asked the Minister of Transport and Civil Aviation whether, in view of the reversion of Western Region, British Railways, to the traditional chocolate and cream colouring for express passenger rolling stock and green for express locomotives for such world-famous trains as the Cornish Riviera Limited, he will give a general direction to the British Transport Commission to discontinue the title "Western Region" and, in the interests of esprit de corps of the railwaymen concerned and service to the travelling public, restore the prenationalisation nomenclature, "Great Western", for all services and routes formerly operated by that railway, and likewise for the other regions of British Railways.

I welcome the reintroduction of traditional colours in the railway regions as a further sign that the regional boards are stimulating the sense of regional pride essential to efficient operation, but I do not consider it would be appropriate for me to give a direction as my hon. Friend suggests.

Would my right hon. Friend bear in mind that it is the declared objective of Her Majesty's Government to convert the nationalised industries, as far as possible, into commercial enterprises, and would it not be in consonance with that objective to restore those magic words "Great Western", which were the nomenclature of the world's most famous railway?

It is my declared objective to try, with the British Transport Commission, to make a success of the very large organisation which it runs. To that extent, I welcome this idea of bringing back a feeling of regional pride, but I do not go to the extent of saying that I am prepared to give any kind of direction to the Commission on this matter.

Will the right hon. Gentleman recognise that there are many more important things to do on the Great Western than to pander to the whims of a conceited general manager?

Oh.

I think that it would be very unfortunate for this House, bearing in mind that I thought that both parties were committed to not interfering in the day-to-day management, not to leave the regions to run their own affairs in these matters in the way they think best.

A quite sympathetic Answer, for all that.

asked the Minister of Transport and Civil Aviation if he will now make a statement regarding his arrangements for the date of starting for a battery rail-car service in Scotland; and on which section of line it will operate.

My hon. and gallant Friend will appreciate that these arrangements are the responsibility of the British Transport Commission. The Commission's Scottish management will, I understand, make an announcement in collaboration with the North of Scotland Hydro-Electric Board as soon as a suitable design has been worked out and the experimental coach is ready.

Does my right hon. Friend not recollect that in an earlier debate he promised that he would tell me when this would be done? Therefore, he assumed some responsibility for finding out on my behalf. Is my right hon. Friend also aware that the Hydro-Electric Board is only too anxious to supply the current for these battery rail-cars, and will he try to press the Commission to produce a rail-car or the body of a rail-car which will operate at the earliest possible opportunity?

I quite agree, and I do not think there is any difference between my hon. and gallant Friend and myself. I am pressing the Commission, and will inform him when the car is ready.

asked the Minister of Transport and Civil Aviation if, in order to help relieve the traffic congestion on the roads and the overcrowding on the Piccadilly and Metropolitan rail lines to Uxbridge, he will instruct the London and Home Counties Traffic Advisory Committee to make a special inquiry into the possibilities of making full use of the branch railway line from Paddington to Uxbridge via West Drayton.

As the hon. Member will know, this is essentially a matter for the British Transport Commission, which is responsible for deciding the services to be provided on this line, and if an independent assessment were desired, it could most appropriately be obtained by means of representation to the Transport Users' Consultative Committee for the London area.

Is the Minister aware that it really is not good enough when the Minister of Transport appears to be contracting out of this business, which involves the traffic congestion in London as a whole? It is a scandal that this valuable ground from Paddington to Uxbridge is being sterilised and not used for the purpose for which it was intended originally. Will he please do something about it?

All I am saying is that it would be right and constitutional for this matter to be put forward through the Transport Users' Consultative Committee, which has powers then to recommend to me.

asked the Minister of Transport and Civil Aviation whether, with a view to reducing the susceptibility of trawlers to icing in bad weather, and to providing their crews with an effective means of avoiding loss of life in an emergency, he will consider altering the present regulations so as to permit all deep sea trawlers to carry one general purposes boat instead of two lifeboats, the second boat being replaced by two inflatable rafts capable of carrying all the crew.

Yes, Sir. I am already considering a proposal on these lines.

asked the Minister of Transport and Civil Aviation if he will introduce legislation to amend Section 1 of the Transport Act, 1947, by altering the title of the British Transport Commission to the Royal Transport Service, and of the regions to companies of that service.

No, Sir. The existing title seems to me accurate and appropriate.

Does my right hon. Friend appreciate the psychological value, both to the public and to the staff, of using such words as the "Great Western Railway Company," and does he not appreciate that there are many precedents for using ancient titles in contexts different from those in which they were formerly used, such as coroner or sheriff, or in the Army, the Rifle Brigade or the Grenadier Guards, which have no connection these days with either rifles or grenades? Would it not be a good thing to have a Great Western Railway in no way connected with the shareholders?

I am sure that there are many precedents, but the one which I propose to follow is to try, with the British Transport Commission, to make a success of what is the country's largest employer.

asked the Minister of Transport and Civil Aviation if his consultations with the British Transport Commission on its financial position have been completed; and what action it is proposed to take in regard thereto.

asked the Minister of Transport and Civil Aviation what progress is being made in the talks between his Department and the British Transport Commission on the question of increased efficiency in the Commission's services.

The six months' period does not end until 18th September and a vast field of inquiry has to be covered by the Commission. My consultations with it are continuing to make good progress and, as I have already promised, I will inform the House of the results as soon as I can.

Yes, but if the period ends in September, the House will be in Recess. How is the House to be informed? Is it proposed to publish a White Paper? Will there be an opportunity for debate following these consultations? Finally, will the Minister make certain that he takes no irrevocable step during the Recess of Parliament?

I am quite willing to tell the hon. Gentleman, and I think it will meet his point, that I shall only announce this in Parliament, which I think is the right and proper place to do it.

Will a White Paper be published?

The right hon. Gentleman will be aware that the returns of the British Transport Commission show that it was £70 million "in the red" at the end of last year and most people believe that the deficit is now running at a rate of £45 million. Cannot the Minister possibly tell the House what he proposes to do about the £115 million deficit?

I shall tell the House at the proper time. I have just said that this is the proper place to announce it. With regard to the deficit, which is well known to all hon. Members, the responsibility for it certainly does not lie only on my shoulders or on this Government.

asked the Minister of Transport and Civil Aviation if he will publish an analysis of road accidents in which motor cyclists have been involved during a recent convenient twelve months' period showing the number of registered vehicles and the number of accidents for each of the following classes, namely, 250 c.c. and under, exceeding 250 c.c. but not exceeding 350 c.c., exceeding 350 c.c. but not exceeding 500 c.c. and exceeding 500 c.c.

The figures asked for are not immediately available. Some statistical research into the number of motor cycles of different sizes involved in accidents is at present being done for the use of the Sub-Committee of the Departmental Committee on Road Safety which is considering the appropriate minimum age for riding motor cycles. I will also arrange for the numbers of motor cycles in certain engine-size groups to be obtained when the next annual census of road vehicles licensed is being made.

asked the Minister of Transport and Civil Aviation if, in furtherance of his road safety campaign, he will issue an appeal to industrial and commercial concerns to include in their advertising matter frequent references to road safety; and if he will collect information from concerns already devoting advertising space to that purpose so that he may be able to offer advice to others contemplating similar activity.

Industrial and commercial concerns already give a measure of support to the road safety campaign in their own advertising, both nationally and also in co-operation with local road safety committees. We are most grateful for such help and should welcome the participation of more firms in this campaign.

The Royal Society for the Prevention of Accidents and my Department are always ready to offer advice and suggestions, based on past experience, to any concern willing to help in this field.

Has the attention of my right hon. Friend been drawn to a particularly extensive campaign being started by Littlewood's, and would he collect information on the effectiveness of that campaign to see whether advice can be given to other commercial concerns? Further, have any industrial or commercial concerns joined with him in the coming child safety campaign?

A number of concerns have taken part in these campaigns, and I know that Messrs. Littlewood is one of them. We are deeply appreciative of what has been done, and we should welcome a number of other concerns doing the same thing. I could not say without notice to what extent industrial or commercial concerns are participating in the "Mind that child" campaign which is being inaugurated in the autumn.

asked the Minister of Transport and Civil Aviation at what hours of the day traffic delays at Hyde Park Corner are estimated to have been reduced by 30 per cent. between 1925 and 1954.

The comparative figure of traffic delays at Hyde Park Corner which I gave to my hon. Friend on 18th July was based on the results of a number of sample runs made at different times of day. Those in 1954 were taken by the Road Research Laboratory and those in 1926 by the police, but these were averages and cannot be related to any particular time of day.

Would not my hon. Friend agree, therefore, that the reduction of the delay may not be anything like as much as 30 per cent. during the peak hours, when it is worse? Would he not agree also that some of this reduction is probably due to the fact that now there is no horse traffic, as there was in 1925? Would he not agree that that is still an appalling place to drive round today, and cannot steps be taken to make an early improvement?

I agree with the third thing which my hon. Friend said.

asked the Minister of Transport and Civil Aviation if he will experiment with one-way working in Cavendish Square, W.1.

The treatment of Cavendish Square is bound up with traffic arrangements at Oxford Circus. As a temporary diversion during road works in Regent Street, a number of one-way streets are very shortly to be tried in this area, and these will include the east and west sides of Cavendish Square. The results of those diversions will be carefully watched.

Will my right hon. Friend also consider the south side of Cavendish Square? Is he aware that at the junction of the Square with Holles Street there is sometimes a most appalling jam, because of the traffic trying to go three ways at once? Will he look into conditions on that side of the Square?

I shall certainly look into this matter at the time the experiment is being made, but we have considered this matter in the past and we thought that, on balance, it would not be desirable to introduce one-way traffic there.

asked the Minister of Transport and Civil Aviation if he will now announce what he proposes to do to encourage the staggering of the times of beginning and ending work in London in order to relieve congestion at peak hours.

After consultation with the Chairmen of the Central Transport Consultative Committee and the British Transport Commission, I have decided to adopt a suggestion made to me by Mr. Fitzgerald, the Chairman of the London Transport Users' Consultative Committee and of the sub-committee which has been concerned with the staggering of hours, that I should appoint a new committee to take on this work from the Consultative Committee, which has important separate duties under the Transport Acts.

I have accordingly decided to set up a committee with the main function of putting in train further measures for the staggering of working hours in central London. I am glad to say that Mr. Fitzgerald has consented to act as chairman of this new committee.

I am circulating the proposed terms of reference in the OFFICIAL REPORT.

I should like to take this opportunity of expressing my appreciation of the excellent work which Mr. Fitzgerald and his sub-committee have done in addition to their regular duties on the Consultative Committee.

Is the Minister satisfied that this is the most expeditious way of dealing with this matter? Surely another committee means that there will be meetings; there will then be a report, during which time no action will be taken. The Government are very apt to appoint these committees, and we then have to wait a very long time before any action is taken. Will not he take any immediate action in this matter? It is very urgent.

No. The fact of the case is—as I think the hon. Member knows—that this is a very difficult technical question. We have to balance buses and trains and all the other means of arrival. Mr. Fitzgerald and his colleagues are, perhaps, the most expert people to do this job, and that is what they will be doing in the autumn of this year.

asked the Minister of Transport and Civil Aviation the causes of the delay in repairing the road from Silverdale in Newcastle-under-Lyme via Crackley Gates to Scot Hay, in the negotiations about the adoption of which representatives of his Department took part and which was last repaired at Government expense thirteen years ago.

The borough council has had difficulties in acquiring the land required for widening this private road. I am informed that these have now been resolved and that the council hopes to let a contract shortly for the road works.

I thank the Joint Parliamentary Secretary for that assurance, but is the right hon. Gentleman aware that my constituents, having waited now for over thirteen years, would welcome some early signs of action on this dangerous road?

Yes, I do not doubt that. I shall welcome it also. But it is the responsibility of the borough council and not of my Department.

asked the Minister of Transport and Civil Aviation why, on Al just south of Newark, the road has been recently widened in two separate lengths totalling about one mile to a width of only 28 feet; and with which standard laid down by his Department this width conforms.

The work of widening the carriageway of this road to 30 ft. was carried out in the summer of last year as part of the policy of improving the Great North Road. The surfacing consists of bituminous macadam 28 ft. wide with a concrete strip 1 ft. wide on each side. The design is in accordance of the standards applicable at that time

Is the right hon. Gentleman aware that road users are of the opinion that this is not wide enough? Will he give some consideration to the possibility of widening the road to a different standard?

In Circular 727 issued by my right hon. Friend, now the Minister of Pensions and National Insurance, a higher standard has been introduced. That is why in my original reply I said that what had been done in this case complied with the standards which were in operation at that time. Owing to the large amount of traffic on this road, it is ultimately intended to provide dual carriageways of 24 ft. width.

asked the Minister of Transport and Civil Aviation whether he is aware of the dangerous road conditions on A1 near and through Stevenage and the new town; and what steps he proposes to take to speed up the construction of the by-pass which was originally authorised in 1947.

Yes, Sir. I have authorised the acquisition of the necessary land for this by-pass, so that as soon as funds can be made available for the constructional work there should be no delay in putting it in hand.

Has the right hon. Gentleman any idea when the funds will be available? Will he press his colleague the Chancellor of the Exchequer to see that they are made available soon, because this is a very dangerous position?

That may be so, but I cannot build a by-pass until I have bought the land, and that, as the hon. Member knows, is quite a long job.

asked the Minister of Transport and Civil Aviation what progress has been made in the plan for a riverside highway from Blackfriars to Battersea Bridge.

In consultation with my Department, officers of the London County Council and of the Port of London Authority have examined the technical aspects of this plan and have made a preliminary Report which is now being considered.

Does the right hon. Gentleman recollect that he wrote a glowing introduction to a pamphlet on this plan in which he said that he was keenly interested in this bold and far-sighted idea? How soon can we expect his decision on the technical Report which is now in his possession?

I welcome anybody who has good and new ideas about how to solve London's traffic problems, and I therefore welcomed the initiative which caused this study to be made. That does not mean that I can go further with it until I have had the benefit of the views of the experts. Those are what I am now getting. As soon as I have them I will look at them and announce my decision.

asked the Minister of Transport and Civil Aviation what steps he is taking to obtain uniform lighting on main roads.

On trunk roads, where we are able to contribute to the expenditure incurred by local authorities on new or improved lighting, conformity with the standards recommended by the Departmental Committee on Street Lighting is a condition of the contribution. On other roads the local authorities are solely responsible for lighting. They are aware of the recommended standards which my Department's technical advice, which is always available, aims at having adopted everywhere.

Are there not still far too many variations in lighting on main roads, other than the trunk roads for which the Ministry is responsible? Is the Parliamentary Secretary aware that a Government Committee sat on this matter twenty-one years ago? Is it not time the Ministry exercised some influence on local authorities to try to get them to deal with this variation in lighting, which does not help to reduce road accidents at night?

I think that the hon. and gallant Gentleman is aware that it is only in respect of trunk roads that we are empowered to make any grants, and it is therefore only over them that we can exercise any control. The other roads are left to local authorities, and I regret that they are not in all cases introducing lighting which is uniform.

Will not my right hon. Friend consult his right hon. Friend the Minister to see whether they could initiate legislation on this subject? The lack of uniformity in lighting is a most serious subject. As he knows, lack of legislation prevents him from doing anything about it. Cannot he initiate some legislation in that respect?

At the present time we do not propose to initiate any legislation on this subject. [HON. MEMBERS: "Why not?"] Such money as is available for work upon the roads will be spent upon road building, which is useful by day and by night. At present we are not disposed to spend on lighting more of any money which is available.

Is the right hon. Gentleman serious when he says that this involves expenditure of money by the Government? Is it not a question of using influence with the local authorities in order to secure some uniformity? Why has he raised the question of finance?

If the right hon. Gentleman had listened to my original Answer he would have heard me say that we use such influence as we are able to use, but experience may have taught him that where one is not able to make any financial contribution one's advice does not gain very much attention.

asked the Minister of Transport and Civil Aviation the average delay between the application by a local authority for approval of a road traffic sign and the necessary regulations and the notification of his decision.

If my hon. Friend will let me know a little more precisely the type of sign or traffic regulation order he has in mind, I will gladly send him the particulars he wants. The time taken varies so widely with the type of sign or order that any general answer would be misleading.

I appreciate that, but is my right hon. Friend aware that the time for all the different kinds of signs and orders is invariably too long? Will he satisfy himself that everything is done to speed up a decision in those cases where local authorities are doing their best to promote road safety?

In the case, for example, of a "Slow" sign, there is no delay whatsoever. In the case of a "Halt" sign the normal time for giving approval, if approval is given, is about two weeks. In the case, however, of traffic regulation orders it very largely depends upon the local authority; it depends also upon whether a public inquiry has to be held, and it may be anything up to two years

asked the Minister of Transport and Civil Aviation if he will give the details of the order which he has made and type of crossing gate of which he has approved, as being suitable for a rail crossing over the trunk road A5 at Oakengates, Shropshire.

My right hon. Friend has made no order. I understand, however, that, as the result of discussions between the local interests concerned, the company operating the railway has agreed to provide longer and lower swing barriers across the road. These will carry an illuminated warning and the advance warning signs will also be illuminated.

While thanking my right hon. Friend for his reply, may I ask whether he thinks that swivel arms alone are suitable on a main trunk road? Why is he not willing to make an order on the same lines as that for the gates used by the National Coal Board or British Railways where a private railway crosses a trunk main road, and avoid some serious accidents?

For two reasons. The first, as I indicated on a previous occasion, is that my right hon. Friend has no power to make the order.

Take it.

In the second place, we are satisfied that this is a reasonable provision for ensuring the safety of the crossing.

On a point of order, Mr. Speaker. I assure you that the provisions are not suitable, and I beg to give notice that I shall raise the matter on the Adjournment as soon as possible.

asked the Minister of Transport and Civil Aviation if he will take steps to increase road space and the radius of the roundabout at the junction of the Great West Road and Chiswick High Street.

Early in September work will begin on a temporary improvement of the roundabout, which should help traffic movement until the fly-over scheme is completed.

I thank the right hon. Gentleman for that Answer. Will he bear in mind that there seems to be plenty of room on the outside of this roundabout and extra pavement space which could be used to increase the radius?

I quite agree.

asked the Minister of Transport and Civil Aviation how long he anticipates that it will take to complete the actual construction of the St. Albans by-pass.

The construction of the St. Albans by-pass will take about three years, and will, I hope, be completed by about the end of 1960.

asked the Minister of Transport and Civil Aviation what he estimates to be the average daily rate of construction of a new road providing a dual carriageway with room for two lines of traffic each side; and what steps he is taking to accelerate the present rate of road contruction.

In theory, after all the preliminary work has been done, a carriageway surface can be laid at a rate of about 100 yards a day. This is, however, an artificial figure of no practical value as a yardstick since the rate of progress will vary greatly with the job. The use of modern road-making machinery is steadily increasing, and this will make the best contribution towards accelerating the rate of construction of the new roads included in the programme.

May I ask my right hon. Friend why it takes so much longer to build roads in this country than on the Continent? Is he aware that in Germany roads are laid at the rate of 200 yards a day? Is he further aware that a recent report in the newspapers stated that the roads on the motorway from Milan to Naples, a distance of 167 miles, will be completed in two years?

If they can do it, we can.

In each case it depends to a large extent on the nature of the subsoil and the number of bridges, etc., which have to be constructed. To give an example of two by-pass roads at present being constructed—and we are satisfied that both are being constructed as expeditiously as possible—on the Markyate by-pass, to do less than a mile will take eighteen months and on the Preston by-pass to do one mile will take twelve months That arises out of the different circumstances in each case. Generally, the larger the job the heavier and more up-to-date equipment is used and therefore, relatively speaking, progress is more rapid.

The right hon. Gentleman is no doubt aware that a number of hon. Members recently saw a great deal of road making in Germany and Holland where some remarkable machinery is used for laying the road surfaces. Can he assure the House that our equipment for laying road surfaces is at least as modern, up-to-date and effective as that now being used on the Continent?

I was under the impression that our equipment is as up-to-date as any, but in view of what the right hon. Gentleman has said, and if he will give me particulars, I will look into the matter.

asked the Minister of Transport and Civil Aviation whether he is now in a position to state the date on which the Tyne Tunnel project will commence.

I am still awaiting comments from some of the interested bodies on the question whether a crossing of the Tyne should take the form of a bridge or a tunnel. Until that point has been decided I cannot make any decision about when it may be possible to include an approved scheme in the road, programme.

Is the right hon. Gentleman aware that a number of people in the North are cynical about this matter? Is he aware that plans were approved for a tunnel, and that it was not until his predecessor threw out the idea of a bridge—many people thought he did so in order deliberately to delay the project—that there was any suggestion of a bridge? Can the right hon. Gentleman say whether, when this project is sanctioned, the recent statement which he made to the National Productivity Advissory Council on Industry will apply; and whether this project, which has been under discussion, for which plans have been made and the necessary ground bought, will provide free transport, or whether there will have to be a toll charge?

I cannot allocate this project any place in the programme at all until a decision has been taken by the interested parties—which at the moment do not include myself—whether a bridge is suitable or not. As soon as I have that information I can go into the matter.

Can the right hon. Gentleman say whether it will be free?

While not necessarily agreeing with the strictures passed by the hon. Member for Jarrow (Mr. Fernyhough), may I ask whether my right hon. Friend could go up to the North and do a bit of "stirring up".

I was in Newcastle a fortnight ago.

asked the Minister of Transport and Civil Aviation the length of the new diversionary road round Gatwick Airport from the Brighton Road A23; and how long it will take to construct.

The length is 2⅔miles. It is estimated that the new road will be completed in the summer of 1957.

asked the Minister of Transport and Civil Aviation the length of the new Markyate by-pass; and how long it will take to construct.

Nearly a mile. The construction of the by-pass will, I hope, be completed by about the end of next May.

Is my right hon. Friend aware that at Markyate, instead of the new road proceeding at an artificial figure of a hundred yards a day, it is proceeding at a figure nearer three yards a day? Can he explain—

Government policy.

why this slow progress has been made and also why Gatwick, in Surrey, is doing so much better than Markyate, in Hertfordshire?

Because Hertfordshire is a minor county.

I have already replied, in answer to an earlier Question, that it is difficult to make a comparison between one engineering project and another, but I will certainly make further inquiries into the progress being made at Markyate, and write to my hon. Friend.

asked the Minister of Transport and Civil Aviation the cost and area of the land which has been purchased for the two fly-overs on the St. Albans by-pass at North Orbital Road and the junction of the London—Holyhead road which projects are estimated to cost £5,500,000.

Between 20 and 25 acres of land will be required for these fly-overs. None of this can yet be acquired and I cannot, therefore, say what its cost will be.

As the estimated cost of the total project presumably includes the land, at £5½ million, can the Minister say how much the estimated cost of the land is?

No—not without notice.

asked the Minister of Transport and Civil Aviation his estimate of the saving in time for passengers travelling by road to London Airport when the Cromwell Road extension is finished; and what would be the additional saving of time if the fly-over junction at Hammersmith were put in hand.

The saving in journey time will be considerable, particularly during the busier hours of the day. I cannot give precise up-to-date figures, but I am having a survey made to establish as nearly as possible what the savings are likely to be when the new road is open to traffic.

Can my right hon. Friend say what the saving would be if there were a fly-over junction? As, in the very nature of things, there is bound to be a vast increase in the traffic to London Airport, does not he think that a fly-over ought to be constructed?

One of the reasons why I am having this survey made is that one of the figures in the possession of my Department shows that there would be only from two to two and a half minutes' advantage in time with a flyover, and I thought that I had better have it checked.

asked the Minister of Transport and Civil Aviation in what way a decision to build the Hammersmith fly-over as soon as possible would delay the carrying out of the ground-level scheme, in view of the estimate that the latter will be completed by the middle of 1958 and the unlikelihood of the contract for the fly-over being let before then.

Because it would then be necessary at the outset to acquire more land, demolish more property and do more works to provide for raising the main carriageway on to the fly-over.

asked the Minister of Transport and Civil Aviation if he is now prepared to say when a British-produced civil air liner will be available to meet the needs of the British Overseas Airways Corporation; and if he will make a statement.

asked the Minister of Transport and Civil Aviation the latest prospects of British makes of aeroplanes being available to the British Overseas Airways Corporation and the British European Airways Corporation to maintain an up-to-date and fully competitive service; and to what extent he has found it necessary meanwhile to consent to the purchase of United States and other foreign aeroplanes to maintain the British air services.

British European Airways already operates British aircraft of exceptional competitive efficiency and has just contracted to purchase a still more advanced British type—the Vanguard.

B.O.A.C. has already ordered thirty-three Britannias, twenty Comets and twelve Viscounts. As regards further orders, the Corporation is urgently studying the findings of its technical inquiries in this country and America. Decisions will have to be taken as soon as these are completed. If these should involve the purchase of American aircraft, B.O.A.C. would wish them to be equipped with British engines.

Is the Minister aware that all he has said is welcome news indeed and, of course, much of it was familiar; but the point about which I should like to hear him say something is as to when we are to get a machine that will satisfy the needs of B.O.A.C. on the Transatlantic routes? It is worrying a great many people, in view of the fact that so much public money has been poured into the aircraft production side.

Do I take it that the hon. Gentleman means when we are to get a British aircraft?

indicated assent.

That is one of the reasons why the Chairman of the Corporation wished to have the most thoroughgoing technical inquiry into all the aircraft that might be available before he took a final decision.

May I ask the Minister whether it has not yet come to his knowledge that the British aircraft industry is in a terrible muddle, and that nothing will happen until the Government do something about it?

I should not be surprised if, despite the right hon. Gentleman's background in business, I know a little more about the aircraft industry at this moment than he does.

Does my right hon. Friend recall that at the end of last year he referred to the 1965 aeroplane for B.O.A.C, and would he tell us when a decision will be made in that direction? Will he also remind the right hon. Gentleman the Member for Ipswich (Mr. Stokes), if he does not read the papers, that only yesterday De Havilland's sold £27 million worth of aeroplanes?

As regards the 1965 project, I am only concerned at the moment—or it is more proper to say that the Corporation is concerned, because I do not come into the matter until the Corporation has taken a decision—about taking a decision on what aircraft will best secure its competitive position in the North Atlantic. There are British aircraft that can be considered, as well as American.

As the hon. and gallant Member for Macclesfield (Air Commodore Harvey) challenges me, of course I read the papers and saw that order, and I was glad to see it. But the fact is that as regards the defence of this country we are in a deplorable mess and there are no worth-while aeroplanes.

That has nothing to do with the Question, which is about civil aircraft, and in many civil aircraft we still lead the world.

Will my right hon. Friend confirm that B.O.A.C. has been able to place orders for British aircraft to the amount of £80 million and B.E.A. to the amount of £37 million? Is not this a good indication that our aircraft industry is well to the fore, and that we are right in pursuing the policy of "Fly British" as well as we can?

Yes, Sir, that is a completely accurate statement, and it is the policy of both Corporations to follow the policy of flying British aircraft. Indeed, their past history shows that they have done it very successfully. But, as my hon. Friend has just said, they cannot carry that to the length of being uncompetitive if from time to time there are foreign aircraft which are better for particular purposes.

Is the Minister aware that most people in the House will appreciate the very reasonable statement he has just made?

Hear, hear.

That does not contradict what I said.

It is a further indication that the right hon. Gentleman has completely eaten his words given in that unfortunate interview to the News Chronicle, in which he said that the Corporation had to buy British or get out.

That is not true at all. The position is as I have said, that it is the policy of this Government, as indeed it was the policy of the Government of which the hon. Member was a Member, to apply a policy of flying British. However, I am not prepared, and nor should any responsible Minister of Civil Aviation be prepared, to prejudice the commercial future of the Corporations for which he is responsible. That is always a difficult combination of circumstances to provide for, and that is why I will not take any decision until I am satisfied that the merits of British and other aircraft have been fully investigated.

asked the Minister of Transport and Civil Aviation whether the 24-hour licence is now in operation at London Airport; and whether he is satisfied that it is confined to bona fide travellers.

The Answer to both parts of the Question is "Yes, Sir."

Can my hon. Friend say whether any restrictive conditions were applied to the licence so that the licensee carries some responsibility for observing the intentions of Parliament?

The basic responsibility has been laid by Parliament on my right hon. Friend, but the management of London Airport has told the catering management to issue written instructions to its staff reinforcing the oral instructions which it has already given on the subject.

asked the Minister of Transport and Civil Aviation if he will give consideration to the provision of a garage at London Airport for the cars of passengers flying from there.

Since car parking facilities at London Airport are at present adequate, my right hon. Friend does not consider that he could justify the provision of a garage there for passengers' cars.

Will my hon. Friend consider the question of putting up a garage there with service facilities which would enable those members of the public who wish to fly abroad for a few days to leave their cars at London Airport for servicing, as that would be a considerable convenience?

We are in the process of negotiating with a firm to establish a petrol filling station in the central terminal area, but I must repeat that my right hon. Friend does not think that it would be right to establish garages at present.

asked the Minister of Transport and Civil Aviation if he will take steps to open new landing fields in the Highlands and Islands of Scotland.

No, Sir. I am not aware of any demand from operators for such new facilities.

May I asked the Minister to look into this matter of developing air services in the Highlands and Islands, which would seem to be a suitable area? Is he aware that the present service is absolutely full in summer and yet, for some reason, neither private nor public operators are opening new services? Is that because of the lack of suitable landing grounds, or aircraft, or the cost, or what is the reason?

I do not fully share the view of the hon. Gentleman. A comparison between the Highlands and Islands routes operated by all the operators in the summer of 1939 and those operated today by B.E.A. alone, would show that on the western Scottish routes almost eight times as many seats are offered weekly today and in Orkney and Shetland almost five times as many.

But there are no new routes.

If my hon. Friend cannot think of opening new fields in the area, will he consider re-opening the port of Errol?

Errol is being held on a care and maintenance basis against the need to cater for air services in the area.

asked the Minister of Transport and Civil Aviation if he will ensure, in framing a scheme to prevent the collision of aircraft flying in controlled air spaces, that such standards of separation between aircraft will be enforced as will prevent the occurrence of incidents like near misses.

I consider that the internationally agreed separation standards already applied to flight under Instrument Flight Rules are adequate. The extent to which aircraft fly under these rules will automatically increase as a result of the change in Visual Flight Rules to which I referred in reply to a question by the hon. Member for Uxbridge (Mr. Beswick) on 6th June.

Is the Minister aware that, replying to me last Wednesday, the Joint Parliamentary Secretary said that in the last six months there had been 58 incidents involving the safety in flight of civil aircraft, but of these only two were "near misses"? Can the right hon. Gentleman tell me what exactly are "near misses"?

Something that does not hit.

For the benefit of my right hon. Friend, may I say that I was asking a question of the Minister?

Secondly, can the Minister say whether, in the scheme now being formulated, every aircraft will be brought under complete radar control when it is in flight?

Of the 58 incidents only two were serious and involved a real danger of collision. That is the definition of "near miss." As to the second part of the hon. Gentleman's supplementary question, I do not think that I can pronounce on that until the most careful study which is taking place has been completed and proved the facts, so far as we can. In the meantime, as I have said, we have increased the visual flight distance.

Can the Minister say when he expects to be able to announce the result of the study?

indicated dissent.

asked the Minister of Defence what investigations he has made into overlapping in the supply and maintenance of aircraft and stores between the Royal Navy and the Royal Air Force.

The Ministry of Supply is responsible for supplying aircraft and associated stores both to the Royal Navy and the Royal Air Force. I am not aware that there is any overlapping, but I should be happy to look into any particular case the hon. Member may have in mind.

As regards maintenance facilities, the special requirements of the two Services and the different conditions in which they operate make it doubtful whether the pooling of their resources would contribute either to economy or to efficiency. I appreciate, however, the anxiety felt by the hon. Member and others on this score, and I have called for reports on this and other related aspects of Service co-ordination.

asked the Minister of Defence whether he will investigate the cost in time and money involved in the sea trooping of Service men and their families in modern steamships compared with that of air trooping in modern transport aircraft.

This matter is under continuous review by the Service Departments in consultation with the Ministry of Transport and Civil Aviation, but it is not possible to arrive at a true comparison of the costs involved in trooping by the two alternative methods mentioned in the Question, except by reference to the particular circumstances of a given series of movements.

Is it not a fact that, apart from the capital saving in using aircraft, the number of men saved in the lines of communication if air transport and not sea transport is used may well bring much nearer the day when we can do without such large numbers of men and so abolish conscription?

I am not sure that I would go so far as that, but I am sure that the hon. Member will be glad to know that, if we omit Germany, about half of all personnel movement in 1955–56 was carried out by air, and we shall do as much of that as we can.

Was that ordinary individual trooping, or by unit? Was a considerable proportion done by unit?

It is in the case where we are doing it by unit that we are more likely to be using sea transport, because the men move with their equipment and families. I was taking an overall figure for movements, leaving out Germany.

The right hon. and learned Gentleman says that about half the trooping is done by air. Is not that exactly the same figure as it was last year and the year before?

I am afraid that I cannot answer about last year without notice. I do not know the figure.

asked the Minister of Defence whether, in view of public disquiet as to the waste of public money in the aircraft industry, he will investigate the cost of designing, developing and producing aircraft for the three Services.

As I have already announced, I am looking into the arrangements for supplying the Forces with aircraft, and I will inform the House of the conclusions I reach.

Steps have already been taken to lighten the load on our resources, and I hope these will contribute to the end which both the hon. Member and Her Majesty's Government have in mind.

Will this really meet the point that there are at this moment inefficient firms which are kept going through public money, at great cost not only to the Exchequer but also to the efficiency of other firms which are really doing the work?

I should not like to make a general answer to that. I am aware that there are great differences, and in lightening the load we shall be able to take advantage of that.

Has the Minister paid any attention to what I said to him in February this year? I then asked whether he had made any investigation into the then declared statement that of 166 projects started in the last ten years we had sunk more than £1,000 million in unsuccessful aircraft, and only eight projects had been successful. Surely there is something wrong with that.

I do not recollect the figures which the right hon. Gentleman gave me upon that occasion. What I said today was that steps have been taken to reduce the number of projects, and I think that that is the right course to take.

asked the Secretary of State for Foreign Affairs whether Britain has yet entered into a firm commitment to make a grant to Egypt for the construction of the high dam at Aswan.

My hon. Friend will be aware that since he put down his Question Her Majesty's Government have announced that they do not consider it feasible in present circumstances to participate in this project.

I am sure that my right hon. and learned Friend knows that the decision of Her Majesty's Government not to proceed with this project has been welcomed throughout the country for hydro-logical, economic and technical reasons. But will he now consider, in view of the fact that the Aswan folly is out of the way, the idea of a Nile Valley authority—the idea of using the £200 million now floating about in the World Bank for investment in the Nile Valley, and a return to the World Bank conception of a multiple dam scheme for the whole Nile Valley?

I entirely agree with my hon. Friend that that is a matter which now requires careful consideration.

Will not my right hon. and learned Friend consider approaching the American, Soviet and Egyptian Governments with a proposal to grant international aid, through the Social and Economic Council of the United Nations, to build the Aswan dam on conditions consistent with the principles, purposes and obligations of the United Nations Charter?

That is a different question from the one on the Order Paper.

In view of the fact that Egypt unilaterally repudiated the Treaty of 1936, is the right hon. and learned Gentleman aware that some of us are relieved that we have not gone in for this loan, which might also be unilaterally repudiated by this or another Egyptian Government?

Is it not a fact that Egypt can get all the water she wants from the White Nile for an expenditure of about one-third of that involved in building the Aswan dam?

Again, I think that that is rather wider than the Question on the Order Paper.

asked the Secretary of State for Foreign Affairs if he will make a statement on the decision not to assist with British funds the construction of the dam at Aswan.

I dealt with this matter yesterday in the course of the debate on foreign affairs.

I have read what the Foreign Secretary said yesterday. While it may well be that we have come to the right conclusion, nevertheless, would he not agree that the handling of the matter has been rather unfortunate? Could he not review the machinery by which these projects are examined before they are entered into at all, because to have a withdrawal at the heels of the Americans in the last resort seems to have put us in a somewhat difficult position?

What the hon. Member said is not true. We were in close consultation with the United States Government about this matter, and our announcement followed immediately after the announcement of the American decision.

asked the Secretary of State for Foreign Affairs whether he will make a statement regarding compensation by the Egyptian Government to those British officials who were dismissed from Egyptian employment in 1951.

As my hon. Friend the Joint Under-Secretary said in his reply on 25th June to my hon. Friend, the Egyptian Commission set up under the Exchange of Letters annexed to the Anglo-Egyptian Agreement has submitted its recommendations to the Egyptian Government. No award has been announced. Her Majesty's Ambassador, on my instructions, has reminded the Egyptian Government of the importance we attach to an early and generous settlement.

Does not the right hon. and learned Gentleman agree that there is now little possibility of the Egyptian Government paying any compensation to the people involved, because they may take note of how generously Mr. Leonard Lord treats his people when they are redundant?

I do not at all accept what the hon. Member says.

asked the Secretary of State for Foreign Affairs whether, when financial assistance is provided for Egypt for the development of projects in that country, he will make it a condition that the Suez Canal should be made free for vessels belonging to any nation.

Financial assistance is not being provided by Her Majesty's Government to Egypt for the development of projects in that country. The Question therefore does not arise.

In replying to an earlier Question, the right hon. and learned Gentleman said that in present circumstances it was not proposed to extend financial help to Egypt in connection with another project. If the circumstances change, would the conditions which I have set forth in the Question apply?

Of course, that is a very hypothetical question, but I am interested that the right hon. Gentleman should suggest that strings should be attached to aid.

Are not these strings in compliance with a decision of the United Nations, and does not that make a difference?

Anyhow, the right hon. Gentleman's Question is hypothetical.

asked the Lord Privy Seal what effects strontium has had upon Welsh mountain sheep; and if he will make a statement.

I have been asked to reply.

In studying the distribution of radioactivity arising from fall-out, measurements have been made of the strontium 90 associated with the calcium in various biological materials. Among the representative samples of sheep bones examined, a few from very localised mountain areas in Wales have shown higher values than those from other areas. Even so, the levels are too low to have any detectable effects on sheep.

asked the Lord Privy Seal (1) how much of the enriched uranium now agreed to be supplied by the United States of America to the Atomic Energy Authority will be passed on or sold to Germany;

(2) how much enriched uranium he expects to receive this year under the amendment to the Atomic Energy Agreement signed in Washington last month; and how much of this material will be used for war weapons.

I have been asked to reply.