Sport: Football Clubs Question 15:30:00 Asked By Lord Dubs To ask Her Majesty’s Government what discussions they have had with the football authorities about the financial difficulties facing clubs. Lord Brett My Lords, in answering this Question, I first declare an interest. I am a lifelong Manchester United supporter and a long-standing patron of the Manchester United Supporters’ Trust. I congratulate Arsenal on their victory last night. My honourable friend Gerry Sutcliffe, the Sports Minister, met the three football authorities—the Football Association, the Premier League and the Football League—on 8 February 2010 to discuss football regulation, governance and the national game. Lord Dubs I am grateful to my noble friend for that Answer. Is he aware that Portsmouth and a number of other football clubs are currently in serious financial difficulties; that British fans pay among the highest admission charges in Europe; that the money that many clubs take at the gate is pretty well all absorbed by the weekly wage bill; that some owners treat the clubs like playthings; that the Glazer brothers bought Manchester United with borrowed money and may damage that famous club through their efforts to recoup; and that we do not even know who owns Leeds United? It is a mess. Does he agree that British fans and British players deserve better than this? Will he encourage the football authorities to introduce a better system of voluntary regulation? Failing that, maybe the statutory path is the way we should go? Lord Brett My Lords, I can go two-thirds of the way with my noble friend. I certainly believe that the supporters of British football clubs deserve better. I also believe that it is the responsibility of the authorities to seek and provide better self-regulation. It is wrong to say that there have not been messages from government or, indeed, that there has been a lack of action. The football authorities have recently made significant moves to toughen regulations with early warning systems on tax debts, the introduction of transfer embargoes and help to monitor and curb club spending. I should like to pay tribute to the noble Lord, Lord Mawhinney, who is in his place, and to the noble Lord, Lord Triesman, both distinguished Members of your Lordships’ House, who play a part in trying to bring that better self-regulation. We will continue to advise and assist, but it is not for the Government to regulate football. It is for the governing authorities and it is for the clubs to manage themselves. Lord Mawhinney I declare an interest, first, as chairman of the Football League and, secondly, as deputy chairman of England’s 2018 World Cup bid. I thank the noble Lord for his kind words and for his recognition of the efforts that are being made to improve regulation in the world of football, on which I entirely agree with the noble Lord, Lord Dubs. Is the Minister aware that, in pursuit of our campaign against indefensible debt, the Football League has recently entered into an arrangement with Her Majesty’s Revenue and Customs so that if, in any month, any of our clubs do not pay PAYE or national insurance, we apply sporting sanctions to them until they do pay? Lord Brett I was aware of the message that the noble Lord extends to the House. I am not sure that the whole House was aware of it. I am certainly not sure that the great British public are aware of it. The authorities are to be congratulated on that particular, and other, endeavours that they are making. Football is more than just another commodity. Football fans carry an allegiance. It is a community asset. In my lifetime I have lived through paternal ownership, vanity ownership and international financial ownership. The latter seems to me to carry some dangers and requires a much stronger self-regulation. In the absence of that, there will be continuing pressure on clubs from dissatisfied fans. Today three more clubs were in the High Court. Southend and Cardiff City were given extended periods of 35 and 56 days. We hope that they will escape from going out of existence. However, HMRC has a responsibility to collect money owed to the taxpayer. We cannot have clubs running on the avoidance of paying their obligations to the taxpayer. Lord Grocott My Lords, will my noble friend acknowledge that one club that is recognised by the Premiere League and others as being particularly well managed financially, and which lives within its means, is Stoke City? Does he agree that this is in no small part due to an excellent chairman, born and brought up locally and personally totally committed to the club, as well as a splendid manager and a very talented squad of players? Will he join me in wishing them all the best in tonight’s match? Lord Brett My Lords, I recognise a totally impartial speech when I hear one. Stoke City is indeed a good example, but there are others. We should not necessarily pray in aid solely British ownership; I happen to think that Aston Villa is also a well run club, and it has an American owner. It is not about physical ownership. I think it is astonishing, as does everyone else, that Leeds United fans cannot know who the directors of Leeds United are, but those are the vagaries of Swiss law. I hope that the endeavours of Ministers for Sport over a number of years, which will continue when the current Minister for Sport meets the football authorities again in June, mean that we will continue on the right path. In the mean time, we will do all that we can do. The Inland Revenue, or HMRC, as I should insist on calling it, looks to assist clubs. It does not seek to force them into liquidation—although one, Chester City, went into liquidation today—when there are other ways of finding means of providing the money and paying back debts within a reasonable period. Lord Davies of Coity My Lords— Lord Pannick My Lords— Lord McNally My Lords— Lord Howard of Rising My Lords— Lord Hunt of Kings Heath My Lords, we have not heard from the Liberal Democrats yet. Lord McNally My Lords, is the Minister aware that Watford Football Club lost its third game on the trot last night and is now only two points from relegation, and that recently the noble Lord, Lord Ashcroft, invested 37 per cent in that club? Is there a pattern here of the noble Lord backing losers? Lord Brett My Lords, if I were to extrapolate from Watford to the noble Lord’s other interests—that is, the funding of particular political party candidates in a number of seats—I would expect the crowd at Watford to rise by about two percentage points, but I doubt whether its performance would improve at all.