asked the Secretary of State for the Colonies if he will now make a further statement on the situation in Kenya.

As regards the political situation, I would refer the hon. Member to the statement which my hon. Friend made on 30th May, in reply to the hon. Member for Cardiff, South-East (Mr. Callaghan). As regards the security situation, the Kenya Government are taking all necessary measures to counter subversive activities in the Rift Valley and in Meru district. Fifteen persons who administered or helped to administer oaths in Meru have been dealt with by the courts and seventeen cases are awaiting trial. A curfew has been imposed on the affected part of the district since 25th May and movement into and out of a specified part of the Imenti forest area is prohibited. Police and K.A.R. are operating in the forest with the object of tracing and arresting any remaining oath administrators.

Is the Colonial Secretary aware that there is a great deal of confusion and dismay in Kenya about the political situation? There is a need for some clarity from him. Does he accept the interpretation Lord Salisbury has expressed in the correspondence columns of The Times, namely, that he has established a new principle in his treatment of the Kenya position? Does he now accept the advice of some of his supporters on the benches behind him that the best way to establish stability in Kenya is to release Jomo Kenyatta?

Regarding the letters in The Times, as another letter from one of my hon. Frends pointed out a day later, I had said this before on a considerable number of occasions. As for the political situation in Kenya, it is important to remember that there have been a great number of votes since the Legislative Council met. On all those the Government have commanded a substantial majority, and in every single case a majority of elected representatives as well.

asked the Secretary of State for the Colonies what special action is being taken to watch ex-Mau Mau detainees.

Before Mau Mau detainees were finally released it was the normal practice for them to undergo a period on probation under the supervision of their local Chief and District Officer in order that the Kenya Government could be fully satisfied that their release would not constitute a threat to public security. The Kenya Government have taken swift action wherever there has been a resurgence of Mau Mau type activities. This is an aspect of the security situation over which the Kenya Government are keeping the closest watch.

asked the Secretary of State for the Colonies how many persons were charged with administering or taking unlawful oaths, and of belonging to or managing an unlawful society in connection with Mau Mau activities, during May, 1961 in Kenya.

Twenty-eight persons were arrested and charged in May with administering or taking oaths in connection with Mau Mau. No persons were charged with managing an unlawful society.

In view of the alarming renewal of Mau Mau activities which these figures reveal, will my right hon. Friend make greater efforts to identify the headquarters of these Mau Mau cells and also the ringleaders of these activities?

Certainly, but I think that my right hon. Friend, who is well informed on these matters, will know that the special branch information in Kenya is pretty good and that we have very close tabs indeed on the headquarters and the personnel of these different movements.

Having in mind the recent cases of conveying fraudulent telegrams designed to stir up inter-racial tension, will the Secretary of State pay close attention to a tendency which, I think, is becoming apparent, namely, the use of the very sinister name "Mau Mau" by persons who are somewhat irresponsible?

It is true, of course, that a number of oaths which are taken have nothing to do with Mau Mau. That is a perfectly fair point and well made, if I may say so. On the other hand, it is equally true that some of the outbreaks of oathing recently have had very disturbing features indeed which are clearly connected in some way or other with the unhappy days of the emergency.

Will the Secretary of State confirm that in the recent murders and other acts of violence, which we all deplore, there has not been any connection traced with any political motive?

People are under arrest in connection with the first charge and, therefore, I do not wish to go into detail. No evidence has come to light so far in either case which could identify these acts as political.

asked the Secretary of State for the Colonies how many African families it is now planned to resettle on land owned by European farmers in Kenya in the course of the next two years.

The scheme for which funds are already in view should provide for about 6,300 families; schemes for accelerated re-settlement are currently under discussion.

Is my right hon. Friend aware that some responsible people in Kenya have plans for settling as many as 25,000 families in the next four months? Would my right hon. Friend look sympathetically at this problem?

Within the last few hours I have received from the Council of Ministers in Kenya new proposals on this matter which I will study carefully.

asked the Secretary of State for the Colonies how many individuals, thought to be members of the Freedom Land Army, have been arrested or detained in Kenya in the last four weeks.

Fifteen such persons have been proceeded against during the last four weeks and all have been restricted. None has been detained.

In view of the very strong condemnation by Ministers and other responsible people in Kenya, is not this a rather small action to take against this subversive organisation?

I am certain that the Kenya administration has taken action whenever they feel there is a case that can stand up in the courts. The figures which I have given are presumably a measure of that.

asked the Secretary of State for the Colonies if full self-government will be extended to the Leeward and Windward Islands before independence is recognised for the West Indian Federation in 1962.

This is one of the many questions which is being considered at the conference which opened at Lancaster House on 31st May, and which is still going on.

As the Federation, we all hope, will attain independence next year, is it not desirable that these two groups of islands should at least have some experience of self-government before independence? Is it not also desirable that economic aid should be given to enable self-government to be effected?

I thank the hon. Gentleman for his proposals. These are precisely the sort of points we are discussing at the conference now. It is quite clear that there will be independence for these islands at the latest at precisely the same moment as independence for the other territories.

Is it not a fair and reasonable principle that all the various units of the West Indies which are entering into an independent Federa- tion should enter into it from exactly the same stage of self-government?

That is also a point which I shall bear in mind, but we are discussing these very points at the conference.

asked the Secretary of State for the Colonies (1) how many West Indian medical students are at present being trained in medical schools in the West Indies, in Britain, in other Commonwealth countries and in other foreign countries, respectively; and what was the total number of West Indian doctors qualifying and entering practice in the West Indies in 1960;

I do not at present have this information nor the last current projection of need but have sought both and will send particulars to the hon. Member as soon as they are available.

Does the Minister feel that sufficient has been done in the various countries, and will he say whether there are sufficient medical students being trained to fit the needs of the parts of the world mentioned in my Question?

I should like to see the figures first. Perhaps the hon. Gentleman will put down another Question in due course.

asked the Secretary of State for the Colonies if he has conferred, or will confer, with the representatives of the West Indies Governments now attending the London Conference in respect of the problem of immigration from the West Indies and elsewhere into this country.

The question of immigration from the West Indies to this country is one of the many questions which the representatives of the West Indies Governments have proposed for discussion.

Does the Minister mean that during the present time, when these representatives are in London, some consultation has taken place? If so, can he say whether the representatives have been impressed by the complexity and indeed the urgency of the problem?

Yes, Sir. We have already had at Lancaster House some discussion on this matter. The hon. Member, of course, will not expect me to give full details on it pending the conference report but the members of the unit territories concerned put their point of view forcibly to me.

Has the right hon. Gentleman's attention been called to suggestions that the Government are contemplating immediate restrictive legislation on immigration? Does he not feel that this suggestion at this moment might throw a spanner into the works of the London conference?

With respect, these suggestions have not emanated from the Government. The position of the Government has been stated by myself, by my right hon. Friend the Home Secretary and by a number of other Members, and when we discussed this matter at Lancaster House I had no change in that position to announce to the conference.

Will the right hon. Gentleman confirm that the view among many responsible West Indian leaders is that they have no particular desire for their people to emigrate to these islands but until there is sufficient capital in the West Indies to relieve their own unemployment they have no alternative?

This is a problem which we shall be taking up at Lancaster House tomorrow morning.

asked the Secretary of State for the Colonies what action has been taken following the Report of the World Health Organisation on Nutritional Standards in St. Helena.

As the reply is rather long I will, with permission, circulate it in the OFFICIAL REPORT.

Does not the Report of the World Health Organisation reveal very great defects in the diet of the people of St. Helena, and will the hon. Gentleman ask his right hon. Friend to approve additional subsidies on essential foods so that the standard of the health of the people may be raised?

When the hon. Gentleman looks at my Answer he will find that there has been an increase in some subsidies, but this movement was going on previously and was confirmed by the Report of the World Health Organisation. A movement in this direction had already been made by the St. Helena Government.

asked the Secretary of State for the Colonies what medical services are now available in St. Helena; and if he will make a statement.

St. Helena has a well-equipped hospital, and a senior medical officer and a medical officer are available for the care of the population.

Can the hon. Gentleman now say whether, in view of the distance between St. Helena and the nearest large hospital at Cape Town, there is a competent surgeon serving in St. Helena who is capable of performing operations?

Since the hon. Gentleman last asked a question in December, 1960, there has been an improvement. The senior medical officer is capable of performing major surgical operations.

asked the Secretary of State for the Colonies how many cars are allotted to the five school dental surgeons of Malta in order to carry out their work; what is the financial saving of this method of transport compared with the use by each officer of his own car at a fixed mileage rate; if he can state the loss of time caused to each officer in using public transport instead of his own car; and which of these methods is the more efficient for carrying out the duties required of these officers.

One hired car is allotted to school dental surgeons. The financial saving could only be calculated if it were known what each officer would claim when using his own car. I am satisfied that if there is any loss of time it has no noticeable effect on the efficiency of the officers concerned.

Is the hon. Gentleman satisfied with the present position—that there should be one car between five officers on three days a week? These men have been on strike, as far as their cars are concerned, for a considerable time, and the delay is creating bitterness. As instructions are given from this country to the G.I.C. in Malta, will the hon. Gentleman give instructions for a recall of this committee in order that this dispute may be settled?

I think that the hon. Gentleman is exaggerating the position. The whole question of motor cars was gone into by a Departmental committee, and it has been found that, without much loss of time, considerable economies have been made in the finances of the island of Malta.

But can the hon. Gentleman give the cost of paying these dental surgeons on a mileage basis, compared with the cost now in transport and loss of time?

I am convinced that this is the correct solution, which I am fully confident the Governor and the Council of Malta will achieve.

asked the Secretary of State for the Colonies (1) what steps his department is taking to encourage students in Northern Rhodesia to take up offers of educational facilities abroad;

Every advantage is taken of offers of educational facilities abroad, especially where appropriate courses are not at present available locally and where the quality and condition of courses abroad are known to be satisfactory.

Is the Secretary of State aware that I have been informed that, within the last three months or so, scholarships have been offered from the United States to Northern Rhodesians, conditional on certain expenses being covered by the Federal Government, and that the Federal Government have turned them down? The result is that these facilities are not available. Will the Secretary of State check whether this is correct and, if it is, will he take appropriate action?

I will indeed check on this matter. I have seen a report which, I think, may be the one to which the right hon. Gentleman has referred, in the Guardian some time ago on this matter, but I understand that the position is not, as far as Northern Rhodesia is concerned, that these have been rejected, but that they are still being considered.

Does not the Secretary of State agree that this raises an important issue and will he do everything he can to discourage some of his officials in Africa from looking down their noses at offers of American educational assistance and regarding this as our private educational preserve? Will the right hon. Gentleman do everything he can to encourage co-operation in educational matters with the United States authorities?

I am sure that that co-operation is there but, naturally, one can form an adequate scholarship level of people going to universities only where there is an adequate secondary school educational level from which to draw these scholars. It is largely on that matter that Governments in East and Central Africa have been concentrating.

But often the objection is at the other end in the view taken of the quality of the education being offered at American institutions. Will the Secretary of State bear in mind that, in view of the tremendous educational needs of these areas, it is a serious matter to turn down reasonable offers of educational help from the United States?

I agree, but, on the other hand, it is necessary that the Governments of those territories should be satisfied clearly of the quality of the education offered to them.

asked the Secretary of State for the Colonies how many sentences of under three months duration have been imposed by the native courts of Northern Rhodesia in the year 1958, 1959 and 1960; and under what regulations the right of appeal against such sentences is refused.

To furnish exact figures would call for a survey of over 150,000 criminal cases in the three years in question. In the overwhelming majority of these, however, any sentences of imprisonment imposed were of less than three months. The only limitation on the right of appeal is that contained in Section 33 of the Native Courts Ordinance, and this is about to be abolished.

Is the Secretary of State aware that there is great anxiety, particularly in the present explosive situation, about the enormous number of people who are now receiving sentences of less than three months for the most trivial offences—even to the point of being sentenced for holding indoor and outdoor meetings? In view of this explosive situation, will the right hon. Gentleman do something to temper the position in the Province?

I think that the point made in the hon. Gentleman's supplementary question is dealt with in my main Answer. The new Native Courts Ordinance now has the Royal Assent and I hope that it will come into effect next month.

asked the Secretary of State for the Colonies if he will give the grounds on which Mr. Kenneth Kaunda was recently served with deportation orders on five occasions in the Northern Province of Northern Rhodesia.

These removal orders were issued in June and July, 1960. They were made by the native authorities concerned because they considered that Mr. Kaunda's presence in their areas at that time was likely to jeopardise law and order.

While thanking the Secretary of State for that reply, may I quote from an article in the 30th April issue of African Life?

Order. Quotations from books, speeches or the like are out of order at Question Time.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I wish to point out that this report reveals that there have been recent deportations. Does not the Secretary of State think—in view of the explosive situation which I mentioned in my supplementary question to Question No. 8—that there should be disclaimers when statements of this kind are made, because these papers have a wide circulation among the native population?

The hon. Gentleman must look at this in the circumstances of the time. This was a considerable time ago—almost a year ago—following a period of great tension when there were outbreaks of violence, especially on the Copperbelt in May of last year. As fat as I know, no recent deportation orders have been served, as suggested in the hon. Gentleman's Question.

Is Mr. Kaunda now free to visit these areas and to organise meetings provided that they are con- ducted in an orderly way?

I imagine so, but I will have to check that point. I assume that the deportation orders made in the summer of last year have lapsed.

The Secretary of State has said that these deportation orders were made a year ago. Can he give an assurance that, in view of the great influence of Mr. Kaunda against violence in Northern Rhodesia, he will have liberty to hold meetings in the Northern Province?

My hon. Friend and I have answered that question several times. We have made careful inquiries into the allegations that have been made about events in the Northern Province and I am satisfied that there is, and will be, no interference with the rights of people to hold ordinary political activities there.

asked the Secretary of State for the Colonies, in view of the danger of fire from the disturbances in Angola, especially in the approaching dry season, what steps are being taken in the neighbouring territory of Northern Rhodesia to prevent the spread of fire into that territory.

The boundary between Angola and Northern Rhodesia is marked by a cleared strip which acts as a fire break. There are regular patrols during the dry season.

Is the right hon. Gentleman aware that in these border areas fire bombs have been used by the Portuguese during the disturbances, despite the cleared strip? Does not the use of these fire bombs present a danger to foodstuffs, fuel, factories and so on across the border? If it does not cease, will the right hon. Gentleman make a protest to the Portuguese Government?

I think that the fact that this boundary is marked by a cleared strip, which in itself is a firebreak, together with the additional precaution that during the dry season there are regular patrols, should take care of any anxiety which the hon. Gentleman has.

asked the Secretary of State for the Colonies what steps are being taken to authorise East African Governments to initiate policies of deficit financing at low interest rates and to establish centralised banking facilities and exchange equalisation funds on modern lines in order to promote a high level of business activity and employment at stable prices.

There has been careful study of the important matters raised by my noble Friend. For example, the I.B.R.D. mission to Tanganyika reported that it would be wiser not to take action to establish central banking facilities in East Africa until political developments in the area were clearer. It is doubtful whether, in present circumstances, deficit financing on a substantial scale could be practised without destroying confidence in the currency. The East African Currency Board is empowered to invest locally up to £20 million of its reserves, and, of course, Her Majesty's Government are giving substantial financial aid to these Governments to stimulate economic activity and employment.

I am grateful to my right hon. Friend for that reply, but can he confirm that in Kenya, for example, just at a time when the economy is somewhat placid, to say the the least, taxation is being increased, thus reducing the impact of the private sector on public financing? Is it not time that some high-powered Treasury officials were sent out to inquire into the possibility of reflationary activities, always guaranteeng a stable price level at the end of them?

I am very conscious of the importance of these subjects. The head of my Finance Department in the Colonial Office has visited Kenya twice in very recent weeks and among other matters has discussed these very points. In reply to my noble Friend's suggestion for a high-level inquiry, perhaps I may send him the report of the I.B.R.D. mission to Tanganyika which, with certain reservations, will apply equally to Kenya and Uganda. I think that he will find an answer to most of the points he raises there.

Can the Secretary of State persuade his noble Friend to apply his progressive Keynesian economics to this country as well as to Kenya?

asked the Secretary of State for the Colonies how many medical students are currently being trained in medical schools in British Colonial Territories; and what was the total number of doctors qualifying in these schools in 1960.

I am asking the overseas Governments concerned for the precise information requested and will write to the hon. Member when I have received their replies.

I thank the Minister for taking that trouble. How closely does his estimate correspond with the needs of the Colonial Territories, and what steps has he in mind for the immediate future to increase the number of medical students?

That is a different question. When I have received the precise information, I shall be very happy to answer a further Question on the subject.

asked the Secretary of State for the Colonies what reply has been given to the request from the Government of Tanganyika that official Portuguese representation be now required to withdraw from that territory.

The formal request from the Tanganyika Government has only just been received, and no reply has yet been sent.

Will the Secretary of State consider his reply to this request very carefully? We appreciate his difficulties in the matter, but will he use this very strong expression of view from one of the finest leaders of African nationalism and one of the best friends of this country to persuade his colleagues in the Government of the folly of policies at the United Nations and elsewhere which appear to condone repressive Portuguese colonial policies?

That is a wider question. Mr. Nyerere will be in this country in a day or two. I shall, of course, be seeing him, and, no doubt, we shall discuss this and other matters. Normally, of course, the fact that one disagrees with the policy of another Government is not—rightly so, in my view—regarded as a reason for breaking off diplomatic relations.

asked the Secretary of State for the Colonies whether he will now make a further statement on the recent riots in Zanzibar, and the developments which have followed.

I deeply regret to inform the House that in the riots there were 66 deaths and that 320 persons were injured, of whom 91 were admitted to hospital. The total number of arrests so far is 1,205. It has been decided to set up a Commission to inquire into the causes of the disturbances; the terms of reference and membership will he announced in due course. Although some tension remains, the situation has been quiet since 8th June and the security forces are in control. At the request of the British Resident, my senior police adviser is flying to Zanzibar this week to advise on the reorganisation of the police force.

Is the Secretary of State able to tell us anything about recent political developments in Zanzibar and the rearrangement of the Government and the effect that these may have on security and on constitutional developments in Zanzibar during the next few months?

On the immediate point, a Government has been formed from the combination of parties which secured most seats at the election. Obviously, at this stage one has no announcement of any kind to make about further constitutional conferences or advance for Zanzibar.

Has my right hon. Friend received any information from the official Opposition that they intend to boycott the Legislative Assembly?

I am told that the present position is as my hon. Friend suggests, that the official Opposition do not intend to take part in events in the Legislative Assembly. If this is so, I regret it very much, because they are a most formidable majority indeed, comprising support from the majority race in Zanzibar, and it would be a great pity if their voice were not heard in the councils of the islands.

asked the Secretary of State for the Colonies what restrictions have been eased by Spain in its dealings with Gibraltar during the last few months, giving the date each took effect.

The easing of frontier restrictions in June of last year for holders of United Kingdom and colonial passports was followed on 28th February this year by the Spanish authorities abolishing triptyques for foreign cars entering Spain. This concession has also been applied at the Gibraltar land frontier. Since then the Spanish customs authorities on the land frontier have also stopped recording the names of drivers. The net effect has been to reduce substantially the time spent in crossing the frontier at La Linea.

But is the Under-Secretary really proud of this? Does he appreciate that there was a general relaxation on passports for the British Commonwealth and that statements by himself, the Prime Minister and the Lord Privy Seal are exasperating the people in Gibraltar? Why do the Government not tackle the real things that are harming Gibraltar so much? Is not the hon. Gentleman aware that the people of Spain, which is a Catholic country, will not allow their footballers to play in Gibraltar and yet a Spanish team is playing in a basket-ball competition in Russia and other countries? Is it not time that this unfriendly act against Gibraltar was looked upon as an unfriendly act against the British Commonwealth?

I am sure that what my right hon. Friend the Lord Privy Seal said yesterday is correct and that the best chance of improving this thoroughly unsatisfactory situation at the moment is to improve our friendship with the Spanish Government.

Will the Under-Secretary bear in mind that while there has been a relaxation on the entry of United Kingdom citizens into Gibraltar, similar relaxation has not taken place where nationals of other Commonwealth countries are concerned, and that they are restricted, in effect, to coming to Gibraltar through La Linea once in three months? Will my hon. Friend press our Ambassador in Madrid to make certain that this relaxation is applied generally to Commonwealth subjects?

As the Lord Privy Seal said yesterday, both the Foreign Secretary and our Ambassador have raised this question with the Spanish Government.

May we not have an assurance from the hon. Gentleman that the future of Gibraltar will not be bartered for the friendship of Spain?

Answer.

May we please have a proper answer?

The answer to that supplementary question is that, of course, we stand absolutely firm on our position in Gibraltar.

asked the Secretary of State for the Colonies what progress has been made in resolving difficulties in Uganda arising from resistance from the Kabaka and the Lukiko of Buganda to constitutional development.

asked the Secretary of State for the Colonies if he will make a statement about the findings of Lord Munster's Relationships Commission in Uganda.

The Governor has continued to discuss the position with the Kabaka. The findings of the Relation- ships Commission Report will be available when it is published in a few days. Its recommendations are to be considered at a constitutional conference to be convened in London in mid-September. I hope that the Report will provide a real opportunity for making progress on Buganda's relationships with the rest of Uganda.

While thanking the right hon. Gentleman for that reply, may I ask whether he could reply more speci- fically to the first part of the Question where I asked what progress is being made? Can the right hon. Gentleman assure the House that progress has been made in this very difficult matter?

I would prefer to put it the other way round and say that I am hopeful, now that we have the Munster Report, which I think is an excellent one, that we shall be able to make progress. We have lacked before a common basis of agreement for solving this big problem. I have always thought that the Munster Report would provide such a basis and, having read it, I think that it will.

asked the Secretary of State for the Colonies whether he will take powers to prevent the spreading of Communist literature in Mauritius, particularly in schools.

The Governor in Council, under the Importation of Publications (Prohibition) Ordinance, 1953, already has power to prohibit the importation of any publication that is contrary to public interest.

Is my hon. Friend aware that I have in my hand two examples of the pamphlets which are said to be circulated in schools in Mauritius and that there is an attempt to flood the country with Communist propaganda and to step up the number of visits to countries behind the Iron Curtain? Will he look at the matter?

Yes, Sir.

Does the hon. Gentleman feel that the banning of books is a very valuable method? Is it not far better to allow this propaganda to multiply, to let people read it and let its futility become apparent?

That is a very open question.

asked the Secretary of State for Scotland when he proposes to bring into operation the provisions of the Legal Aid (Scotland) Act, 1949, so far as they relate to criminal proceedings.

These provisions have been reviewed by a Committee, under the chairmanship of Lord Guthrie, which considered whether they should be varied in the light of experience of civil legal aid and any other relevant circum- stances. I am considering the Committee's Report but regret that I am not yet ready to make a statement.

Is the Secretary of State aware that this reply is very disappointing? Is he not aware that legal aid for criminal proceedings has been in operation in England and Wales since March, 1960, and that the Guthrie Report was published in May, 1960? Surely this has taken a long time. Does not the right hon. Gentleman think that Scotland deserves better than this?

The English position is very different. I will write to the hon. Member to explain the detail, which is rather complicated.

asked the Secretary of State for Scotland if he will make further provision to recompense agents for poor people in criminal proceedings in view of the threatened breakdown of the present service.

I am considering the whole question of legal aid in criminal proceedings, including the payments made to agents who appear in court, in the light of the Report of the Guthrie Committee.

But is not the Secretary of State aware that this was an interim payment which was arranged until such time as the payment under legal aid in criminal proceedings was arranged? Is he not aware that this present amount is totally inadequate, and could he not arrange for some extension of this payment until such time as he has made up his mind and brought in proper procedure for Scotland?

I will certainly bear in mind what the hon. Member has said.

asked the Secretary of State for Scotland to what extent his Department uses the facilities afforded by the Central Office of Information to publicise the potentialities for industrial development in Scotland.

My Department continues to utilise fully the Central Office of Information publicity services for this purpose.

Can the right hon. Gentleman say whether there has been any increase in expenditure in this field consequent upon the inauguration of the Common Market? Is he not aware that there are firms which normally would be expected to come to Scotland but which are increasingly turning their eyes to Common Market countries, and that increased publicity might do something, anyway, to reverse this trend?

I could not give a categorical answer to the various points raised, but I would recall to the hon. Member an Answer which I gave him last year which explained fully the efforts made to circulate information from my office.

asked the Secretary of State for Scotland what further progress has been made in the purification of the River Esk, Midlothian.

Nearly all the sewage works in the Esk Valley have now been modernised or connected to the regional sewer. Pollution of the river by industrial effluent is still serious, but the Lothians River Purification Board has secured the co-operation of the firms concerned and assures me that all are now actively engaged on improvement measures.

Is the right hon. Gentleman aware that I have been getting similar Answers for the last two or three years and that the river is still in as bad a condition as ever? It smells and it is dirty. Is it not time that something much more effective was done and that the people could see that it had been done?

I am informed that real progress is being made in sewerage. Industrial effluent still causes trouble, but, as the hon. Member knows, this is no easy matter. There is real co-operation to try to achieve improvement.

asked the Secretary of State for Scotland if he will state for each of the major road projects completed since 1st January, 1951, the length of roadway, the total cost of construction, and the cost of acquiring land.

I will, with permission, circulate the information, which covers schemes costing over £100,000, in the OFFICIAL REPORT.

Will the right hon. Gentleman indicate the percentage increase in expenditure since 1951, taking into consideration the fall in the value of the pound?

That is another question. If the hon. Member puts it down, I will answer it.

asked the Secretary of State for Scotland if he will take steps to debar vehicles from using narrow roads where the breadth of the vehicle, or its load, protrudes over the mid-road white line.

No, Sir. I think that the matter is dealt with adequately by the Motor Vehicles (Construction and Use) Regulations which govern the width of vehicles and the loads they may carry; and by the powers available to highway authorities under the Road Traffic Act to make traffic regulation orders.

Is the Secretary of State aware of the great increase in propaganda to get tourists to the Highlands during the summer months? Is he aware that there is a great danger on a narrow road with blind corners when vehicles which use it protrude over the centre white line? A motorist who feels that he is travelling perfectly safely on his own side of the road is liable suddenly to be confronted with a vehicle that cannot move over. The right hon. Gentleman already has Regulations governing the height and weight of the vehicles on these roads. Surely, he should take similar powers concerning width.

I realise the danger which the hon. Member has pointed out, but the use of certain lengths of road of the kind he has in mind, in the North-West in particular, has by order been restricted to vehicles not exceeding 7 ft. 6 in. in width.

asked the Secretary of State for Scotland whether, in view of the present high level of unemployment in the City of Dundee he will advance the starting date for building operations on the Tay Road Bridge.

The starting date in 1963, which the local authorities concerned have agreed with me should be aimed at, has taken many factors into account, such as the time necessary for them to take powers to build the bridge; the time required to prepare the engineering plans; and the competing claims of other road projects on our funds. I doubt whether it would be practicable to advance it.

Is the Secretary of State aware that that date was agreed as the latest possible date? Has his attention been drawn to the representations of the Lord Provost to the Parliamentary Secretary to the Ministry of Labour? Is the Secretary of State aware that I understand that the only reason why the bridge cannot be begun in the summer of next year is the Government's unwillingness to authorise it and to give the necessary financial approval?

I am not prepared to add to my original reply. I have noted what the hon. Member has said, but I also hope that he will consider what I have said.

asked the Secretary of State for Scotland what reply he has made to the request of Glasgow Corporation that revaluation of heritable subjects should be delayed for one year, or alternatively that the date for disposing of appeals should be extended.

I explained to the Corporation that postponement of the effective date of revaluation would require legislation and would present insuperable problems. I informed them at the same time that I was watching the position and that if it appeared, when more evidence was available, that there was a case for postponing the last date for disposal of appeals, I would do so.

Is the right hon. Gentleman aware that the Minister of State, speaking on his behalf and dealing with the impact of derating and revaluation on shipbuilding, promised legislation to deal with that problem? Had the Minister of State any authority to do that, or was he merely deceiving the shipbuilders and the people of Scotland?

The hon. Member has raised a whole lot of matters which do not arise out of his original Question.

My Question deals with revaluation, and that is the topic to which the Minister of State addressed himself in Scotland last week on behalf of the Secretary of State, who now repudiates it.

The hon. Member must address himself to his own Question and to my Answer to it.

On a point of order. In what way, Mr. Speaker does my supplementary question not derive from the Question which appears on the Order Paper? Is it out of order?

I did not so rule.

May I therefore, Mr. Speaker, proceed to press the Secretary of State with my supplementary question—[HON. MEMBERS: "No."]—and ask him for an answer to it?

No, I am afraid not. I have no power to compel Ministers to answer.

Then I am right. The Secretary of State repudiates the Minister of State.

asked the Secretary of State for Scotland if he will make a statement on the new course for all-purpose social workers to be instituted at the Scottish College of Commerce in Glasgow.

This full-time two-year course will start in October with an enrolment of about fifteen students. Further information about the course is given in my Health Department's Circular No. 30/61 issued on 22nd March, 1961, of which I am sending the hon. Lady a copy.

Will the Secretary of State tell us how many staff have been recruited, what are their salary scales and how they compare with the scales for similar courses to be instituted in England and Wales? What consultation has there been with organisations of professional social workers in Scotland in the inauguration of this course?

I should be very pleased if I were able to answer all those questions without warning. I will send the information to the hon. Lady.

Can the Secretary of State tell us why this college was chosen rather than a university, where there would have been a much better chance of these people getting the training that is considered so important?

A study group, which was representative of the various interests concerned and was appointed to consider and advise upon the implementation in Scotland of the recommendations contained in the 1959 Young-husband Report on Social Workers, agreed that the college was the most appropriate Scottish centre for this type of training course.

Since the content of the course will be dictated by the kind of staff who are recruited to administer it, why cannot the right hon. Gentleman, since he is giving a statement concerning the course, give details of the staff and their salaries?

Because one answers the Question on the Order Paper to the best of one's ability. One cannot guess in advance all the supplementary questions that could possibly be put.

asked the Secretary of State for Scotland how many cars have now been distributed to disabled war pensioners in Scotland as a result of the extension of the scheme last year.

Ninety-two.

In view of the progress that is being made with this scheme, will the Secretary of State consult the appropriate English Minister to make arrangements for its extension to industrial workers?

The hon. Member will realise that this matter was fully debated on 30th June last. I have nothing to add to what was said on that occasion by the then Minister of Health.

Is the Secretary of State not aware that 30th June is very near again and that there is strong feeling in Scotland that this scheme should be extended to the industrially disabled? I ask the right hon. Gentleman to have in mind particularly the paraplegic miner.

I have noted carefully what has been said.

asked the Secretary of State for Scotland why a constituent of the hon. Member for Lanarkshire, North had to wait four months for the replacement of a surgical boot, details of which case have been sent to him by the hon. Member.

I have explained to the hon. Lady in correspondence the reasons why a delay of this order is unfortunately unavoidable at present in non-urgent cases but that the hospital authorities are doing what they can to reduce waiting time.

Is the Secretary of State aware that the reply which he gave me by letter was not at all satisfactory? Can he tell the House what is considered urgent and not urgent in these matters? Is he aware that my constituent needed this surgical boot to enable him to carry out his work? Does not the right hon. Gentleman agree that to have to wait four months for a surgical boot is a disgrace?

I have great sympathy with the hon. Lady's feelings about this matter and I have been following it up to see what improvements can be made.

asked the Secretary of State for Scotland whether the guaranteed price for fat cattle is calculated on a live-weight or dead-weight; what is the conversion factor applied in equating live-weight with dead-weight; and what is the average percentage of dead-weight to live-weight.

Guarantee payments are determined on the basis of live-weight prices. The conversion factor is 1d. per lb. for every 5s. per cwt. of the live-weight guarantee payment. The average percentage of dead-weight to live-weight is estimated to be about 56 per cent.

Since the conversion factor represents the killing-out percentage considerably less than the national average, can my right hon. Friend estimate the amount of public money which is being poured out unintentionally to those whose cattle are graded after slaughter, and what steps he is prepared to take to remedy this anomaly?

I should inform my hon. Friend that this matter has never been raised formally by any of the representative bodies on the Joint Advisory Panel set up by Ministers to advise them on the working of the fatstock guarantee scheme. I have noted what my hon. Friend has said, but I cannot add to my reply.

In view of the unsatisfactory situation revealed by the Answer, I propose to take an early opportunity of raising this matter on the Adjournment.