House Of Commons
Thursday, 17th November, 1932.
The House—in pursuance of the Resolution of 16th November—met at Eleven of the Clock, Mr. SPEAKER in the Chair.
Oral Answers To Questions
Unemployment
Relief Works
1.
asked the Minister of Labour whether, with a view to reducing unemployment and relieving distress during the coming winter, he will consider putting into operation some measure of relief works as soon as possible?
I would refer my hon. and gallant Friend to the very full statements made on this subject by the Prime Minister, the Chancellor of the Exchequer and myself in the course of the Debate on unemployment on 4th, 7th and 8th November.
The Government said they were going to consider the proposals made in the recent Debate. Can the right hon. Gentleman say whether they have arrived at any conclusions upon them?
No, Sir. We are considering them.
Exchange Facilities, Oughtibridge, Sheffield
4.
asked the Minister of Labour if he will consider the opening of a temporary Employment Exchange at Oughtibridge, near Sheffield, for the period of the winter months, in view of the long distance which the unemployed have to cover to attend the nearest Employment Exchange?
I am having inquiries made regarding the local circumstances at Oughtibridge, and I will communicate with my hon. Friend in due course.
Will the right hon. Gentleman further consider this question, when he will realise that there is now an additional hardship on the unemployed owing to the action of the traffic commissioners in restricting services and increasing fares?
I will take all those facts into consideration.
Broadmoor Asylum (Detentions)
7.
asked the Secretary of State for the Home Department how many persons now incarcerated in Broad-moor have never been convicted by a jury of any offence but have been sent to this place of detention on purely medical grounds?
312 persons at present detained in Broadmoor were found by juries to be insane upon arraignment and therefore were not put upon their trial; 39 other persons were certified insane while awaiting trial or upon remand and were removed to Broadmoor.
Workmen's Compensation
8.
asked the Home Secretary how many cases are known to his Department in which the payments of money under the Workmen's Compensation Act have been delayed or denied to injured employés through default or insolvency of employers?
The Department is aware of 28 cases of liquidations in the coal mining industry since the beginning of 1927 in which there has been some loss, or delay of payment, of compensation. There have been a considerable number of other cases in this industry in which it has been ascertained that no permanent loss of compensation resulted, but there may have been delay in making payment. I regret that no information is available as regards other industries, but practically all the complaints which have recently reached me on this matter have related to the coal mining industry.
May I ask that serious consideration should now be given to the important question of compulsory workmen's compensation insurance?
Serious consideration has been given to it for a considerable time, and I would refer my hon. Friend to the answer which was given by my right hon. Friend in reply to a question by the hon. Member for Leigh (Mr. Tinker) on 27th October.
Is the right hon. Gentleman satisfied that the scheme which the owners are at present working out meets with approval?
I am not quite sure to which scheme the hon. Member refers. Most of the districts have got different schemes.
Is the hon. Gentleman aware that recent attention has been given to this subject and can he say whether any progress was made in the recent discussion?
Yes, an account of the progress was given in my right hon. Friend's reply on 27th October.
Will further consideration, and serious consideration, be given to it?
Obviously.
Education
National Union Of Teachers (President)
9.
asked the Parliamentary Secretary to the Board of Education whether he will recommend that education authorities should suspend the employment of any employé elected to the presidency of the National Union of Teachers during his year of office?
It has been the practice of the Board not to interfere with the discretion of local education authorities in matters of this sort, and I see no reason for any change in that practice.
Does not the hon. Gentleman consider it extremely unfair, both to the authority and the union concerned, that this servant should for that year have to serve both parties, who automatically come into conflict with each other, and does he consider—
That is a matter of opinion.
Schools (Soap Sales)
10.
asked the Parliamentary Secretary to the Board of Education whether his attention has been called to the attempt to use the school organisation for the sale of a special soap; whether he is aware that teachers in different schools throughout England have been approached to promote the sale of such soap through the medium of their pupils, and that booklets and samples have been issued to teachers for distribution amongst pupils; and whether he will issue a circular to education authorities upon the undesirability of public servants being used for the promotion of private profit?
I have seen a reference to the matter, to which the hon. Member refers, in the public Press, but my attention has not been otherwise called to it. The Board strongly deprecate any attempt to utilise the State-aided schools for the advertisement or sale of the goods of any particular firm. I believe that the Board's attitude is well understood by the local education authorities, and, in the circumstances, I see no reason for issuing a circular on the matter.
Is the hon. Gentleman aware that the authorities are placing the responsibility on the National Union of Teachers to cleanse the school organisation of this pernicious practice, and will he look further into the matter, in order that the responsibility may in the future be placed on the authorities, in so far as instructions in the matter are concerned?
If my hon. Friend will give me particulars of the case which he has in mind, I will certainly make inquiries.
Grants (Scotland)
30.
asked the Secretary of State for Scotland whether, in the interests of economy, he will arrange to reduce the Parliamentary grants towards the cost of education in Scotland to the level which prevails in England and Wales?
Under the arrangement embodied in Section 21 of the Education (Scotland) Act, 1918, the grants voted by Parliament in aid of educational expenditure in Scotland are automatically reduced in relation to economies made in England and Wales.
That is not an answer to the question I asked. I want to know whether the Government will put the grants for Scottish education on the same basis as for British education, or am I to understand that it requires 25 per cent. more money in Scotland to produce the same results as are produced in England?
That question should be put down on the Paper.
It is down.
The question which my hon. Friend asks is not that which is on the Paper. In any case, I could not answer it now, because a general discussion on the financial relations between England and Scotland for educational purposes is hardly possible in Question Time.
Does the hon. Gentleman think that it is satisfactory that Scotland should not be allowed to spend as much as she likes on her own education?
Rent Restrictions Acts
16.
asked the Minister of Health if he can now make a statement of the intention of His Majesty's Government with reference to the Rent Restrictions Acts?
My right hon. Friend is not in a position to make any further statement as to the Government's intentions in regard to prospective legislation.
Trade And Commerce
Preferential Duties (Bills Of Lading)
17 and 18.
asked the Chancellor of the Exchequer (1) whether he is aware that His Majesty's Customs decline to admit, at the preferential rate of duty, Empire goods when imported on an optional bill of lading after transhipment at a foreign port, while admitting at the same time at the preferential rate similar goods carried on a through bill of lading and transhipped at a foreign port on exactly similar conditions; and if he will indicate on what grounds this action on the part of the Customs Department is based;
(2) if he is aware that the facilities afforded by an optional bill of lading are essential to certain trades the ultimate destination of whose goods may not be determined until after shipment; and if, to secure that certain Empire goods may not be penalised against others, the Treasury will direct, provided the goods have not entered into the commerce of a foreign country and been reconsigned, that no distinction as far as concerns Imperial preference shall be made by His Majesty's Customs between Empire shipments on optional and through bills of lading?I am aware that in certain trades it is found convenient to ship goods on optional bills of lading, and that it is the practice of the Customs Department to refuse admission to preference in cases where Empire goods so shipped are brought to this country after transhipment at a foreign port. This practice is based on the statutory condition that Empire goods claiming preference must be shown to the satisfaction of the Customs to have been consigned to this country from a part of the British Empire. Goods shipped on optional bills of lading and arriving in this country after transhipment at a foreign port cannot be regarded as fulfilling this condition, and such goods are in consequence not entitled to preference under the existing law. It would be impracticable for the Customs authorities to satisfy themselves in such cases that the goods had not entered into the commerce of a foreign country and been reconsigned, and I regret that in the circumstances I am unable to authorise the procedure which my hon. Friend suggests.
If it can he shown to my hon. Friend that there is really some substance in the complaints which are put forward in my question, will he discuss the matter with a small deputation and, if necessary, subsequently make a slight amendment in the law?
I should be only too glad to meet my hon. Friend on this point, but, of course, he will realise that this has been the practice and the condition of the law ever since preference was instituted.
Customs And Excise Tariff
20.
asked the Chancellor of the Exchequer if he will consider the publication at an early date of a White Paper showing the present customs tariff of the United Kingdom and indicating in the case of every commodity to which it applies the amount, if any, of excise duty applicable to any commodity which is also liable to customs duty?
A publication showing the Customs and Excise Tariff of the United Kingdom will be issued shortly by the Commissioners of Customs and Excise.
In view of the constant additions to tariffs, which are made almost every week, will the hon. Gentleman consider publishing a weekly paper to give this information?
Sugar Machinery (India)
29.
asked the Secretary to the Overseas Trade Department whether his attention has been called to the fact that representatives of Dutch sugar-manufacturing and financial interests are now in Delhi negotiating for the establishment of further sugar factories which will operate with Dutch machinery; and whether any steps have been taken to instruct His Majesty's Trade Commissioner in India to draw the attention of those concerned to the desirability of considering the alternative instalment of British machinery?
While the negotiations to which my hon. Friend specifically refers have not been brought to my notice, His Majesty's Trade Commissioner at Bombay has recently called attention to the activities in India of Dutch and Belgian manufacturers of sugar machinery. The United Kingdom sugar machinery manufacturers are well represented in the Indian market, some having their own branches in the territory, and are doing all in their power to secure business. His Majesty's Trade Commissioners co- operate in every way possible with such representatives or branches in their endeavour to promote the sale of United Kingdom products. Seventy-three per cent. of the imports of sugar making machinery into India during the five months ending the 31st August last, were derived from the United Kingdom and were valued at half a million pounds sterling.
In order that there may be no excuse for the introduction of Dutch machinery, will the Government make it perfectly clear that British manufacturers can supply these requirements?
Yes, Sir, it is our endeavour to make that perfectly clear.
Meat Supplies
32.
asked the President of the Board of Trade if he will state how many months' supply of beef and mutton in cold storage it is estimated that there is at the present time in this country?
I regret that the desired information is not available.
Russia (Trade Agreement)
37.
asked the Secretary of State for Foreign Affairs whether negotiations have been instituted with the Russian Government for a new trade agreement; and whether conversations have already taken place?
I would refer my hon. Friend to the reply which I gave to the hon. Member for Westhoughton (Mr. Rhys Davies) on the 14th November.
Do I understand that the Government are prepared at any moment to go forward with these negotiations?
As I said then, the Government are prepared at any time to go forward when they get a reply from Russia.
39.
asked the Secretary of State for Foreign Affairs whether, in concluding the proposed trade agreement with Russia, he will make it a condition that Russia will receive no more diplomatic immunity for her diplomatic and commercial agents than is afforded to any other country?
Russian diplomatic agents in Great Britain will naturally continue to receive the same diplomatic immunity as similar agents of other countries. The case of commercial agents will, of course, be dealt with in any new agreement which may be reached.
May I ask, as it is the avowed intention of the Soviet Government to overthrow constitutional government, why that Government should have special facilities given them by the British Government to facilitate the carrying out of their purpose?
We are dealing with a matter of commercial relations, and, as we have informed the Russian Government and this country again and again, a commercial treaty, and the action we are taking with regard to it, have nothing whatever to do with politics.
War Debts
19.
asked the Chancellor of the Exchequer whether any payments in respect of war debts have been made to this country in the last 12 months; and, if so, by whom?
No payments have been made to this country in respect of Inter-Allied War Debts in the last 12 months. The only payments made in respect of Dominion War Debts have been two instalments each of £163,750 which were made by the Government of the Union of South Africa in accordance with the generous decision of that Government not to avail themselves of the offer of a suspension of payments during the Hoover year.
Civil Servants (Trade Union Membership)
22.
asked the Financial Secretary to the Treasury the number of civil servants who belong to trade unions under Sub-section (a) and Sub-section (b), respectively, of Section 5 of the Trades Disputes and Trades Union Act of 1927?
The statistical information desired by my Noble Friend I regret to inform him is not available.
Agriculture
Credits
24.
asked the Financial Secretary to the Treasury whether, with a view to relieving the financial strain on the agricultural community, he will consider taking steps to reduce the high interest at present paid under the Agricultural Credits Act, 1923, or granting a moratorium on capital redemption under the same Act?
Advances made by the Public Works Loan Commissioners under the provisions of the Agricultural Credits Act, 1923, were made out of money raised by the issue of Local Loans Stock. That stock could only be redeemed at a heavy capital loss, and so long as it remains unredeemed His Majesty's Government are bound to continue to pay interest upon it at the same rate as when the money was originally borrowed. I am, therefore, unable to hold out any hope that the rate of interest charged upon these advances will be reduced. As regards the last part of the question I understand that it is the practice of the Public Works Loan Commissioners to show consideration to individual debtors in cases of exceptional hardship.
In view of the fact that the nation supported the Government in the recent 3½ per cent. conversion, does not the hon. Gentleman consider that 5½ per cent. is an exorbitant percentage for a distressed industry to have to pay?
I do not know that my view would differ from that of my hon. Friend, but the fact is that he is inviting the taxpayer to come to the assistance of this fund, and therefore is asking him to make even greater sacrifices.
Live-Stock Products (Prices)
27.
asked the Minister of Agriculture when the producers of home live-stock products may expect an increase of price due to the restriction of oversea imports?
The returns from a number of representative markets indicate that the average prices realised for fat stock of all kinds during this week show considerable improvement over those received during the corresponding period last week. My right hon. Friend will agree with me that this early reaction is satisfactory and promising.
While agreeing with my right hon. and gallant Friend, may I ask whether the Government propose to persist in this policy, because upon an increase of prices depends an increase of employment for a very large number of agricultural labourers?
My right hon. Friend may rest assured that we did not lightly enter upon the policy, and we shall not lightly leave it.
British Army
Sixth Yeomanry Brigade (Command)
34.
asked the Financial Secretary to the War Office whether there are any officers in the Yeomanry who are qualified and willing to command a brigade?
Four ex-Yeomanry officers are qualified by rank for the command of a Territorial Army cavalry brigade. The question of their willingness to hold such a command has not arisen.
May I ask why those officers were not offered the vacancy in the Yeomanry Brigade that recently occurred?
Because another officer was considered more suitable for the post.
Territorial Army (Efficiency Decoration)
35.
asked the Financial Secretary to the War Office the reasons for substituting the Efficiency Decoration for the Territorial Decoration as an award for services in the Territorial Army?
The Efficiency Decoration was instituted in order that there might be one decoration throughout the Empire, governed by similar conditions of award, for long and meritorious service of officers of the auxiliary military forces throughout the Empire.
India (Air Force)
36.
asked the Secretary of State for India what is the total personnel of the Air Force in India, and if any estimate has been formed as to what additions would be required to the other forces if the Air Force were abolished?
The total establishment of officers and other ranks on the 1st April last was 2,287. The answer to the last part is that no such estimate has been formed.
May I ask whether it is contemplated to prepare such an estimate, in view of possible developments at Geneva?
We will bear my hon. Friend's suggestion in mind.
Russia (Propaganda)
40.
asked the Secretary of State for Foreign Affairs whether, seeing that the recent riots and disturbances were attributable to the influence of the Soviet or of its agents, and that they involve a breach of the Protocol of October, 1929, he will say what action he has taken or proposes to take?
I assume that my hon. Friend refers to the case mentioned in his question of the 9th November. Since this case has not yet been disposed of by the courts, I cannot add anything to the reply returned to that question.
With great respect, I would say that the Prime Minister assumed wrongly. My question referred to the actual outbreak of a few days ago. May I ask whether, in view of the fact that the methods employed in street fighting were those laid down by the Plenum of the Third International and were carried out in street fighting, that is not in fact a breaking of the Protocol of October, 1929, and what action does the Government propose to take?
The Government propose to take the action of being very careful of their facts before they act upon them.
Can there be any doubt of the facts?
House Of Lords
41.
asked the Prime Minster whether it is the intention of the Government to introduce legislation dealing with the reform of the House of Lords on the lines of the Report recently issued or on other lines?
The Government have not considered this question.
Is the Prime Minister aware of the grave danger, felt in some quarters, of Socialist legislation being passed in this House in accordance with the will of the people as expressed by their representatives here?
Disarmament
42.
asked the Prime Minister whether, in view of the discussion on the future of military aviation at the Geneva Conference, the factor of Russia, with its large air force, will be taken into consideration in any self-denying decision at which the other world Powers may arrive; and, if not, what guarantee will be possessed by the latter Powers against the refusal of Russia to participate in this measure of disarmament?
My right hon. Friend the Foreign Secretary has just made a statement of foreign policy at Geneva, and it is now available to hon. Members in the Vote Office. My Noble Friend will see that the proposals of His Majesty's Government embrace the leading air Powers. Obviously Russia is included.
South America (British Immigrants)
43.
asked the Secretary of State for Foreign Affairs whether, in view of the number of British subjects who are now being invited to go out and settle and carry on plantation work at Victoria, on the Parana river, in South America, he will instruct the British representatives on the spot to make an inquiry into the finance and prospects of such plantation work for the guidance of other British subjects?
My right hon. Friend has already requested His Majesty's Ambassador at Buenos Aires to keep him fully informed of the development of this scheme in so far as it concerns British subjects.
Coal Industry (Accident, Lanarkshire)
(by Private Notice) asked the Secretary for Mines if he can make a statement regarding the pit accident at Cardowan Colliery Stepps, Lanarkshire?
I deeply regret that an explosion, which occurred at this colliery about 9 a.m. yesterday, resulted in the death of four men and the injury of 10 others, and the House will wish me to express deep sympathy with the dependants and relatives of the dead and an earnest hope that the injured will have a speedy recovery. The explosion occurred on a long-wall conveyor face in the main seam. There was no fire after the explosion, and all the dead and injured were immediately brought to the surface. Mines Inspectors were occupied all day yesterday in investigating the circumstances, but until I receive their full report I am not able to give any further details.
Has the hon. Gentleman seen the statement in the Press this morning that these accidents are not coincidences at all, but are due to pressure from the coast line?
The hon. Gentleman knows that it is always wise to accept Press statements with reserve.
The Orders of the Day were read, and postponed.
There will be a Royal Commission at 11.30.
On a point of Order. May I ask if there is not to be a second round of questions?
There never is when the House meets at Eleven.
If there is time available, is it not in accordance with the best traditions of public business that these opportunities should be given?
Royal Assent
Message to attend the Lords Commissioners.
The House went; and, having returned,
(standing in the Clerk's place at the Table): I have to acquaint the House that the House has been to the House of Peers, where a Commission under the Great Seal was read authorising the Royal Assent to—
Prorogation
His Majesty's Most Gracious Speech
I have further to acquaint the House that the Lord High Chancellor, being one of the High Commissioners, delivered His Majesty's Most Gracious Speech to both Houses of Parliament, in pursuance of His Majesty's Command, as followeth:
My Lords and Members of the House of Commons,
The admission of the Kingdom of Iraq to membership of the League of Nations as a fully independent sovereign State marks the successful issue of the policy which My Government and their predecessors have consistently pursued during the last 12 years.
At the Lausanne Conference held in the summer the Governments concerned collaborated with success in devising the conditions of a lasting settlement of the question of German reparations as an essential preliminary to the economic recovery of the world.
I am deeply gratified at the successful conclusion of the Economic Conference held at Ottawa between representatives of the Governments of the different parts of My Empire, and I trust that it will add strength to the ties between My Peoples and stimulate Imperial trade. I have given My assent to the Measure necessary to give effect in the United Kingdom to the recommendations of the Conference.
I regret that certain questions which have arisen between the United Kingdom and the Irish Free State have not yet, despite the efforts made, been found capable of adjustment.
In accordance with the Resolutions approved by both your Houses, My Ministers have been investigating the many difficult questions involved in the revision of the Indian Constitution, and they have removed a serious barrier to progress by issuing a Declaration on the subject of communal representation.
Members of the House of Commons,
I thank you for the provision you have made for the public service.
My Lords and Members of the House of Commons,
The measures taken to meet the crisis of last autumn and the readiness of the community to make all necessary sacrifices have succeeded in re-establishing a balance between income and expenditure in our national finances.
Within the last few months operations on a scale never hitherto attempted have been carried through with complete success for the purpose of reducing the charge to the public for the service of the National Debt.
The adverse balance of trade which occasioned so much anxiety last year has been checked by the passing of the Import Duties Act and a substantial addition to the Revenue has been obtained by the same means, while a reasonable protection has been afforded to British industry on the recommendations of an impartial advisory committee.
Since the passing of this Act approaches have been made to My Government, by the Governments of a number of foreign countries, with a view to the negotiation of trade agreements. My Ministers welcome these approaches and conversations have already begun which will, I trust, lead to mutually satisfactory arrangements.
The condition of the agricultural industry has received the anxious consideration of My Ministers. The serious position in the live-stock industry has demanded emergency measures and a scheme for the voluntary regulation of imports of meat into this Country is now being brought into operation with the co-operation of the Governments and commercial interests in the Dominions and Foreign countries concerned. I am gratified to learn that this co-operation has been so readily forthcoming.
I have given My assent to a Measure for the assistance of growers of wheat in this Country, and provision has been made for the protection and encouragement of the fruit growing and market gardening industries.
An Act of great constitutional significance, namely, the Statute of Westminster, 1931, which makes clear the powers of Dominion Parliaments, has been passed. This Act gives effect to certain resolutions passed by the Imperial Conferences of 1926 and 1930 setting out the relationship of the United Kingdom and the Dominions.
I have given My assent to a Bill laying down the rules to be observed with regard to certain matters in the assessment of transitional payments to the unemployed, and enabling the same rules to be applied to outdoor relief.
A Measure has been passed consolidating and amending the law of town planning, whereby the responsible authorities will in future be enabled, subject to due consideration of all interests concerned, to study and deal with problems of development in relation to areas, whether built up or not.
A number of other Measures of public utility have been added to the Statute Book.
On the advice of My Ministers I have appointed a Commission to inquire into the existing law and the practice thereunder relating to lotteries, betting, gambling and cognate matters, and to report what changes, if any, are desirable and practicable.
In bidding you farewell, I pray that the blessing of Almighty God may rest upon your labours.
Then a Commission for Proroguing the Parliament was read in the Rouse of Lords.
After which the LORD CHANCELLOR said:
MY LORDS AND MEMBERS OF THE HOUSE OF CommoNs,—By virtue of His Majesty's Commission, under the Great Seal, to us and other Lords directed, and now read, we do, in His Majesty's Name and in obedience to His Majesty's Commands, prorogue this Parliament to Tuesday, the twenty-second day of November, one thousand nine hundred and thirty-two, to be then here holden; and this Parliament is accordingly Prorogued until Tuesday, the twenty-second day of November, one thousand nine hundred and thirty-two.
End of the First Session (opened Tuesday, 3rd November, 1931) of the Thirty-sixth Parliament of the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland, in the Twenty-third year of the Reign of His Majesty King George the Fifth.