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Written Answers

Volume 141: debated on Friday 13 May 1921

Written Answers to Questions

Friday, May 13, 1921

Questions

Ambush, Carnan

asked the Chief Secretary for Ireland whether his attention has been called to a meeting held at Carnan, County Tyrone, to contradict the statement made in the Press to the effect that two policemen on cycle duty had been ambushed while descending Legurm Hill, between Carnan and Stuart Hill, on 24th April; and whether, in view of the serious consequences liable to befall any inhabitant of a neighbourhood in which an ambush is alleged to have taken place, such reports are in all cases thoroughly investigated before reprisals are carried out?

My attention has been drawn to the meeting in question, and I should be glad to accept the contradiction issued if the facts were such as to admit of my doing so. It appears from the police report, which I see no reason to doubt, that an attack was made on two constables on cycle patrol duty between Carnan and Stewartstown on the evening of the 24th ultimo. A wire was stretched across the road, and one of the constables was thrown from his bicycle and sustained injuries to his face and hands. A few shots were fired at them from an adjacent hedge, but fortunately neither was hit, and their assailants, only one of whom was actually seen, at once made off. This outrage was probably the work of only one or two irresponsible individuals, no doubt committed for the purpose of stirring up trouble in a peaceful neighbourhood, and I am glad to know that it met with no sympathy or approval from the majority of the local people. No reprisals of any kind were committed, and the last part of the question therefore does not arise.

Shootings

asked the Chief Secretary the result of the inquiry into the death of Mr. John Geoghegan who was shot by uniformed men at Moycullen?

Investigations are still being pursued, but I am not yet in a position to throw any further light on the matter.

asked the Chief Secretary, with reference to the shooting of Mr. T. Hennesey at Crosshaven, County Cork, whether the members of the Crown forces concerned were dressed in mufti; whether they were at the time on duty; and, if not, how did they come to be in possession of a Government motor launch?

The detachment referred to was a plain clothes patrol, definitely detailed to search a suspected farmhouse.

Arrest (Joseph Orme)

asked the Chief Secretary if his attention has been drawn to the case of Mr. Joseph Orme, lately employed at Messrs. Eustace Brothers', Dublin, who was arrested by the military on Saturday, 23rd April, whilst on his way to a trade union meeting to transact purely trade union business; whether he is aware that this man has taken no part in political agitation of any kind; and whether he will have immediate inquiries made into this case with a view of this man's release?

Joseph Orme was arrested on the date mentioned while playing cards with six others at No. 93, Cork Street, Dublin. In the house several revolvers and a number of seditious documents were found. Orme was tried on the 11th instant for possession of these articles; but I am not yet aware of the result of the trial.

Police Pensions

asked the Chief Secretary the number of pre-War pensioners of the Royal Irish Constabulary who are now living, the average amount of their pensions, and the average age of the pensioners; and whether he can give an estimate of the additional cost that would be incurred if in the case of these pre-War pensioners the Pensions (Increase) Act, 1920, were amended by removing the restriction as to age and by raising the limit of means from £150 and £250, respectively, to £200 and £300, respectively?

The number of pre-War pensioners of the Royal Irish Constabulary now living is 6,088. Of this number 4,075 have received increases under the Pensions (Increase) Act, and the average amount of the full pensions in such cases is £65. The average pension of the remainder who have not received increases is £47. The average age of the pensioners is 63 years. The estimated cost of removing the restrictions as to age is £350,000. No estimate can be framed of the cost of altering as suggested the existing limit of means.

asked the Chief Secretary whether he is aware that under Part I. of the Schedule to the Pensions (Increase) Act, 1920, the pensions of head constables of the Royal Irish Constabulary who retired under the 1908 Act amount only to £97 Is. 4d., those of sergeants to £77 13s. 1d., and those of constables to £72 16s., and that under Part II. of the Schedule the pensions of those men who retired during the War up to 31st August, 1918, are limited to the same amounts; that there is a considerable number of pensioners who retired under the 1866 Act whose pensions, with the increase under the Pensions (Increase) Act, 1920, amount to £127 8s. in the case of head constables, to £100 16s. in the case of sergeants, and to £86 16s. in the case of constables; and whether, in view of the disparity between these pre-War pensions and the great advance in the pensions now being paid to men retired since 1st April, 1919, namely, £245 to head constables, £195 to sergeants, and £165 to constables, he will take steps to ameliorate the position of those pensioners who retired before 1st April, 1919?

The reply to the first two parts of the question is in the affirmative. The number of existing pensioners referred to in the third part of the question is very small, and does not exceed ten. As regards the last part of the question, I would refer the hon. and learned Member to my reply to his question of the 10th March.

Military Operations

asked the Chief Secretary whether the house of Mrs. Brosman, of Newtownsandes, near Listowel, was destroyed on the night of 10th April; whether this was carried out by order; and what was the reason for this destruction?

I have now received the Commander-in-Chief's report and the police report on this case, from which it appears that a party of Crown forces proceeded on 10th April to search the house occupied by this person, a publican, and a prominent member of the rebel forces. While the search was in progress, the sentries posted outside were fired on by rebels. The forces immediately gave chase, and while they were away a party of rebels returned, locked the doors, and set fire to the house with the obvious intention of burning the search party alive, and destroying incriminating evidence of rebel activities. The search party succeeded with great difficulty in escaping by the windows with only slight injuries.

Police Operations, Scariff

asked the Chief Secretary whether he is aware that on Sunday, the 24th April last, a party of the Auxiliary Division entered the village of Scariff, County Clare, at 8.30 a.m., and arrested Father Clancy, one of the parish priests who was then, returning from a sick call and was about to celebrate the nine o'clock Mass; whether he is, aware that the officer in charge of the auxiliary force refused to allow Father Clancy to proceed with the celebration and forced him to enter a lorry with a number of his congregation who had already been arrested; that the lorries were then driven to a spot 12 miles from the village; and that Father Clancy was compelled to remain there all day while the other arrested men were filling up trenches, thus preventing him performing his religious duties; and whether he will give such instructions as will in the future prevent an occurrence of this kind?

I am informed by the Commander-in-Chief that, following extensive activity and road cutting by the rebels in the Mountshannon and Scariff area, operations were carried out on 24th April, 1921, by the Auxiliary Division, Royal Irish Constabulary, to concentrate all males of military possibilities with a view to their examination and employment on road repair, where possible. It was intended in some instances to collect men leaving Church; but at Scariff, where service had not commenced, such men as were required were detained before the service and removed by motor transport to a point of concentration. It is untrue that Father Clancy was prevented from celebrating Mass and was himself carried off. He protested in a most objectionable manner at the action of the auxiliary police and was told that he was at liberty to accompany his flock if he so wished. This he did. The responsibility for any neglect of his parochial duties on this Sunday rests with Father Clancy himself. Large numbers of the civilians were conveyed home at the end of the day and the whole population was very well treated. The Commander-in-Chief would be glad to be informed of the source of this libel on the auxiliary police as he is satisfied that this effective operation was well carried out and properly conducted.

Clothing (Prices)

asked the President of the Board of Trade whether the price of clothing is still affected by any agreement between the Imperial Government and the Government of the Commonwealth of Australia regulating wool prices; and, if not, whether the high cost of clothing is due to undue profit-taking or to high wages in the clothing trades?

The answer to the first part of the question is in the negative. I am not aware that, relatively to other prices, the price of clothing at present is excessive, and the last part of the question, therefore, does not arise.

Middlemen

asked the President of the Board of Trade whether there is still, or has recently been, sitting a Conference on middlemen or irregular trading; if so, whether any Report has been presented either to the Board of Trade or other Government Department; and, if so, whether the Report will be published?

I would refer my hon. Friend to the answer given to the hon. and gallant Member for Bournemouth (Lieut.-Colonel Croft) and the hon. Member for the New Forest (Mr. Perkins) on the 16th March, and to the hon. Member for Brighton (Mr. Thomas-Stanford) on the 28th April, copies of which I am sending him.

Trade Boards (Tailoring)

asked the Minister of Labour whether he has received a communication from the Scottish Federation of Merchant Tailors asking for the abolition of the tailoring Trade Board; and, if so, what action he purposes taking in the matter?

I have received the letter to which my hon. and gallant Friend refers, and I propose in the first place to consult the employers' and workers' organisations concerned in the matter.

Out-Of-Work Donation (Licensed Premises)

asked the Minister of Labour whether his attention has been called to the communications received from Mr. Wilberforce, the magistrate of the Old Street Police Court, and from the chairman and justices of the Tower Bench, concerning the conviction of a licence holder for supplying intoxicating liquors out of proper hours to men who are receiving their out-of-work donations at his premises; and, considering that the practice of paying out-of-work donations at licensed premises is undesirable, will he issue instructions that all such payments should be made at labour exchanges or some other suitable premises?

I have seen the communications to which my hon. Friend refers. I would refer him, however, to the answer which I gave on the 25th April to a question on this subject by the hon. Member for Cambridge University (Mr. Rawlinson), of which I am sending my hon. Friend a copy.

Unemployed Benefit

asked the Minister of Labour how many contributions an insured person who has received a repayment of contributions under the provisions of Section 25, Sub-section (1), of the Unemployment Insurance Act, 1920, must pay before he is entitled to unemployed benefit; and whether he would be entitled to the benefit provided in the Unemployed Insurance Act, 1921?

Ordinarily a person entitled to a repayment under Section 25 of the Unemployment Insurance Act, 1920, would be entitled to the full amount of unemployment benefit under Section 3 of the Unemployment Insurance Act, 1921, and where this is so his rights to benefit under that Section are not affected by the receipt of a repayment under Section 25 of the Unemployment Insurance Act, 1920. In the cases, relatively few in number, of persons who cannot qualify under Section 3 of the Unemployment Insurance Act, 1921, and therefore claim benefit in respect of contributions actually paid, the receipt of a repayment under Section 25 of the Unemployment Insurment Act, 1920, does not necessitate the payment of any further number of contributions before benefit becomes due, but has the effect of reducing the total number of weeks of benefit payable in the case of men to three-fifths and in the case of women to five-eighths of the total number which would otherwise have been payable.

Queues (Death in Shoreditch)

asked the Minister of Labour if he has seen the report on the inquest held at Shoreditch on 10th May concerning the death of William Beadle, who was waiting for his unemployment pay; if he is aware that ten men fainted in consequence of having to wait so long for their money; and that many men and women at the various labour exchanges in the different parts of the country wait, in some cases, two hours and more before they receive their unemployment pay; whether it would be possible for one half of the men and women to be paid one day and the other half be paid another day; and if he will take action in the matter?

I have made full inquiry into this sad incident, which I need hardly say I profoundly regret. The applicant whom the Employment Exchange officers at Shoreditch had known for some time past to be in poor health, and who was registered as physically capable of light work only, fainted while waiting in the queue on the 5th May. He was immediately attended to by the Exchange staff, and after stating that he felt better was assisted to the counter in order to sign the register as an unemployed person. On reaching the counter he was told that he had exhausted the sixty days' benefit awarded him by the Local Employment Committee, and that his claim would have to be reviewed at once by the Committee. At this moment he dropped dead.

As regards the question of waiting for payment, I need not remind my hon. Friend of the tremendously heavy burden that is falling upon the officers of the Employment Exchange Service at the present time in their efforts to cope with a volume of unemployment which is without precedent in the recorded industrial history of this country. At the present moment the Employment Exchanges throughout the country are paying benefit week by week to over 2,500,000 men and. women. Every step that is humanly possible is being taken to minimise the difficulties and to expedite the smooth working of the registration of unemployed workers and the payment of benefit. Only on Tuesday last I held a conference of the principal controlling officers of the Employment Exchange Service, including the managers of some of our chief industrial centres, on the whole question of the working of the Insurance Acts.

For some time past the Divisional Controllers of the Ministry of Labour have been given authority to engage such temporary additional staff as is necessary to deal with the increasing volume of work at the Exchanges. Further, a timing system has been put into operation in all the large Exchanges requiring applicants to attend at stated hours in order to prevent queues and to reduce the period of waiting to a minimum.

The existing arrangements provide for payment to be spread over Thursdays, Fridays, and Saturdays by instituting three separate pay week periods ending Mondays, Tuesdays, and Wednesdays.

Short Time Working

asked the Minister of Labour whether he has considered and, if not, whether he will consider the extension of unemployment benefit to underemployment?

Provision is already made by the Unemployment In- surance Act, 1920, for payment of benefit under certain conditions to persons who are under-employed, in the sense of working short time. Over 1,000,000 persons are obtaining benefit in respect of short-time working.

Electricity Commission

asked the Minister of Transport what is the cost of the Electricity Commission for the year ending 31st March, 1921?

The cost of the Electricity Commission for the period 23rd January, 1920 (the date when the Commission was established), to 31st March, 1921, was £39,900. This sum covers advances by the Treasury and interest thereon, and the whole amount is repayable under Section 29 (2) of the Electricity (Supply) Act, 1919.

Necessitous School Children

asked the President of the Board of Education the extent to which, in the mining districts, recourse is being had to the Act permitting the feeding of necessitous school children?

As I explained in a reply which I gave on the 21st April to a question addressed to me by the hon. Member for Pontefract (Mr. Forrest), the returns that I receive from local education authorities as to the action taken by them under the Education (Provision of Meals) Acts do not enable me to distinguish between those portions of the authorities' areas which are mining districts and the remaining portions. According to the latest returns, however, action is now being taken by all local education authorities in whose areas, so far as I am able to judge, mining is a predominant industry. During the week ended 7th May, it appears that in these areas about 1,500,000 meals were supplied to some 182,000 school children.

Settlement Proposals

asked the Prime Minister whether, despite the holidays, some Ministers will remain at their posts to contribute, in case of need, to any settlement of the existing dispute in the coal industry?

Certainly, Sir. All Ministers will be available as required for the discharge of their public duties, and the Ministers immediately concerned will be in regular attendance.

Coalowners' Proposals (Piece-Workers)

asked the Secretary for Mines whether, under the coalowners' wages proposals, piece-workers will retain the percentage advance that was given to them as compensation for the reduction of hours?

Yes, Sir. It is part of the coalowners' proposals that these advances should be included in the standard wages below which wages would not be automatically reduced under the scheme.

Pooling Proposals (Yorkshire and South Wales)

asked the Secretary of Mines whether under the pooling proposals of the Miners' Federation, the miners in Yorkshire would give up part of their wages in order to subsidise the wages of miners in South Wales; and what is the difference in the output per man in Yorkshire and South Wales?

It is inherent in the pooling proposals of the Miners' Federation that the workmen in the pits which can afford to pay the higher wages shall make a contribution towards the wages of, the workmen employed at the less profitable pits, and, under present conditions, therefore, the Yorkshire miners, generally speaking, would be called upon to give up part of their wages in order to subsidise the wages of miners in South Wales. The average output per person employed in Yorkshire in 1920 was 216 tons and in South Wales 177 tons; but in drawing any inference from the difference between these figures, the hon. Member will no doubbt bear in mind that the conditions in the two coalfields are not the same.

Infantry

asked the Financial Secretary to the War Office the number of efficient infantry soldiers of 19 years of age and upwards obtained from 1,000 recruits; the expenditure on the 1,000 recruits to produce that number; and what does this show per head for each efficient recruit?

Out of 1,000 infantry recruits, about 800 become efficient soldiers after a year's service. The expenditure on these 1,000 men, including the cost of the training staff at the depôt at which the recruits are trained during their first few months, is about £142,000.

Reserve Officers (Disturbance Allowance)

asked the Financial Secretary to the War Office whether paragraph 419, Special Reserve Regulations, promising to officers of the Special Reserve a disturbance allowance of £50 on mobilisation, has been cancelled; and, if so, on what grounds?

This grant is issuable to Special Reserve officers who joined for duty in the present emergency.

Schools, Aberdeen (Military Occupation)

asked the Financial Secretary to the War Office whether immediate payment can be made to the Aberdeen education authority of the sums due to them in respect of the military occupation of Rosemount, Northfield, and Westfield Schools, Aberdeen, seeing that the authority's financial year closes on the 15th instant and that the claim was submitted more than two months ago?

I regret that it has not been found possible to agree as to the sums due in respect of these schools in time for payment as suggested. An advance has already been made, and steps have been taken to expedite the negotiations with a view to settlement at an early date.

Deserted Children

asked the Minister of Pensions if the children of the late William Longman, No. 32,296, rifleman, King's Royal Rifle Corps, have been refused motherless rate of pension al- though their mother has deserted them after her remarriage to a Canadian; why these children, whose mother and stepfather are in no way contributing to their support and whom it has not been possible to trace with a view to compelling them to do so, are treated less generously than children whose mothers desert them prior to remarriage; whether undue hardship is thereby caused to the relatives who have taken charge of the children by the Ministry's decision; and whether, in view of the fact that the children are for all practical purposes motherless, he will give instructions that they shall be regarded as entitled to the motherless rate of pension?

I am looking further into this matter, and will communicate with my right hon. Friend.

Mesopotamia (Lance-Corporal M'arthur)

asked the Secretary of State for India whether his attention has been drawn to the case of Lance-Corporal Duncan M'Arthur, of the civil gaol, Bagdad, whose body was found on the outskirts of Bagdad on Saturday morning, 12th March; whether he is aware that this soldier was wounded during the Persian Gulf campaign; and will he take steps to grant a pension, to his mother?

The facts of this case were reported by the High Commissioner of Mesopotamia immediately, and were communicated without delay to the next of kin. The answer to the second part is in the negative. As to the third part, it appears from the High Commissioner's report that the deceased had ceased at the time of his death to be employed by the Mesopotamia Government; but in any case he would not have been entitled to a pension, for the contract under which he had been employed carried no pension rights.

Recreation Ground, Broom, County Durham

asked the Minister of Health if he can see his way to sanction a loan to Broom Parish, County Durham, so that they can purchase land in their parish for a recreation ground at Ushaw Moor, which is greatly needed both for the health and safety of the children's lives; and if he is aware that they have already arranged for the purchase of the land, but subject to his approval; that the Broom Parish Council have no loans of any kind; and that the object is to get the children out of the traffic of the streets where their lives are always in danger?

I fully appreciate the case for this recreation ground, and have informed the council that it is open to them to lease it. In accordance with the circular as to economy issued to local authorities by my predecessor, sanction to proposals for loans in such cases is being withheld wherever possible.

Serum Laboratory, Langley Court, Beckenham

asked the Minister of Health whether he is aware that a private firm proposes to use Langley Court, Beckenham, as laboratories for the purpose of the cultivation of germs and the inoculation of horses and other animals in order to make diphtheria and other serum; whether over 60 animals have already been assembled on the premises for the purpose; whether these operations will constitute a danger to the inhabitants of the district; and what action he proposes to take in the matter?

I am aware of this case. A local inquiry has been held by one of my inspectors, and his report is now under my consideration.

Unfit Horses (Export)

asked the Minister of Agriculture whether he will take steps to ensure that no worn-out or other pit ponies and horses shall be exported from this country for the purpose of being used abroad for vivisection or experimental purposes in connection therewith, and that no such animals so exported shall be so used abroad?

So far as the Ministry is aware, no horses are exported from this country for the express purpose of being used for experimental research, and no worn-out pit ponies are reported to be exported. With regard to the latter part of the hon. and learned Baronets question, such legislation as he suggests would be impracticable, and could not have any validity in a foreign country.

Civil Service (Salaries and Bonus)

asked the Financial Secretary to the Treasury (26th April, 1921) if he will state how many civil servants are in receipt of salaries of £1,000 a year and upwards; what is the total sum payable; and what are the proportions of salary and war bonus respectively?

The following are the figures asked for by the hon. Member:

The number of permanent civil servants in receipt of salaries of £1,000 a year and upwards is estimated at about 775, of whom about 200 are receiving salaries of exacty £1,000 a year. The total salaries of these officers are estimated to amount to somewhat less than £1,000,000 a year, and their total receipts by way of bonus are estimated, at the present rate of bonus, at about £550,000 a year.

Wool

asked the Financial Secretary to the Treasury what is the quantity of wool entrusted to the British-Australian Wool Realisation Association for sale on commission on account of the British Government; whether any price has been fixed below which the wool is not to be sold, or whether the British-Australian Wool Realisation Association has a free hand to sell; who advised the Government in carrying through the negotiations; and whether, having regard to the magnitude of the transactions and the public interest evinced, especially by those engaged in the woollen industries, he will issue a White Paper giving full details and particulars of this transaction?

The quantity of wool entrusted to the British-Australian Wool Realisation Association for sale on commission on account of the British Government was approximately 1,500,000 bales. No price has been fixed below which the wool is not to be sold, and the selling agents have a free hand subject to reporting to the British Government at frequent intervals as to the state of the market and other surrounding circumstances. The arrangements which led up to the formation of the British-Australian Wool Realisation Association were negotiated with the Government of Australia; the Colonial Office, the Treasury, and the Ministry of Munitions all concurring. A White Paper will probably be issued about the end of June, when the balance sheet of the Raw Materials Department as at 31st December, 1920, has been struck, this being the starting point of the operations of the British-Australian Wool Realisation Association.

Home Grown Sugar, Limited

asked the Chancellor of the Exchequer what is the total charge to the national Exchequer in respect of the Kelham Sugar Beet Estate and Home Grown Sugar, Limited; what further sums it is anticipated will be required; and, in view of the Government's decision to abolish all forms of subsidy, can the payment of this subsidy be reconsidered?

In 1920 the Government took up 250,000 ordinary £1 shares in Home Grown Sugar, Limited, at par. It is now proposed, subject to certain conditions, to make an advance to the company on second mortgage of the sum of £125,000 which has recently been voted by Parliament for the purpose on the Estimate of the Ministry of Agriculture. In addition the Government has undertaken to ask Parliament, if necessary, to provide in each of the ten years ending the 31st March, 1930, such sum as with the divisible profits of the company for that year is equal to interest at 5 per cent. per annum on the ordinary capital of £250,000 issued to the public. These advances are repayable out of future profits. I hope that the arrangements will not prove to have involved any subsidy, but in any case I do not think that it is now possible to reconsider the agreements already made between the Government and the company.

Members of Parliament (Expenses)

asked the Lord Privy Seal whether he is aware that, while the electorate as a whole is willing; that a reasonable salary should be paid to Members so that men and women without private means may find it possible to stand for election, it desires that public money shall only be given for the purpose for which it is granted, namely, actual attendance at Westminster; and will he consider the advisability of the salary of Members being paid according to their attendance to their duty?

Having regard to the many and varied duties that fall upon Members of this House, I do not think that the course proposed would be practicable.

asked the Lord Privy Seal whether there is any record, official or otherwise, kept of the attendance of Members at the sittings of the House; and, if the information is available, will he grant a Return showing the number of attendances of each Member from the commencement of the present Session until the 13th instant?

No, Sir. There is no such record in existence and the information is not available.