National Insurance Act Travelling Expenses 15. Mr. CATHCART WASON asked the Secretary to the Treasury if he can now state what provision will be made for travelling expenses of insurance committees in cases where any levy is insufficient; and if he will state if any portion of the special Grant set apart for the Highlands and Islands will be available for such purpose? Mr. W. BENN I am afraid it is impossible to give a definite answer on this subject at present. Mr. C. WASON Is my hon. Friend aware that this question has been before the Treasury for six months, and is it not quite time there was an answer? Mr. W. BENN The Scottish Insurance Commissioners are making special inquiries into this matter, and as soon as they are complete an answer will be given. Hospital Subscriptions 16. Sir J. D. REES asked whether the right hon. Gentleman is aware that the Saturday collections for Nottingham hospital are £1,600 less than those of the previous year; that the deficiency is due to the unwillingness of subscribers to continue their subscriptions since the National Insurance Tax has been levied; and whether the Government proposes to reimburse hospitals in such cases or to in- troduce the principle of voluntary contribution under the National Insurance Act? Mr. W. BENN The answer to the first two parts of the question is in the negative. With regard to the last part, as I have previously stated, if, as the result of experience the voluntary hospitals find that they require State Grants, the whole question of State control would necessarily be raised, and at the present time this is not contemplated. Sir J. D. REES May I ask whether the Government have under consideration the giving up of the compulsory character of these contributions, the effects of which are so cruel in some cases? Mr. W. BENN That is not a question which rests with me. Sir J. D. REES How can I help addressing the question to the hon. Gentleman when the Minister concerned is not here? Mr. W. BENN My right hon. Friend is absent on account of ill-health. I am pointing out to the hon. Gentleman that his question should be addressed, not to the Financial Secretary to the Treasury, but to the Prime Minister. Unemployment Benefit 44. Mr. O'GRADY asked the President of the Board of Trade whether W. Andrews, a bricklayer, has for the last six weeks been unable to obtain 10s. unemployment benefit due to him at the Holloway Labour Exchange; and will inquiries be made at once into the reason of this delay, and, meanwhile, instructions be given that Mr. W. Andrews be paid what money he may be entitled to under Part II. of the National Insurance Act? The PARLIAMENTARY SECRETARY to the BOARD of TRADE (Mr. J. M. Robertson) I understand that the claim in question was the second claim made by Mr. Andrews, and that the delay in dealing with it, which I greatly regret, was due to the fact that the original claim, without which it was impossible to decide the second claim, had been mislaid. This claim has now been traced, and payment has been authorised. Mr. WILLIAM THORNE Is the hon. Gentleman aware that when a man claims at a Labour Exchange, and the claim is disputed, it sometimes takes three weeks or a month before the Labour Exchange gives a definite answer? Mr. ROBERTSON In regard to direct claims I do not think there is any such delay. Mr. W. THORNE Yes, there is. Mr. ROBERTSON I do not know whether my hon. Friend is referring to direct claims or to claims made under Section 105 by a trade union. Mr. W. THORNE When a claim goes to the Labour Exchange and it is disputed investigation takes place, and sometimes it is a month before a definite decision is given. Mr. ROBERTSON We are certainly doing our best to accelerate such claims. I assume that in such cases there has been an appeal to the Court of Referees. Mr. O'GRADY Had the first claim anything to do with the second, and why was the man not paid in respect of the claim that was not disputed? Mr. ROBERTSON The matter could not be dealt with without the knowledge of the details of the other, the paper with regard to which had been mislaid. Medical Benefit 61. Mr. MALCOLM asked the right hon. Gentleman whether the scheme for medical benefit put forward by the Scottish Clerks' Association, which is similar to the proposals made by them and approved by him while the National Insurance Act was in Committee, has now been refused by the Glasgow Insurance Committee; and whether he proposes to take any action in the matter? Mr. WEDGWOOD BENN I would refer the hon. Member to the answer given by my right hon. Friend the Secretary to the Treasury to my hon. Friend the Member for Glasgow (Bridgeton) on the 27th instant. 17. Sir J. D. REES asked whether the friendly societies operating in the Heanor, Langley Mill, Ripley, and Codnor districts decided to form a medical aid association; that ten doctors of the district thereupon issued a manifesto to the effect that they would refuse under any circumstances to attend uninsured persons in families joining such association; and whether the Government countenances such action on the part of the said doctors? Mr. W. BENN The arrangements made for the medical attendance of uninsured persons do not require the approval of the Government or the Insurance Commissioners. Aged Members Of Friendly Societies 20. Mr. O'GRADY asked whether the 2s. 6d. Capitation Grant in respect to the increased cost of medical benefit above the 6s. assumed by the actuaries when drafting the scheme under Part I. of the National Insurance Act is only to be given insured persons whose societies elect to provide medical treatment as one of the benefits; and whether, in view of the fact that there are a number of aged members of friendly societies who, by reason of ill-health, cannot become insured persons but who are included in Section 15 (2) (e) of the Act and are now without medical benefit owing to the increased cost; and, having regard to the hardship thus inflicted, will steps be taken to grant the 2s. 6d. in the case of these persons conditional upon their societies making provision for their adequate medical treatment? Mr. WEDGWOOD BENN I am afraid I can add nothing to the answers already given to similar questions by my right hon. Friend the Secretary to the Treasury. The money voted by Parliament for a Grant of 2s. 6d. per head in respect of insured persons is not available in respect of uninsured persons. Mr. O'GRADY Will the hon. Gentleman remind his right hon. Friend that these persons are aged members of friendly societies, that the total cost the first year would be £16,000, and that at the end of the fifth year the liability would fade away? Mr. W. BENN I am aware of those facts, but the difference is between insured and uninsured persons. These persons are not compulsorily insured. Mr. WORTHINGTON-EVANS Will the hon. Gentleman take some steps to carry out the intention of the House of Commons at the time of the passing of the Act that the uninsured old and incapable members of friendly societies shall receive equally good treatment as those who come in compulsorily? Mr. W. BENN I will draw my right hon. Friend's attention to the remark of the hon. Member. Mr. WORTHINGTON-EVANS Will the hon. Gentleman try and induce his right hon. Friend to do something in the matter, or else give the House of Commons an opportunity of discussing it? Mr. W. BENN I will, as I have said, draw my right hon. Friend's attention to the matter. Petrol Tax 65. Sir JOHN LONSDALE asked to what extent has the yield of the Petrol Tax been affected by the increasing use of paraffin for motor purposes; and whether paraffin is held to come within the definition of motor spirit in 10 Edward VII., c. 8? Mr. McKENNA The use of paraffin as motor fuel has not appreciably affected the yield of the tax on motor spirit. It is still, I believe, in a somewhat experimental stage, but the possibility of its further development has not been lost sight of. It could be taxed under the definition referred to if it should come into general use, on its capacity being established for providing reasonably efficient motive power. Sir J. LONSDALE Is it contemplated to impose any tax on paraffin? Mr. McKENNA It will depend how far it becomes used as a means of generating motive power. Land Valuation 66. Mr. NEWMAN asked whether, in arriving at site value on the transfer or sale of a composite property, it is the custom of the Inland Revenue authorities to include with the value attributable to the buildings any profit to which they may consider the transferor or seller to be entitled and to levy Increment Duty on any excess sum then shown as compared with the site value as on 30th April, 1909; and, if so, whether any instructions have been issued to valuers defining the normal percentage of profit on a transaction which may be allowed to a seller as a deduction? Mr. McKENNA It is the duty of the valuers to ascertain the market value of the property by the ordinary processes of valuation, and the addition of a fixed percentage of profit for the seller forms no part of those processes. Mr. NEWMAN Has the right hon. Gentleman had an opportunity of studying the letter which was sent by the secretary of the Chancellor of the Exchequer to a Somersetshire builder, which stated that the custom of the Inland Revenue authorities was as suggested in my question? Mr. McKENNA I will call the attention of my right hon. Friend to the contradiction. 68. Mr. NEWMAN asked the Chancellor of the Exchequer whether, in view of the fact that Increment Duty is being claimed on the excess of any sum obtained on the sale of a composite property above its market value, it is his intention to repeal the Clause of the Finance (1909–10) Act, 1910, which enacts that Increment Duty shall only be charged on an increase in the site value of the hereditament? Mr. McKENNA The practice of the Commissioners of Inland Revenue, as described in the hon. Member's question, is not, having regard to the definition in Section 2 (2), inconsistent with the Section to which he refers, and my right hon. Friend sees no reason to repeal the Section. Mr. NEWMAN Is there any intention of fresh legislation on this subject? Mr. McKENNA I could not express an opinion on that. Payment Of Dividends (Deduction Of Income Tax) 67. Mr. CASSEL asked the Chancellor of the Exchequer whether the circular to banks with regard to Income Tax is yet ready; and when it will be laid upon the Table of the House? Mr. McKENNA I would refer the hon. and learned Member to the reply which has already been given this afternoon upon this subject by my right hon. Friend the Prime Minister. This answer was prepared before it was known that the Prime Minister would be absent. Mr. CASSEL Can, the right hon. Gentleman give me the answer? Mr. McKENNA I am afraid I am not in a position, in the absence both of the Prime Minister and the Chancellor of the Exchequer, to give the answer. Sir G. YOUNGER Does the right hon. Gentleman think the circular will be issued immediately? Mr. McKENNA I am afraid I am not in a position to state anything more. Mr. CASSEL Is the right hon. Gentleman aware that the Chancellor of the Exchequer undertook to lay it on the Table of the House before it was issued and before 5th April? Mr. McKENNA Yes, the Chancellor of the Exchequer has still a long time ahead of him. Aviation (India) 69. Sir J. D. REES asked the Under-Secretary of State for India whether any Army aviation classes have been formed in India? The UNDER-SECRETARY of STATE for INDIA (Mr. Montagu) The answer is in the negative. Sir J. D. REES Has the Secretary of State the matter under consideration and, in view of the fact that the greater part of the British Army is in India, does he not think it a serious omission? Mr. MONTAGU The Government of India has the matter under consideration. Labourers Acts (Ireland) 71. Mr. GINNELL asked the Chief Secretary for Ireland if he will state the total amount of the loans under the Labourers (Ireland) Acts now outstanding, the total interest and sinking fund, respectively, being paid at the present time by rural district councils on that sum, and the average annual local expenditure on repair, equipment, and upkeep of the labourers' cottages and administration of the Acts in the last five years, so far as known in the offices of the Irish Local Government Board? Mr. T. W. RUSSELL There is no complete information available as regards the loans outstanding, and it could only be obtained, if at all, by communicating with every clerk of a rural district council in Ireland. The average annual cost of repairs to labourers' cottages for the five years ending 31st March, 1912, is £14,609, while the average annual cost of insurance, rent collection, and legal proceedings for the same period is about £8,485. There are further expenses in connection with the administration of the Labourers Acts, such as salaries and other charges, which would be impossible to estimate, as that work forms only a part of the duties of the rural district councils. National School Teachers (Ireland) 74. Mr. GINNELL asked why the Commissioners of National Education, on promoting a teacher from one grade to another to which a higher salary is attached, do not automatically pay that higher salary from the date of promotion, especially as they return unused some of the money voted to them by Parliament; and, if it be the Tresury, into which this unsued money goes, which prevents its use, by what statutory authority does it refuse to provide salaries according to the Board's scale? Mr. RUSSELL I have nothing to add to the numerous replies given by my right hon. Friend the Chief Secretary to questions on this subject. Teachers qualify for promotion under Rule 104 (a), but the number of teachers recognised in each grade is limited and an increased salary cannot be awarded until vacancies arise. It is not permissible for the Commissioners of National Education under the Regulations sanctioned by Parliament and the Treasury to apply the balances remaining on hand at the end of the financial year towards payments of Grants not provided for in the Vote, or for which the sanction of Government and the Treasury had not previously been obtained. Mr. GINNELL The right hon. Gentleman has not explained by what statutory authority the money is withheld by the Board which returns money to the Treasury unused? Mr. RUSSELL The returning of unexpended money to the Treasury is obligatory upon all Departments. Mr. GINNELL They pay their debts first? Mr. RUSSELL This is not, a debt until a vacancy occurs. 82. Mr. O'DONNELL asked the Chief Secretary to the Lord Lieutenant of Ireland whether he is aware that the Fish teachers' executive, as well as the annual congress of teachers just concluded, unanimously decided to refuse to gve evidence before the Committee of Inqury while it sat in private; whether he is aware that under these circumstances he further sittings of this Committee will be of no value; and, if they still refuse to admit the Press, will he take steps to dissolve the Committee? Mr. RUSSELL It is not proposed to dissolve the Committee? While regretting not to receive the assistance of the teachers' organisations, its members hope to be able to furnish a useful report from the documents and evidence which have been submitted to them. Land Purchase (Ireland) 75. Mr. GINNELL asked the Chief Secretary having regard to the number of Acts passed promising relief to bonâ fide evicted tenants in Ireland and the number of those officially noted as entitled to this relief who still remain unprovided for while their farms remain untenanted, whether he will take care that the Land Purchase Bill now in preparation will remedy this hardship by compelling the landlords of such vacant farms to sell them for the purpose of restoring thereto the evicted or their representatives? Mr. RUSSELL Three thousand two hundred and forty-eight tenants have been reinstated or provided with new holdings and there are now only 303 evicted tenants whose applications have been provisionally noted for consideration in the allotment of untenanted land acquired by the Estates Commissioners, and who have not yet been reinstated or provided with new holdings (in some sixty of these latter cases the applications received stated that the evicted holdings were in the landlord's occupation). The Commissioners consider that these cases include all persons whose claims deserve consideration and who are suitable to work land, and they are not prepared to reconsider the other cases in which they have decided to take no action. The Commissioners hope to be able to provide holdings for such of these 303 applicants as may be finally approved, on further consideration, out of untenanted land acquired under the voluntary provisions of the Land Purchase Acts. Mr. GINNELL The right hon. Gentleman has not answered the question whether the preparation of the forthcoming Land Purchase Bill will be availed of to provide for these people. Mr. RUSSELL The Estates Commissioners have these cases in hand altogether apart from any consideration of future legislation. Mr. GINNELL Seeing that the Estates Commissioners have had these cases in their hands for ten years without effect, will the Chief Secretary now take steps to settle these cases? Mr. RUSSELL I cannot allow the hon. Member to say that. It is quite true that the case of the evicted tenants has been under consideration for ten years, but that these cases have been under consideration for ten years is not true. Mr. GINNELL Is the right hon. Gentleman aware of the fact that every one of these cases has been on the list of approved cases for ten years? Mr. RUSSELL I am not aware of that. Mr. GINNELL I am aware of it. Mr. W. O'BRIEN Is it not the fact that, although the right hon. Gentleman has stated that there are only 300 cases pending, more than 5,000 cases have been rejected altogether, and is there to be no reconsideration of these cases? Mr. RUSSELL I must conclude that if the Estates Commissioners rejected these cases there are bonâ-fide grounds for it. Mr. O'SHAUGHNESSY Will the right hon. Gentleman see that the Estates Commissioners deal with those cases that they have recognised as genuine at once and without further delay as these people have been evicted for twenty years? Mr. RUSSELL I have no objection to pressing that on them. Mr. CREAN Why should not they continue to exercise their influence in the interests of those whom they approved of originally? Because they could not get land they simply cast them out. Mr. RUSSELL I cannot add anything to the information which the Estates Commissioners have given me. A large number of cases have been rejected, and from my information I think properly rejected. The Estates Commissioners who are entrusted by Parliament with this duty declare that out of between three and four thousand they have still 303 on the list, and they intend to confine themselves to that list and will not go back on the rejections. Several HON. MEMBERS rose. Mr. DEPUTY-SPEAKER Further questions must be put down. Castledawson Riot 76. Major M'CALMONT asked whether, on the 26th November last, the Reverend R. Barron, Presbyterian minister at Whitehouse, gave the police at White- house, at their request, a list of the names and addresses of men, women, and children of his congregation who had been injured at Castledawson, on the previous 29th June, by members of the Ancient Order of Hibernians, who were subsequently tried and convicted of riot; and whether the Crown Solicitor for County Londonderry had this or any similar list before the trial? Mr. RUSSELL A list was given on 28th November, 1912, by the Rev. Robert Barron to the police and forwarded to the Crown Solicitor, who submitted it to the counsel appearing for the Crown. The list contained the names of three children, but no women. The indictment on which the accused were tried was for riot, and the evidence given at Petty Sessions was, in the opinion of Crown Counsel, sufficient to sustain the indictment without further evidence, and all the prisoners referred to in the question returned for trial were convicted. Captain CRAIG Why was not the evidence bearing on the wounding of these women and children not brought before the Crown Prosecutor in Court? Mr. RUSSELL Counsel for the Crown saw that the evidence given before the Petty Sessions Court was sufficient to convict them, and they were convicted on the evidence. Captain CRAIG Is it not the fact that they were released after undergoing a very short term of imprisonment simply because the Crown Prosecutor did not bring forward the evidence that they had acted as cruelly as they did? Mr. RUSSELL No, these prisoners were released by order of the Lord Lieutenant when they had served almost the full three months—I think within a fortnight—and they were released by the exercise of the prerogative of the Crown. Mr. RONALD M'NEILL May I ask whether it is customary to suppress evidence when it is considered by the Crown solicitor that a conviction might be obtained without it? Mr. DEPUTY-SPEAKER The hon. Gentleman's supplementary question should be confined to a matter of fact arising out of the answer. Mr. MITCHELL-THOMSON May I ask whether it was at the request of the police that that evidence was not brought forward? Mr. RUSSELL I am not aware of that. Crown Solicitors (Ireland) 77. Major M'CALMONT asked the Chief Secretary whether, on the recent death of the Crown Solicitor for county Londonderry, the Sessional Crown Solicitor for that county should have been appointed to the amalgamated offices of Crown Solicitor and Sessional Crown Solicitor in accordance with a Treasury Minute; and whether Dr. R. H. Todd, who had formerly held both offices in county Westmeath, was appointed Crown Solicitor for county Londonderry? Mr. RUSSELL On the resignation of the Crown Solicitor for the county and city of Londondery in November, 1911, Dr. R. H. Todd, who at one time held the offices of Crown and Sessional Crown Solicitor for county Westmeath, was appointed to the vacancy. There is no Treasury Minute such as suggested, but one of the recommendations of a Departmental Committee, approved by the Treasury, was that the offices of Crown and Sessional Crown Solicitor should be amalgamated, and this recommendation is, as a rule, acted on, but in the present instance it was not deemed desirable in the public interest to impose further duties on the Sessional Crown Solicitor. Mr. MITCHELL-THOMSON Can the right hon. Gentleman say whether there are any other cases in which the recommendations of the Departmental Committee have not been followed? Mr. RUSSELL I think there have been cases in my own recollection. I cannot at the moment say where they were. Captain CRAIG Is it not a fact that in the cases referred to it was intended to give jobs to those who received the appointments? 78. Major M'CALMONT asked the Chief Secretary whether Dr. R. H. Todd, now Crown Solicitor for county Londonderry, who prosecuted at the recent Ulster Winter Assizes, is the same gentleman who was formerly Sessional Crown Solicitor for county Westmeath; whether, in accordance with the Treasury Minute which lays down that the offices of Crown Solicitor and Sessional Crown Solicitor shall be amalgamated as opportunities arise, he was subsequently appointed Crown Solicitor for county Westmeath; and whether he resigned that office, under pressure from the Attorney-General, owing to the manner in which he carried out his duties? Mr. RUSSELL The answer to the first paragraph of the question is in the affirmative. Dr. Todd, who held the office of Crown Solicitor for county Westmeath, was subsequently, on a vacancy occurring in the office of Sessional Crown Solicitor for same county, appointed to the united offices of Crown and Sessional Crown Solicitor. When holding these offices Dr. Todd was permitted to reside in Londonderry, and as he was unable to carry out his duties from that place to the satisfaction of Government, he resigned. Captain CRAIG Is this the gentleman who was the Crown Prosecutor in the cases arising out of the Castledawson outrages? Mr. RUSSELL Yes. Major M'CALMONT Is the reason given by the right hon. Gentleman the only one why this gentleman resigned the office? Mr. RUSSELL So far as I know. Carriage Of Potatoes (Ireland) 79. Mr. DUFFY asked the Chief Secretary (1) whether he will call the attention of the Congested Districts Boards to the rates charged for the conveyance of potatoes, etc., from Arran Isles, county Galway, to the city of Galway; is he aware that the steamship company refuses to weigh or give a receipt for potatoes delivered to the company at Kilronan; can he say if the Congested Districts Board, the Agricultural Department, the Irish Lights Board, and the General Post Office give a yearly Grant for the running of this steamer to Arran Isles; will he cause inquiry to the made from the shipping company why better facilities are not given for the marketing of the produce of the islands; (2) whether he is aware that complaints have been made by traders and others as to the high rates of freightage charged by the shipping company on the carriage of potatoes and other goods from Arran Isles, county Galway, to the city of Galway; is he aware that potatoes are one of the chief products of the island, and that a quantity of them at the present moment are practically useless to the people owing to the rate charged by the shipping company for their carriage to Galway; and, having regard to the urgency of disposing of these potatoes at once, will be communicate with the Congested Districts Board and have arrangements made to enable these poor people to market immediately this perishable crop? Mr. RUSSELL The rate charged by the Galway Bay Steamboat Company on potatoes is 5s. a ton between Arran and Galway. Inquiries are being made as to whether there has been any departure from this rate, and also with regard to the allegation that the company refuses to weigh or give receipts for potatoes delivered to them at Kilronan. The Congested Districts Board and the Post Office make yearly Grants towards the steamship service to the Arran Islands.