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Commons Chamber

Volume 2: debated on Thursday 12 July 1804

House of Commons

Thursday, July 12 1804

Minutes

brought up the report of the committee on the petition from the city of London, respecting the rebuilding of the Poultry Computer. Upon the motion of the hon. bart. leave was given to bring in a bill for rebuilding the said Computer, and for enabling the sheriffs, in the interim, to remove their prisoners.—A new writ was moved for a representative for Bath, in the room of Lord J. Thynne, who has accepted the place of Lord Chamberlain to his Majesty.—The Expiring Law bill was committed.—The Lottery bill was read a 3d time and passed, as was also the Irish Small Note bill.—Mr. Sturges Bourne brought up a bill for permitting the exportation of salt from this country and the Bahamas, to certain settlements in North America.

Ordnance Lands Bill

On the motion for the 2d reading of the Ordnance Lands bill,

objected to it, on the principle of its allowing the permanent purchase of lands for the crown, which was contrary to the principle of our constitution. The General Defence bill already gave power for the temporary purchase of such lands; but this bill would go to render the purchase permanent. That the principle may have been adopted in any former bill, was no reason, in his mind, why it should serve as a precedent to justify new errors. The reference, too, was to the lord lieutenant of the county, whom he considered ineligible, as being an officer of the crown, removable at pleasure; and, therefore, he thought that reference to the bench of justices of the county would be infinitely more proper. He did not know whether the present was the proper stage in which to object to particular clauses; but if not, he would avail himself of the future stages of the bill.

informed the hon. member, that in the present stage of the bill he must confine himself merely to the general principle of the bill.—The bill was then read the 2d time.

Irish Trade With Newfoundland

The house having resolved itself into a committee on the acts for regulating the trade between Ireland and Newfoundland,

observed, that the trade to Newfoundland was of importance to Ireland, and deserved encouragement, and for that purpose he proposed two resolutions to the committee: 1st, that salt should be allowed to be exported, duty free, from the ports of Waterford, Ross, Cork, and Limerick, to Newfoundland, for the benefit of the trade; and 2dly, that salt imported into Ireland should be allowed to be re-shipped, without being landed from the vessels in which it should be imported into vessels clearing out for Newfoundland, free of duty.—The resolutions were agreed to, and the house being resumed, the report was ordered to be received to-morrow.

Irish Revenue Bill

On the motion for the 2d reading of the Irish Revenue Regulation bill,

objected to its being read a 2d time in so thin a house. He thought it a bill of much importance, and that it ought to be printed, and time given for its mature consideration. He was himself unacquainted with its contents, but only knew from report, that it was directed to raise a very great revenue in Ireland, and therefore the fullest time ought to be given for its due discussion.

answered, that the bill was printing, and he had every reason to believe would be ready this day. If the hon. member would not oppose the 2d reading now, and allow the bill to be committed for to-morrow, he pledged himself to them to agree to defer it farther till Saturday, if the hon. gent. desired.—The bill was then read a 2d time, and committed for to-morrow.

Irish Spirits Warehousing Bill

observed, that this measure was a direct violation of the articles of union, and he felt himself bound, of course, to object to it. The distillers of Ireland felt considerable alarm on the subject; and in such a case, he trusted the right hon. gent. would not persist in his intention of proceeding with the bill this day, and in so thin an attendance. It would not be too much, therefore, to ask, that the right hon. gent. should defer the 2d reading, till the bill should be printed, and in the hands of the members.

replied, that he was willing to give the hon. gent. every indulgence consistent with the period of the sessions. There was a bill before the house for the collection of all the revenues of Ireland, which had been kept back above 3 months, and depended for some of its clauses on the provisions of this bill. The hon. gent. would have many opportunities of opposing the principle of the bill; though he was certain he should, on examining it, perceive that it was calculated to carry into effect the spirit of the Union. There was one clause in it, however, which, consistently with his duty to his constituents, he could not but approve, that was the clause for allowing the warehousing of spirits for exportation, without paying the duty, which amounted to 4s. 6d. per gallon, whilst the intrinsic value of the spirit was not above 2s. The right hon. gent. stated some other circumstances, to shew that the measure was not inconsistent with the article of Union, and expressed a firm persuasion, that whatever might be the opinion of certain distillers, all the rational, moderate, and loyal persons engaged in the trade would be satisfied. He should consent, if the bill should not be printed this day, to put off the committee to Saturday, beyond which he could not delay it.

rising to reply, was reminded by the Speaker of the necessity of confining himself strictly to explanation. The hon. member then expressed a wish that the right hon. gent. would not compel him to take advantage of the state of the house.

observed, that there was not a more loyal body of men in Europe, than his respectable constituents, in whose behalf his hon. colleague had opposed the present question.

then moved, that the house be counted, when it appearing that only 29 members were present, the order was necessarily dropped, and the house adjourned.