asked the Minister of Labour if he will issue a full statement as to the working of Section 5 of the National Service Act, 1939, to include the number of tribunals set up, the number of applicants interviewed by each and by the appellate tribunals, the numbers under Sub-section (6), in one-year periods up to the latest convenient date, separating those who have co-operated by alternative useful national service from those who, in varying degrees, have not so assisted or complied with the terms of the Act.

As the statement is long, I will, with permission, circulate it in the OFFICIAL REPORT, and will send to the hon. and gallant Member an additional tabular statement giving the full and detailed information requested.

Can my right hon. Friend say now what is the total number of conscientious objectors who have been registered?

I think the hon. and gallant Member had better look at the official figures.

In view of the complexity of this question, may I give notice, Mr. Speaker, that I propose to raise it on the Adjournment for the Whitsun Recess?

Following is the statement:

Nineteen local tribunals (of which four have since been disbanded) and six divisions of the appellate tribunal have been set up to consider applications for registration in the register of conscientious objectors under Section 5 of the National Service (Armed Forces) Act, 1939. These tribunals heard applications from 58,780 men and 1,056 women. They ordered 3,430 men and 93 women to be registered in the conscientious objectors' register unconditionally, 28,591 men and 771 women to be registered on condition that they undertook specified civil work, and 14,628 men and 30 women to be registered as liable for non-combatant service in the Forces. The applications of the remaining 12,131 men and 162 women were rejected and their names removed from the conscientious objectors' register.

Many applicants registered in the conscientious objectors' register have since renounced their objections to military service. On 31st March, 1945, a total of 24,625 men and 732 women remained conditionally registered and of these 23,046 men and 583 women were reported to be complying with their obligations. Of the remainder 1,013 men and 65 women had furnished satisfactory reasons for not having complied, 498 men and 68 women were the subject of further inquiries, 61 men and 15 women were under consideration with a view to prosecution, while seven men and one woman were in prison. Up to that date a total of 307 men and 84 women had been prosecuted in connection with non-compliance with the condition of their registration. As the complete statement asked for is rather long, I am sending it on to the hon. and gallant Member.

asked the Minister of Labour whether in the light of the views expressed by serving Members in the Debate on demobilisation, on 15th November, 1944, he will consider giving some priority of release to prewar members of the Territorial Army.

No, Sir. Careful consideration has been given to the opinions expressed in the Debate on 15th November, but the Government adhere to the view that there is a real difference between service in the Armed Forces in peace-time and in time of war and that the only service which should be taken into account for determining the order of release from the Forces is service during the war.

Will my right hon. Friend bear in mind that many units of the Territorial Army were called into the field several months before the outbreak of hostilities?

On the age and length of service principle, I do not think any grievance will arise, as they were the first in.

asked the Minister of Labour with regard to the decision not to call up to the Armed Forces men now over 30 years of age, how many men would be liable to call up if the limit were raised to 40 years of age; and whether he will consider using such men for the armies of occupation and so ensure earlier release for those who have been serving many years in the Forces.

The information which the hon. and gallant Member requests in the first part of his Question is not available, but I may say that the number involved is small. As regards the second part of the Question, the answer is in the negative, as the decision not to call up these men will not affect the rate of release from the Forces.

Is my right hon. Friend aware that there is considerable dissatisfaction among troops overseas, who have a feeling that this decision is resulting in the prolongation of their service after many years of service already?

I am glad to be able to assure the men overseas that that is not so. It does not affect the rate of release to the slightest extent. I know that a good many newspapers and others have suggested that it does, and the misunderstanding is very easily caused. It seems to be a happy hunting ground for causing misunderstanding.

Does my right hon. Friend appreciate that many men in the Services over the age of 40 feel they have now to go on serving overseas when many younger men, who have been in reserved occupations, are going to escape military service altogether; and they feel it is time the younger men took their part in military service?

I can assure the hon. and gallant Member that that is not so. There is no person of these ages who will be kept a moment longer in the Services because of this decision.

Is my right hon. Friend aware that many of the men referred to in the Question desire most ardently to serve in the Forces and would welcome a relaxation of this decision?

We would welcome them as volunteers if they showed signs. This is a question of calling up.

Would they be accepted as volunteers?

We cannot have a Debate on this Question.

asked the Minister of Labour whether he is aware that the decision not to call up new recruits to the Forces over the age of 31 years will react adversely upon the prospects of demobilisation of those at present in the Forces and is particularly resented by men over the age of 31 years who are at present being transferred into the Army from the R.A.F.; and whether he is prepared to revise this decision.

asked the Minister of Labour whether he is aware of the dissatisfaction caused by the fact that men over 40 years of age, and who have already served abroad, are now being drafted to the Far East, while men of 30 and over who have not yet been called to military service have now been exempted; and if he will take steps to allay this discontent by releasing the over 40's and calling up the 30's.

asked the Minister of Labour whether he is aware that the recent decision of the Government to restrict, after 1st May, the calling up of men to the Forces to those under 31 years of age has caused grave dissatisfaction to Servicemen who are above that age; and will be take steps to see that the return of these men to civil life is not delayed through this decision.

I am glad of this opportunity of correcting any impression in the minds of the older men in the Services that the decision to restrict the calling up of men to those under 31 years of age as from 1st May will retard release from the Forces under the reallocation scheme. The number of releases will, in fact, be the maximum consistent with operational requirements and with transport and accommodation facilities, and will not be affected by the decison not to call up men over 30. As regards the drafting of older men to service in the Far East, I would refer my hon. Friends to the reply given by the Prime Minister to the hon. Member for Cheltenham (Mr. Lipson) on 10th April and to the reply given by my right hon. Friend the Secretary of State for War to the hon. Member for Twickenham (Mr. Keeling) on 1st May.

If these operational requirements could be carried out by younger men who have not been called up, would not that necessarily mean that the older ones would be released more rapidly?

The number of men under 31 who will be available is in excess of the training facilities that the Army has, and in any case they could not be trained and got out to the Far East in time. Therefore the decision to restrict to 31 was made because the numbers available to meet the release and to meet the estimated occupation forces in Germany can be supplied by the younger ages.

How does the right hon. Gentleman explain the purely mathematical position that, if the intake is reduced, the period of those already in is not increased?

The intake is not reduced. The Army can take in so many people to train, and the numbers that they can take in can be made available out of the age groups below 31.

asked the Minister of Labour if a soldier, who in civil life was a master builder, will be allowed, if given priority release under Scheme B, to resume business on his own account or will he be liable to be directed to work for somebody else.

The object of releasing building workers in Class B is to supplement the labour force available for build- ing houses and it is an essential condition of the scheme that the men released shall be directed to work where their services are most urgently required for this purpose. No guarantee can, therefore, be given that a man would be allowed to resume business on his own account.

asked the Minister of Labour whether, in view of the slight relaxation of direction into factories of young women that may be effected in the near future, the domestic needs of our hospitals can have priority; and whether he is aware that the strain of over-work on nurses is having serious repercussions; and if he is in consultation with the Minister of Health on this matter.

High priority is already given to the supply of domestic workers in hospitals. As to the steps I have taken to assist hospitals to obtain domestic workers, I would refer my hon. and gallant Friend to the reply I gave to the hon. and gallant Member for Wellingborough (Wing-Commander James) on 7th December, 1944, a copy of which I am sending to him. Hospital staffing—both domestic and nursing—is a subject on which I am frequently in consultation with my right hon. Friend the Minister of Health.

asked the Minister of Labour the number of prosecutions of employers who have refused to reinstate workers when directed by the Board of Appeal; and will he give the figures for the mining industry.

Up to 30th April, 1945, 63 prosecutions (including two in the coalmining industry) were brought in England and Wales against employers either for terminating the employment of workers without the permission of a National Service Officer or for failing to comply with the directions of a National Service Officer to reinstate. I regret that information as to the number of prosecutions in these two classes is not readily available and the time necessary to extract it from the records would not be justified.

What steps are taken when trouble arises to institute prosecutions? Is my right hon. Friend aware that there is a feeling among the workers that he is hard on one side and not very hard on the other?

I really have been moderate on both sides. I have not rushed into prosecutions without trying to settle these things, whether the man has been wrong or the employer wrong. I have used the sanction as a very last resource in all cases.

In how many cases were employers convicted?

I would want notice of that question.

asked the Minister of Labour if he will make a statement on the arrangements that have been made for the establishment of regional appointments offices in the principal regional areas; and if wide publicity is being given to the valuable opportunities thus afforded to retired officers of the fighting Services.

Thirteen appointments offices have now been established in the principal regional areas, one in each of the 11 cities or towns where there is a regional office of the Ministry and one each in Liverpool and Glasgow. In addition to the information contained in the recently issued handbook "Release and Resettlement," the attention of officers retiring from the fighting Services is specially drawn to the facilities offered by my Appointments Department.

Has my right hon. Friend received a report from Birmingham on the valuable work done in the West Midlands area by the Appointments Office?

Yes. I get fortnightly reports from Birmingham and all the other offices, which I go through. I think the Department is becoming known, and the placings have been on the whole very good.

asked the Minister of Labour when the Report of Miss Markham and Miss Hancock on the future proposals for domestic service will be published.

As I have alreay informed my hon. Friend I have been considering this report in conjunction with my colleagues. I had hoped to be able to make a statement of the Government's proposals concurrently with the publication of the report. As, however, I am not yet in a position to make any announcement I have decided to publish the report forthwith.

asked the Minister of Labour how many men now under 40 years of age who would have been liable to service in the Armed Forces but for having been in a reserved occupation, have now been de-reserved; and how many of these would now have been called up to the Armed Forces but for the decision to limit future calls-up to men under 30 years of age.

I regret that the information is not available.

Does my right hon. Friend agree that the effect of this decision is that large numbers of young men, between 25 and 30 at the outbreak of the war, who would otherwise be now liable to military service, have never been engaged in military service at all?

The men have been where they were told to be. They have not had their freedom any more than persons in the Army. Perhaps the hon. and gallant Member will await the answer to another Question on this matter in a moment or two.

asked the Minister of Labour whether he has yet appointed the chairman and directors of the Disabled Persons Employment Corporation, Limited.

Yes, Sir. The appointments to the board of directors have now been made. I will, with permission, circulate particulars, together with a brief note on the scope and functions of the Corporation, in the OFFICIAL REPORT. The House will, however, wish to know that I have been fortunate in securing the services of my right hon. Friend Viscount Portal, as Chairman.

Following is the statement:

The following persons have been appointed by the Minister of Labour and National Service to be members of the board of directors of the Disabled Persons Employment Corporation, Limited:

The Viscount Portal, P.C., D.S.O., M.V.O. (Chairman);

Brigadier-General Atwell Charles Baylay, C.B.E., D.S.O.;

Major Sir Jack Benn Brunel Cohen;

Samuel Courtauld, Esq., D.Lit.;

Miss Caroline Harriett Haslett, C.B.E.;

George Alfred Isaacs, Esq., J.P., M.P.;

Lieut.-General Sir Ronald Morce Weeks, K.C.B., C.B.E., D.S.O., M.C., T.D.;

Frank Wolstencroft, Esq.

The undermentioned has been appointed by the Minister of Labour and National Service, in agreement with His Majesty's Treasury, to be the Financial Director of the Corporation:

Sydney Herbert George Hughes, Esq., C.B., C.B.E.

The appointments are for a period of three years.

The Corporation is a public company, incorporated under the Companies Act, 1929, required by its constitution to apply its profits, if any, or other income in promoting the objects for which it was formed, and prohibited from paying any dividend to its members.

The function assigned to the Corporation by Section 15 of the Disabled Persons (Employment) Act, 1944, is to make special provision for registered disabled persons who, by reason of the nature or severity of their disablement, are unlikely to obtain employment or work on their own account except under special conditions. In carrying out this function the Corporation will take account of, and where necessary supplement, the work of voluntary organisations and other nonprofit making bodies already providing facilities for this class of disabled persons and also of local authorities who make similar provision in the exercise of their Statutory powers. The measures and methods which the Corporation will adopt will depend largely upon the nature and extent of the field to be covered and this will not be precisely known until the register of disabled persons has been compiled. Its powers are, however, wide enough to cover, for example, the provision of special workshops, the provision of hostel accommodation linked with these workshops, and the provision of special facilities for home-workers.

asked the Minister of Labour what addition to the cost of living will, according to his information, result from the increase of three shillings and sixpence per ton on the price of fuel.

If the prices of other commodities remain unchanged, the effect of an increase of 3s. 6d. a ton in the retail prices of coal and coke, with an equivalent increase in the prices per cwt. would be to raise the official cost-of-living index by nearly three-fourths of a point.

asked the Secretary of State for India whether he is now in a position to state how many members of the Indian Legislative Assembly are serving terms of imprisonment; and of those released, how many are precluded from attending or speaking in the Assembly and for what period it is intended that this disability shall persist.

Yes, Sir. None of the 200 members of the Central Legislature is serving a term of imprisonment. One member of the Council of State and three members of the Legislative Assembly are at present under detention. Of the three members who have been released from detention, none is precluded from attending or speaking in the House.

Is my right hon. Friend satisfied that no change of policy is warranted in this regard?

The matter is continuously under the review of the authorities in India.

asked the Secretary of State for India the extent and nature of the epidemic in Bengal, with particular reference to cholera; how far Calcutta is affected; and what measures are being taken to deal with this.

The incidence of cholera in Bengal as a whole has during the past year been below normal, but I have seen recent Press reports of a cholera epidemic in Calcutta and have asked the authorities for a report. Smallpox has been not very greatly above normal and very much below the corresponding figure for last year. Malaria which has been for some time above the average has recently been improving.

When is the right hon. Gentleman likely to have a report regarding the outbreak of the disease in Calcutta?

I cannot say, but I have asked for it.

asked the Secretary of State for India whether famine conditions now obtain in Malabar and the Northern Sirkars; and which districts are affected by cholera and by malaria.

The answer to the first part of the Question is in the negative. The food situation in Malabar and Northern Madras had given rise to some anxiety but the Government of India have been able to alleviate the situation by internal movement of foodgrains, and the Government of Madras have introduced systems of rationing throughout the heavily deficit areas which are reported to be working satisfactorily. The latest reports are that the food situation in Madras province remains fairly satisfactory. Malaria unfortunately is endemic throughout India. I have had no report of any epidemic of cholera in Madras.

asked the Secretary of State for the Home Department if he is aware that many persons, such as evacuees returning home from reception areas and mobile training trade workers concentrated in London, may be living away from the place for which they are registered as electors at the time of the General Election and will thus be unable to vote; that a very short time was allowed for applications to go on the absent voters' list and this process received little publicity; and if he will appoint another day for applications to go on the absent voters' list, make forms of application readily available to the public, and give the matter wide publicity.

asked the Secretary of State for the Home Department whether he can take any, steps to provide that men living away from home by reason of their occupation such as the considerable number of building workers in London, who did not make application before 9th April to be placed on the May electoral register, will have an opportunity of voting at a General Election held before publication of the next register on 15th October.

As I have already indicated consideration is being given to the question whether any modification of the existing arrangements in respect of the May Register is possible to meet the circumstances referred to in these two Questions, but unhappily I am doubtful about the prospects, and I am not yet in a position to make a statement.

Will the right hon. Gentleman consider publishing the May register as arranged and at some future date a supplement to the absent voters' list?

That will be considered among other possibilities, but the registration machinery is working under very great difficulties and they have to go forward with the October register afterwards. I admit that there will be imperfections about the May register. I cannot help it, but I will do my best to make it as perfect as possible.

While appreciating the difficulties of the situation, may I ask if my right hon. Friend is aware that, unless some alteration is made, hundreds of thousands of electors will not be able to register their votes at an election held before the middle of October? It is a very serious situation.

I should not like to commit myself to my hon. Friend's figure, but I admit that there will be material imperfections and I am not happy about it. I can only say that I will do my best in the circumstances, which must inevitably be difficult in total war when a lot of the population has been pushed about.

If I introduce a one Clause Bill, will the Government give it support?

I have not the least idea, but I should not have thought my hon. Friend would have any chance to introduce any Bill at all.

Would it not be possible to make some arrangement by which an elector who has left the area in which he has been living could apply for transference of his registration to his own home?

That has been considered, but the business of giving large numbers of electors an option as to where they are going to vote, opens up possibilities of abuse.

Is it not possible that the May register will not be required at all, and that it is the October register which will be required?

That question should be addressed to the Prime Minister.

asked the Secretary of State for the Home Department whether he has given consideration to the position of patients in hospitals, especially ex-Servicemen, who are unable to vote by proxy at any election; and whether arrangements will be considered to enable such patients to vote by proxy in any contest for the district in which they normally reside.

All hospital patients in this country who are on the Service Register are entitled to appoint a proxy or to apply to vote by post in respect of the constituency containing the address to which they have declared. As regards civilians who are physically incapacitated, I would refer my hon. and gallant Friend to the reply given on the 1st March to my hon. and gallant Friend the Member for the Hartlepools (Colonel Green well).

Is my right hon. Friend aware that many ex-Servicemen, who are no longer on the register, are detained in hospital on account of injury or disability, and that under present conditions they have no chance of voting by proxy?

That point, as I said to the hon. and gallant Member for The Hartlepools (Colonel Greenwell), is under consideration, and while I cannot be sure, I hope it will be possible to cover it by legislation.

asked the Secretary of State for the Home Department whether, in view of the large numbers of people long resident in the Chelmsford division who found that their names had been omitted from the register, he will consider the advisability, either by Bill or regulation, of extending the time during which such people can have their names placed either on the original or on a supplementary register.

As the hon. and gallant Member is aware, the register of electors has been prepared from information furnished by national registration offices. In an electorate of about 30,000,000, it is inevitable that there should be some omissions from the register, and I have been informed that some persons were, for this reason, unable to vote in Chelmsford, but I have at present no reason for supposing that the number of omissions generally is sufficient to justify the special steps proposed. I am, however, considering whether any steps can be taken to remedy defects in the May register.

Is my right hon. Friend aware that the figure is something near five per cent., and that does represent a very serious omission?

I agree that it would, but the information I have, does not bear that out. If my hon. and gallant Friend would like me to have further particulars and concrete evidence, I will be glad to look at them.

Is the right hon. Gentleman aware that the result of the Chelmsford by-election was most unsatisfactory?

Is the right hon. Gentleman aware that at the next election, thousands of electors all over England will not be on the register for the neighbourhood in which they are living at the time?

Will the right hon. Gentleman consult the registration officers in the recent by-elections? It really is a very serious state of affairs.

I freely admit—I open my heart to the House—that the registration business is by no means perfect. As time goes on it will be better, but in the meantime it is bound to be imperfect, and I can only crave mercy from hon. Members.

Had not the right hon. Gentleman better put off the election, if he has not got a proper register?

asked the Secretary of State for the Home Department whether he has considered resolutions from the Northamptonshire, Leicestershire and Rutland County Councils urging that Section 28 of the Road Traffic Act, 1939, be amended so as to make it an offence to take away a bicycle without the owner's consent; and what action he proposes to take.

I have considered the resolutions to which my hon. Friend refers. The information which is at present before me shows, however, that the main difficulty experienced by the police in dealing with this mischief does not arise from any difficulty in supporting a charge of larceny, but is the practical one of identifying and recovering a bicycle which is reported as missing. I understood that there are comparatively few cases in which a charge of taking and using a bicycle without the owner's consent could usefully be preferred as an alternative to a charge of larceny. I appreciate, however, that there are arguments for bringing the law with regard to the misappropriation of bicycles into line with the law with regard to the misappropriation of motor vehicles, and the point will be borne in mind when legislation to amend the Road Traffic Acts is under consideration.

In view of the necessity of making an alteration of the law speedily, would the right hon. Gentleman consider making one final regulation?

I should not have thought that this could be dealt with by regulation, because regulations have to be re- lated, in some way, to the prosecution of the war and, as the hon. Member knows, I am very anxious not to abuse my powers.

asked the Secretary of State for the Home Department whether he will circularise licensing authorities with a view to ensuring that hotels and dance halls in seaside and other holiday resorts shall have extended licences during the Victory celebrations period, in order that workers who are precluded from leaving their posts on V-Day may equally obtain a Victory holiday.

If there should be unconditional surrender by the enemy, it is proposed that the day on which the announcement is made and the following day shall be public holidays, and the circular sent by the Home Office to local authorities and licensing justices gives advice as to the granting of extended hours for public dancing and for premises licensed for the sale of intoxicating liquor. It is hoped that so far as practicable compensating holidays will be given to workers in essential services who may have to remain at their work on one or both of these days, but as such compensating holidays will take place at various dates, it is impossible to recommend that licensing authorities shall make special arrangements for these workers. In case the reference to seaside and other holiday resorts suggests that there will be justification for taking extended holidays away from home, let me emphasise what has already been said by my right hon. Friend the Prime Minister, that the end of warfare in Europe will not be an end of the struggle and that there must be no relaxation of the national effort until the war in the Far East has been won.

Is it not true that the dances where people enjoy themselves most, and dance most, are those where there is no drink?

Could my right hon. Friend use his great influence with the Noble Lady, on this occasion, to have just one drink?

Sometimes I am tempted—

Order.

asked the Minister of Health whether he is prepared to give some special allowance to enable the aged people and widows to celebrate VE-Day with other workers who are to have holidays with pay.

As regards persons in receipt of public assistance, I do not propose to issue any directions in this matter to the public assistance authorities. In so far as my hon. Friend's Question relates to other types of cases, the matter is one for my right hon. Friend the Minister of National Insurance.

asked the Secretary of State for the Home Department the num-

The normal retiring age in the Prison Service is 55, but as from April, 1942, as a war measure, this was extended to 60, subject to health and efficiency.

ber of prisoners and staff at Cardiff, Wormwood Scrubs and Wandsworth Prisons on 1st April, 1945; the number of reports for misconduct against prisoners in these establishments in the previous year; the number of reports for misconduct against the members of the staffs concerned; and the number of officers employed at these establishments who have been dismissed or forced to retire before the war-time retiring age.

As the answer involves a table of figures, I will circulate it in the OFFICIAL REPORT.

Following is the table:

The numbers of prisoners and uniformed staff at the respective prisons on 1st April, 1945, were:

The number of officers superannuated and the number dismissed since April, 1942, is:

asked the Secretary of State for the Home Department how many whole-time wardens there were in the County of London on 1st April, 1942, and the number on 1st April, 1945.

The number of whole-time wardens in the County of London was 9,297 at 1st April, 1942, and 2,895 at 1st April, 1945. These totals do not include the corresponding figures for the City of London which were 114 and 56.

Do I take it that those 2,000-odd are now being stood down?

Yes, Sir, they are in process of being stood down.

asked the Secretary of State for the Home Department whether any decision has been come to regarding the organisation of Civil Defence in peace time; and whether he can make any statement on this subject.

The organisation of the Civil Defence services in war has fallen in a large measure on local authorities, and before I can reach even provisional conclusions on the post-war arrangements, I must discuss the considerations involved with representatives of those authorities.

Has any decision been arrived at regarding the future organisation, in peace time, of Civil Defence? I do not think my right hon. Friend has answered that question.

The answer is very simple. It is in the negative. We, thought it would be right, before we came to any conclusions, to consult the local authorities.

asked the Secretary of State for the Home Department what is the cost of the maintenance of the regional organisation for Civil Defence; to what extent their continued maintenance is necessary under present conditions; and whether they will be closed down at the earliest possible moment.

The present cost of the Home Security regional organisation is £797,427 of which £722,427 represents salaries and £75,000 travelling. After the 2nd May, the appointed day for the stand-down of the Civil Defence Services, Regional staffs are being reduced by at least 60 per cent. with consequent reductions in cost. In view of the time and labour involved, however, I do not feel justified in ascertaining the exact reduction in cost. The process of standing down the Civil Defence Services and of bringing to an end the functions and duties of the regional offices throws on the regional organisation a considerable amount of work which is obviously more easily handled by outposted officers of the Ministry than by correspondence between the authorities concerned and Whitehall. The answer to the third part of the Question is "Yes, Sir."

Is my right hon. Friend aware that these regional organisations are now no more than post-offices, through which letters to and from his Ministry pass; and would it not be a very good thing if direct contact between the scheme-making authority and the Ministry were resumed at the earliest possible date?

I could not disagree more with my hon. and gallant Friend. I know his view is that all would be well if everything were handed over to the Hampshire County Council.

Withdraw.

It is as good as the London County Council, anyhow.

I know that is the hon. Member's view, but if this sort of business, involving a mass of detail in demobilising these services, is to be handled between the local authorities and a congested Whitehall, we shall get slowness in the process.

asked the Secretary of State for the Home Department, what steps he proposes to take to safeguard children employed in agriculture in the present emergency.

Much consideration has been given by the Home Office, the Ministry of Education and the Ministry of Agriculture to this matter, and various statutory safeguards are embodied in Defence Regulations made in 1942 and 1944. I am sending the Noble Lady copies of these regulations.

Will the right hon. Gentleman bear in mind that, in spite of the regulations, the sanitary arrangements are appalling and the feeding very bad; and does he not think he ought to see that the regulations are carried out, as he is going to ask thousands of children to work this summer?

If the Noble Lady can let me have particulars of any cases she has in mind, I will see that the proper Department looks into it.

asked the Secretary of State for the Home Department whether the facilities available to Members of Parliament to visit France can be extended to Belgium.

Yes, Sir. It has been decided that Members who are successful in the ballot, may be granted exit permits for Belgium or for France or for both countries, as they prefer. I have been asked to repeat the warning that accommodation in Brussels is very difficult to obtain, and Members will be well advised to arrange for lodging through their friends before commencing their journey.

Will Members be called upon to pay their own expenses?

In order to avoid giving the impression that there has been any favouritism, will the right hon. Gentleman make it clear that not only Service Members of the House, but civilian Members who, like myself, perform certain functions for the Government and who go abroad in the course of those functions, are not bound by the regulations?

Members travelling abroad on duties which are regarded as being in the national interest will be considered independently of these proposals.

asked the Secretary of State for the Home Department when the Order creating the new constituencies in Middlesex will be made.

It is intended at an early date to lay before Parliament the Report of the Boundary Commission, and the draft of an Order in Council, giving effect thereto. If Parliament approves the draft Order it will then be laid before His Majesty in Council.

Would not my right hon. Friend agree, in view of the statement that appeared yesterday that before long there may be a General Election, that time is getting very short?

There are all sorts of difficulties as between getting things ready and the date of the General Election, and I cannot fully answer because I do not know the date.

In view of the number of constituencies involved under the reorganisation scheme, cannot my right hon. Friend give some indication of when the regulations will be laid?

I have done my best in the matter, and I am told that the Report is now being printed. This is primarily a matter of printing, and it is difficult for me to be precise. I should think, however, that both documents will be ready for laying at any rate before Whitsuntide.

Is it intended to lay one draft Order in Council covering all the redistributions, or will there be an Order for each separate redistribution?

It is intended to lay before Parliament the Report of the Boundary Commission and the draft Order giving effect thereto, and it will cover the whole of the recommendations.

Will it be possible for each constituency concerned to be told informally what is to happen in their respective areas?

The people in the constituencies concerned were parties to the discussions, and they probably know a good deal. I imagine that they are not ignorant of what is going on. We will, however, lay the Order as early as possible, for I appreciate that it will be for the convenience of the House and the political parties.

Would it not be possible to provide a draft Order for each constituency which is redistributed? Otherwise it would be inconvenient for the House to have to disagree with the whole of the Regulations, in order to call attention to one anomaly in a particular constituency.

I think it will be more convenient if they are comprised in one Order as a whole. They will be specified in the Order, and I should have thought that it was more convenient and expeditious for the Order to be in that form.

Of course it will be more expeditious; it would be more expeditious if there were no Parliamentary say in the matter, but should not the House be given an opportunity of considering the draft Regulations singly? If there is no controversy about most of them, they will go through without trouble.

I will keep that point in mind, but, as far as I know, there is no great controversy about them.

May they be presented separately on the same day, so that each can be amended if necessary?

I will go into that point. The difficulty is that we are fighting against time, and I am not sure that I can break them up at this stage.

asked the Secretary of State for the Home Department whether he is aware that nearly 30 caterers in Blackpool have been prosecuted, convicted and fined for alleged food offences, which it is now known do not exist in fact or in law; what steps he proposes to take to direct the expungement of the prosecutions, the return of the fines and costs and the correction of the appropriate records; and whether he will ensure that appropriate trade and local publicity will be given to the correction of these errors so that the exoneration of those concerned may be complete.

My attention has been called to the cases to which my hon. and gallant Friend refers, and I have suggested to the Justices that in the circumstances the proceedings in question should be regarded as a nullity, that the amount of the fines, if they have been paid, should be returned to the defendants, and that an appropriate entry should be made in the court records. I will call the attention of my right hon. and gallant Friend, the Minister of Food, to the suggestion made in the last part of the Question.

Can my right hon. Friend say whether the costs will be returned as well? Is he aware that the present multiplicity of Regulations is causing great confusion throughout the country, and that similar mistakes have occurred in other places?

None have come to my attention. As regards costs, the matter is complicated because there were some other charges which were properly sustained in some of the cases. It would be best if my hon. and gallant Friend raised the question with the Minister of Food.

asked the Secretary of State for the Home Department, whether the actual civilian casualties caused by enemy action in this country exceeded or did not reach the expected casualties for which His Majesty's Government made preparation; and whether he can give any figures.

Before war broke out, there was little evidence on which to base estimates of casualties. Various provisional estimates were made, but they were changed from time to time and no proper comparison can be made between them and the actual figures. It is, however, safe to say that casualties have fortunately been less than was generally expected.

asked the Secretary of State for the Home Department whether he will introduce legislation to amend the law relating to the activities of spiritualist mediums; and whether he will make a statement as to the present position of mediums under the existing law and as to the considerations which should guide the police in taking prosecutions under this law.

I am afraid that legislation on this controversial subject is out of the question at present. While some people might press for more latitude to those who offer to exhibit spiritualistic phenomena, other people might well advocate tighter restrictions over such activities, which are, of course, capable of being used fraudulently for the purpose of obtaining money. I have no doubt that those who genuinely believe in the existence of mediumistic powers are in complete agreement with the policy of punishing such fraudulent practices under the criminal law. The relevant provisions of the law are contained in Section 4 of the Vagrancy Act, 1824, and in the Witchcraft Act, 1735. While I have no power to determine questions of law, I am advised that the provisions of the Witchcraft Act—which abolished proceedings "for witchcraft, sorcery, inchantment or conjuration" and substituted a provision penalising fraudulent pretences to the exercise or use of such arts or powers—make it quite clear that the mischief aimed at by the Statute is imposture or fraud. The same is true of the Vagrancy Act, 1824, except in so far as it relates to fortune telling. The police have been advised by the Home Office that, having regard to the statutory provisions, proceedings should be instituted only against persons whose activities have been the subject of complaint by members of the public, and where there is sufficient evidence that the person is an imposter and is taking money or other valuable consideration. I hope that this answer will help to remove any misapprehensions which may at present exist as to the mischief aimed at by the existing law, which, as I have said, is aimed at imposture or fraud.

Is the right hon. Gentleman aware that his answer will give a deal of satisfaction to thousands of people in this country who are very sincere in their beliefs? It is all right for certain hon. Members of this House to laugh, but they do not know much about the philosophy of spiritualism. I am very happy to have heard the statement of the right hon. Gentleman and it will give a good deal of satisfaction—

Speech.

Mr. Speaker, may I ask this question—

Order.

Surely all hon. Members of this House, including the Home Secretary, believe in religious freedom, which is one of the four points of the Charter.

If the right hon. Gentleman amends the law will he give hon. Members an opportunity of witnessing a spiritualistic seance?

Does the right hon. Gentleman realise that under existing law it is criminal to undertake a seance? The mere fact of engaging in any exhibition of spiritualistic phenomena is illegal under the existing law, and that is what the spiritualists object to.

With great respect to my hon. Friend, I know that has been argued, but I am advised that it is not so. In fact, the view expressed in my answer as to the law was reached after consideration of the relevant judgments of the courts. The Lord Chancellor, who is no mean lawyer, has written a letter to Lord Dowding expressing similar views as to the effect of the existing law, and it is understood that this letter was published in a public document.

Is the right hon. Gentleman aware that there is a recent decision of the Court of Criminal Appeal which is in conflict with the legal interpretation which he has given, and that there is a British subject now serving a term of imprisonment as a result of that interpretation? I would like to ask the right hon. Gentleman whether, in the advice which is given to the police, they are advised in any prosecution not to rely on anything but proved allegations of fraud.

The police have been advised in accordance with what I have said, which approximates fairly closely to what my hon. Friend has said. I know there is dispute, and that it has been argued that the courts have decided in a sense contrary to what I have said. On the other hand, I am advised that that is not so. Of course, lawyers take different views; it is too much to expect lawyers to agree on any point of law. If they did, the courts of law and the legal profession would go out of business.

Is not ambiguous law the worst kind of law; and if there is any dubiety about this matter ought it not to be put right by fresh legislation, so that citizens may know what their rights are under the law?

That is a perfectly fair point, but I am advised there is no dubiety about the law.

asked the Secretary of State for the Home Department how many Poles have taken advantage of the British offer of British nationality; and how many Jews are among them.

No statement has yet been made as to the method of implementing the offer of British nationality to members of the Polish Forces who fought with us and may be unable or unwilling to return to Poland. It is possible that legislation may be required to give effect to the offer, but any forecast of the precise method to be adopted would be premature at the present stage. The steps to be taken can only be settled when more is known as to the size and nature of the problem which may arise in future circumstances.

Have His Majesty's Government also considered the just claims of people of foreign nationality who have served, generally with distinction, in the ranks of the Armed Forces of the Crown?

I answered a question on that subject some time ago. The statement which was made by the Prime Minister on the matter arose specifically in relation to Polish Forces, and resulted from the proceedings at the Crimea Conference.

With reference to the latter part of the Question on the Paper, can my right hon. Friend say that in considering any such application there will be no kind of racial or religious discrimination?

My hon. Friend may be quite sure of that.

asked the Minister of Education whether he is aware that many private and independent schools are raising fees and that many parents cannot afford the added cost and yet cannot place their children in county schools, which do not charge fees, because of lack of accommodation; and whether he proposes to take any action in the matter.

The evidence in my possession does not give me the same impression of difficulty as that to which my right hon. Friend refers. If the accommodation in a county school is insufficient, the problem of how to increase it is one for the consideration of the local education authority concerned. Where necessary, I am prepared to consider proposals from authorities to provide temporary accommodation.

Will the right hon. Gentleman use his influence in the meantime, and while there is a shortage of school places, to discourage the raising of fees until the necessary accommodation is available?

asked the Minister of Education how many buildings, so far, have been procured for use as emergency training colleges.

Three buildings have so far been occupied for the purpose of emergency training colleges. Negotiations are in progress with the object of making provision in the autumn for all the suitable candidates who have already applied.

asked the Minister of Education (1) why, under paragraph 20 of the Draft Statutory Rules and Orders, a distinction is made between maintained grammar schools and direct-grant schools in the matter of school holidays;

(2) why direct-grant schools are to be treated differently from maintained grammar schools in that the former may pay salaries above the Burnham scale.

In the case of direct grant grammar schools the grant from public funds payable to the school represents only a proportion of the total expenses of maintaining the school. It is accordingly reasonable to allow a wider discretion to the governors in such matters as teachers' salaries and school holidays than is appropriate in schools entirely maintained out of public funds.

Is the Minister aware that there is very great concern in the country about this matter?

No, Sir.

asked the Minister of Education how he proposes to ensure that preference in admission to residuary places in direct-grant grammar schools is given to pupils in accordance with their ability and aptitude.

As one of the conditions of recognition, the governors of a direct grant grammar school are required to make adequate arrangements for ensuring that preference in admission is given to candidates who are considered, on the ground of their abilities and aptitudes, likely to profit most by the education in the school. Such arrangements will normally take into account school records and reports, educational qualifications, and the period for which particular pupils may be expected to remain at school. My department has means, through His Majesty's Inspectors and otherwise, of satisfying itself that the conditions of recognition in the case of grant aided schools are properly observed.

asked the Prime Minister whether, in the interests of the future security of this country, and in order to implement any commitments necessary for the establishment of world peace, he will announce a decision on compulsory national service before a dissolution.

I have been asked to reply. My right hon. Friend the Prime Minister has no statement to make about this subject to-day.

Does not the Minister think that it would be in the best interests of the nation, if the question of compulsory national service were kept outside party politics?

As my right hon. Friend has no statement to make, it would be quite out of place for me to attempt one.

Before making such a statement, will the Government come to this House with detailed information as to the number of men they will require for the Fighting Services in order to meet our commitments, so that this House and the country can make up their minds on this question?

No doubt that is a point which will be kept in view.

asked the Prime Minister whether the United States, Russia and Great Britain have reached an agreement respecting the future of China.

I have been asked to reply. I presume my hon. Friend is referring to Press reports arising out of a statement made recently at a Press conference by General Hurley, United States Ambassador to China, who has just returned to Chungking from the United States after visiting London and Moscow. According to a report received by His Majesty's Government General Hurley stated, as a deduction from his conversations in the three capitals, that the leaders of the three nations are unanimous in endorsing China's aspirations to build up a united, free and democratic country, and are anxious for China to work out her destiny in her own way. As previous pronouncements by His Majesty's Government will have shown, their attitude was correctly reflected in this statement.

asked the Minister of Agriculture what steps he is taking to encourage the production of seed potatoes in England in view of the insufficient supply of Scotch seed potatoes.

The shorter supply of Scotch seed potatoes this season, which was caused by unfavourable weather conditions, is being made good by increased supplies from Northern Ireland and by a greater use of English seed.

Is the Minister satisfied that it is merely a seasonal shortage and that the general maintenance of increased food production will not make it necessary to increase the supply of seed potatoes from other areas?

I earnestly hope that next year we shall not have to maintain our existing acreage of potatoes.

asked the Minister of Agriculture whether any case of foot-and-mouth disease has been traced to swill properly processed by a licensed authority.

No, Sir.

In that case, can the Minister do more to bring home to farmers the danger of using unprocessed swill, and especially swill obtained from foreign meat?

That is a matter on which we are engaged, but it is not only farmers who are at fault. It is also butchers.