Education Reorganisation Schemes 28. Mr. BEAUMONT asked the President of the Board of Education from how many local education authorities he has received completed schemes dealing with accommodation for reorganisation and the raising of the school age; from how many he has received preliminary schemes; from how many he has received no schemes at all; and how many have informed him that, in their view, it is impossible to get the work done in the time at their disposal? The PRESIDENT of the BOARD of EDUCATION (Sir Charles Trevelyan) I have received complete programmes from 95 local education authorities, and preliminary programmes from 31. Programmes have not yet been received from 191 authorities, but I expect to receive most of these shortly. Only six authorities have expressed doubts as to their ability to carry out a complete scheme of reorganisation within the time at their disposal. Mr. BEAUMONT Can the right hon. Gentleman tell us how many of those replies have been received from county authorities? Sir C. TREVELYAN I cannot offhand, but I will give the hon. Member the information. Mr. HARRIS Are the six authorities referred to within the area of the London County Council? Sir C. TREVELYAN I must have notice of that question. Medical Services 29. Dr. VERNON DAVIES asked the President of the Board of Education if he has made any estimate of the increased personnel and extra cost for the school medical services necessitated by the compulsory raising of the school age? Sir C. TREVELYAN Although some extension of the existing arrangements will be necessary, I am advised that the raising of the school age will not in itself involve any material increase in the personnel and cost of the school medical service. Dr. DAVIES Does that mean that the Board of Education intends to work the present medical staff more fully than they are being worked at present? Sir C. TREVELYAN No. I said that there was no reason to suppose that it would involve any material increase in the personnel; that is to say, there will not be an additional school inspection, and therefore no increase of work will be required. Maintenance Allowances 30 and 31. Dr. DAVIES asked the President of the Board of Education (1) if he proposes to make regulations that the inquiries into the means of parents whose children are affected by the compulsory raising of the school age for the purpose of assessing the amount of maintenance grant shall be made in each case by means of a committee of the local education authority or that they shall be made through their paid officials; (2) if maintenance grants for children at school to be granted where the school age is compulsorily raised to 15 years will vary according as the father is at work or simply dependent on unemployment benefit? 36. Sir KINGSLEY WOOD asked the President of the Board of Education whether he is now in a position to give further details as to the means test which is proposed by the Government in relation to the payment of maintenance allowances in respect of the children affected by the raising of the school age? Sir C. TREVELYAN I have invited a Committee of representatives of Local Authorities to make recommendations as to scales of need and the procedure for determining eligibility for maintenance allowances. The Committee held their first meeting last week, and until I have received their recommendations it would be premature for me to deal with the particular points which are raised in the hon. Members' questions. Sir K. WOOD I take it that there is no question of the Government withdrawing from their proposals, and that the means test is necessary under this particular proposal? Sir C. TREVELYAN No, Sir. Mr. HARRIS Does the right hon. Gentleman's reply mean that this Committee is considering a means test, as opposed to a flat rate? Sir C. TREVELYAN As I explained to the House before we broke up last time, I have asked the local authorities to make recommendations to me on the basis of what I explained. Dr. DAVIES Are we to understand that the President of the Board of Education wishes to throw the onus of the unpopularity of this Measure on the local authorities? Mr. SPEAKER Mr. Gould. School-Leaving Age 32. Mr. GOULD asked the President of the Board of Education what will be the effect of his proposal to raise the school-leaving age to 15 years in the Administrative County of Somerset in regard to increased numbers of school children to be provided for, the increases in teaching staff, and the new building programme necessitated? Sir C. TREVELYAN I have not yet received the programme of the Somersetshire Local Education Authority. I expect, however, to receive it shortly, and I will then be glad to give my hon. Friend the information for which he asks. 33. Mr. WARDLAW-MILNE asked the President of the Board of Education how many more children are estimated to be at school in April, 1931, as a consequence of the raising of the school-leaving age then to 15 in England and Wales; and whether any estimate has been made of the number who will be at school under these proposals in 1936, in view of the drop in the birth rate in the last few years? Sir C. TREVELYAN As a consequence of raising the school-leaving age to 15, it is estimated that the number of children in attendance at public elementary schools will increase by degrees between the 1st April, 1931, and the 1st April, 1932, from 5,342,000 to 5,771,000. The number on the 1st April, 1936, is estimated at 5,487,000. Mr. WARDLAW-MILNE Is it not possible, in view of the figures which the right hon. Gentleman has now given, that, if the proposal had been postponed for a year or two, there would have been ample accommodation for the children at the increased age even without expenditure at the present time? Sir C. TREVELYAN No, Sir; I do not think that the eventual increase of cost will be material. Costs 35. Mr. RAYNES asked the President of the Board of Education the cost per school-place, including building and furnishing, of elementary schools and secondary schools in the county boroughs of Birmingham, Coventry, Derby, Leicester, Nottingham, Sheffield, and Wolverhampton; and the average cost for England and Wales? Sir C. TREVELYAN I have not yet been able to provide myself with all the figures necessary for a reply to my hon. Friend's question, and I will, therefore, ask him to allow me to send them to him as soon as they are available. School Commencing Age 37. Mr. WARDLAW-MILNE asked the President of the Board of Education if he will make inquiries as to what other countries in the world commence compulsory education at the ago of five; and whether he can give the comparative ages at which compulsory education starts in the principal countries of Europe, in the United States of America, and Canada? Sir C. TREVELYAN So far as I am aware, this is the only country in which compulsory education begins at the age of five. I understand that the age is fixed at seven in Denmark, Norway, Holland and Poland, and at six in France, Germany, Italy and most other European countries. It is fixed at six in some Canadian towns and at seven in the rest of the Dominion, while it varies between six and eight in the different American States. Mr. WARDLAW-MILNE Is it correct that, as has, I believe, been publicly stated, if the age here were raised to six there would have been ample accommodation under the new proposals for all children, without any further expense of any kind? Sir C. TREVELYAN No, Sir. Mr. HARRIS Is it the fact that in Germany, where the compulsory age is only six, there is a general provision of nursery schools all over the country for children between three and five? Sir C. TREVELYAN There are a great many more than there are here yet. Sir G. DALRYMPLE-WHITE Can the right hon. Gentleman say what is the starting age in Russia? Lord EUSTACE PERCY In order to make the matter clear, may I ask whether it is not the case that attendance at nursery schools in Germany is compulsory? Sir C. TREVELYAN No, I do not think so; I imagine not. I do not think that that was the hon. Member's question. Nursery Schools 38. Mr. T. GRIFFITHS asked the President of the Board of Education how many new nursery schools have been approved in the period July to December, 1929, inclusive; what number are now under construction; and the average initial cost of building a new school? Sir C. TREVELYAN Proposals for nine new Nursery Schools were approved in the period 1st July to 31st December, 1929. So far as my information goes, there are nine schools at present under construction. The average cost of providing a new Nursery School, on the basis of a number of recent examples, is about £34 per place. School Accommodation, Selsdon, Surrey 39. Mr. EDE asked the President of the Board of Education when he will be in a position to announce his decision with regard to the plans for a new school at Selsdon, in the urban district of Coulsdon and Purley, from the Surrey County Council? Sir C. TREVELYAN I am in communication with the Local Education Authority in regard to this proposal, and I hope to be able to announce my decision shortly.