in bringing up the report of the select committee appointed to inquire into the laws and ordinances of foreign states regulating the intercourse between their Roman Catholic subjects and the see of Rome, took occasion to observe, that had such a report as he had then the honour to present, appeared at an earlier period, much of the disorders by which Ireland was agitated, would have been prevented. Such a mass of evidence as the report contained, would have rendered it impossible for any self-interested persons, who entertained but little regard for the honour of their religion, to impose on so large a class of his majesty's subjects. He then proceeded to detail the course taken by the select committee, in which he had the honour to preside, in applying the various documents which had been submitted to their examinations. The committee had directed their examination chiefly to two points, namely, the appointment of bishops of the Roman communion, and the exercise of the regium placitum or regium exequatur, upon the intromission of all rescripts and mandatory missives from the see of Rome, or any other foreign jurisdiction. Under a third head they had classed such matter as came within the scope of their instructions, but which was not applicable to either of these heads. And first, they had classed all those states in communion with the see of Rome,— secondly, the Greek church,—and thirdly, the Protestant states, whether of the Lutheran or Calvinistic, or more usually termed the reformed communion. In all those states (the exception being scarcely worthy of notice), it would be found that the exercise of a direct or indirect authority on the part of the sovereign, both in the nomination of prelates of the Roman communion, and upon the intromission of papal rescripts was uniformly in force. The evidence which had been adduced was not merely from writers of the highest authority, but also from the official dispatches of his majesty's ministers, accredited to foreign courts, who, in consequence of an application made by himself to the noble secretary of state (lord Castlereagh) four years since, had been directed to pay the minutest attention to this important subject, and it would be found from their dispatches, that they had manifested the greatest zeal, industry and ability, in collecting the necessary information from the most accredited sources. Sir J. C. H. said, he could not but observe, that when he had the honour to make the motion which had been productive of the present mass of information, one hon. member only had expressed his opposition to that motion, on the ground that it was not becoming this country to ground its proceedings or its regulation on the principles or practices of those states. He regretted that this observation came from an hon. and learned gentleman whose profession might have informed him that our own laws were, with all their perfection, but a tissue of the laws and ordinances of other nations contexed with our own; nor had we scrupled at a very late period, to adopt a canon of the council of Trent, since the Reformation, as the basis of our celebrated marriage act, thereby making the descent of property and honours dependent upon the wisdom of a Romish canon. The opinion of that great legal luminary, lord Bacon, was decisive upon that subject, who had declared that our laws were as mixed as our language— Danes, Saxons, and Normans, all had their share in its frame. He then moved, that the report be laid on the table.

said, that having been one of the majority, which on a former occasion prevented the purpose of the hon. baronet from being carried into execution, he was desirous of showing the difference which existed between that period and the present. Then the measure proposed would have had the effect of impeding the progress of a bill before the House; and rather than delay a bill of such consequence he had no hesitation in declining the information which the hon. baronet had it in his power to give. But on the present occasion, the hon. baronet could not have a warmer supporter than himself; nor had he the least hesitation in saving farther, that the information contained in the report was necessary to the having the question fully understood. Deeply as they were all interested in the final settlement of the question, that settlement could only be valuable in so far as it was founded on the firm conviction, and cordial assent of all parties. The Catholics of Ireland had not only objected to the modifications and conditions which the House might wish to annex to the boon sought for by the Catholics; but it had been argued by them, that the proposing such conditions was a singular proceeding in this country, and that Catholics were subjected to no such conditions in no other country on earth. This erroneous belief was but too often accompanied by another, that no two religions could exist together in perfect tolerance and harmony. He was anxious that this question should be now finally settled, not on the romantic notion, that with it every feeling of animosity would at the same time be settled; but because he believed that the question was one, without the settlement of which no other evil could be radically cured; it was not only an evil in itself, but it was made the pretext for many more, and it aggravated them all. The documents appended to the report, would show that the conditions which had been proposed in this country, fell far short of what every other country, whether Catholic or Protestant, thought it necessary to adopt for its safety. It had happened to him to be a few weeks ago in a part of Europe, stated in many publications which he had read, to contain the seeds of bitter persecution of the Protestants, on the part of the Catholics. He found no marks of the existence of any such persecution; but he had found what was so little known in this country, that Protestants were not only tolerated, but in every respect on an equal footing with their Catholic fellow subjects, and even seemed to have more than their proportion of honours and employment. He alluded to the department of the Gironde, which contained a population of 514,000, of whom the Protestants amounted to 30,000, or one seventeenth of the whole. Of the seven members of the chamber of deputies returned by the department, one was a Protestant. Of the five counsellors of the prefecture, one also was a Protestant. Of 24 members of the municipal administrations, five were Protestants. In another council at Bordeaux, seven were Protestants. In a procession which took place while he was at Bordeaux, the archbishop of Bordeaux was first in order, and he was immediately followed by a Protestant clergyman. The banker to whom he had been recommended, had received a patent of noblesse from the present government; and of four other patents bestowed in the department since the accession of the government in question, three were to Protestants, and one to Catholics. All this existed without creating any convulsion, or subjecting the Protestants to any inhuman persecutions. It might indeed be said, that these acts showed the spirit of the government rather than that of the people; but however, as many of the elections were by corporations, they could not have happened if any angry religious feelings had existed. He was more and more convinced of the necessity of emancipation; and that with the conditions which it might be thought advisable to annex to the boon, the final settlement of the question ought not to be delayed. To this final settlement the report of the hon. baronet could not fail greatly to contribute.

wished to communicate to the House some information received by him from the Catholic prelates of Ireland. They had proposed of their own accord, that instead of the present mode of nominating bishops, they should in future be elected by the dean and chapter. This mode would assimilate the discipline of the Catholic church of Ireland to that of several other Catholic states, and would bring it back to the purer ages of the Catholic church. This plan of election by the dean and chapter was the law for many ages of the Christian church; and had been adopted by the church of France, and in our own statute of provisors. The Catholic clergy, in making this proposal themselves, had receded from their resotions of 1808, in which they declared the inexpediency of any change whatever.

apprehended that the question, whether bishops should be elected by the dean and chapter, or, as latterly, by the see of Rome, was one with which the parliament could not meddle, without departing from the rule which they had always laid for themselves, of avoiding all interference with the Catholic religion. This was a question between the clergy of Ireland and the see of Rome, and not between the Catholics of Ireland and parliament. However much it might be wished that the election of the bishops of Ireland should approximate as much as possible to our own, he could not consider such a mode of election as a substitute for the security proposed to be taken. He conceived the House were greatly indebted to the hon. baronet for the pains he had taken in collecting the information contained in the report; and with respect to which he had given the hon. baronet every facility in his power. The body of information was so extensive, that the labours of the committee were likely to be attended with success. They would carry conviction into every mind, that the British legislature never contemplated the proposing any regulations which were not thought necessary both in Protestant and Catholic states. This information could not fail to do good in the case of those whose minds had been led away and disturbed by false statements on this subject. Those who hereafter opposed the conditions must do it from an indisposition to a liberal connexion with the state. He was extremely happy to see that they were likely to have on their table a report founded on so many documents of the greatest authority.

could not help congratulating the Catholics on what he had heard with so great satisfaction, the sentiments delivered by the right hon. gentleman (Mr. Canning), who had lately acceded to the ministry. He could not help inferring from the manner in which, as well as the occasion when these sentiments were delivered, that they might look forward with better hopes and expectations than they had ever yet had of a speedy settlement of the great question of Catholic emancipation. When he coupled those sentiments which the right hon. gentleman had just delivered with the circumstance of his recent accession to the administration, he felt convinced that the right hon. gentleman would not have expressed his increased sense of the importance of a final settlement of the question, unless he had previously come to a distinct understanding on the subject with the rest of the administration: and he felt this conviction the more strongly when he called to remembrance the very manly grounds on which the right hon. gentleman stated some time ago that he had declined acceding to the same administra- tion He hoped, therefore, that the right hon. gentleman had not delivered his sentiments on this occasion merely as a member of parliament; that in the next session the question would not come before the House as usual, merely in consequence of petitions from the Catholics, but that it would be officially brought in by those who held the most prominent place in the councils of the country, and that they would no longer have to witness that trifling, which, year after year, had been displayed, of men filling the highest situations of the government, holding out this as a measure of the most vital importance —declaring that no measure with regard to Ireland was likely to be attended with any good effect, if it was not carried—that Ireland could not otherwise be tranquillized and yet leaving a measure of such vital importance to the country, to be brought forward, not by themselves, but by those who could not have the same weight with themselves, and whose efforts could not, therefore, be expected to be attended with the same success. The right hon. gentleman had thought proper to allude to another topic, which had little or no connexion with the present subject —for what reason it was not so easy to see—the situation of the Protestants of the South of France. Who had ever said, that the Protestants were persecuted at present in the part of France, which the right hon. gentleman had mentioned? But did he take upon himself to undo all the evidence which had been given of the existence of the most severe persecution of the Protestants in another quarter of France? No one ever said, that there had been any persecution in the department of the Gironde, but in the department of the Gard. Neither had it been said, that that persecution was carried on by the French government, but by the lower orders of Catholics against their Protestant fellow subjects. Yet though the government had not themselves carried on the persecution, it was stated, and justly stated, that it had not done its duty in taking those measures which would have put a stop to it.

After a few words from sir J. C. Hippisley, the report was brought up, and ordered to be printed.

said, that as some severe reflections had been reported to have been made on a very deserving body of men by an hon. member (Mr. Barham) he wished to make a few remarks respecting them.

observed, that it was irregular, even when a question was before the House to refer to a former debate; but as there was now no question, it was still more irregular.

regretted that the rules of the House did not permit him to give the explanation which the hon. member seemed to call for.

then gave notice of a motion tomorrow, for extracts of the dispatches received by the government from the colonies, respecting the proceedings of the missionaries during the two last years.

made some inquiries as to the causes of delay in the ratification of the treaty with the Nepaulese; and moved, " That there be laid before the House an account of the foreign and territorial debt of India, bearing interest, and that not bearing interest, specifying the rate of interest."

replied, that no accounts had been received by government, which would enable him to form any conjecture as to the probable cause of delaying the ratification of the treaty. The accounts of the debts would be made up as soon as possible.

asked Mr. Canning whether he had any objection to his moving for the production of such papers as related to the mandamus issued by the court of King's-bench, and served upon the directors of the East India company, at the instance of the board of control; and stated that his object in moving for such papers would be, the information of members during the recess, not only as he considered the subject to be one materially affecting the efficiency of our governments in India, but as he had reason to believe that the subject would be brought forward early in the next session.

replied, that he was not disposed to accede to such a motion, that it would only tend to revive animosities, that the subject was now gone by, and that, therefore, notwithstanding the menace of the hon. member to bring on a discussion on this matter on some future say, he should oppose it.

observed, that he had not menaced in any way, that it did not rest with him, but with others to bring this question on; with regard to the time being gone by, he must beg leave to assure the right hon. president of the board of control, that in consideration of the state that board bad been placed in for Some months (without a president), not only discussion on this subject, but on other matters of great importance to the affairs of India had been postponed.

Lord Morpeth's motion was agreed to.

reminded the House that in the last session, a committee of the House had sat to examine into the state of the prisons, which committee had recommended that a commission should be appointed to inquire in to the state of the King's-bench, Marshalsea, and Fleet prisons, and that it should be recommended to the judges to investigate and remove the abuses existing therein. At the beginning of the session, when he had made inquiries as to this commission, it was said that it had been appointed, but that it had not then proceeded with its investigation. Since that, though the session was so near its termination, he had heard no more of it. As to the King's-bench it was said that much had been done to remedy the abuses. Now, though Something had been done, yet nothing effectual had been done. It would hardly be believed in that the marshal had derived 800l. a year from a percent age on the beer drank in the prison, in defiance of act parliament; and 2,500l. a year from the rules: that was to say, this sum of money was taken from the pockets of debtors, to the injury of their creditors, for the benefit of the marshal He could not imagine that these abuses could continue, unless the marshal was supported by some person of high authority. The paper which he had moved for respecting the Petworth house of conrrection, would show that the abuse of the system of solitary confinement, had exceeded any thing that could have been imagined. For the crime of vagrancy a person had been subject to this terrible punishment for 13 months, one for 7 months, and several for 4 months. As to the wretched woman, whose case he had before mentioned, he had no doubt that her insanity had been produced by the solitary confinement, as she was now declared to be not insane. Among the cases mentioned in the return was, that of a man who had been kept in solitary confinement three months for destroying a pheasant's egg ! That was to say, the miserable being Who fell under the sentence, was kept 23, hours out of the 24 within four small walls, without any kind of employment, either entirely open to the air, or quite excluded from light, and the crime for which this punishment was inflicted, was the breaking a pheasant's egg. He thought it was the duty of the person with whom the power resided, to strike out of the commission the magistrates who had concurred in this sentence. The hon. gentleman then moved for an account of the number of persons confined in the King's-bench prison on the 24th of June, 1816, and of the greatest number confined in that prison, between the 24th of June, 1815, and the 24th of June 1816.

said, the commission which had been appointed had not yet made its report, but considerable progress had been made in the investigation. When the report of the committee had been laid on the table last session, no motion, had been made on the subject, but the secretary of state for the home department had thought it his duty to recommend the appointment of a committee, and he had also laid a copy of the committee's report before the chief justice of the King's-bench, who, it was presumed, would take the steps which were necessary with respect to the prison more immediately under his jurisdiction

hoped he should be allowed say a few words to do away the impression which the hon. mover had made on the House. As to the first case of Isaac Francis, who had been confined for 13 months as a vagrant, his confinement was an act of charity when he was taken up he was unable to give an account who he was, all he could utter was the word "Newport." Inquiry was made at Newport in the Isle of Wight, but no such person was known there. At last a woman happened to come into the neighbourhood from Newport in Monmouthshire, from whom it was learnt that the person belonged to that town, and he was restored to his parents. As to the female who had been mentioned, she was still supposed to be instance, but if security was given for her the magistrates would willingly liberate her. The case of the man who was confined for destroying a pheasant's egg, he was not acquainted with. The cause of complaint which had been given by solitary confinement would soon be removed, as two rooms were to be built for the common use of the prisoners.

defended the magistrates of the district, whom he could state to be attentive and humane. The female alluded to had, when brought before the magistrates, in the first instance, committed such acts of violence that he had considered her insane. The inconvenience arising from the want of windows in the cells had been removed, by introducing a pane of glass into the shutters, so that even when they were closed there was light enough to read by.

said, that the manner in Which this poor woman had been confined, and the period of that confinement, was enough to make her insane. He entered into a statement of the particular circumstances attending her seduction, which he thought extremely distressing, and deserving of serious attention. The punishment of solitary confinement had, he believed, been much abused, not so much by a stretch of power, as by a mistaken idea of what was intended to be produced by it. The punishment had been recommended by Mr. Howard, in order that the individual secluded from all intercourse with society, might have time to reflect on his conduct, and to form proper principles of reformation. It certainly, however, was never meant by Mr. Howard to extend this punishment to so enormous a length as two years, and to keep the individual buried alive without admitting him to the open air. The case was of vast importance, and particularly called for the attention of the House.

said, that considerable alterations were making in the prison, by order of the magistrates. He did not, however, wish the punishment of solitary confinement to be abolished. It gave the individual time to review his conduct, while, on the contrary, unlimited intercourse with prisoners actually vitiated the morals, and led of hardened incorrigible impenitence. The character of Mr. Serjeant, chairman of that county, for humanity and attention to the interests of justice, was too well known to require any eulogium from him.

The motion was agreed to.

drew the attention of the House to the propriety of building free churches, instead of pillars, to celebrate our victories, and moved an address to the Prince Re- gent, to request his royal highness to give directions, that free churches be erected as National Monuments, in honour of the ever memorable victories of Trafalgar and Waterloo.

acknowledged that there was a want of churches in the metropolis, and stated that it was intended to propose some measure next session to remedy the evil. He said that the idea of appropriating a great number of churches to commemorate our triumphs, did not appear to him one that could be entertained. If adopted, he thought that the expense would exceed the sum voted. He concluded by moving the previous question.

hoped the monuments, whatever they might be, would be made to answer some purposes of utility, besides those of national trophies.

The previous question was agreed to.