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Written Answers

Volume 155: debated on Friday 30 June 1922

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Written Answers

India

Constitutional Reforms (Extra Expenditure)

asked the Under-Secretary of State for India whether he can make a statement showing the difference between the number of officials employed and the cost of administration of the Central and Provincial Governments in India before the introduction of the reforms effected by the Government of India Act, 1919, and at the commencement of the present year?

The statement supplied to me by the Government of India is as follows:

STATEMENT SHOWING THE ANNUAL EXTRA EXPENDITURE INCURRED IN CONNECTION WITH REFORMS.
Province.Particulars of appointments involving extra cost created.Extra annual cost involved.Remarks.
Rs.
Govt. of IndiaPresident, Council of State50,0007 months at Rs. 5,000 and 5 months at Rs. 3,000.
President, Legislative Assembly50,000
Joint Secretary36,000
Additional DeputySecretary24,000
Two Superintendents at Rs. 600–40–800 each.18,000
Seven Council Reporters at Rs. 450–25–750 each.53,750
One Secretariat Assistant in the upper time scale at Rs. 375–25 5005,625
Ten Assistants at Rs. 200–15–50042,000
Seventeen clerks at Rs. 100–8–30038,675
Three stenographers at Rs. 175–9–400.9,675
Six daftris at Rs. 15–1–351,080
Two jamadars at Rs. 20–1–24480
Sixteen peons at Rs.10 each1,920

Province.Particulars of appointments involving extra cost created.Extra annual cost involved.Remarks.
Rs.
Eighteen temporary peons at Rs. 10 each.2,160
Hill journey allowances22,000
Travelling and daily allowances of the Members of Council of State and of Legislative Assembly.5,05,500
Appointment of a Ceremonial Officer for the Indian Legislature.3,000
Provision for purchase of books for the Library for the Members of the Indian Legislature.15,000*

* This expenditure is fluctuating. This year 15,000, next year 10,000 and every subsequent year 6,000.

Staff for the Library: one Assistant (Librarian) on the upper division time scale, one clerk on the lower division time scale and two daftris.6,800
Salary of the Deputy-President of the Legislative Assembly at Re. 1,000 per mensem for periods during which he is engaged on work connected with business of the Legislative Assembly.7,000
TOTAL—Government of India8,92,675
MadrasOne Member, Executive Council, at Rs. 5,333–5–4 p.m.64,000
Three Ministers at Rs. 5,333–5–4 p.m.1,92,000
One President, Legislative Council, at Rs. 3,000 p.m.36,000
One Deputy President at Rs. 5,000 a year.5,000
Three Council Secretaries at Rs. 500 each.18,000
One Secretary to Council18,000
One Secretary, Finance Department, at Rs. 3,000 p.m.36,000
One Assistant Secretary, Finance Department, at Rs. 700 p.m.8,400
Travelling allowance of Members of Council, Ministers and Members of Legislative Council.1,31,000
Establishment under Ministers7,938
Hill journey allowance of establishment.2,600
Contingencies of establishment9,440
Legislative Council office establishment at Rs. 1,555–8–0 p.m.18,666
Legislative Council shorthand reporting charges.24,000
Total for Madras5,71,044
BombayOne Member, Executive Council64,000
Three Ministers1,92,000
One President, Legislative Council36,000
One Deputy President, Legislative Council.1,500
One Secretary to Government, Finance Department.31,200
One Secretary to Government, Political Department.30,000
One Deputy Secretary, Finance Department.21,000
One Deputy Secretary, General Department.20,000

Province.Particulars of appointments involving extra cost created.Extra annual cost involved.Remarks.
Rs.
Bombay-cont.One Deputy Secretary, Legal Department29,400

*Six reporters

14,114

*Inclusive of a duty allowance of Rs. 50 per annum to one Reporter.

Two clerks (including a steward)2,244
Four personal clerks to the Honorable Member and Ministers.10,416
Hill allowance to clerks (including a steward).608
Ten peons (including two hamals and one sweeper).3,362
Travelling allowances:—
One Additional Member3,802
Three Ministers9,334
Additional Members of Legislative Council.55,383
Total for Bombay5,24,363
BengalOne Member, Executive Council64,000
Three Ministers1,92,000
One President, Legislative Council36,000
One Deputy President, Legislative Council.5,000
One Secretary, Agriculture and Industries Department.33,000
One Deputy Secretary, Chief Secretary's Office.23,400

*Two Assistant Secretaries

10,320

* Of the five posts of Assistant Secretaries sanctioned on the introduction of the reforms, one was previously in existence, and two have merely replaced Under-Secretary merely replaced Under-Secretaryships which have been abolished.

One Deputy Secretary, Legislative Department.18,000
Travelling and halting allowances of one Executive Councillor, three Ministers and Members of the Legislative Council.1,15,500
Printing, contingencies, etc. in connexion with the reformed Legislative Council.50,000

*Extra ministerial establishment in the several Departments of the Secretariat.

37,240

*Does not include petty items like additional chaprasies, additions to ordinary contingencies, etc.

Total for Bengal5,84,460
United Provinces.One Governor

*20,000

*Difference between pay of present Governor and former Lieut.-Governors.

One Additional Aide-de-Camp9,300
Two Member, Executive Council1,28,000
Two Ministers, Executive Council1,28,000
One President, Legislative Council, at Rs. 4,000.48,000
Two Council Secretaries.36,000
One Deputy President, Legislative Council.5,000
Travelling and halting allowance of executive Councillors and Ministers.20,000
One Secretary at Rs. 2,300 p.m.27,600
One Deputy Secretary at Rs. 2,000 p.m.19,200
One Deputy Secretary in place of an Under Secretary.10,500
Eight Assistant Secretaries in place of one Under Secretary and four Registrars.37,200

Province.Particulars of appointments involving extra cost created.Extra annual cost involved.Remarks.
Rs.
United Provinces-cont.One Assistant Secretary to Council (temporary for 6 months at Rs. 480 p.m.).2,880
Reporting allowance9,000
Three Superintendents at Rs. 450–40–650.21,600
Fifteen Clerks on Rs. 150–10–260–20–360.50,088
One Clerk on Rs. 2402,880
Six Clerks on Rs. 170–10–22014,940
One Clerk on Rs. 1902,280
Eleven Clerks on Rs. 70–5–15015,224
One Librarian on Rs. 350–20–4505,100
One Assistant Treasurer on Rs. 200–10–300.3,200
Fourteen Stenotypists on Rs.150 to Rs.40037,200
One Daftri on Rs.17204
Two Daftris on Rs.16384
Seven Jemadars on Rs.191,596
Six junior Jemadars on Rs.161,152
Twenty Peons on Rs.143,360
Eleven Peons on Rs.131,716
Eighteen Peons on Rs.122,592
Four Doorkeepers on Rs.16768
Two Chaukidars on Rs.12288
Travelling and halting allowances of members of the Legislative Council.1,00,000
Total for United Provinces7,89,252
PunjabTwo Members, Executive Council1,20,000
Two Ministers1,20,000
One Deputy President, Legislative Council, at Rs. 5,000 a year.5,000
One President, Legislative Council at Rs. 3,000 p.m.36,000
One Secretary, Transferred Departments, at Rs. 2,550 p.m.30,600
One Secretary, Legislative Council9,600
Office Establishment, Legislative Council.10,600
Four Council Secretaries at Rs.2,000 a year each.8,000
Travelling allowances of Members of Legislative Council and of Ministers and Members of the Executive Council of the Governor of the Punjab.57,500
Three Council Reporters at Rs. 300–15–450 p.m. each.14,400
Two Personal Assistants at Rs.175–12½–350 p.m. each to Ministers and Members.7,440
Five Jemadars at Rs. 19 each1,140
Fourteen Peons at Rs.16/18 each2,772
Printing Charges29,000
Additional Secretariat Staff20,000
Total Punjab Government4,72,052
Bihar and Orissa.Two Ministers1,20,000

*One President, Legislative Council

* Post at present held by a Member of the Executive Council.

One Deputy President3,000
One Secretary to Council25,200

Province.Particulars of appointment involving extra cost created.Extra annual Cost involved.Remarks.
Rs.
Bihar and Orissa-cont.Travelling and halting allowances of Members of Council and Ministers and Members of the Legislative Council.60,000
One Secretary25,200
One Under Secretary9,600
One Superintendent at Rs. 400–20–5004,800
One Head Assistant at Rs.250–15–400.3,000
One Assistant at Rs.110–5–1501,320
One Accountant at Rs.75–5–100900
Two Accountants at Rs. 55–4–751,320
Two Accountants at Rs.50–4–701,200One of these is at present vacant.
Two Typists at Rs. 70–3–1001,680
One Typists at Rs. 40–3–70480
One Stenographer at Rs. 120–8–2001,440
One Temporary Assistant at Rs. 150–10–250.1,800
One Daftri at Rs. 20–1–25240
Four Peons at Rs. 15 each720
Four Peons at Rs.14 each672
Two Peons at Rs.13 each312
Two Darwans at Rs. 11–1–15264
One Jemadar Sweeper at Rs.12144
Five Sweepers at Rs.10 each600
Four Frashes at Rs.9 each432
Four Watermen at Rs.9 each432
Total Bihar and Orissa2,64,756
Central Provinces.One Governor10,000

*Difference between the present pay of the Governor and the former pay of the Chief Commissioner.

Two Members of the Executive Council.54,000*

*Pay at the rate of Rs. 48,000 per annum for each—Rs.96,000 less the annual saving effected by the abolition of the post of Financial Commissioner Rs.42,000/54,000

Two Ministers72,000
One President, Legislative Council36,000
One Deputy President, Legislative Council.3,000
Four Council SecretariesThese Council Secretaries are selected members of the Legislative Council, who have not accepted any remuneration for their work as their proposed pay at Rs.250 p.m. each was not voted by the present Council.
Central Provinces.Travelling allowances of the Home Member and Ministers.4,594This is an estimate for one year based on the actual expenditure incurred during the first nine months of 1921.
Travelling allowance of Members of the Legislative Council and of the Standing Committees and of clerical and menial staff of the Home Member and the Ministers.16,489
Halting allowance of Members of the Legislative Council and of the Standing Committees and of clerical and menial staff of the Home Member and Ministers.11,513
Extra clerical establishment of the Legislative Council.8,268

* I Superintendent, 3 Clerks and 2 menials. Estimate based on average pay.

Province.Particulars of appointments involving extra cost created.Extra annual cost involved.Remarks.
Rs.
Central Provinces-cont.Stenographers to Home Member and Ministers at Rs.216. 2.3 each.7,800
Menial establishment of President, Deputy-President, Home Member and Ministers.4,240

* 17 Jamadars and peons on rates of pay from average Rs. 13.5.4. to Rs. 19.8.

Total for Central Provinces2,27,904
Assam.One Governor6000Difference between pay of Governor and that of former Chief Commissioners.
Two Members, Executive Council84,000
Two Ministers84,000
One President, Legislative Council12,000
One Deputy-President, Legislative Council.2,500
One Private Secretary to H.E. the Governor.3,000

*Since the introduction of Reforms one Private Secretary has been appointed for H.E. the Governor on a salary of Rs.1250 a month, in place of one Personal Assistant employed by the Chief Commissioner on a salary of Rs.1000 a month.

One Aide-de-Camp to H.E. the Governor.12,000
Four stenographers for the Hon. Member and Ministers (Rs.250–10–350).12,000
Four Jamadars for the Hon. Member and Ministers (20–½25).960
Twelve Chaprasis for the Hon. Members and Ministers (Rs. 14–⅓17).2,016
One Daftri for the Hon. Member and Ministers (Rs.20–½–30).240
One Jamadar for the President of the Council (Rs.20–½–25).240
Two Chaprasis for the President of the Council (Rs. 14⅓–17).336
One Council Clerk (Rs.120–6–190)1,440
One Chobdar for His Excellency (Rs.18–½–25).216
One Chaprasi for Aide-de Camp (Rs.14–⅓–17).168
One Superintendent for Private Secretary's Office (Rs.250–10–450)1,320*

*The difference as compared with the pay of a Head Assistant employed at the time of the Chief Commissioner.

Two Head Assistants for the Assam Secretariat (Rs.300–14–370).7,200
Three Assistants for the Assam Secretariat (Rs.150–10–250).6,240
Two Assistants for the Assam Secretariat (Rs.60–3–90–4–130).1,440
Two Record Suppliers for the Assam Secretariat (Rs.30–1–50).720
One Typist for the Assam Secretariat (Rs. 5085).606
Four Chaprasis for the Assam Secretariat (Rs.14–⅓–17).672
One Clerk for the Legislative Department (Rs.50–4–90–4–130–4–150).600
One Clerk for the Legislative Department (Rs.60–3–90–4–130).720
Travelling allowance and halting allowance etc. of Members of the Legislative Council.22,000

Province.Particulars of appointments involving extra cost created.Extra annual cost involved.Remarks.
Rs.
Assam-cont.Travelling allowance and halting allowance etc. of Members and Minister of Government and their Staff.Rs.10,000
Total for Assam2,72,628
Grand Total for the whole of IndiaRs.45,99,134

Widow's Pension (Mrs E Finnerty, Mountain Ash)

asked the Minister of Pensions if he is aware of the case of Mrs. E. Finnerty, of 11, Napier Street, Mountain Ash, South Wales; that this woman lost her husband and son in the late War; that she received a pension of £1 18s. 7d. per week for the loss of husband and son; that the pension has been cut down to 15s. 6d. per week by the pensions officer because this woman gave birth to a child, the father of the child having promised marriage but not keeping his word; and will his Department give this woman some consideration under the circumstances?

The Special Grants Committee, to whom this case was referred for a decision under the provisions of Section 3 of the Naval and Military War Pensions, etc,, Act, 1915, came to the conclusion that the facts called for the forfeiture of the pension granted to this woman in respect of her deceased husband. I understand, however, that the Committee propose to review the case at an early date.

Aviation (Helicopter)

asked the Secretary of State for Air what progress has been made in the experiments on the helicoptic system of flight, and whether the reward for any successful invention on this system is still offered by the Department?

The answer to the first question is that satisfactory progress is being made with the experiments; to the second, that it is still intended to offer u prize for a successful helicopter, but that it has been necessary to settle points of detail in connection with the conditions of the competition. I hope, however, that a formal announcement Brill be made before very long.

Coal Prices

asked the Secretary for Mines (on Monday, 29th. May) (1) whether, in view of his statement that it is important that the House should realise that there are many other factors in the cost of household coal besides the wages of the miners and the profits of the owners, such as the cost of carriage, railway rates, and the cost of distribution, he will give some idea of the percentage of cost which must be added in respect of each contributory factor to the pithead price of cottage coal sold, for instance, 50 miles from the colliery producing it;(2) whether, seeing that the high price of cottage coal diminishes its consumption, and that it would benefit the millers to increase consumption by efforts to ascertain and remove the causes of the high prices, which, according to authentic statements, are not due to the colliery owners or workers, an inquiry could be instituted to ascertain information as to these causes, if it is not at present available?

STATEMENT, furnished by the Coal Merchants' Federation of Great Britain, showing the Retail Selling Prices of House Coal delivered in various Provincial Centres at 25th May. 1922, and the Items of Cost included in the Retail Selling Prices.
Items of Cost.Northampton.Cheltenham.
Derby Best.Baddesley Cobbles.Kitchen Coal.Best.Medium.Cheap.

s.

d.

s.

d.

s.

d.

s.

d.

s.

d.

s.

d.

Pit price310270220290250190
Railway rate866158929292
Wagon hire161010202020
Distribution charges, including factorage9610089969696
Retailers' profit061507040404
Total - Retail price, delivered510456380500460400

Items of Cost.Leeds.Manchester.
Best.Medium.Best.Seconds.Kitchen

s.

d.

s.

d.

s.

d.

s.

d.

s.

d.

Pit price (average)368287303287245
Railway rate (average)3419555555
Wagon hire (average)1009141414
Distribution charges, including factorage81187101010
Retailers' profit0804111
Total—Retail price, delivered507400484468426

Items of Cost.Colchester.Liverpool.
Best Silk stone.Best Bright House.Hard Kitchen Nust.Best.Seconds.Kitchen.

s.

d.

s.

d.

s.

d.

s.

d.

s.

d.

s.

d.

Pit price280263220380340260
Railway rate1011111107403030
Wagon hire202020101010
Distribution charges, including factorage103103103939393
Retailers' profit0100502090909
Total—Retail price, delivered520500450530480400
NOTES.—1. Since the 25th May the retail selling prices of coal have been reduced.
2. The figures for Cheltenham differ from those given in the reply on the 29th May. The discrepancies in the earlier figures were discovered by the Coal Merchants' Federation in the subsequent process of verifying the details.

Items of Cost.Cardiff.
Best House.Best Monmouthshire.Kitchen.

s.

d.

s.

d.

s.

d.

Pit price310260216
Railway rate363030
Wagon hire161616
Distribution charges, including factorage909090
Retailers' profit101010
Total—Retail price, delivered.460406360

Unemployment

Benefit Payments (Delays)

asked the Minister of Labour whether he is aware that, owing to the necessity for sending certain forms from the local Employment Exchanges to London, delays of five or six weeks occur in payment of unemployment benefits to applicants; and whether, if such forms are returned stating that nothing stands to the applicant's credit, any appeal from this decision is possible?

Delays of the extent suggested are altogether an exception. The form in question is in the great majority of cases returned in time for the authorisation of any benefit payable to the claimant on the first pay day on which it would be due. Further, the authorisation of uneovenanted benefit (which is the benefit payable to the large majority of claimants) does not depend on this form, but may proceed independently. Unavoidable delay takes place in certain eases, for example, where the particulars supplied by the claimant do not agree with the particulars originally furnished on his entry into insurance, or where he has not returned an expired unemployment book. I will, however, have in- quiries made in any particular case brought to my notice. In regard to the latter part of the question, if benefit is refused on the ground that nothing stands to his credit, the applicant has the usual right of appeal to a Court of Referees.

Southwark Board Of Guardians

asked the Minister of Health whether he is aware that the scale of relief now being granted by the Southwark Board of Guardians is from 6s. to 10s. below the scale approved by him; and whether he will make representations to the Board in question with a view to the scale being raised to a proper level?

I am informed that while the Southwark Board of Guardians look to this scale for guidance, they have not themselves adopted any fixed scale. They consider each case on its merits, and where they are satisfied that a lower amount than the Common Poor Fund scale is adequate, such lower amount is quite properly given. It is no part of my duty, and I certainly have no intention, of making representations to a board of guardians who are not exceeding the scale I have laid down.