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Science, Innovation and Technology

Volume 757: debated on Wednesday 20 November 2024

The Secretary of State was asked—

Shared Rural Network

The Government and industry are working together to accelerate the shared rural network and deliver substantial improvements to outdoor 4G mobile coverage across the UK. In the past few months, the Government have activated 13 publicly funded masts across the UK, and there are now 27 Government-funded extended area service mast upgrades delivering 4G.

In my constituency, only 40, 50 and 60 miles away from this House, villages such as Cuddington are still complete mobile notspots. Will the Minister explain how quickly the Government intend to move on activating the shared rural network, to ensure no rural community is left without a reliable mobile signal?

I know about Cuddington, because the hon. Gentleman told me about it yesterday. Cuddington is such a typical English village that it has featured in “Midsomer Murders”, which is fictional—a bit like the previous Government’s financial affairs. I know we have said that the desire to please is not part of what Ministers are meant to do, but I do have a desire to please him and his constituents. The Government will work as fast as we can with industry to try to develop 4G in his constituency. I am happy to arrange for a meeting between him and my officials to ensure he has street-by-street analysis of how we can do that.

We welcome the recent update on the expansion of 4G to rural areas under the shared rural network project, particularly for businesses and farmers who are under such pressure at the moment, with the recent Treasury announcements. Which Secretary of State should we thank for the planning approval and funding of this vital infrastructure project?

We support developing all the plans set out under the shared rural network and Project Gigabit—those plans were regularly announced by the previous Government, but they never actually put any money into the budget. There was never a line in a Department for Science, Innovation and Technology budget that said, “This money is guaranteed for the future.” We are putting our money where our mouth is and we are determined to ensure everybody has proper connectivity. Frankly, that is essential for people’s businesses, whether they are farmers or running any other kind of business, up and down the land. We will deliver that.

Digital Connectivity: Rural Areas

We are improving digital connectivity in rural areas by rolling out 30 Project Gigabit contracts, filling in gaps that are not being met commercially, predominantly in rural areas, and delivering better 4G mobile coverage and eliminating partial notspots through the shared rural network.

A number of my constituents in the village of Haslington have been in touch with me about poor mobile signal and digital connectivity in the village. One constituent was unable to contact emergency services in the event of a medical emergency. Does the Minister agree that the lack of progress on connectivity in our rural areas under 14 years of Conservative Government is unacceptable? Will he meet me to discuss how we can improve matters for my constituents?

I am very happy to meet my hon. Friend, not necessarily at the same time as I am meeting the hon. Member for Mid Buckinghamshire (Greg Smith), but Haslington is a bit like Cuddington: they have exactly the same set of problems. I am sure many hon. Members from across the House have similar issues in their constituencies that they have a burning desire to raise with me. I am happy to make arrangements for hon. Members to meet officials and go through issues case by case. In relation to the 999 emergency my hon. Friend referred to, I would be grateful if he could provide me with specific details. All 999 calls from mobile phones should automatically roam on to another available network if there is no signal from their own provider, so I want to get to the bottom of the issue in that case.

Can I add to the Minister’s list of beautiful villages to visit the wonderful villages of Cranleigh, Shamley Green, Peaslake, Gomshall and Bramley? They are all having big problems with 4G and 5G mobile phone reception, not least because apps need to be used to pay for parking there. Can he meet me to discuss what more can be done to help those beautiful, but also economically important, places?

I am very happy to meet the right hon. Gentleman as well. I am not the Pope, but it feels like I will be having a series of audiences over the next few weeks. The right hon. Gentleman has villages, I have villages. If only he knew someone who had been the Chancellor in recent years, who would have been able to deliver the financial support that we really needed to secure the investment.

My constituents in the village of Crowthorne will welcome the Government’s action to tackle this massive issue and support connectivity for phones and 4G in rural and semi-rural constituencies. Will the Minister have a meeting with me to discuss the issues affecting Crowthorne?

I am getting more popular day by day, which is unusual in my life. I am, of course, very happy to discuss the issues in Crowthorne.

One thing that really concerns me is that quite often, the published version of what connectivity is available in everybody’s constituency will say that there is 92%, 93% or 95% of connectivity from all four operators, but actually, if we stand there with a mobile phone, there will not be any connectivity whatsoever. I have written to Ofcom and it has written back saying, for instance, that in that precise location the coverage may be above or below the predicted level, leading some consumers to not get the service they expected. There is a phrase for that.

Organisations such as TechResort in my constituency support people who are digitally excluded to become digitally included. The Minister has a long list of meetings to go to, so instead, can the Secretary of State come along the coast to the sunniest town in the UK to visit TechResort and hear more about the funding it needs to power its work?

I am pleased to say that the Secretary of State says he will indeed visit when he possibly can.

There is a really important point here: poor digital connectivity excludes so many communities up and down this country. We have no chance of creating the economic growth that we want in this country unless we take the whole of the country with us. That is why it is so disgraceful that we have not had a proper digital inclusion strategy for 10 years. That is something we will remedy.

Project Gigabit: Rural Areas

4. What assessment he has made of the potential impact of using Project Gigabit funding in urban areas on download speeds in rural areas. (901336)

Project Gigabit has always been designed to deliver gigabit-capable broadband to premises that will not be met by the market, regardless of whether they are in urban or rural areas. Most premises deemed uncommercial by the market are in rural areas, but consistent evidence suggests that we will also need to intervene in some urban areas to achieve full national gigabit coverage. Funding will continue to be provided where it is needed.

There are 11,500 houses that will be connected to fibre as a result of the Conservative Project Gigabit policy. There is real concern that some of those will miss out if money is redirected from rural to urban communities. After the family farm tax, can we please give rural communities a break?

The vast majority—more than 90%—of the spending in Project Gigabit has gone to rural areas because those are the areas most in need. There is absolutely no change in our policy to that. However, some urban areas have significant problems as well and we need to rectify those. The hon. Gentleman points out some of the issues in his own constituency. I am happy to provide him too with a meeting, if he wants. I see he has nodded.

Innovation in the Black Country

5. What steps his Department is taking to help increase levels of innovation in the Black Country. (901337)

We want to boost investment in innovation and enable people in all regions of the UK to benefit from an innovation-led economy. That is why the spending review supports the UK’s research and development ambition, with total Government investment in R&D rising to a record £20.4 billion in 2025-26. That allows us to extend innovation accelerators for another year, which will continue to bolster the west midlands’ high-potential innovation clusters, fund the Midlands Industrial Ceramics Group through the Strength in Places fund, and support the region’s investment zone.

Last month, alongside Richard Parker, the Mayor of the West Midlands, I was lucky enough to join Halesowen college as it opened its new digital and media campus at Trinity Point. Does the Minister agree that excellent institutions such as this are fundamental to supporting innovation across our region, and would she be so kind as to visit us at some point in the near future?

I agree with my hon. Friend that educational institutes are crucial to innovation. Halesowen college is one of five colleges across the region using the further education and innovation fund to support innovation and technical excellence within the local community. Such facilities and expertise will help businesses to develop a workforce with skills and take advantage of that. I would be delighted to visit the Trinity Point college if the opportunity arises.

Increasing levels of innovation across the UK are crucial to unlocking growth and solving some of our biggest problems. That is why I was worried to read about the Secretary of State saying that we have to apply “a sense of statecraft” to working with multinational tech companies. Does the Minister agree that what we should be doing is working with such companies as companies, not states, focusing on increasing healthy competition and supporting innovative UK businesses so that they are not left with the choice of being bought up or leaving the UK?

As I have said, increasing productivity right across the UK is fundamental to our mission to kick-start economic growth. Through our industrial strategy and the development of local growth plans, we will build on local strengths to ensure that public and private research and development businesses right across the UK help local places to reach their potential. We are strengthening the relationships with businesses to deliver for British people.

Frontier AI Safety

6. If he will take steps to support the creation of a global network of scientific research on frontier artificial intelligence safety. (901338)

The UK is a founding member of the AI Safety Institute international network. The network convenes for the first time today in San Francisco.

The UK is a global leader in AI development, which brings many opportunities, but we know that the risks associated with AI can be managed only by global co-operation. What steps is the Department taking to ensure that the UK works with other main leaders in AI development, including the US and China, to ensure that the most advanced frontier AI models are safe for global consumers?

My hon. Friend is completely right to say that safety has to be there from the outset. We want our country to safely explore all the opportunities that AI offers, but it can do so only if people are reassured that safety is there from the outset. The UK safety institute is at the forefront of this. It is the first safety institute, and we are at the forefront of delivering international as well as domestic safety. We are currently working on an international review of the science of AI safety, which draws on the expertise of 30 countries.

On question number 13, Mr Speaker, may I ask the Minister what steps he will take to ensure that people who are visually impaired are able to engage—

Order. Sorry—we have not reached that question. I call the Chair of the Science, Innovation and Technology Committee.

My hon. Friend the Member for Folkestone and Hythe (Tony Vaughan) rightly raises the need for research into frontier AI safety, and I welcome the Government’s commitment to protecting the public from future AI risks. But AI affects all of our lives already. Today, my Committee launches an inquiry into algorithms, AI and their role in spreading online harm, as we saw in the terrible riots over the summer. As we build our evidence, how is the Minister building the evidence base on AI online harms and their social impact right now?

I am extremely grateful to the Chair of the Select Committee for choosing this as her first inquiry. It is an incredibly important area. This Government are committed to the algorithmic transparency recording standard. The previous Government reneged on their commitment to having individual Departments releasing their standard statement each year. This Government are committing to doing so again and will remain committed to reinforcing the fact that algorithms are there to serve people and not the other way round.

There are many firms in Northern Ireland that have the capability and the experience to offer some advice on getting scientific research on AI safety. I know that the Minister is very interested in Northern Ireland, so has he had an opportunity to speak to companies in Northern Ireland so that we can play our part in how we take this matter forward?

I am grateful to the hon. Gentleman for acknowledging my interest in Northern Ireland, which I have already visited since being appointed in order to meet some of the pioneering tech companies there. I will stay committed to ensuring that the Government recognise the talent across Northern Ireland, harnessing it for not just the domestic good but the global good.

5G Roll-out

7. What comparative assessment he has made of the effectiveness of the roll-out of 5G in (a) the UK and (b) other countries. (901339)

Unfortunately, the UK’s roll-out of 5G has been far too slow. According to Opensignal, the UK ranks 22nd out of 25 European countries for 5G download speeds and availability after 14 years of Conservative rule. We are determined to change that, aiming to have higher-quality stand-alone 5G in all populated areas by 2030.

Access to 5G data is a real issue in Aldershot. According to Ofcom, a third of our households cannot connect to 5G—nearly three times the national average. What are the Government doing to give residents in Aldershot and Farnborough the same data access as the rest of the country, and will the Minister make that work a priority?

My hon. Friend is right: that work has to be a priority for businesses, families and everybody engaged in her constituency, and for the public sector. We want the Ministry of Defence in her constituency, for instance, to have the highest-quality data access possible, so that we can deliver more effective and productive government across the whole United Kingdom. The work will indeed be a priority for us.

There have been great improvements in connectivity across Ceredigion Preseli, but there remain total mobile notspots such as Porthgain, and a growing body of evidence collected locally that the connectivity reported by Ofcom does not quite stack up against the lived experience of those on the ground. Will the Minister meet me so that I can present some of the evidence collected by local authorities in Ceredigion Preseli and he can address the problem?

The hon. Gentleman has just said what I said a few minutes ago. It is great that Plaid Cymru is signing up to the Labour party’s agenda these days, but it is upsetting that he forgot to mention the seven high-quality masts extending better coverage of 4G in Wales that have been installed in the last couple of months alone. Of course I will happily meet him, and place in the Library a copy of the letter that I received from Ofcom that makes the precise point that we need to do much better in recognising the real experience of people’s mobile connectivity rather than a theoretical, ethereal version of it.

Project Gigabit

More than 30 Project Gigabit contracts are currently in place, with a total value of almost £2 billion, and more are in the pipeline. In the past few months, the first premises have been connected as part of Project Gigabit contracts in areas including Norfolk, West Yorkshire and south Wiltshire, and the build has now started in earnest in other parts of the country.

I welcome the progress that the Government are making on the roll-out of Project Gigabit to all corners of the country, but in Telford the inequality remains stark, with some wards having complete gigabit coverage and areas such as the world heritage site in Ironbridge having almost none. Will the Government confirm that their agenda to break down barriers to opportunity includes residents, businesses and world heritage sites that cannot get online?

The world heritage aspects relate to my Department for Culture, Media and Sport responsibilities, but my hon. Friend is right about Ironbridge. I hope that we will be able to announce something shortly in relation to extending gigabit coverage in his constituency through a procurement via Openreach.

The Minister will be aware that there is a strong link between communications technology and the roll-out of smart meter technology in areas in the north of Scotland that are suffering from cold weather. Particularly at the moment, connectivity is really important for such alternative technologies to work. What discussions has he had with the Department for Energy Security and Net Zero on that issue?

The hon. Gentleman is right: there is a series of issues about the security and safety of connectivity in areas that suffer from particular weather conditions. We had a successful summit on Monday morning to discuss the closing down of the public services network to ensure that everybody will be secure, but I assure him that we will work closely with the Scottish Government to ensure that the roll-out in all such areas works in the interests of businesses, whatever the weather conditions.

Topical Questions

To protect people online, today I became the first Secretary of State to exercise the power to set out my strategic online safety proposals for Ofcom to consider. From increasing transparency to baking safety into social media platforms from the outset, those priorities will support Government in monitoring progress on acting where our laws are coming up short. I have also launched a new research project to explore the impact of social media on young people’s wellbeing and mental health.

Each year millions of patients in England interact with two or more different hospital trusts. Most of the trusts that commonly see the same patients do not use the same record systems. What steps is the Minister taking with Cabinet colleagues to utilise the Centre for Improving Data Collaboration and other available technology to improve data sharing across NHS hospital trusts?

What a pleasure it is to speak from the Dispatch Box to another Labour MP from Sussex.

That issue is a Department of Health and Social Care responsibility but, on its behalf, the Data (Use and Access) Bill will include a requirement that IT providers in the NHS have to meet information standards. That will deliver the interoperability needed so that data can be shared across the NHS, often for the very first time.

On the Opposition Benches we are proud that it was the last Conservative Government who created the Department for Science, Innovation and Technology. I am glad that Labour is following our agenda, and I look forward to my exchanges with the Secretary of State.

Under the last Conservative Government, Britain was home to more billion dollar tech start-ups than France and Germany combined, but last month an industry survey found that nearly 90% of tech founders would consider leaving Britain if Labour raised taxes on tech businesses. Yesterday, Labour U-turned on policy in Scotland, so today will the Secretary of State commit to reversing Labour’s jobs tax, which damages tech businesses across the entire country?

I welcome the hon. Gentleman to his post. We worked together on the all-party parliamentary group on the fourth industrial revolution, which he chaired, and I look forward to having a constructive relationship going forward.

The hon. Gentleman mentioned the last Government. Given the way the Conservatives are going, that will have been their last Government. To be honest, the circumstances that businesses, large and small, operating in the tech landscape have asked for are a smooth regulatory process—we have already delivered regulatory reform; reform to planning—we have delivered reform to the planning system; a stable financial settlement—we have delivered that with a Budget for—

Order. Please, this is topicals. We will see a very good example from the shadow Secretary of State.

I thank the Secretary of State for his kind words, but he has punished labour: figures from his own Department show that workers will be losing out by nearly £800 each per year as a result of Labour’s Budget. Will he stand up to the Chancellor and oppose any further tax rises on Britain’s hard-working tech sector?

The Budget gave a pay rise to working people in this country and set the conditions for a stable economy, fixing the black hole left in our economy by the mismanagement of the last Government.

T4.   Last week I was at London City airport’s STEM event, which brought together 500 students from secondary schools across east London. Does the Secretary of State agree that if we are to see thriving STEM industries, we need more engagement events like that? (901352)

Outside the classroom, the CyberFirst programme has engaged 250,000 young people across the UK. Those are the first steps; this Government will be going further.

T2. Recently, I hosted a briefing event for People for the Ethical Treatment of Animals, where strong evidence was presented that almost all drug research and research into other products could be done without abusing animals. Will the Secretary of State take the opportunity to ensure that we no longer experiment on animals and that we use other methods to get products into service? (901349)

I am grateful for the hon. Gentleman’s question, because the first job I ever had was at the Body Shop working for Anita Roddick, and I joined her campaign against animal testing for cosmetics. She would be proud to see me at the Dispatch Box engaging in this conversation. Labour made a manifesto commitment to phase out animal testing in the long term. That is something we are committed to and something we are taking steps towards.

T5. The peddling of fake news and disinformation on social media platforms is fuelling extremism. It also impacts heavily on our democratic processes in the UK. What safeguards are the Government putting in place to combat this really serious issue? (901353)

I am extremely grateful to my hon. Friend for raising one of the most serious issues of our time. The Online Safety Act 2023 requires providers, as part of their risk assessment, to consider specifically how algorithms will impact a user’s exposure to illegal content and children’s exposure to harmful content. I have introduced new measures to ensure that children are kept safe, and today I issued a statement of strategic priority to Ofcom to insist that it continues to do so in future.

T3.   Last year, nearly 50 British universities were identified as having research ties with what are deemed very high-risk Chinese institutions. Subsequently, the intelligence services briefed 24 universities on resisting the infiltration attempts of foreign agencies, but the Intelligence and Security Committee report states that it is “highly likely” that joint UK-China research projects are used for military purposes. What is the Department doing to protect our research and our security? (901351)

The Government are working closely with individual universities, the university sector and our intelligence community to ensure that our research is not only world class but safe and secure.