asked the Minister of Labour whether, in considering the proposals for demobilisation, he will examine the practicability of including in the first priority class those married men of or over 45 years of age having children of school age, so that paternal control can be resumed, in the interests alike of the children and their mothers.

Under the White Paper proposals, men aged 50 and over will be treated as a priority class, to be released, if they so desire, before other men. In framing these proposals, the possibility of giving some priority of release to married men with children was considered, but had to be rejected as impracticable, and likely to lead to anomalies. The fact that age is taken into account as well as length of war service will, however, benefit the class of men that the hon. and gallant Member has in mind.

asked the Minister of Labour whether he will make clear the position as regards demobilisation of men of the Armed Forces who are serving on regular engagements; and whether the provisions of the White Paper on the Re-allocation of Manpower will be applicable to such men.

The Government's plan for release from the Armed Forces as set out in the White Paper an the Re-allocation of Man-power, does not apply to officers holding permanent regular commissions on the active list of their Service or to ratings and other ranks whose regular engagements have not expired. Ratings and other ranks whose regular engagements have expired will be eligible for release under the plan in accordance with their age and length of war service. In the case of a naval rating, the term "regular engagement" in this connection applies also to the active service portion of a special service engagement; in the case of a soldier, it means his period of service with the Colours, and in the case of an airman, the regular portion of his engagement.

Will my right hon. Friend make these provisions which he has just enunciated very clear, and give them publicity, because I think the position is not understood by a large number of serving personnel?

Is not this only a White Paper proposal, without any force of law yet?

The question of the reallocation of man-power is one for decision by the Government, and does not need legislation.

Will my right hon. Friend represent to the Leader of the House that a Debate on this subject should be arranged soon?

asked the Minister of Labour whether the provisions of the White Paper on the Re-allocation of Manpower are intended to apply generally to officers as well as to other ranks of His Majesty's Forces, and, if not, whether further instructions applicable to officers will be issued.

The proposals in the White Paper are intended to apply to both officers and other ranks.

asked the Minister of Labour whether in his interim plan for demobilisation, he will take into consideration the early release from His Majesty's Forces of as many as possible of those who are enrolled as candidates for Holy Orders in the various religious denominations.

Representatives of the Anglican and Free Churches are in touch with my Department on this subject, and they have been requested to furnish me with certain information, which will enable me to decide the extent to which early release of the men in question will be necessary, having regard to the numbers who will be released in their age and service order.

asked the Minister of Labour whether, as a result of his consultations with the Minister of Education, he is now in a position to state the procedure under which schoolmasters may be demobilised under the Class B scheme of the White Paper; whether he includes them under the designation of individual specialists or whether he proposes to take any special measures to secure the early release of schoolmasters from the armed forces in order to help to bring the supply up to present and future requirements.

I am not yet able to add to the reply which I gave to the hon. Member for the English Universities (Mr. Edmund Harvey) on 28th September, regarding the release of school-teachers from the Forces under the White Paper proposals.

asked the Minister of Labour whether he is in a position to indicate the terms of demobilisation to be applied to young men directed to the mines, to war-time police and to others who have been directed or have volunteered for non-military duties.

As announced when the coalmining ballot scheme was introduced, young men sent to coalmining under that scheme will not be retained compulsorily beyond the date at which they would have been released from the Forces if they had been called up. The terms to be applied on release to members of the police auxiliary services and the Civil Defence services are being worked out in consultation with the appropriate Government Departments, and an announcement will be made as soon as possible. Other men engaged in non-military duties will be deal with under the arrangements for re-allocation of civilian labour which are under consideration.

Will the Minister see that that announcement is made at the earliest opportunity possible, in view of the uncertainty in the minds of many workers in these categories?

Will that include the National Fire Service?

I would like to have notice of that Question.

asked the Minister of Labour if full-time service in the A.F.S. or Civil Defence organisations will count as Army service in assessing the time for demobilisation from the Army or other services.

I would refer the hon. and gallant Member to the reply given to the hon. and learned Member for Ilford (Mr. G. Hutchinson) on 10th October, of which I am sending him a copy.

Will my right hon. Friend give me the gist of that now?

I think my hon. and gallant Friend had better look up HANSARD.

asked the Minister of Labour whether he will consider the advisability of introducing legislation to make the decisions of joint industrial councils legally enforceable throughout the industry concerned.

Under the Conditions of Employment and National Arbitration Order, 1940, employers are required to observe such recognised terms and conditions of employment in the trade or industry in the district as have been settled by representative joint machinery. I am at present considering what further provision should be made to meet the requirements of the post-war position, but I am not yet able to make a statement on the subject.

How soon does my right hon. Friend think he can make a statement about this very important matter?

I have negotiations to carry out with a lot of people who do not always agree.

asked the Minister of Labour whether he will arrange for compensating ex gratia payments to be made to officers employed by the Assistance Board who have been transferred daily within the London postal area to deal with the victims of the flying-bomb menace, and who have been denied, under existing regulations, any recompense for the additional expenditure incurred by them in the purchase of meals ordinarily taken at home or in their offices.

The officers in question have been dealt with under Regulations applicable to the Civil Service generally, and the Assistance Board advise me that they do not feel that the circumstances to which my hon. Friend refers afford any ground for giving their staff special concessions in the matter of subsistence by way of ex gratia payments which would not apply to other civil servants who may similarly be transferred from one part of the London postal area to another.

In view of the fact that the Regulations to which the Minister refers were never devised for the conditions which exist to-day, and of the fact that he himself insists upon workmen having subsistence in such conditions, could he not press for the amendment of those Regulations?

I understand that the matter is being discussed by the staff side of the Whitley Council and the Treasury, and I do not think that I ought to interfere with the discussions.

asked the Minister of Labour the present position with regard to the recognition by the railway companies of collective bargaining for certain grades of their employees; and whether the decision of his Ministry has been made.

My Department is awaiting information from the parties concerned which would enable it to deal with the suggestion that a certificate should be given with regard to the extent to which the Railway Clerks' Association represent the grades in question.

Am I to understand that neither side has yet sent in its evidence?

That is so.

Is my right hon. Friend aware that a difficulty has arisen from the fact that the railway companies' representatives have run away from the undertaking that they gave to this House?

I am not aware of that. My duty is to hear the evidence, and then if satisfied to give the certificate.

If I furnish the evidence will my right hon. Friend consider it?

I will look into it.

asked the Minister of Labour what steps he proposes to take to release or direct the necessary labour to enable the publishers to make use of the additional paper recently allocated to them by the Board of Trade and Ministry of Supply.

I cannot accept the implication that an increase in the supply of paper necessarily involves an increase in the amount of labour required for printing. Nevertheless, I appreciate that there are difficulties at the present time in supplying adequate labour for printing, and this general question is under discussion with the industry.

asked the Minister of Labour if he has considered the letter from the New Forest Trades Council, sent to him by the hon. Member for West Fife, regarding the case of Mr. Smith; and whether any action is contemplated by his Ministry in this case.

A summons was issued against Mr. Smith's employers on 14th September for failing to comply with a direction to reinstate him. On 5th October the employers were convicted, and fined £25, and £5 5s. costs.

Will the Minister not consider advising the prosecuting authorities, in a case of this kind, to make an example by putting one of these employers in prison?

That would be a very dangerous precedent.

asked the Minister of Labour if there has been any tightening of the scheme under which certain apprentices are deferred from military service to complete their apprenticeship: and for what reason.

The scheme for the deferment of apprentices was revised last May. Under the revised scheme, deferment may be granted only to apprentices in occupations in which men older than themselves are not ineligible for deferment, and only if the apprenticeship is an effective one, in which the apprentice is gaining adequate experence of his trade.

asked the Minister of Labour if he will give instructions that greater leniency in call-up is to be shown in those cases where one-man businesses would be seriously prejudiced.

This is one of the matters that I am considering at the present time. I must, however, have regard to all classes of the community if there are to be any modifications in existing arrangements.

Will the Minister take into account that the sacrifice entailed in many of these cases is shared by members of His Majesty's Forces, and that not only people in this country, but people serving overseas, are affected?

I think I have largely met this trouble by the decision not to call up people over 35.

As consideration is to be given to these men, would it not be right to give equal consideration to men owning one-man businesses who are now in the Forces?

asked the Minister of Labour if, to avoid an unnecessary increase in the number of persons temporarily unemployed owing to the reduction in the demand for labour for various war-time purposes, he will issue instructions that no more women who are not normally engaged in any gainful employment shall be directed to such employment in future.

My hon. Friend is under a misapprehension if he thinks that there is any general reduction in the demand for labour for war purposes, and I am unable to accept the proposal which he makes.

Will my right hon. Friend undertake to keep this matter under review, having regard to the fact that married women have homes of their own to look after?

I keep this matter constantly under review, but I must have regard to the fact that I have to start the normal life of the community as well.

asked the Minister of Labour whether in view of the releases from the Civil Defence services and the fact that a number of factories engaged on war work have had to curtail production owing to lack or orders, he will cease directing into part-time work married women of 47 years of age and over.

As I stated in reply to the hon. Member for Colchester (Mr. Lewis), on 5th October, I am considering the position of women in the older age classes with household responsibilities in relation to their position under the Registration for Employment Order.

asked the Minister of Labour how many prosecutions have been undertaken to date under Regulation IAA; and whether, in view of the improved war situation and its relation to industry, he can now withdraw the Regulation.

The question of proceedings under Regulation IAA is not for me; but I am informed that there have been no prosecutions under that Regulation, and I am not prepared to withdraw it.

Will my right hon. Friend be good enough to keep this Regulation under review, in the same way as the Home Secretary is keeping other Regulations under review?

Yes, we shall carry out the pledge we gave to the House.

Does not the statement of the Minister of Labour demonstrate that the Regulation is utterly unnecessary?

No, Sir; plenty of things take place in the street when the policeman is not present, which do not happen when he is there.

asked the Minister of Labour whether he is aware that many one-man businesses had to be closed through the owners having been directed to work in industry; and will he now consider the release of these men so that they may restart their businesses, seeing that there is already a redundancy of labour in many factories.

There are still urgent demands for war production, and I am unable, therefore, to give any general concession such as my hon. Friend suggests. Where a man who previously ran a one-man business becomes redundant, as a result of changes in production, and wishes to restart his business, it is necessary to consider, in his case, as in that of other persons who wish to return to their previous work, whether he is still needed for war work.

Will the right hon. Gentleman sympathetically consider applications for release in cases where the men were engaged in one-man businesses, and have had many workers taken away, and, though they themselves are able to accept contracts for war work, they cannot carry them out if they cannot get releases?

This matter is constantly under review by the Man-Power Board, but I am afraid I cannot give any general undertaking in reply to a question without knowing the actual facts and circumstances.

asked the Minister of Labour whether his attention has been drawn to the ruling of the chairman of a court set up under the Reinstatement in Civilian Employment Act, that Merchant Navy does not come under the jurisdiction of the Act; and whether he has any statement to make.

asked the Minister of Labour when he intends to introduce legislation to provide a right to reinstatement in pre-war employment for merchant seamen similar to that provided for soldiers, sailors and airmen under the Reinstatement Act.

asked the Minister of Labour if members of the Mercantile Marine services are in the same position as members of His Majesty's Forces for the purposes of the Reinstatement of Employment Act.

The Reinstatement in Civil Employment Act is confined to service in the Armed Forces, and does not apply to service in the Merchant Navy. For reasons which I expained when the Bill was before the House, I could not undertake to widen its scope in this respect.

asked the Minister of Labour in regard to the discussion which took place at the I.L.O. Conference on the recommendation of the desirability of paying the rate for the job irrespective of sex, if he will place in the Library of the House records of the speeches made by the official, employers', and workers' delegates.

I will place in the Library of the House a copy of three numbers of the provisional record of the Philadelphia Conference, which contain the report of the Committee on Employment and the discussion on this report in the plenary sitting of the Conference.

In view of a recent vote of this House, what mandate had the official delegate to oppose equal pay for equal work?

I must have notice of that question.

asked the Minister of Labour whether he proposes to report to the governing body of the I.L.O. the nonobservance by the Government of India of the convention concerning the employment of women underground, having regard to the provisions of Article 411 of the Constitution of the I.L.O.

No, Sir.

asked the Secretary of State for India whether he will now make representations to the Government of India to ensure the recognition of its obligations under the I.L.O. concerning the employment of women underground.

Six months after the ban on the employment of women underground had been lifted, the Government of India, in accordance with their undertaking, reviewed the position. In spite of all the other measures taken to increase coal production it remains much below requirements and the situation is serious. The Government of India were therefore forced reluctantly to the decision that it was not practicable to re-impose the ban immediately. But the question is to be examined again very shortly.

Does the Minister contend that there are not enough men in India to go underground, leaving the women completely outside? Is there a shortage of man-power in India?

The Government of India have made every effort to recruit male labour from other parts of India.

But is there a shortage of man-power in India?

Yes, Sir.

Could the right hon. Gentleman now answer the question I asked him about a year ago—whether pregnant women are prohibited from going underground?

As a temporary measure, women are doing certain work underground in seams over six feet in height.

Pregnant women?

Will the Minister answer whether pregnant women are prohibited from going underground?

I think they are, but I will make sure on the point.

It is absolutely disgraceful.

It is a crying shame.

Is it the case that a similar practice is going to be put into operation in this country with regard to women working underground?

No, Sir. As I have said, I am not aware that pregnant women are working underground.

On a point of Order. I asked the Minister a question, and I notice that he is evidently becoming so deaf that he answers the hon. Member who put the previous question.

Oh!

May I ask whether any attempt has been made to induce more male workers to go into the mines by increasing their wages; and may I also ask how much extra coal has been produced by these women?

Yes, Sir. Every effort has been made to secure male workers from other parts of India and from Government works in the neighbourhood, and I also understand that there has been an increase of wages. I gather that production since last year still shows a decline of about 4½ per cent.

Then the women have produced less than the men?

asked the Secretary of State for India whether he has any information to give the House as to the breakdown of the conversations between Mr. Gandhi and Mr. Jinnah; and whether there is any prospect of these conversations being reopened.

The reply which I gave to the hon. Member for the Combined English Universities (Mr. E. Harvey) on 5th October was intended also as a reply to my hon. Friend's Question, which has been deferred from that day, and I have nothing further to add to it.

asked the Secretary of State for India whether he has considered the effect upon the sterling balances now held in London by India of the Government's declaration in favour of the principle of non-discrimination so far as commercial and currency agreements are concerned; and whether the Government of India has been consultated on this subject.

As regards the first part of the Question, I would refer my hon. Friend to the answer given him by my right hon. Friend the Chancellor of the Exchequer on Tuesday last. As regards the second part, the Government of India were consulted about the Mutual Aid Agreement and the Currency Agreement and were represented by their own delegation at Bretton Woods.

Does my right hon. Friend realise that it is really impossible to make out, from the Chancellor's answer to my Question and from his speech, what the policy of the Government is?

asked the Secretary of State for India if he is in a position to make a statement concerning the general food position in India.

I would refer my hon. and gallant Friend to my reply to the questions by the hon. Members for West Leytonstone (Mr. Sorenson) and East Birkenhead (Mr. Graham White) given on 5th October, to which at present I have nothing to add.

asked the Secretary of State for India, if the quantity of food grains stuffs which the Government undertook to import into India in the 12 months ending 31st October, 1944, has now been delivered.

Shipments of the wheat which His Majesty's Government have undertaken to make available to India are proceeding satisfactorily and the whole of the quantity due for shipment up to 30th September is covered by arrangements already made.

asked the Secretary of State for India if plans have been made or are being made for the reinstatement of soldiers of the Indian Army on demobilisation.

Yes, Sir, this matter is dealt with by the Reconstruction Committee of the Governor General's Council and has been the object of special study in all its aspects by the Policy Committee on Resettlement and Re-employment.

asked the Secretary of State for India whether he is aware that cabled messages from this country to the Free Press Journal of Bombay and other newspapers frequently have portions of the messages deleted but without information being given to the recipients of the extent or nature of the deletions; and whether he will ensure that the censorship more reasonably operates so that only references of a specific military nature become liable to deletion.

While the Government of India have reserved the right to scrutinise any incoming message not only from the purely military aspect but in the light of their knowledge of conditions in India, I am confident that the number of deletions is in practice very small. The Government of India regularly intimate to me by telegram the more important deletions and the reasons for them, and this information is passed on to the individual correspondents concerned for their confidential guidance.

Is the Minister aware that editors in India do not know what is deleted, and that sometimes messages are almost incomprehensible? Could not that practice be stopped?

Yes, Sir. Information is supplied to correspondents here for their guidance, so they shall not make the mistakes again.

Can the editors in India be informed what deletions have been made from the messages which they do receive?

That would give them the opportunity of publishing precisely what they are expected not to publish.

But cannot they be told?

asked the Secretary of State for the Home Department in how many parliamentary divisions the returning officers are in a position to state the approximate number of Service men and women whose names have been placed on the register of voters.

No doubt the Electoral Registration Officers could get out these figures, but, as I told the hon. Member last week, I am reluctant to add to their work by calling for special returns at a time when they are under heavy pressure to ensure that their records are as complete as possible by the date from which the new arrangements will operate, and when fresh batches of declarations are reaching them from day to day.

May I ask the Home Secretary if he has inquired of any of the returning officers whether they can give an approximate idea of the progress of this registration without involving any great amount of labour?

I dare say I could, but it really is a choice between getting on with the job and getting much more done, and making inquiries in order to answer the hon. Member's Question, and, on the whole, I would sooner get the job done.

What method is adopted in order to get the men overseas placed upon the register?

They fill up forms which come to this end, and they are allocated to the appropriate constituencies and registered. I think that that is how it is done.

asked the Secretary of State for the Home Department if he will consider the advisability of introducing the necessary legislation to enable local elections to be held once more.

This matter is under consideration, but I am not yet in a position to make any statement.

Seeing that consideration is being given to the question of holding local elections on the Continent, will the right hon. Gentleman see that we are not left behindhand, in view of the fact that all over this country, for five years, people have not had the opportunity of selecting their own council?

I appreciate the hon. Member's point, but I am not sure that the circumstances on the Continent are exactly the same as they are in this country. In France, for example, they have no Parliament yet, whereas our Parliament has been running all the time.

Are preparations being made for local elections next April? The right hon. Gentleman might tell us that.

I cannot say, but I am anxious that when local elections come they shall be conducted on a basis which is representative and will give representative results. It would be premature to make a statement at the present time, but I am not unsympathetic to the desire that local elections should be resumed.

If legislation is introduced, will the right hon. Gentleman consider the abolition of the undemocratic system whereby aldermen do not have to present themselves to the electorate for election?

I am a county alderman myself and I have great respect for the institution.

Why not abolish aldermen altogether?

asked the Secretary of State for the Home Department what progress has been made with paying out increased pensions due under the Pensions (Increase) Act to pensioners in the Metropolitan Police.

Grants under the Pensions (Increase) Act, 1944, have been made to 2,750 Metropolitan Police widows and their children. 700 applications from widows and 7,000 applications from retired police officers are outstanding.

Does the Home Secretary realise that these figures mean that under an Act of Parliament which we passed last February and which operates from last January less than one-quarter of the applications have so far been dealt with, and will he remember in this connection that "He gives twice who gives quickly?"

Yes, Sir, an Act of Parliament may be passed, but administrative preparations have to be made. I have made inquiries and I think it is going with all reasonable speed. There are staffing difficulties; there has been evacuation, people are moving about, and often inquiries have to be made. I can assure the hon. Member that I want to get on with this, as quickly as I can.

Is the Home Secretary aware that at the present rate of progress it will be four years before this is done and that half the fellows will be dead by that time?

I think the hon. Member is being pessimistic.

Is the Home Secretary aware that it is over two years since the House passed a unanimous recommendation on the subject of police pensions, especially for widows, and that absolutely nothing has resulted?

That is another matter.

asked the Secretary of State for the Home Department if part-time unpaid A.R.P. wardens and other Civil Defence workers will on retirement be allowed to retain their greatcoats and boots.

asked the Secretary of State for the Home Department whether, when part-time members of the Civil Defence forces are demobilised, they will be allowed to retain their uniforms free of charge.

It is the wish of the Government that part-time members of Civil Defence Service, including the National Fire Service and the Fire Guard, should be allowed to retain the authorised uniform (including greatcoats and leather boots or shoes), with which they have been supplied for duty purposes. In the case of the Civil Defence General Services and the Fire Guard, the actual decision with regard to retention or withdrawal must rest with the local authority, which has bought the uniform with the aid of grant, but I hope that local authorities will give effect to the Government's wish in this respect and thus show their appreciation of the splendid services which have been rendered without payment by these men and women. In the case of the N.F.S., the retention of the fireman's tunic cannot, on security grounds, be allowed, and it must be surrendered. In lieu of the tunic, part-time members of the N.F.S. will be allowed to retain a set of dungarees. It will be a condition of retention of uniform that all badges and other insignia (except war service chevrons and wound stripes) are to be removed before it is worn on unofficial occasions. Details will be communicated to the responsible authorities as soon as possible.

I wish to thank the right hon. Gentleman for a very satisfactory answer.

asked the Secretary of State for the Home Department if, in view of the fact that some motor-cars use open or strong headlights, he will allow all motor-cars to use the same standard of headlighting in order to contribute to safety on the roads and to facilitate travelling.

The standard of lighting for motor-car headlamps is the same for all vehicles. As regards the remainder of the Question, I would refer my hon. and gallant Friend to the answer which I gave to my hon. Friend the Member for Great Yarmouth (Mr. Jewson) on 5th October.

Will my right hon. Friend consider that even if the standard is the same, the practice is not, and there is real danger when driving down the Great West Road and other roads where perhaps one car out of five, or out of ten, has a full headlight and all the rest have dimmed headlights; has not the time come when we can at least have lighting on the roads and so save some of the lives which we are losing?

I agree with the hon. and gallant Member that, if it be the case that some people are breaking our law, it is our duty to do something about it. If particulars are given to me, I will take them up with the appropriate authorities with pleasure and with energy, even if they are cases which concern Allied Forces. But I cannot see that it necessarily follows that because somebody on the road has blazing headlights, it would be more safe if everybody had blazing headlights.

Will the right hon. Gentleman take a drive down there and see for himself, as anyone who motors knows, that it is dangerous to have different kinds of lighting?

The right hon. Gentleman in a reply last week on the subject, undertook to approach the authorities on the subject of bright lights on lorries. Has he in fact done so?

I do not know that I did give that undertaking. If I did, we probably have done so.

asked the Secretary of State for the Home Department whether he is aware that women and children who, in response to the Government invitation to relieve the pressure on the official evacuation scheme, went to Eire in August under their own arrangements without any condition as to the minimum period they would remain are now being told by the United Kingdom permit office in Dublin that they must remain in Eire for six months; and whether he will alter this rule forthwith.

Instructions have already been issued to the United Kingdom permit office in Dublin to grant visas to persons who were granted exit permits to enable them to take refuge in Eire from flying bombs and who now desire to return to their homes in Great Britain.

asked the Secretary of State for the Home Department (1) what is the total number of men between the ages of 18 and 38 who are engaged in full-time duties in Civil Defence at the present time;

I regret that no recent figures are available, but in January last about one-fifth of the whole-time male members of the Civil Defence Reserve and General Services were in this age group. The great bulk of these men were in the Rescue Service, and over the age of. 34 Of the men in the National Fire Service about 60 per cent. were in the age group in question; but the number of men under 34 was some 25 per cent, of the total whole-time male strength of the service. It would not be in the public interest to give the numbers of men concerned.

asked the Secretary of State for the Home Department whether any decision has now been taken as to the issue of the King's Badge to personnel discharged from the National Fire and Civil Defence Services.

I would refer my hon. Friend to the reply given by the Prime Minister to my hon. and gallant Friend the Member for South Portsmouth (Sir J. Lucas) on 18th July.

asked the Secretary of State for the Home Department for what reasons the installation of klaxon horns as a local warning of the approach of flying bombs has been abandoned.

Klaxons were intended to provide a local warning in London for flying bombs when attacks were frequent and prolonged. Since the capture of the flying bomb bases in France and Belgium, the scale of attack has been considerably reduced. It has, therefore, been decided that the expenditure of man-power and materials required to complete the manufacture of klaxons and to instal them, and the greater expenditure of man-power required to operate them after installation, are not now justified. The siren warning is still in use and is, I think, adequate.

asked the Secretary of State for the Home Department whether any attempt has been made to estimate what it would have cost the State had they had to pay at current rates for the work done voluntarily for almost every Government department by the W.V.S.

The cost of administration of the W.V.S., in so far as it is borne by the Exchequer, is carried on the Ministry of Home Security Vote. The services of the W.V.S. to other Departments are a matter of direct arrangement by those Departments, and no assessment of their aggregate money value is possible. Indeed I should feel it indelicate to attempt to put a cash value on the fine work of this public-spirited body of British women. I am sure that all the Ministers concerned would readily acknowledge, as I take this opportunity of doing for the Ministry of Home Security, the great value to the community of the work of the W.V.S.

Is the right hon. Gentleman aware that his extraordinarily flowery tributes to the work of women would be far more impressive, if the Government sometimes backed them with material evidence of their appreciation; and could we know when the membership of the Royal Commission on Equal Pay will be announced?

That is far beyond my competence, but the Deputy-Prime Minister tells me that there is a written Question about it to-day.

asked the Secretary of State for the Home Department if he will now publish the complete list of members of the Right Club, the activities of which were the subject of police inquiries.

asked the Secretary of State for the Home Department whether he will now publish the names of the members of the Right Club, seeing that the hon. and gallant Member for Peebles and Southern (Captain Ramsay), in the statement recently circulated by him, has given his own account of the club and named certain members of both Houses as connected with it and has stated that among the grounds given to him by the Home Office for his detention under Regulation 18B was the subversive character of the club.

No, Sir. For reasons which I have explained on a previous occasion I do not think that it would be fair or in the public interest to publish this list, but I can give an assurance that appropriate steps are taken to watch any individual against whom there are grounds of suspicion.

Is the right hon. Gentleman aware that this club existed for the specific purpose of spreading anti-Semitism; and, in view of the fact that anti-Semitism is one of the classic weapons of Nazism and Fascism, is it not time to let the light of day in on the proceedings and personnel of this very shady secret society?

I still think it would be unfair to publish the list. [An HON MEMBER: "Why?"]It is a list which has been compiled by a private individual. It may be correct, or it may not. There may be people who went on that list, with or without the opinions to which the hon. Member referred, and to publish lists of this character would, I think, be an improper use of the information which comes to the Home Office in all sorts of ways, and from all sorts of directions.

If there should be any truth—I am not suggesting that there is—in the allegation that some hon. Members of the House, past and present, were members of this club and were supporters of subversive activities, is it not desirable in the public interest and in the interest of Members as a whole, that the list should be published?

If hon. Members were engaged in activities which were unlawful the law would have taken its course. If their activities were such that they should have been detained under Regulation 18B, they would have been so detained. That not being the case in these instances, it would be wrong for me to publish lists that come to me in a certain way.

Can the Home Secretary say whether Lord Haw-Haw and the convict Tyler Kent are still members of the Right Club?

That is a question which I obviously should not answer, having regard to the previous answers given by me.

With reference rather to Question 61 and on the general matter, will the right hon. Gentleman not consider that the circumstances are now somewhat different? The hon. and gallant Member for Peebles and Southern (Captain Ramsay) has now disclosed that one of the reasons why he was interned was his connection with the Right Club, and has described it as having close connection with the Conservative Party and having Conservative members. Is it not only fair to the Conservative Party to publish, not an inaccurate, but an accurate list of those persons known to the Home Secretary to be members of the Right Club?

What the hon. and gallant Gentleman says is one thing, but I cannot agree that that should bind me. One of these days I might be asked in this House if I will publish a list, for example, of secret members of the Communist Party. I am not sure that my hon. and learned Friend would say that it was right for me to publish it.

May I ask the Home Secretary if it is not the case that all, or some, of those who were members of the Right Club, were accessories to the theft of documents and to espionage carried on by Tyler Kent and Anna Wolkoff? Is it not right that this House should know who these Members are who were accessories to the activities of these two people? Will the Minister dare to deny that they were accessories to the theft of documents?

I think my hon. Friend is getting into rather deep water in relation to these questions. Of course, as he will recall, there have been some other people who have improperly acquired official information.

In view of the Home Secretary's tenderness to this quisling organisation, I give notice that I will raise the matter on the Adjournment.

On a point of Order, Mr. Speaker. As I, too, have put down a Question on this subject, I also would like to give notice that I will raise the matter on the Adjournment.

On a point of Order, Mr. Speaker. Is it in Order for the Minister to dodge an answer to my question by referring to another case where the offender was prosecuted? If the offender was prosecuted in one case, why is he not prosecuted in the other case?

He was.

That is not a point of Order.

asked the Secretary of State for the Home Department how many British subjects are now detained under Regulation 18B; and how many of these were members of the British Union, of the Right Club and of other organisations of a Fascist or other anti-democratic nature.

The number of British subjects detained under the Regulation is 114. As the hon. Member is aware, membership of the British Union is only one of the grounds of detention under the Regulation. The great majority are detained on the grounds of hostile origin or associations—many being persons who, though British subjects by birth in this country, also possess enemy nationality. Persons detained on these other grounds are not classified according to whether or not they have belonged at any time to a Fascist or anti-democratic organisation, and I am not, therefore, in a position to give the information asked for.

Is there any point in keeping the small fry in any longer, when the arch-traitors are released?

I will take note of my hon. Friend's wish that all persons detained under 18B shall be released.

Is it not likely that some of those detained under 18B are less responsible for subversive action than the hon. and gallant Member for Peebles and Southern (Captain Ramsay) whom he has released? Why does he make this distinction? Can he explain why distinction is made between the hon. and gallant Member for Peebles who has been released, and the others who are still incarcerated?

There is a distinction of some sort about every person released under Defence Regulation 18B. There must be some order of priority, and that I try to apply as fairly as I can. Clearly the reason must be that I thought it safer to let out the hon. and gallant Member for Peebles than some of the people who are still inside, but they will all be considered in due course. My hon. Friend questions whether I have been fairly administering the Regulation. I have tried to do so, and he must take it that I am forced to let people out in order of priority, which has relation to the interests of public security.

But would my right hon. Friend not be disposed to agree—I give him credit for all sincerity and integrity in this matter—that where an hon. Member is concerned, there ought to be no No. 1 priority but that he should be the last to be liberated because of his public responsibility?

The position of a Member of Parliament cuts both ways. It can be argued in his favour; it can, in certain respects, be argued against him. I can assure my hon. Friend that the issue in these cases is one of balance of consideration against consideration. I do my best and, honestly, I feel that the Regulation has been fairly administered and that it is right, in the circumstances, to release some people before others, and to keep others until later.

asked the Prime Minister whether, as four years have elapsed since the Battle of Britain, he will consider the granting of a distinctive emblem to be worn on the ribbon of the 1939–43 star, in a similar manner to that authorised for the Army numeral on the Africa Star, to air crews engaged operationally in that victory.

This matter is under consideration.

asked the Prime Minister whether he will arrange for periodical meetings between London Members and Sir Malcolm Trustram Eve.

Several Ministers are concerned in the repair of houses and the provision of temporary accommodation in London. I have arranged that my right hon. and Noble Friend the Minister of Reconstruction will meet the London Members. He will be accompanied by Sir Malcolm Trustram Eve and by the representatives of other Ministers, as necessary.

Will these meetings be repeated at reasonably regular intervals?

That is a matter for consideration. The hon. Member should deal with the Ministers on these matters.

Is the right hon. Gentleman aware that many of us have constituents working in London on this bomb damage who are also interested? Could these hon. Members take part also?

It is always open to hon. Members to make arrangements to see Ministers, and Ministers are always willing to see hon. Members. It should not be regarded as a matter which has to be the subject of special arrangement.

asked the Minister of Agriculture whether he is aware that the Gloucestershire Agriculture Committee is stocking and selling fencing wire; and whether it is part of the Government's policy to encourage trade through such organisations to the detriment of traders dealing in these articles.

Earlier this year the Gloucestershire War Agricultural Executive Committee purchased a stock of barbed wire and some of this wire has been sold to farmers. The question of the disposal of the balance of the stock is under consideration. The Committee's purchases will in future be limited to their own reqiurements. The answer to the second part of the Question is in the negative.

asked the Minister of Agriculture whether the list of firms from whom steel sheets and bolts can be obtained, issued by his Ministry, was issued after consultation with the trade; and whether it includes a number of people who have never previously handled such goods.

The arrangements for distribution which my hon. and gallant Friend has in mind apply only to a relatively small quantity of surplus sheets and bolts which were originally constituent parts of silos, the manufacture of which was arranged by my Department as part of the silage campaign carried out in 1940. The sale of these silos to farmers was entrusted to certain firms of general agricultural merchants who at that time were in a position to stock them together with component parts of silage. When the demand for these silos had been met, the surplus parts were made available to farmers through the stockists concerned.

Is it the policy of the Board of Agriculture to encourage the disposal of these agricultural parts to those recognised in the trade, and is the disposal confined to traders in that particular line?

In the particular case in question, the spare parts referred to having been lodged in the premises of something like 134 merchants, when there were. nuts and bolts left it would have been unsound economy again to have distributed those nuts and bolts to other dealers. I can assure my hon. and gallant Friend however that there is no intention of establishing a Government monopoly in these parts.

asked the Minister of Agriculture what steps he proposes to take to prevent the serious flooding of the river Ogmore and the danger therefrom to life and property at Bridgend; and whether he will arrange for officials of the Catchment Board to meet representatives of the urban district council on the spot to decide upon preventive measures being taken before the winter sets in.

I understand that a fortnight ago representatives of the Mid-Glamorgan Rivers Catchment Board, who are the responsible drainage authority, received a deputation from the urban district council and informed them that if the council were prepared to make a substantial contribution under Section 32 of the Land Drainage Act, 1930, towards the execution of protective works, the Board would carefully consider the position. My right hon. Friend would be prepared to consider for grant-aid under the Act any suitable scheme of works which may be submitted by the Board.

Would the Minister like members of the council and officials of the catchment board to visit the site and discuss the matter, because it is getting serious?

The catchment board are the statutory bodies who deal with such drainage schemes. I understand that they have already met the urban district council representatives, and I am sure my right hon. Friend would be very happy if they would visit the area and suggest a scheme at the earliest possible moment.

asked the Minister of Agriculture whether he intends to define the agricultural land that must not be used for building sites adjacent to towns and cities which are expected to have a housing overspill.

My right hon. Friend's rural land utilisation officers are in close and constant touch with the regional planning officers of the Ministry of Town and Country Planning. Full information about agricultural considerations, including the quality of land, is made available to planning authorities in order to avoid, wherever possible, the diversion of productive agricultural land to building and other industrial development.

Is the Minister aware that a good many local authorities are very anxious to increase their rateable value, and that there is a great temptation to use this agricultural land? Will he try to make this impossible?

My right hon. Friend, as my hon. Friend may be aware, does not possess powers, except temporary powers under Defence Regulation 51 for food production, to prevent the development of good agricultural land. But, by agreement with the Ministry of Health and the Ministry of Town and Country Planning, wherever the use of good agricultural land can be avoided, such influences are brought to bear.

Would my right hon. Friend do his best to make this information as widespread as possible? I can name certain places where this is being actually done, or is being considered at the moment.

I hope my hon. Friend's questions and my replies will get the publicity they deserve.

asked the Minister of Agriculture (1) whether he is aware that as the land-girls employed under the Ministry are recruited mainly from non-rural areas they are not as interested in animals as if their origin had been rural; and whether he will take special steps to interest new entrants in animals; (2) what proportion of the land-girls are able to milk; and whether he will encourage all land-girls to acquire this accomplishment and offer prizes for this purpose.

Special attention is already given to encouraging volunteers for the W.L.A. from both urban and rural areas to take up milking and the care of livestock. I have no information about the proportion of land-girls who are able to milk, but about one-third of those employed on farms or by war agricultural executive committees are employed as milkers, or on general farm work, including milking.

Will my right hon. Friend consider granting prizes, such as I have suggested?

I rather doubt whether that suggestion would be wise. If we start granting prizes to one section, we shall have to make universal distribution of prizes over all sections of agriculture.