asked the President of the Board of Trade when he expects to be in a position to give an estimate of the direct and consequential loss arising out of the London dock strike.

It would not be practicable to make any reliable estimate. There is no indication of any dislocation in industrial production.

Cannot the hon. Gentleman do a little better than that? If this is a Government of planners who are working on a year's target, surely they are capable of working out what is the estimated loss of holding up the inward and outward traffic of the Port of London for over two weeks?

When we have the June figures of industrial production, they may show some variation, but, at the present moment, it certainly is not practicable to make any estimate.

Will the hon. Gentleman call the attention of his right hon. Friend to the question, how can we be worthy of Marshall Aid when the people of this country act with such folly?

I do not see any reference to Marshall Aid in the Question.

Is the Minister aware that, again and again, the Government have stated that the turn-round of shipping is vital to our trade, and, that being so, then, surely, any slackening of that turn-round must affect it?

I do not think that any body disagrees with that.

Can the hon. Gentleman say how many ships were held up?

I think the figure amounts to a total of something like 800,000 tons, which is, of course, a serious matter.

asked the President of the Board of Trade how many re-equipment schemes have been sanctioned under the terms of the Cotton Spinning (Re-equipment Subsidy) Act, 1948; what are the names of the firms and groupings concerned; the amount of the subsidy granted in respect of each scheme; and how many schemes are being considered.

Fifteen groups, comprising 17 million mule equivalent spindles, have so far been approved for the purposes of the Cotton Spinning (Re-equipment Subsidy) Act, 1948. With the hon. Member's permission I will circulate a list of the groups in the OFFICIAL REPORT. Six of the approved groups have submitted modernisation schemes, which are under discussion with them. No payments of subsidy have yet been made.

Does the Minister consider this to be a reasonable rate of increase in this highly complex matter?

I do not think we are doing badly, but I hope we shall do better.

Is it not a fact that the industry has received no benefit what ever from this Act—that no subsidy what ever has been paid?

The industry will receive benefit from the Act when the subsidy is paid, and that will be paid when we have concluded agreements with those sections of the industry which qualify for the subsidy.

Has not a good deal of the delay been caused by the fact that there are so few accountants specialising in this matter?

That may be the case, but I am afraid I do not know whether it is.

Following is the list of approved groups:

Amalgamated Cotton Mills Trust, Ltd.

Barber Textile Corporation, Ltd.

Beehieve Spinning Co., Ltd.

The Belgrave Mills (1926) Ltd.

Combined Egyptian Mills, Ltd.

Crosses and Heatons, Ltd.

Dunlop Cotton Mills, Ltd.

English Sewing Cotton Co. Ltd.

Fine Spinners and Doublers, Ltd.

Hagues Textiles, Ltd.

John Hawkins & Sons, Ltd.

Horrockses Crewdson & Co., Ltd.

Joshua Hoyle & Sons, Ltd.

Lancashire Cotton Corporation, Ltd.

Swan Lane Spinning Co. (1920) Ltd.

asked the President of the Board of Trade (I) what progress has now been made in setting up development councils for industry, as provided for in the Industrial Organisation and Development Act, 1947; and what industries are affected;

(2) whether he is now in a position to make a statement on the formation of a development council for the pottery industry; and what is the cause of the delay.

I would refer my hon. Friend to the reply given to him by my right hon. Friend on 17th June, to which I have at present nothing to add.

In view of the slow progress which has been made in the setting up of development councils in 10 or 11 industries, and in view of the Minister's promise on 17th June to give a firm statement of his intentions before the end of the Session, may we hear something of what the Government intend to do in this matter?

The intention of the Government is to secure the agreement of industries to the setting up of development councils, and we are proceeding to wards that end, but it involves negotiations, and I am afraid that the negotiations are taking rather a long time. However, we are continuing to keep in the closest possible touch with the industries concerned and we shall report progress as soon as we possibly can.

Will the Parliamentary Secretary reassure the House that no development council will be set up against the wishes of industry, and that a substantial number of people desiring it will be a prerequisite of its establishment?

I think the fact that we have been carrying on these negotiations for a very long time indicates our desire to secure agreement with industry.

Will the Parliamentary Secretary take note of the fact that the organised workers who represent a substantial part of the industries concerned will not be willing to accept advisory bodies without statutory backing?

I think that pending the conclusion of negotiations with the industries concerned, it would be inadvisable to say much about it at this stage.

Is my hon. Friend aware of the very high level of administrative and economic achievement on the part of the Wool Control in the first world war and the recent war, and, in view of those circumstances and the experience of the subsequent inquiries which were made, will he seek to promote a development council in that industry, so as to obviate industrial infiltration from other quarters and permit us to retain our own industrial independence?

We are well aware of the work of the Wool Control with whom we shall be in the closest contact, and, of course, we shall bear all these factors in mind.

asked the President of the Board of Trade why Messrs. Williams and Gray, Ltd., late of Villa Street, Aston, Birmingham, and now temporarily of Caroline Street, Birmingham, whose premises were destroyed by fire last August, have not yet been granted a licence to rebuild their premises, although an official of the Board of Trade has assessed the percentage of their total output that is exported at 90 per cent., and although they cannot remain at their temporary premises beyond December, 1948.

This re-building project has now been approved and a licence for the work has been issued.

Is my hon. Friend aware that so far approval has been given for only 57 tons of steel for use on this building, whereas the work cannot be done without 85 tons of steel? It is no use giving a licence unless the right amount of steel is issued.

My understanding is that this licence was held up in the first place because the quantity of steel asked for could not be supplied; that a revised estimate was put in, and on the basis of the revised estimate the licence was given to the firm. It is not within my knowledge that work is being held up because the required quantity of steel is not forth-coming, but I am quite prepared to have a further look at this matter, and if it is the case that although a licence has been issued less than the necessary quantity of steel is forthcoming, I will see what can be done about it.

asked the President of the Board of Trade for what purpose the Amalgamated Engineering Union representative was included on the engineering trade mission to Canada to investigate market possibilities.

Mr. Fitzpatrick was appointed a member of the Mission in accordance with the policy of His Majesty's Government to secure the co-operation of organised labour in all matters affecting production and export.

Will the representative of the A.E.U. be given special facilities for studying the high level of engineering productivity in Canada?

I have not the slightest doubt that he will be given all the necessary facilities.

asked the President of the Board of Trade whether he has issued, or intends to issue in the future, the necessary licences for the export to Poland or any other eastern European country of the machine tools which were purchased recently by a Pole at Government auction sales.

No licences have been issued for the export of machine tools to any of these countries. The only machine tools that require export licences are certain types designed for munition making, and should any applications be received for these exports they would be carefully considered from all aspects.

If and when machine tools specially designed and solely suit able for the manufacture of armaments are bought by anybody wishing to get an export licence from the President of the Board of Trade, may we be assured that no such licence will be given if they are war potential?

I thought my answer made that quite clear. Machine tools which are of possible value in the case of a war are subject to an export licence, and before an export licence was granted very careful consideration would be given to all aspects of the transaction.

Did the hon. Gentleman at the time of the Election make political use of the granting of export licences by the Government for the sale of scrap iron to Japan, and while that was largely fanciful, is this not a dangerous fact?

I am not sure whether 1 did or not, but in this case we are considering something completely hypothetical, namely, the possible export of some supposed machine tools about which I have no definite information. In the case to which the noble Lord alluded, we were referring to something which in fact happened.

Will the hon. Gentleman assure the House that none of these tools came to this country under Lend-Lease?

I have been asked a Question about an export licence for some machine tools. Since there has been no application for an export licence for these machine tools, I cannot say either that they exist or where they came from if they do exist.

Does the hon. Gentleman mean that he has received no application to permit the export of the rifling machines recently purchased by the Polish Purchasing Commission?

That is precisely what I said.

asked the President of the Board of Trade if he is aware of the shortage of honey jars in this country and particularly in Lincoln-shire; and that considerable quantities of honey may be wasted; and what steps he is taking to meet this requirement in the near future.

The output of glass containers generally has recently increased. Honey jars have shared in this increase but as they are still scarcer than some other types of container, I have asked the manufacturers to do what they can to step up their production.

Will the hon. Gentleman look into the particular local shortage in Lincolnshire, because it does exist, and it may well upset the whole of the honey harvest?

Perhaps the hon. and gallant Gentleman will give me details, and I shall be glad to look into them.

Is the Minister aware that the bee population of this country is very much less than it used to be, and is the real reason for the shortage of honey?

the President of the Board of Trade if he is aware that many retailers are concerned about a prospective shortage of utility industrial overalls and shirts; and whether he is prepared to release additional material to the manufacturers in time to ensure adequate supplies during the Autumn and Winter.

The supply of cotton cloth of all types to the home market is falling as a result of the expansion of export production. Output of overall cloth, however, is being maintained at as high a level as possible, in view of the essential character of these garments. The supply of cloth for shirts cannot be similarly maintained, owing to the needs of export, but I hope that supplies will continue to be available in the shops as a result of the increase of coupon pointing which came into effect on 26th May.

Does the hon. Gentleman realise that retailers dealing with large agricultural areas are particularly concerned about this matter, and that shirts are extremely important, particularly in view of the coming Winter months?

I am aware of that. I hope the hon. Gentleman is aware that we do not control the allocation of cloth to the makers-up. That was de-controlled two years ago, and in many cases the effects have not been what were expected by those who asked for de-control.

asked the President of the Board of Trade if manufacturers in this country who desire to import certain machinery from the United States for the purpose of expanding production for export, and for the import of which import licences are not now available, will be enabled to secure such essential equipment under Marshall Aid.

It is already the policy to issue import licences for machinery when an essential need has been established and provided that similar British machinery is not available within a reasonable time. I hope that our future allocations of aid under E.R.P. will enable us to maintain these arrangements.

Is it not a fact that licences to import certain very necessary machinery into this country have been refused? What I want to know is whether the Marshall Plan will afford better facilities for the granting of import licences in respect of those machines.

The normal practice is to issue an import licence if the machinery is deemed to be necessary and if it is unobtainable in this country or possibly in a soft currency area. Those arrangements will continue under E.R.P. If the hon. Member has any knowledge of any particular instance of necessary machines being refused import licences, I will be glad if he will let me have details and I will do what I can.

On the assumption that owing to the shortage of dollars it is extremely unlikely that the Government will give permission for the import of machinery from America or, indeed, for the making of machines in this country under an American licence, would my hon. Friend say whether it is the policy of his Department, in circumstances where such permission is granted, to make an allocation of raw materials to that industry where the new machinery is installed?

I am afraid that is rather a different question, but the raw material situation has been taken into account in deciding whether the importation of a machine is desirable or not.

asked the President of the Board of Trade what success has met his efforts to introduce new units of textile manufacture within those areas in South Wales where the percentage of un-employment exceeds seven.

Three extensions to existing factories engaged on textile manufacture have already been completed in areas in the South Wales development area where the percentage of unemployment exceeds seven, and three new factories are under construction.

asked the President of the Board of Trade what steps he is taking to ensure that the planned Grenfell factories in South Wales are being proceeded with with an urgency befitting the high percentage of unemployed men suffering from varying degrees of disablement.

We have throughout taken all possible steps to overcome the many difficulties which have tended to delay completion of these factories, and have kept in close touch with the Ministry of Supply and the Ministry of Works with a view to speeding up deliveries of building materials and components. I am glad to say that all 10 factories should be ready within the next two months.

Is the Minister aware that the volume of unemployment, particularly in regard to disabled men, is mounting up rather rapidly? In one area in South Wales the percentage is now 12, in another it is 10, and in another it is about 7½, and the average over the whole country, by comparison, is only about 2 per cent. Is the Minister aware that this high percentage in South Wales compares very un-favourably with the rest of the country?

I am aware of the very serious and, in some cases, tragic problems. That is why I do everything I possibly can, and my Department does everything it possibly can, to speed up the completion of these factories and to deal with any other difficulties which may arise to prevent the reduction of this figure of unemployment.

Would my hon. Friend consider concentrating on one factory at a time and getting that one ready, because the delay appears to be caused by the scattering of effort over a number of factories?

No; I do not think that is at all practicable. There are different stages in the building of a factory; different men and different materials are employed at different times and if we concentrated on one factory at a time there would be men and materials unemployed which could be usefully employed helping the completion of other factories.

Will the hon. Member make certain that when the factories are completed they get priority of raw materials to keep them engaged?

It is a fact that the factories in the development areas receive prior consideration in the allocation of raw materials, where His Majesty's Government have control of the allocation of raw materials.

asked the President of the Board of Trade why an extra supply of paper was issued to the firm of Dennis Yates Publications, Ltd., to enable it to print extra copies of the story of the film called "the Iron Curtain."

No paper has been specially licensed for this publication. It does not appear to qualify for assistance from the special reserve of paper for essential books for the home market. It may, however, qualify for assistance from the special reserve for export sales.

Is the Minister aware that a report was issued by the publishers declaring that they had a special supply and will he look into it to see whether they are obtaining this on the black market for this very black market kind of book?

The authority for saying whether these publishers are getting an extra supply is the Board of Trade and not the publishers themselves. I have assured the House that they have not had a special allocation, and if the hon. Member cares to send me any details of any information of black market activities I shall be only too happy to look into them.

asked the Minister of Fuel arid Power whether a uniform system of recording absenteeism is employed throughout the British coalfields; and whether the records distinguish between absenteeism caused by injuries, including those causing no more than three days' absence, from all other causes.

Absenteeism statistics are collected on a form of return which is the same for all coal fields. This return does not show separately absenteeism caused by injuries, but separate statistics are now collected showing under one head the number of wage-earners absent because of accidents, industrial disease or certified sickness where the absence lasts for the whole of any week.

Is my right hon. Friend aware that in the past the different districts of the British coalfields employed different bases for compiling statistics of this kind, with the result that in some districts the figures adversely reflected upon the miners?

Yes, Sir. That has now been put right: we have a uniform return.

May I ask the Minister if, when compiling the list on absenteeism, he will also compile a list of regular attenders and make a recommendation that the Closure shall never be used against a regular attender in this House?

asked the Minister of Fuel and Power how many of the 8,885 European Volunteer Workers and the unspecified number of other volunteer workers who entered the mining industry during the first six months of 1948 are now employed in the industry.

All but about 200 of the European Volunteer Workers who entered coalmining employment during the first six months of 1948 remained so employed at the end of the period. I regret that I have no information as to how many of the other recruits, all of whom were, of course, volunteer workers, both entered and left the industry during the same period.

May I ask the Minister, with regard to the unspecified number of volunteers, what steps are taken to retain these men in the industry after they have been trained?

All workers in the industry are subject to the Control of Engagement Order.

Is my right hon. Friend aware that a large number of people, particularly some of the Irish workers—not all of them—who come over here, come here definitely stating that once they have been trained they do not intend to remain in the industry? What steps are taken to see that they do remain in the industry?

If my hon. Friend could give me any particulars of this kind I would pass them on to my right hon. Friend the Minister of Labour for attention.

asked the Minister of Fuel and Power if, in view of the fact that some 500,000 tons of coal is lying in dumps in Eire and that because of the inferior quality the people of Eire will not buy it, he will take steps to improve the quality of the coal offered for export.

I am advised that the coal referred to is not United Kingdom coal. I am also informed by the National Coal Board that they have had no com plaints about the quality of the coal exported from this country. With regard to the last part of the Question, I would refer the hon. Member to paragraphs 272–277 of the Annual Report of the National Coal Board for 1947.

In view of the general complaints, will the Minister introduce legislation to withdraw the salaries from members of the Coal Board and pay them by results?

asked the Minister of Fuel and Power what proportion of men employed in the mines are not engaged in producing coal; and what was the com parable figure prior to nationalisation.

All wage-earners employed at collieries are engaged, directly or indirectly, in the production and preparation of coal. The proportion of those employed at the coal face has increased slightly from 40.13 per cent, in the second quarter of 1946 to 40.32 per cent, in the corresponding quarter of this year.

Can the Minister say whether he is giving his attention to trying to get an increase in the number of those directly producing coal at the coal face, because that is one of the advantages that we expected to come from nationalisation?

I fully agree that it is most essential that we should get an increased proportion of face workers.

asked the Minister of Fuel and Power what monthly saving has been effected by the new petrol rationing arrangements; and when he expects to be able to increase the standard ration.

In reply to the first part of the Question, I would refer the hon. Member to the reply I gave to the hon. Member for Mile End (Mr. Piratin) on 15th July. I am not at present prepared to make any statement on the future of the standard ration.

Can the Minister say whether he has succeeded in stopping the leaks of petrol into the black market and, if so, when the honest motorist may feel the benefit of that?

So far as we can see, the measures taken to stop the black market have been very successful, but at the moment I cannot say how much saving has been achieved, partly because the standard ration can be used at any time during the six months.

asked the Minister of Fuel and Power if, in view of the large number of overseas visitors who will be in London during the next few weeks, he will authorise a temporary restoration of pre-war lighting in the West End of London.

No, Sir. In view of the continuing need for economy in the consumption of all kinds of fuel, including electricity, I am afraid I cannot agree to relax the restrictions on display lighting.

asked the Minister of Fuel and Power whether he will arrange for the issue of petrol coupons to enable a 64-year-old badly disabled ex-Service man, particulars of whom have been sent to him, to use his car for the purposes of a short holiday trip.

Yes, Sir.

In thanking the right hon. Gentleman for that humane and generous answer, may I ask him to invite the attention of his officials, who refused this application for two months, to the necessity for adopting a more humane and tolerant attitude in these cases?

I cannot accept that the officials were wrong in this case. They did not have the information on which my final decision was based.

asked the Minister of Fuel and Power if the area covered by a commercial traveller and manufacturer's agent will be taken into account in future in deciding the granting of an allowance of petrol, in view of the fact that the maximum possible allowance on the existing basis is inadequate for those whose business extends over a very wide area.

I would refer the hon. Member to the answers given to my hon. Friend the Member for Rother Valley (Mr. D. Griffiths) on 18th March and to my hon. Friend the Member for Caernarvonshire (Mr. G. Roberts) on 15th July, to which I have at present nothing to add.

Is the Minister aware that there are commercial travellers and manufacturers' agents with very wide areas to cover? It is undesirable to split them up because that is a waste of manpower. Could he not give consideration to increasing the maximum possible allowance?

As I explained on a previous occasion the matter is being discussed with the Commercial Travellers' Association and we have asked them if they will produce some plan which is more satisfactory than the present one, without using any more petrol.

Is the right hon. Gentleman aware that it is possible to get the maximum allowance for a very much smaller mileage than that covered by these commercial travellers? People are travelling within a very near radius of a city with the maximum allowance, while these travellers, travelling far afield, cannot get any more petrol.

All these matters are being discussed with the Commercial Travellers' Association. I must say that hitherto they have always taken the line that it would not be possible to allocate petrol on an area basis. Now they have changed their minds and we have asked if they will help by producing a plan.

Arising out of previous answers, is the Minister aware that the previous answers were not at all helpful and is he also aware that at the present minute this attitude towards commercial travellers is seriously handicapping trade and industry, particularly in agricultural and rural areas?

All I can say is that commercial travellers are getting about three times as much petrol as they got in 1945.

Is the right hon. Gentleman aware that people who have two jobs can get petrol in respect of the main job and not in respect of the subsidiary job? Will he look into that with a view to increasing the amount of petrol used in the subsidiary job?

That is an entirely different question, but the noble Lord is not quite correct in his assumption.

asked the Minister of Fuel and Power what potential loss of refined petrol has been incurred since the closing down of the Haifa refineries; and what are the conditions proposed before these refineries can be restored to full operation.

In normal circumstances the amount of motor spirit produced at Haifa refinery is approximately 645,000 tons per annum out of a total output of 4 million tons of refined petroleum products. As regards the second part of the Question, I would refer my hon. Friend to the reply given yesterday to my right hon. Friend the Secretary of State for Foreign Affairs to the hon. and gallant Member for Lewes (Major Beamish).

Is my right hon. Friend aware that the figure of 4 million tons given yesterday is more than 33 times the present total allocation of basic petrol and that if petrol could be brought over from our Persian oilfields in tankers to Haifa the present basis of the allocation of petrol could be increased 33 times over? Is not that rather a terrible price to pay for the delays in securing facilities in Haifa?

No, Sir. One cannot, of course, consider the output of one refinery in relation to supplies to the United Kingdom. We have to consider it in relation to the needs of the sterling area, export trade and everything else.

May I ask my right hon. Friend if any petrol has been sent from Kirkuk to be refined in Tripoli or Syria?

I am afraid that I should want notice of that question.

As the capacity of the Haifa refinery may now be utilised for refining American oil, does not this represent a very substantial loss in our dollar market?

Nobody denies that the loss of output from the refinery at Haifa is a serious matter, but the oil which is refined is, in fact, produced by the Iraq Petroleum Company, which is an international body.

asked the Secretary of State for the Home Department what advice he has given to local authorities respecting the selection and scale of salary of Children's Officers.

General advice as to the qualifications to be looked for in persons to be appointed as children's officers was given to local authorities in a circular isued by the Home Office in September last: this advice was related to paragraph 446 of the Curtis Committee Report. Detailed advice is offered when authorities consult me about individual applicants in accordance with Section 41 (2) of the Children Act. Salaries are settled by the local authorities: the circular called attention to the importance of offering such salaries as to attract candidates with high qualifications.

Will my right hon. Friend impress on authorities when he has the opportunity of doing so the importance of selecting candidates of a really high grade, and, particularly, of a grade comparable, so far as possible, with that of directors of education?

I think that it is very difficult to compare the officer of one local authority with the officer of another, and I am not sure that all the qualifications that should be looked for in a director of education would be required in the case of these officers. I hope that the Debates in this House left no authority under any delusion as to the importance this House attaches to the quality of the persons to be appointed.

It seems to me that the right hon. Gentleman's reply could well have been made a year ago. Have not his views been at all affected by what has been said during the passage of the Bill through the House?

No question was put to me a year ago, and, therefore, I did not have to answer it. The views that I have today expressed are the same as those I expressed in Committee on the Bill, as the hon. Member knows, for he served on the Committee.

asked the Secretary of State for the Home Department the composition of the Poisons Board.

I will with permission circulate in the OFFICIAL REPORT the names of the present members of the Poisons Board and of the authorities appointing them.

Following are the names:

Pharmacy and Poisons Act, 1933

Poisons Board (1945–1948)

Name of member and appointing authority—

Bertram Reece, Esq. (Chairman)—Secretary of State for the Home Department.

Major W. H. Coles, D.S.O.—Secretary of State for the Home Department.

E. J. Mount, Esq—Secretary of State for the Home Department

J. M. Johnston, Esq., M.D., F.R.C.S.E. (Ed.)—Secretary of State for Scotland.

J. N. Beckett, Esq.—Minister of Health.

W. P. Kennedy, Esq., Ph.D., F.R.I.C, L.R.C.P,, L.R.C.S., B.Sc—Minister of Health.

C. T. Gimingham, Esq., O.B.E., B.Sc, F.R.I.C.—Minister of Agriculture and Fisheries

J. R. Nicholls, Esq., D.Sc, F.R.I.C— Government Chemist.

W. Deacon, Esq., C.B.E., M.Sc, M.P.S., J. P.—Pharmaceutical Society of Great Britain.

C. W. Maplethorpe, Esq., Ph.C, F.R.I.C— Pharmaceutical Society of Great Britain.

H. H. Linstead, Esq., O.B.E., Ph.C, M.P.— Pharmaceutical Society of Great Britain.

H. Noble, Esq., B.Ph., Ph.C—Pharmaceutical Society of Great Britain.

A. Wilson, Esq., M.P.S.—Pharmaceutical Society of Great Britain.

Professor Sir Francis Fraser, M.D., F.R.C.P.—Royal College of Physicians of London.

D. M. Lyon, Esq., M.D., D.Sc, F.R.C.P. (Ed.)—Royal College of Physicians of Edinburgh

Professor David Campbell, M.C., M.A., M.D.—General Medical Council.

G. Roche Lynch, Esq., O.B.E., M.B., B.S. (London), D.P.H. (Eng), F.R.I.C—Royal Institute of Chemistry of Great Britain and Ireland.

J. W. Bone, Esq., M.B., CM. (Ed.), B.Sc— British Medical Association.

asked the Secretary of State for the Home Department if he has come to any decision on the question of appointing a committee to inquire into the question of punishments in prisons.

I hope to be able to announce the composition and terms of reference of this Committee in the near future.

Will this Committee have power to look into the question of prison punishments in Scotland?

I am consulting my right hon. Friend the Secretary of State for Scotland about the appointments.

asked the Secretary of State for the Home Department approximately what amount of money or moneysworth has accrued to his Department by reason of the surrender of fire-arms since the war.

None, Sir.

asked the Secretary of State for the Home Department what has become of the firearms purchased by citizens in order to defend the country against invasion and since surrendered without payment; are they stored and maintained; have they been sold and if so, through what agency; what guarantee is there that they do not return into illicit circulation; are they sold for scrap; and what effective guarantee is there that they are, in fact, so used.

Firearms surrendered to the police are handed over to the Central Ordnance Depot, and their storage and disposal are matters for my right hon. Friends the Secretary of State for War and the Minister of Supply. I am satisfied that effective steps are taken to prevent their passing into illicit circulation.

Yes, but suppose that, unhappily, a second emergency should occur, and that the Home Guard should be reformed, can the right hon. Gentle man say whether those people who have commanded those units who bought their own weapons out of their own pockets and have surrendered them to him will be sup plied with them free next time, or whether they will have to buy them again the next time and then have to surrender them again?

I think that question should be addressed to the Secretary of State for War.

asked the Minister of Health what steps he is taking to implement the Spens Report on dental remuneration with regard to the salaries of public dental officers.

I would refer my hon. Friend to the reply given to the hon. Member for South-East Essex (Mr. Gunter) on 22nd July, a copy of which I am sending him.

asked the Minister of Health how many members of the local dental committees of the Middlesex Executive Council have applied for inclusion in the dental list under the National Health Service Act.

Six, one of whom has given notice that he wishes his name to be with drawn.

asked the Minister of Health what steps he is taking to expedite the delivery to dentists of Forms E.C. 17 and E.C. 25.

So far as I am aware supplies of these forms are now being sent to all dentists as soon as they apply for inclusion in the dental list.

asked the Minister of Health when the first free distribution of mechanically-operated invalid chairs can be anticipated under the new National Health Scheme; on what scale it will be maintained; and on what basis of priority these facilities will be made available.

Arrangements have already been made through the Ministry of Pensions to provide these chairs as part of the Hospital Service. Patients will receive them on the same grounds as war pensions. That means, broadly, people who are medically fit to drive, have lost the use of their legs or are badly disabled and need the chairs to get or to keep work.

Could my right hon. Friend give the House any idea of how many of these chairs are to be allocated? Is he fully aware of the desperate need that exists for these chairs, especially among the poorer sections of the population?

That need, of course, has existed for some time, and now it is to be dealt with. I cannot say to what extent the need will be met immediately, but we are expediting the provision of these chairs, and an order has been placed.

Could my right hon. Friend give publicity to the scheme as soon as possible, so that the hopes of many sufferers will not be doomed to disappointment?

I do not want to give too much publicity ahead of available facilities, but as soon as chairs are available I shall see to it that they reach the people who need them.

asked the Minister of Health what steps he is taking to ensure that under the National Health Service persons desiring to consult homoeopath or other special classes of doctor shall be enabled so to do notwithstanding the distance of such doctors from the proposed patient's home.

If he is on the medical list of an area, a homoeopathic doctor can—like other doctors—accept any person living in that area, however far away the person lives, provided he is prepared to visit that person at his home when necessary.

Does the right hon. Gentleman appreciate that the question of distance often affects the willing ness of such doctors who take on patients who desire this particular type of treatment? Has he considered the issue of mileage allowances to surmount that very real difficulty?

It would be impossible to issue mileage allowances to people who wish to attend a particular doctor. The cost of the service in such a case would be insupportable, as I think the hon. Gentleman will appreciate. It is, of course, possible for a doctor to take a patient anywhere he likes, although I appreciate that there may be people desiring homoeopathic treatment who will not readily find a homoeopath immediately available.

Will my right hon. Friend give us an assurance that the medical men practising homoeopathy for patients under the National Health Service are those who have registered qualifications and are on the Medical Register?

Homoeopathy is a form of therapy which is used by doctors on the Medical Register, and so it is accessible, in so far as facilities are available, to the whole population.

asked the Minister of Health if he is aware that although he has had circulated to each member of hospital staffs an explanatory booklet on the subject of the Health Service Superannuation Scheme, considerable confusion still exists in the minds of great numbers of the staffs; and will he arrange for a member of his permanent staff to be available to attend any conference arranged for the purpose of explaining in more detail the difference between the provisions of the new superannuation schemes and the scheme which previously operated.

I realise how necessary it is that all the staffs concerned should understand the provisions of the National Health Service Superannuation Scheme, and officers of my Department are available to attend meetings of employees in order to explain the Scheme in detail. In response to requests from employee organisations they have already attended a number of such meetings.

Would my right hon. Friend be prepared to arrange through regional boards for these conferences to take place for the whole of the hospital staffs in the several regions?

It may not be desirable to do this through the regional boards, but I shall arrange meetings of this sort wherever they are required.

asked the Minister of Health the number of women students now attending medical schools in Great Britain; what percentage they form of the total; and which medical schools have as yet no women students.

Approximately 2,875 women medical students, representing about 27 per cent, of the total, are now attending medical schools in Great Britain. There are no schools without women students.

Can my right hon. Friend say whether he contemplates any extension of those medical schools catering exclusively for women students, and whether he accepts in principle that as wide an expansion as possible should be made in this type of medical school?

The number of women medical students today is 27 per cent, of the total as against 15 per cent, in 1938, so the hon. Gentleman will understand from those figures that we have given every encouragement to such students. I cannot, of course, give an assurance that any of the schools exclusively devoted to women can have particular priorities; I would rather have more women students in all the schools.

Can my right hon. Friend say how many would-be women students are unable to take up this career because of the inadequacy of the medical training facilities provided for them?

I dare say that there is a considerable number, but there is also a considerable number of men. There is a restriction on the amount of accommodation now available and a long waiting list. I am doing my very utmost to extend the facilities for both men and women.

Why does not the Minister of Health set up a definite policy of in creasing the number of medical schools in the country? We need 80 instead of 42.

Precisely because there are all kinds of competing claims for the resources available, and I cannot give one claim a superior position to all the others.

Why not?

For obvious reasons.

asked the Prime Minister whether he has considered the suggestion of the War Memorials Advisory Council that the national achievements and sacrifices in the war of 1939–45 should be visibly commemorated, and their suggestion that the site of a memorial should be either the area around Westminster Abbey or the area around St. Paul's; and if he will make a statement on the matter.

I have been asked to reply. Yes, Sir. The Government do not consider that there is at present any public demand for a national war memorial in physical form other than the Cenotaph. No scheme has yet been put forward which makes a wide popular appeal.

Even if, as a Dominion statesman remarked today, we won the war because we are an unimaginative people, does not the Lord President think that we have enough imagination to commemorate the heroism of those who won the war?

I can only say that the Government have given the matter very careful and sympathetic consideration, and others have, too. Nobody, as yet, has produced a scheme which would have the necessary degree of adequate public appeal to enable the proper funds to be raised. I have the impression that the general feeling is that the addition to the Cenotaph of the period of the second world war was the right thing to do.

Would the Lord President give an assurance that if a responsible body submits a reasonable proposal it will be given full consideration?

Yes, Sir. We will give consideration to it by all means, if it is a proposal calculated to effect an adequate public response.

What does the right hon. Gentleman mean by that? What sort of test is there that any particular scheme would have what he calls "an adequate public response?"

That is a matter of assessment and judgment in relation to the reaction created. There was a letter in "The Times" from very influential people urging this course; it had very little response, and we feel that there is not a big public opinion which wants something done, apart from the addition to the Cenotaph, which I have mentioned.

What does the right hon. Gentleman mean by "response"? Because there was a letter in "The Times" does that mean that there were not a lot of other letters in "The Times," or what?

There were no other letters except one which disagreed with that letter. I think that correspondence in "The Times" is a fair indication of the degree of public response. I cannot give a definition; it must be a matter in which everyone is entitled to his own judgment.

Will the Lord President give an undertaking that neither that committee nor the War Graves Commission will continue to take large tracts of open spaces, such as they propose to do at Plymouth Hoe, for the erection of ghastly memorials?

Does my right hon. Friend think that St. Paul's Cathedral would have been built if Sir Christopher Wren had waited for public opinion to express itself?

That is a bright observation, but it really does not help us in examining this matter.

Would not the best memorial to the victims of the last war be for us to keep out of another one?

asked the Minister of Labour if he will arrange for an investigation into the functioning of Joint Industrial Councils, Works Committees and Joint Production Committees, on the lines of the 1917–18 investigation with a view to obtaining a report on how instalments of industrial democracy could be introduced, and how workshop joint machinery functions

:I do not feel that in the circumstances of today there is need for a further investigation of the kind suggested. The Government will, however, continue to pursue its policy of giving all possible support and assistance to the two sides of industry in developing arrangements for joint consultation.

asked the Minister of Labour how soon he proposes to restore to the miner his right to leave the industry if wages and conditions are not satisfactory to him.

It is too early yet to say when it will be possible to dispense with the rule that men, age 18 to 50, employed in coalmining may not take employment outside the industry except through a local office of the Ministry or an approved agency.

Would not the Minister consider withdrawing this control, or advising the Coal Board to make an acceptable wages structure for the industry; and is he aware of the fact that if this control were withdrawn and a lot of miners went away from the industry, they could be replaced by the appeals that are being made at garden fetes by hon. Members on the other side for volunteers for the industry?

Do not these restrictions discourage recruiting? Is it surprising that young men are reluctant to enter an industry from which they are unable to go out?

There is no evidence to that effect. The Coal Board is working in co-operation with the National Union of Mineworkers, and we feel that an application would be made to remove this restriction as soon as it was felt necessary to do so.

asked the Minister of-Labour if he will make a statement on the cause of the failure of the recruiting campaign for the textile industry; and if he will now give consideration to special schemes submitted to him based upon favoured terms for undermanned industries.

At the rate of recruitment up to May of this year there would be a shortfall in relation to the manpower target, but the campaign has not been a failure. This shortfall has been mainly due to the non availability of suitable and accepted foreign workers. Improved methods of production plus the present flow of new workers enabled the cotton industry to reach its spinning target in June, and it is too early to assume that the end of the year production target will not be reached.

Is the Minister quite satisfied that in the wool textile areas there is sufficient accommodation to accommodate all the foreign labour that is required?

So far accommodation has not been a restriction on the inflow of foreign labour. Our difficulty has been to get the foreign labour that is acceptable.

Is not my right hon. Friend aware that he will get all the workers in the textile industry that he wants, if only he will give them decent housing conditions?

Can the right hon. Gentleman say if he has any further plans in view to improve the position?

Yes, Sir. This matter is under continuous examination, and we are, at the moment, looking al the American zone in Germany for the purpose of bringing over, I am told, thousands of single women, who could be brought over if we could get agreement about it.

Will the hon Gentleman look again into the question of houses, as his remark in reply to a previous supplementary question, that shortage of houses has no restrictive influence on geting people for this industry is really quite inaccurate?

I did not say that I said that shortage of hostel accommodation is restricting the inflow of foreign workers and not the shortage of houses make on the present position.

Would the hon. Gentleman be good enough to reply to the latter par of my original Question? I asked him if he would give consideration to special schemes submitted to him based upon favoured terms for undermanned industries.

I am obliged to my hon. Friend for one scheme which he has put forward. I was hopeful that we could adopt it, because I thought that it would have a very good influence, but after a thorough examination, we were compelled to reject it.

The hon. Gentleman said if we could get agreement there would be thousands of Germans who would come to this country. Does he mean agreement with the trade unions or with whom?