asked the Minister of Labour whether he is aware of the diversion of the London and North Eastern Railway Company's coach-building works from Dukinfield; and whether, in view of the already depressed state of industry locally, he will consult with the company with a view to retaining or extending such employment for Dukinfield?

I would refer the hon. Member to the reply given by my right hon. Friend the Minister of Transport to the hon. Member for Stalybridge and Hyde (Mr. Trevor Cox) on 12th December of which I am sending him a copy.

Will the Minister endeavour to secure some substitute work for these men in view of the railway work being diverted?

If the hon. Member will look at the answer of which I am sending him a copy, he will see that my right hon. Friend is in communication with the railway company?

asked the Minister of Labour whether he will consider introducing legislation to ensure that conscientious objectors who refuse work connected with national defence should not draw unemployment benefit?

The Unemployment Insurance Acts contain provisions defining the circumstances in which a refusal of an offer of employment entails disqualification for the receipt of unemployment benefit. I do not contemplate amending these provisions by adding a specific disqualification such as is suggested in the question.

Does not the right hon. Gentleman think that such refusal to do work which may be of national importance ought not to be rewarded by the issue of unemployment benefit? Does he think that that is right?

I would not state it in those terms at all. The hon. and gallant Member will have the particular case in mind which he raised last week when I pointed out to him that the impartial court of appeal were employers, workers and an independent chairman, and I would point out to the House that, as regards major decisions of the umpire, we have had only one such case in 15 years.

Will the right hon. Gentleman see that Members of this House who do not attend here regularly have their pay stopped?

asked the Minister of Labour (1) the number of persons in receipt of unemployment allowances at the most recent date for which the information is available; the number in receipt of winter allowances at the same date; and the average amount paid in each case;

(2) the number of persons in receipt of unemployment allowances in the Chesterfield, Ilkeston, Mansfield, Barnsley, Mexborough, and Rotherham areas at the most recent date for which the information is available; the number who were in receipt of winter allowances at the same date; and the average amount paid in each area?

As the reply contains a table of figures I will, with the hon. Member's permission, circulate it in the OFFICIAL REPORT.

asked the Minister of Labour the number of unemployed workers in the Pontardawe Rural District Council's, Neath Rural District Council's, and Neath Borough Council's area for 1930, 1935, 1937, and the latest available date this year, in mining, steel trade, tinplate trade, agriculture, transport, and miscellaneous?

As the reply includes a table of figures, I will, if I may, circulate a statement in the OFFICIAL REPORT.

asked the Minister of Labour whether he will consider the advisability of finding work for the unemployed in the distressed areas of South Wales in removing the unsightly buildings, etc., where industries have definitely closed down to make the sites more attractive for new industries and to improve the amenities in the depressed areas?

The Commissioner for the Special Areas (England and Wales) has acquired sites in South Wales and large areas have been cleared with a view to their utilisation for industrial purposes. He has under consideration the desirability of effecting further clearance on one of these sites and would be prepared to undertake further schemes if the need arose. It is not proposed, however, that he should depart from his policy of not giving assistance to public works for the sake of the employment thereby provided.

Does the right hon. Gentleman think that the Commissioner for the Special Areas is making an attempt to assist South Wales at the present moment; and has the right hon. Gentleman seen the statement he made to the Press this week when attending a dinner in London?

I am sure that he is making every attempt to assist South Wales, as this answer will show.

Does the right hon. Gentleman think that the powers of the Commissioners are sufficient to do this work in the Special Areas?

Undoubtedly.

asked the Minister of Labour when he will be able to announce his proposals for dealing with the distressed areas which are outside the scheduled Special Areas; and whether he can indicate when the legislation dealing with the matter will be introduced?

I am not yet in a position to make any announcement in this matter, but I can assure the hon. Member that there will be no avoidable delay.

asked the Minister of Labour the number of applicants for assistance to the Unemployment Assistance Board who are 45 years of age or over; whether this represents an increase or reduction on the figures for 1936 and 1937; and whether he can now say when he will be able to implement the promise made that proposals would be tabled to deal with the position of the elderly unemployed?

On the basis of a sample investigation made on 7th November, 1938, the number of applicants in receipt of allowances who were 45 years of age and over on that date is estimated to be 268,000. This represents a reduction of about 2,000 from the comparable total arrived at after a similar investigation made on 3rd December, 1937. At the end of 1936 the number of such persons was estimated to be 265,000 but, owing to the transfer to the Board on the Second Appointed Day of persons not previously entitled to unemployment allowances, the figures for 1936 are not comparable with those for later years. In reply to the last part of the question, I would refer the hon. Member to the answer given to the hon. Member for Houghton-le-Spring (Mr. W. Joseph Stewart) on 21st June, of which I am sending him a copy, and to the statement I made in the Debate on 18th July.

Is the right hon. Gentleman aware of the grave dissatisfaction that exists in the whole of these areas where these men are unemployed, and that the promise he made publicly in South Wales in September, 1937, has not yet been carried out? When does the right hon. Gentleman propose to bring these suggestions before the House?

If the hon. Member suggests that I have no general remedy for this, I have never made such a statement. I have done what I promised by administrative effort and every other way, namely, my very best to call the attention of employers to the capabilities of these elderly men for whom we all mean to do all we can to get them back to work.

I am not suggesting that the right hon. Gentleman said that there was a complete cure for this, but he promised definitely that proposals would be put by him before the House of Commons to deal with the position. When is that promise to be kept?

The statement to which I referred deals with a whole number of proposals. The hon. Member will see that it is a very long statement.

Will the right hon. Gentleman bear in mind that although he is doing his best, it is not good enough?

I am quite aware of that, but it is a great deal better than some people did.

Will the right hon. Gentleman guard against creating another category of unemployed, namely, "elderly unemployed"?

I protested against that. I did not like it. All the same, the facts are serious enough to warrant special attention being given to this and, indeed, to the younger group at the other end.

asked the Minister of Labour whether he can give particulars when his Department proposes opening a new Employment Exchange to meet the needs of the borough of Southwark; and what has caused the present delay?

There has been difficulty in adjusting the Department's requirements to the limitations of the site proposed for the new building. This difficulty has now been surmounted and the site has been acquired. I cannot yet say when the building will be ready for occupation.

Can the Minister say when the work will be commenced, as the plans were prepared two years and a half ago?

That cannot be so. The plans have now been approved, but I cannot go into details at the moment.

Did not the Minister state in this House, in reply to a question of mine two years and a half ago, that the plans were in preparation?

asked the Minister of Labour the number of persons who have been imported to work on the new aerodrome at Hatfield, near Doncaster; on whose authority were they imported; and why local unemployed were not given the first chance of this work?

asked the Minister of Labour whether he is aware that notices have been posted at the Thorne Employment Exchange asking for lodgings for imported labourers who are to be engaged on the new aerodrome at Hatfield; whether he is aware that there are between 3,000 and 4,000 unemployed in the Doncaster and Thorne area; and will he explain why any labour is being imported from Ireland or elsewhere?

The total number employed at present on these works is between 70 and 80 most of whom have followed the contractors from a previous job. The contractors have undertaken to co-operate with the local Employment Exchange in the filling of vacancies. I can assure the hon. Members that the Exchange will give first preference to suitable local labour, and up to 12th December it had filled nine vacancies all of them with men from either Doncaster or Thorne. I am informed that the local supply of skilled labour is not likely to be sufficient. Such labour must therefore be imported to the necessary extent and it was in this connection that the notice with regard to lodgings was posted at the Exchange. So far as the Exchange is concerned there is no truth in the allegation that labour is being imported from Ireland.

Therefore, we may take it that the statement that was made in the Press last week that a number of men were coming over from Ireland is incorrect, and that whatever labour is wanted will be drawn from the locality if the labour is there?

Undoubtedly, and, in fairness to the paper which published the report, it has since corrected it.

Is it the policy of the Minister to see that Ireland shall not be considered in this matter?

No, Sir, that is an entirely different issue. The unemployed in Doncaster and district are entitled, other things being equal, to local preference for local jobs.

Is it the practice for there to be some transfer from other service establishments?

asked the Minister of Labour whether he is aware that at the Exeter Employment Exchange persons have to stand outside in all weathers while waiting for their unemployment benefit, with the result that cases of illness have occurred; and whether immediate steps can be taken to provide shelter?

I am advised that it is impracticable to provide a shelter at this building, which abuts directly on to the public pavement. There should be no need for applicants to wait any length of time provided they adhere to the timing system.

asked the Minister of Labour whether he is aware that in the South Hylton district of Durham there is a large percentage of unemployment; that most of the industries in the area are closed; and what steps are being taken by him or by the Commissioner for the Special Areas to help to provide work for the people affected?

I am aware of the position in this area. I would draw the hon. Member's attention to the acquisition by the Commissioner for Special Areas of the site at Pallion for the provision of factories for new industrial undertakings.

Is the right hon. Gentleman aware that this district which was once prosperous, is now practically derelict owing to the closing down of nearly the whole of the industries there? Is he aware that the site at Pallion will not help us? Can he not say definitely today whether he is prepared to do anything? In the event of his doing nothing, can he persuade the Commissioner for the Special Areas to do something to help these people?

I cannot add anything to the answer I have given to the hon. Member.

asked the Minister of Labour the number of persons who are receiving winter allowance in the county borough of West Ham?

This information is being extracted. I will communicate with the hon. Member when it is available.

asked the Minister of Labour whether he intends to carry into legislation the proposals made by the statutory committee presided over by Sir W. Beveridge; and whether it is his intention to introduce his proposals before the Christmas Recess?

I assume that the hon. Member has in mind the report of the Unemployment Insurance Statutory Committee as to Holidays and Suspensions in relation to Unemployment Insurance, which was made in October. This report is under actual consideration, but I do not anticipate that it will be possible to introduce legislation in connection with it before Christmas.

In view of the fact that the proposals are fairly wide-reaching in their effects, would it not be better if hon. Members during the Recess had the Bill before them for consideration, seeing that a large number of trade unions are affected by the proposed legislation?

There will be plenty of time for consideration before the discussion of the Bill.

asked the Minister of Labour whether he is aware of the hardship which many unemployed persons suffer through not being able to claim unemployment pay for a housekeeper unless the claimant has children residing in the same household; and whether it is his intention to take any action on this matter?

The hon. Member is, I think, aware of the difficulty there would be in proposing any change in the existing law on this subject without inviting demands for an unjustifiable extension; and all I can say at present is that I will give the matter my consideration.

asked the Minister of Labour whether he has considered the request of the Briarfield Urban District Council that unemployment benefit for unemployed persons in their area should be paid out locally instead of at Nelson; and whether he is prepared to accede to this request?

I have been in correspondence with the hon. and gallant Member for Clitheroe (Sir W. Brass), who raised the matter on the council's behalf. I regret that I could not feel justified in providing separate Exchange facilities at Briarfield, which is 1¼ miles from Nelson.

Will the right hon. Member bear in mind that it is not an Employment Exchange they are asking for, but an office where the benefit can be paid out, the expenses of which office the urban district council are prepared to pay? In these circumstances, does the right hon. Gentleman not think that the balance of convenience would be to allow the urban council to have its way?

In the early days this question was discussed, and it was agreed that the State should provide the whole thing, including the offices.

asked the Minister of Labour how many persons have been thrown out of employment as a result of the official request for the withdrawal of the almost completed "Siege of Lucknow" film?

No demands had been made at the local office of the Ministry in this connection, and no claims to benefit can be traced in respect of persons who may have been engaged in any part of the production.

In view of the fact that a large number of persons have lost their employment as a result of Government intervention, do the Government propose to compensate these persons?

The hon. Member makes a statement which, as my answer already makes clear, is very dubious.

asked the Minister of Labour what action the Government are taking with regard to the seaman's welfare in ports recommendations, adopted by the International Labour Conference at Geneva in October, 1936, and accepted by the Government in March, 1938?

I have decided to make an inquiry into the arrangements in certain of the principal ports in order to have first-hand information of the present position. Officers of the Board of Trade will co-operate with officers of my Department in this inquiry.

Is the Minister aware of the importance of this matter, in view of the fact that foreign nations look to us as the greatest maritime country in the world to set an example; and is he also aware that for all practical purposes not one single port in the United Kingdom is doing anything in this matter except the Port of London; and is he also aware that the Port of London—

The hon. and gallant Member is giving information.

On a point of Order, Mr. Speaker. I have had only one other question to the Minister.

The hon. and gallant Member has already asked three supplementary questions.

On a point of Order. I happen to be chairman of the London Welfare Council, and I am very anxious about this matter.

I will answer if the hon. and gallant Member will give me an opportunity. He must realise that I understand the importance of this subject, seeing that I set on foot the inquiry. I should not like to be as critical of other ports as he seems to be. I have no objection to his praising London, but there are efforts being made in other ports. We will do our best to bring this matter to a satisfactory conclusion as soon as we can.

I can provide information regarding the other ports to show that they are not doing much.

I should be glad to receive the information.

asked the Minister of Labour whether he is aware that the North Eastern Housing Association, who have arranged to build 32 houses at Tow Law, county Durham, have notified the urban district council that the rents of the pro- posed houses will be on the average 2s. 7d. per week more than houses previously built; and will immediate steps be taken to prevent so large an increase?

The answer to the first part of the question is in the affirmative. The question of the amount of rent charged is a matter for settlement by the local authority in consultation with the Housing Association.

Did not the Minister of Labour state when this Housing Association was set up that the object was to build houses at cheap rents in the distressed areas? Here we have people who lived in houses which have been pulled down, and paid 5s. a week, and in these houses they will have to pay 10s. to 11s. a week. How can it be done?

The answer is that the purpose for which the Housing Association was set up is being fulfilled. I understand, on inquiry, that the rents would compare favourably with the rents of houses erected by local authorities and the Association in other parts of the county if the rents of all the houses built by the Tow Law Urban District Council were equated.

Was not an assurance given when this Association was set up, with the consent of the Government, that rents would not be above the existing level of rents?

It is not a question of raising rents, but of new houses being constructed.

asked the Parliamentary Secretary to the Board of Education whether he is satisfied that proper instruction is being given to the children at Highworth, whose parents do not desire them to attend at the senior school at Stratton?

I understand that the local education authority is considering the question of the prosecution of the parents of the children who are attending the "private" school at Highworth on the ground that they are not causing the children to receive efficient elementary instruction. In these circumstances I do not think it would be proper for me to express an opinion on the matter.

asked the Parliamentary Secretary to the Board of Education whether he is aware that on the decision being made to build a new senior school at Stratton in 1934 that Section 18 (1) of the Education Act, 1921, whereby public notice must be given to those concerned, was not complied with in respect of Highworth at that date; and what action does he propose to take?

The Board are satisfied that, at the date of the publication of Notices under Section 18 of the Education Act, 1921, in respect of the proposed senior council school at Stratton, the local education authority had no intention of making provision in that school for senior children from Highworth. The authority were, therefore, under no obligation to give public notice of their intention to build this senior school to ratepayers of High worth.

Does not the Parliamentary Secretary think that the building of a school greatly in excess of numbers, and to include children from other districts, against their parents' wishes, is contrary to the intention of the Act, and can he say what steps are being taken to prevent the Act being circumvented in other parts of the country in this way?

I am afraid that I cannot accept the premise of my hon. Friend's supplementary question. I may say that I intend to visit the area.

asked the Parliamentary Secretary to the Board of Education the daily average number of pupils transported from Highworth to Stratton during the past 12 months and the cost per head for this period?

I am informed by the local education authority that the daily average number of pupils conveyed by bus from Highworth and district to the Upper Stratton senior school during the 12 months ended on 30th November was 10. The average cost for conveyance per pupil for the same period was £24 4s. The explanation of this obviously abnormal cost is fully given in a letter received from the local education authority, of which I am sending my hon. Friend a copy.

Is not this cost the highest in the whole country?

I should be most surprised if it was not out of all proportion to any other cost. For that reason I have used the word "abnormal," and for that reason I am sending to my hon. Friend copy of a letter which will explain matters.

asked the Parliamentary Secretary to the Board of Education what were the reasons for altering in 1936 the composition of the Secondary School Examinations Council, which, prior to that date, was composed of 10 representatives of the eight university examining bodies, five representatives of the local authorities, and six of the teaching profession, but subsequently and up to the present time is composed of 10 representatives of the examining bodies, 10 representatives of the local authorities, and 10 representatives of the teaching profession; and whether he will revise the constitution of the council to accord with the original conception of the council as an advisory body, qualified to speak with authority on educational questions?

The change in the composition of the Secondary School Examinations Council was made, in view of the largely increased interest of the schools in the examinations, in order to give equivalent representation to the teachers, the local education authorities and the university examining bodies. My Noble Friend is at a loss to understand why it should be considered that this revision of the constitution of the council renders it less qualified to speak with authority on educational questions.

Does my hon. Friend really think that the local authorities are better qualified to decide on the educational value of courses in schools, than the governing bodies of the universities?

It is not for me to assess which is the more competent body, but the local authorities and the teachers are certainly entitled to a view on this matter.

asked the Parliamentary Secretary to the Board of Education whether he is aware that the chairman of the Secondary Schools Examinations Council expressed the opinion that the character of the secondary school certificate examination is no concern of the universities which, at the invitation of the Board of Education, conduct that examination in the schools; and whether the chairman, who was appointed by the President of the Board, in making this observation expressed the official view of the Board?

As regards the first part of the question, the letter to the "Times," to which my hon. Friend no doubt refers, does not appear to be susceptible of the construction which he seeks to place upon it. The letter was written by the chairman of the Secondary School Examinations Council in his capacity as chairman of that body, and not as representing the Board of Education.

In view of the fact that that letter was written by the chairman of the School Examinations Council, which was appointed by the Board, who signed it in his official capacity; and inasmuch as the letter does bear that interpretation, will my hon. Friend take steps to correct that impression?

I think, with respect to my hon. Friend, he has read into the letter something that is not there. The content of the letter was that the curriculum of the secondary schools, as distinct from the school certificate examinations, was no concern of the universities.

asked the Minister of Health whether he is aware that more than 2,800,000 school children are now receiving milk daily at school, and of these 460,000 receive it free; and whether he is instituting an inquiry into the nutritional standards of the families in the latter group, with a view to the raising of their standards of nutrition?

Investigations, including precise surveys of family diets, are being conducted on the recommendation of the Advisory Committee on Nutrition, appointed to inquire into the facts, quantitative and qualitative, in relation to the diet of the people, and to report as to any changes therein which appear desirable in the light of modern advances in the knowledge of nutrition. Similar surveys, with which, I understand, the committee are in close touch are also being carried out on behalf of the Carnegie Trust.

In view of the interest taken by the Government in the physical fitness campaign, cannot the right hon. Gentleman see that an inquiry into this matter is expedited?

It is also very desirable that the surveys should be accurate.

When the right hon. Gentleman is considering this report, will he also take into consideration the result of the latest experiments?

I think they are being considered.

asked the Minister of Health whether he is aware that the town council of Bilston is unanimous in desiring to preserve their own isolation hospital and willing to make any necessary improvements; and will he give an assurance that Bilston shall not be compelled against its will to be included for hospital purposes in a larger scheme?

I am aware of the council's views in this matter, which has been the subject of a public local inquiry. After considering the report of the inquiry I formed the opinion, as my hon. Friend is aware, that the inclusion of Bilston in a united district for the purposes of isolation hospital accommodation would be in the best interests of the public health. I have made a Provisional Order accordingly. The Bill to confirm this Order is now before the House.

In view of the public interest taken in this question, will the right hon. Gentleman be willing to receive a deputation from the corporation of Bilston?

I should have to receive counter-evidence from other persons if I did. I am willing to consult the hon. Member on the matter.

asked the Minister of Health whether he is aware that the Wirral Urban District Council has submitted to his Department a drainage scheme for sewerage from the Fender Valley; why there has been delay in dealing with this matter; and whether he will give an approximate date when the nuisance due to the lack of proper drainage facilities in this area will be abated?

This scheme requires the agreement of the Birkenhead Corporation to the use of sewers belonging partly or wholly to them. This agreement has not so far been obtained, but I am informed that the technical advisers of both authorities have now agreed upon a scheme which has been submitted to each authority. I am making inquiries as to the progress made in the consideration of the new proposals.

Will my right hon. Friend use every facility to get this matter attended to as soon as possible?

Yes, Sir. It was, however, a dispute between two local authorities, and that must take a little time.

asked the Minister of Health whether he can give the names of the register of the Nurses Central Emergency Committee that he intends setting up?

I regret that I am not yet in a position to give the information desired, but I will write to the hon. Member as soon as it is available.

asked the Minister of Health whether he is aware that many instances have recently occurred when cows that are T.B. reactors, after being weeded out from a T.T. herd, have been retained by the same owner for the production of accredited and ordinary milk; and whether he intends to take action to give better protection to the public health in connection with such cases?

Cows showing a reaction to the tuberculin test are not, on that account, slaughtered, since as the hon. Member is aware, reaction to the tuberculin test does not in itself imply infection in the milk of a reactor. The question of improving the standard of the milk supply of the country is receiving active attention on the part of His Majesty's Government.

Does not that show the absolute necessity for giving local authorities power to secure the pasteurisation of milk?

Has the right hon. Gentleman reached the conclusion that the tuberculin test for cattle is not reliable?

asked the Minister of Health (1) why the pension of 8s. per week paid to Arthur Sterratt, of 4, Harrowby Lane, Farnworth, for many years has been discontinued, seeing that there has been no change in the circumstances under which it was awarded;

(2) whether he is aware of the fact that, since the passing of the Blind Persons Act, 1938, persons who had previously been in receipt of pensions have been informed that they were no longer eligible to receive them and have been deprived thereof; and will he take steps to see that such pensions are restored?

The particular case mentioned by the hon. Member and, I presume, the other cases which he has in mind are those of certain blind workshop employès concerning whom it has recently been decided that the amounts received by them by way of augmentation of wages must be treated as earnings for the purposes of the Old Age Pensions Act, 1936, and, in consequence, that their yearly means exceeded the statutory limit for the receipt of a pension. This decision follows upon legal advice which I have received in relation to the relevant provisions of that Act and is not a result of the Blind Persons Act, 1938.

Can the Minister inform us upon whose interpretation the Act has been worked hitherto? Was it the same Minister?

I cannot say without notice.

Is the right hon. Gentleman prepared to implement his promise made when the Blind Persons Act was going through the House that no blind person would suffer as a consequence of the passage of the Act?

Certainly. It is not a consequence of the passage of that Act. It is the interpretation of the Act of 1936.

Can the right hon. Gentleman tell us how it is that until the Act was passed and other people were brought in, this interpretation had never been applied; and will he also explain how it is that the earnings of a home which are made up from the same sources are not treated as earned income?

That is, obviously, impossible by way of question and answer.

Owing to the unsatisfactory nature of the reply, I beg to give notice that I will raise the matter on the Adjournment.

asked the Minister of Health whether he will consider introducing legislation to provide that after a man has been a member of the National Health Insurance for 25 years and has attained the age of 65, he will grant the man's wife, if she is 60 years of age, the 10s. pension also?

This particular proposal will receive careful consideration when any legislation on the subject is possible.

Does the Minister not think that this matter wants attention, seeing that there are thousands of women whose husbands have been contributing to National Health Insurance for 25 years and who because they are five years younger than their husbands, will never come in for the pension of their husbands?

I have said that the matter will receive attention.

asked the Minister of Health whether he can give an estimate of the average age of widows now in receipt of pensions and also an estimate of the average age at which they entered pension rank, excluding in each case the pre-Act widows who entered by statute at 55 years of age.

The average age of post-Act widows who were in receipt of widows' pensions at 31st December, 1937 (the latest date for which such information is available) was about 55 years and three months. Information is not available as to the average age at which the post-Act widows are awarded their pensions, but it is estimated that, on average, awards of such pensions are made at about age 51.

asked the Minister of Health how many county councils do not apply the maximum grant allowed under the Housing (Rural Workers) Reconstruction Act; and what is the position in regard to Wiltshire in this connection?

So far as I am aware two county councils (of which Wiltshire is one), have made a practice of limiting the maximum grant made to an amount less than the full sum which could be granted under the Statute. So far as Wiltshire is concerned, I understand that the county council normally limited the maximum grant to £80 unless the dwelling in respect of which a grant is claimed has been the subject of action by the council of the county district or special circumstances are present, but that the question of altering this practice is under consideration.

Is there a tendency in both cases for the county councils to neglect the erection of working-class houses?

I think Wiltshire has done a good deal, but in this matter it is considering an alteration of its practice.

asked the Minister of Health whether he will consider the suggestion of the Welsh Federation of the Loyal Order of Ancient Shepherds Friendly and Approved Society, a copy of which has been sent to him, as to the need of legislative action to amend the National Health Insurance Act to incorporate dental benefit as a statutory benefit; and whether it is proposed to introduce legislation for the purpose?

I would refer the hon. Member to the answer given on 24th November to the hon. Member for Consett (Mr. David Adams).

Is the right hon. Gentleman aware that the system of providing differential benefits for the same compulsory insured person is creating great discontent in the whole field of national health insurance?

The right hon. Gentleman knows that the question of pooling surpluses would cause great apprehension on the part of some societies.

asked the Prime Minister whether he can give the names of the members who will constitute the Royal Commission that is to investigate the question of workmen's compensation; when is the Commission expected to meet; and when is it hoped to terminate the proceedings?

Yes, Sir. The King has been pleased to approve the setting up of a Royal Commission to inquire into the subject of workmen's compensation, constituted as follows:

• Sir Hector James Wright Hetherington, LL.D. (Chairman).
• Robert Reid Bannatyne, Esq., C.B.
• John Smith Boyd, Esq.
• Arthur Belcher Cauty, Esq.
• Miss Grace Drysdale.
• Reginald Cheyne Elmslie, Esq., O.B.E., M.S., F.R.C.S.
• Edgar Hackforth, Esq. C.B.
• George Alfred Isaacs, Esq., J.P.
• William Lawther, Esq.
• John Adam Lillie, Esq., K.C.
• Clarence Thomas Albert Sadd, Esq., C.B.E., J.P.
• J. L. Smyth, Esq.
• His Honour Judge William Stewart.
• F. J. Williams, Esq.
• W. D. Woolley, Esq.
• Mrs. Barbara Wootton.

It will be for the chairman to arrange for the first meeting, but I have no doubt it will be held as soon as reasonably practicable. I cannot forecast at present how long the inquiry will take.

Will the Prime Minister consider introducing some immediate reforms, such as increasing the maximum amount of workmen's compensation in the case of miners' nystagmus and silicosis, while the Commission is sitting?

The Prime Minister seems to have appointed a large Commission. As he knows, some of the reforms are extremely urgent and the Commission must have some time before presenting their report. Will he consider recasting the Commission to make it smaller and more effective, or introduce one or two of the more urgent reforms pending the Commission's report?

I understood that it was thought desirable the Commission should be representative, and that is the explanation why it is rather large. I am quite aware of the urgency of some of the problems the Commission has undertaken to survey, and I am sure they will take into consideration their urgency and will endeavour to expedite some part of their report.

Will the Prime Minister make representations to the Commission asking that one or two points which are urgent should be dealt with in an interim report?

I will represent to the Commission that on one or two matters an interim report might be made, but I must leave it to them to say how soon they can deal with those matters.

Can the Prime Minister say how many members of the Commismission are lawyers?

I think one is a lawyer.

asked the Secretary of State for the Home Department whether his attention has been called to the case of Lissenden versus C.A.V. Bosch, Limited, heard in the Appeal Court on 7th December, 1938, when each of the three judges expressed regret that under the existing workmen's compensation law the court was powerless to correct an injustice to the injured workmen; and will he take immediate steps to amend the law so as to remedy this injustice?

I have seen reports of the proceedings in this case, and I appreciate that the point raised may have to be carefully examined. I understand, however, that leave was given to appeal to the House of Lords, and in the circumstances it would be premature at the moment to go further into the question.

Arising out of that reply, may I ask the Prime Minister whether he is including this subject among those which are being submitted for consideration to the Royal Commission on Workmen's Compensation to be dealt with in any interim report which may be made?

On a point of Order. Have hon. Members the right to interrogate Ministers other than those to whom the original questions are addressed?

asked the Prime Minister whether all firms engaged in or eligible for Government work, whether head firms or sub-contractors, will have the right of direct access to the Panel of business men set up in connection with supply?

I would refer the hon. and gallant Member to the answer which I gave yesterday in reply to questions addressed to me by my hon. Friend the Member for East Fife (Mr. Henderson Stewart).

Is the right hon. Gentleman aware that many firms of sub-contractors feel that they are not given a fair opportunity with regard to the Government's rearmament programme and that their complaints in this respect never reach the proper quarters? Will the Panel be adjusted to meet that complaint?

It was because of that that the Panel was appointed.

May I take it that the firms which, during the last six or seven years, have had their applications refused, will receive new consideration if they make application?

Certainly, they can make application.

asked the Minister of Health the number of contributory and old age pensioners who are receiving public assistance in the West Riding of Yorkshire?

On 1st January, 1938, the latest date for which figures are available, there were in receipt of poor relief in the administrative county of the West Riding of Yorkshire, together with the 10 associated county boroughs, 6,851 widow pensioners and 22,789 old age pensioners, including those persons between 65 and 70 years of age receiving old age pensions under the Contributory Pensions Acts.

Do these figures include all the county boroughs inside the West Riding?

They include the county boroughs.

Does not this show the necessity for giving additional pensions?

asked the Prime Minister whether the speech delivered by the Secretary of State for Dominion Affairs, in London, on 13th December, relating to the future of the British Commonwealth of Nations expresses the policy of His Majesty's Government?

asked the Prime Minister whether the recent speech of the Secretary of State for Dominion Affairs, concerning the British Empire, represents the policy of the Government?

My right hon. Friend's speech, which was only partially reported in the Press, included a statement of various influences at work within the British Commonwealth of Nations, and gave the reasons for his firm faith that the nations of the Commonwealth will survive in co-operation together whatever crises they might have to face in the future. His Majesty's Government certainly fully share that faith.

May I ask whether, in present circumstances, it would not be better if Ministers confined themselves to dealing with matters of policy rather than speculating as to hypothetical matters?

I think my right hon. Friend's speech was a very brilliant and statesmanlike exposition.

Is my right hon. Friend aware that a large body of Conservatives who heard this statement welcomed it as a well-balanced and most helpful speech?

Is it not a fact that this report was based upon a single news agency report, and can my right hon. Friend give us an assurance that before a Cabinet Minister is going to make an important speech in future, all the leading news agencies and newspapers will receive an invitation?

Is the right hon. Gentleman aware that a good many people outside the Government do not think the British Empire is likely to survive with the present Government?

asked the Minister of Health whether the recommendations made by the district auditor to the Cornwall County Council for re-organisation of the highways accounts, including the separation of accounts for the operation of quarries, have now been carried out; whether the district auditor has made any further report; and whether, in view of the fact that about 20 county councils own or work quarries in connection with road works assisted from the Road Fund, he will ask the district auditors concerned to report on the methods of accounting in connection with these quarries?

I understand that the extensive re-organisation of the accounting arrangements involved in the district auditor's recommendations is to be made by stages from the commencement of the next financial year. I have not received any further report by the auditor. As regards the last part of the question, it would not be competent for me to suggest what matters the district auditors should refer to in their reports to the local authorities concerned.

May I ask whether it is a fact that, in spite of 12 months having elapsed since that report, there is still a complete absence of all proper accounts, and, if that be so, will my right hon. Friend make representations that the matter should be brought to a conclusion as speedily as possible?

Is the Council paying the wages recommended by the Joint Industrial Council?

asked the Minister of Health whether, in view of the fact that serious consequences are liable to result from fires in many old houses both in London and the provinces, he will consider introducing legislation to compel landlords to provide better means of escape in all such old buildings?

As regards London, any extension of existing legislation on the subject is a matter for consideration, in the first instance by the London County Council. In respect of areas outside London, I may remind the hon. Member of the power of local authorities to make by-laws under the Housing Acts for securing the prevention of, and safety from, fire in working-class houses. Certain other powers of requiring means of escape from fire in respect of special classes of buildings have been given to local authorities under the Public Health Act, 1936. I am not satisfied that any fresh legislation is necessary.

Does the right hon. Gentleman consider that the present powers are quite sufficient?

Yes, Sir.

asked the Minister of Health whether the Liverpool City Council have yet prepared a scheme of superannuation within the terms of the Local Government Superannuation Act, 1937; and will he, when considering such scheme for approval, endeavour to include workmen as well as officers in the employ of the council?

The Local Government Superannuation Act, 1937, applies to the Liverpool City Council and no scheme is required for the purpose of securing superannuation benefits under the Act to any employè. The question whether servants or any class of servants should be made superannuable is one entirely within the discretion of the council.

Is it not a fact that the scheme will have to be approved by the Minister, and if that be so, will he take notice of the latter part of the question and use his influence in favour of the workmen in the employ of the council?

Is the right hon. Gentleman aware that there is a differentiation, and that some men are classified for pensions and some are not, though they are in the same category and have the same status?

That is a matter within the responsibility of the local authority, and not within the discretion of the Minister.

Is the right hon. Gentleman aware that the council differentiates between two men of equal status, and classify one as a workman and the other as a servant?

If they did anything illegal, of course I could not approve of it, but these matters are in general within the discretion of the council.

asked the Home Secretary the number of fatal and nonfatal accidents that have occurred at the docks and wharves in the vicinity of the Port of London during 1937 and the nearest available date?

The numbers of such accidents reported to the Factory Department are, for 1937, 38 fatal and 2,188 non-fatal, and for 1938, up to the end of last month, 20 fatal and 1,961 non-fatal.

asked the Home Secretary what progress has been made towards establishing the fire-fighting research centre, under the Department of Scientific and Industrial Research, in connection with the Fire Brigades Act, 1938?

Preliminary discussions have taken place regarding the arrangements for the establishment of a fire research centre; and the amount of the provision to be made for the purpose of firefighting research in the Estimates for 1939–40 is under consideration at the present time.

Is my right hon. Friend satisfied that sufficient practices take place in order to obtain the necessary experience?

I am not quite sure what my hon. and gallant Friend has in mind. If he will communicate with me, I will look into the matter.

Do these researches embrace researches into fire-fighting on water, on the estuaries and narrow seas around these islands?

The details of the scheme were described during the passage of the Fire Brigades Act. The intention is to set up a research centre at Watford.