asked the Minister of Labour how many industrial rehabilitation centres have been set up by his Department on the Tees-side for industrial workers; and what steps he intends to take in this area to extend such facilities for those industrial workers who are recommended to take such courses of rehabilitation.

No industrial rehabilitation unit has been set up on Tees-side as the numbers likely to require these facilities do not justify it. Residential facilities are available at units elsewhere.

Is the Minister aware that this question of industrial rehabilitation has been causing concern on Tees-side? Is he further aware that here is one of the most highly industrialised parts of this country, and does he not think that further consideration should be given to such a project as this on Tees-side?

We are very sympathetic to the point raised by the hon. Gentleman, but our difficulty is that to make it possible to have an industrial rehabilitation unit we want an annual demand of about 600 people for these facilities. I have no evidence at all that this kind of demand can be expected.

Is the hon. Gentleman aware of the existence on Tees-side of a former mansion which was bought by a private hospital and has never been used for this purpose, and would not the opening of such a place by his Department mean that many men who have now to go to London would receive their treatment on Tees-side?

The same answer applies to the right hon. Gentleman. We have not—though we are quite prepared to look at this again—enough evidence at the moment that there are the cases to justify opening a centre.

asked the Minister of Labour what steps he proposes to take to secure the implementation of the report of the committee on conditions in the drop forging industry.

Factory inspectors are bringing the report to the attention of employers during their visits. Its recommendations are being widely publicised by the industry, and in accordance with a suggestion in the report the Chief Inspector of Factories is setting up a Standing Joint Advisory Committee, which will keep under review the progress made.

Is the Minister aware that this excellent Report is welcome on both sides of an industry in which relations are good, and that his announcement of the action being taken will also be welcomed? Will he keep the matter constantly under review in order to see that that Report is implemented?

Yes, Sir. I am grateful to my hon. Friend for giving it this additional publicity.

asked the Minister of Labour whether he is aware that the proposed sale in lots with premises in or near Leicester of most of the 74 lorries at present used for the distribution of Stewart and Lloyds' tubes and accordingly located at Corby will put out of employment men engaged in driving the lorries and as depot staff; and what steps he proposes to take to obviate this un employment or to find other employment for the men in question.

I do not accept the implication that the sale of these lorries will necessarily lead to unemployment among drivers or depot staff. If, however, any of the workers concerned become unemployed, the employment exchanges will do everything possible to help them to find other suitable work.

Is the Minister aware that this is the tube works where, recently, partial unemployment has arisen for the first time? In these circumstances, is he not prepared to put his head together with those of his colleagues in the Ministries of Transport and Supply, both of whom are concerned, and use their active influence with the Transport Commission and the Road Haulage Disposals Agency, to find a better means of disposing of these lorries than by this piece of improvident folly?

I should be delighted to put my head together with those of any of my colleagues. This Government works as a team. I think I should tell the hon. and learned Gentleman—and I am very glad to say it—that unemployment at Corby is still only 0.5 per cent., which is a long way below the national figure.

Is the hon. Gentleman not aware that, owing to the consequences of the Transport Act, 74 lorries which have been operating efficiently as a unit have now been split up among half-a-dozen smaller depots, merely to satisfy the requirements under which they must be sold under the 1953 Transport Act?

That will be a matter for my right hon. Friend and not myself.

asked the Minister ofLabour if he will recommend a short-term settlement of the dispute in the engineering and shipbuilding industry based upon a substantial increase in wages to be made restrospective, the restoration of the pre-1931 basis for piece-work calculation of earnings, and a special advance for the highly-skilled craftsmen, pending the appointment of a court of inquiry who shall issue a report which shall form the basis for negotiating a long-term settlement.

No, Sir. The basis of payment of workers in the engineering industry is a matter for the employers' organisations and trade unions concerned.

On a point of order. With great respect, Mr. Speaker, do we understand that, on a fundamental question such as the one raised in this Question, no supplementary questions are to be permitted?

I had my eye on the hon. Member for Stoke-on-Trent, South (Mr. Ellis Smith), who nodded and did not seem to want to ask one.

The answer completely knocked me out.

Perhaps that will suffice also for the hon. Member for Leeds, West (Mr. Pannell).

asked the Minister of Labour whether he is satisfied with the industrial and scientific background of the recruits to the factory inspectorate.

It is not necessary for all recruits to have such a background, but I should welcome an increase in the number who have.

Is my hon. Friend fully satisfied that the terms offered for the recruitment of new inspectors for the factory inspectorate are sufficiently satisfactory to attract sufficient men with the proper background to perform the duties which these inspectors have to carry out?

We are looking carefully into that, but, since putting down this Question, my hon. Friend has written to me, and I should like to give her a detailed reply, which I am sending to her.

asked the Minister of Labour the reasons for retaining the operation of the Notification of Vacancies Order, Statutory Instrument, 1952, No. 136, as amended by Statutory Instrument, 1952, No. 1402.

The Order is designed to provide opportunities for employment exchanges to inform persons seeking employment, or a change of employment, of the jobs which most need to be filled in the national interest. There is still a big demand for labour for vacancies of national importance, particularly on export work, and the Order is continuing to assist substantially in getting these filled.

As the Order is disregarded on a very wide scale, could not the Minister consider discontinuing or, at least, modifying it so that it does not apply to the whole working population, as it does today?

I do not accept my hon. Friend's view that it is being largely disregarded. I think it will put the matter into proportion if I say that we are placing nearly 250,000 workers every four weeks. As long as we get that sort of flow through the employment exchanges, I think we need to have this Order.

asked the Minister of Labour what steps he will take to find alternative employment for building workers dismissed by local authorities in London as a result of cuts in the housing repair programme.

The employment exchanges will do everything possible to find suitable employment for any unemployed workers who register for employment. I am, however, not aware of any general cuts in housing repair work in London likely to lead to dismissals by local authorities of appreciable numbers of men from their building labour forces.

Is the hon. Gentleman aware that the Lambeth Borough Council, for example, are having to sack 50 building workers this Christmas because the Minister of Housing and Local Government has cut down the repair programme for requisitioned property? Will the hon. Gentleman have a word with his right hon. Friend, who is apparently increasing unemployment as well as the number of houses in need of repair? More people out of work and more slums will be the result of this lack of policy on the part of Her Majesty's Government.

The hon. and gallant Member refers only to requisitioned houses. I hope that he will vote for my right hon. Friend's Bill, to make up for it.

asked the Minister of Labour the increase in average wage rates and earnings since 1939 for all workers and for railwaymen.

It is estimated that at the end of November, 1953, the average level of full-time weekly rates of wages of adult male manual workers was between 121 and 124 per cent. higher than at the beginning of September, 1939, for the principal industries and services taken as a whole. For adult railwaymen in the conciliation grades of British Railways it is estimated that average wage rates rose between 126 and 127 per cent. over the same period.

In the new rates that yesterday's agreement proposes should be worked out is contained the phrase, "Worked out after consultation with the Government." Does that mean that there is to be an increase in fares or a subsidy given by the Government?

That question does not arise out of the one on the Order Paper.

As the British Transport Commission has been given the duty of paying its way and has said that it cannot do so, and as the Minister of Labour has been the Minister who has been in charge of those negotiations, will not the Parliamentary Secretary be a little more forthcoming and tell us whether this phrase means anything at all, because upon it the agreement hinges?

To the agreement concluded yesterday, which was reached after long and very difficult negotiations, we owe a very great deal to the skill and patience of my right hon. and learned Friend. I think that the whole House welcomed that agreement and I thought that the whole House now wanted the railways and the British Transport Commission to get on and do their job of increasing the efficiency of the railways. Although the hon. Gentleman's supplementary question does not arise out of the Question on the Order Paper, perhaps I might say that I think that that is the main task in front of us and not going into all these details.

If any consideration of a subsidy arises to be paid by the taxpayer, will the Minister represent to the Government that they should suspend the operation of the Transport Act, 1953, and so keep £7 million in the hands of the public?

Will my hon. Friend bear in mind, as I am sure he will, that on this side of the House we are just as interested in paying good wages to railway workers and to every other industrial worker as are hon. Gentlemen opposite? Is it not rather a pity that when I asked a Question about comparative wages and average earnings a fortnight ago I was referred to the Ministry of Labour Gazette, and that an opening has now been given to the hon. Member for Cardiff, South-East (Mr. Callaghan) to make party capital out of what we think is a very satisfactory piece of work on the part of the Ministry of Labour.

rose—

Order. We cannot debate the matter now.

Suspend the operation of the Transport Act.

To ask the Minister of Labour if, after consultation with the Trades Union Congress he will introduce legislation to make secret ballots compulsory before any strike action is taken.

On a point of order. Do I understand that Question No. 15 has been withdrawn, Sir?

Yes.

I want to protest about a Question containing an innuendo being withdrawn in this way. The withdrawal of the Question has prevented my making a request to the hon. Member for Louth (Mr. Osborne) that he should prove some of these statements. This Question, with these imputations, is slanderous.

I see nothing slanderous in the Question at all.

asked the Minister of Labour whether he is now in a position to state the result of his review of the present system of deferments of farmworkers, with a view to allowing a change of employer within the industry.

asked the Minister of Labour if he has now arrived at a decision regarding the call-up for National Service of farmworkers who transfer from one farm to another; and if he will make a statement.

asked the Minister of Labour whether he will make a further statement about the proposed call-up of farm workers who have transferred from farms after their deferment and for which further applications for deferment are pending.

My right hon. and learned Friend has already explained the difficulties of principle that he feels about this problem. Nevertheless, we recognise the strength of the representations made to us that it would be a serious set-back to production on the small farms if we were to start, at this stage, refusing all applications for further deferment of men who have had deferment on one farm and change their employment. Accordingly, for these practical reasons, we are prepared to allow the old practice to continue for the time being. We propose, however, to review the position again towards the end of next summer in the light of further experience.

Will the hon. Gentleman consult the National Farmers' Union and the unions catering for agricultural workers on this question? Does he realise that there is a great sense of grievance and injustice about tieing men to specific farms or farmers, instead of to the industry generally, which would be an advantage.so far as production is concerned?

That does apply under the present arrangements.

Will my hon. Friend also take into consideration the great concern in Scotland on this subject, and make it clear that the answer he has just given applies to Scotland as well?

Yes, Sir.

asked the Minister of Labour if he will consider taking measures to exempt intending teachers of science and mathematics in secondary schools from military service.

My right hon. and learned Friend has not yet received any representations on this matter.

Is the Minister aware of the very great scarcity of science and mathematics teachers in secondary schools, and of the fact that that scarcity will be considerably increased when the post-war higher birth-rate affects the secondary schools in three years' time? Would it not be in the national interest to give some such inducement as this to science and mathematics graduates to take up the teaching profession?

We still have had no representations.

Are we to assume that the Minister of Education has not made the Minister of Labour aware of the difficulties experienced in this field?

Will my hon. Friend undertake to reconsider the whole question of calling up in peacetime, at considerable expense for training, those who, in no circumstances, would be required to serve in the Armed Forces in wartime?

We are always only too pleased to look at any of these problems, and if my hon. Friend and any other hon. Gentleman likes to make any representations we will certainly consider them.

Will the hon. Gentleman ask his right hon. and learned Friend to review again the work of the Hankey Committee on technical personnel during the war, and to consider whether the time may not have come for possibly a temporary resurrection of that committee?

We will certainly have a look at that.

asked the Minister of Health how many rehabilitation centres were taken over by his Department through the introduction of the National Health Service Act; and what plans he has for extending this service.

On the introduction of the National Health Service, in addition to some 300 hospitals with facilities for rehabilitation, eight residential rehabilitation centres were taken over; seven residential centres for the rehabilitation of miners have since been brought within the Service. There are now 475 hospitals with facilities for rehabilitation, and hospital authorities are encouraged to develop these facilities so far as their resources allow.

Would the Minister circulate a statement in the Official Report to show where these rehabilitation centres are that have been taken over, and his proposals for extending these services?

I am very happy to take any convenient way of giving the House information. If the hon. Gentleman puts down a Written Question I can then circulate the answer in the Official Report.

Is the Minister aware of the anxiety expressed by the Tees-side hospital authorities about the shortage of adequate facilities which have resulted in tens of thousands of man hours being lost each year in that area and has he received any representations from Newcastle-upon-Tyne?

No representations have been received, so far as I am aware. The figures I have given of increase from 300 to 475 hospitals are most impressive. There may well be difficult periods. If the hon. Member likes to write to me about the matter I will take it up.

asked the Minister of Health if he is aware that many old age pensioners cannot afford the necessary chiropody treatment even where this may be offered at a reduced charge; and if he will consider providing chiropody services as part of the National Health Service.

My right hon. Friend regrets that under present circumstances it is not possible to extend the limited chiropody service available under the National Health Service.

Is the hon. Lady aware that the Coventry central committee for old people's welfare feel that for old people chiropody is as important as dental or medical treatment? Is she further aware that although some reduction of the charge has been made in Coventry, it does not cover all old age pensioners? Will she look into the matter again?

I agree that this is a service which, if the finance were available, we should like to be able to provide. I accept the very real benefit of this service to old age pensioners where it is available. But the hon. Lady is aware of the many claims for the extension of existing priority services, and in the present limited economic circumstances we do not think it possible to extend a new service, especially when many other schemes for priority services. which are often suggested by hon. Members on both sides of the House, still remain unfulfilled.

asked the Minister of Health what proposals he has for improving the wages and conditions of staff employed as nurses in mental hospitals.

asked the Minister of Health what effort has been made to make the rates of pay of trained mental nurses more attractive, in view of the shortage of trained staff.

I understand that the rates of pay in mental nursing, including the rates for trained staff, are being referred for settlement by arbitration.

The Minister will be aware that the Parliamentary Secretary gave an undertaking during an Adjournment debate a little time ago that hospital authorities would be instructed to give increased wages and improved conditions forthwith, but that this undertaking has not been complied with. It would appear that the management side of the Whitley Council argued that these suggested increases should not be given to the fully paid staff. Can the Minister say what line he took with regard to these negotiations?

The hon. Member, who has great experience in this field, knows that it is not proper to go into details regarding Whitley Council negotiations. This matter has been referred to arbitration. The terms of reference are being arranged, and I hope that a speedy settlement will result.

Is the Minister aware that during that Adjournment debate the Parliamentary Secretary gave the impression that, in fact, this matter was coming to an early and final conclusion, and that, indeed, only some two days before that debate, this reference to arbitration had taken place? The offers from the management side did not meet the case at all.

That is precisely why the matter is being referred to arbitration.

Will the Minister be good enough to tell us the terms of reference of the arbitration?

They are at present being negotiated.

asked the Minister of Health whether his regulations provide that every year the mental hospital nurse serves counts double for pension purposes.

In calculating the pension of a mental hospital nurse under the National Health Service (Superannuation) Regulations, every year in excess of 20 years' contributing service as such a nurse under the National Health Service is counted as two years. Earlier mental nursing service counts towards this period required before double reckoning is allowable, subject to certain conditions set out in the Regulations.

Is the Minister aware that, again, a rather misleading impression was given by the Parliamentary Secretary in the debate on this subject? According to Hansard, she said that every year served by a mental nurse counts for extra pension. That gives a wholly misleading impression to the country of the advantageous position of mental nurses. Does not that fact strengthen the necessity for giving more speedy attention to the matter of the wages paid to mental nurses if we are to solve this very real problem?

We must certainly look at the whole problem, but I think the hon. Gentleman is making rather heavy weather over the first half of his question. Very many experienced people, with a wide knowledge of mental health problems, were present, and none of them was misled. Indeed, I am informed that my hon. Friend used qualifying words to indicate that there were conditions before the double service counted.

asked the Minister of Health if he will take steps to enable old age pensioners of modest means, who are not in receipt of National Assistance, to be relieved of the liability of paying the charges levied in respect of medical prescriptions; and if he will make a statement.

No, Sir. This matter was fully discussed in the debates on the National Health Service Act last year, and I cannot add anything to what was said in that discussion.

Does not my hon. Friend agree that pensioners who are in receipt of only modest means are, at the end of the week, no better off than persons who receive National Assistance? That being so, should not their needs be given very sympathetic consideration?

I think that my hon. Friend is under a misapprehension, because, if those old age pensioners are in no better position than people in receipt of the standard rate of National Assistance, then they can apply for a refund.

Is the Parliamentary Secretary aware that apart from the hardship to pensioners the Is. prescription charge is causing hardship to an ever growing number of people? Has not the time arrived when this unwarrantable and immoral imposition should be abolished?

All our inquiries and investigations about the payment of this prescription charge have produced no evidence to bear out the hon. Gentleman's allegations. In some of the largest hospitals, in very congested and highly industrialised areas, there is no evidence to show that those who do not qualify for the refund, or who are not in receipt of a supplementary pension, find it any great hardship to pay the prescription charge.

Is there any evidence that the hon. Gentleman opposite thought this proposal immoral when his Government introduced the necessary legislation?

Read Hansard.

On a point of order. The hon. Member for Barry (Mr. Gower) has raised an important point of principle, and I wonder whether you, Mr. Speaker, can guide us in the matter. When an hon. Member is sorry for the way in which he has cast his vote and wishes to modify it, what redress is open to him to explain that he voted for this charge to be put on pensioners?

That does not seem to be a point of order.

asked the Minister of Health the number of aliens who have had free treatment under the National Health Service during the 12 months to the nearest convenient date, and, in particular, what was the number of persons of Egyptian nationality who have so benefited.

I regret that this information is not available.

Is there any information to show that many foreigners are coming here specifically for the purpose of obtaining free treatment? In the interests of the taxpayer, has not the time come to see that this free service is somewhat restricted?

There is not a great deal of evidence of that. The Socialist Party, when in office, took powers under the 1949 Act to make regulations in regard to that and those powers are still available if there is any widespread evidence of abuse.

asked the Minister of Health if he will give details of the scheme prepared by the Derbyshire local health authority, and approved by him, under Section 28 of the National Health Service Act, 1946, giving power to the local health authority to take action, as indicated in circular 5/52, in connection with the short-term care of mental defectives in cases of urgency.

The local health authority have not submitted any scheme to my right hon. Friend in relation to this circular.

Can my hon. Friend say whether, even in the absence of such a scheme, the local health authority in Derbyshire have the power to make short-term arrangements for taking charge, for instance, of mentally defective children when their parents are in a state of collapse?

If the local authority takes advantage of the powers under Section 28 it can board the children out and pay for their maintenance; or arrange for admission to hospital in suitable cases, for which no special power is needed.

In the absence of any action by the Derbyshire County Council to provide these facilities, what action is the Minister taking?

To establish the existing arrangements I would require notice of a further question, but it is within the power of local authorities, and within their local knowledge, to apply for the powers if they feel it is necessary. If the hon. Member desires further information he will, no doubt, put down a Question.

asked the Minister of Health why he has refused a local inquiry into the closing of the Portland Road, Hove, annexe of the Sussex Maternity Hospital, and why expectant mothers in Hove who require lying-in accommodation cannot obtain such accommodation under the National Health Service within their borough, but must go to the county borough of Brighton or the urban district of South-wick.

I do not think I can usefully add to the reply I gave to my hon. and learned Friend on 26th November, 1953.

Is my right hon. Friend aware that in such matters a non-county borough is in a difficult position, because these decisions are made at a county level where the borough is hopelessly outnumbered? The responsibility, therefore, is all the more on the Minister to see that the non-county borough is able to voice its opinion properly. A local inquiry would have done so. My right hon. Friend has never answered that question.

I am satisfied that the decision was a correct one. Although I appreciate my hon. and learned Friend's point about the distinction between a county and a non-county borough, this is not a local authority matter but fundamentally a regional hospital board matter. I have discussed it with the chairman of the regional hospital board, who is satisfied that the decision is right.

asked the Minister of Health in which new towns new hosiptals have been built.

asked the Minister of Health if he will make a statement with regard to the provision of hospital facilities for the new towns.

It is for the regional hospital boards to plan the development of hospital facilities, and I know that the boards for the regions concerned are aware of the needs of the new towns and take them into account. Present limitations on hospital capital development generally have so far prevented any large scale new building to meet these needs and no new hospital has been built. Meanwhile, reliance must be placed on existing hospitals, at many of which additional facilities have been provided.

Is the right hon. Gentleman aware that there is a growing deficiency of hospital accommodation in the new towns, and that the building of new hospitals really ought to keep pace with the increase in population? Will he keep this matter under his very close attention, because the service is definitely lagging behind?

Yes, certainly. I am well aware of the difficulties.

Is the right hon. Gentleman aware that special consideration has been given by all other Departments to other essential services in the new towns? Why is his Department falling behind in this respect? Is he aware that this is quite beyond the powers of any regional hospital board to cope with this problem out of their normal capital resources?

Certainly, and in the region which the hon. Member has in mind I have agreed to meet a deputation to discuss this. It is true, of course, that the cost of a new hospital, which is now anything from £1 million to £4 million, is far too big for it to be possible for a region to provide from its own funds. When new building becomes possible it will have to be met out of central funds.

asked the Minister of Health how many new hospitals are under construction in England and Wales, showing mental hospitals and mental deficiency hospitals separately.

One new mental deficiency hospital near Southport, for which preliminary site works are in progress.

Will the right hon. Gentleman not agree that that is a very disappointing reply? Does he not also agree that this country is steadily falling behind practically every other European country? Is he not aware that in France, Italy, Switzerland and all the Scandinavian countries there are excellent modern post-war hospitals?

I am certainly aware that it has not been possible to build new hospitals since the war; but, after all, none was built in the six years in which the party opposite were in power. At least we are now making a start.

Is the right hon. Gentleman not aware that he told me only a week or two ago, in a Written answer to a Question, that during the first two years of his Government's administration there was less capital expenditure each year for hospitals than in the previous two years?

The right hon. Gentleman must study the allocation for next year.

Has the right hon. Gentleman sufficient staff for his existing hospitals?

In many cases the problems of staff are not so much those of total number as of distribution. There are, and remain, very considerable problems in sanatoria and in the mental field. That is one of the matters that we were discussing earlier in relation to a pay claim that has now gone to arbitration.

asked the Minister of Health whether, in accordance with the terms of his recent letter to the Joint Emergency Committee of the Optical Profession on National Health Service lenses in non-National Health Service frames, persons up to and including the age of 15 years may now be supplied with frames outside the standard range specified in Part III, Section A, and Part IV, Section A, of the Minister's directive, E.C.N. 102; and what charges are applicable.

This would be within the terms of my right hon. Friend's recent letter, but he trusts that parents will select suitable sturdy spectacle frames for their children, and that opticians will encourage them to do so. The charges for frames supplied privately would depend on private contract.

Is this not an alteration of the Act since, under the Schedule, children were formerly only allowed to be supplied with frames under Part IIIA, and two frames under Part IVA?

There was some doubt about that, and therefore, executive councils have been invited, on the ground that the regulations were in some doubt, not to take action against opticians who did so supply frames. It is not illegal to supply children with adult types of National Health Service frames under the regulations.

If there is some doubt about this, surely the Minister should not attempt to alter the Act merely by means of a letter.

He has not altered the Statute. He has given what is regarded as a better interpretation.

asked the Minister of Health whether he can give any information about the results of the steps he has taken to encourage doctors to reduce the cost of their prescribing in order to release funds for improvements elsewhere in the National Health Service.

Yes, Sir. While the average cost of a prescription has hitherto increased progressively every year since the National Health Service started, I am glad to say that in August the estimated cost fell to about 1½d. less than in August, 1952. This was maintained in September and there was a further reduction to 2d. in October.

I am glad to have this opportunity to thank the Joint Committee on Prescribing for their valuable work in classifying preparations, and the General Medical Services Committee of the British Medical Association and the whole body of general practitioners for their co-operation in producing this encouraging result.

Can my right hon. Friend say whether this very satisfactory result follows upon the advice given to general practitioners about prescribing drugs of doubtful therapeutic value?

It seems almost certain that the two are linked, because the letter to which my hon. Friend refers was sent out by my Chief Medical Officer on 18th July, and the first noticeable drop was in the month following.

Will the right hon. Gentleman consider giving instructions to doctors not to prescribe certain drugs if there is an equivalent in the National Formulary?

I think that would be too big an interference with the ordinary discretion of doctors. In view of the satisfactory results of co-operation, I think we should continue along these lines.

Is the Minister aware that this is precisely the practice in Scotland?

Can the Minister say, in judging what sort of savings have been effected, whether the number of prescriptions has gone up or down?

My impression is that the number itself is about the same, but I will give details if the hon. and gallant Gentleman wants them.

asked the Minister of Health what progress he has made in collecting information from local authorities concerning the services and amenities offered to old people resident in homes run by the local authorities as mentioned by him on 26th October last; and if he will consider publishing a booklet containing this information for the benefit of local authorities and of Members.

A comprehensive picture can be drawn from the reports of my right hon. Friend's inspecting officers. My right hon. Friend does not feel that publication of a booklet as suggested by the hon. Lady would be the best way of making use of this material, but he is considering including in the Annual Report of the Department for 1953 a short section showing progress and developments since the National Assistance Act came into force in 1948.

While thanking the hon. Lady for the last part of her reply, may I ask whether she is aware that these services and amenities vary very much from local authority to local authority and that the more bias the authority has towards the pensioner the better use the old folk can make of the small amount of money left to them? Will she try to make the reference as comprehensive as possible?

I agree with the hon. Lady that there is great diversity in local authority homes as well as diversity in the type of resident, from the extremely infirm to the comparatively able-bodied. We feel that a better result can be achieved by the inspecting officers, who can pass on and recommend the better practice of the good areas to the less good areas and probably achieve more by so doing than we could by publishing a booklet.

asked the Minister of Health why Mr. C. E. S. Joyce, Ottershaw, had to wait from 29th April, 1953, to 27th October, 1953,for his artificial arm, which was delivered at Roehampton for repairs on the earlier date.

The delay was due to the need for major repairs, the abnormal volume of repair work falling on the contractor, and a shortage of staff in his Department owing to sickness. I should add that a duplicate, said to be satisfactory, was available for use, and as soon as this was reported early in October to be uncomfortable, immediate action was taken to complete the repairs.

Six months is rather a long time. I have since heard of an officer, a Mr. Denham, of the British Limbless Ex-Serviceman's Association, who waited 3½ months for an artificial, below-the-knee leg. Cannot the Minister get his Parliamentary Secretary, who, in my constituency advertised her knowledge of "old sweats," to go and talk to some of these "old sweats"?

I very much regret this delay, which was far too long, and I am genuinely grateful to the hon. Member for drawing it to my attention. I will look into it myself.

asked the Minister of Health the average time taken, from delivery at Roehampton to return to the amputee, for repairs to artificial arms during the periods January to July, 1953, and August to November, 1953.

The average time taken for repairs to artificial arms was 50 days and 70 days respectively.

asked the Minister of Health the average time taken, from delivery at Roehampton to return to amputee, for repairs to artificial legs during periods January to July and August to November, 1953.

The average time taken for repairs to artificial legs was 30 days and 35 days respectively.

Is it not apparent that, since the Ministry of Pensions has ceased to have responsibility for these repairs, there has been a longer time lag? Will the Minister do his best to see that Roehampton is not penalised by the change in administration?

I will certainly do my best, but I really think that to suggest that a firm which is providing artificial limbs for ex-Service men is going to alter its skill and time of delivery purely because there has been a Departmental change is quite unworthy of the hon. Gentleman.

I am making no imputation at all against the firm, but against the change in administration, because, after all, they have to work under the administration of the right hon. Gentleman's Department.

Can my right hon. Friend give us an absolute assurance that the fact that the two Ministries have merged has no relevance whatever to the increased time involved in repairs?

None at all.

asked the Minister of Health with which local authorities he has been able to arrange experiments in the fluoridation of water supplies before a decision is taken as to whether it should be generally adopted.

This matter is still under consideration, and no authority has yet been approached.

In view of the importance of this matter and the fact that several weeks ago it was announced in the House that arrangements would be made with local authorities, can the Parliamentary Secretary say when progress is likely to be made?

I do not accept the implication that no progress has been made. In choosing a particular area for a study of this kind, great care has to be taken regarding the size and compactness of the area, and also its water supply. That study is now being carried out, but the decision as to the exact areas has not yet been made.

asked the Minister of Health if he will prescribe separate regulations and conditions of issue of motor-propelled tricycles for limbless and other badly wounded ex-Service men, distinct from those for National Health Service patients, so as to ensure that any necessary restrictions and economies in connection with this scheme for National Health Service patients do not have adverse repercussions on the much smaller numbers of war-disabled pensioners affected.

My hon. and gallant Friend appears to be under some misapprehension. This matter is not governed by regulations and I am not aware of any restrictions or economies which have had or are likely to have the effect he foresees.

Will my right hon. Friend bear in mind that this is not my own apprehension, but the apprehension of the very severely disabled ex-Service men who feel that their claim may well be overlooked and swamped by the very much larger claims of the civilian population?

I understand the point which my hon. and gallant Friend is putting to me, but he will be aware that, with the exception of cars, there is no differentiation between war pensioners and those who suffer such disabilities in the ordinary way of life.

asked the Minister of Health if he will take steps to transfer the administration of day nurseries from the Middlesex County Council to those county district councils of Middlesex who are willing to accept the responsibility.

No, Sir, and in any case the county district councils have no power to provide day nurseries.

That is precisely what I am asking the right hon. Gentleman to take powers to do. Is the hon. Lady aware that when the Middlesex County Council took over the day nurseries from the district councils they showed great indifference, and even hostility, and that their administrative policy is leading to a disintegration of the service and, finally, to its elimination? Before that stage of elimination arrives will the hon. Lady give the district councils the opportunity to take over these day nurseries again so that they may continue?

My right hon. Friend is satisfied that the Middlesex County Council will continue to meet the needs for this day nursery accommodation as necessary. He does not feel it advisable to introduce what would necessarily be legislation to meet the extension for which the hon. Gentleman has asked.

asked the Minister of Health if he will give a direction to the Middlesex County Council that the children of Service men shall not be excluded from day nurseries where the wife is compelled to seek employment because of the inadequacy of the Service allowance.

No, Sir. My right hon. Friend is satisfied that Service families have their needs considered by the county council on the same grounds as other families.

Under the new formula for admission that means, in fact, that children of Service men will be put outside the day nurseries of Middlesex.

Question.

The hon. Member should ask a question, and not make a statement.

Is the hon. Lady aware of what I have said, that she is really misinformed on this point, and that if she will make inquiries she will find that there is some substance in the Question I have put down?

From the information at my right hon. Friend's disposal we have an assurance from the Middlesex County Council that their new proposals will not alter their existing priority categories for admission to day nurseries, so the position of a Service family should be in no way worsened from its former position.

asked the Minister of Health whether he is satisfied with the number of newly-qualified doctors entering the two-year training period prior to qualifying for acceptance as medical officers of health.

My right hon. Friend understands that there has recently been some increase in the numbers, but he would be glad to see a still larger number of doctors taking this qualification.

asked the Minister of Health to what extent the appropriate authorities are having difficulty in filling vacancies in the medical officer of health service.

I am informed that the difficulties which were experienced shortly after the war in filling vacancies to the public health service are now much less, but my right hon. Friend is keeping the position under review.

Although the difficulties may be less, is the hon. Lady aware that they are still causing considerable concern in responsible professional circles, that in the past there has been a tendency in the medical profession rather to look down upon the doctor who goes into public service of this type, and that this situation should be rectified by Government encouragement?

The hon. Member will be aware that post-graduate training is under the universities and does not come under the Ministry, but we have had not representations from local authorities, county councils, or the like, that they are experiencing any great difficulty in filling vacancies of this kind. Were we to receive such representations they would be seriously considered.

Is the Minister satisfied that the salaries paid to medical officers of health compare fairly with those earned by the profession outside and by other local government officers?

That is very much another question and has many implications. Perhaps the hon. Member would like to put down a Question.

asked the Minister of Health why information and statistics about tuberculosis and its incidence in Wales, which were collated by the Welsh Board of Health and published by his Department before the last war, are no longer available; if he will arrange for such information to be published in the same way as formerly; and if he will make a statement.

Separate information and statistics about tuberculosis in Wales continue to be available, but, like other general information relating to the health services, they are not separated when published in the Ministry's Annual Report for England and Wales. I will certainly consider my hon. Friend's suggestion.

Will my right hon. Friend seriously consider this matter? Is he aware that the Welsh Tuberculosis Campaign Committee is sadly handicapped in its work by the lack of information which was formerly available?

I will certainly consider it. It will, of course, add greatly to the length of the Report to give the information in the terms suggested. My right hon. and learned Friend the Home Secretary has said that there is to be an annual digest of Welsh statistics, and it may well be that it can find a useful place in that.

Is the Minister aware that these figures were published before the war, and in any digest to be published will he give the figures of those who have to pay for their medicine although suffering from T.B., because they would be new figures?

I am not sure that that particular division is a feasible one, but I will certainly consider this matter and see how best the information may be given.

asked the Prime Minister on what basis the amount of fissile material estimated to be available in 1954 will be divided between military purposes and civil purposes, respectively.

I am advised that it would not be in the public interest to answer the hon. Member's Question.

Will the right hon. Gentleman bear in mind the great concern that is felt, not only among scientists and workers in nuclear research but among the public generally, that in the interests of world peace the greatest possible amount of fissile material should be available for industrial and economic purposes?

Yes, I will certainly bear that in mind.

asked the Prime Minister what discussions he had at Bermuda with President Eisenhower with regard to enlarging the exchange of information between this country and the United States of America about atomic weapons and atomic research.

That is just what I am going to tell the House a little later.

asked the Minister of Education (1) on what grounds her Department is rejecting applications for a 75 per cent. grant in respect of courses in architecture in technological institutions;

The special rate of grant is intended to encourage the development of advanced courses in technology which will lead directly to an increase of industrial efficiency and productivity. I regret that I cannot regard the subjects mentioned by the hon. Member as satisfying these conditions.