asked the Minister of Transport and Civil Aviation if he will direct the Road Research Laboratory to draft a code of standards of safety in vehicle design dealing with visibility, controllability, braking, lighting, and fitments; if, upon receipt of such a draft code, he will review the Motor Vehicles (Construction and Use) Regulations; and if he will then take steps to bring those Regulations into line with such code.

As my hon. Friend will be aware, the Road Research Laboratory is the responsibility of my noble Friend the Lord President of the Council, and it is not, therefore, for me to give any such direction as is suggested. I am, however, in close touch with the Lord President and the Laboratory, and make full use of the results of the Laboratory's work in this and other directions.

Is it not the case that the Road Research Laboratory has in recent years made some very valuable investigations and reports on this subject? Does not my right hon. Friend think that it would be wise, having regard to the change in the design of cars during recent years, to bring these Regulations up-to-date?

The process of keeping them up-to-date is a continuing one, but I share my hon. Friend's obvious appreciation of the extremely valuable work which the officers of the Road Research Laboratory are doing.

asked the Minister of Transport and Civil Aviation if he will try to arrange that possession of international certificates for motor vehicles and international driving permits shall no longer be necessary for motorists visiting any country in Western Europe.

The elimination of these documents is one of the aims of the 1949 Convention on Road Traffic, and should be achieved in Western Europe when all the countries concerned have become parties to that Convention.

Can my right hon. Friend say when the other parties who have not yet ratified the Convention are likely to do so?

I am afraid it is very difficult to speculate when foreign Governments will take action of that sort.

asked the Minister of Transport and Civil Aviation the average time that persons living in Heston and Isleworth and who wish to take the driving test have to wait between applying for the test and being tested.

Nine to 10 weeks. I am taking steps to reduce it.

asked the Minister of Transport and Civil Aviation whether he is now able to announce his decision in reference to car owners leaving them without lights on the street if within 100 yards of public lighting.

I cannot at the moment add anything to the answer I gave to the hon. Member's Question on 26th January.

Will the Minister say when he will be able to bring in these regulations, in view of the fact that it was never necessary to have them at all?

I am not quite sure whether the hon. Gentleman wants me to introduce regulations or not, but the position is that I have now received the views of the organizations which, as I indicated in my earlier statement, have to be consulted, and I am considering them.

Is the Minister aware that the suggestion contained in the Question will be very widely welcomed, and that, in the meantime, there is a discrepancy in treatment by the police in different areas which is causing a very unfortunate situation for motorists?

It is because of that that I initiated action on this matter, but I think the hon. Gentleman will appreciate that it is wise in these matters to take the views of the various interests concerned before actually drafting the regulations.

asked the Minister of Transport and Civil Aviation if he will take steps to make compulsory the fixing of rubber flaps on the rear mudguards of road vehicles.

Mud flaps are not wholly effective and are often unnecessary. The Regulations already require the provision of wings or other similar fittings to catch so far as practicable the mud or water thrown up by the wheels, and I do not think that any further compulsory requirements would be feasible.

Is my right hon. Friend aware how dangerous it is to drive on a wet road, with mud being thrown back on to the windscreen, and how much easier it is to follow a public service vehicle or a petrol lorry, which have these mud flaps? Does not my right hon. Friend think it is dangerous to have mud thrown back on one's windscreen?

I do not think that the contribution mud flaps could make, additional to what can be made by the wings, would justify my introducing further compulsions.

asked the Minister of Transport and Civil Aviation if he will make an order for the discontinuance of flashing car indicators.

The Road Research Laboratory is making an investigation into the use of various types of flashing indicators, and I will review the whole question when I receive its report.

Has my right hon. Friend not experienced difficulty when following these flashing lights, particularly as one's foot might slip and put on the foot brake? They are very misleading. On the other hand, indicators that go straight out tell one surely whether a car is going to the right or to the left. Is it not a fact that, in the past, winks have led many a man into trouble?

As to the last part of my hon. Friend's supplementary question, I must bow to his superior knowledge. As regards the main part of it, he will recall that these indicators were authorised only on 1st January, 1954, with a view to assisting the export trade. In view of the investigation to which I have referred, and in view of the short time that these indicators have been operating, I ought to keep an eye on them a little longer.

Is not the Minister aware that these flashing car indicators have, in that short time, added a great deal to the confusion for even the most sober driver who is following behind them? Will he bear in mind that the sober driver already has to contend with traffic lights, flashing beacons, and what not? Please do not add to his difficulties.

There is a good deal in what the hon. and gallant Gentleman has said, but he will appreciate that these indicators are of different types and that the objections apply more strongly to some than to others.

asked the Minister of Transport and Civil Aviation whether he is now in a position to make a further statement about the steps he proposes to take on the question of universal headlamp dipping.

No, Sir.

Early in 1952, when the attention of the right hon. Gentleman's predecessor was drawn to the matter, we were told that his predecessor was awaiting the result of an international conference in America. The right hon. Gentleman himself told me four months ago that he was considering the matter. When are we likely to get some satisfaction for the drivers of public service vehicles, who believe that to make this practice universal would lessen the danger of driving at night?

We try to proceed jointly with other countries. I understand that the report of the International Committee is expected this spring. To a considerable extent, I share the hon. Gentleman's impatience.

Why has the right hon. Gentleman to wait for other countries? Most of them drive by the right while we drive by the left. We are going further left—in case the right hon. Gentleman does not realise it. Will he consider saying in his instruction that all motorists must extinguish their nearside headlight and deflect the offside light? That is the only safe way.

I would not go as far as the right hon. Gentleman. As he will appreciate, it is possible to be dazzled on the left as well as on the right.

In the meantime, will my right hon. Friend deal with the similar problem of the unnecessary use of fog lights? The police never seem to check on the number of cars on the road that only use the left-hand sidelight, which is extremely dangerous. I never heard of the police checking on either of these two points.

I will gladly look into the suggestions made by my hon. Friend, but police enforcement is more a matter for my right hon. and gallant Friend the Home Secretary than for me.

asked the Minister of Transport and Civil Aviation what steps are being taken by the licensing authori- ties in an endeavour to maintain adequate omnibus services in the rural areas.

There is constant informal consultation between operators and licensing authorities, which frequently results in existing unremunerative country services being preserved and new or experimental services promoted. Licensing authorities also assist, for example, by authorising, where desirable, variations in timing and routing, the combining of services, and the running of buses without conductors.

Is it not a fact that, in spite of the efforts of the licensing authorities, bus services are being withdrawn from rural areas all over the country, and will my right hon. Friend see whether other steps cannot be taken to assist the operators to make these services pay?

I agree with my hon. Friend that there is cause for a good deal of concern in this matter, but he will appreciate that I have no powers to compel the operation of services, and that probably the best method of dealing with this matter is along the lines outlined in my original answer.

Does not the right hon. Gentleman think that, in the light of his experience, and the Government's decision of last July that these bus undertakings are commercial undertakings and not public service undertakings, we are bound to have a continual withdrawal of these services until we have a nationalised public service, run for the public convenience?

I do not altogether like the implication of the hon. Gentleman's suggestion that a nationalised service must necessarily be unremunerative.

Will my right hon. Friend invite the attention of the Chancellor of the Exchequer to this problem in order that he may consider it very deeply?

I am sure that my right hon. Friend is aware of all the relevant considerations.

asked the Minister of Transport and Civil Aviation whether he is aware that county councils are refusing to accept as evidence of an applicant having passed a driving test the production of a War Office driving licence; and whether he will ensure that this evidence, when properly completed and in order, is accepted.

Military drivers who pass the official driving test are issued with Army form A2039, and this is accepted by county councils. Councils cannot, however, accept the driving permit (Army form A2038) sometimes issued to soldiers, as the issue of this permit does not depend on passing the official test.

asked the Minister of Transport and Civil Aviation if he has considered the evidence sent by the hon. Member for Cardiff, South-East, concerning breaches of the law; and if he will make a special investigation into the hours worked by private enterprise lorry drivers and the condition of their lorries.

Yes, Sir. I have seen the newspaper cutting which the hon. Member was good enough to send me. It does not identify any case in which a charge could be brought. I do not accept the implication that there is a general disregard for the law either by private enterprise employers or by their employees.

As this was not a newspaper cutting except in a technical sense—it was a detailed newspaper article written by a special investigator for a reputable newspaper in the North of England—does not the Minister think that he has a responsibility for doing a little more than dismiss it in this way? Does not the article reinforce the allegations which are made constantly to us? Has he not a responsibility for asking his licensing authorities throughout the country to go into these matters to see how well-founded these charges are?

The hon. Gentleman knows that the article, which is most interesting, contains no specific allegations on which proceedings could be brought, because it does not identify individual cases. It is rather a flimsy foundation for a general charge against both sides of an important industry. But my licensing authorities are always anxious to secure that the law is observed, and work extremely hard to that end.

Is the Minister aware that in all the technical Press—whether it be "Motor Transport" or "Headlight" or any of the other papers—there have appeared recently a large number of cases indicating that there is a breach of the law in this respect? Is he deceiving himself into believing that there has not been an increase in this practice since the 1953 Act came into force?

As I have said, I am always ready to consider evidence in respect of particular breaches of the law, but the hon. Member knows perfectly well that it is not possible to proceed in this kind of matter, involving possible prosecutions, on the basis of general allegations, however sincere.

asked the Minister of Transport and Civil Aviation to what extent his Department analyses road accidents in relation to make and model of car involved; and what conclusions have been drawn from such analyses as to dangerous features in vehicle design.

Statistical analyses of vehicles involved in road accidents by make and model are not undertaken by my Department. Some work is being done on analyses of this kind by the Road Research Laboratory, but I understand that it cannot yet report any precise results.

My technical officers are, however, constantly on the watch for the disclosure, in service as well as in accidents, of faults in vehicle design which may affect safety. Such faults are brought to the notice of manufacturers where necessary, and many improvements have been secured.

asked the Minister of Transport and Civil Aviation when the statistics for road accidents for 1954 will be published; and if he will make available to the House the statistics of road accidents for the first six months of 1954 immediately.

Figures for the whole year 1954 should be published this month. I am circulating in the Official Report a summary of the figures for January to June, 1954.

Will the right hon. Gentleman tell me why he has not yet published the statistics for 1953? The answer which he gave a few weeks ago was, in my judgment, rather an excuse. Shall we get the statistics for 1953 before we get those for 1954, because we can better assess the blame when we have the full statistics? I congratulate the right hon. Gentleman's Department on the statistics that it has published, because when they are published they are very full.

I am obliged to the hon. Gentleman for the last part of his supplementary question. The figures for 1953 have been published. What I think he is concerned about is the rather elaborate statistical analysis of the figures for these years, and an elaborate statistical analysis takes a little time.

asked the Minister of Transport and Civil Aviation if he has considered representations from the Heston and Isleworth Borough Council regarding the proposed South Wales Radial Road to the effect that steps should be taken to protect the interests of owners of property likely to be affected; and what action he proposes to take to meet this request.

Representations were received in my Department and have been referred to my right hon. Friend the Minister of Housing and Local Government for consideration in connection with the Middlesex Development Plan, which is now before him. Before the line of this road can be fixed, I shall have to publish a draft scheme under the Special Roads Act, 1949, and the statutory procedure provides for the lodging of objections.

Is it possible for the Minister to say when such a scheme is likely to be published? Would he bear in mind that the present uncertainty about the future of this road, which may take anything up to 20 years to build, is having an adverse effect on the value of property?

I can appreciate that, but I cannot add anything to what I said in my original answer.

asked the Minister of Transport and Civil Aviation if he is yet prepared to impose a speed limit of 40 miles per hour on the Great West Road, Middlesex.

No, Sir. I propose to await the Report of the London and Home Counties Traffic Advisory Committee, which, as I recently announced, is at my request examining speed-limit questions in the London traffic area.

Will my right hon. Friend bear in mind that it is very difficult indeed for vehicles to pull up at traffic lights if they are travelling at between 70 and 80 miles an hour? There are frequently the most dreadful accidents on the Great West Road.

It is a difficult road, and that is just the sort of problem which has caused me to put all these difficult questions to my Home Counties Traffic Advisory Committee so as to get general proposals for dealing with them.

Would my right hon. Friend consider the great advantage of keeping the traffic flowing rather than slowing it down, and of expediting it rather than having it coagulating in clots because of traffic lights every few hundred yards, and then being released in a racing, struggling mass? Could he not arrange for the cutting down of the duration or frequency of the time allowed for crossing?

That is just the sort of point one has to consider on this subject.

Is not the real remedy for these difficulties in traffic flow in and out of London to have a large number of tunnels and overhead bridges for pedestrians, rather than to interfere with the road traffic?

I agree with the right hon. Gentleman that tunnels can be extremely useful. That is why a certain number of them are proposed in my programme.

asked the Minister of Transport and Civil Aviation if, in view of the improvement of the flow of traffic at Brent Bridge and Neasden Circus on the North Circular Road since roundabouts were replaced by traffic lights, he will reconsider all road improvement schemes involving the construction of roundabouts wherever the traffic is dense.

I agree that there has been an improvement. The roundabouts in question were too small, and it was not possible to enlarge them. But roundabouts of proper size are sometimes extremely effective, and I shall look at each case on the merits.

Will my right hon. Friend bear in mind that it is not only the volume of traffic at the roundabouts that makes them awkward, but the inconvenience to drivers? Is he aware that Hyde Park Corner is about the worst place on earth to drive round because traffic on each side has to be watched? Will he take that into account in future road improvements?

Certainly, Sir, but in the proper places roundabouts are useful and are the right answer.

asked the Minister of Transport and Civil Aviation whether he is aware of the concern felt by motorists regarding the present practice of laying deep kerbstones along the sides of arterial roads especially where such roads are wide enough only for two lanes of traffic; and what action he proposes in this matter.

Yes, Sir. I am proposing to amend the general advice about kerbs as at present set out in Memorandum 575 of October, 1943, and Memorandum 653 of August, 1950.

While thanking the Minister for that answer, may I ask him to bear in mind the dangerous nature of these high kerbstones, particularly to motor cyclists? Would he advise county councils to institute more sloping kerbstones than are being used?

The purpose of the Memoranda to which I referred was to advise county councils. The circular will have the same purpose.

What the motorist wants is a kerb that he can get over. Is that idea embodied in the instruction?

The fact that a motorist wants to get over the kerb has a rather different effect on one's mind according to which side of the kerb one is. The needs of motorists are very relevant in this respect. A high, vertical kerb does add to danger on the roads.

Is it not an additional irritation to observe these kerbs going down, at considerable expense, on roads which we know are to be widened before long? Will my right hon. Friend look into this point?

Sometimes these kerbs are required for engineering reasons, as the road would collapse if we did not have them.

asked the Minister of Transport and Civil Aviation whether, in considering the introduction of parking meters, he will protect the interests of commercial travellers who might be adversely affected by such a system.

It is precisely in order to protect the legitimate interests of motorists, including commercial travellers. who wish to leave their cars for short periods in congested urban areas that the experimental use of parking meters is being commended to Parliament.

asked the Minister of Transport and Civil Aviation what steps he is proposing to take to abate the flooding of Captain Newlove's farm and the surrounding area in Woodmansey in the East Riding of Yorkshire caused by the new culvert on the Hull—Beverley road which was built by the East Riding County Council in March, 1950.

As my hon. Friend is aware, full responsibility in respect of the flooding of Captain Newlove's farm has not been accepted by my Department. Experts representing both Captain New love and my Department have now agreed on a remedial drainage scheme and details of this are at present being prepared.

While thanking my right hon. Friend for that reply, may I inquire why nearly five years have elapsed before steps have been taken to deal with this matter?

The main reasons are two. In the first place, this began as a matter of litigation, and it was only after the settlement of the intended proceedings that it was possible to investigate the details and the rights of third parties also involved.

asked the Minister of Transport and Civil Aviation how many road traffic accidents occurred on the experimental surface on the Dumfries—Carlisle, A75, road opposite Rockhall Mains Farm in 1952, 1953 and 1954; and how many claims against his Department have been made as a result of such accidents.

This length of road has not had an experimental surface. Accidents on it involving personal injury were five in 1952, 6 in 1953 and one in 1954. There was one claim against my Department in 1953.

Is my right hon. Friend aware that there is a notice at this junction of roads saying that it is an experimental surface?

Perhaps my hon. Friend will put down that question, because my information is that, whatever the notice says, it is not.

asked the Minister of Transport and Civil Aviation which authority was responsible for the design and what was the respective cost of two footbridges recently constructed alongside the bridges carrying A.6 main road over the main railway line at Clifton in West-morland and over the River Eamont at the boundary of Westmorland and Cumberland.

These bridges were erected on my behalf by the Westmorland County Council. I accept full responsibility for them. Their cost was £1,406 and £3,400 respectively.

Will my right hon. Friend look into the design of these two bridges, because one is much more costly than the other and also much uglier, and since the uglier one is constructed alongside one of the most beautiful bridges in the North of England, it seems rather a pity that his Department, through its agents, should be responsible for work of this sort?

The "ugly one" was put alongside the beautiful one—by which, I presume, my hon. Friend means the second one mentioned in the Question—because the problem there is that the original one is a very fine ancient monument, protected by the Ministry of Works. It was thought desirable, whilst providing safe accommodation for pedestrians, not to alter its construction, and, therefore, we had to build another one.

asked the Minister of Transport and Civil Aviation whether his attention has been drawn to the "No Parking" signs placed on the pavements outside the Dorchester Hotel in Park Lane; and whether he will cause these signs to be removed on the grounds that they have no validity and obstruct the pavements.

I have asked the Westminster City Council, as highway authority, to look into this.

Is my right hon. Friend aware that there are appearing over London many of these pavement signs which are quite illegal and obstruct the traffic, and also that signs are appearing on the sides of houses and business premises, saying, "No Parking," for which there is no legal validity whatever?

In the first place, action on that is for the highway authority, which in the case to which my hon. Friend refers is the Westminster City Council. I will gladly draw the attention of whatever highway authority is concerned to any case which my hon. Friend has in mind.

asked the Minister of Transport and Civil Aviation the major improvements sanctioned for the county of Cumberland arising from the expanded road programme.

I have as yet nothing to add to my statement of 2nd February.

asked the Minister of Transport and Civil Aviation (1) if he will authorise, during the financial year 1955–56, a road development scheme for west Cumberland; (2) what individual road schemes for west Cumberland he will authorise during 1956–57, 1957–58, and 1958–59,

I have nothing to add at present to my statement of 2nd February, for the reason then given.

Will the Minister really give us something more definite? Cumberland feels that it is being neglected. This is a large Development Area, and there is an enormous atomic energy factory. A major road is urgently needed in the area. Will he do something about it?

I have well in mind the needs of Cumberland and the facts to which the right hon. Gentleman has referred, but he will realise that there is no part of the country which could not make a similar request.

I have stressed that we have an enormous atomic energy factory in the area. Will the Minister bear in mind that he has already cut down the maintenance grant for trunk roads in the county for 1955–56, and as this will cause hardship, will he reconsider his decision?

There is no question of reconsideration. I have recently asked all highway authorities to submit schemes to me, and I have no doubt that Cumberland will take part in replying to that invitation.

May I ask my right hon. Friend to pay attention to the needs of west Cumberland? Not only have we there an important and developing industrial area but one that is virtually cut off from the rest of England. Its access either north or south is a very narrow and circuitous route between sea and hills. The need for this consideration is very pressing.

asked the Minister of Transport and Civil Aviation if he will consult with the Cumberland County Council and the Cumberland Development Council with a view to the authorisation of a comprehensive road programme for west Cumberland.

I have already invited the county council to submit its proposals for classified roads and shall consult it, in the normal way, about trunk road schemes. The Cumberland Development Council is, of course, always free to express its views to me or the county council.

For the reasons I have given, will the Minister consult them in a special way? There is strong feeling about this matter. We are geographically isolated, and if the area is to develop it must have good road communications.

I am well aware of the problems of this area, and I shall be perfectly happy to listen to any recommendations or views that either of the bodies mentioned care to express.

asked the Minister of Transport and Civil Aviation if he is aware that in built-up areas of our cities and towns there are few places for pedestrians to cross the roads; that pedestrian crossings have been reduced by about 66 per cent. since1951, so that now there are only two or three pedestrian crossings to every mile of main road; and if he will consider having placed in the centre of wide roads, posts or islands to assist pedestrians crossing the roads where no zebra or police-controlled crossings are in existence, and take steps to make it obligatory for local authorities to carry out these improvements in the interest of road safety.

The number of uncontrolled pedestrian crossings was reduced by about 60 per cent. in 1951, when striping was introduced. This step has greatly increased the respect for these crossings shown both by motorists and by pedestrians. The cost of constructing approved pedestrian refuges on classified roads is accepted for grant. The need for each refuge has to be judged on its merits, and I do not think a general power compelling local highway authorities to provide them would be desirable.

Is the right hon. Gentleman aware that in the City of Liverpool there were 571 pedestrian crossings in 1951, and that at the present time there are only 153 in 35 miles of double carriageway and very many miles of main roads? My reasons for putting the Question is the fact that there are only two or three crossings for every mile of main road. Where are pedestrians to cross the road in safety, if they are to avoid accidents?

I know that the hon. Gentleman does not agree with the reduction in the number of these crossings which was effected in 1951, but I think that he must give due weight to the fact that it is possible to cross much more safely at the existing ones than it was before these reductions took place.

Is the right hon. Gentleman aware that many old people have to cross roads 60 or 70 feet wide, which they are afraid to cross because there is no special place for them, and that they may have to walk a quarter of a mile to get to a safe crossing?

This is a difficult question, but we have to weigh against the desirability of having frequent crossings the even greater desirability of securing respect for those that there are. It is a matter of balancing one consideration with the other. I think that our policy is right, but I know that the hon. Gentleman does not.

Can the right hon. Gentleman do anything to encourage, where the road is wide enough, the placing of refuges to assist pedestrians to cross?

As I said in the last part of my main answer, this is a matter in the first place for the local highway authorities, and I have never found them unwilling to put forward reasonable proposals.

asked the Minister of Transport and Civil Aviation how many persons were killed or seriously injured on zebra crossings during 1953 and 1954, respectively.

Eighty-nine persons were killed and 686 seriously injured on zebra crossings during 1953. The corresponding figures for 1954 were 80 persons killed and 785 seriously injured.

Do not these figures represent a very substantial increase in the number of people killed and seriously injured on zebra crossings in 1954 as compared with 1953? How does the Minister reconcile that fact with his statement a month or two ago that increased respect is being shown for pedestrian crossings and that the accident rate is being reduced? Does not this show that the zebra crossings are an absolute failure?

I do not think the hon. and gallant Gentleman can base that conclusion on this evidence because, in fact, though the number seriously injured increased in 1954 as against 1953, the number killed shows a reduction.

Will the right hon. Gentleman consider publicising the suggestion to the general public that they should not step off the footpath after a car has passed the 15 ft. studs? I think that would tend to reduce these accidents.

I will certainly consider that suggestion.

In view of the unsatisfactory nature of the reply, I wish to give notice that I shall raise the matter on the Adjournment.

asked the Minister of Transport and Civil Aviation what schemes for road improvements he intends to sanction, or has already recently sanctioned, for the counties of Nottingham and Derby.

With the hon. Member's permission I will circulate in the Official Report a list of schemes in these counties which have been sanctioned or committed since 1st April, 1954. As regards the future I cannot at present add to my statement of 2nd February.

Is the Minister aware that a considerable number of existing roads are in a very bad state of repair and require a good deal of alteration? I am thinking particularly of the A.6 road, which is his responsibility, where an old Bailey bridge takes a single line of traffic over the river.

I shall, of course, look at each of these schemes as it is put forward, but, for the reasons which I gave in my statement on 2nd February, I cannot go further in announcing authorisations at this stage.

asked the Minister of Transport and Civil Aviation the respective estimates if the Linthouse Tunnel is made complete as one operation and alternatively in two or more stages.

asked the Minister of Transport and Civil Aviation if he will give an estimate of the relative cost of building the two tunnels at Linthouse together, and of building them as separate projects, starting the second immediately on completion of the first.

The estimated cost of the entire twin-tunnel scheme is about £5 million, and it is not expected that, with suitable co-ordination, authorisation of the tunnels in succession will increase the cost.

Can the Minister say whether the scheme includes the gas, electricity and water services which are required to pass under the Clyde? Is it not desirable that there should not be three or four public utilities making tunnels under the Clyde, but that the work on gas, electricity, and water services, as well as on the road, should be embodied in one great operation?

My answer related—as I understood, perhaps wrongly, the right hon. Gentleman's question to relate—to the roads crossing by way of a tunnel. If the right hon. Gentleman had in mind tunnels for other utilities I should be grateful if he would put down another Question, although I doubt whether it would be addressed to me.

The proposition is that one tunnel should be used for all those purposes and that there should not be a number of tunnels. Is the Minister coordinating with his fellow-Ministers to see that there is not a duplication or multiplication of work? The greatest economy is achieved by doing all these things in one operation.

I would rather not answer that question without notice, though I am bound to say that I have a great deal of sympathy with the right hon. Gentleman's point of view.

Is the Minister aware that his figures will have value only if the second tunnel is started immediately the first is completed?

My figures are based on proper co-ordination, which is the expression I used. If the hon. Gentleman thinks that that is proper co-ordination, as he has suggested, I have no doubt that we should not quarrel very much.

By "proper co-ordination" does the Minister mean that the second tunnel will start immediately the first is finished? Otherwise his figures are valueless.

The figures are a result of calculations of what can be done. I certainly do not propose to add to my answer.

asked the Minister of Transport and Civil Aviation whether he will give an assurance that the toll schemes which he is considering will be limited to certain costly bridges and tunnels, and will not be applied to stretches of highways or to motorways.

No, Sir. I have nothing to add on this subject to what I said in the course of my statement on 2nd February.

Is not the Minister aware that in any case there is a considerable amount of feeling against the introduction of tolls, but, if he does introduce them, will he keep them within very small limits?

I do not think that there is any need to add to what I said. The hon. Member will recall that I related tolls specifically to certain very large and costly schemes of national importance.

Since more roads and bridges will benefit the whole of the community, would it not be a mistake to make motorists, by means of these tolls, pay more than their fair share?

That is a debatable question, but I do not think that it arises on this one.

May I ask the Minister not to hold up any of these projects because of the argument about tolls? Once the bridges are there we can deal with the question of tolls at any time.

Is my right hon. Friend not aware of the great strength of feeling there is in the country against the whole idea of going back to tolls—[HON. MEMBERS: "No tolls."]—and that our hope is that we shall get rid of some of the existing tolls as soon as possible?

Of course my hon. Friend recognises that this is not an innovation. Tolls have operated in the Mersey Tunnel for a good many years.

From the questions that have been asked, does the Minister realise there is a considerable difference of opinion in this House as to the advisability of introducing tolls? Will it be necessary to introduce legislation in regard to them? If not, will he at least give an assurance that before any tolls are introduced the House will have an opportunity to express its views?

In this respect I think the House reflects opinion outside. There is a good deal of difference of view. So far as particular schemes are concerned, legislation has previously been required to enable tolls to be levied in respect of them, but I would rather not answer a general question on legislation without notice.

asked the Minister of Transport and Civil Aviation how many tolls there are on British roads at the present time.

There are 103.

Since the aim of the new road programme is to speed up traffic, would it not be a retrograde step to have any more tolls on these new roads?

That raises the rather wider question whether it is wiser to concentrate all our money on road construction rather than for the time being on dealing with tolls.

How many of the 103 tolls are owned by private enterprise, and how many of them have more than repaid the cost of the original construction time and time again?

I have no details of those figures. One or two are owned by the British Transport Commission and one or two by local authorities, but if the hon. Gentleman likes to put down a Question, and give me time for necessary research, I will endeavour to give him an answer.

Is my right hon. Friend aware that there are many people who would prefer a toll road to no road at all?

asked the Minister of Transport and Civil Aviation what public bodies decide or advise on the priority of the construction of new roads and bridges, as now authorised by Her Majesty's Government.

Responsibility for the decision as to the authorisation of trunk road schemes or acceptance for grant of classified road schemes must necessarily rest with me. I give due weight to the views expressed by all interests concerned, particularly those of the highway authorities in respect of classified roads. There is no public body specifically charged with the duty of advising me on these matters, but in fact I get plenty of advice.

When considering all the advice which is given to him, will the right hon. Gentleman bear in mind the advice given by the hon. Members for Lancashire, who impressed upon him the urgency of Barton Bridge?

The particulars published in my statement of 2nd February give to the hon. Gentleman a pretty satisfactory answer to that point.

As the Minister takes responsibility for decision on behalf of the Government, can he tell us why this Government has changed the decision of the two previous Governments to put the Tyne Bridge and the Severn Bridge on the top priorities in any road reconstruction scheme?

I think the hon. Gentleman means the Tyne Tunnel.

What about the Severn Bridge?

If the hon. Gentleman likes to put that Question down, I shall, in view of the fact that I have answered a Question about it last week, be happy to answer it again.

The Minister has never answered the question as to what considerations have led the Government to put the Severn Bridge, which was given No. I priority, in such a place that it does not appear in the programme at all.

If the hon. Gentleman will read the reply which I gave last week to his right hon. Friend the Member for Battersea, North (Mr. Jay), he will see that I gave an answer, whether he likes it or not.

asked the Minister of Transport and Civil Aviation if the plan in connection with the road improvement on A82 at Dumbarton has now been approved; if all the necessary land has yet been acquired; and on what date in 1955–56 he expects work will commence.

The plans for the section of this improvement between Dumbuck and south-east of Barloan Crescent have been agreed, and most of the land has been acquired. I hope that work will begin this summer.

May I have an assurance that the Minister will do all in his power to expedite the work?

Yes, Sir.

asked the Minister of Transport and Civil Aviation why the improvement on A82 does not include the fly-over junction at Barloan, Dumbarton, for which the Dumbarton Town Council have repeatedly asked in the interests of road safety.

The improvement on A.82 at Dumbarton to be authorised in 1955–6 does not include the fly-over junction at Barloan, because preparation of plans and acquisition of land on the length from south-east of Barloan Crescent to east of Bellsmyre, which includes the fly-over junction have still to be undertaken and will take some time to complete.

Could the Minister inform the House whether there is any moral to be drawn from the fact that the road improvement in this case stops at the local cemetery gates, and would he consider the plea of the local council with a view to carrying this improvement past that point?

As I have explained to the hon. Gentleman, the land for the fly-over to which he refers has to be acquired and, as he probably knows, there is a procedure laid down for that which I cannot accelerate beyond a certain point.

Would not the right hon. Gentleman find it possible to accelerate the procedure if he made the owner of the land pay a tax according to its value?

That is a very different question.

asked the Minister of Transport and Civil Aviation whether he has now reached a decision on the proposals made to him for relief roads to remedy traffic congestion in Newbury.

Yes, Sir. I hope shortly to publish draft Orders under the Trunk Roads Act, 1946, as a preliminary to the construction of two relief roads.

I am obliged.

asked the Minister of Transport and Civil Aviation if, in view of his decision to include a high-level bridge over the Manchester Ship Canal at Barton in his programme of major road works for the years 1956–9, he will now authorise the Lancashire County Council to increase the rate of work on the south approach and to begin work on the north approach.

I will consider any proposal which the Lancashire County Council may care to put to me. My hon. Friend is, no doubt, aware that the line of approach on the north side was the subject matter of objection at a recent public inquiry.

Is my right hon. Friend aware that tipping has already started on the south approach and that it could be considerably increased if the necessary authority was given to the Lancashire County Council? Will the Minister take every step possible to expedite the commencement of work on the north side, because this bridge is necessary to industry and to the workers in Trafford Park?

I agree that this bridge is necessary, and that is why it is in the programme. I believe that tipping on the south side is proceeding fairly satisfactorily and economically.

asked the Minister of Transport and Civil Aviation whether the expanded road programme makes provision for fly-over or fly-under crossings at Hammersmith Broadway and at the Elephant and Castle.

In the Cromwell Road Extension scheme there will not be a fly-over at Hammersmith Broadway initially, but provision will be made for constructing one later if necessary. At the Elephant and Castle a fly-over is not considered suitable.

Does my right hon. Friend not think that at a time when we are proposing to make spectacular changes in road development in this country, these important changes should be introduced in the radial roads out of London? Why should we be more backward than the French, who provide these facilities at nearly every radial exit from Paris?

My noble Friend will, I think, appreciate that this stretch of this road is one for which the London County Council is the improvement authority. The London County Council has indicated to me that it does not feel that a fly-over, which would cost £1 million, of which it would have to find 25 per cent., is desirable at this stage, but it has undertaken to protect the line of a future one so that one can be installed later, if necessary.

asked the Minister of Transport and Civil Aviation when he expects the Pelham Bridge, Lincoln, to be completed.

The constructional work should take about two years, but as I indicated in my answer to the hon. Gentleman's Question, on 1st February, the scheme has not yet been submitted for my consideration.

Is it not a fact that the Minister has known about this scheme for many months? It should have been submitted by yesterday, and I am very surprised that the Minister should say what he has said. Could he not say definitely that if the scheme is submitted to him within the next few days it will be possible to make a start this year?

I appreciate the importance of this work there, but I could not give a blank answer with regard to a scheme which I have not yet seen.