asked the Minister of Labour how many men over 65 years of age have made application at the Employment Exchanges to be placed in employment; and how many have been found jobs?

I regret that the statistics desired are not available.

Is my right hon. Friend aware that many of these people could be of service to the State if found suitable work, and could not the matter be reorganised to put younger men in the jobs for which they are best suited, putting older men in their place? I am satisfied that he will find plenty of men to do that.

I am constantly putting pressure on my Regional chairmen to comb through these men time and time again, and replacement is going on all the time, but I have not kept statistics on actual numbers.

Is the right hon. Gentleman aware of the feeling of a good many people over 65 years of age that it is wrong to sign at the Exchange because they think that there is some connection between that and benefit? Will he make it clear, if he can, that a man can sign at the Exchange for employment?

I will issue a public statement on the matter.

asked the Minister of Labour whether he will give the number of undertakings now scheduled under the Essential Work Orders; and how many people are now working under it?

By 18th July, 1941 (the latest date for which figures are available) 10,409 undertakings had been scheduled under the various Essential Work Orders, excluding the Essential Work (Merchant Navy) Order, which schedules the Merchant Navy as a whole. As regards the second part of the Question the number is large. It would not be in the public interest to give more precise information.

From the reports which my right hon. Friend gets, is it working fairly satisfactorily now?

I think I can answer "Yes." The industries, on both sides, were a little slow to grasp the right procedure, but, like every new measure, affecting so many millions of people, and introduced suddenly, one cannot expect it to work without some teething troubles.

Is it confined to businesses only; have public social services the right to make application?

Every industry that regards itself as essential to the life of the nation can make application. Those which do not come under that category can apply under the Protected Work Order.

asked the Minister of Labour whether he is aware that tinplate workers, rendered idle, are refused permission to take work near their homes and are being held in reserve for work which is not at present available; and will he make a statement of the intentions-of his Department in regard to these men?

Substantial numbers of unemployed tinplate workers have been placed in employment locally and there has been no attempt to reserve them for work which was not at the time available, though some colour may have been given to this suggestion by unavoidable delays in transfer which have occurred in certain cases. Under the special labour supply scheme which has just been introduced for the iron and steel industry the use to be made of unemployed tinplate workers will be a matter, in the first instance, for the Regional Committee which will operate this scheme in Wales, consisting of representatives of my Department and of the Ministry of Supply and of the two sides of the industry. Any unemployed tinplate workers for whom suitable employment in the iron and steel industry either in South Wales or elsewhere is not available will be placed on other work of national importance.

May I take it that if this work, for which they are reserved, is not available, and other work is available, they will not be kept idle?

I must give precedence to the iron and steel trade as a whole. I have approved of a scheme which treats the industry as an entity, and I must fill up within the industry first. If there are no available positions in the industry to which to transfer the men then they must be placed on other work.

asked the Minister of Labour whether he is aware that many women, above the registration age, are deterred from seeking work through the Employment Exchanges from fear that they will be sent considerable distances from their homes; and will he consider permitting them to volunteer direct to local factories engaged on war production?

I am not aware that such a feeling exists amongst women of the age referred to. Those women who desire to offer their services for local work should notify their nearest Employment Exchange, where full account will be taken of their wishes. I am not prepared to nullify the Restriction of Engagement Order by allowing direct application to factories.

In view of the desirability of getting older women into munition factories to replace men, would not the right hon. Gentleman try an experimental period of allowing employers to engage them direct, or them to seek employment direct, to see whether the results justify the step?

No, Sir. Directly I tampered with the Restriction of Engagement Order, I should get right back to the chaos from which this House desired that I should emerge.

asked the Minister of Labour how many electrical engineers have been placed through the instrumentality of the Central Register since September, 1940; and the cost per placing?

The number of electrical engineers placed through the medium of the Central Register between 1st October, 1940, and 26th July, 1941, is 404. I am unable to give the cost per placing.

In view of the small number of people who are being placed through the Central Register, could the right hon. Gentleman speed up the machinery and if possible, if he could spare the time, attend one of the meetings with the idea of speeding-up placing generally?

I will certainly look into it.

How many electrical engineers are there on the Central Register?

I should have to have notice of that question.

asked the Secretary of State for the Home Department whether he will consider modifying the regulations governing permits to persons to visit their homes in Northern Ireland, in view of the fact that, as the definition of home is restricted to the residence of parents, husbands or wives, great hardship is caused in many cases?

In my view the existing regulations go as far as is possible, having regard to the interests of national security, in enabling persons to pay visits to their homes in Ireland, and I regret that I see no prospect at present of being able to make any further relaxations.

May I ask if the right hon. Gentleman would not give special consideration to a case of this kind, of which I think there are one or two—an Ulster person working in this country, whose parents are dead, whose only home is in Northern Ireland, who may be doing war work in this country, and who, unless there is some alteration, cannot get back during the war on holiday or on leave?

I will, of course, consider any very hard cases, but I really cannot hold out much hope. There are not only shipping matters but security aspects concerned, and there are other Questions on the Order Paper asking me to tighten up security. Northern Ireland Members should make up their minds which way they want me to go. I must be pretty firm on security grounds. Still, I will look into the case that the right hon. Gentleman has put to me.

asked the Home Secretary, in view of the fact that insurance companies encourage householders to have the water turned off when their premises are left empty, as shown by the circular which has been sent him, whether he will intimate to such companies that they would be contributing to the safety of the public by modifying the stipulation in the said circular?

Experience has shown that serious waste may occur if water supplies are left on in empty premises. What is essential is that there should be adequate supplies of static water in all such premises, and it is proposed to require this in the Order shortly to be issued under the new paragraphs recently added to Defence Regulation 27.

asked the Home Secretary whether in view of the fact that there are innumerable cases where owners of unoccupied houses have not given access to local authorities, and because of the urgency of this matter, in view of the likelihood of heavy air-raids in the near future, he will give powers to local authorities to make forcible entry into houses where access has not been given voluntarily?

Wide powers of entry by authorised persons for the purpose of extinguishing fires already exist. Other powers are given by a new paragraph recently added to Defence Regulation 27, under which an Order will shortly be issued.

asked the Home Secretary whether he will publish the list of members of the Right Club in possession of the Home Office; and what supervision is now exercised by his Department?

No, Sir. I do not think it would be in the public interest to publish the names of the members of this organisation, or to state what steps have been taken from the point of view of national security. Appropriate steps are taken to watch all kinds of people about whom there may be grounds for suspicion. About many members of the Right Club there are no grounds of suspicion, and about many people who were not members of the Right Club there are grounds of suspicion. To publish the names of people who are being watched would be most unwise: to publish the names of people who are not being watched would be unfair. Secrecy is the essence of any system of supervision.

In view of the fact that it has been stated that a number of distinguished persons, including Members of this House, belong to this rather remarkable organisation, does not the right hon. Gentleman think it would be in the public interest for everyone to know who belongs to it?

I think it would be very interesting, but there is much interesting information in the Home Office which we really must keep to ourselves.

As regards the allegation that several hon. Members belong to this questionable organisation, will my right hon. Friend give an assurance that this is not so, or, if they have belonged to it, that they have resigned?

No, Sir.

Does that mean that my right hon. Friend does not wish to give such an assurance or that there are no hon. Members belonging to this organisation?

It does not mean either of those things. It means that I do not propose to give any indication of what names there are, or are not, on this list.

What is the difference between the Right and the Left?

asked the Home Secretary whether he is now in a position to assure the House that plans have been devised, and are being put into execution, whereby the activities of enemy spies and agents in Eire are being countered and their designs to impede the war effort frustrated?

asked the Home Secretary whether he is aware that the fullest information of events in Great Britain is still being despatched to Germany from the German Legation in Dublin; that there is a perfunctory checking of identity cards of persons going into Eire from Northern Ireland; whether the position has now been reviewed; what improvements have been made; and what further steps are being taken to stop this menace to the safety of Britain and to the British war effort?

If my hon. Friends are assuming that no steps have been taken to secure this object, that is an entire misapprehension. Appropriate steps have been and are being taken.

Is my right hon. Friend aware that this matter requires haste, and that a month has passed and practically nothing has been done? Is he aware that it is reported that there is a possibility of another pro-Nazi Legation being established there in the near future?

It really is impossible to discuss the details of this matter across the Floor of the House. It would be most unwise. I can only assure my hon. Friend and the House that every possioie step is being taken.

Is my right hon. Friend aware that I put my Question down to the Prime Minister, knowing that it was much too wide a matter for the Home Secretary? Can he answer the first and last parts of my Question, as to the safety of this country being imperilled by Germany being in direct touch with troop movements both in Northern Ireland and in this country?

I am aware of all that is happening. As to the first two parts or my hon. Friend's Question, I doubt whether they are justified by the facts. As to the other point, the Prime Minister thought, and I thought, that the matter was one for the Home Office.

Will my hon. Friend see, at any rate, to the tightening-up on regulations relating to the checking of identity cards of persons coming into Northern Ireland?

asked the Home Secretary whether his Department was represented at a recent demonstration at Grosvenor House of the use of Incendex for the purpose of extinguishing incendiary bombs; and whether he has received any reports with regard to the result of that demonstration?

The answer to the first part of the Question is in the negative; as regards the second, a report has been furnished by the producers of this substance.

asked the Home Secretary whether he is aware that, under the Personal Injuries (Civilian) Act, 1941, a Civil Defence volunteer who sustains a physical injury arising out of and in the course of the performance of his duties does, in the event of such incapacity lasting three days, also suffer in some instances a loss in wages of 30s., whereas, if he was compelled to remain idle for seven days his compensation would be £3 10s.; and as this is due to no compensation being paid for any period less than seven days will he take steps to provide for the payment of compensation on a basis similar to that of the Workmen's Compensation Act?

Under arrangements already in force, part-time volunteers enrolled as members of a local authority's Civil Defence services may be compensated for actual loss of earnings by an amount which, together with the allowance paid under the Personal Injuries (Civilians) Scheme, does not exceed the basic Civil Defence rate of pay. An injury allowance under the Personal Injuries (Civilians) Scheme is not payable unless incapacity for work lasts for not less than seven consecutive days. Where the period of incapacity was less than seven consecutive days and the fact of injury arising out of the performance of authorised Civil Defence duty was established, I should be prepared to authorise payment of compensation on the principle stated above.

asked the Home Secretary whether he is aware that paid wardens and stretcher-bearers over 38 years of age were called up from Stepney; why this was done; and whether he will take steps to prevent further dislocation of the Civil Defence services of Stepney?

I am informed that, owing to a failure in this case to adopt the procedure laid down for securing deferment, five whole-time wardens in Stepney have recently received enlistment notices. The appropriate deferment procedure has since been complied with in the case of-other wardens under 41 years of age. who will accordingly be deferred until 30th September. An enlistment notice was sent to one stretcher bearer owing to a misunderstanding about his employment as a full-time member of the service. Application has been made to the War Office for the release of all six men.

asked the Home Secretary whether he is aware that full-time wardens in Stepney are being paid by shopkeepers and others to act as fire-watchers while they are on duty; and will he take steps to put a stop to this practice?

It is clearly improper that Civil Defence volunteers who receive pay from local authorities for their services on the basis of a normal duty week of not less than 72 hours (or 48 hours if women) should, while on duty, work for and receive pay from other employers. If my hon. Friend will inform me of the names of the individuals concerned, I will take appropriate action. Inquiries to date have failed to identify the parties concerned.

Is my right hon. Friend aware that the whole of the wardens' system in Stepney is honeycombed with this sort of thing, and that it has developed into a ramp? Without investigation it is very difficult to discover the extent of its ramifications. Will stricter control be exercised over the wardens in Stepney?

Will my right hon. Friend look into the growing practice in certain London districts of demolition workers leaving work in the morning, after working all night, and commencing work with contractors?

Yes, Sir, I will do that. If particulars are given to me, it will be of assistance.

Is my right hon. Friend aware that I have discussed this matter with the controller at Stepney, who agrees with all that I have said?

asked the Home Secretary whether, before he decides to disagree with the Advisory Committee's recommendation in any case with regard to appeals against detention under Regulation 18B, he will either himself interview the detained person, or personally discuss the case with the Advisory Committee before taking a decision?

During the Debate on 23rd July I outlined certain of the difficulties which would be caused by the suggestion that I should interview detainees personally, and I regret that I cannot see my way to adopt this suggestion. I should, however, feel no hesitation in discussing any case with the Advisory Committee or the Chairman if I felt that any useful purpose would be served by doing so, and, in fact, cases are frequently referred back to the Committee for further consideration if I do not feel able at once to accept the Committee's recommendation.

asked the Home Secretary how many of the persons detained under Defence Regulation 18B still remain in prison; and how many have been sent to other places of detention?

There are 642 in the Isle of Man, and at the present date there are still 118 in prison establishments in this country; but the figure of 118 includes 75 persons of whom some do not wish to go to the Isle of Man and the remainder are being detained in this country for the time being for some temporary reason, such as pending litigation or attendance before the Advisory Committee.

May I take it that it is the policy of the Home Secretary in the future to see that His Majesty's prisons will be used only for those who have been tried and duly convicted by law and not for people who have been detained under this Regulation?

I think the House will know, from the policy I have adopted, that I am very anxious to remove ail these cases so far as I can, but I do not think it would be right to commit myself 100 per cent. to such an undertaking, because circumstances may arise in which it would not be possible. It is my intention, however, to try and do what the hon. and gallant Gentleman suggests.

Regarding these 600 who went to the Isle of Man, did they have the option of not going?

Not necessarily. The House gave me powers of transference to the Isle of Man. There have been cases where people have expressed a preference not to go to the Isle of Man, and that has been taken into account. I am quite willing to meet them so far as I can.

Can the Home Secretary say whether any persons still in prison are subjects of foreign Powers, or are they British subjects?

I would not be quite sure, but I think some are subjects of foreign Powers.

Can my right hon. Friend say on what basis some remained in this country, compared with others who wished to remain here yet were sent to the Isle of Man?

There is a variety of considerations, but I can assure my hon. Friend that he need not think there is anything sinister about the fact that some are here and some are in the Isle of Man. We do try to meet their wishes so far as we possibly can.

asked the Home Secretary whether he is now prepared to release from detention the Communist ex-deputies to the Czech Parliament, Mr. Gustav Beuer and Mr. Kreibich, and the other Czechoslovakians, of the same- political faith, now detained in the Isle of Man internment camp?

I am arranging to have these cases reviewed by the Advisory Committee sitting in the Isle of Man and will consider them when I have received the Committee's report.

Will my right hon. Friend remember that it is now six weeks since the beginning of the war on the Russian front, and that the men referred to in the Question are highly respected men, against whom, I believe, there is no cause for complaint except their Communist opinion? Can that be an objection now that Russia is our Ally? Arc-not these men our allies?

The hon. Lady has always felt strongly that detainees should be released, and I have held the view that they should not. I agree that new circumstances have arisen, and I am having the matter investigated, but there has to be an investigation before they can be released.

asked the Home Secretary how many non-enemy aliens are still detained in prisons, specifying the Regulation under which they are detained; and whether, in view of the long time that such detention has lasted in many cases, he will arrange that all, except those he feels able to release, or those whose specially dangerous character require closer seclusion, should be transferred to internment camps?

The total number of aliens of non-enemy nationality who are at present being detained in prison is 204. Of these 56 are detained under Article 12 (5A) of the Aliens Order because their deportation is impracticable or would be prejudicial to the national interests and their detention is necessary or expedient; they will be sent to internment camps as soon as their cases have been reviewed unless, in any particular case, it is considered desirable for reasons such as those suggested by my hon. Friend to detain the alien in prison. 143 are detained temporarily under Article 3 (4) of the Aliens Order and they consist of a miscellaneous collection of persons refused leave to land pending inquiry and a decision as to their ultimate disposal. Five aliens are detained under Defence Regulation 18B whose cases are at present under consideration.

asked the Home Secretary whether it has been found possible to give useful occupation to those, both British and foreign, interned in the Isle of Man.

Yes, Sir. More than half of the total number, approximately 4,5000, of men interned or detained in the Isle of Man have been found useful occupation inside or outside the camps. The larger number of these perform camp duties, but about 800 are employed on agriculture, land reclamation, quarrying and other work of this kind outside the camps, and 200 on industries established in the camps. A considerable amount of employment has also been found for the women in the women's camp and the married camp. Every effort is being made to find suitable work for those willing and fit to undertake it.

Are the Government aware that I am constantly getting complaints that Fascism is finding plenty of work for idle hands to do among the younger people who are not employed?

Will my right hon. Friend comb out the young women and other workshies and National Service dodgers who have interned themselves in the Isle of Man?

asked the Home Secretary whether he will indicate what liability has been put upon a local authority when goods from bombed premises, stored by it, are stolen?

Local authorities are expected to take all reasonable care of chattels which they remove from bombed premises and store on the owner's behalf. No specific liability has been put upon them to do more than this.

Will my right hon. Friend remember that goods are stolen, in spite of the care taken by local authorities, and that many of the people who own these goods are quite poor? Cannot something be done to close this gap?

To give an unrestrained undertaking about compensation would be opening up for ourselves and the local authorities a great deal of trouble, and I do not think I ought to do that. Local authorities do their best to take care of people's goods, and I think they deserve a vote of thanks for what they are doing.

asked the Home Secretary whether he is aware that an unpaid volunteer section leader in the Cambridge air-raid precautions service has been dismissed from the service without being told the charges made or given an opportunity to meet them; and whether he will instruct the local authority to hold an immediate public investigation into all the circumstances?

The engagement and termination of the services of Civil Defence volunteers is a matter for the local authority concerned and one in which in ordinary circumstances I am not prepared to intervene.

Is my right hon. Friend aware of the very exceptional circumstances connected with this case, that a good deal of feeling has been shown in Cambridge on the matter and that I am informed that the local medical officer of health acted on a misconception of the facts? Cannot my right hon. Friend make representations to the local authority to hold an inquiry?

It is a question of the relative importance of a Minister's duties, and unless a case is really such that it indicates that the administration of a local authority in that respect is fundamentally bad, I really think it best that the local people should settle the problem themselves.

asked the Home Secretary whether any reports have been received from the Australian Government as to the conditions and amenities in the new camps for internees?

No, Sir, but my representative in Australia, Major Layton, is in communication with the Australian authorities in the matter, and I hope to receive a report shortly.

Can my right hon. Friend say why the new camps were set up?

I am afraid I could not, but I imagine it was a matter of local administration.

Are not the Commonwealth Government and Parliament at least as enlightened as the Government and Parliament in this country in the management of internees? Does it not amount to an unwarrantable interference with the affairs of a self-governing Dominion to comment on their action?

As to the first part of that supplementary question, the answer is in the affirmative. As to the second part, it is the case that these people were sent out on the initiative of the British Government, and it is right that the House of Commons should be able to query matters about them.

asked the Home Secretary whether any recent progress has been made in discussions with the Australian Government for the release in Australia of those whose release has been authorised by His Majesty's Government, but for whom no travelling facilities to this country are available?

As I explained in answer to a Question by the hon. Member for the English Universities (Miss Rathbone) on 24th July, this is entirely a matter for the Commonwealth Government, and there have been no discussions between His Majesty's Government in the United Kingdom and that Government.

While appreciating that that is so, in view of the fact that these internees would have been released if they had been in this country and that many of them are young people who could do extremely useful war work, will my right hon. Friend make representations to Australia?

I cannot do that. We made a firm agreement with the Government of the Commonwealth of Australia that this was a matter for them and them alone. It touches the immigration policy of the Commonwealth Government, and it is quite inappropriate that a British Minister should interfere.

While I appreciate that fact, cannot my right hon. Friend represent that if these people cannot be released, they can at least be kept under less humiliating conditions? At present they are behind barbed wire and cannot see their friends unless they are accompanied by an armed guard.

I have no doubt that that is one of the matters in the course of discussion between Major Layton and the Commonwealth Government.

asked the Home Secretary whether any arrangements have been made for the continued education of the boys and youths between 16 and 19 years of age, about 400 in number, who were sent as internees to Australia in June, 1940, on the s.s. "Dunera"; and whether he will request His Majesty's Government in Australia to give favourable consideration to the release in Australia, for the duration of the war, of schoolboys and college students for the purpose of continued education?

Yes, Sir. Information received from the Australian authorities through the High Commissioner in London at the end of May showed that extensive educational projects had been in operation in the camp at Hay, and that action would be taken to ensure provision of the necessary educational facilities in the camps to which the internees have since been transferred. Equipment and books have been provided, partly by the Commonwealth Government and partly by a Welfare Society. As regards the question of release in Australia, I can add nothing to the Answer which I gave to the hon. Member on 24th July.

Will my right hon. Friend consider limited release for the duration of the war as a point to be placed before the Australian Government?

No, Sir. That would touch an honourable agreement reached between the two Governments, and it would have a repercussion on the immigration policy of the Australian Government to which that Government have always attached great importance. I am sure we should run the risk of creating harmful friction if we were to seek to back out of the agreement we made with the Australian Government.

Surely, my right hon. Friend will agree that it is possible to vary an agreement. Would there be anything dishonest in that, in view of the changed circumstances?

When the Australian Government consented to receive the refugees or detained persons, they did so on specific conditions, to which we agreed. Having made that agreement, I think we should stick to it

asked the Home Secretary whether he can now make a statement on the Fire Order?

I am not in a position at present to add to the first part of the Answer which I gave my hon. Friend on 24th July in reply to a Question on this subject.

Will my right hon. Friend be able to make a decision shortly? Does he remember that six weeks ago I brought to his notice cases given by the warden of Toynbee Hall and much on the same lines as the case mentioned by the hon. Member for Whitechapel (Mr. James Hall) earlier in Questions?

I can assure the hon. Gentleman that I am anxious to make a statement as soon as possible, but I think the House will agree that it is important to clear up amicably the discussions now proceeding with the employers and the Trades Union Congress.

asked the Home Secretary (1) whether he is aware that large numbers of partially disabled men are being deprived of their partial payment under the Workmen's Compensation Acts on account of the notional wages which they are deemed to be capable of earning being increased; and whether he will take steps to protect these men, who are deprived of compensation though their disability continues and is of a permanent character?

(2) Whether he is aware that workmen who are partially disabled by industrial accident and disease who take up suitable work in furtherance of the war effort are losing their partial payments under the Workmen's Compensation Act; and whether, as such loss of payment is continuous, he will take steps to prevent these men being penalised in this way?

I would refer my hon. Friend to the Reply given to a Question by the hon. Member for the Penistone Division (Mr. McGhee) on 24th July. For the reasons then given, I regret that I cannot promise any legislative action at present. I may point out that where a workman is suffering from a continuing disability he will, in the event of his earnings being reduced in future below his pre-accident earnings, be able to claim further compensation on the basis of his reduced earnings.

Does my right hon. Friend not agree that in the meantime these men are suffering considerable hardship? Since this is a bar to their undertaking war work, will he consider introducing a simple Measure to stabilise partial payments of compensation at the pre-war level, so that every man who is free to do so may give of his best to the nation at the present time?

This matter was carefully, and not unsympathetically, considered in consultation with the Trades Union Congress some time ago. As a result, we came to the conclusion at the Home Office that we could not deal with this single point without a wider reshaping of the system, and that was not thought desirable at the moment.

Could the Home Secretary not re-examine this matter, which is causing great anxiety?

It was fully considered, and that conclusion was deliberately reached after weighing all the facts. I do not think it would be fair for me to hold out prospects that the question could be reopened.

Is it not a fact that when a man gets an increase of wages, no matter how small, his partial compensation is lower as a result, so that he gets no advantage at all from the increase?

We must take into consideration what the basis of workmen's compensation is. I do not see how this particular point can be segregated from a wide range of others inherent in workmen's compensation.

In view of the public importance of this question and of the large number of people involved, I beg to give notice that I shall raise it on the Adjournment.

asked the Home Secretary whether he is aware that prisoners are confined to their cells for as long as 18¼ hours per day; and whether he will take steps to alter these conditions?

The hours for which prisoners are in their cells include the meal periods and the night period. The aggregate time is always long, but before the war every effort was made to shorten it by extending the working day and arranging for certain associated activities in the evening. With the depletion of staff resulting from war conditions it became impossible to maintain this policy, and in the local prisons the hours of association are now shorter than I should wish. In the convict prisons, where those prisoners who are serving long sentences are detained, the hours for which prisoners are allowed out of their cells are considerably longer than is suggested in the Question. Moreover, special arrangements have been made as regards young prisoners in local prisons, and I hope to improve these arrangements. But my hon. Friend will recognise that the special difficulties created by war conditions prevent the adoption of many measures which in other circumstances I should be anxious to take.

Will my right hon. Friend be good enough to look into the position at Leicester and consider whether it is possible to remove what are regarded by most sensible people as inhuman conditions?

Yes, Sir.

asked the Home Secretary whether his attention has been called to recent prosecutions of motorists in London for over-running traffic signals, and to their defence that the lights at some points are not visible on sunny days through want of cleaning or deterioration of bulbs; and whether he will direct the police to call the attention of borough councils to any signals at which the light is inadequate?

It is not uncommon for motorists prosecuted for infringements of automatic traffic signals to plead in mitigation that the lights are difficult to see in bright sunlight—the difficulty being usually ascribed to the present method of masking the lights rather than to want of cleaning or deterioration of bulbs. Traffic light installations are regularly inspected by police and any defects observed are reported to the authorities responsible for maintenance.

Is the Home Secretary aware that a number of provincial authorities show a fuller light in day-time than at night, and does he think it right that London, which should lead in these matters, should be so far behind?

It is a matter of degree and of black-out regulations, but I will consider the point.

Is my right hon. Friend aware that some of the signals, especially in London, are completely and totally invisible, and that it is really hard for people who want to be law-abiding to be converted into offenders by reason of not obeying signals which they really cannot see?

I gathered that my hon. Friend had in mind some particular signals, and if he will be good enough to let me have the particulars, I will have them examined.

asked the Home Secretary (1) who are the remaining 18 beneficiaries entitled, under the Welsh Church Acts, to receive the funds and property vested in the Welsh Church Commission by the Acts;

(2) the aggregate of the payments made, to date, to each of the remaining 18 beneficiaries, on capital and revenue account, respectively, by the Welsh Church Commission out of the funds and properties vested in the Commission under the Welsh Church Act; and what are the funds and estimated value of the property still to be transferred?

I am having a statement compiled giving as fully as possible the particulars for which my hon. Friend asks, and I will communicate it to him as soon as possible.

asked the Home Secretary whether his attention has been called to the traffic in domestic servants between Southern Ireland and this country and the abuse of the Home Office requirement of a certificate from an employer in Great Britain that employment was available, whereby often, when the servant has only been a short time in the employment in question, she has given notice and disappeared; and what action is being taken in this matter?

I have no reason to think that there are many cases of the kind referred to by my hon. Friend, but certain amendments are being made in the Regulations which will make it possible to deal with any abuses which may occur in the future.

Does, the right hon. Gentleman realise the serious danger of the matter as indicated in the Question? I have had instances brought to my personal notice. Will he see that the Regulations are tightened up?

That is the principal purpose of the amendments we are making.

asked the Home Secretary how many aliens serving in the Pioneer Corps have applied for naturalisation; and whether he will bear in mind the assurances repeatedly given to the House that admission to this country from Nazi oppression was to be for temporary transit only and was not to be a prelude to the granting of British citizenship?

It was found necessary more than a year ago to suspend the consideration of applications for naturalisation at the present time. Inquirers are being informed that it has not been found possible to make special arrangements for dealing with applications from men serving with His Majesty's Forces and that service in the Pioneer Corps could not of itself be regarded as a special ground for naturalisation.

Will my right hon. Friend answer the first part of the Question, as to how many applications have been made?

I am afraid I could not do that without a great deal of research, but I imagine that the number may be fairly considerable.

Is it not the case that the applications have to go through the usual channels, and therefore, must be available almost at once?

I will go into that further, but in any case there was some difficulty in getting the figures in time for my answer.

Is it not a fact that many aliens belonging to the Pioneer Corps are suffering great hardship, as many of them had their naturalisation papers almost completely through at the beginning of the war and many of them would be extremely desirable as citizens, and does not my right hon. Friend deprecate the malicious spirit behind the Question?

That is a gross misrepresentation— a wild statement that my hon. Friend ought not to make. There is no malicious spirit about this.

I think my right hon. Friend misunderstood me. I asked whether he did not deprecate the malicious spirit behind the original Question?

It is not in Order for an hon. Member to comment in that way on another hon. Member's Question.

May I ask

rose

May I not ask a supplementary question on a very important point?

There has been a considerable number of supplementary questions on this Question.

asked the President of the Board of Education whether all schoolchildren are now receiving full-time education; if not, what number are receiving no education, and why; and also the numbers receiving only part-time education?

I have no later information than that given in reply to the hon. Member for the English Universities (Mr. E. Harvey) on 19th June. Figures for the week ended 12th July are now being collected and I will send them to the hon. Member when they are available, together with the explanation he desires.

Does not the right hon. Gentleman agree that many changes must have happened in this matter since 19th July, and could not the figures be made available to the House? Are there still numbers of schoolchildren receiving no education?

I am glad to say that there is only a small number, under one per cent., of children receiving no education, and I think that is a very remarkable figure in the circumstances. I have told the hon. Member that I will give him the figures for the week ending 12th July directly I have them, and I will also make them available to the House.

Is the Board satisfied that the school attendance officers employed by the local authorities are able in the difficult circumstances prevailing to perform their duties as effectively during the war as in peace time?

It is my opinion that they are.

asked the President of the Board of Education what is the representation of his Department on the Joint Committee concerned with accelerating the provision of nursery centres?

A principal from the Board of Education, who has been conversant with the nursery centres scheme from the beginning, has been attached to the division of the Ministry of Health, which is administering war-time nurseries. In addition, one of the Board's medical officers and one of His Majesty's expert inspectors are assisting the Ministry in the work.

When my right hon. Friend has time to do so, will he reconsider the recent decision to transfer this work to another Department, as it goes against the experience of all the best workers of the last 30 years?

I am satisfied from what I have seen hitherto that the arrangements made are working satisfactorily. I have announced to the House the arrangements we have made in collaboration with my right hon. Friend's Department.

Will my right hon. Friend bear in mind that the people who have been interested in the question of nursery centres consider that the recent decision was a retrograde step, and will he also give a guarantee that there will be qualified inspectors?

asked the President of the Board of Education whether any State grants for higher education or scholarships at universities, and, if so, how many of the latter, are now granted to students who have declined military service?

Grants arc made by the Board to State scholars and to intending teachers in attendance at Universities. The information for which my hon. and gallant Friend asks is not readily available. The position of a conscientious objector has been established by law, and there are no grounds upon which the Board could debar them from State grant, or otherwise penalise them, so long as they carry out the directions of the Tribunal.

If I put down a Question at a later date, will my right hon. Friend be able to give the figures for which I have asked?

It is extremely difficult to obtain the figures, but I will look into the matter.

asked the President of the Board of Education whether he is aware of the unsatisfactory condition, supply and distribution of milk delivered to Southport schools, and of a report of the Southport health department which indicated that one sample of milk must have been stale before it was pasteurised; and whether any regulations exist which forbid the pasteurisation of stale milk?

I am aware of the difficulties which have arisen in Southport about the supply of milk to schools, and my Department have been in communication with the Ministry of Food, who have taken the matter up actively. I am informed by my right hon. Friend the Minister of Health that the conditions prescribed for pasteurised milk include a bacterial standard for the milk after, but not before, pasteurisation.

Will my right hon. Friend bear in mind that pasteurised milk is no longer of use for feeding purposes when it goes bad, whereas un pasteurised milk can be used in all kinds of ways?

asked the Prime Minister whether he is prepared to make propositions to the head of the Eire Government, aimed at removing existing difficulties which stand in the way of the closest co-operation between the peoples of Eire and Great Britain?

My right hon. Friend the Prime Minister has frequently made clear the attitude of the Government here as regards relations with Eire, and can only add that, in present circumstances, he does not see that there are any proposals which he can usefully make to the Eire Government.

In view of the situation which now exists, and following the fiasco of conscription in Northern Ireland, will the Prime Minister not seriously consider discussing with the Leader of Eire the question of removing partition and the problems which arise between the two countries?

asked the Prime Minister whether he will give an assurance that whenever the Minister of State be recalled to this country for consultation this House, if it is sitting, will be afforded an opportunity of hearing a statement from him?

My right hon. Friend the Prime Minister could not at this stage give such an undertaking as suggested by my noble Friend. Any proposal of the kind will have to depend upon circumstances at the time.

Will my right hon. Friend give assurance that so far as is possible the old constitutional rule will be observed, that a Minister, especially a Cabinet Minister, is answerable for his official actions in this House or in another place? That is a very important constitutional point.

Certainly the constitutional principle remains the same, but the noble Lord, in his Question, is rather tying us down to a particular date which it might not be possible to give.

Is the Minister aware that if many more Cabinet Ministers are sent abroad it will be necessary to bring some of them back to fill up the places on the Front Bench?

asked the Lord President of the Council what sums were allocated in 1938–39, 1939–40 and 1940–41 to medical research; and whether he will consider reducing, if not abolishing, this grant in view of the number of vivisection laboratories which have been closed since the beginning of the war?

The grant-in-aid of the Medical Research Council, exclusive of a special capital grant of £70,000 for Building in 1939–40, was £195,000 in each of these years. The answer to the second part of the Question is in the negative.

What use can these grants be if the laboratories are being closed in the meantime?

The grants-in-aid are paid by the Council to various institutions and individuals for research work. It is perfectly true that since the outbreak of war there has been some falling off in the amount of general medical research, but I am assured that that has been more than offset by work on special war problems.

Is not more money required for medical research instead of less?

Would it not be better to spend the money on prevention?

asked the Minister of Agriculture why consideration of the application for an increase in the minimum wage of agricultural workers has been postponed to November?

In accordance with the Agricultural Wages (Regulation) Acts, 1924 and 1940, consideration of the national minimum wage for agricultural workers is a matter for the Agricultural Wages Board. I would refer the hon. Member to the announcement issued by the Board following its meeting on 22nd July, which appeared in the Press. I am sending the hon. Member a copy.

Does not my right hon. Friend think farm workers are entitled at the present time to a little more consideration than they have been receiving, and is there any connection between this delay and the White Paper which was recently issued on price stabilisation?

As is pointed out in the announcement, the Agricultural Wages Board have proposed deferring consideration until November, but that will not prevent farm workers making use of the existing machinery for the settlement of wages. In fact an increasing number of counties have agreed to an increase in wages in the last few weeks under the ordinary procedure.

May I have an answer to the last part of my Question? Is there any connection between this delay and the price stabilisation policy laid down in the White Paper?

I am afraid I cannot say what was in the mind of the Board when they took their decision.

Is it not a fact that the Minister supplied the appointed members with the Government's point of view on that White Paper?

No, Sir, we did not supply the appointed members with our point of view on that White Paper. The whole Board asked, me for a paper, showing what were the real economic conditions of the industry, in accordance with the terms of the Act, and I provided them with a factual and entirely objective statement.

asked the Minister of Agriculture what progress has been made in preparing the scheme for the eradication of diseases in dairy cattle?

I am glad to say that substantial progress has been made towards securing the agreement of all interested parties to a scheme for the control of diseases of dairy cattle.

When is the scheme likely to come into operation?

I hope, in the autumn,

asked the Minister of Agriculture whether his Department is aware of the increased horticultural production secured by the process of steaming the soil; and whether he is doing any thing to encourage this process?

The Answer to the first part of the Question is in the affirmative, but it is important to realise that the treatment in question is concerned with the soil of glasshouses in relation to the tomato crop only. My Department has issued a bulletin specially on this subject. In cases where I am satisfied that the demand is sufficient and that suitable facilities are not already available, I am willing to provide, through county war agricultural executive committees, the necessary apparatus for soil sterilisation in glasshouses.

asked the Minister of Agriculture how many allotments have been abolished by the Birmingham authorities in the last ten years; and how many new allotments have been started since the war began?

I have no information that enables me to answer the first part of the Question. As regards the second part, 9,000 war-time allotments have been provided in Birmingham since the outbreak of war, including more than 6,000 by the Corporation direct.

Cannot the Minister obtain the statistics asked for in the first part of the Question?

I doubt it.

asked the Minister of Agriculture whether he is yet in a position to make any further statement about the reform of the system of agricultural education?

Yes, Sir. After consultation with my right hon. Friend the late President of the Board of Education, I have appointed a Committee under the Chairmanship of Lord Justice Luxmoore to examine the present system of agricultural education and to make recommendations for improving and developing it after the war. The other members of the Committee are: The hon. Member for Batley and Morley (Mr. Hubert Beaumont), Mr. W. J. Cumber, Mr. Ifor L. Evans, Mr. W. M. Goodenough, Dr. T. Loveday and Mr. J. M. McClean. I have further appointed Mr. A. R. Whyte, of the Ministry of Agriculture, and Mr. Ronald Ede, Secretary of the School of Agriculture, Cambridge, to be Joint Secretaries to the Committee.

Can the Minister give any indication as to the scope of this committee's work Will it touch elementary, secondary and higher school education?

Yes, Sir. I have told the Committee that I expect them to cover the groundwork of elementary and secondary education which forms the source of supply of recruits to agriculture. The types of training required by the various categories for which agricultural education should cater, including farmers, landowners, bailiffs, farm workers, land agents, agricultural engineers, teachers, technical advisers, and the extent to which the existing system should be modified or increased to meet these needs.

In reading the list of names of those who are to serve on the Committee, the Minister did not state the qualifications of the members for the task. Will he set out in some paper the qualifications of the men appointed to this important work?

The hon. Member for Batley and Morley is well known to the House; Mr. Cumber was Chairman last year of the Council of Agriculture; Mr. Evans is Principal of the University of Wales, Aberystwyth; Mr. Goodenough is a prominent banker and farmer; Dr. Loveday is Vice-Chancellor of Bristol University, and Mr. McClean is a leading farmer.

Will adult education be included, with special reference to experience in Denmark?

Yes, Sir.

Is it intended that women should take part in agriculture after the war?

asked the Minister of Agriculture whether any action has been taken by his Department to co-ordinate and ensure the killing of rabbits during the coming corn-cutting season; or, alternatively, will he consult with the Minister of Food with a view to decontrolling prices of rabbits during the month of August to encourage their destruction?

An intensive campaign for the destruction of rabbits has been in progress since the making of the Rabbits Order in March, 1940. The powers conferred on county war agricultural executive committees by this Order enable them to deal with rabbits at all times, and I am satisfied that the aspect of the problem to which my hon. Friend refers will receive the attention of the committees.

Does the Minister realise that owing to the dry season a large number of rabbits are now hidden in the corn, and that this is the best time for dealing with them? Furthermore, is he aware that since the Home Guard was formed the public have given up guns in answer to the appeals made to them, and that it is no use farmers having ammunition without guns?

If any men, formerly known as poachers, take part in this destruction, will they be summoned?

I do not know about that.