House of Commons
Tuesday 5 July 2016
The House met at half-past Eleven o’clock
[Mr Speaker in the Chair]
Oral Answers to Questions
The Secretary of State was asked—
Review on Antimicrobial Resistance
1. What plans the Government have to lead the international response to the recommendations of the final report of the Review on Antimicrobial Resistance, published in May 2016. (905653)
16. What plans the Government have to lead the international response to the recommendations of the final report of the Review on Antimicrobial Resistance, published in May 2016. (905668)
The O’Neill AMR review is galvanising global awareness, as I have seen for myself, and it is greatly to the Prime Minister’s credit that he showed the foresight to commission it. The UK continues to play a global leadership role on antimicrobial resistance. We co-sponsored the World Health Organisation’s 2015 global action plan on AMR, we created the Fleming fund to help poorer countries to tackle drug resistance, and we are now championing action, including taking forward the O’Neill review’s recommendations, through the United Nations, the G7, and the G20.
I recently met biotech firm Matoke Holdings, which has developed a new technology—reactive oxygen technology. It has found that this technology forms the basis of a whole new generation of antibiotics that has been proven to combat multi-resistant bacteria, including MRSA. This is an incredibly exciting development. Will my hon. Friend and her team agree to meet Matoke Holdings to hear about the new technology and the pace at which it has developed? What are the Government doing to support research into new antibiotics?
My hon. Friend will be aware that a key focus of the O’Neill review was how to incentivise the development of new antimicrobials. It is scary to think that there has not been a new class of antibiotics for some decades now. The Government are funding an extensive AMR research programme. Matoke Holdings has been in contact with the Department, and we are in the process of arranging a meeting to discuss reactive oxygen technology in the coming weeks. My ministerial colleague the Under-Secretary of State for Life Sciences has indicated that he would also be happy to have such a meeting.
I recently hosted a parliamentary drop-in session to highlight the benefits of C-reactive protein testing as a way of reducing the number of antibiotics inappropriately prescribed in primary care. Will the Minister agree to look again at the case for rolling out CRP testing as standard across primary care as part of the Government’s strategy to tackle antimicrobial resistance?
My hon. Friend is right to champion these new technologies. In fact, the Department has already invested in research into CRP. We look forward to seeing what that brings and, in due course, to seeing how it might move forward. It is very much already on our radar.
There is an impending public health issue in this regard, not least with strains of gonorrhoea, for example, that are starting to show resistance to antibiotics. A number of doctors are incredibly concerned about this. What more can be done to incentivise research and development to ensure that this public health concern does not become a public health crisis?
The hon. Gentleman, who knows a great deal about these matters, is right. Incentivising discovery is absolutely at the heart of the O’Neill review. O’Neill has made a series of recommendations about unblocking the drugs pipeline, and we will respond to that in full. It is a critical issue. In the meantime, conservation of the antibiotics we have and sensible prescribing is critical to making sure that, as the hon. Gentleman says, drug-resistant strains of gonorrhoea, for example, do not take hold.
This is an incredibly important issue on which I urge the Minister to communicate with the public more effectively, because inappropriate use of antibiotics could have severe effects. Some of the medical interventions that are reliant on antibiotics, whether gut surgery, joint replacements, caesarean sections or chemotherapies, could become too dangerous to perform if we do not get this right.
That is exactly right. Things we take for granted now could become risky procedures again. Globally, old diseases could make a comeback because of drug resistance—diseases such as TB which, around the world, people are winning the battle against. This is why it is so important to pay tribute to the Prime Minister’s foresight in commissioning the independent review and taking this issue global. The Government, along with the chief medical officer, are championing this at an international level, but, at the same time, we are not resting closer to home, where we are working with GPs and so on to deal with the prescribing issue. However, it is a big challenge and the hon. Gentleman is right to highlight it.
Is my hon. Friend aware that there is strong evidence that herbal medicine can help treat conditions currently treated by antibiotics, but there is a desperate need for more research? Is she also aware that homeopathic medicine can do the same, particularly with upper respiratory tract infections, and that homeopathic treatments are now the second largest medical system in the world, according to the World Health Organisation?
The Government are always interested in anything that can be proven to be cost-effective and efficacious.
Millions of people around the world are dying annually from resistant infections. In the light of that and the positive correlation between antibiotic resistance rates and antibiotic consumption, urgent action needs to be taken. What steps and cross-departmental work is the Minister taking to address the findings of the Review on Antimicrobial Resistance and to reduce the unnecessary use of antimicrobials in agriculture?
There is consensus on the importance of this issue. It is worth highlighting the work that the Government are doing internationally, through the creation of the Fleming fund, in which we are investing £265 million, to help poorer countries to tackle drug resistance and to make sure that we have proper monitoring systems in place. Without a baseline to understand where we are even starting from, it is very difficult. We will respond more fully to all the issues highlighted by the hon. Lady when we respond formally to the O’Neill review, but it goes without saying that we are trying to take this work forward internationally and we are working towards further meetings at the United Nations this autumn.
Target Antibiotics Toolkit
2. What assessment his Department has made of the uptake of the Target antibiotics toolkit among NHS commissioners and GPs. (905654)
Continuing with the same important theme, it is excellent to see Parliament taking such a close interest in antibiotic resistance. In England, 60% of clinical commissioning groups reported reviewing the Target toolkit, which has been designed to help GPs in particular, in a primary care survey in November 2014. A patient safety alert went to providers and commissioners in 2015, highlighting the importance of programmes such as Target. The House might be interested to know that the Target programme gives GPs help in understanding how to deal with the pressure from patients, because a lot of inappropriate antibiotic prescribing comes from the pressure from patients to walk away with an antibiotic script. Work is being done, but we know that we have more to do.
I thank the Minister for her reply. Disappointingly, the most recent data show Bolton to be one of the highest prescribers of antimicrobial agents in Greater Manchester, and it is in the highest quartile nationally. Although Bolton CCG has seen reductions in antibiotic prescribing following guidance given to GPs, when will the Target antibiotics toolkit be fully implemented across all CCGs in England?
Public Health England is doing a huge amount of work on this. There has been a very welcome drop in prescribing in the last year and that appears in the data available for this year. That gives us encouragement. Of course, 79% of antibiotic prescribing occurs outside hospital, so my hon. Friend is right to highlight general practices. I draw his attention to Public Health England’s Fingertips portal, which allows both providers and commissioners to assess how they are doing compared with other areas locally. That is allowing us to see where we have particular problems. It varies around the country and Public Health England is leading the action being taken in that regard.
The growth of antibiotic resistance is a massive problem worldwide, as the Minister knows. No new antibiotics have been classified for more than 25 years. This is a real problem, as antibiotic resistance increases. What are the Government doing to address the issue?
As I have said, it was our Prime Minister who commissioned the independent O’Neill review, showing astonishing foresight, and that review is now galvanising the discussion. I was at the World Health Assembly in Geneva in May, and the review was the talk of Geneva. Lord O’Neill presented it to many delegations from around the world and we now need to move forward. As well as working on human health, we are also looking to work with animal health organisations, as we take forward the very important recommendations on prescribing and the use of antibiotics as growth stimulators.
NHS Services for EU Nationals and UK Citizens Abroad
3. If he will make an assessment of the potential effect of the UK leaving the EU on the availability of NHS services for (a) EU nationals living, studying and working in the UK and (b) UK citizens abroad. (905655)
Before I start, the House will want to mark an important milestone, which is that this year, alongside Arnold Schwarzenegger, Brian May, Camilla Parker Bowles and Meat Loaf, the NHS is 68 years old, and its birthday is, in fact, today. I know that we will all want to wish the NHS and all who work there a very happy birthday.
As long as the UK is subject to EU law, current arrangements remain in place. As we move to a new relationship with Europe, our guiding principle will be to get the best possible deal for British citizens who live and work in, and who visit, EU countries. An EU unit will be set up in the Cabinet Office and will report to the Cabinet, and my Department will feed into its work.
I am aware that nothing will change for the next two years, but what is the Secretary of State’s proposal for reciprocity of access to healthcare within the EU, and does he envisage the £500 NHS immigration health surcharge applying to EU nationals already living in the UK?
The health surcharge that this Government have instituted for people on long-term visas to come and work and live in the UK is the right thing to do, because it is important that everyone makes a fair contribution to the cost of NHS services. In terms of future arrangements for EU nationals in the UK, that would obviously be subject to the negotiations that now happen, and a very important part of those negotiations will be access to the EU health systems for British citizens currently living in EU countries.
Will the Secretary of State tell the House how many EU nationals work in the national health service and how many EU nationals use the national health service? Is it not the case that the number of eastern Europeans, especially, coming to this country has simply overwhelmed GP practices and A&E centres up and down the country, and now we have got a chance to redress the balance?
Without wanting to reopen the debate that concluded on 23 June, the overwhelming view in the NHS is that we are very lucky to have the incredible support of 110,000 EU nationals working in the health and social care system. I want to put on record to this House what a fantastic job they do and how much we are all in their debt.
Very many of those 110,000 people are now acutely anxious about their future in this country, because of the despicable suggestion that they should be used as a bargaining pawn in negotiations with the EU. Will the Secretary of State ensure that the Government, as a matter of urgency, guarantee their future in this country doing their dedicated work in our NHS and care system?
I can reassure the right hon. Gentleman that we are incredibly aware of the brilliant work that EU nationals do, not just in the NHS but in the social care system, which he was responsible for, in care homes up and down the country. We recognise that, and I hope that he will be reassured by statements made by the Foreign Secretary and the Home Secretary yesterday that we want to find a way of allowing those people to stay in the UK for as long as they wish to. We recognise the incredibly valuable contribution that they make, and we are confident in the negotiations ahead that we will be able to secure the outcome that they and we all want.
The last time the Secretary of State and I had an exchange in this Chamber, I suggested to him that it might be the final time we would face each other over the Dispatch Box. Although I was clearly prescient, it has not quite turned out the way I thought it would.
Following the results of the referendum, will the Secretary of State say whether he still intends to introduce an NHS charges Bill as outlined in the Queen’s Speech? Does he agree that migrants give more to the NHS than they take, that their contribution should be welcomed and that our NHS simply could not survive without them?
I enjoyed our many exchanges in this House, and it is a loss on our side as well that they will not continue. I would like to welcome the hon. Lady’s successor to her post, and I hope that I will have a chance to do so again when she asks a question later.
I agree with the hon. Member for Lewisham East (Heidi Alexander). Migrants, or the people who work in the NHS who come from different countries, make an extraordinary contribution. It is fair to say that the NHS would fall over without the incredible work that they do. It is also true that the British people voted to control migration on 23 June, and we have to accept that verdict. In terms of the NHS and social care system, I did not hear, and I have not heard in my time as Health Secretary, enormous amounts of worry about the pressure of migration on NHS services, because on the whole migrants tend to be younger and fitter people. While accepting the verdict of the British people and what they said on 23 June, the important reassurance that we now need to give is to the many people from outside the UK who make a fantastic contribution to the running of our health and care system.
The Secretary of State may be aware that in the wake of the Brexit vote NHS commissioning bosses have delayed funding for vital medicines and services because of the fall in the value of the pound. One affected patient is Abi Longfellow, the teenager who won her battle for a wonder drug thanks to a campaign by the Sunday People. Abi currently spends 11 hours a day on a dialysis machine and was due to start on a drug that would give her a fighting chance with a kidney transplant. We were all aware that the pound might fall post referendum, so will the Secretary of State explain why no contingency plans were put in place and what he will do to ensure that, despite the Brexit vote, patients like Abi receive the lifesaving treatments and medicines that they need?
First, I welcome the hon. Lady to her position. She is the third shadow Health Secretary I have faced in less than a year, and I am beginning to worry that it may be something personal. I wish her well; she knows the brief extremely well and has campaigned on it a great deal in her long parliamentary career. I will look into the case she brought up. I would not want anyone to be deprived of vital lifesaving drugs because of exchange rate fluctuations. The whole British economy, including the NHS, will have to deal with the economic shock that we may now face as a result of the Brexit vote. But now that the decision has been taken by the British people we must look for the opportunities for the UK and the NHS, and not simply worry about the uncertainties, although there will be lots of things we have to deal with.
General Practice and Primary Care
4. What plans his Department has to increase capacity in general practice and primary care. (905656)
6. What plans his Department has to increase capacity in general practice and primary care. (905658)
10. What plans his Department has to increase capacity in general practice and primary care. (905662)
We will be investing an extra £2.4 billion a year in general practice by 2020-21, a 14% increase in real terms. The General Practice Forward View, published earlier this year, sets out a package of support for general practice to boost the workforce, drive efficiencies in workload and modernise primary care infrastructure and technology.
General practitioners in Henley have recently written a letter to all their patients pointing out the difficulties they face in fulfilling their workload. Will the Secretary of State explain what the Government are doing about that and how what they are doing will help?
I am happy to do so. I recognise the picture that my hon. Friend paints—not just in Henley but across the country—of a huge increase in GPs’ workload, which they are finding extremely challenging. What have we done? We have almost 1,300 more GPs working and training in the NHS compared with 2010. We have said that by the end of this Parliament we will seek to make available an additional 10,000 primary and community care staff, including 5,000 doctors working in general practice and 1,000 physician associates. We recognise the problem and are doing something about it.
Given proposals for significant increases in housing across Dorset, my constituents are rightly concerned about access to services, including to GPs. Will the Secretary of State reassure me and my constituents that housing numbers will be taken into account when assessing provision and increasing capacity of general practice in Poole and Dorset?
I am happy to give my hon. Friend that assurance. NHS England looks at areas of new housing very carefully when deciding where to invest additional resources for new GP practices. I recognise those concerns. I was in Dorset at the weekend. It is a lovely place that many people retire to, and of course older people tend to use the NHS more, so it is very important that that is reflected in our investment patterns.
Having met GPs, health centre managers and patient groups in Frome, Wincanton and Somerton in my constituency, I know that GP recruitment is a serious problem in Somerset. What measures is the Department putting in place to address both that issue and the additional challenge of excessive agency costs, both of which are placing a considerable strain on rural health providers?
I am happy to do that—I visited a GP practice with my hon. Friend in the run-up to the last election, and I know the close interest that he takes in this issue. As I said, we are making huge efforts to recruit more GPs during this Parliament, and to do that we must increase the number of medical school graduates to 3,250 a year. We are making progress in that direction, and we have also introduced tough new rules on the use of agencies, including maximum hourly rates for agency doctors and nurses.
Will the Secretary of State do something about the Hardwick commissioning group in north Derbyshire? I met it a week last Friday to talk about dementia care, which he knows is due to change a little, according to the local authorities and so on. Will he tell the group that the mad idea to close Bolsover hospital, and the hospital in Bakewell in Derbyshire Dales, should be stopped? Will he tell Hardwick commissioning group that it has gone beyond its terms of reference, and that those hospitals should remain open?
I recognise the important role that community hospitals play in many of our constituencies, and that role will change as we get better at looking after people at home, which is what people want. We can all be proud of significant progress on dementia in recent years. Dementia diagnosis rates have risen by about 50%—indeed, we think we have the highest diagnosis rates in the world. However, it is not just about diagnosis; it is about what happens when someone receives that diagnosis, and the priority of this Parliament will be to ensure that we wrap around people the care that they need when they receive that diagnosis.
The Health Secretary has just promised 5,000 new GPs, and GP Forward View mentions recruiting 500 GPs from overseas. I understand that Lincolnshire GP leaders are looking to recruit GPs from Spain, Poland and Romania. As we have heard, EU nationals who live in the UK and work in the NHS are seen by the Home Secretary as bargaining chips, which has made them incredibly nervous about their status. How successful does the Health Secretary think that that GP recruitment will be?
This is a time when all sides of the House should be seeking to reassure many people from other countries who do a fantastic job in our NHS that we believe they will have a great future here. The Home Secretary has prioritised doctors, paramedics and nurses in the shortage occupation lists, and in all countries that have points-based systems—look at what happens in Australia or Canada—the needs of the health service and health care system are usually given very high priority.
Mr Speaker, let us note another milestone this year: your election yesterday as a freeman of the City of London. We look forward to you bringing your own flock of sheep to Westminster in future.
The Secretary of State will know that we are facing a diabetes crisis, and by 2025, 5 million people will have been diagnosed with diabetes. There are 32,000 pharmacies in the United Kingdom, with 13,000 community-based schemes. Given that 99% of the population live near a pharmacy, does the Secretary of State agree that more diabetes work should be given to pharmacies, to try to ease the burden and pressure on general practitioners?
There is a lot of potential in what the right hon. Gentleman says. The financial pressures on the NHS and general practice mean that this is the right moment to rethink the role of pharmacies, and consider whether we can be better at tapping into the incredible skills that pharmacists have as trained clinicians, which I do not think we make the most of. He is right to say that diabetes and childhood obesity is a big priority for the Government, and I hope we will be able to inform the House more about that soon.
Pharmacy Access Scheme
5. How much funding he plans to make available for the proposed pharmacy access scheme. (905657)
We intend to announce details of the pharmacy access scheme, including funding, as part of a wider announcement on community pharmacy in 2016-17 and beyond.
Pharmacies play an important role in our community healthcare system. An accessible pharmacy is particularly important for those with mobility issues and for those from communities with a greater propensity to experience health inequalities. However, the planned changes to pharmacy funding risk closing the pharmacies that serve these groups. Will the Minister give me a direct assurance that the pharmacy access scheme will be properly organised and that no pharmacies serving those vulnerable groups will close because of changes in funding?
The hon. Gentleman is right to praise the role pharmacies play and right to identify that we must do all we can to ensure that those who are most vulnerable retain the excellent access they currently have. The national formula on access proposal will be used to identify those pharmacies that are most geographically important for patient access, taking into account isolation criteria based on travel times and distances, and population sizes and needs. Both deprivation and isolation will be covered in the access formula.
Given that the access scheme could potentially alter the situation for community pharmacies, will the Minister consider more money than was originally proposed for community pharmacy budgets to stop any shock from the cuts we are expecting later this financial year?
There are no changes to the funding issues announced when the review of pharmacies started on 15 December. As my right hon. Friend the Secretary of State said, we are hoping to make an announcement on pharmacy when we can. I am aware that pharmacy is waiting for that.
7. What progress his Department has made on improving the safety of maternity care. (905659)
Since 2010, we have invested £37 million in improving the physical environment of over 140 maternity units and purchasing equipment to improve safety. We now have 2,103 more midwives in the NHS and 6,400 more in training than in 2010.
Expectant parents in Colchester are among the first in the UK to have hypnobirthing courses—I recently attended one myself. What consideration has the Secretary of State given to the effectiveness of hypnobirthing in improving maternity safety?
A variety of pioneering techniques, which could make a huge difference to women’s experience of birth, are emerging. I am delighted that we are seeing lots of experimentation and innovation. I would particularly like to pay tribute to my hon. Friend’s trust, which is in special measures and has been through a very difficult period. The fact that it is still managing to do this kind of innovation is wholly to be commended.
Has the Secretary of State seen the Autism Commission report on barriers to healthcare for people with autism? In maternity care and all other care there are very severe barriers that, with the right will and the right action, we can overcome. Will he read the report and talk to me about it?
I am more than happy to do so. In fact, we have a copy of the report right here, which my Minister of State has handily given to me. When I was shadow Minister for disabled people, I had a lot of contact with parents of autistic children and with people on the autistic spectrum themselves. The hon. Gentleman makes a very important point.
The maternity unit at North Devon district hospital in Barnstaple in my constituency is one of the services being reviewed under the current Success Regime. Can the Secretary of State reassure me and my constituents that maternity care, and the safety thereof in what is a geographically huge region, will be the first priority under this review?
I can absolutely assure my hon. Friend on that. I know there are very big national and global events happening right now, but I want to tell the House that over the next month one of my big priorities will be to do something to improve our record on maternity safety. We have made huge progress in reducing stillbirth rates and so on, but maternity safety is still not as good as it should be and certainly not as good as in other countries in western Europe. This is an absolute priority and I hope to be able to inform the House more on this before recess.
As the chair of the all-party group on infant feeding and inequalities, I welcome the new guidance issued by Public Health England, in conjunction with UNICEF Baby Friendly, on the commissioning of infant feeding services. I welcome in particular the recognition of raising infant feeding at the antenatal stage. Will the Secretary of State explain what resources the Department of Health is putting in to promote the guidance and increase breastfeeding at local levels?
We already commit huge resources to that, but we can do more. As I just said, we hope to announce something to the House before the break.
NHS Staff from Other European Countries
8. How many staff working in the NHS have been recruited from other European countries in the last 12 months; and if he will make a statement. (905660)
There are no centrally held data on the countries from which NHS staff are recruited, but self-reported nationality data suggest that 15,723 non-UK European nationals joined the NHS in England and that 7,900 left, leaving a net increase of 7,800. As the Minister responsible for the NHS workforce, may I say that every single one of them is very welcome in, and provides an invaluable contribution to, our NHS?
The problem is that the Immigration Minister’s waffle yesterday and Ministers’ warm words today are not giving confidence to these vital NHS employees. Has the Minister spoken to the Immigration Minister to request that he guarantee permanent residence to every EU national working in the NHS so that they can have the security that they—and we, their patients—need?
The Home Secretary is well aware of the enormous contribution that EU nationals make to the NHS. We all have a duty to undo the damage done during the referendum campaign and the poisonous atmosphere that exists in some parts of our communities and to thank personally—I will be doing so myself—EU nationals working in the NHS for their hard work and dedication so that they feel valued by each and every one of us.
There has been a 27% surge in trainee applications to NHS Scotland because of the conflict around the junior doctors contract in England, and now doctors and academics from the EU are not taking up posts here because of the Brexit vote. With a one-in-four rota gap in many specialties, how does the Minister plan to sustain the current service, let alone extend it?
As much as I admire and like the hon. Lady, my opposite number on the Scottish National party Benches, I think that the behaviour of some of her colleagues in Scotland during the junior doctors dispute was not in the spirit of concord by which we try to establish relations with the devolved Administrations. I do not recognise the figures she quoted about junior doctors—I am glad that we have recruited well in this country during this difficult period—but I know that she will want to thank the British Medical Association for its work in bringing the dispute to an end. I hope that in the next few days we will come to a conclusion suitable for everyone.
I thank the Minister for that and for his welcome to EU nationals here, but with the Secretary of State merely repeating what the Immigration Minister said yesterday and given what the Home Secretary has said, does he not understand the urgent situation facing EU nationals working here? With more than 100,000 of them, do we not want to give them security of residency now to avoid haemorrhaging vital staff from the NHS?
The Home Secretary said she was confident we could get a deal ensuring that they could stay, but we need a new Prime Minister able to start the negotiations caused by the decision of the British people on 23 June. I say in my capacity as a Health Minister— the House has heard from other Members, including the Secretary of State—that we have full confidence in the EU nationals working in the NHS and wish to praise their contribution, which makes the NHS a better organisation.
The head of the NHS, Simon Stevens, has strongly defended the role of immigrants in the NHS, saying that there has never been a time in its 68-year history when the NHS has not
“relied on committed employees from around the world”.
One of these employees was my own mother, who migrated from Jamaica to the UK in the 1950s to be a pupil nurse. Workers from the EU and other countries are the backbone not just of the NHS but of our social care system, which is facing many challenges. Does the Minister agree that we should be thanking these hard-working individuals for their service, not leaving them with questions about their status and job security?
I agree entirely with the hon. Lady that we should be thanking EU nationals working in the NHS and social care system. She herself is evidence of the enormous contribution of migrant labourers, not just in the first generation but in subsequent ones. We, as a nation and a House, should be grateful for it. This is a difficult time for many EU nationals in this country, and we should be thanking them not just for the numbers but for the special qualities they bring. In my constituency, the amazing Portuguese nurses in Ipswich hospital bring qualities and skills that some of our own nurses in our own country do not possess in our own hospitals.
Cost of Interpreters
9. What the cost to the public purse was in 2015-16 of providing interpreters for people using the NHS who did not speak English. (905661)
Until now, data on NHS foreign language translation and interpretation have not been gathered centrally, but I am delighted to say that, as a result of the representations of my hon. Friend and other colleagues, we have changed that, and NHS England is now conducting a major piece of work looking at both commissioning and provider organisations’ expenditure as part of a procurement review. It is worth saying that in view of the importance of effective communication in good diagnosis, informed consent, safeguarding and public health, it is in all our interests that all our patients understand what the doctors and clinicians are saying to them.
I am grateful for that answer, but may I respectfully suggest to the Minister that if we are to have a serious discussion about the costs and the impacts of large-scale migration into the UK on the NHS, we must have access to figures on this cost and we should not have to wait months and months to get them? The figures must be out there somewhere.
My hon. Friend will find no more passionate champion of good data in the NHS than myself. He makes an important point about getting on with this, and I have already signalled to the team in NHS England that we will need to get a grip on this quickly, not least so that the new Administration implementing the Brexit decision will know the figures and have them to hand.
I made a recent freedom of information request to my local hospitals to find out the cost of interpreters. Airedale hospital reported that last year the cost was almost £200,000 and I suspect that, when I receive an answer, it will be even higher at Bradford royal infirmary. This money could be better spent on patient care. Surely it is better for these patients, if they want to contribute to the British way of life, to be able to speak English themselves. What is the Minister’s Department doing with other Government Departments to make sure that people who live in this country can speak English so that money for the NHS goes to the purposes for which it was intended?
Let me gently and respectfully point out that those who work in the NHS and the leaders responsible for it have made it very clear how dependent it is on people who come to work here in the NHS from overseas. Under the terms of our own mandate and indeed our own laws, the NHS has a duty to make sure that it provides proper diagnosis and treatment for all our citizens. For public health and safety, it is in nobody’s interests for citizens of the UK not to be able to integrate, deal with and get proper diagnosis from the system. My hon. Friend’s wider points about the speaking of English are well made, but they are not relevant to this particular question.
Local Dispensing Arrangements
11. What steps his Department plans to take to improve local dispensing arrangements. (905663)
For improving local dispensing arrangements, patients need to receive their NHS prescribed medicines promptly, efficiently, conveniently and to high quality. NHS England is responsible for ensuring that there are adequate arrangements in place for the dispensing of medicines so that this happens across the country. We keep this under constant review.
I have been contacted by a number of disabled constituents who have encountered difficulties receiving dispensed drugs from their local GPs because they fall outside geographical criteria as of last year, therefore adding a significant financial burden. Given instances where dispensing GPs have blocked the arrival of some local pharmacies in parts of my constituency, will the Minister give some consideration to how this discrepancy could be remedied?
I am sorry to hear about the difficulties of my hon. Friend’s constituents. There is a provision within the regulations to enable patients who have serious difficulty in getting to a pharmacy because of the distance involved or the lack of transport to receive dispensing services from a doctor. Doctors should certainly not be blocking the addition of local pharmacies. If my hon. Friend writes to me, I can look into the matter in greater detail.
Taking into account the immeasurable value that community pharmacies provide for some of the most vulnerable people in sections of our society, does the Minister agree that, when it comes to Government budgets, these dispensing services should be included in any ring-fencing that goes on around front-line services?
The hon. Gentleman’s support for these services is well known and what he says is right. The regulations do protect the more vulnerable, but when I next look at them, I will make sure that they fulfil his requirements.
NHS Bursaries: Student Nurses
12. What assessment he has made of the potential effect of the proposed removal of NHS bursaries on the number of applications from mature students for nurse training places. (905664)
Mature students represent a significant proportion of the nursing, midwifery and allied health professions’ workforce. Looking at what happened following the introduction of the maximum £9,000 per annum tuition fees in 2012, the latest UCAS data for last year show that full-time mature student numbers have now significantly exceeded previous levels.
I am proud to have served on the front line of our national health service for the last 10 years, and to ask my first question on its 68th birthday.
St George’s hospital in my constituency is operating at a significant deficit, partly owing to expensive agency staff costs. Does the Minister agree that cutting NHS bursaries for nurses, midwives, radiographers and other allied health professionals will prevent the recruitment and retention of high-quality trained staff and make the problem worse?
I welcome the hon. Lady to her seat. She fought a courageous campaign, and it is good to see her in the Chamber. She brings expertise to the House, which is also very welcome.
I agree with the first part of the hon. Lady’s question—the deficit at her local hospital is indeed partly caused by the excessive costs of agency nurses, and we are trying to put a cap on those costs—but I am afraid I disagree with the second part. I believe that changes in nurse bursaries will enable us to get more nurses and healthcare professionals into the NHS. There has been a similar development in the rest of the higher education sector, and I want to replicate that success in the NHS so that we can provide it with the workers that it requires.
I, too, am delighted to welcome my hon. Friend the Member for Tooting (Dr Allin-Khan) to her seat. Her recent experience on the front line of the NHS will be of great value, and we in the Labour party pride ourselves on listening to NHS staff. Let me also put on record my thanks to my hon. Friend the Member for Lewisham East (Heidi Alexander) for the excellent job that she did as shadow Secretary of State.
I must challenge the Minister again about the impact of this policy on mature students. According to an answer given to me by his colleague the Minister for Universities and Science, in 2010-11 there were 740,000 enrolments in higher education among people aged 21 or over. Let me ask a simple question: in 2014-15, after tuition fees trebled, was the number of enrolments among mature students higher or lower?
I echo the hon. Gentleman’s remarks about the hon. Member for Lewisham East (Heidi Alexander). She gave the House admirable assistance in challenging the Government, and I regret her loss from the Opposition Front Bench.
The latest figure from UCAS, for 2015, shows that the number of mature student applications has risen since the introduction of £9,000 tuition fees, but the hon. Gentleman is right to identify that factor as a challenge in relation to our new plans. That is why we asked open questions during the consultation, and I hope that, now that it has closed, we shall be able to respond to those questions to ensure that we can give the best possible assistance to mature students who want to become nurses.
According to the universities Minister, the number of mature students enrolling in universities has fallen by 22%. If that were repeated in the health sector, what is already a staffing crisis would become a catastrophe. The Minister has said that an extra 10,000 training places will be created during the current Parliament, but everything I have heard from the Government suggests that that figure was plucked out of thin air. What is the baseline figure for the Minister’s claim—10,000 more places compared to when?
There will be 10,000 additional places over the five years from when the policy was announced last year, and that will give NHS organisations throughout the country the assistance that will enable them to bring down their agency costs. It is only through such bold initiatives that we can reform the NHS for the betterment of patient care throughout the country.
13. What assessment his Department has made of the potential effect of measures to reduce the size of NHS deficits on NHS staff numbers. (905665)
Trusts and foundation trusts are responsible for ensuring that their workforces are affordable, given the financial control totals that have been set for this financial year. We are clear about the fact that the first priority in the reduction of provider deficits will be to reduce unsustainable spending on high-cost temporary staff.
Five per cent. of NHS workers in England come from the European Union. What steps is the Minister taking to ensure that every effort is made to retain those skilled workers, and will he provide them with the confirmation of their permanent employment status that they so urgently need?
At the risk of repeating what the Secretary of State and I have said previously, we very much welcome the contribution of all EU nationals working in the NHS. It is for the process of the negotiations to establish the precise status of everyone, both EU nationals and British nationals working abroad. That was not my choice at the referendum, but the decision has been made by the British people. I hope that the hon. Lady will take comfort from what the Home Secretary has been clear about: that she hopes to be able to secure a deal so that we can retain EU nationals in this country.
Can the Minister confirm that the challenge to NHS budgets will not compromise in any way the provision of sufficient consultants and middle-grade doctors to not only keep North Middlesex hospital open, but to provide sufficient care to patients and proper quality training to trainee doctors?
The problems at my hon. Friend’s hospital are a result of management issues and long-running troubles that the hospital has encountered. I hope we will be able to fix them in the short term and provide long-term solutions, which I will be briefing about in the days to come.
Order. Progress has been rather slow today, but I want to accommodate one further inquiry. I call Karin Smyth.
Forward Budget Planning
14. What steps he is taking to ensure that forward budget planning in his Department is robust. (905666)
In the autumn statement and the Budget the Government fully funded NHS England’s five year forward view. We have committed to an extra £10 billion in-year by the end of this Parliament. Furthermore, we have frontloaded it, as we were asked to do by NHS England, with £6 billion extra by the end of 2016-17 with an extra £4 billion for technology funding.
I thank the Minister for his answer. Having published reports on seven areas of the Department’s work since January, members of the Public Accounts Committee, of whom I am one, were looking forward to the publication of the annual accounts with some anticipation. It is becoming clear that Brexit’s impact on staffing, procurement and medicines will be huge, so what is the Minister doing to assess and mitigate the risk to the 2016-17 budget and will this be made clear in this year’s published accounts?
May I first make it clear, as the Prime Minister has done, that nothing immediately changes? We are still full voting-right members of the European Union, and nobody in the system needs to worry about any immediate changes. The Government are putting together a plan for handling the negotiations that now need to be taken forward, and for my own part I as a Minister in the Department have convened a workforce to look at the issues around medicines access. There are three things we need to do: first, to reassure people that this country has a very strong life science and healthcare research system and economy; secondly, to make sure that we negotiate our new relationship with the EU in a way that works; and thirdly, to take advantage of the regulatory freedoms that we now have to make sure that this country is the very best country in the world in which to develop those innovations.
We are most grateful to the Minister for his thesis.
T1. If he will make a statement on his departmental responsibilities. (905643)
As we plan a new relationship with the EU, this Government will continue to ensure that the NHS is given the priority and stability it deserves. I have already sent a message of reassurance to all NHS staff, emphasising the vital role played by the 110,000 EU nationals working in our health and care system. To be able to allow them to continue making their outstanding contribution will be a key priority in our negotiations, and we are confident they will be able to remain in this country as long as they wish. Whatever other changes are happening at a national or international level, the commitment of the British people and this Government to our NHS and its brilliant staff remains unwavering.
A report published yesterday by the health journal Pulse showed that last year two thirds of young people referred by their GP for mental health services received no treatment, and moreover a third were not even assessed. I am a strong supporter of this Government’s commitment to improving mental health care, so what reassurance can the Secretary of State give today that results in child and adolescent mental health services will improve rapidly?
My hon. Friend is right to draw attention to that issue. We, too, are very proud of the progress we have made on mental health, with 1,400 more people accessing mental health services every day than six years ago, but there is a particular job to do with children and young people’s mental health, and we are putting £1.4 billion into that during the course of this Parliament—and there is a specific plan for the Manchester area, which I think will help my hon. Friend’s constituents.
It seems that almost every day there is another report about the deteriorating condition of NHS finances. Today we hear of a survey by the Healthcare Financial Management Association that said 67% of clinical commissioning group finance officers reported a high degree of risk in achieving their financial plan for the year, so does the Secretary of State now accept that the Government need to commit more funds to the NHS?
We have accepted that, which is why in our manifesto at the last election we were committed to putting £5.5 billion more into the NHS than was being promised by the hon. Gentleman’s party, but we have to live within the country’s financial envelope, because we know that without a strong economy we will not have a strong NHS. We will continue to make sure we get that balance right.
T5. In May, the Under-Secretary of State for Health, my hon. Friend the Member for Battersea (Jane Ellison), gave me a very encouraging answer about improving the treatment and diagnosis of Lyme disease. Will she meet me and other concerned colleagues to discuss what more can be done to tackle that terrible condition? (905648)
I am pleased to report that the commissioning of the systematic reviews of the diagnosis and treatment of Lyme disease, which I mentioned at that time, is under way. We expect that work to start in the autumn, and the researchers will approach relevant stakeholders. Once that work is under way, I would be happy to organise a meeting for colleagues at which the experts leading it can brief them further.
T3. Will the Secretary of State join me in welcoming the formation of the all-party parliamentary group on blood donation? Will he agree to take part in and perhaps give evidence to its inquiry into the criteria for blood donation, particularly those regarding men who have sex with men? (905645)
As Members will know, the Department has asked the Advisory Committee on the Safety of Blood, Tissues and Organs—SaBTO—to review the donor selection criteria for blood donation that relate to men who have sex with men. SaBTO has approved the remit, the terms of reference and the work streams, and it is cracking on. It has a second meeting coming up later this month. The chair of the working group has written to the chair of the all-party group, welcoming its inquiry and inviting it to contribute evidence during the autumn.
T7. To expand on the question asked by the shadow Secretary of State, I too would like to raise the case of my constituent Abi Longfellow who suffers from dense deposit disease and is awaiting a decision by the NHS’s specialised commissioning body. She and her family have been subjected to frequent delays and miscommunications. I first met Health Ministers, NICE and NHS England a year ago to discuss Abi’s situation. What steps will the Government take to ensure that decisions on treatments such as this are taken in a timely fashion and that families are kept updated on the progress of those decisions? (905650)
My hon. Friend raises an important point. NHS England is currently unable to take final decisions on this year’s new treatments, including this particular drug, until the courts have decided whether pre-exposure prophylaxis HIV prevention should compete with other candidate drugs. She makes an important point about timeliness, and that is why I am leading an accelerated access review to speed up the way in which such decisions are taken.
T4. In March, the Scottish Government made a commitment to substantially increase the financial support for the victims of contaminated blood. Initially, that will have to be administered through the current system, but the Department of Health appears to be dragging its feet. Will the Secretary of State explain the cause of the hold-up and say how he plans to expedite these payments to people with life-threatening illnesses? (905647)
No one is dragging their feet and we are trying to get this matter sorted out. I have had a number of discussions with the Cabinet Secretary for Health and Sport, Shona Robison, most recently last Thursday. We are working together to facilitate the increased payments, using the current scheme administrator. We want the payments to be made as quickly as possible to people who were infected in Scotland and across the UK. Officials in the Department of Health and officials in Scotland are working closely together to expedite the matter.
T8. Community hospitals such as John Coupland in Gainsborough are very popular, yet health authorities seem intent on centralising services. Will the Secretary of State today make clear his absolute commitment to supporting local community hospitals and giving them work, and state that there will be no closures without his personal authorisation? (905651)
Community hospitals form an important part of the NHS landscape and are valued by local communities, many of which have contributed to them through their fundraising efforts. The Secretary of State has to abide by the decisions of the Independent Reconfiguration Panel and the advice of clinicians, but it is clear that community hospitals that evolve and modernise will have a place in the NHS in the future.
T6. The cancer drugs fund is due to be handed back to NICE later this month. In May, 15 leading UK cancer charities published an open letter detailing their concern that that would see patients missing out on clinically proven cancer drugs because the NICE system is outdated and no longer fit for purpose. Will the Secretary of State agree to carry out a wide-ranging review of NICE’s health technology appraisal process for cancer drugs to ensure that all cancer patients can access the drugs they need? (905649)
I am delighted to assure the hon. Lady that as part of the accelerated access review, we are considering how we can ensure that the £1 billion commitment to the cancer drugs fund is used to accelerate through the most effective treatments, and, through the new system that NHS England is putting in place, to make sure that patients get access to better drugs more quickly.
T9. The Royal Free London NHS Foundation Trust recently signed an agreement to share 1.6 million patient records with Google’s DeepMind subsidiary. The data include medical history, HIV status, past drug overdoses, abortions, and all pathology, radiology and visit records. It is claimed that the data are anonymised, which is impossible given the nature of the data, and no permission was obtained from patients. It is also claimed that the agreement was made under the Secretary of State’s guidelines. Will he tell the House what he is doing to protect the privacy of such information? (905652)
I am very happy to do so. My right hon. Friend has campaigned long and hard, and rightly so, on such issues. The truth is that the guidelines under which the NHS operates for the sharing of patient-identifiable data are not as clear as they need to be. That is why I asked the Care Quality Commission to undertake an independent investigation into the quality of data protection by NHS organisations and Dame Fiona Caldicott to update her guidelines. I hope that we will have news on that soon and certainly before the summer recess, which will please my right hon. Friend.
Happy 68th birthday to the NHS and thank you to its creator, Labour’s Aneurin Bevan.
According to research by the British Lung Foundation, the mortality rates for lung disease have not improved over the past 10 years. Will the Secretary of State take a lesson from the Welsh Government, which have put in place a specific strategy and delivery plan to tackle the issue?
The hon. Gentleman will know that the Under-Secretary of State for Health, my hon. Friend the Member for Battersea (Jane Ellison), opened an exhibition on this topic yesterday and that the Chancellor recently put an extra £5 million into mesothelioma research. Through the National Institute for Health Research, the Government are committing to invest in that disease area. We are also committed to ensuring that we drive up both research and better treatment for such diseases.
Prevention of ill health has to be given a higher priority if the NHS is to meet the challenges set out in the five year forward view. Central to that will of course be the childhood obesity strategy. Has the Secretary of State had any discussions with the Prime Minister about the strategy’s future? Is he in a position to take over the strategy should No. 10 become distracted?
I welcome my hon. Friend’s close interest in ensuring that this important agenda does not get swept aside. I can assure her that we have had many discussions inside Government about what to do. There is a strong commitment to take it forward as soon as possible, and I hope that she will get some good news on that front before too long.
Will the Minister responsible for public heath confirm when a statement on contaminated blood will be made to the House, and in particular on the response to the consultation that closed in April?
I am not in a position to be specific about when we can make a statement, but I can give the hon. Lady and other interested Members the absolute assurance that we continue to look closely at the issue. We have read every single response that we have received. I was at a well-attended all-party group meeting on 25 May and gave people a sense of the direction of travel of our analysis. I hope to keep the House updated.
Will the Minister confirm how he plans to implement the General Practice Forward View? Will he also confirm that sustainability and transformation plans will be returned to for further development if they fail to deliver the investment in general practice mandated by the forward view?
Yes indeed, we are developing detailed plans to implement the 80-plus commitments set out in the General Practice Forward View, which has been widely welcomed. The development of GP practices will be incorporated into sustainable plans.
There is a shortage of GPs across the country, but certain areas, especially deprived areas such as Halton, have a high rate of sickness, in particular respiratory diseases and cancer. Is any action being taken to target those areas? Has the Minister had any discussions about that with NHS England?
Although there is a general shortage, to which my right hon. Friend referred when speaking about the work being done to recruit, retain and return GPs, bursaries are available in particularly difficult areas as incentives for people to go to such areas. NHS England concentrates on trying to ensure that under-doctored areas are properly resourced.
The recently published Mental Health Taskforce report recommended that NHS England should by 2021 support at least 30,000 more women annually with specialist mental healthcare during the perinatal period. Will my right hon. Friend assure me that the Department will be working to reach that target?
I thank my hon. Friend for her question. Thanks to the Prime Minister’s excellent initiative in relation to perinatal mental health and the £390 million extra added to that, I can indeed confirm that work is already under way to increase the number of beds in the 15 existing perinatal mental health units. There are plans for three more in the south-west, the east of England and the north-west. This has been an important initiative, and perinatal mental health is very high up among my priorities and those of the NHS.
Order. Despite the fact that we are late, I am keen to try to satisfy the inquisitorial appetite of colleagues, but can do so best if they are each now very brief.
What is the Health Secretary doing to ensure that the NHS gets the £350 million a week that it was promised during the referendum campaign?
I am a little stumped, because I was never really sure whether we would see that money. All I can say is that I am committed to successful negotiations with the EU, and I am delighted that a number of people who championed the Brexit vote have said that any extra funding should go to the NHS.
As we celebrate the 68th birthday of the NHS—one of the Labour party’s proudest achievements—let us not forget the fact that there are thousands of people across our country with mental health conditions who continue to face stigma, discrimination and prejudice. Recent reports tell us that young people are waiting up to a decade to receive the appropriate treatment, and future plans for children and young people’s mental health are not up to scratch. Will the Minister please tell us how many more NHS birthdays will have to pass before real equality for mental health is secured?
How I miss the hon. Lady sitting on the Opposition Front Bench with her questions on mental health. I pay tribute to the exceptional work that she has done in this particular area. The £1.25 billion extra that is going into children and young persons’ mental health over the course of this Parliament—I along with other Members in the House have absolutely fought to make sure that it stays in the plans—will help. We have done more work than ever before in relation to combating stigma, but she is right to raise that, as it is essential that we do. It is also essential that the money that is provided centrally goes through clinical commissioning groups into mental health spending, and I am quite sure that she and I will make sure that happens.
The Secretary of State and others have sought to reassure us that nothing changes immediately with Brexit, but that is not right for the NHS. The impact on the economy is already clear, and that will have a knock-on effect on our health service. That is why I will meet local leaders in Wirral on Friday to try to formulate a Brexit plan for the NHS. Will the Secretary of State receive that plan and take all necessary steps to protect the health service in Wirral?
Of course, and we will take every step necessary to protect the NHS throughout the country, because it remains our most important public service. I am sure that, economically, the period ahead will be difficult, but now that we have had the argument and the British people have made their decision, it is also important that we talk up the opportunities from the new relationships that we may have in the future, and the extra funding that those could generate for the NHS, and I certainly hope that that is what happens.
Last, I call Mhairi Black.
An elderly constituent of mine came to my surgery to explain that, sadly, her husband had passed away as a result of being infected with hepatitis C during the contaminated blood scandal. She has applied to the Skipton Fund four times, and has been turned down because her husband’s medical records have been destroyed since his death. Can the Minister offer any advice on how I can best move forward with this? I am also happy to meet her to give her more background information.
I think the latter suggestion might be the better one. I am happy to meet the hon. Lady and talk about the matter in more detail.
Point of Order
On a point of order, Mr Speaker. As there is a slightly more relaxed atmosphere, I wonder whether the House will indulge me as I offer a broad thank you. Twenty-four years and one month ago, I answered my first oral questions as a junior Minister, and now I have just completed my last one. This is not a sudden post-Brexit resignation—it is not catching. A few weeks ago, I made it clear to the Secretary of State, the Prime Minister and the Chief Whip that, after the referendum, I would not seek a post in what I expected to be a reshuffled Government. In the event, I hope to carry on with my duties until September, but that was my last oral questions. Therefore, in taking the chance that most Ministers do not get because we never know when the end will come, I thank colleagues for their forbearance over many years in subjects as varied as child support, disability, and the Arab spring—and in the relentless pursuit of mental health data by the hon. Member for Liverpool, Wavertree (Luciana Berger). I am looking forward to taking part in more questions from another seat in the Chamber, and I wish all colleagues very well indeed.
Further to that point of order, Mr Speaker—
I will come to the hon. Lady’s point of order, but first let me say that although that is a relatively unconventional way of expressing appreciation, the Minister of State was typically courteous in signalling in advance to me his wish to do so, and I simply want to say to the right hon. Gentleman—I think I can say it without fear of contradiction, and it was evident from the response to his point—that he is an extremely popular and respected Minister who commands widespread affection and loyalty in all parts of the House. We very much look forward to his continuing contributions, albeit in the future from the Back Benches. I thank him for what he said and the way in which he said it.
Exactly on that point, Mr Speaker, may I, on behalf of everyone on the Opposition Benches, pay tribute to the right hon. Gentleman? He has been an absolutely fantastic Minister and he is a brilliant MP. Long may he continue.
That is extremely welcome and I thank the hon. Lady for what she has said.
(Urgent Question): To ask the Secretary of State to make a statement on today’s teachers strike and its impact on children, parents and school communities.
Let me first declare my interest as a retired NUT member. Not only have we had the first junior doctors strike on this Government’s watch, but today we have failure in another public service, with a teachers strike. Sadly, this Government have relished attacking—
Order. I do not wish to disrupt the flow of the hon. Gentleman’s eloquence or the eloquence of his flow, but at this point all he needs to do is ask his urgent question. His more detailed supplementary will come after he has heard what the Minister has to say, in which I am sure he is extremely interested.
There is absolutely no justification for this strike. The National Union of Teachers asked for talks, and we are having talks. Since May, the Department for Education has been engaged in a new programme of talks with the major teaching unions, including the NUT, focused on all the concerns raised during the strike. Even before then we were engaged in round-table discussions with the trade unions, and both the Secretary of State and I meet the trade union leaders regularly to discuss their concerns.
This strike is politically motivated and has nothing to do with raising standards in education. In the words of Deborah Lawson, the general secretary of the non-striking teacher union Voice, today’s strike is a
“futile and politically motivated gesture”.
Kevin Courtney, the acting general secretary of the NUT, made it clear in his letter to the Secretary of State on 28 June that the strike was about school funding and teacher pay and conditions, yet this year’s school budget is greater than in any previous year, at £40 billion—some £4 billion higher than 2011-12. At a time when other areas of public spending have been significantly reduced, the Government have shown our commitment to education by protecting school spending.
We want to work with the profession and with the teacher unions, and we have been doing that successfully in our joint endeavour to reduce unnecessary teacher workload. With 15,000 more teachers in the profession than in 2010, teaching remains one of the most popular and attractive professions in which to work. The industrial action by the NUT is pointless, but it is far from inconsequential. It disrupts children’s education, inconveniences parents, and damages the profession’s reputation in the eyes of the public, but our analysis shows that because of the dedication of the vast majority of teachers and headteachers, seven out of eight schools are refusing to close.
Our school workforce is and must remain a respected profession suitable for the 21st century, but this action is seeking to take the profession back in public perception to the tired and dated disputes of the 20th century. More importantly, this strike does not have a democratic mandate from a majority even of NUT members. It is based on a ballot for which the turnout was just 24.5%, representing less than 10% of the total teacher workforce.
Our ground-breaking education reforms are improving pupil outcomes, challenging low expectations and poor pupil behaviour in schools, and increasing the prestige of the teaching profession. This anachronistic and unnecessary strike is a march back into a past that nobody wants our schools to revisit.
Not only have we had the first junior doctors strike on this Government’s watch, but today we have failure in another public service with the teachers strike. Sadly, this Government have relished attacking education professionals, undermining them and describing them as “the blob”, instead of engaging with them and celebrating their role in driving up individual child and school performance. At a time when people have a right to look to Government for stability and security, a breakdown of trust among teachers and a strike of this nature is most unfortunate.
At the heart of this is concern felt by people on the frontline, be they teachers, head teachers or parents, about future school budgets. Everyone knows that despite the Secretary of State’s protestations, school budgets are going to fall in real terms, year on year, up to 2020. Head teachers know it, parents know it, and the Institute for Fiscal Studies has confirmed it. The only person who is shoving her head in the sand in total denial is the Secretary of State. That failure of Government has resulted in what we are witnessing today—massive disruption, classes cancelled and pupils sent home.
The Chancellor has made it clear that he is tearing up his fiscal rules. As my hon. Friend the Member for Manchester Central (Lucy Powell) asked yesterday, will the Government now commit to securing our children’s future by reversing the planned cut in funding and securing the necessary cash for our nation’s children? As I asked yesterday, will the Minister commit to publishing the Government’s response to the School Teachers Review Body by the end of this academic year so that head teachers can plan effectively?
It is clear that the Government have lost the plot. They have a problem with teachers—they cannot recruit or retain enough, and they have lost teachers’ confidence in large numbers. It is clear today that our children, who are our future, are paying the price of Tory education failure.
It is nice to hear from the shadow shadow Schools Minister on the fourth row of the Opposition Benches. The only people who are undermining the teaching profession are the leadership of the National Union of Teachers. I am disappointed that the hon. Gentleman is jumping on this dispute to make cheap political points, instead of joining the Government and condemning this unnecessary and pointless strike. Will he now say that he opposes this strike by the NUT, which is disrupting children’s education and inconveniencing parents?
Finally, just to respond to the hon. Gentleman’s point about the School Teachers Review Body report, we will publish the report, together with our response and a draft revised school teachers pay and conditions document, as soon as we have completed our consideration of it.
Parents do not know why many teachers have gone on strike, and I am sure many of the teachers themselves do not understand why this strike is taking place. What parents do know is how difficult it is to make arrangements for childcare at short notice. Will the Minister pay tribute to the many teachers who are in work today, doing the right thing by their pupils?
My hon. Friend is right. These strikes not only damage children’s education, with every extra day of school missed damaging the outcomes for those children, but hugely inconvenience working parents, who have to make childcare arrangements or take a day off work in order to look after their children. So I share my hon. Friend’s comments, and I pay tribute to the vast majority of teachers and head teachers who are working today, resulting in seven out of eight schools refusing to close.
As in the case of the junior doctors dispute, I am sure that the general public watching this debate will see through this Government’s mirage and their fascination with what they seem to think is the picture out there. Taking strike action is one of the most difficult decisions any teacher makes. No one takes that decision lightly, but teachers have said enough is enough. They are fed up with the cuts, which 70% of heads say are directly affecting educational standards. Will the Minister now accept that class sizes are increasing, pupils are getting less choice about the subjects they learn, jobs are going and children are getting less individual time with staff?
I find the Minister’s faith in the free market’s ability to decide teachers’ salaries touchingly naive, on a day when the pound has fallen to a 31-year low. Can he tell us whether there is any limit to how far he is prepared to see teachers’ salaries fall? Meanwhile, the Secretary of State has refused to say anything about what will happen to teachers’ pay and conditions in September, and we have still not heard anything about that from the Minister. We are less than a month from the end of term, so will he finally end the uncertainty and update the House on what teachers can expect?
Unfortunately, the Secretary of State seems to be spending more time on the Justice Secretary’s campaign for the Tory leadership than on her day job. Will the Minister now agree to get around the table and thrash out a better deal for the next generation, which is what every parent across the country wants? The working conditions of our teachers are the learning conditions of our children, and our children deserve the very best.
What the public are seeing is a Labour party that is equivocal about whether it agrees with strike action that is disrupting children’s education. The hon. Lady is not prepared to condemn strike action that is not only damaging children’s education but hugely inconveniencing working parents, who have to make alternative arrangements for looking after their children.
The hon. Lady talks about class sizes, but the average infant class size has remained at 27.4—unchanged from 2015. Indeed, of the 3,066 infant classes with 31 or more pupils, 80% have just 31 pupils, and that is because of the flexibility we have built in to allow one or two extra children—for example, twins—to have access to those schools. Will the hon. Lady condemn that policy?
I have said that we will publish the STRB report when consideration of it is complete. We will consult teachers and stakeholders about the future of the STRB and about the arrangements when all schools are academies. However, let me give the hon. Lady one final chance to say, on behalf of the Labour party, that it condemns this unnecessary and futile strike by the National Union of Teachers.
Working mums and dads in my constituency will today be hugely inconvenienced by this completely unnecessary strike action. Many of them work in the local NHS and in local public services and social services, and their patients and customers will be inconvenienced by their absence as part of a politically motivated strike that is, frankly, an embarrassment to many members of the NUT itself. Will my hon. Friend the Minister praise those teachers who have walked across picket lines today to teach children in our local schools? They are the shining example, not the NUT.
Yes, my hon. Friend is absolutely right. Nothing is more important than ensuring that young people get a good education—that they master the basics of reading and writing, get good GCSEs and are prepared for life in modern Britain. I do pay tribute to all those teachers who have gone into work today, despite the NUT’s action, which is based on a ballot of less than 25% of its members. We want to make sure that no child’s education is disrupted, and I pay tribute to the fact that seven out of eight schools have refused to close.
This strike by teachers is significant. This group of people have gone into a vocational and caring profession. They are not driven by money, but they do seek to be recognised and valued for the job they do. The ongoing erosion of teachers’ pay and conditions and their increasing workload make their vocation hard to live out, particularly when they could earn more and have better terms and conditions working in the local supermarket. It is easy to say at the Dispatch Box that teachers are valued, but actions have to match the rhetoric. Yesterday in Education questions, I asked the Minister a question, and I repeat it today: what is he doing to ensure that teachers have a nationally guaranteed level of pay? How is he working with teachers to reduce their workload? How is he protecting their terms and conditions, such as maternity and sick pay?
Kevin Courtney, the acting general secretary of the NUT, has made it clear that the dispute is about pay and conditions. On workload, what is disappointing about the strike is that we have been working extremely closely and constructively with all the teacher unions to tackle unnecessary workload. As a consequence of our discussions, we have established three workload groups, staffed by highly experienced teachers and headteachers. We have looked at data management, planning and dialogic marking. Those groups have all reported, and we have accepted all their recommendations. That will have a genuine effect on the top three workload issues highlighted by the Secretary of State’s workload challenge, to which 44,000 teachers responded. On teachers’ pay and conditions, as we move into a situation where more and more schools become academies, we will consult with the profession about the future of the STRB process.
If the shadow Secretary of State is right that strike action is always a big and difficult decision, is it not about time that strike action is not allowed when such a derisory proportion of members—in this case, 24%—vote for it, particularly given the huge disruption it causes to pupils’ education, to parents’ lives and to other teachers, who have to cover for those who are out on strike?
My hon. Friend is absolutely right. The Trade Union Act 2016 will ensure that industrial action in essential services gets the go-ahead only after a ballot of at least 50% of members. Bearing in mind that the turnout for this ballot was just 24.5%, this strike would not be legal if the new regulations had taken effect. We are consulting with stakeholders on the regulations, and the thresholds are likely to come into force later this year.
I received a message today from Nicola, a teacher—I am sure her class is not full of twins—who said that she is trying to work out how to fit next year’s class of 34 into a room with furniture for just 28 children, while also making leaving cards for four members of staff. What does the Minister have to say to Nicola?
What I would say is that the percentage of pupils in infant classes of more than 30 is 5.8%, which is down from 6.2% in January 2015. In the last five or six years, we have created 600,000 more school places. We have doubled the amount of capital going into creating new school places, compared with that spent by the previous Labour Government. Incidentally, they removed 200,000 primary school places, which is the problem we have had to tackle, and they did not plan for the increased birth rate.
Our teachers do a fantastic job, but does the Minister agree that there are ways to protest that do not involve damaging children’s education and inconveniencing parents? Does he agree that there has to be the strongest possible justification for such drastic action and that that threshold has not been met in this case?
My hon. Friend is absolutely right. Ministers in the Department are always open to having discussions with trade union leaders. We have one-to-one discussions, we attend the new programme of talks and we attend the roundtable talks. Officials also have regular talks with the trade unions. This is not a necessary strike, because those discussions are always taking place. This has more to do with the internal workings of the NUT than with the real pay and conditions of teachers in this country.
Has the Minister not got a cheek to be talking about 20,000-odd teachers deciding to strike for a moment or two, when he is part of a Government who are going to let only 120,000 people decide the Prime Minister, instead of having a general election? Does he agree with that?
The hon. Gentleman talks about 20,000 teachers, but there are 456,000 teachers in this country—the highest number in our history. He has been a Member of this House for a long time, and he knows that we live in a parliamentary democracy.
This is an England-only strike. There are no strikes in Wales, Scotland or Northern Ireland, because their devolved Governments listen to and respect teachers. Standards have increased in Wales year on year, and the gap with England is closing. Where teachers are valued and listened to, that does not lead to strike action. The Minister should follow the lead of the devolved nations in supporting all teachers.
The problem with education in Wales is that standards are behind those in this country. In fact, yesterday we were asked what advice we could give to the Welsh Government about our academies programme, our reforms to the curriculum, and our reforms of GCSEs and A-levels, which are resulting in higher and improving standards in this country. The gap, I suspect, is widening.
As we now have a Chancellor talking about post-Brexit largesse, what do Ministers intend to do to ensure that the projected schools funding cuts are prevented?
We have protected school funding on a per-pupil basis. School funding is now at £40 billion—the highest it has ever been, and £4 billion more than in 2011-12. Because of the decisions that the Chancellor took in his Budgets, particularly the June 2010 Budget, we are not facing, and have not faced, the crisis facing countries such as Greece that had the same deficit as a percentage of the budget. We have not faced their crisis of closing schools, slashing salaries, and cutting numbers of teachers; we have maintained stability in our system. The average class size has remained stable in that period despite the fact that we have also created 600,000 more school places.
There is a section of the Government that does not believe in experts, but, for the record, is the Minister really contradicting the Institute for Fiscal Studies, which predicts an 8% fall by 2020 in school budgets, in real terms?
We are aware that there are costs that schools have to face in the coming years, but we have protected school funding. If we look across Whitehall, we see the reduction in spending that we have had to secure to tackle the record public sector deficit that we inherited in 2010—£156 billion, or 11% of GDP. It is now down to less than 4% of GDP, thanks to those savings. We have issued significant guidance to schools about how they can manage their budgets and procure savings and efficiencies in the way they run their schools to meet these challenges.
I congratulate my hon. Friend the Member for Scunthorpe (Nic Dakin) on ensuring that the Government are held to account on the failure in education policy, which is very important. The Minister should know, as he articulated, how real the demoralisation is of teachers in our schools. Have the Government made any assessment of the impact on our children’s education of how demoralised teachers are? Why do the Government not take serious steps to try to lift the morale of teachers rather than constantly denigrating them in this Chamber?
No one on the Government Benches is denigrating teachers. Teachers in this country are a much respected profession who are providing a very high, and improving, quality of education to young people. We have reformed the primary curriculum and the secondary curriculum, and we have reformed GCSEs, putting them on a par with the best qualifications in the world. The teaching profession has responded magnificently to those new challenges. Today we have published the key stage 2 results on a pupil basis, and we see that two thirds of pupils are now meeting the new expected standards in reading and 70% of pupils are meeting the new expected standards in mathematics. That is a tremendous achievement given the very significant rise in the expectations and rigour of the new primary curriculum.
Just to be clear, does the Minister accept the IFS’s prediction that school budgets will fall by over 8% up to 2020—yes or no?
School budgets have been protected. We are spending £40 billion, and we have said that per-pupil funding for schools is protected throughout this Parliament. Schools will face increased costs of salaries, pension contributions and national insurance, but we have provided advice to them about how they can meet those challenges to procure more efficiently and to make sure that their staffing arrangements provide the best education within their budgets. We have protected school funding throughout this Parliament.
Perhaps I need to declare an interest, as my sister is a teacher. With regard to why she would go on strike, it is not just about her terms and conditions—it is about the pupils to whom she believes she has a responsibility. The Minister has mentioned record budgets. Will he confirm or deny whether, in real terms, the budget has gone up per pupil?
It has gone up in real terms overall, as I have said, and £40 billion is the highest ever level of spending. We have had to take some very difficult public spending decisions over the past six years because of the mismanagement of the public finances by the Labour Government—a party and a Government whom the hon. Gentleman supported. As a consequence of taking those difficult decisions, we are not facing the challenges that other countries in Europe that have had similar levels of public sector deficit have had to face.
I think that our constituents would expect us to try to cool the temperature here. Those of us who have been around in education for some time know that previous Labour Governments have had their disagreements with the NUT. The fact of the matter is that there are a lot of unhappy teachers out there at the moment, and they do have some real concerns. This is an important statement. Indeed, what other statement could have got the whole ragtag and bobtail that remains of the Government Front Bench here at one time? This is a serious matter. Let us cool the temperature, talk to teachers, meet their concerns, and get them back to work.
I totally agree with the hon. Gentleman and former Chair of the Education Committee; he is right. We do talk to the teaching profession. We have regular discussions. The Secretary of State and I, and other Ministers, regularly visit schools up and down the country and talk to teachers. There is no question but that the reforms that have been put in place over the past five or six years have been very significant; we do not resile from stating that. It was important that we raised standards of reading and arithmetic in primary schools, that we reintroduced grammar into the primary curriculum, and that we revised and improved the curriculum in secondary education. We have to make sure that our young people are prepared for life in modern Britain and prepared to compete in an increasingly competitive global jobs market, and we are delivering on that. I am delighted by the way in which the profession has responded to those challenges.
Does the Minister agree that teachers are the experts in education, and that when these professionals have genuine concerns that funding cuts are damaging the education of our children, it would be irresponsible of them not to make those concerns known to Government? If the teaching profession had the respect and the ear of this Government, they would not be in the position of having to take last-resort strike action to protect the education of our children.
No, I think that is an anachronistic approach to discussing important political issues. We have regular discussions with the teacher unions. We have all kinds of reference groups of representative teachers whom we meet regularly in the Department for Education. We are very aware of teachers’ concerns about the changing curriculum and worries about workload. We had a workload challenge to which 44,000 teachers responded. We take all these issues very seriously, and we respond to concerns. We do not want to go back to the 1980s and have strikes as a way of engaging in issues of concern. They are not necessary, and most teachers agree with that.
The Minister can say all he likes about school budgets going up, but the facts on the ground paint a very different picture. One of the schools in my constituency has had to close down its summer school, which was deliberately targeted at helping deprived students to catch up before the beginning of the school year. Will he look at that example, and other examples that other hon. Members are sure to raise, to make sure that the funding cuts do not impact on deprived students, in particular?
Yes, of course I will look at any individual examples that the hon. Lady or any other hon. Member wants to bring my attention, and I will make sure that the school is receiving the best possible advice on how to manage its budget.
Schools in my constituency are affected by industrial action today, and governors have been clear with me and with parents that it is funding pressures, particularly in relation to children with special educational needs, that are forcing them to make redundancies to balance their budgets. Will the Minister guarantee that the needs of children with special needs are adequately funded?
We want to make sure that the education of those children in particular, and that of all vulnerable children, is protected. One of the reasons we introduced the pupil premium, which provides £2.5 billion a year, was to make sure that funding goes to the most vulnerable children in our school system. We are consulting on the national funding formula and on the high needs funding formula. That consultation has closed and we will respond to it shortly.
My impression is that the Minister is prepared to hand out blame but not to accept it. He says that this action is damaging children’s education and disrupting parents, but his Government’s decision to impose on primary teachers of key stage 2 a new four-year curriculum that they had only two years to deliver led to a chaotic series of results, which were published today. The results have upset parents and they are much worse than the Secretary of State predicted. Does that not harm children’s education more than the antics of the NUT today?
No, it does not. The new curriculum is essential if we are to prepare young people for life in modern Britain and equip them to do well at secondary school. The previous levels did not ensure that children, including those reaching level 4 at the end of key stage 2, went on to get at least five good GCSEs. This curriculum is much more rigorous and it has been designed to be on a par with the best education jurisdictions in the world. Some 66% of pupils are already meeting the new expected standard in reading, while 70% are meeting it in maths and 72% in grammar, punctuation and spelling. I think that teachers have done a great job in preparing pupils for this new, more demanding curriculum.
Brilliant former colleagues of mine have been brought to their knees by the unmanageable and exhaustive workloads introduced by this Government. Given that more teachers left the profession than joined it last year, does the Minister accept the link between teachers’ morale and the huge numbers leaving the profession?
Let me give the hon. Gentleman some facts: in 2015, 43,000 teachers left the profession—some due to retirement, while others went into other walks of life—but 45,000 entered it. Some 14,000 people returned to the profession, which is a higher number than the 11,000 in 2011. I do not recognise the picture painted by the hon. Gentleman. Whenever I visit universities and schools and make public statements, I talk up the profession, to encourage young graduates and sixth formers to think about a career in a very important and highly respected profession.
I do worry about the Minister’s arithmetic capabilities when he sets himself against the IFS, which has clearly said that school budgets will be cut by 8% in real terms by 2020. That is one side of the equation. The other side, as my hon. Friend the Member for Wythenshawe and Sale East (Mike Kane) has said, is teacher morale, which has been compounded by some of the changes to the curriculum and the additional workload. Why have Ministers set their face against the teaching profession in this way? Have they not today reaped what they have sown?
I accept that the changes implemented in the past five years have been radical. They have taken many years to prepare. The primary curriculum was published in 2013 and became law in September 2014, and the first assessment of it took place in May 2016. The first teaching of the English and maths GCSE reforms began in September 2015, after four or five years of preparation, and the first teaching of a number of other subjects will take place this September. I understand the work involved in preparing for a new specification and a new curriculum, but the changes are hugely important and they will have a dramatic impact on the standard of education in our state schools in the year ahead. That is a prize well worth delivering, and I hope that the hon. Gentleman will support higher academic standards in our state schools.
In encouraging people to go into teaching, what reassurance can the Minister give to those who want to teach art, drama and music that there will be departments that require their services in the years ahead?
There was a Westminster Hall debate on this issue yesterday, during which I set out the figures for art and design and for music. They show that the take-up and entry figures for those subjects have remained stable, notwithstanding the introduction of the EBacc combination of core academic subjects. It is important that more young people take those core academic subjects of maths, English, science, a humanity subject and a modern foreign language at GCSE. That is what happens in a number of high-performing jurisdictions around the world. We want our young people to be competent in a foreign language. That is why we set a target that 90% of pupils will be taking the EBacc combination by 2020, but that does not mean that there is no space or time in the school curriculum for those important creative arts subjects.
Digital Economy Bill
Presentation and First Reading (Standing Order No. 57)
Secretary John Whittingdale, supported by the Prime Minister, Secretary Sajid Javid, Secretary Stephen Crabb, Secretary Greg Clark, Secretary Nicky Morgan, Secretary Amber Rudd, secretary Elizabeth Truss, Matthew Hancock, Mr David Gauke and Mr Edward Vaizey, presented a Bill to make provision about electronic communications infrastructure and services; to provide for restricting access to online pornography; to make provision about protection of intellectual property in connection with electronic communications; to make provision about data-sharing; to make provision about functions of OFCOM in relation to the BBC; to provide for determination by the BBC of age-related TV licence fee concessions; to make provision about the regulation of direct marketing; to make other provision about OFCOM and its functions; and for connected purposes.
Bill read the First time; to be read a Second time tomorrow, and to be printed (Bill 45) with explanatory notes (Bill 45-EN).
Business without Debate
Supply and Appropriation (Main Estimates) Bill
Motion made, and Question put forthwith (Standing Order No, 56), That the Bill be now read a Second time.
Question agreed to.
Bill accordingly read a Second time.
Question put forthwith, That the Bill be now read a Third time.
Question agreed to.
Bill accordingly read the Third time and passed.
[1st Allocated Day]
Considered in Committee
[Mrs Eleanor Laing in the Chair]
Permanence of the National Assembly for Wales and Welsh Government
I beg to move amendment 17, page 1, leave out lines 5 to 9 and insert—
“In section 1 of the Government of Wales Act 2006 (the Assembly), after subsection (1), insert—”.
The amendment changes the place in the Government of Wales Act 2006 in which the text inserted by Clause 1 appears. Rather than in section 92A, references to the permanence of the Assembly would appear in section 1 of the Government of Wales Act 2006.
With this it will be convenient to discuss the following:
Amendment 8, page 1, leave out line 8 and insert “CONSTITUTIONAL ARRANGEMENTS FOR WALES”.
This amendment amends the title of the new Part 2A inserted by Clause 1 in consequence of the proposal in amendment 7 to require the review of the functioning of the justice system in Wales.
Amendment 18, page 1, line 10, leave out
“and the Welsh Government are”
and replace with “is”.
The amendment gives effect to separate provisions relating to the National Assembly for Wales, as the Legislature, and the Welsh Government, as the Executive.
Amendment 19, page 1, line 14, leave out “and the Welsh Government.”
The amendment gives effect to separate provisions relating to the National Assembly for Wales, as the Legislature, and the Welsh Government, as the Executive.
Amendment 20, page 1, line 16, leave out
“and the Welsh Government are”
and replace with “is”.
The amendment gives effect to separate provisions relating to the National Assembly for Wales, as the Legislature, and the Welsh Government, as the Executive.
Amendment 21, page 1, line 18, at end insert—
“( ) In section 45 of the Government of Wales Act 2006 (the Welsh Government), for the words in subsection (1) before paragraph (a) substitute—
(1) There is to be a Welsh Government or Llywodraeth Cymru.
(1A) The Welsh Government is a permanent part of the United Kingdom’s constitutional arrangements.
(1B) The purpose of subsection (1A) is, with due regard to the other provisions of this Act, to signify the commitment of the Parliament and Government of the United Kingdom to the Welsh Government.
(1C) In view of that commitment it is declared that the Welsh Government is not to be abolished except on the basis of a decision of the people of Wales voting in a referendum.
(1D) The members of the Welsh Government are—”.”
The amendment gives effect to separate provisions relating to the National Assembly for Wales, as the Legislature, and the Welsh Government, as the Executive. The amendment changes the place in the Government of Wales Act 2006 in which the text relating to the permanence of the Welsh Government would appear.
Amendment 22, page 1, line 18, at end insert—
“( ) In the Government of Wales Act 2006, after Part 2 (the Welsh Government) insert—”.
The amendment is required as a consequence of changing the location of the provision relating to the permanence of the Assembly.
Amendment 5, page 2, leave out lines 1 to 6 and insert—
Separation of the Legal Jurisdiction of England and Wales
92B New legal jurisdictions of England and of Wales
The legal jurisdiction of England and Wales becomes two separate legal jurisdictions, that of England and that of Wales.
Separation of the law
92C The law extending to England and Wales
(1) All of the law that extends to England and Wales—
(a) except in so far as it applies only in relation to Wales, is to extend to England, and
(b) except in so far as it applies only in relation to England, is to extend to Wales.
(2) In subsection (1) “law” includes—
(a) rules and principles of common law and equity,
(b) provision made by, or by an instrument made under, an Act of Parliament or an Act or Measure of the National Assembly for Wales, and
(c) provision made pursuant to the prerogative.
(3) Any provision of any enactment or instrument enacted or made, but not in force, when subsection (1) comes into force is to be treated for the purposes of that subsection as part of the law that extends to England and Wales (but this subsection does not affect provision made for its coming into force).
Separation of the Senior Courts
92D Separation of Senior Courts system
(1) The Senior Courts of England and Wales cease to exist (except for the purposes of section 6) and there are established in place of them—
(a) the Senior Courts of England, and
(b) the Senior Courts of Wales.
(2) The Senior Courts of England consist of—
(a) the Court of Appeal of England,
(b) the High Court of England, and
(c) the Crown Court of England, each having the same jurisdiction in England as is exercised by the corresponding court in England and Wales immediately before subsection (1) comes into force.
(3) The Senior Courts of Wales consist of—
(a) the Court of Appeal of Wales,
(b) the High Court of Wales, and
(c) the Crown Court of Wales, each having the same jurisdiction in Wales as is exercised by the corresponding court in England and Wales immediately before subsection (1) comes into force.
(4) For the purposes of this Part—
(a) Her Majesty’s Court of Appeal in England is the court corresponding to the Court of Appeal of England and the Court of Appeal of Wales,
(b) Her Majesty’s High Court of Justice in England is the court corresponding to the High Court of England and the High Court of Wales, and
(c) the Crown Court constituted by section 4 of the Courts Act 1971 is the court corresponding to the Crown Court of England and the Crown Court of Wales.
(5) References in enactments or instruments to the Senior Courts of England and Wales have effect (as the context requires) as references to the Senior Courts of England or the Senior Courts of Wales, or both; and
(6) References in enactments or instruments to Her Majesty’s Court of Appeal in England, Her Majesty’s High Court of Justice in England or the Crown Court constituted by section 4 of the Courts Act 1971 (however expressed) have effect (as the context requires) as references to either or both of the courts to which they correspond.
92E The judiciary and court officers
(1) All of the judges and other officers of Her Majesty’s Court of Appeal in England or Her Majesty’s High Court of Justice in England become judges or officers of both of the courts to which that court corresponds.
(2) The persons by whom the jurisdiction of the Crown Court constituted by section 4 of the Courts Act 1971 is exercisable become the persons by whom the jurisdiction of both of the courts to which that court corresponds is exercisable; but (despite section 8(2) of the Senior Courts Act 1981)—
(a) a justice of the peace assigned to a local justice area in Wales may not by virtue of this subsection exercise the jurisdiction of the Crown Court of England, and
(b) a justice of the peace assigned to a local justice area in England may not by virtue of this subsection exercise the jurisdiction of the Crown Court of Wales.
92F Division of business between courts of England and courts of Wales
‘(1) The Senior Courts of England, the county courts for districts in England and the justices for local justice areas in England have jurisdiction over matters relating to England; and (subject to the rules of private international law relating to the application of foreign law) the law that they are to apply is the law extending to England.
(2) The Senior Courts of Wales, the county courts for districts in Wales and the justices for local justice areas in Wales have jurisdiction over matters relating to Wales; and (subject to the rules of private international law relating to the application of foreign law) the law that they are to apply is the law extending to Wales.
92G Transfer of current proceedings
(1) All proceedings, whether civil or criminal, pending in any of the Senior Courts of England and Wales (including proceedings in which a judgment or order has been given or made but not enforced) shall be transferred by that court to whichever of the courts to which that court corresponds appears appropriate.
(2) The transferred proceedings are to continue as if the case had originated in, and the previous proceedings had been taken in, that other court.”
This amendment replaces the Bill’s proposed recognition of Welsh law with provisions to separate the legal jurisdictions of England and of Wales, as drafted by the Welsh Government.
Amendment 9, page 2, line 1, after “law” insert
“and review of the justice system in Wales”.
This amendment amends the heading of Clause 1 in consequence of the proposal in amendment 7 to review the functioning of the justice system in Wales.
Amendment 7, page 2, line 3, at end insert—
“(2) The Lord Chancellor and the Welsh Ministers must keep the functioning of the justice system in relation to Wales under review with a view to its development and reform, including keeping under review the question of whether the single legal jurisdiction of England and Wales should be divided into a jurisdiction for Wales and a jurisdiction for England.
(3) In exercising their duty in subsection (2) the Lord Chancellor and the Welsh Ministers must have regard to—
(a) divergence in the law and its administration as between England and Wales,
(b) the need to treat the Welsh and English languages on the basis of equality, and
(c) any other circumstances in Wales affecting operation of the justice system.
(4) The Lord Chancellor and the Welsh Ministers may appoint a panel to advise them on the exercise of their functions in this section.
(5) The Lord Chancellor must make an annual report on the functioning of the justice system in relation to Wales to the Welsh Ministers.
(6) The Welsh Ministers must lay the report before the Assembly.
(7) The Lord Chancellor must lay the report before both Houses of Parliament.”
The provision in the Bill recognises the existence of a body of Welsh law made by the Assembly and the Welsh Ministers. The new subsections to be inserted after that provision by this amendment require the Secretary of State to keep the justice system as it applies in relation to Wales under review with a view to its development and reform, having regard in particular to divergence in the law as between England and Wales.
Amendment 10, page 2, leave out lines 4 to 6.
This amendment removes subsection (2) of the proposed new section 92B of the Government of Wales Act 2006 (recognition of Welsh law). Subsection (2) seeks to explain the purpose of subsection (1) of that section.
Clause 1 stand part.
Amendment 23, in clause 2, page 2, line 12, leave out “normally”.
This amendment removes the word “normally” from the recognition that the Parliament of the United Kingdom will not normally legislate on devolved matters without the consent of the National Assembly for Wales.
Amendment 3, page 2, line 12, leave out “legislate with regard” and insert “enact provisions relating”.
This amendment is a consequence of amendment 4, which defines the meaning of “devolved matters”.
Amendment 24, page 2, line 13, after “Assembly” insert—
“(a) there is an imminent risk of serious adverse impact on—
(i) the national security of the United Kingdom, or
(ii) public safety, public, animal or plant health or economic stability in any part of the United Kingdom,
(b) the legislation specifically addresses that risk,
(c) the imminence of the risk in relation to Wales makes it impractical to seek the consent of the Assembly,
(d) no Bill has been passed under section 110(1)(a) specifically to address the risk, and
(e) no subordinate legislation specifically to address the risk has been laid before the Assembly and has come into force.”
This amendment specifies the circumstances in which Parliament can legislate on devolved matters on behalf of the National Assembly for Wales without its consent.
Amendment 4, page 2, line 13, at end insert—
“(7) For the purpose of subsection (6), a provision relates to a devolved matter if the provision—
(a) applies in relation to Wales and does not relate to a reserved matter.
(b) modifies the legislative competence of the Assembly, or
(c) confers a function on, or removes or modifies a function of, any member of the Welsh Government.”
This amendment defines the meaning of “devolved matters” for the purpose of the statutory recognition of the convention about Parliament legislating on devolved matters proposed by Clause 2.
Amendment 25, page 2, line 13, at end insert—
“(7) In this section, “devolved matters” means matters that—
(a) are within the legislative competence of the Assembly;
(b) modify the legislative competence of the Assembly;
(c) modify a function of the Assembly;
(d) modify a function of a member of the Welsh Government exercisable within devolved competence (and “within devolved competence” is to be read in accordance with section 58A).”
The amendment defines devolved matters for the purposes of Clause 2.
Clauses 2 and 4 stand part.
Amendment 26, in schedule 4, page 94, line 10, at end insert—
“National Assembly for Wales Commissioner for Standards.”
The amendment adds the National Assembly for Wales Commissioner for Standards to the list of Wales public authorities.
Amendment 27, page 94, line 10, at end insert—
“National Assembly for Wales Remuneration Board.”
The amendment adds the National Assembly for Wales Remuneration Board to the list of Wales public authorities.
Schedule 4 stand part.
Diolch yn fawr, Dirprwy Lefarydd. Nineteen years have passed since the 1997 referendum to establish the Assembly. It is now clear that to have our own democratically elected Government and legislature is the settled will of the people of Wales. I note with disappointment and surprise the Secretary of State’s recent refusal of an invitation from the Chair of the Assembly’s Constitutional and Legislative Affairs Committee to give evidence on the Bill. I would argue that now, especially, is the time for co-operation and the sharing of knowledge.
Clause 1 is a very welcome addition to the Welsh devolution dispensation. Any clause to recognise the permanence of the institution is, of course, overdue. Amendments 17 to 22 are not controversial, and they deal with two technical issues. First, amendment 17 and amendment 22, which is consequential on amendment 17, change the place in the Government of Wales Act 2006 in which the text of clause 1 would appear. I know that the Presiding Officer in the Assembly, Elin Jones, has made this point, and I share her view that the declaration of the permanence of the Assembly should be given prominence in the Bill. Placing it in section 1 of the 2006 Act would achieve that.
Secondly, amendments 18 to 21 reflect the constitutional separation of the legislature, the National Assembly of Wales, and the Executive, the Welsh Government, by dealing with them in separate new provisions to be inserted into those parts of the Government of Wales Act 2006 that deal respectively with the Assembly and the Government. These are probing amendments and we do not intend to press them to a vote, but I hope that the Secretary of State will agree to accept these proposals and to table his own amendments at the next stage.
I do, however, intend to press amendment 5 to a Division. This amendment deals with what was perhaps the key focus of the prelegislative stage of the Bill and remains, in our view, the main reason that it fails to achieve what the Secretary of State has said he wanted to achieve: that is, to produce a lasting devolution settlement for Wales.
Since the original Government of Wales Act 1998, we have been forced to change the devolution dispensation four times. If enacted, this Bill will become the fifth dispensation. The perpetual modifications have been necessitated by sustained reluctance from successive UK Governments, both Labour and Tory, to legislate with the long term in mind. Although all of Wales’s devolution Acts were described as settlements to settle the debate for a generation, not one of them has achieved that aim. It is clear to me that this Bill will continue that trend, unless, of course, the Secretary of State changes course.
Many, if not most, of the criticisms of the Bill made by politicians, lawyers, civil society and academics alike have been of clauses or sections that have been justified as necessary by the Secretary of State in order to maintain the single unified legal system of England and Wales. The inclusion of clause 3—this will be discussed next week—and in particular its much debated necessity test is down to the fact that the Welsh legislature operates within a shared jurisdiction. The inclusion of clause 10, on justice impact tests, which have been subject to questioning and criticism since the publication of the latest Bill, is down to the fact that justice is a reserved matter—a reservation that is apparently necessary to safeguard the shared jurisdiction. These are among the contents of the Bill that are intended to prevent the Assembly from making any provisions that will impact on so-called public authorities. Again, these are in the Bill to protect the unified legal jurisdiction. As the Wales Governance Centre and University College London report stated:
“Complexity is piled on complexity...the potential for legal challenge casts a long shadow”.
I remind the House that Wales is unique in the world in having a primary law making legislature without a jurisdiction. Scotland has a wholly separate legal jurisdiction, and the Scottish settlement is simpler as a result. It avoids the complex and unnecessary exceptions and reservations. The relative stability of the Scottish devolution settlement, when compared with the turmoil in Wales, is stark. It is rare that Wales passes a law without the threat of legal challenge from somewhere.
If there were a practical need to maintain the unified legal system, it would be worth making these compromises elsewhere in the Bill and perhaps worth the legal battles. However, I have yet to hear a genuine, practical reason for doing so. The most frequently made argument against creating a separate Welsh jurisdiction is that it is unnecessary and costly, and that divergence between the law as it applies to Wales and the law as it applies to England is minimal. To those who make those arguments I say two things. First, to say that divergence is minimal is to continue the short-term approach of previous Governments and to ignore the fact that divergence will do nothing but increase as the Assembly continues its work and as the institution gains more maturity and responsibility.