great public agitation, to withdraw the mean charges to which these victims were subjected, will he also withdraw the other mean charges which we are to discuss on the Bill this afternoon?

asked the Minister of Health if he is aware that Mrs. Brunsdon, of 54 Brynmon Park, Compton, Plymouth, who has been on the waiting list for a hearing aid since August, 1950, at the South Devon and East Cornwall Hospital, informed the hospital on 22nd January, 1952, that her husband had had a severe stroke, and that she was unable to communicate with him; that the hospital ignored her repeated applications; and if he will ensure that, in future hospitals give consideration to cases of this sort.

I have made inquiries, and regret the delay which I understand occurred following Mr. Brunsdon's illness. I must, however, rely on hospitals to use their own discretion in giving priority, and they do usually take into account exceptional circumstances of this kind.

Is the Minister aware that in fact Mrs. Brunsdon lost her husband and was unable to communicate with him before his death, that she had warned the hospital that this might happen and that the hospital in March gave her the explanation that she has no longer a priority, presumably because she has no one to speak to as she is living alone? Will my right hon. Friend ensure that those in this hospital concerned with similar cases are not only more efficient, but treat similar cases with more consideration and understanding?

Of course, if those were the facts I would entirely agree with my hon. Friend, but I have a different version of the facts. I am informed that although Mr. Brunsdon has died, his widow has not lost her priority but that she is going to be fitted within the next two or three weeks.

Is my right hon. Friend aware that the last communication the hospital made to this lady was exactly opposite to what he has stated?

There seems to be a conflict of evidence here which cannot be straightened out during Question time.

asked the Minister of Health if the detailed investigation into the costs of feeding patients in hospitals under the control of the South-West Metropolitan Regional Hospital Board have yet been completed and with what result.

No, Sir. The investigations are still proceeding.

Does the right hon. Gentleman appreciate that it is six weeks since he said that there was to be an investigation into the formidable cost of provisioning? Does he not think that is an undue length of time in view of the rapidly increasing prices?

No, we want a thorough investigation and shall have to analyse the results when we get them.

asked the Minister of Health what powers exist under his regulations to obtain the deletion from the patient's record card of a libellous statement.

I think this is scarcely a matter to be dealt with by regulation. Perhaps the hon. Member might like to send me particulars of any case he has in mind.

asked the Minister of Health whether he will now increase the weekly pocket-money of 5s., as laid down in his regulations, retained out of their old age pensions by residents in old peoples' homes.

asked the Minister of Health if he will introduce regulations to enable local authorities to increase the amount of spending money to old people in hostels under their control.

This matter will need to be considered in connection with the proposals now being worked out for increasing rates of retirement pensions and other National Insurance benefits.

Would the right hon. Gentleman give an assurance that, whenever the pension rate is increased, some part of the increase will be added to the meagre pocket-money of these old people? Is he further aware that these people have a claim to our sympathy at least equal to that of Surtax payers, who will get their benefit much more promptly than will old people?

asked the Minister of Health in view of the fact that some 8,000 persons in the United Kingdom suffering from tuberculosis are awaiting admission to sanatoria, if he will consider sending some of these cases to sanatoria in Switzerland where there are many vacant beds and where the cost per bed compares favourably with the cost in this country.

One hundred and thirty sanatorium beds in Switzerland are already being used in this way, and I am not satisfied that it would be justifiable to increase this number in present circumstances.

Is the right hon. Gentleman aware that owing to the long waiting lists, the time between diagnosis and admission is up to nine months throughout the country, and that even in Birmingham, where we pride ourselves on being well advanced in the treatment of tuberculosis, there is a three months waiting list? Surely, with beds empty in Switzerland, it would cost no more to this country to send people there?

I think the hon. Gentleman is a little pessimistic. The bed situation is nothing like as bad as he suggests. As a matter of fact it has sometimes been found that, by the time a person has been selected and made ready to go to Switzerland, a bed is available in this country.

If the Minister thinks it an economic proposition to send 130, could he not try to send 1,030? In the long run, the saving made by stopping infection spreading throughout the country would represent an enormous economic advantage?

I hope that the Minister will be prepared to make inquiries into his own statement, because the chief T.B. officer for Birmingham has stated recently that the waiting period is three months in Birmingham, and up to nine months in the rest of the country.

asked the Minister of Health how many tuberculosis patients awaiting admission to sanatoria have been on those lists for more than 12 months in Monmouthshire and in Wales, respectively.

For sanatoria and tuberculosis hospitals, the figures are 27 in Monmouthshire and 125 in Wales, excluding Monmouthshire.

asked the Minister of Health how many people suffering from tuberculosis are on the waiting list for admission to sanatoria in Monmouthshire and in Wales, respectively.

The number waiting for admission to sanatoria and tuberculosis hospitals on 29th March was 182 in Monmouthshire and 759 in Wales, excluding Monmouthshire.

Can the Minister give any idea as to when he will be able to reduce this list, which I believe is growing monthly?

I have given the House the trend of the figures. I should like to see a Question on the Paper about the point raised by the hon. Member, which I cannot answer offhand.

asked the Minister of Health how many mentally defective children are waiting admission to homes; and if he will state the average length of time which these children have been waiting for such admission.

Statistics of children now awaiting admission to mental deficiency institutions will be available in a few weeks' time, and I will send my hon. Friend the information. I regret that figures are not available as to the average length of time on the waiting lists.

Will my right hon. Friend accept my assurance that there are many cases within my personal knowledge where the waiting time is up to four years?

I must admit that this is one of the most pressing and difficult problems of all those I have to study.

When the Minister is compiling his figures, will he give details of the length of time and the severity of the cases waiting for admission? Is he aware that there are many cases that have no right to be at home at all, that they are a danger to people in the home and a trouble to their parents, and that they have been waiting for as long as 18 months for admission to these homes?

asked the Minister of Health if he is aware of the disruption in home life caused by mentally defective children; and what steps he is taking to increase the institutional facilities.

Yes, Sir, and I am reviewing proposals of the regional hospital boards to increase institutional accommodation.

Will my right hon. Friend, if he has not had personal experience of what happens in these cases, try to obtain it so that he can appreciate to the full the distress which this kind of mental child causes in the home?

Will the right hon. Gentleman say what pressure he is putting on the regional hospital boards in this matter, because some of them do not feel that they can advance as quickly as they would like to do?

asked the Minister of Health the number of mentally defective children in the Sheffield Regional Hospital Board area requiring institutional accommodation.

Up-to-date figures will shortly be available, and I will send the information to the right hon. Member.

Is the right hon. Gentleman aware that it is reported that there is a hold-up in regard to children in this area needing this treatment? Is he aware that a great many have been waiting for years and years, and will he do what he can to help the Hospital Board to provide the accommodation so badly needed?

I have already referred to that this afternoon.

In view of the number of inquiries in Questions put to the Minister this afternoon, will he realise that this is a very urgent matter—a very serious matter—because, whatever the situation in Sheffield, I am given to understand on good authority that the position in Manchester is possibly still more serious?

Perhaps the hon. Member was not present, but I have already said this afternoon that I view this situation with grave concern.

I was present, but I could not get in.

asked the Minister of Health whether he will consider imposing charges for meals taken at hospitals by members of management committees and regional hospital boards on a similar basis to the charges levied on doctors and other staff.

No, Sir, but I would expect members taking meals at hospitals either to pay for them or refrain from claiming the normal subsistence allowances.

Is the Minister aware that, as a member of a regional hospital board, whenever I have a meal at a hospital I have to pay for it?

asked the Minister of Health what rate of pay is granted to a member of the N.H.S. Reserve during the annual 48-hour refresher course.

Trained nurses are paid at the rates appropriate to their grades under Whitley Council agreements. Nursing auxiliaries are paid 1s. 10d. an hour for part-time service and receive free meals on duty. If employed full-time they are paid the appropriate proportion of a full-time salary of £225 a year, assuming they have had no previous full-time service as a nursing auxiliary.

Would my right hon. Friend agree that 2s. 9d. an hour is about the average rate for refresher courses, and since it is, if anything, a little below the rate earned by charwomen, does he think that it is adequate?

All I can say is that the National Hospital Service Reserve is the only one of the Civil Defence services which pays its members for refresher courses.

That is not the point.

asked the Minister of Health what proportion of hospital pay-beds are normally occupied.

Complete information is not available, but I understand that the proportion of these beds occupied by paying patients varies so greatly in different hospitals that no average figure would have any value.

Does my right hon. Friend appreciate that the regulations of his Department which demand that the charges should cover the entire costs of these beds are such that a great many people cannot afford to use them? Will he consider allowing off the total charge their normal cost in the ward?

I should like to see that question on the Paper.

Is the right hon. Gentleman aware that it would be more in the nature of a comprehensive National Health Service if the pay-bed system were entirely abolished?

That was not the view of the previous Government; nor is it mine.

asked the Minister of Health if the use of the Leeds Regional Hospital Board's car for other than hospital board work has now ceased; what views were expressed by the auditors upon this irregular use; and what surcharge has been made upon the member of this hospital board who so used the car.

The auditor drew attention in a report dated 8th March, 1951, to the use of the car for purposes other than National Health Service duties and expressed the view that the cost of these journeys was not a proper charge on Exchequer funds. This use of the car has now ceased. There is no power of surcharge in circumstances of this kind.

Will my right hon. Friend point out to this Regional Hospital Board that money spent extravagantly and illegally like this means less money for spending on the treatment, cure and prevention of disease?

asked the Minister of Health whether inquiries into the claims of Mr. Rees Evans for curing cancer have now been concluded; and when a report may be expected, in view of the long delay that has already occurred.

Yes, Sir. I am considering the committee's report, but I am not yet ready to make a statement.

Will the report be published when the right hon. Gentleman has studied it?

I could not say today.

asked the Minister of Health what significant increases there have been in the incidence of dermatitis traceable to the use of branded detergents and soap substitutes.

I have no information of any significant increases of this kind.

Are any measures in prospect for establishing standards of detergents and other of these cleansing agents?

I should like to see that question on the Paper. I do not even know whether it is my responsibility or that of one of my colleagues.

asked the Minister of Health the average cost of a National Health Service prescription in each of the five years, 1948 to 1952.

The approximate average cost in England and Wales in the second half of 1948 was 2s. 8½d. In the years 1949 and 1950, it was 3s. and 3s. 2½d., respectively. Complete figures for 1951 are not yet available, but the average cost is estimated to be 3s. 8d. No figures are available for 1952.

asked the Minister of Health how many National Health Service prescriptions were dispensed in the month of January in the years 1949, 1950, 1951 and 1952, respectively.

The figures for England and Wales are 18,343,000; 19,892,000; 28,917,000 and 20,799,000, respectively.

asked the Minister of Health how many hospitals beds are available for general medical practitioners to look after their own patients not requiring specialist treatment; and to what extent this number has increased since the end of last year.

The returns from hospital authorities show 6,982 beds at 31st December, 1951. I regret that I have no later figure than this.

Is the Minister aware that in the statement of Tory policy issued by the Conservative Party and published for the General Election of October, 1951, these words appear on page 30:

"The general practitioner should be able to take part in hospital work. Beds should be made available where he can look after those of his patients not requiring specialist treatment."

Can the right hon. Gentleman now confirm that Tory election promise and give an assurance that the Government will honour it?

I have already made statements on that subject before.

Answer.

In view of the thoroughly unsatisfactory nature of that reply, I beg to give notice that I shall raise this matter on the Adjournment at the earliest possible opportunity.

asked the Minister of Health whether he will study the diminution of dental decay achieved in certain American cities by the addition of fluorine to the drinking water supplies; and whether he will encourage similar measures in this country.

asked the Minister of Health what consideration has been given to the advisability of administering fluorine in public water supplies with the object of preventing dental caries in this country.

A scientific mission is at present in the United States studying this matter on behalf of Her Majesty's Government. The question whether similar measures should be taken in this country will be considered in the light of the mission's report.

Is the Minister aware that there are traces of fluorine in the wheat berry, if it is not spoiled by taking out the inner and outer husks? Will he use his influence with the Ministry of Food to give us a more satisfactory type of bread and then we shall not need fluorine in the drinking water?

Is my right hon. Friend aware that the suggestion of the medical profession that this would prevent the increase of decay amongst children's teeth was made in 1892? Does not my right hon. Friend think it is time we made some progress in this matter?

There is progress, in that since I have been in office a mission has been sent to the United States.

Is my right hon. Friend aware that I made the suggestion to his predecessor in 1944 and, in view of this delay and of the great shortage of dental surgeons, will he see that there are no more experiments but that we use the experience gained in other countries?

asked the Minister of Health if he is aware of the inadequacy of the residential accommodation for aged persons in need of care and attention in Stoke-on-Trent; and whether he will help the local authority to extend its present limited facilities and to carry out the provisions of the National Assistance Act, 1948.

I am aware that here, as in other places, there is a shortage of such accommodation. As soon as building resources allow, I will do all I can to help the provision of additional accommodation by the local authority.

As this application has been turned down on the grounds of shortage of steel, and as there is some hope of getting increased supplies towards the latter part of this year, may we expect a favourable reply when those supplies come to hand?

We shall have to see what happens then, but at present the allocation of steel for purposes of this kind is almost wholly for maintenance work.

Will the right hon. Gentleman bear in mind one important point, that if accommodation is not found for these aged and sick folk in this way they tend to find their way into local hospitals, which is very much more expensive and is the responsibility of the Minister?

asked the Minister of Health to what extent the shortage of steel is holding up work designed to provide extra accommodation for aged and sick persons, as required under the National Assistance Act, 1948.

The shortage of steel has had the inevitable effect of delaying work on a considerable number of schemes for providing accommodation under the National Assistance Acts.

Will the Minister satisfy himself that some other arrangement cannot be made in the case I cited about Stoke? It is only a modest amount of steel required to reinforce the concrete bases owing to mining subsidence—does the right hon. Gentleman understand the position?

Yes, but I am afraid the steel is just not available for this purpose now, and no one regrets it more than I do.

Is the right hon. Gentleman aware that the amount of steel required is very small both for the structure and also for radiators and things of that sort, and that it will be very much less than if he has to provide accommodation for old people elsewhere?

asked the Minister of Health how many children, whose health renders them unfit for normal education, are awaiting admission to hospitals or other institutions where they can get special treatment and education.

I regret that the information is not available.

Although he may not have specific figures, is the right hon. Gentleman aware of the seriousness of the problem, and can he say where the obstacles lie? Is it with his Department with the Treasury, with the regional hospital board, or in labour and materials?

Is it not a fact that the difficulty lies in insufficient accommodation, and is it not time that more buildings were put up to accommodate people?

I am quite aware how grievous the position is, but all the Question asked was for a figure, which is not available.

asked the Minister of Health the number of general practitioners in Great Britain who are receiving payments from the National Health Service.

At the 1st January, 1952, the number of general practitioners in Great Britain receiving payment from the National Health Service was 20,859.

Is the Minister aware that his answer means that the Danckwerts Award proposes to increase the income of doctors by £10 per week with £30 a week back money?

asked the Minister of Health what sum of money was paid in 1951, under the National Health Service, to general practitioners in Great Britain.

Figures for the calendar year are not available, but for the year ending 31st March, 1951, the total amount payable to general medical practitioners in Great Britain for work done under the National Health Service is estimated to have been £51,644,000.

Is the Minister aware that his answer indicates that the average income of the general practitioner from the National Health Service is £50 per week and, while nobody would object to making up the money received by rural doctors and those with small lists, there seems no justification for the amount proposed under the Danckwerts Award?

asked the Minister of Health (1) whether the negotiations on the redistribution of the central pool from which Health Service general practitioners are remunerated are actively proceeding; and how soon he expects them to be concluded;

(2) whether he will give an assurance that no additional payments into the general practitioners' central pool will be made, following the recent adjudication, unless or until full agreement has been reached upon redistribution and other matters referred to a Working Party.

The acceptance of the adjudicator's award was conditional on an agreement satisfactory to both sides being reached on a revised plan of distributing the central pool. Discussions are proceeding to produce a plan of distribution, but I cannot say when they will be concluded.

Is the right hon. Gentleman aware that his reply will help to clear up some misunderstanding which appears to exist, because it was part of the agreement which does not seem to have been generally understood that there should be this review of distribution as well as this adjudication on the size of the central pool, and that the two are quite inseparable?

asked the Minister of Health the average waiting time for patients needing hospital treatment at the latest available date.

The waiting time varies widely according to the nature of the case, and no useful average figures are therefore available.

asked the Minister of Health whether he will consider amending the rules governing the allocation of hospital beds for maternity cases in order that women who are unable to obtain home helps may be permitted to go to hospital for the birth of their children.

Hospital authorities have already been advised that adverse social conditions, which include lack of help at home, justify priority, next after medical need, for admission in hospital maternity beds.

Will the Minister include in that the particular case of Mrs. Cotton, of Bridge Farm, North Hill, and say why that principle has not been applied in her case?

I am afraid I have not heard of that particular case, but if my hon. Friend will let me have details I will look into it.

asked the Minister of Agriculture what further talks he has now had on the question of sheep-worrying by dogs; and what new proposals he has to try to secure better control of dogs in the countryside and to ensure that the existing law is more strictly enforced and, if possible, improved.

My right hon. and gallant Friend has had talks with the representatives of the animal welfare societies concerned. The conclusions will be announced as soon as possible.

Is the Minister aware that while there is obviously no easy solution to this problem, there is very little understanding by the general public of the great damage which has been done? In 1951 nearly 11,000 sheep were killed or injured by stray dogs, and the figures are going up steadily year by year. Will the hon. Gentleman give an assurance that his right hon. Friend will look at this matter with the greatest sympathy to see what can be done?

My right hon. and gallant Friend is well aware of the gravity of the problem. That is why he is taking this step, and he hopes to get some useful result.

Why is it that this problem has developed so recently? It did not exist to such a serious extent before the war.

Shortage of meat.

Is my hon. Friend aware that some farmers are being driven out of sheep rearing by the gravity of this menace from dogs, and does he realise that this situation is a real threat to food production?

asked the Minister of Agriculture if he will consider the appointment of a committee to examine the problem of starlings, with a view to suitable steps being taken to reduce the damage done by these birds.

A number of my right hon. and gallant Friend's colleagues are also concerned with this complex problem, and he will consult them and the Nature Conservancy about the most suitable procedure for examining it further.

Is not it a fact that many of the outbreaks of foot and mouth disease recently reported have been caused by migrant starlings?

That is probably so.

asked the Minister of Agriculture if he will reconsider his Department's request made to certain other Departments to effect the termination of their contracts for collection of pigswill by farmers licensed as processors since before 1945.

No, Sir. In the interests of animal health, swill from canteens and messes controlled by Government Departments is, whenever possible, centrally sterilised before being taken on to farms; and the results justify a continuation of this arrangement.

Instead of concentrating on animal swill, will my hon. Friend concentrate on starlings, and does he realise that great hardship is being caused to individual pig breeders by this recent withdrawal of their basic supplies?

I cannot accept that great hardship is being caused. Where a contract for the collection of swill is cut down, or the swill goes to a central processing plant, arrangements are made for the previous collector to get an equivalent quantity of processed swill.

asked the Minister of Agriculture on how many farm premises there has been more than one outbreak of foot-and-mouth disease during the last 12 months.

Three, Sir.

Is my hon. Friend satisfied that the interval of six weeks before the farmer can restock is long enough without risk of infection of neighbouring farms?

Yes, Sir. My right hon. Friend is satisfied that the period is long enough. The probability is that these secondary outbreaks have occurred through migrant birds.

asked the Minister of Agriculture what international machinery exists for discussion and implementing joint action here and on the Continent to combat foot and mouth disease.

The International Office of Epizootics, the Organisation for European Economic Co-operation and the Food and Agriculture Organisation of the United Nations are collaborating in this matter.

Can my hon. Friend say how actively they are collaborating on this matter, in view of the fact that many areas in the south of England, and particularly in south-east England nearest to the Continent, are obviously suffering, either through migrating birds or imported straw, from the results of what is now raging on the Continent, and will he have another look at the veterinary arrangements?

We are not in control of the veterinary arrangements in Europe. We are making our contribution through these bodies to bring this epidemic under control. More than that we cannot do.

Are these international organisations being given the funds they require to deal with these matters on an adequate scale?

We are making our proper contribution, and, indeed, we may take credit for our Chief Veterinary Officer, Sir Thomas Dalling, having been appointed as Chief Veterinary Consultant of the F.A.O.

Is there any scientific evidence that migrating birds are responsible for this disease? Surely there is a great danger of hysterical and hypothetical theories being formulated and blaming everything on an innocent party?

I think the probability is that migrating birds are responsible.

asked the Minister of Agriculture the number of farmers under supervision in the county of Kent at the nearest convenient date; and the number who have been dispossessed since the operation of the Agriculture Act, 1927.

On 29th February last 64 farmers in Kent were under supervision for husbandry and three others had been, or were being, dispossessed.

Can the Minister say how many of these farmers have been under supervision previously?

That is another question. If the hon. Member will put it on the Order Paper, I will give him details.

asked the Minister of Agriculture the full cost of collecting quarterly agricultural returns; and what was the cost of 4th June returns in 1938.

A large part of this work is carried out, as it was in 1938, by staff who are mainly employed on other duties. I regret therefore that estimates of the cost of collection are not available.

Does not my hon. Friend consider that the time has arrived when quarterly returns are unnecessary and that half-yearly returns would provide him with all the information he requires?

No, Sir. In the opinion of my right hon. and gallant Friend, the collection of quarterly returns is essential for the carrying out of our present farming policy.

May I ask how many returns are still outstanding eight weeks after Quarter Day has passed?

That is another question, and if my hon. Friend will put it on the Order Paper I will give him an answer.

asked the Minister of Agriculture the number employed by the statistical branch of his Department; and what was the number employed in the same branch in 1938.

There are 265 staff employed full-time in my right hon. and gallant Friend's Department on agricultural statistics, and 350 county staff employed for a small part of their time. In 1938 the number of staff employed full-time on such work was 51; there were also about 220 clerks employed for a few months each year and 305 part-time crop reporters.

May I ask if that includes staff employed down to district offices below county level?

That includes the whole staff employed.

Does that answer mean that none of the returns required from agriculturists in the country are ever to be reduced?

The only implication in that answer is that quarterly agricultural returns continue to be essential.

Is not the hon. Gentleman aware that in the inter-war years statistical returns were of little or no value, since there was no consideration at all given to agriculture, and unless the statistics were made available it would be quite impossible for the right hon. and gallant Gentleman to carry out his policy?

If the system of quarterly returns were abandoned, could the figures of staff be reduced even below the figure before the war?

I have already said that the collection of quarterly returns really is essential to carry out the present agricultural policy.

asked the Minister of Agriculture how far the reports he is receiving from the county agricultural executive committees show that there is a satisfactory response to the Government's offer of £5 an acre grant on grassland ploughed and cropped for this year's harvest.

My right hon. and gallant Friend has not called for detailed reports at this stage. Those reports he has had show a satisfactory response.

To ask the Minister of Agriculture, if, in view of the delay again this year in concluding the February review of farm prices, he will consider the desirability of arranging in future years that this annual review follows the Budget, making the price schedule effective from 1st June instead of 1st April.

On a point of order. May I ask whether or not the word "again" in the first line of this Question would not give a misleading impression, since on no other occasion have we failed to complete the February review before 1st April?

Further to that point of order, I think that if the right hon. Gentleman were to refresh his memory he would find that the Question is perfectly correctly framed.

I must point out that hon. Gentlemen who put down Questions on the Order Paper are themselves responsible for the accuracy of the expressions which they use.

My right hon. and gallant Friend has no occasion to think that the reasons for this year's delay are likely to occur again? He will be glad to consider my hon. Friend's proposal. There are, of course, good arguments for the present arrangements.

Would it not, in fact, be better to follow precisely the opposite procedure to that described in the Question, namely, to ensure that the review was completed before the Budget, so that the Chancellor of the Exchequer could take into account, in framing his economic policies, the future rise in the cost of food, instead of relying upon a bogus figure, as he had to do on this occasion?

My right hon. and gallant Friend will take note of that.

asked the Minister of Agriculture if he will give details of his discussions with the National Farmer's Union on the review of farm prices.

Yes, Sir, in due course.

Will the Parliamentary Secretary consult with his right hon. and gallant Friend the Minister and make the suggestion to him that, before he comes to any agreement, he should consider appointing an independent committee of inquiry, and, perhaps, including on that committee the hon. Member for Wednesbury (Mr. S. N. Evans)?

No, Sir.

asked the Minister of Agriculture if he is satisfied with the progress of his Department's building scheme; how many such buildings were completed in 1949, 1950 and 1951; and what stocks of fabricated steel were held by his Department at the latest convenient date.

I assume that my hon. and gallant Friend is referring to the scheme for the manufacture and distribution of standard components for farm buildings which was in operation from May, 1948, to June, 1950. During this period, enough standard components were sold to construct the equivalent of 6,500 buildings each 60 ft. by 18 ft. The scheme enabled many farmers to obtain urgently needed buildings and has served a useful purpose.

The manufacture and distribution of the components was entirely in the hands of private firms, and at no time did the Department hold any stocks of fabricated steel for this purpose.

Will my hon. Friend tell me if this scheme is now completely stopped, or whether his Ministry has some scheme which is similar to it which is now working?

When steel control was reimposed last February, the manufacture of M.A.F. building components could not continue unless an authorisation of steel was made for the purpose and, as there has been a continuing demand for these components, allocations of steel have, in fact, been made for them.

asked the Minister of Agriculture what progress has been made with the formation of a new domestic poultry keepers' organisation; and what assistance he proposes to afford it.

Twenty-seven county federations of domestic poultry clubs have been set up and a preliminary meeting of delegates from county federations has been called for 3rd May to consider a constitution for the national organisation and plans for holding its first meeting.

The new organisation will receive financial assistance from the Government in the initial period of its development. Such assistance will be on a diminishing scale and the organisation will be expected to become self-supporting.

Will the hon. Gentleman bear in mind that one very great form of assistance for this very desirable development would be to make some issue of balancer meal to members of the federations and of clubs? As we had 12½ million domestic hens during the war feeding something like 5 million people, will the hon. Gentleman not consider doing something of this kind?

I am afraid I cannot hold out any hope to the right hon. Gentle- man that there can be an increase of the existing ration for domestic purposes.

Does the hon. Gentleman not recognise that if we are to feed people better than they are now being fed, this is a valuable source of supply that makes small demands both on scarce currency and imported feedingstuffs?

I do indeed, but the food ration for domestic poultry keepers could only be provided by subtracting it from that given to commercial poultry keepers, and at the present time that is not in the general interest.

asked the Minister of Agriculture if he is aware that the contribution of Blackpool Corporation to the expenses of the newly-established Lancashire River Board for the year ended 31st March, 1952, is £20,830 as against the average annual contribution previously of £2,233 for the old Lancashire Rivers Board and the River Wyre Catchment Board; and whether, as a corporation such as Blackpool derives small benefit from the increased expenditure, he will, at an early date, review the arrangements under which the expenditure of river boards is collected from local authorities.

My right hon. Friend is aware of this increase. It arises largely from the fact that only part of the town was included in the previous Catchment Area whereas it is wholly included in the present River Board Area. This is in accordance with the River Boards Act, 1948, which also lays down the arrangements under which the expenses of river boards are met. My right hon. Friends the Minister of Agriculture and the Minister of Housing and Local Government see no reason to review these arrangements which have been so recently approved by Parliament.

Is my hon. Friend aware that in many cases this Act has had the effect of placing the main burden of costs on those who are least concerned?

Is the hon. Gentleman also aware that if wealthy Blackpool paid less, more unfortunate authorities would have to pay more?

May I ask if my hon. Friend is aware that precisely similar conditions apply in the not very wealthy City of Liverpool, where the proportion of the increased precept is almost exactly the same, without any compensating advantage?

asked the Minister of Agriculture whether he will provide figures showing how the total annual expenditure for all river boards in the country for the financial year ended 31st March, 1952, compares with the average total expenditure on river work by other responsible organisations during the five years preceding April, 1952, when the new river board machinery came into operation; and what steps are being taken to curtail unnecessary and extravagant expenditure by river boards in the light of the new economic circumstances of the country.

I am afraid that it is not possible to provide such comparative information. River boards have important functions to perform and my right hon. and gallant Friend has no reason to think that they are incurring unnecessary or extravagant expenditure.

asked the Minister of Agriculture (1) if he will give consideration to the Distant Water Vessels Scheme Agreement and take the necessary action to protect the consumers' interests;

(2) if he is aware of the concern at that part of the Distant Water Vessels Scheme Agreement which includes a penalty of £25,000 for breaking an agreement by firms engaged in the fishing industry building new trawlers or expanding their fleets in any way; and, in view of the undesirability of restrictive practices, if he will state what consultation took place with the White Fish Authority before the scheme was put into effect.

The agreement to which the hon. Member refers does not prohibit new building by subscribing owners, but confines it to the replacement of old vessels. It is designed to prevent production of distant water fish from seriously outrunning consumer demand, with resulting slumps and distress, such as occurred in 1950. The White Fish Authority were not in existence when the agreement was drawn up, but have, I understand, since been informed of its contents. As regards those parts of the agreement which relate to catching. I would refer the hon. Member to the reply given by my right hon. and gallant Friend the Minister of Food on 10th March to the hon. Members for Sedgefield (Mr. Slater) and Wallsend (Mr. McKay).

Does the Minister deny that in one Clause the trawler owners have agreed that, in the event of a full catch, 20 per cent. will go to the salters at below cost price, and does he really think that skippers who depend upon commission on net earnings are really going to be encouraged to get that additional 20 per cent.? Is he aware that in the agreement there is a £25,000 fine for expanding their fleet, and can the Minister say if he thinks that half-a-dozen housewives are going to subscribe to get a trawler to catch this additional fish?

To answer the second question first, since at the present time no fewer than 23 new trawlers are being built, evidently the penalty is not working in the way which the hon. Member expects.

Does the Minister deny that it exists?

I do not deny that it is there, but the object of building restriction is to prevent large-scale over-production of distant water fish for which there is no consumer demand. If we have a recurrence of the slump of 1950, the inevitable result will be bankruptcy, ships going out of commission, and eventually smaller supplies of fish for the market and at higher prices.