asked the President of the Board of Trade whether, in view of the increased cost of materials, owners are still bound to provide pit-head baths, even if the cost of maintenance exceeds 3d. per week for each workman?

My right hon. Friend has asked me to answer this question. Under Section 77 of the Coal Mines Act, 1911, which deals with the matter, the owner is not required to provide baths if the estimated total cost of maintenance exceeds 3d. per week for each workman affected.

Having regard to the fact that Mr. Justice Sankey made recommendations in favour of solving this problem, does the Government propose to do anything to change that position?

I do not know that I am able to make any definite statement on that point.

asked the President of the Board of Trade whether he is aware of the great congestion in South Wales ports and consequent. serious delay to steamers, which are kept waiting for lengthy periods not only for cargoes of coal but also for bunker coal; whether he is aware that, owing to the difficulty of obtaining bunker coal in Liverpool and the high cost of the same, steamship owners were requested by the Coal Controller to bunker their steamers at South Wales ports; whether he is aware that a 10,000ton liner steamer has been delayed ten days waiting for bunker coal at Cardiff, entailing congestion and waste of quay space occupied by her outward cargo at Glasgow and at Liverpool; and can he state whether the congestion and delay are due to the Coal Controller or the Ministry of Transport in failing to provide wagons?

I am aware that there is considerable detention of vessels in South Wales' ports at the present time. The acute position is due to the fact that there is an unusually large amount of tonnage in the ports, but the transport situation in South Wales and tipping facilities at the ports are not satisfactory, the chief difficulty being, I am informed, the restricted hours of working at the tips which results in the loss of considerable output of coal and involves delay to shipping. This matter is receiving the attention of the Ministries of Shipping and of Transport, and also of my Department. I am not aware of any case of a 10,000-ton liner delayed for ten days waiting for bunker coal at Cardiff. If, however, the hon. Member has in mind the "Hyacinthus,"this vessel arrived on the 12th instant and required a part cargo of coal as well as bunkers; the attention of the local representative of the Controller of Coal Mines was not called to the position by the shipping agents until the 16th instant; and arrangements have been made for the vessel to be bunkered to-day.

Is not the right hon. Gentleman aware that the whole of this delay is due to the action of the Coal Controller in holding up coal, and that this steamer has now been waiting thirteen days for bunkers, which will add some £8,000 to the cost of the voyage, and that also will add to the cost of food in this country?

I know about the "Hyacinthus," but in that particular case it was not due to the local representative of the Coal Controller failing to do something. Really, he was not told by the ship agents what they wanted.

Will the right hon. Gentleman inquire further into the matter, and then he will find it was due to the Coal Controller and not to the local coal controller?

I will make further inquiry.

asked the President of the Board of Trade whether he is aware that fuel overseers or other local administrators are denied the power, without the consent of the Coal Controller, to check the price or to examine the books of registered merchants for transactions under the Coal Prices (Limitations) Act or Wholesale Coal Prices Order; and whether, in the interests of the consumer, he will consider the desirability of inquiries being made at the time of the sale by the officers of local authorities on the spot, rather than the inquiry being left to six representatives of the Coal Controller, who cannot, after the transaction has taken place, obtain reliable evidence of any overcharge?

Fuel overseers and local representatives of the Coal Controller do, in fact, investigate transactions coming under the Price of Coal (Limitation) Act, 1915, and the Wholesale Coal Prices Order and report any irregularities to the Coal Mines Department. The measures provided have been in force for some time, and the procedure, adopted for securing compliance is working satisfactorily.

asked the President of the Board of Trade whether he is aware that local administrators of the Household Fuel and Lighting Order with many years' experience resent and consider it a reflection on their honour in having to obtain the sanction of the Coal Controller or his representative. more or less influenced by trade considerations and of no administrative experience, before instituting any proceedings. Whilst in other spheres local officers have much more important matters to decide; and whether he will reconsider the necessity of revoking Clause 71 of the Household Fuel and Lighting Order, 1919, which is without precedent, and bestow upon local authorities and such of their officers as they may appoint power to decide whether proceedings shall be taken similar to that obtaining under the Food Orders?

I am not aware of the existence of any dissatisfaction of the nature referred to. As regards the latter part of the question, I have nothing to add to the reply given to the hon. Member on the 20th November.

asked the President of the Board of Trade whether in administering coal prices under the Household Fuel and Lighting Order, 1919, experience has shown that the public are at present inadequately protected against overcharges made by registered coal merchants, in view of the fact that the Coal Controller's district representatives, from whom local fuel overseers have to obtain a written consent before proceedings can be instituted for excess prices, are directly or indirectly interested or have been previously employed in the coal trade; and if he will say what steps will be taken to deal with this matter?

No, Sir. The experience of the Coal Mines Department does not bear out the suggestion contained in the question.

asked the President of the Board of Trade whether he is aware that there is no difficulty in obtaining consent to prosecute a small coal dealer selling in quantities less than two cwts, for charging an excess price for coal, whilst consent Can seldom, if ever, be obtained under the Household Fuel and Lighting Order, 1919, to prosecute a registered coal merchant for charging an excess price, even if evidence is or can be procured; and whether he proposes to take any steps to deal with the matter?

I am advised by the Coal Controller that he has no information which would justify the suggestions made in the question, and I shall be obliged if the hon. Member will let me have any evidence in his possession.

asked the President of the Board of Trade if he will state how many registered coal merchants have been prosecuted under the Household Fuel and Lighting Orders, 1918 and 1919, respectively; how many licensed coal dealers have been prosecuted under the 1918 and 1919 Orders, respectively; whether he is aware that there is much more overcharging for coal by colliery proprietors and registered merchants than by licensed coal dealers selling in a less quantity than 2cwts.; that the practice is prevalent for registered coal merchants to sell inferior coal at a higher-quality price to consumers; and that it is prevalent to sell common coal at a higher-quality price to dealers for resale to the consumers who, in consequence, have to pay an excess price contrary to the laws made and provided; whether there are only six officials to prevent these excess charges being made throughout the country; whether he will consider the desirability of extending these duties, in addition to these six officials, to local authorities and such of their officials as they may appoint; and whether he will consider the advisability of amending Part VII., the Sale of Coal, of the Household Fuel and Lighting Order, 1919, and, before doing so, seek the advice of local administrative officers who have experience of the many defects and omissions of the Order?

As regards the first two parts of the question, I regret that the Coal Mines Department are unable at short notice to add to the information which I furnished in reply to a question by the hon. Member for the Wentworth Division of Yorks on 8th December. As regards the third part of the question, I have no reason to believe that the allegations are justified by the facts. With regard to the final part of the question, I would refer the hon. Member to the reply given to the hon. Member for Bolton on the 4th December.

asked the Prime Minister whether he could now make a statement as to the Government's policy in relation to the coal mines; and whether any provision was to be made for the development of the coalfields which was at present held up?

I have been asked to reply to this question on behalf of the Prime Minister. The statement is very long, and with the permission of the House I will have it circulated in the OFFICIAL REPORT. In substance it amounts to this, that the Government is discussing the financial position of the mining industry with the coal-owners, and will introduce legislation next Session to obtain powers to make necessary financial adjustments.

The following is the statement referred to:

1. It is not proposed to proceed with the Second Reading of the Coal Industry (Emergency) Bill. In the Debate on that measure, hon. Members opposite having intimated authoritatively that the Miners' Federation did not regard the Coal Industry (Emergency) Bill as the fulfilment of a Government pledge, and that they preferred the continuance of the existing Coal Mines Control Agreement, accordingly, the Leader of the House undertook that the Government would investigate what it would mean to the coal-owners and the general taxpayer if the agreement were adhered to. From both points of view, adhesion to the agreement would work such injustice as to be impossible.

2. First, from the. public point of view a considerable loss to the Treasury would be involved, because the coalmining industry during this financial year has been controlled on the basis of some limitations of profits becoming enforceable For example, the incidence of the cost involved in the increase of wages and reduction in hours under the Interim Sankey Report and the subsequent increase of 6s. per ton on all inland coal in July last were determined on this basis. So was the recent reduction of 10s. in the price of domestic coal, as was fully explained to the House. This reduction was made, not out of a surplus then in hand, but out of a surplus which would accrue before the end of the financial year because of the unexpectedly high export prices now ruling as a direct result of the dislocation produced by the War. Either to cancel the "Sankey" wage or to leave it as a charge on the Exchequer is unthinkable. To abandon the benefit to the consumer represented by the 10s. reduction in the price of domestic coal or to leave it as a charge on the Exchequer while such prodigious export profits are being made as a result of conditions which are inflicting great hardships on the community is, in the view of the Government, also unthinkable.

3. But, secondly, as a matter of fairness to the industry as a whole, adhesion to the agreement for this year is equally impossible. Briefly, the position is this: With a total output of coal far below the prewar output, the strictest control over the destination of supplies has been and still is essential. Even if the output were on the pre-war level some control of destina- tion would continue to be necessary while the present level of export prices obtains, otherwise the country would not be able to retain home supplies except at world prices At the moment both inland quantity and inland prices are safeguarded with great benefit to the nation. Some collieries—favoured by geographical position —are allowed to export at, a price which is unregulated; the greater number of collieries are, however, compelled to supply inland requirements only at a regulated price, which is, on the average, below the cost of production. In the years 1917 and 1918 there was no very substantial difference between export prices and home prices, say 4s. on the average, there is now an enormous difference, say 30s. on the average, as compared with industrial price. If exporting collieries were to have the advantage of these prices—even subject to the limitations of the Coal Mines Control Agreement—they would be reaping an advantage from a valuable monopoly conferred upon them by the State, while collieries compelled to supply home consumers, whether industrial or domestic, would in spite of the provisions of the Agreement, stiffer financially not through any fault of their own, but because of emergency circumstances of which they are the victims.

4. It is impossible for the Government (in the exercise of its functions of safeguarding home supplies and home prices) to grant to selected exporting collieries a valuable monopoly without arranging for some special contribution from them, and to take from inland collieries the opportunity of making themselves even self supporting without in same way compensating them. It is contemplated that this special contribution and the compensation fairly payable should, as nearly as may be, balance. The readjustment of the finances of the industry is, therefore, imperative, and although the Government is no longer bound to adjust them in the manner provided in the Coal Industry (Emergency) Bill—a procedure which they would certainly not have adopted apart from the Sankey Report and pledge of 20th March—the readjustment in the light of present circumstances cannot be very different in its 'broad financial result.

The position is now being discussed and explored with the coal owners with a view to arriving at a fair and equitable distribution of the total profits of the industry but if agreement cannot be obtained in this way, the Government will formulate

proposals of their own. In either event, a Bill to give effect to the readjustment will be submitted to the House when it reassembles.

The effect of not proceeding with the Coal Industry (Emergency) Bill will, of course, be that there will be a cash deficit on this financial year, but as the readjustment will, in the end, be retrospective to the same date as the Bill prescribed, namely, the 1st April last, it will be a temporary deficit and not a permanent one.

Essential parts of any readjustment will be:

(a) that increased capital employed in the business in development or otherwise is remunerated;

(b) that the Sankey Wage shall be treated as a working expense of the colliery; and,

(c) that collieries whose coal is retained in the United Kingdom—whether for industrial or household and domestic purposes—are equitably and justly dealt with, as compared with collieries enjoying the export monopoly, so that they do not suffer by reason of the reduction in price of household and domestic coal.

5 So far as control of the industry is concerned, no new legislation requires to be introduced. Control of the industry has been exercised under certain of the Defence of the Realm Regulations, and these Regulations it is intended to continue by means of the Emergency Laws (Continuance) Bill until 31st August next. The Price of Coal (Limitation) Act, 1915, and the Orders made under that Act and under the Defence of the Realm Regulations will remain quite apart from financial legislation

6. The Government during the autumn has continued to consider the future of the mining industry and will, during the Recess, give further close consideration to this matter.

asked the President of the Board of Trade if coke is being exported from South Wales whilst blast furnaces in the Midlands are on the point of closing down owing to the shortage of supply of coke?

There is coke available for the blast furnaces in question, and the only difficulty is that of obtaining the necessary wagons. The Coal Controller has been in communication with certain firms in the Midlands on this point.

asked the President of the Board of Trade whether he is aware that it is a common practice in all sections of trade in commercial centres for cartage to be paid for at a specified rate per ton, and such practice is prevalent in the coal trade when carts are hired; that although local conditions vary it is found possible for coal merchants to pay a cartage contractor for the cartage of coal at a flat rate and to fix locally the price of coal at a flat rate according to grade 1, 2, 3, or 4, as the case may be; that the expenses said to be entailed for cartage in the sale of coal cover up many excess charges, and if cartage was charged at a flat rate per ton consumers could be better protected than under the present system; and whether he is prepared to recommend that local fuel overseers, when fixing the retail price of coal under the Household Fuel and Lighting Order, should fix the cost of cartage and the delivery of coal to the consumers' premises at a flat rate per ton?

In fixing retail prices for coal, the local fuel overseers take into consideration the charges for carting ruling in their districts, and, although no separate charge may be made to the consumer for carting, the result desired by the hon. Member is attained.

asked the President of the Board of Trade whether the present Law Officers, or their predecessors, have at any time given a written opinion that any of the proclamations affecting articles other than arms and ammunition issued under Section 43 of the Customs Consolidation Act, 1876, were legal; if so, who were the Law Officers; and will he lay the opinion before the House?

asked the President of the Board of Trade who were the Law Officers of the Crown responsible for the Regulation which was declared illegal by the recent Sankey decision?

The Proclamation affecting pyrogallic acid was not itself referred to any Law Officer, but was issued in 1919 as the thirty-second of the series founded on the precedent established in the first half of 1915 and acted on by all the Governments which have been in office since the outbreak of war. It is not and never has been the custom to refer to the Law Officers Regulations which involve no departure from accepted precedent. In view of the interest attaching to this matter, I propose to have circulated in the OFFICIAL REPORT a full list of the Proclamations, showing the dates of their issue.

The following is the list referred to:

Was the case of the legality of these Proclamations over submitted to any Law Officers, and are any of their opinions in existence in writing, and, if so, whose?

I know nothing of the circumstances in which the first Proclamation was issued. It was issued on the authority of the Cabinet, of whose internal doings I know nothing. From that time forward no opinion of the Law Officers has been taken without reference to existing precedents, and, therefore, no opinion of the Law Officers is independent of the precedents which exist.

Is it not a fact that there are no written opinions on this point by either Lord Buckmaster or Sir John Simon, and is it not a fact that such written opinion as there is is of Law Officers who are not either of these two gentlemen named, and, if that is the case, was not the right hon. Gentleman wholly incorrect when he gave the answer he did last Thursday?

I cannot agree that I was wholly or even partially incorrect. The first Proclamation was issued at the time when these two gentlemen were the Law Officers of the Crown. They may not have been consulted. I do not know.

You said so.

They were the responsible Law Officers. A member of the Cabinet, as Sir John Simon was, cannot divest himself of his responsibility.

No; he was not!

There has been no law opinion of any Law Officer taken independent of the existing precedents. It may be of some interest that there is a pre-war precedent in the case of Holman v. Hill, in which there is a decision based upon a judgment of three Irish judges which is very relevant.

The right hon. Gentleman has not answered my specific question. Is there a written opinion by Law Officers on this point, and, if so, who are the Law Officers who gave that opinion?

I have, I think, answered the question. There is no opinion expressed by any Law Officer subsequently to the institution at the beginning of this procedure, which does not take into account the precedents established.

There are 232 questions on the Paper.

asked the Prime Minister whether, in view of the Government's intention to pass legislation to deal with Mr. Justice Sankey's decision in the case of import prohibitions, it was intended further to use public money on appeals to the Court of Appeal and the House of Lords?

The decision referred to is at present under appeal to the Court of Appeal, and the appeal will pro- ceed. The present decision seems to be to some extent at variance with a decision of a Court of three judges in Ireland upon the construction of the same Section of the Statute.

When the representative of the Board of Trade on 11th August and Lord Somerleyton on 26th August in another place stated that the Cabinet had consulted the Law Officers and were advised that they were right, who were the Law Officers referred to?

I must have notice of that.

I have already given notice.

The answer, I believe, has already been given. Does the hon. and gallant Member refer to the time it was undertaken, or to a later stage?

When the representative of the Board of Trade said, "We have consulted the Law Officers, and are advised that we are within the limits of the law," who were the Law Officers to whom reference was made?

I cannot say.

asked the Prime Minister whether he had now decided to abandon the Imports and Exports Regulations Bill?

No, Sir.

asked the Minister of Transport (1) whether he is aware that, owing to an apparent shortage of ticket collectors, congestion and delay occurs at Balham Station on the arrival of the evening trains from Victoria; and whether he will ask the railway company to see that two collectors are posted at each exit between the hours of 5 p.m. and 8 p.m.; and (2) whether he is aware of the overcrowded travelling conditions between Balham and Victoria on the London, Brighton, and South Coast Railway; whether even during the dinner hour, when the trains are shortened, as many as five and six passengers are compelled to stand in each third-class compartment; and whether he will consider the possibility of starting a number of trains from Balham to relieve the morning congestion, and to refrain from detaching coaches from the latter trains where the overcrowding is due to preventable causes?

There has been considerable increase of traffic at Balham Station, and the possibility of increasing the number of trains is engaging the attention of the railway company, but they are unable at present to put on more trains, as the whole of their electric stock is in use. The service will be improved as soon as motors can be obtained Two additional ticket collectors have been trained for the work at Balham Station, and they took up their duties there on the 17th and 16th December, respectively.

asked the Minister of Transport if he is aware that a train leaves Morpeth at 7.35 a.m., and can arrangements be made for it to start at 8.30 a.m., as that time will suit better miners, teachers, and others going to the colliery districts, the next train at 9.28 a.m. being one and a-half hours late?

This train is timed to reach Newcastle at the most convenient time for the majority of passengers using it. The detailed arrangements of timetables is a matter for the railway company concerned, who endeavour to meet the convenience of the public to the greatest possible extent. It is obviously impossible, and, I think the House will agree, undesirable to concentrate such detailed matters in the Ministry.

Is the right hon. Gentleman making inquiries on the spot by his agents?

asked the Minister of Transport it he is aware that a train leaves Alamouth at 8.42 a.m. and does not stop at Widdrington and Pegswood, causing inconvenience to many miners; and, seeing that 1,000 employés are working at Pegswood, many of whom live away from the colliery, will he have inquiries made into the matter?

I am informed that an additional train which should meet this difficulty will run from 1st January, but, as stated in my answer to the previous question, the detailed arrangement of time tables is a matter for the railway corn-panics, and I hope hon. Members will support me in my desire not to interfere in such matters from Whitehall.

Is the right hon. Gentleman aware that the men cannot get to the pit, and have to walk ten miles?

asked the Minister of Transport whether he is aware that, even when there was a daily service between Stornoway and the mainland, numerous complaints as to the insufficiency and inefficiency of the service were made by public bodies and by representatives of the trading and travelling public; that now, since the services have been reduced by one-half, there is a real danger of the necessaries of life being short during the winter, as well as the business and trade of the port and island being seriously hampered; whether he is aware that, owing to the invariably crowded state of the mail boat, travelling by this service, which is a night service, is always uncomfortable and often dangerous; whether he is aware that over 200 women returning from the English fishing were held up recently at Kyle for two days with little food or shelter; and whether he will induce the Highland Railway Company to exercise their powers to maintain an efficient daily service between Kyle and Stornoway, or in any other way to take steps to restore a daily and efficient service?

I have been asked to answer this question. While I regret that it is not possible to restore the prewar mail-boat service to Stornoway, I am advised that the present service, coupled with other steamer facilities, is adequate both for the supply of food and for necessary trade purposes. The regrettable incident referred to in the latter part of the question was, I believe, the result of the women missing the mail-boat connection by about two hours. It is, of course, impossible to guarantee that a small steamer is not at times rather crowded when the traffic is subject to great variations of this kind, but I do not gather that this is a normal state of affairs. So far as I am aware, the Highland Railway Company have no powers to maintain the present service from Kyle, but in any case they would not be likely to undertake it, still less to increase it, without a subsidy from the State.

Is the hon. Gentleman aware that the Transport Committee appointed by the Government when the War was going on reported that even when there was a daily service between Lewis and the mainland it was inadequate, and recommended an extra steamer?

asked the Minister of Transport whether he is aware of the position in which traders of all classes are placed by the refusal of the railway companies to convey returned empties; and, in particular, whether he will cause inquiries to be made with regard to the treatment by the railway companies of Messrs. A. Burke, Dean, and Company, of 300, Radford Road, Nottingham, who have crates and boxes on hand which have been charged up to them but which they are unable to return?

There is no general restriction on the conveyance of empties, though it is sometimes necessary to impose temporary embargoes, as in the case of other traffic, when pressare is abnormally heavy. As regards the firm referred to, I understand no complaints have been made to the railway companies serving Nottingham regarding their empties, though there may have been some misunderstanding about one consignment.

asked the Minister of Transport whether the congestion at the collieries and docks could be greatly relieved by running freight trains on Sundays when the lines are comparatively free of other traffic; whether such trains could be run with scarcely any additional labour beyond that of the drivers and others in charge of such trains; and whether he will consider the advisability of appealing to railwaymen to volunteer for this work to assist the country in the present emergency?

It is a customary railway practice to run freight trains on Sundays, and therefore the third part of the question does not arise. As regards the second part, it should be remembered that the running of trains means the employment of signalmen and terminal staff, as well as train staff.

asked the Minister of Transport if he will give comparative figures of the pre-war and present capacity, actual load, journey time, daily earnings, and demurrage charge of the average goods wagon engaged in any typical traffic?

The information asked for is not available, as the railway companies do not compile statistics in this form. If my hon. Friend will, however, consult with the Ministry, I will be glad to see whether any figures which do exist will help him.

asked the Minister of Transport whether his refusal to instruct the Midland Railway Company to reopen the closed exit opposite Trent Street, Nottinghm, arises from the cost involved; and if he will state what the annual cost would be and give details as to how the total is arrived at?

The cost which the reopening of the exit referred to would involve is, in view of the present necessity for economy, a consideration of importance. I am not in a position to add to the details of such cost, which are given in the report by the Chief Inspecting Officer of Railways, of which the hon. Gentleman was furnished with a copy in August last.

Will the right hon. Gentleman accept my assurance that the very greatest discomfort is experienced by passengers at Nottingham by this arrangement?

Why does the right hon. Gentleman take no notice of a question relating to the North-Western Highlands and answers questions on this everlasting gate every week?

When are the people of Nottingham to be given these facilities?

It is believed the present facilities are adequate.

Can the right hon. Gentleman give the comparative cost of paying the demobilised soldiers' out-of-work donation and making this alteration?

That requires notice.

asked the Minister of Transport whether he has considered the question of restoring the facilities to traders in the way of delivering to them their parcels arriving by passenger train; and whether he is aware that the limitation of the radius for delivery owing to the introduction of the eight-hours day has the effect of burdening the traders of Nottingham with an expense hitherto borne by the railway companies?

I am at present. unable to add to the answer given to my hon. Friend and to the lion. Member for Rushriffe on the 17th November, in reply to similar questions.

Is it a fact that it is the policy of the right hon. Gentleman to pass part of the costs of railway administration on to traders?

No, that is not a fact.

Is that not the result of what is now being done?

No. It means that there is a reduction of this facility.

asked the Minister of Transport if he has received an offer from Mr. Dudley Docker, chairman of the Metropolitan Carriage and Finance Company, to build 500 railway wagons per week at less cost than His Majesty's Government can produce them under their national scheme; and if he is prepared to accept the offer?

The Minister has received a letter from Mr. Dudley Docker. chairman of the Metropolitan Carriage and Finance Company, offering to build wagons at the rate of 500 per week, and six railway companies have been placed in communication with him.

Can the right hon. Gentleman say whether a chartered accountant has been appointed to go into the question of the cost?

No, Sir; not yet.

Many months ago did the right hon. Gentleman receive an offer from another big firm offering to supply wagons at a very rapid rate for a profit of only 5 per cent!

I have no recollection of such an offer; all the facilities for the construction of wagons at a reasonable cost, expeditiously, have been explored.

Is it not a fact that wagons are being held up—wagons built by the Metropolitan Company—through the lack of the appointment of this chartered accountant, as promised last week?

Will the right hon. Gentleman get a move on?

I am doing it as quickly as I can.

Was not an answer given by his Department last week that an accountant would be appointed at once?

The appointment is to be made in agreement with those who represent. the wagon building interest.

Is the right hon. Gentleman aware Ilea a deputation from the workpeople concerned were told that there would be no delay in the appointment of t his accountant?

There has been no avoidable delay.

asked the Minister of Transport whether he is aware that the iron and steel works in Cleveland are often out of work for two or three days owing to the shortage of wagons; to what extent is this due to the general bad running of wagons; and, if so, what steps does he propose to take to remedy this state of affairs?

I am unable to add to the general statement which I made to hon. Members on the 10th December, and in which I dealt with the position in the Middlesbrough district.

Is the right hon. Gentleman aware that the increase in the output of the new steel plant in the iron and steel works of Cleveland has increased 50 percent., and that in each of these works there are £50,000 to £60,000 worth of steel lying on the ground waiting for wagons?

I am aware that the output has increased, but the wagon-building capacity has not increased, owing to the War, and we need to overtake our arrears first.

Why did the right hon. Gentleman refuse the offer of 3,000 wagons per annum at £40 or £50 less per wagon than can be built at Woolwich?

asked the Minister of Transport how many firms in the United Kingdom are capable of building railway wagons; how many inquiries from that Ministry or from the various railway companies were sent to the railway wagon builders; whether their attention has been called to the statement that several large firms of wagon builders have never had an inquiry and are working short time; and whether they will take such steps to have specifications sent to them without any further delay.?

I must refer the hon. Member to the general statement which I made on 10th December. The railway companies concerned have made numerous inquiries from wagon builders, the results of which I then quoted. Such inquiries are frequently made, and I see no reason to call for a return of the total number. In reply to the latter part of the question, I am, as already stated, anxious to put any firms who desire to quote for early delivery at reasonable prices in communication with the railway companies.

Is the right hon. Gentleman aware that there are many wagon builders who have never been asked to quote for prices of wagons?

If such firms will write either to the railway companies who are ordering the wagons or to me I shall be glad to deal with the matter.

Has the right hon. Gentleman any power to place orders himself?

No, Sir.

asked the Minister of Transport whether, in the events of private firms giving orders for railway trucks, he will give an undertaking that such trucks will not be pooled?

I am unable to give such an undertaking, as Clause 13 of the Ministry of Transport Act provides that the Minister shall not purchase wagons used for the conveyance of any particular class of traffic unless he purchases all privately-owned wagons so used, but I am afraid I do not quite understand what my hon. and gallant Friend desires to ascertain, and if he will confer with me I shall endeavour to satisfy him.

Is it not possible for the right hon. Gentleman to say that no privately-owned wagons will be interfered with in any way whatever, and that this is the only way that the orders will be given?

I cannot do that. The Ministry of Transport Bill provides that they may be.

asked the Minister of Transport if he is aware that the Teeside Bridge and Engineering Company, Middlesbrough, have converted their munitions workshop into a wagon building shop, and although they are prepared to turn out over 1,000 railway wagons per annum, the North-Eastern Railway Company will only allow them to quote for one solitary wagon, notwithstanding the fact that this railway company is extremely short of wagons; and can he do anything to obtain wagons from this firm, provided the price is satisfactory, in view of the deficiency in transport facilities on the North-East Coast?

Yes, Sir; I am aware of the arrangements made by this firm, and a communication received from them has been passed on to the Railway Executive Committee for communication to the railway companies interested. I am not aware of the negotiations with the North-Eastern Railway Company referred to, but not long ago the general manager of the company stated that he was anxious to find firms able to build for early delivery at a reasonable price.

asked the Prime Minister whether, in view of the Government decision to carry out locomotive wagon building at Woolwich, he will consider the claims of other similar establishments which have been solely devoted to the manufacture of munitions; and whether, in that case, he will investigate the claims to consideration of the Greet lands munition works?

Woolwich is in a very exceptional position, and in any case, I am informed that, as the factory and plant at Greetlands was designed for the production of chemicals, it would not be suitable for locomotive wagon building.

Who placed the orders for these wagons at Woolwich—the Ministry of Transport, the Prime Minister, or the Government?

I am not quite sure, but I think the railway companies.

asked the Minister of Transport whether he will recommend the withdrawal of the guarantee to the railway companies of their pre-war dividends in order that there may be a greater inducement to the railway companies to effect more efficient organisation and greater economy in working so that traffic will be more expeditiously handled?

I cannot recommend the withdrawal of the guarantee given to the railway companies, because it is in fulfillment of an undertaking entered into by the late Government in 1916.

asked the Minister of Transport if his attention has been called to the fact of the increased extent of pilferage of goods during transit by land and sea; and if he will take immediate steps to prevent pilferage?

I am aware that there has been an increase of pilferage on the railways. and the companies are consequently insisting on the use of firmer packages where the rules have been relaxed during the War, and increased vigilance is being exercised to prevent pilferage. Sea transit is not within the Purview of the Ministry of Transport. If my hon. Friend will suggest means of attaining the immediate prevention of pilferage, I shall give them my most sympathetic consideration.

asked the Minister of Transport whether he is aware that the wear and tear to roads caused by motor omnibuses throws considerable expense on the local authorities; and whether he will consider the possibility of introducing legislation to provide for the payment of a fair mileage rate by the owners of private motor omnibuses to the highway authority?

As I stated in reply to the hon. Member for Gateshead on Monday, 10th December, a Departmental Committee is now considering the whole question of the taxation of mechanically propelled road vehicles, with a view to advising on the simplest means of securing revenue to assist the highway authorities of the country in meeting the increasing cost of the maintenance and repair of highways. It is by no means certain that a mileage rate, as suggested, would be in the best interests of the highway authorities.

asked the Minister of Transport whether he has now received the whole of the nominations for the constitution of the Roads Advisory Committee, and if he is aware that the delay in appointing this Committee is causing much discontent?

Yes, Sir; I have now received the nominations and have appointed the Committee. I am circulating the names in the OFFICIAL REPORT.

The following are the names:

• Mr. F. Dent, County Councils Association.
• Sir Kenneth J. Mackenzie, Bart., Association of County Councils in Scotland.
• Mr. J. A. Brodie, M. Inst.C.E., M.I. Mech.E., Association of Municipal Corporations.
• Major W. H. Prescott, M.P., Urban District Councils Association.
• Mr. P. J O'Neill, J.P., Irish County Councils General Council.
• The Hon. Sir Arthur Stanley, G.B.E., C.B., Royal Automobile Club.
• Sir Wm. Joynson-Hicks, Bart., M.P., Automobile Association and Motor Union.
• Mr. D. P. Maclagan, Royal Scottish Automobile Club.
• Mr. E. White, Royal Irish Automobile Club.
• Colonel F. S. W. Cornwallis, D.L., Royal Agricultural Society.
• Mr. Will Thorne, M.P.

May I ask the right hon. Gentleman whether the motor representatives will be in the same largely preponderating majority as on the Lights Regulations Committee under the same Ministry?

No; I do not think there is any undue representation of any interest, but perhaps my hon. Friend will wait until he sees the list?

When will this Committee be called together?

As soon as possible after they are appointed.

Will there be anybody on it representing the Cyclists' Touring Club?

asked the Minister of Transport whether he is aware that there has been no reduction in the congestion with regard to street traffic; whether the Select Committee on Transport (Metropolitan Area) made several proposals for the alleviation of such congestion; whether ally of the suggestione have been carried out; and, if so, which?

The steps which have already been taken to alleviate congestion at certain points are undoubtedly proving useful, but substantial alleviation cannot be expected immediately, seeing that this period of the year is necessarily the heaviest for street traffic. The Chairman of the recently-appointed Advisory Committee on London Traffic was also Chairman of the Select Committee, and is therefore aware of the suggestions referred to. The Select Committee reported that the evidence they had received showed the need for certain measures, and those which are considered immediately necessary and can be brought into effect without further legislation are being given effect to; these include better control of traffic, arrangements for stopping-places for omnibuses as for trams, and the formation of queues.

May I ask my right hon. Friend whether he is aware that no notice has been taken of the recommendation with regard to slow-going traffic, and that that is the chief factor in the congestion in many important streets; and will he immediately take steps to bring the suggestions on that point into operation?

That is a matter which is having the attention of the Committee which has been appointed, and I would remind my bon. and gallant Friend that both Committees have the same Chairman, so that he is fully advised of the recommendations.

Will the right hon. Gentleman turn some of the Fleet Street traffic down the Embankment, and so relieve the congestion in Fleet Street?

Is the right hon. Gentleman aware that, although the Chairman of this Advisory Committee is the same as of the Select Committee on Transport (Metropolitan Area), we have no tangible knowledge that anything has been done on the lines indicated? Will he take steps in the matter? That is all I ask.

The question is being considered by the Committee, and by the Technical Committees which they have appointed, and no single recommendation has been turned down. The whole question is being tackled as fast as inspection on the spot allows.

Are we to have no answer to my supplementary question?

I will repeat the question as soon as the House reassembles.

asked whether the Government will consider some relaxation of the War Regulations of the Central Control Board (Liquor Traffic) from Christmas Eve until 1st January, in view of the fact that this is our first post-war Peace Christmas?

I cannot add anything to the reply which I gave on this subject to my hon. and gailant Friend on 11th December.

Will the right hon. Gentleman give us some hope of spending a reasonably happy Christmas this year?

Will the right hon. Gentleman see that there is a reasonable quantity available?