I beg to ask the Secretary of State for War whether in the case of the killing of Godefroy at St. Helena an investigation before a coroner was demanded by the Boer prisoners, which demand was refused; and, if so, can he state why it was refused; whether at the military inquiry which did take place the friends of Godefroy were represented, and whether his; representatives were allowed to cross-examine the military witnesses; whether the committee of Boer prisoners who communicated with the Governor in reference to this incident have sent in any statement; and, if so, whether such statement was considered by the court which conducted the inquiry; and whether he will allow the Member for East Mayo to have access to any correspondence which has passed between the Camp Committee, the Governor, and the President of the Court in reference to the shooting of Godefroy, and to the official record of the proceedings of the Court. In asking the question which stands in my name, perhaps I may be permitted to express my profound sympathy with the Secretary of State for War in the grievous loss he has sustained.

I thank the hon. Member for his expression of sympathy—an expression which, I am sure, will meet with approval in all parts of the House. With regard to the question on the Paper, the report called for has not yet arrived. 1 am not therefore in a position to answer the question.

I beg to ask the First Lord of the Treasury whether it is intended to propose any grant of money to Sir R. Buller on account of his services in South Africa; and, if not, will he say why no such proposal is made.

Before the right hon. Gentle- man answers, may I ask if he will kindly see that the services of this gallant general are not undervalued because he is recommended by the hon. Member for East Mayo?

We have no proposal to make on the subject.

Are we to understand that no grant is to be made to Sir R. Buller at any period, and will the right hon. Gentleman kindly answer the concluding portion of my question?

As regards the concluding part, I do not think that it is a fit subject to be discussed here.

The right hon. Gentleman has not answered even the first part of my question.

^* : Order, order! The right hon. Gentleman has answered it, and he says he has no proposal to make on the subject.

That is not an answer. I beg to ask the right hon. Gentleman whether he intends to propose any grant. The question I put is not exactly in the form in which it appears on the Table.

We have no proposal to make.

Does that apply to the future as well as to-day?

Sir, proposals always refer to the future.

I beg to ask the Secretary of State for War whether he can state what date General Sir Baden Powell applied for leave of absence, on what date the leave was granted, and on what day General Sir Baden Powell sailed from South Africa.

Major-General Baden Powell applied for leave on 1st July and sailed on 5th July. I telegraphed to Lord Kitchener on the 4th July authorising the grant of leave.

Am I to understand that General Baden Powell sailed before he obtained leave?

No, Sir, certainly not. He sailed on the 5th; leave was given on the 4th.

^* who had on the Paper the following question: To ask the Secretary of State for the Colonies whether, seeing that the Pass Law of the Transvaal has been repealed by proclamation, dated Monday last, at Pretoria, he can state what is the extent of the abolition of the punishment of flogging apparently announced by the same proclamation, and whether the labour clause of the last Gold Act has been left unrepealed, said he would not put the question, as it had been altered at the Table into a form which was incorrect. He would ask, instead, whether, under the Proclamation, flogging was abolished both under the Pass Law and under the Gold Law?

I have laid on the Table, at the request of the right hon. Gentleman the Member for West Monmouthshire, a statement giving a full account of the law in force under the old Republic. It will be seen that the laws are extremely complicated, and question is made still more difficult by the fact that the laws themselves were very imperfectly and, in some cases, corruptly administered; so that the actual state of the case is riot perfectly clear. It is evident that the whole question must be carefully revised, and that revision will, I hope, result in placing the law on a satisfactory and intelligible footing, but, of course, it cannot take place until Lord Milner has returned to South Africa. He has been directed to make it one of the earliest objects of his investigation to examine the effect of this law and its working, and to make suggestions. In the meantime, I thought I was justified in telegraphing to the Attorney General to inquire whether the punishment of flogging was, in his opinion, necessary or justifiable, and if not, that it should be abolished. I have received from him a telegram, and I gather from it that flogging is no longer to be allowed for being without a pass or for breach of contract, or for any offence under either the Pass Law or Gold Law, except those specified in Section 18 of the Pass Law relating to the fraudulent use of passes by natives. I have fully discussed this difficult and complicated matter with Lord Milner, who will deal with it on his arrival in South Africa, and will consider whether there is any sufficient reason for retaining the penalty in the case of offences under Section 18 of the Pass Law.

I have to thank the right hon. Gentleman for his courtesy in laying Papers on the Table. May I ask whether the Pass Law now in force has been in point of fact invalid, but has been revived by a proclamation of the British Government.

I understand the right hon. Gentleman to suggest that it is in force now as an enactment of the British Government. I am not perfectly clear on that subject myself, but what I believe is the case is that, with the exception of the flogging clauses, the old Pass Law of the Transvaal is in force under proclamation by the British Government; and, as I have already stated, the whole of this law will be carefully reviewed as soon as Lord Milner gets back to South Africa. In the meantime, it is necessary to have some law, and the old law has therefore been re-enacted.

I will not press the subject, as I believe we shall have an opportunity of discussing the matter on the Estimate for the Civil Administration of the Transvaal, and I hope by then the right hon. Gentleman will be able to tell us what he intends to do.

May I ask whether, when the laws affecting natives are under consideration, the right hon. Gentleman would consider the prevention of any such compound system as now exists at Kimberley.

I think the question is rather premature. I have already stated that the whole matter will be reviewed by Lord Milner when he goes back, and until I have his report I am unwilling to make any statement on the subject.

I beg to ask the Secretary of State for the Colonies whether he can state who is now in command of the South African Constabulary; whether the South African Constabulary are acting as a military force; and whether it is at the disposal of Lord Kitchener.

In the absence of the Inspector-General, the Constabulary is commanded by the chief staff officer, Colonel J. S. Nicholson, D.S.O. The Constabulary acts as a military force in time of war, and as such is under the directions of the Commander-in-Chief.

I beg to ask the Secretary of State for War whether it has been brought to his notice that the last batch of Police and Yeomanry recruits were of such a low standard from a medical point of view that a number of them went into hospital suffering from ailments of different kinds, including phthisis, shortly after they had landed in South Africa, and whether he can give any explanation of the fact that these men succeeded in passing the medical examination.

Reports have reached me that a number of the last batch of Imperial Yeomanry have been at various times admitted to hospital in South Africa, and I have telegraphed for a full report.

The noble Lord has not answered the latter part of my question. He has not explained how these men succeeded in passing the medical examination.

I must wait till I see the report.

Surely that has no bearing on the report from South Africa. The question is whether the recruits were properly examined by the Army Medical Department prior to their departure.

When we know the complaints for which these men were admitted into hospital we shall be better able to judge whether any blame attaches to the Medical Department.

^* : Will the noble Lord make inquiry as to whether there is reason to suspect that a large number passed the various tests in other people's names.

I could not answer that off hand.

I beg to ask the Secretary of State for War whether his attention has been directed to the fact that consignments of goods sent on in April last by the Dutch Committee for the use of women and children in prison camps, and directed to Nurse Bokkes, Refugee Camp, Winburg, Orange Free State, were on 30th June still lying at Port Elizabeth, and whether he will telegraph instructions to have the goods immediately sent on.

Inquiries were addressed to South Africa at the end of June, and the General Officer at Cape Town promised to look into the matter, and take the necessary measures for forwarding on the consignment.

Will the noble Lord now kindly make inquiry as to whether the consignment has gone on?

No. The General Officer Commanding gave his distinct promise to look into the matter, and I think that is enough.

I beg to ask the Financial Secretary to the War Office whether he can state what was the total cost of the war from 31st March last up to the present, and what the weekly cost of the war was during July.

The approximate expenditure on the war in South Africa from 1st April to 31st July amounted to £25,750,000, but this includes large payments in April chargeable against the accounts of the preceding year. The approximate weekly cost during July was £1,250,000.

I beg to ask the Secretary of State for War, having regard to the fact that in response to a request by the officer commanding the 72nd Regimental District to arrange for the conveyance by a special steamer on the 11th June of the Lewis section of the Sea forth Highlanders (600) from Kyle of Lochalsh to Stornoway, Mr. M'Brayne provided a steamer which was not only unable to carry little more than half the number, but was also deficient in shelter accommodation, with the result that Private Macaulay, of Brager, Island of Lewis, died from exposure to the weather, while others have been invalided; will care be taken that a steamer affording suitable protection against the weather is provided should it be found necessary to again convey His Majesty's forces to and from Stornoway.

The matter will not be lost sight of.

^* : I beg to ask the Secretary of State for War whether he will consider the advisability of relaxing the conditions under which messing allowance is not granted to private soldiers unless they have attained the age of nineteen years, have been a full period of six months under training, exclusive of days of absence and days in hospital, and have during the period of such training made satisfactory progress.

The matter has been carefully considered, and there would appear to be no justification for relaxing the regulations.

^* : I beg to ask the Secretary of State for War whether any steps have been or are being taken to reduce the weight of 18st. 10¼; lbs., 19st. 8¼ lbs., and 20st. 4¼ Ibs. carried on field service by the horses of the light, medium, and heavy cavalry respectively.

In South Africa the weights have been reduced to a minimum. In the United Kingdom no final decision has been arrived at, but this question is receiving careful consideration in view of our recent experiences.

^* : May I ask if the noble Lord is aware that the riding weight of the American cavalry is some 2 stone or 3 stone less than our own?

^* : Order, order!

I beg to ask the Secretary of State for War whether, in view of the different conditions which obtain in civil elementary schools, and to prevent certificated teachers being misled thereby, paragraphs can be inserted in the instructions for the guidance of candidates for admission into the Army as schoolmasters, to inform intending candidates what are the hours of duty on joining at Aldershot, that evening school work is compulsory upon Army schoolmasters, and that such evening school work does not carry any extra pay.

Candidates join for a year's probation at Aldershot, where they have full opportunity of learning the conditions of service as Army schoolmasters, and where they have the option of leaving on giving three months notice. The suggestion will, however, receive consideration.

I beg to ask the Secretary of State for War whether, in the terms offered to officers of the Reserve to join the Royal Garrison regiments, there was no mention of a time limit of service, so that officers joined in the belief that they could serve up to the age of fifty-five, as laid down in the Royal Warrant, and in many cases furnished themselves with colonial outfits; whether such officers have now been informed that they have only an engagement for one year, with power of renewal; and whether, seeing that no statement has yet been made as to the prospect of promotion of such officers, it is intended that they shall continue to serve in the ranks they now hold, or be promoted in due course, if fit.

The services of Reserve officers when called up for employment can be dispensed with when they are no longer required, but, in order to give the officers doing duty with the Royal Garrison regiments some fixity of tenure, a year was fixed as the minimum period of their employment. This, however, is not necessarily the maximum. In the event of any vacancies taking place in the regiments, they will be filled either from the Reserve or by regimental promotion, at the discretion of the Commander-in-Chief.

Were the officers told of the limit on joining?

They certainly ought to have been told, and I have no reason to suppose that they had not the information.

I beg to ask the Secretary of State for War, seeing that land required in connection with the conversion of Woking Prison into an artillery barrack was offered for £2,533, but owing to the Treasury Solicitor failing to understand the War Office instructions to purchase, delay occurred which resulted in the land being ultimately secured by arbitration at a cost of £6,800, will he say by whom the War Office instructions were pre- pared; and whether, in future, care will be taken to place work of this character in the hands of competent persons.

It is to be regretted that, owing to a misunderstanding, the delay mentioned should have occurred. Steps have, however, been taken to prevent any similar occurrence in the future.

I beg to ask the Secretary of State for War whether he is aware that the principal medical officer for the Scottish district reports that the bath accommodation at Piershill barracks, Edinburgh, is still insufficient, and will he state whether any action has yet been taken in the matter.

No, Sir. No such report has been made.

If the noble Lord will have the goodness to look at the report he will see that my question is absolutely correct.

I asked in Scotland if such a report had been made, and was answered in the negative.

I will give the noble Lord further information.

I beg to ask the Financial Secretary to the War Office whether he is aware that John Tighe and Michael Tighe, natives of Elphin, have been detained for one year and eight months in South Africa as members of the Militia Reserve of the 5th Battalion of the Connaught Rangers; and whether, as these men were the bread winners for their parents and a family of eight, who are now in destitution in Elphin, he will take steps to have them sent home from South Africa with the first batch of troops leaving there.

I am not aware that these men have been detained beyond the period of service for which they are liable. The reasons given are not sufficient to justify their being treated dif- ferently from other men of their battalion. It is within the power of these men to remit their pay or a portion of it for the support of their families.

Why are not these men treated in the same way as the C. I. V.'s?

I beg to ask the Financial Secretary to the War Office whether his attention has been drawn to the fact that the Department has received from Michael Dalton, contractor for artificers' work in Boyle, Sligo, and Carrick barracks, a detailed statement, dated 25th July, as to the methods employed against him in the fulfilment of his contract; whether these statements have been inquired into by any independent officer; and, if so, with what result.

No such statement has reached the War Office.

When the statement reaches the War Office will it be inquired into, as it makes very strong charges?

Any question there may be between this contractor and the military authorities will be decided by the General Officer commanding. If there is to be decentralisation at all, we cannot possibly interfere with the discretion of the general officer commanding.

If this man is treated wrongly, will he get no redress?

No, Sir, he will not.

I beg to ask the Secretary of State for War whether the boy Mellin, whose release was decided on early last month, has yet been set free; and, if not, can he say why this has not been done.

In the early part of July it was decided to release this soldier on the date on which he embarked for South Africa. The draft with which he will go leaves about the end of August. I am afraid that I misled the hon. Member in a reply on the spur of the moment to a supplementary question.†

I beg to ask the Secretary of State for India whether he can state what effect has been given by the local governments in India to the Government of India's resolution in the Quinquennial Review of Education, by Mr. F. S. Cotton, published in the Gazette of India , 4th November, 1899, for the clear determination of the relations between private enterprise and the State.

^* : The resolution of the Government of India contained for the most part directions for further inquiry and report. I understand that local governments have submitted the reports called for in it, and that these are now under the consideration of the Viceroy. I have not, however, received the final conclusions of the Government on the questions discussed, which are of a very extensive and complicated character. No new principle has, so far as I am aware, been laid down regarding the relation between private enterprise and State expenditure on education, which continues to be regulated by the principles accepted in the Report of the Education Commission of 1883.

On behalf of the hon. Member for West Denbighshire, I beg to ask the Secretary of State for India whether he will state what, up to the end of the year 1900, was the amount of the arrears due from the railway system of India to the general revenues of the country.

Up to the end of 1900 the total loss upon Indian railways was Rx. 57,800,000; but in the financial year 1899–1900 there was a net gain of Rx. 115,000. These figures of course take no account of the immense

† See page 54.

indirect gain to the prosperity of the country and to the State revenues from the construction of railways.

I beg to ask the Secretary of State for India if he is now able to say what action he proposes to take with regard to the sum of money lying at the Bank of England to the credit of the Scinde, Punjab, and Delhi Railway, which railway was taken over by the Government of India in 1886.

^* : I am in communication with the Treasury on this subject, but am not yet in a position to make any statement.

I beg to ask the Secretary of State for India if he can state what number of troops, British and native, of the Indian army are now on service outside the frontiers of India, at each respective place at which they are stationed, and what troops serving in South Africa are to be withdrawn, and, if so, how soon.

^* : Since I answered a similar question addressed to me by the hon. Member on 18th February‡ last, the number of native troops serving in China has been reduced by some 9,000 men, and it will be further reduced. Otherwise the figures I then gave remain substantially unaltered. The British troops sent from India for service in South Africa will, I hope, be replaced at an early date, but I am unable as yet to say how soon that will take place.

I beg to ask the Secretary of State for India whether the Board of Visitors of Cooper's Hill College has made any report since representatives of the universities were added to the Board; and, if so, whether he is prepared

‡ See Debates [Fourth Series], Vol. lxxxix] page 303.

to lay the report upon the Table before the discussion of the Indian Budget.

^* : A report has been submitted making various recommendations which are now under consideration. I will lay it on the Table as soon as possible together with a copy of a letter conveying my decision on the points raised. But the Papers will not be ready for publication for some time to come.

I beg to ask the Secretary to the Admiralty whether the Army Order of 25th June, 1901, relating to pensions and compassionate allowances for the widows and children of soldiers killed in action will be followed by a Royal Warrant and instructions extending the same privileges to the Royal Navy.

The answer to the hon. Member's question is in the affirmative

I beg to ask the Secretary to the Admiralty whether his attention has been drawn to the fact that an average sum of £200 per annum is required to be spent by every commander of a battleship in the Mediterranean and Channel Squadrons in painting and adorning his ship with materials such as gold leaf and enamel not supplied by the State, which expenditure does not add to the fighting efficiency of the fleet; and whether, with the view of preventing the exclusion of officers not in possession of private means from the position of commander and first lieutenant in these squadrons, he will take steps to relieve commanders of this expenditure.

The Admiralty have no information as to the sums officers may expend upon the adornment of ships in excess of regulation requirements. Many officers do undoubtedly expend money on their ships from their private resources, but there is no reason to believe that the average is as high as that mentioned by the hon. Member. It is not proposed to prohibit the practice. At present the quantities of paint materials supplied to His Majesty's ships are amply sufficient for all service purposes, and commanding officers are authorised to sanction the issue of special allowances whenever the necessities of the service make such a course desirable.

I beg to ask the Secretary to the Admiralty whether during the recent French naval manœuvres in the Mediterranean the signals of the French Admiral, transmitted by wireless telegraphy, were received and read on board a British cruiser; and, if so, whether the Admiralty have taken any precaution, for securing British messages from similar publicity in the French fleet.

It is not apparent what public advantage is served by asking or answering such questions as that of the hon. Member. It is the duty of the admirals and officers in command of British fleets and ships to take proper precautions to arrange for the confidential transmission of messages, and they spare no effort to perform their duty in this respect.

I beg to ask the Secretary to the Admiralty whether he has any information to the effect that wireless telegraphy is fitted on board fourteen French battleships now in the Mediterranean, while only three English battleships belonging to the Mediterranean Squadron are thus equipped.

The Admiralty has no official information as to the extent to which wireless telegraphy is supplied to vessels of the French fleet, but the statement as made in the hon. Member's question is believed to be incorrect. Seven British ships in the Mediterranean are now fitted with wireless telegraphy. A large number of additional sets are now in course of manufacture, and will be delivered at an early date.

I beg to ask the Secretary to the Admiralty whether the Admiralty have come to any decision with regard to the claims of the accountant branch of the Navy, which are understood to be under consideration, for an improvement in status and pay.

There is no present intention of making any change in the status and pay of the accountant branch of the Navy.

I beg to ask the Secretary to the Admiralty whether he can state when the Report on the construction of the Royal Yacht will be laid upon the Table.

The Report of the Royal Yacht Committee is a Departmental Report, which, in the ordinary course, would not be presented to Parliament. The whole matter has been investigated, the responsibility traced, and the blame assigned to the proper persons. It is not proposed to lay the Report upon the Table.

I beg to ask the Under Secretary of State for Foreign Affairs, in view of the fact that the Chinese Commissioners negotiating with representatives of the Powers in Peking have received an Imperial Edict protesting against the excessive fortification of the Legations commanding the Imperial City, and that this Edict is specially directed against the high loopholed wall and tunnels towards the Imperial City wall which form part of the British Legation works, whether His Majesty's Government will avoid the danger of reprisals on British subjects in cities where such defences do not exist by limiting the fortifications so as to deprive them of any aggressive character.

^* : We have not received any information of a protest by the Chinese Government against the British Legation defence works. The scheme for the defence of the Legations was drawn up by the military representatives of the Powers in China, and the defence works of the British Legation are part of that general plan.

Will the noble Lord inquire by telegraph?

[No answer was returned.]

I beg to ask the Under Secretary of State for Foreign Affairs if he is now in possession of the facts with regard to the alleged removal of the Britannic Consulate General at Odessa from a central urban position to a distant suburb, which now necessitates journeys costing time and money to British shipmasters who enter and clear from the port; and, if so, will he state the facts and the decision of the Foreign Office.

^* : It has been ascertained that the offices of the Consulate General at Odessa were moved last month from their former position. More commodious premises were thus secured and better arrangements made for the conduct of official business. The extra expense is reported as quite insignificant, and as regards time, the present drive from the Custom House is estimated at fifteen minutes as against eight minutes formerly. The position of Consular Offices is governed by local considerations, and is not as a rule referred to the Foreign Office.

I beg to ask Mr. Chancellor of the Exchequer whether he is aware that resolutions have been passed from time to time by the County Councils Association, the Association of Municipal Corporations, the Urban District Councils Association, and the Institute of Municipal Treasurers and Accountants in favour of an amendment of the Trustee Act, 1893; and, seeing that there is a precedent for the desired amendment in the case of the Trusts (Scotland) Act, 1898, and in view of his answer of the 13th March, 1900, whether he can now state when the law relating to trust investments will be amended on the lines suggested.

Yes, Sir, I have received resolutions of the nature described in the question. I understand that the Lord Chancellor, with whom the initiative would rest, is desirous of proposing legislation on the matter. Other Government business, however, has made this impossible.

I beg to ask the Secretary of State for the Home Department whether his attention has been called to a number of accidents to girls employed in a fruit-preserving factory at Millwall; whether these accidents were officially reported to the Home Office; and what steps he proposes to take to prevent such accidents in future.

^* : Yes, Sir; I am informed that there have been several accidents in the factory to which I understand my right hon. friend to refer, and that there have been some failures to comply with the requirements of the law as to reporting the accidents. Proceedings have been taken with the result, in one case, of convictions and fines of £2 for each of the offences of not reporting and not registering an accident; and another case is pending. The existing law appears to meet the case, and every effort will, of course, continue to be made to enforce it.

I beg to ask the President of the Board of Trade whether he is aware that the report of the sub-inspector of railways on accidents shows that Peter Gallagher, a goods guard, lost his life at Maryhill, on the North British Railway, on the 5th November, 1900, through having fallen over a heap of rubbish in the four-foot way when about to couple two vehicles shunted into the siding; and will he ascertain whether the North. British Railway Company have given effect to the recommendations of the sub-inspector that arrangements should, be made for the entire removal of the rubbish heaps from the paths the men have to use during shunting operations.

The sub-inspector in reporting on the fatal accident referred to pointed out that no one saw the occurrence, but that it was probably caused as stated by the hon. Member. The North British Railway Company informed the Board of Trade in February last that instructions had been given with the view of securing that the yard in question should in future be kept, as far as possible, in a clean state.

I beg to ask the President of the Board of Trade, seeing that Mr. David M'Brayne's paddle steamer "Glencoe" is now fifty-four years old, having been built in 1847, is used for the conveyance of passengers through the exposed seas around the coasts of the Western Highlands and Islands, will he state when, where, and by whom she was last surveyed.

The steamer to which the hon. Member refers holds a Board of Trade passenger certificate. She was last surveyed at Glasgow in June this year by one of the Board's surveyors.

Is she not fifty-tour years old?

[No answer was returned.]

I beg to ask the President of the Board of Trade whether he can state how many appointments have been made in the Board of Trade during the last seven years to positions ranking as higher division posts excluding those of a technical nature, how many of such positions have been filled by the assignment of candidates by the Civil Service Commission after Class I. examinations; how many by direct appointment from the outside without examination, and how many by the promotion of second division clerks; whether any vacancies at present exist in the higher division of the Department; and, if so, how many; and whether it is in contemplation to fill any of them by the promotion of qualified second division clerks.

The number of clerical appointments made in the Board of Trade and subordinate departments during the last seven years to positions with salaries in excess of those of the second division was twenty-four. Of these eight were filled by the assignment of candidates by the Civil Service Commissioners, after Class I. examinations; one by direct appointment from the outside without examination; and fourteen by the promotion of former Class II. or second division clerks, while in addition to those promotions two official receiverships, which are of a quasi-technical nature have been conferred upon former Class II. clerks. Five vacancies at present exist for the higher division and staff posts. It is the practice of the Board of Trade to consider whether they have second division clerks on their establishment with the necessary qualifications for promotion to the higher division, and the usual course will be followed in connection with these vacancies.

I beg to ask the President of the Local Government Board if he has now consulted the law officers of the Crown on the subject of the powers of the metropolitan borough councils to acquire land necessary for their duties and purposes; whether he has come to any conclusion on the question; and, if so, will he state whether the councils have such powers.

The question which has been under consideration relates to the power of the Local Government Board to authorise metropolitan borough councils by Provisional Order to purchase land compulsorily. I am now advised that the Board are not empowered to issue any such Order for the purposes of the Adoptive Acts, the Electric Lighting Act, or the Open Spaces Acts, but that it is competent for them to issue such an Order for the purposes specified in Section 150 of the Metropolis Management Act, 1855, and Section 24 of the London County Council (General Powers Act, 1893. As regards the case at Bethnal Green, in which my hon. friend is interested, it would be competent for the Board to issue a Provisional Order so far as the extension of the depot is concerned, but not for the purposes of the Electric Lighting Act.

I beg to ask the Vice-President of the Committee of Council on Education if His Majesty's inspectors of schools have reported any cases of the discounts off list prices for school appliances being accounted as voluntary contributions to schools, the full list prices being charged on the expenditure side of the balance-sheet; and will he issue instructions to His Majesty's inspectors to have regard to such a matter when inspecting school accounts.

The answer is in the negative, and no instructions therefore seem necessary.

I beg to ask the Vice-President of the Committee of Council on Education if he will grant a Return of the statistics of higher grade schools conducted by school boards which include a school of science.

Yes; I shall be very glad to give the Return asked for. Perhaps the hon. and gallant Member will communicate with me as to the form in which it should be moved.

I beg to ask the Secretary to the Treasury, as representing the Postmaster General, whether complaints have been received from the Birmingham telegraphists with reference to the amount of overtime they are compelled to perform, and whether he can state the number of male telegraphists at the Birmingham Telegraph Office on 1st January and 1st July respectively, together with the number of hours of overtime performed during those months.

Yes. The Birmingham telegraphists have complained of the amount of overtime they have to perform, and a considerable addition to the force has recently been sanctioned to provide the necessary relief. It has not been practicable to furnish the in formation respecting the number of hours of overtime performed at Birmingham during the months of January and July in the short time available; but it may be stated that the telegraph work in July is always much heavier than in January.

I beg to ask the Secretary to the Treasury, as representing the Postmaster General, whether his attention has been called to the fact that, though counter clerks in the London district post offices who received risk money prior to the Report of the Tweed-mouth Committee were allowed to retain this right, a clerk in the London district was recently placed on certain counter duties, these duties usually being performed by a senior clerk; and whether the Postmaster General will direct that the clerk should be paid risk allowance in accordance with the usual practice.

The Postmaster General's attention has not been called to the case referred to, and, in the absence of further particulars, it has not been possible to trace it. Under the present rules of the service, however, the counter officer in question could only receive a risk allowance provided—(1) that he was in receipt of such allowance prior to the 1st April, 1897; (2) that the duty upon which he is employed if created before that date would have had a risk allowance attached to it; and (3) that the total risk allowance authorised for the office at the time is not exceeded.

I beg to ask the Secretary to the Treasury, as representing the Postmaster General, whether it has been brought to his notice that there are some fifty clerks in the Postal Service belonging to the old counter establishment who were appointed with a risk allowance of 3s. a week, which allowance, prior to the Tweed mouth Committee, they regularly received, but which they now lose when called upon to take the duties of either overseers or senior telegraphists; and whether, seeing that they had remained in the class from which they were promoted their position would have been better and their salary in some instances as much as £50 per annum higher, he will consider the advisability of allowing them to draw the risk allowance regularly in addition to their weekly salary.

Risk allowances are paid to officers performing particular duties and cannot, of course, be paid to them when they temporarily perform other duties. For the same reason risk allowances cannot be continued to officers after their promotion to a higher class.

I beg to ask the Secretary to the Treasury, as representing the Postmaster General, if rural postmen will in future be placed on the same footing as town postmen in regard to Christmas overtime, and if they will receive payment for extra time for which they were employed while attending at the office to prepare for delivery the extra amount of correspondence and other matter which has to be dealt with at that season of the year; whether their present rate of payment is based solely on the distance walked; and whether any account is taken of the time required for sorting their deliveries before starting.

Established rural postmen are paid extra for duty on Christmas Day at a rate and a half of their ordinary wages, according to the distance walked, that being the basis on which their regular pay is fixed. As they are not paid by time like town postmen, they do not receive extra payment for prolonged attendance in preparing their letters for delivery, and no reason is seen for altering this practice. But if rural postmen are required to come on duty earlier than usual they are paid for the extra attendance.

I beg to ask the Chief Secretary to the Lord Lieutenant of Ireland whether he is aware that Messrs. O'Shaughnessy and Haughton have recently been in county Kerry as court valuers for the Land Commission revising second-term rents fixed by the Sub-Commission; and seeing that in many of these cases the first terms had been originally fixed by Messrs. O'Shaughnessy and Haughton themselves, whether it is intended to continue the practice of sending court valuers to particular districts to revise rents originally fixed by themselves in those districts.

The reply to the first paragraph is in the affirmative. The fact that in some such cases the rents for the first term were fixed upwards of fifteen years ago by a Sub-Commission of which the gentlemen named were members, has not, in the opinion of the Land Commissioners, precluded them from employing them as valuers. The Commissioners have full confidence in their impartiality and integrity.

Is the right hon. Gentleman aware that at least 50 per cent. of the tenants can get no reduction whatsoever in their rents?

I am not.

Well, it is a fact.

I beg to ask the Chief Secretary to the Lord Lieutenant of Ireland whether he is aware that Mr. M. J. Nolan, of Newtownsands, a magistrate for the county Kerry, was refused the use of the court houses at Tarbert and Ballylongford by the High Sheriff of the county, although Mr. Nolan in his application stated that the court houses were to be used only by the ratepayers of the district in connection with the building of a line of railway from Listowel and Ballylongford to Tarbert; and, seeing that Mr. Nolan also gave his personal guarantee as a magistrate as to the safety of the court-house buildings to the High Sheriff, whether he can state on what grounds the High Sheriff refused to this magistrate and ratepayers of North Kerry the use of the court houses, and what steps the Government intend to take in connection with the action of the High Sheriff of Kerry.

The custody of the court house is vested in the Sheriff. Its primary and paramount use is the administration of justice. The ratepayers have no right to the use of it for the purposes mentioned. I have no authority to interfere with the sheriff in the exercise of his discretion.

Have the ratepayers, then, no right to use these buildings?

I understand not. It is a matter within the discretion of the sheriff, who in this case was not apparently disposed to accord the privilege.

Will the right hon. Gentleman make representations to the Lord Lieutenant with a view to preventing the reappointment of this gentleman as high sheriff, seeing that he resigned his commission in the army in order to avoid going out to South Africa?

[No answer was returned.]

I beg to ask the Chief Secretary to the Lord Lieutenant of Ireland whether he is aware that Fenit pier was built at a cost of £90,000 to the ratepayers of Kerry, that there is no direct representation from the ratepayers on the Fenit Harbour Board; and that, though the county council have to contribute out of the public rates to the harbour commissioners, the county council have no representation on the Harbour Board, although they have passed resolutions asking for representation thereon; and, seeing that the harbour board is principally composed of shipping merchants who elect themselves, and that the press has frequently of late years been excluded from the meetings of the harbour commissioners, whether the Government intend to take any action in connection with this matter for the protection of the ratepayers of the county.

The Board of Works made a loan of £95,000 to the Pier and Harbour Commissioners in 1881. The harbour board consists of eleven members, of whom two are the chairmen of the Tralee Union and Town Commissioners, three representatives of the Tralee and Fenit Railway, five shipping merchants, and one member appointed by the Board of Trade. Legislation would be necessary to alter the constitution of the Harbour Board, and I cannot give an undertaking to introduce such legislation.

Is there another body of harbour commissioners throughout all Ireland which——

^* : Order, order!

Is the right hon. Gentleman aware, then, that out of thirty-two votes three shipping merchants control twenty-six?

^* : Order, order! The hon. Member must not discuss the question now.

I beg to ask the Chief Secretary to the Lord Lieutenant of Ireland whether he is aware that the estate of Francis Comyn Woodstock, near Galway, and within a congested district, is for sale, and that the occupying tenants have entered into agreements for the purchase of their holdings; and whether the Congested Districts Board has made any move towards acquiring the grass lands in the possession of the landlord, and which have not yet been sold, with a view to enlarging the holdings of the occupying tenants; is he aware that the sheriff, who is also receiver, has put in his son as tenant in order that he may qualify under the Act to become a purchaser, and if this proceeding will receive the sanction of the Land Commission?

A number of tenants on this estate have already purchased their holdings, and proceedings for sale of the unsold portions are pending in the Land Judge's court. A letting was made by the court to the receiver's son, and the land judge was satisfied that the letting was made bona fide at a full fair rent. The lessee, however, having declined to purchase at the price fixed by the land judge, the lands are to be sold by public auction. The question whether the Congested Districts Board will make an offer to buy is at present under consideration.

I beg to ask the Chief Secretary to the Lord Lieutenant of Ireland, having regard to the fact that tenants have the right to set snares on their land for the purpose of taking ground game, whether he will make inquiries into the cases of two men named Morgan and Concannon, who were fined at Ahscragh petty sessions, one 30s., the other £2 and costs, for having snares set on their land.

The conviction in these two cases were for using snares for the purpose of taking feathered game, not ground game. The convictions were upheld on appeal to quarter sessions.

proceeded to put a question about the magistrate who tried the case.

^* : Order, order! The hon. Member cannot in that way put a question which has been struck out at the Table.

It was the most important part of the question. Can the right hon. Gentleman say how anyone can tell if the snares were set for ground game?

Anybody can.

It is ridiculous.

I beg to ask the Chief Secretary to the Lord Lieutenant of Ireland whether he can state on what grounds the Commissioners of National Education are at present recommending the resignation of teachers who have not reached the age for maximum pensions of their class, and will the Commissioners be advised to allow such teachers to serve until they qualify for full pension.

The Commissioners have power, under the rules, to call on teachers to resign before they reach the compulsory age for retirement, on account of inefficiency, etc. The Commissioners cannot undertake to allow all teachers to serve until they qualify for full pension.

Will some scheme be introduced to secure these men reasonable compensation?

^* : The Board of Education has power to retire teachers whose work is unsatisfactory.

I beg to ask the Chief Secretary to the Lord Lieutenant of Ireland whether he can state the amount of school grants for the years 1899 and 1900 respectively, and what was the amount expended under each of the four heads specified in the Education Act, 1892.

A Return is in preparation showing this information for each year since the school grant became payable under the Act of 1892. When completed it will be laid on the Table of the House.

I beg to ask the Chief Secretary to the Lord Lieutenant of Ireland whether he can say on what basis recent salaries of teachers were fixed, and on what basis and at what rate the residual grant at end of year will be paid.

The salaries were fixed generally on the basis of the new rules, subject to special consideration in cases falling under Rule 43. The residual grant will be paid on the basis of the average attendance of pupils between three and fifteen years of age, and in accordance with Rule 12. The rate of the residual grant cannot be determined until the end of the year.

I beg to ask the Chief Secretary to the Lord Lieutenant of Ireland whether, in the case of a school with an average of sixty, the assistant's salary has been fixed at less than the minimum for third grade; and, if so, will he explain how such teachers will get the full benefit of the official promise that none shall suffer financially by the introduction of the new system.

No assistant's income should be fixed below the minimum of the third grade. If the hon. Member will supply me with particulars of the case he refers to it will be inquired into.

I beg to ask the Chief Secretary to the Lord Lieutenant of Ireland whether he is a ware that the Reverend Edwin Symons, Rector of Kilmactigue, county Sligo, and three other persons there are at present boycotted by the local branches of the United Irish League, and that they are unable to get their horses shod for the necessary farm and other work; whether he can arrange for permitting a military blacksmith to perform the work required in horse-shoeing for these persons, and whether the Government will give assistance to citizens under the conditions mentioned.

The facts are correctly stated in my hon. friend's question. The Government has instructed the Inspector General of Constabulary to send a portable forge to this locality, in charge of a constable who is a competent farrier, for the purpose indicated.

Is it not the case that this reverend gentleman has made himself most obnoxious to the people of the District?

[No answer was returned.]

I beg to ask the Chief Secretary to the Lord Lieutenant of Ireland whether he can state when the order for the sale of the White estate, near Bantry, was made, and why the order is not given effect to.

I presume the hon. Member refers to a sale under the 40th Section of the Act of 1896. The Land Judge issued his request for an inspection of the White estate on the 11th June, and until the Land Commissioners' report of the inspection has been made no further action can be taken.

I beg to ask the Chief Secretary to the Lord Lieutenant of Ireland whether he will give the amount levied annually during the past six years in Kerry for the purpose of paying railway guarantees and interest on pier loans, and also state the total valuation of the company, and whether he will investigate this burden with a view to finding out the treatment of the ratepayers by the Government and by the railway companies.

I have been, supplied with detailed Returns, but it is not possible to summarise them in reply to a question. The object which the hon. Member has in view can best be atta ned by moving for a Return in the form I have privately communicated to him. If this is done it will be issued without delay.

I beg to ask the Chief Secretary to the Lord Lieutenant of Ireland whether he is aware that the Banagher fair's committee sent a request to the Inspector-General, Royal Irish Constabulary, to instruct the police to enforce section 10, sub-section 10, of the 14 and 15 Vic., c. 92, in connection with the Banagher great fair held last September; and, seeing that the police took no action in the matter, whether, with a view of preventing horses being sold in the public streets of neighbouring towns and villages during the days preceding the Banagher annual great fair, steps wilt for the future be taken to enforce the law with respect to the matter.

The enactment referred to provides that horses shall not be exposed for sale except in the fair or market lawfully appointed for the purpose. In the present case the custom appears to have grown up of anticipating the fair by buying and selling in Birr and other places on the day preceding the holding of the Banagher fair. It is for the patentee of the fair to assert his rights by action for an injunction in the Chancery Division, and in such an action the legality of the custom referred to can be decided. The police cannot interfere in the matter, as suggested.

I beg to ask the Chief Secretary to the Lord Lieutenant of Ireland whether the decision of the Local Government Board, which was promised twelve days ago, has yet been delivered to the guardians of the Shillelagh Union; and, if so, will he say when was it delivered.

The Board communicated with the guardians yesterday.

Have they given their decision?

Yes, I communicated the decision.

I beg to ask the Chief Secretary to the Lord Lieutenant of Ireland is he aware that the Great Southern and Western Railway Company's rate for carriage of tea from London via Milford and Waterford to Rathkeale is 53s. 4d. per ton, while previously to the amalgamation the Waterford and Limerick Railway Company's rate was 45s. 10d. per ton; and seeing that the Great Southern and Western Company are bound to give facilities to traders equal to those enjoyed by them previously to the amalgamation, will he take steps to remedy this and similar grievances.

No specific representations have been made to the Department of Agriculture in this matter. Any such representations, if made, will be considered.

I beg to ask the Chief Secretary to the Lord Lieutenant of Ireland if he is yet in a position to state what is the result of the inquiry by the Department of Agriculture into the statement of Mr. Herbert Sullivan, of Curramore, Broadford, Charleville, a butter exporter, to the effect that before the amalgamation of the Great Southern and Western and the Waterford and Limerick Railways, his consignments of butter were taken from Newcastle West, county Limerick, to London within eighteen hours, and that, between the dates 18th April and 26th June of this year, twelve similar consignments of his from Newcastle West to London on twelve different dates were not delivered until four or five days after shipment; and, if found to Le correct, whether he will take any and, it so, what action to induce or compel the Great Southern and Western Company to give a better service to the public, so that Irish farm and other products may be expedited to English markets.

The facts are substantially as stated. As a result of communications between the Department and the railway company the latter have agreed that, pending the completion or certain negotiations which are in progress, they will convey the goods traffic to Waterford by the train which is due there at 9.30 p.m., in order that it may be shipped the same evening, provided the Great Western Railway of England will agree to delay their steamer for the, purpose

I beg to ask the Chief Secretary to the Lord Lieutenant of Ireland whether he is aware that Sergeant Sheridan, recently dismissed from the Royal Irish Constabulary, was stationed in hospital, county Limerick, in 1897 and 1898, and subsequently in Drumconra, county Leitrim; that while at hospital he, with Sergeant Keegan, was instrumental in convicting a man named Bray, who was sentenced to three years imprisonment for setting fire to a rick of hay; that Bray has always protested he was innocent; whether he is aware that at Drumconra Sergeant Sheridan, with Constable Reid, secured the conviction of Dan Mayoohan for cutting the tails off cattle; that Mayoohan was convicted by a jury at Sligo, and sentenced to two years hard labour; and that rewards of £5 each were given to Sergeant Sheridan and Constable Reid for their conduct in this case; whether inquiries have recently been made into the circumstances connected with the above cases; and, if so, what has been the result of those inquiries; will Sergeant Keegan and Constable Reid be retained in the Constabulary; and will he advise the Lord Lieutenant to reconsider his refusal of a public inquiry into the case of Sergeant Sheridan.

The statement in the first paragraph is correct. In answer to the second paragraph, an inquiry has recently been made, and the action to be taken on it is still under consideration. A public inquiry could not be held. Where it is alleged that a criminal offence has been committed, the only inquiry that can be held on oath must be made before a magistrate on a direct charge against the persons who are alleged to have committed the offence. There was not evidence on which to put Sheridan upon his trial, although there was no moral doubt that the case against Ryan was improperly preferred. The disclosure in Ryan's case suggested the consideration of other cases with which Sheridan was connected, and the inquiries so made have raised in my mind such doubts as to lead me to the conclusion that the convictions may have borne hardly on the individuals. I am unable at present to make a more definite statement.

May I ask whether' in view of the result on the right hon. Gentleman's own mind of the inquiries which have already been conducted, and the fact that the liberty of two or three men is at stake, while others have already served severe sentences, he will not advise the Lord Lieutenant to reconsider his determination and satisfy the public mind by ordering a full public inquiry, in accordance with precedent.

^* : I am unable to tender that advice, but if the men who have been accused were still in prison, I should advise the Lord Lieutenant with a view to having a review of their sentences.

Considering that the policemen whose names are mentioned in this question co-operated with Sheridan, are they to be retained in the force?

I have said that the whole question is engaging my attention, but I am not prepared to advise the Lord Lieutenant to grant a public inquiry.

I shall repeat the question before the end of the session, and if I do not get a satisfactory answer I shall raise it on the Appropriation Bill.

Will the persons imprisoned on the evidence of these men receive any recompense?

I am considering the whole question.

Will the mother of the man who lost his life during his imprisonment receive any recompense for the death of her son?

Order, order! The hon. Gentleman had better put that question down.

I beg to ask the Chief Secretary to the Lord Lieutenant of Ireland whether he has made any investigations into the case of Daniel Mayoohan, of Ballinamore, South Leitrim, who was convicted at the Sligo Winter Assizes on the evidence of a policeman named Sheridan, who has been since dismissed from the force for his conduct in the county Clare; whether he can state what was the result of the investigations, and if it is proposed to grant any compensation to Mayoohan for his wrongful imprisonment.

These inquiries are dealt with in my reply to the question of the hon. Member for East Mayo.

Will special inquiry be made into this case?

I have already replied to that.

I beg to ask Mr. Attorney General for Ireland whether he is aware that the trustees of the Bantry Estate claim the right to the rocks, sand, and seaweed on the foreshore of Bantry Bay between the railway pier and Newtown; and whether the right to a portion of the said foreshore is vested in the Crown.

The right to the foreshore between high-water and low-water mark of ordinary spring tides, prima facie belongs to the Crown, but I am informed that in September, 1898, the Board of Trade, the proper authority, conveyed to the trustees of the Bantry estate the interest of the Crown in various portions of foreshore, including a portion lying between a point at the junction of the townlands of Newton and Renvour East, and a point at the junction of the townlands of Beach and Abbey. The portion of the foreshore, mentioned in the question is apparently included in the grant.

What was the consideration paid for this?

That question should be addressed to the Board of Trade.

Has the Board of Trade any legal power to assign its rights to certain landlords in Ireland?

It is frequently done.