asked the Parliamentary Secretary to the Ministry of Education what steps are being taken to provide specialist teachers at the Polesworth Secondary Modern School in the County of Warwick.

The staffing of individual schools is the responsibility of the local education authority.

Is the Minister aware that, in addition to the overall shortage of teachers at this school, there is a shortage of specialist teachers which may make the new technical and commercial course impossible to develop? Will the Minister ask the education authority to let him know what steps it is taking to make the specialist teachers available by September next?

I know very well that the country as a whole is short of teachers of specialist subjects, but recruitment to specialist training colleges has improved and more third year supplementary courses are being provided. I am sure that the local education authority will do all it can to fill the vacancies at this school, but I do not think that I can ask it to give it special preference.

asked the Parliamentary Secretary to the Ministry of Education whether he will cause phase 3 of new building at the Polesworth Secondary Modern School to be completed at the same time as phase 2, in view of the increasing numbers of pupils at the school.

No, Sir. The building work already approved will be sufficient for the numbers of pupils expected.

Will not the number of pupils increase by over one hundred by September next, and is the Minister aware that phase 2 of this programme includes only one classroom in a school where the majority of the classrooms are already too small?

The third phase of building work would replace the old premises now being used by the secondary school and enable them to be used by the primary school. This would be a desirable improvement, but it is not within my noble Friend's present building policy. If the number increases more than expected, this matter can certainly be reconsidered.

asked the Parliamentary Secretary to the Ministry of Education what provision exists for technical education in the Atherstone, Polesworth, Wilnescote and Kingsbury areas of the County of Warwick; and what steps are being taken to provide technical courses at the Polesworth Secondary Modern School.

Technical education is provided at Sutton Coldfield Institute of Further Education, at Nuneaton Technical College and School of Art and at a number of evening institutes. At Polesworth County Secondary School courses in engineering, agriculture, commerce and dressmaking are about to be started.

Is the Minister aware that there is no provision in this area for secondary technical education, and does he consider that his duties under the Education Act, 1944, which instruct him to provide a varied and comprehensive educational service in every area, have yet been fulfilled in this area?

I think that the hon. Member is a little too gloomy about this matter. In addition to what I have mentioned, some students also attend technical colleges at Birmingham, Coventry, Tamworth and Hinckley; and an engineering workshop and a drawing office are at present being built in the Polesworth Secondary Modern School. Secondary schools in the area provide a wide range of courses, but my noble Friend does not ask local education authorities to provide exact details about individual schools.

asked the Parliamentary Secretary to the Ministry of Education how many State studentships in arts and science, respectively, have been granted to students in each of the four constituent colleges of the University of Wales.

My Department is concerned only with postgraduate State studentships in arts subjects. The process of making these awards cannot be completed until all the candidates' degree results are known.

Can the Parliamentary Secretary give an assurance that the University of Wales will be no worse off in regard to these State studentships now that they are granted by the Ministry of Education and not by the university authorities in Wales?

At this stage I cannot forecast what the final number of successful candidates from the University of Wales will be for my Department's awards, but I will bear in mind the point that the hon. Member has made.

asked the Parliamentary Secretary to the Ministry of Education what proposals have been submitted to him for enlarging the school-building programme for the excepted district of Newcastle-under-Lyme, in the light of the increasing population and development of new housing estates.

My noble Friend has approved for starting in 1958–59 two of the eight projects for Newcastle-under-Lyme submitted to him by the Stafford-shire local education authority. The other six could not be justified as requiring to be started in that year to meet the needs to which the hon. Member refers.

Will the Parliamentary Secretary kindly explain what he means by "could not be justified"? Is he aware of the tremendous expansion of housing estates in Newcastle-under-Lyme, especially at Clayton, and the very great distance that children are now travelling to schools where there is considerable overcrowding? Will he reconsider this matter? Is he aware that the need is very great in Newcastle-under-Lyme and that there is a slack in the building trade which could be taken up on this work?

The first of the six is to replace the existing school, that is, the Clayton Hall County Grammar School, and has no relation to the growth of population. As the hon. Member is well aware, we cannot replace old buildings until we have made further progress with providing places for the increasing numbers of children. A satisfactory case has not yet been made for the other five in view of the existing estimate of the future numbers of pupils, but some of them may well be approved for later years.

asked the Parliamentary Secretary to the Ministry of Education the percentage of successes in grammar school selection tests in the rural areas of Buckinghamshire; and how this percentage compares with the average for the whole county.

I regret that this information is not available.

Would the hon. Gentleman obtain it? It is stated locally that the opportunities for children in the rural areas are less than 10 per cent. and in the urban areas 20 per cent., which means that the child in the town has twice the opportunity of getting into a grammar school that the child in the rural area has. Cannot the hon. Gentleman do something? Is he aware of the appalling conditions in schools in country areas, the insanitary buildings and the difficulties of getting teachers? Will not he look at the whole of this subject?

We have got on very well in recent years with the problem of re-organisation in getting rid of all-age schools in rural areas. I agree with the hon. Member that this is important, but he will recognise that the Buckinghamshire education authority could not provide this information without making a very lengthy analysis of individual classes. My noble Friend would not feel justified in asking the local authority to make the very detailed returns required.

asked the Parliamentary Secretary to the Ministry of Education the reduction in the number of children taking school meals in Sunderland since the recent increase in the cost of the meals.

I regret that this information will not be available until local education authorities submit their annual return in October.

Will the hon. Gentleman try to get this information earlier? Is he aware that my information is that there has been a fall of about 10 per cent., which is really disastrous? Is it not time that the Government revised their policy and looked at the question again?

I do not think that it would be right to add to the burden on local authorities by asking them to make a return more often than once a year.

Is not this becoming a rather pressing question? Is the hon. Gentleman aware that we had Questions last week which bore out that there is a relation between the cost of school meals and the falling off in the number of school meals taken?

I have, of course, noticed that there has been a number of Questions on the subject. The actual proportion of those taking school dinners in Sunderland has been declining steadily for some years, but we shall have the normal autumn report later this year and there will be ample opportunities for discussing the matter in the House when that return is available.

asked the Parliamentary Secretary to the Ministry of Education to what extent the secondary school building programme still lags behind the basic needs of the children.

The provision of Secondary school places is in general keeping pace with the growth in the number of senior pupils.

Would the hon. Gentleman make a tour of the country to check on this? Is he aware that in many parts of the country secondary schools are terribly overcrowded and children are being taught in classes of over 40 and 50? Is he aware that there are very grave discrepancies between proposals made to the Ministry by the local authorities and the number that the Minister approves? Since there are unemployed building workers in the country, will the hon. Gentleman seriously consider accelerating this building programme?

The hon. Member has another Question on this theme. In 1956 the number of school pupils increased by 120,000. The number of school places increased by 130,000, and over 300,000 secondary school places are at present under construction.

asked the Parliamentary Secretary to the Ministry of Education what are his latest figures of secondary classes of over 50, over 40, and over 30 pupils, respectively.

The figures for January, 1957, will be available in the autumn. In January, 1956, in schools maintained and assisted by local education authorities there were 38,940 senior classes with more than 30 pupils. Of these 4,181 classes had more than 40 pupils and of these again 64 had more than 50.

Is it now the Minister's policy to reduce the size of secondary classes to a maximum of 30 pupils? Does that remain the policy of the hon. Gentleman's Department If so, what will he do to enlarge the school building programme as well as to recruit more teachers, so as to get rid of the very large number of over-sized classes?

As I have explained on several occasions in the House, our prime aim during the last few years has been to cut down the size of classes in primary schools. We believe that that improvement can be maintained without effecting adversely the size of classes in secondary schools. My noble Friend is confident that in the next few years the increase in the number of teachers will be fully sufficient to match the increase in the number of children, but he hopes that as the numbers in the primary schools fall some primary school teachers will be willing to take jobs in secondary schools.

asked the Parliamentary Secretary to the Ministry of Education what percentage of the children attending elementary schools in England and Wales entered grammar schools in each of the years 1946, 1951 and 1956.

In January, 1956, the proportion of 13-year old pupils in England and Wales in grammar schools maintained and assisted by local education authorities, or in the grammar streams of bilateral or multilateral schools, or holding places at direct grant grammar schools or at independent schools for which local education authorities were responsible, was 20·8 per cent. I cannot give exactly comparable figures for 1946 and 1951, because all the necessary statistics were not collected until 1954, but the available information suggests that the proportion increased very slightly over the period.

While thanking the hon. Gentleman for that reply, may I ask whether his attention has been drawn to some shocking propaganda issued by his political party, in which it is stated that there are better educational opportunities for children under a Tory Government than under Socialism? Does not the hon. Gentleman think it very wrong that such propaganda should be published in the Press? Will he use his influence with his party chiefs to refrain from publishing the portraits of nice-looking children, who are probably the children of Socialists in any case, in this propaganda? If the hon. Gentleman must publish portraits, why not publish a portrait of the Cabinet and let the electorate see the horrible truth for themselves?

I do not see how that supplementary question arises from this Question, but since the hon. Member has given me the opportunity to mention that there has been great educational progress under this Government, I am very pleased to do so.

Has the hon. Gentleman also noticed that in this propaganda there is a very unworthy and contemptuous reference to comprehensive schools, which will be rightly resented by the people who work in them?

I cannot debate comprehensive schools in answer to this Question. I made a statement on 5th April, which represented Government policy and gave general satisfaction in the House.

Will my hon. Friend bear in mind that we are looking forward to more grammar school places under the Conservative Party in the northern region and when are they going to come along? May I have an answer, please?

I was not sure that my hon. Friend's question arises out of this one—

That does not matter. I want an answer.

But if she will look at the figures she will find, as I have said, that there has been substantial progress in all departments of education during the past five years.

asked the Parliamentary Secretary to the Ministry of Education what consultations he is having with the teachers and the universities with a view to giving university status to the three-year training period.

None, Sir.

Is the hon. Gentleman aware that those of us who are concerned about this matter feel that for the three-year training period to be really valuable it should confer some kind of university status on the teacher? Will he not at least consider the suggestion, which I made when he announced the three-year period, that there should be some arrangement between the training colleges and the universities so that the period confers some university status, either in the way of a first degree in education or something else? Is he aware that there is nothing that would raise the status of the teaching profession more than for it to become a graduate profession, and that this is the opportunity?

All these matters will be considered, but the three-year course at the training colleges will be good enough to stand on its own feet without having to call itself something else. We intend that the three-year training course shall justify itself on its own merits, though I will certainly bear in mind the points which the hon. Gentleman has made.

asked the Parliamentary Secretary to the Ministry of Education if he will introduce legislation to enable local education authorities to assist in the provision of teachers or schools or equipment in the Colonies.

The provision of teachers, schools and equipment in Colonial Territories is the responsibility of my right hon. Friend the Secretary of State for the Colonies and the Governments of the individual territories. But the Government attach great importance to encouraging British teachers, and especially teachers of English, to take up posts in the Colonies, as well as certain other posts overseas. The Government's proposals were described in the White Paper on the Overseas Information Services and the local education authorities' and teachers' associations have been asked to co-operate in making a success of these measures.

While thanking the Minister for the very sympathetic reply on the principle of the Question, may I ask if he is aware that the crying need of the Colonies is for school places and for teachers, that it is our moral duty to assist the impoverished Colonies to provide these facilities for children, and that probably a number of British local education authorities would be willing to lend a hand by the provision of a teacher or a school if the Minister would make such provision legal?

The main purpose of the proposals in the White Paper is to give teachers going overseas confidence that their career prospects when they return to this country will not be impaired. These proposals will not require legislation. I can assure the hon. Gentleman that we are bearing all these points in mind.

asked the Parliamentary Secretary to the Ministry of Education whether, in view of the fact that the Government propose to discontinue National Service, he will introduce legislation so as to permit teachers who have done National Service before entering their teaching career to count this Service for superannuation purposes.

No, Sir. It is a long standing principle of public service superannuation schemes that National Service should count for pension purposes only if it interrupts civil employment.

Is the Minister aware that this grievance has been accentuated since the granting of equal pay, and does he think it right that men who have done National Service, as contrasted with women or conscientious objectors, should be perpetually at a financial disability because they have served their country voluntarily?

We should think very hard before departing from this principle which, after all, was most recently laid down in the Superannuation Act, 1948. Any concession for National Service would also have repercussions affecting those engaged in war service before entering on their civil employment in the public service.

asked the Parliamentary Secretary to the Ministry of Education how the percentage pass mark required for entry to grammar schools after this year's 11-plus examination in the north-west Middlesex division compares with that required for the remainder of the county; and what qualifications, other than examination results, were taken into account before deciding which of the marginal cases should be included in the grammar schol entry.

The qualifying mark in the written examination is the same for north-west Middlesex as for the rest of the county. In addition, school records, teachers' opinions and any exceptional circumstances are taken into account in marginal cases.

In so far as the school records are all pretty much the same and all children receive a recommendation from the head teacher, does not the Parliamentary Secretary think that this process of selecting almost arbitrarily one or two out of the marginal cases was bound to lead to the unhappiness we have seen amongst parents and children since the last lot of examinations?

As I have said many times, we are doing all we can all the while to improve our methods of selection, and we are not afraid of experiments. Equally, it would be wrong to abandon the principle of selection because of the difficulties to which the hon. Gentleman has referred.

asked the Parliamentary Secretary to the Ministry of Education the approximate percentage of children in England who sit for the 11-plus examination and who gain entry to grammar schools; and the comparative percentage of children who sat for this year's examinations in the north-west Middlesex division and the West Drayton schools, respectively.

In January, 1956, the proportion of thirteen-year-old pupils in England in grammar schools maintained and assisted by local education authorities, or in the grammar streams of bilateral or multi-lateral schools, or holding places at direct grant grammar schools or at independent schools for which local education authorities were responsible, was 20·1 per cent. The information asked for in the second part of the Question is not available.

As a matter of fact, I did get some figures in a letter from the Parliamentary Secretary, though they referred to the year before. Would he not agree, if he makes further investigation, that the percentage coming from that part of Middlesex is much lower than the remainder of Middlesex or of the country? Would he look into the matter again and find the reason?

The corresponding figure for Middlesex as a whole was 25 per cent., as I think the hon. Gentleman knows. My noble Friend does not keep statistics for parts of local education authority areas, and I do not think it would be right to ask the local authorities to provide these.

asked the Parliamentary Secretary to the Ministry of Education the total number of grammar school places available within the northwest Middlesex division; and what percentage this represents of the total number of children who sat this year for the 11-plus examination.

This information is not available. Many children who live in the north-west Middlesex division attend grammar schools outside it.

Nevertheless, there is a very strong feeling in Middlesex that why there is such a smaller percentage of children going to the grammar schools from this area is because grammar school places are not available in this district. If that is not the reason, there must be some other. Does not the Parliamentary Secretary think it worth while to look at the breakdown of these figures to discover what is the trouble?

We ought to be careful about sub-dividing a local authority area, since that would lead to all kinds of difficulties. When a particular local authority does not seem to have a sufficient share of grammar school places for the whole of the local authority area, then on numerous occasions—and I have quoted some in the House before now—we try to adjust the figure of the building programme. But to try to sub-divide an area for which a local authority is responsible would give rise to great difficulties.

asked the Parliamentary Secretary to the Ministry of Education whether he will make a statement in the near future on the abolition or modification of the parental means' test, which applies to grants and awards made to university entrants; and whether he will give an assurance that any modifications will operate from the academic year beginning this autumn.

This would require amending legislation and there is no present prospect of this.

Does that mean that the Parliamentary Secretary and his right hon. Friend the noble Lord are unaware of the tremendous burden placed upon parents who are on salary scales, such as civil servants, particularly if they have more than one child at one of the older universities, which is something that can and does happen?

My noble Friend dealt with this matter exhaustively in a debate in another place on 22nd May. He has arranged for a working party, consisting of officers of his Department and representatives of the local authority associations, in consultation with representatives of the universities, to examine the arrangements for assessing university awards.

May we have at least an assurance on the second part of the Question, namely, that if a decision is reached, the decision will become active, as it were, from this autumn?

I would not ask the hon. Gentleman for a moment to expect any legislative changes by this autumn, but the working party will hold its first meeting on 25th July. It will confine its attention to adjustments within the framework of the existing arrangements, and will not deal with more fundamental issues, such as the abolition of the means test. Any detailed changes in the existing arrangements will come into effect in the autumn of 1958.

asked the Parliamentary Secretary to the Ministry of Education what progress he is making in persuading local authorities to establish regional school building groups, with a view to reducing costs particularly in the purchase of building materials and the employment of professional and technical staffs.

My noble Friend will shortly be discussing with a number of local education authorities the possibility of grouping some of their building projects with a view to obtaining favourable terms for certain building components.

When this matter is being further considered, will the Parliamentary Secretary and his noble Friend consider extending what I think is an excellent idea, not only for the purposes of pooling the purchase of building materials and the employment of technical staff, but also heavy mechanical equipment, such as excavators?

My noble Friend welcomes the initiative of local education authorities in this matter. It is rather too early to say whether it will prove to be of wider application.

asked the Parliamentary Secretary to the Ministry of Education what steps he is taking to encourage the provision of facilities for teachers and students for the study of comparative education in English-speaking countries and in the Commonwealth particularly; and if he will make a statement.

Comparative education is primarily a field of university study at the post-graduate level and any question of developing it is a matter for the university authorities.

In connection with this idea, may I ask the Parliamentary Secretary, in conjunction with his noble Friend, to use what influence they have to foster the idea by establishing a centre here for the study of comparative education, particularly in the Commonwealth, with a view to strengthening Commonwealth ties within this cultural field, and also replenishing our stock of educational ideas from Commonwealth sources?

It is worth remembering that about 200 teachers each year go from the United Kingdom on exchange to Commonwealth countries and the United States, under arrangements sponsored, and to a considerable extent financed, by my Department, and they thus have direct experience of education in those countries.

asked the Parliamentary Secretary to the Ministry of Education the percentage of children over eleven years old who attend all-age schools in Berkshire, compared with the national average; and what further progress is being made in providing secondary modern school places in the county.

In January, 1957, the proportion in Berkshire was 15·3 per cent.: the figure for England and Wales is not yet available, but in January, 1956, it was 8·2 per cent. Over 2,000 more secondary modern school places in Berkshire are likely to be taken into use by the end of next year, and work on schools providing a further 4,500 will start between now and March, 1959.

Can my hon. Friend tell us when all the children in Berkshire will have the opportunity of going to either a secondary modern school or a grammar school?

I think the figures that I have given are encouraging. The programme of building for rural re-organisation will greatly reduce the proportion of Berkshire children in all-age schools during the next few years. All but two of the new schools needed to complete rural re-organisation in Berkshire have been approved by my noble Friend for starting between now and March, 1959.

How many of the additional places come from new towns, where there is increased population?

I cannot answer that without notice, but I would ask my hon. Friends to study the figures which I have given, for I think they are encouraging.

asked the Parliamentary Secretary to the Ministry of Education the percentage of children attending primary schools in the rural areas of Berkshire who now qualify for and receive grammar school education compared with children attending primary schools in Reading, Newbury and other towns in the county.

I regret that this information is not available.

Would it not be well to take a sample as between village areas and town areas, because there are many parents who feel that their children do not have the advantages of those who happen to be brought up in towns?

I know the feeling on this matter—we had it expressed on an earlier Question—but I rather doubt whether a sample would be helpful and of real value.

Will the hon. Gentleman reconsider getting information about rural areas? Obviously, a number of hon. Members are interested in the matter, which is one of concern throughout the country. I think that the hon. Gentleman, if he tries, could make a general survey of the opportunities for grammar school education in rural areas compared with those in urban areas.

It would be a much more lengthy and arduous task than the hon. Gentleman imagines, and I do not think my noble Friend would feel justified in asking authorities to make the detailed returns which would be required. I can tell the House that in January, 1956, the proportion of thirteen-year-old pupils in Berkshire as a whole attending grammar schools maintained by local education authorities or direct grant grammar schools was 24·4 per cent., and the corresponding figure for Reading County Borough was 15·9 per cent.

asked the Parliamentary Secretary to the Ministry of Education whether he will give an estimate of the total cost of the adoption by local education authorities of the scales of educational maintenance allowances described in his Department's Circular 327.

If all local education authorities adopted the scales the estimated total annual cost would probably be between £2 million and £2½ million as compared with a present expenditure of about £1 million.

asked the Parliamentary Secretary to the Ministry of Education whether he will revise Ministry of Education Circular 327 so as to make it conform with the recommendations of the Working Party on Educational Maintenance Allowances.

No, Sir.

Can the hon. Gentleman say why he will not accept the full recommendations of the Working Party? Does he remember that the Working Party said that it could not conscientiously recommend any economies—that is, scales less than that which it had proposed—without there being the risk of a significant loss to the education of the child?

The matter was, of course, very fully considered. My noble Friend felt he could not accept fully, as a basis for expenditure from public funds, all the assumptions embodied in the Working Party's Report, and in deciding to approve lower maximum allowances he naturally had regard to the Government's other commitments and the need for ensuring that additional expenditure is directed towards meeting the most urgent needs. I think the hon. Gentleman will agree that, in the present economic climate, to have secured an increase of expenditure in respect of maintenance allowance of even that order was something not to be despised.

asked the Parliamentary Secretary to the Ministry of Education what steps he has taken to appoint the Committee to consider the future of the library service as proposed in the Local Government White Paper, Command Paper 161; and what interests he proposes to have represented on the Committee.

I am glad to say that Mr. S. C. Roberts, Master of Pembroke College, Cambridge, has agreed to act as Chairman of this Committee. The names of the other members will be announced as soon as possible.

Will the hon. Gentleman bear in mind that there is a very deep cleavage of opinion in the Library Association about the size of authority which ought to be allowed to maintain a library service, that this led to the rejection of a resolution put forward by the council of the association at its annual conference, the subsequent carrying of it on a postal ballot, and the subsequent rejection of it in the following year, and that that in itself led to the formation of a Smaller Libraries Association? While I do not wish to encourage parochialism, might I point out that this is an Association which is worthy of a hearing?

I have heard details of the points to which the hon. Member has referred. The intention is that the Committee should be representative of the local authorities and professional bodies mainly concerned with the public library service, as well as of other interests connected with it.

asked the Parliamentary Secretary to the Ministry of Education the percentage national averages of children admitted to grammar and technical schools over the last four years; and what he estimates these will be during the next four years.

As the Answer to the first part of the Question contains a number of figures, I will, with permission, circulate it in the OFFICIAL REPORT. The proportions have remained virtually constant during this period and my noble Friend hopes that in general they will be maintained.

Will the hon. Gentleman answer the second part of my Question, which asked for an estimate about the future?

I do not think it would be possible for me to give an estimate about the future, because these are, after all, largely matters for the individual local authorities. However, my noble Friend has always said in his speeches that he believes the proportion of children selected for grammar or technical schools ought to be aproximately 25 per cent., adding the two together. If the hon. Gentleman looks at the figures, he will find that my hon. Friend's proportion has on the whole been maintained during the last few years.

When the block grant replaces the specific education grant, what guarantee will there be that this can be maintained? Will not the disparity be likely to increase?

We shall have an opportunity of debating the general grant in the near future.

asked the Parliamentary Secretary to the Ministry of Education what steps he is taking to avoid further delay in the building of two new classrooms at Holy Trinity School, Cookham, Berkshire.

My noble Friend approved the plans in February, 1957, and it is for the local education authority to carry them out. I understand that it is now doing all it can to get work started quickly.

Is my hon. Friend aware that the discussions about the extensions to the school have been going on for the last eighteen months, that building has not yet begun, and that the present accommodation is most insanitary and unsatisfactory, for a number of reasons which he knows very well? Does he not agree that urgent emergency action should be taken?

My noble Friend approved the plans last February. I hope that the Question and Answer will draw the attention of all concerned to the importance of getting the work started quickly. One lesson that I draw from looking at the relevant papers is that it is a mistake for firms of architects, however proficient, to take on more work than they can really plan in the time.

asked the President of the Board of Trade what steps are being taken by Her Majesty's Government to supply Colonial and Commonwealth countries with machine tools, engineering goods and civilian aircraft in view of redundancy in industries affected by the curtailment of defence work.

I do not accept the assumption that the curtailment of defence orders will lead to serious unemployment. Exports to Commonwealth countries, including the Colonies, of the products referred to have increased in recent years, and exporters have available to them the services offered by the Board of Trade and the Export Credits Guarantee Department.

Did the right hon. Gentleman note the statement of the Minister of Supply this week that 7,000 workers are likely to be made redundant in the Royal Ordnance factories during the next two and a half years? Is he aware that at Blackpool and at Langley in my constituency the Hawker works have been entirely closed down, and as these factories can be used to produce exactly the goods for which there is a crying need in the Colonies and the Commonwealth, will he consult his fellow Ministers and try to meet the needs in this way?

There is a very heavy load on the engineering industries at this moment. It is the Government's belief that men released from the defence contracts will readily find other work. In the hon. Gentleman's constituency, for instance, the last figure for unemployment was half of 1 per cent.

asked the President of the Board of Trade the value of steel imported from the United States of America in 1956 for the manufacture of motor cars.

In 1956, total imports from the United States of uncoated steel sheet, the bulk of which was used by the motor car manufacturers, were valued at £7,236,598.

Is the right hon. Gentleman aware that recently a British motor firm, a major importer of dollar steel, concluded a barter agreement with Norway in order to exchange about £300,000 worth of motor cars for Norwegian sprats? Is that the way to deal with the dollar problem?

The hon. Gentleman may have seen a number of Questions and Answers on that subject. I think it was finished motor cars which were exchanged for Norwegian silds.

Can the right hon. Gentleman give the figures of steel imports from Canada in the same period?

Not without notice.

Does not the right hon. Gentleman think it would be better to import considerably thicker steel plate from dollar countries for shipping than this steel for the motor car industry, which involves the cost of processing and, thus, a greater dollar expenditure?

That is a question which I think should be addressed to the Paymaster-General, who is responsible for steel supplies.

asked the President of the Board of Trade in how many cases the exceptions procedure has been applied to the export of embargoed goods to Poland and Bulgaria, respectively; and what were the goods, amounts and values involved.

Since the revision of the lists in August, 1954, we have granted one hundred and fifty-one licences for embargoed exports to Poland and four for embargoed exports to Bulgaria. In almost all cases the goods involved were goods in the metals and chemical groups. All but ten were for values of less than £40; and where the values were greater all were for spare parts for equipment previously supplied from this country.

May I assume from that answer that the President of the Board of Trade will continue to use his maximum efforts to free trade with these countries as he did trade with China?

That is rather a different question. These are exceptions for goods on the embargo list, and we have said that these have to be rare and only trifling in amounts.

Will the right hon. Gentleman pay attention to the revision of the embargo list?

Not for the time being.

asked the President of the Board of Trade (1) what assistance is being given to British manufacturers desirous of trading with Union of Soviet Socialist Republics to enable them to accept orders from outside the planned sector of the Soviet economy;

(2) what assistance is being given to British manufacturers desiring to trade with the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics to distinguish between orders placed outside the Soviet planned economy, and those offered from within the planned economy.

There may be some misunderstanding. My right hon. Friend suggested in his letter to Mr. Bulganin that Soviet trading agencies might be given more freedom to place orders for goods for which no specific provision had been made in their planning. But this would not involve any question of placing orders outside the Soviet planned economy and British manufacturers would not be called upon to make the kind of distinction the hon. Member suggests.

Can the President put it to his right hon. Friend that it is ludicrous to establish such a prerequisite for trade with the Soviet Union? Would he break it gently to the Prime Minister that the Soviet Union economy is a controlled economy and that the British trader is not concerned with whether he is selling inside or outside a planned economy? What he wants to do is to trade with Russia.

I think that is well understood. My right hon. Friend had in mind an increase in consumer goods which were not on the lists which were exchanged when Mr. Bulganin came here.

asked the President of the Board of Trade whether Her Majesty's Government are now operating the procedure for making exceptions to the strategic embargo on United Kingdom exports to the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics.

I would refer the right hon. Gentleman to the Answer given on 13th May by my right hon. and learned Friend the Secretary of State for Foreign Affairs to the hon. Member for West Ham, North (Mr. Lewis).

Is it not a fact that the exceptions procedure applies to trade with the whole Soviet bloc and China?

Yes, Sir.

asked the President of the Board of Trade whether, following the disagreements between the shareholders of the Daimler Company, which have resulted in a decline in trade and the threatened dismissal of 1,000 workers, he will set up under Section 165 (b, iii) of the Companies Act a committee of inquiry in order to investigate the company's affairs.

I see no reason for an investigation under the Companies Act. I am informed that the figure of 1,000 mentioned by the hon. Member is much exaggerated.

While I recognise that the inquiry may have to be postponed until the next Labour Government comes into power, is the right hon. Gentleman aware that the Daimler workers in my constituency believe that they have become the victims of an irresponsible feud between shareholders of the company? Further, is he aware that the company, with its famous name, is threatened today with extinction, and will he take action now, or does he intend to wait until another North American company takes control of a leading British firm?

I think that the hon. Gentleman's constituents are under a misapprehension. The Daimler Company intends to continue making cars. What it has done is to rationalise the number of models.

asked the President of the Board of Trade what will be the Government's policy in regard to priority for Commonwealth trade in the forthcoming international discussions on a European Free Trade Area.

The Government's policy remains as stated in paragraph 14 of the White Paper, Cmnd. 72, dealing with the Free Trade Area. As the Prime Minister said recently, we do not believe that there is any contradiction between our determination that inter-Commonwealth trade should grow and our proposal for freer trade in industrial products in Europe.

Bearing in mind the Government's unwillingness to help Commonwealth investment and the economically abortive nature of the recent Commonwealth Conference, is there not a danger that the Government may fall between two stools and neither expand Commonwealth trade nor enter into the European Free Trade Area?

I do not accept what the hon. Gentleman says about Commonwealth investment. The Government are very anxious to increase it, but we cannot invest a deficit. It is necessary, therefore, to earn and save more.

asked the President of the Board of Trade what advice he is giving, pending the determination of quotas, to British firms wishing to accept orders from China for goods on the quantitative control list.

asked the President of the Board of Trade (1) to what extent the export quotas for goods on the quantitative control list for China, now being considered by the Paris Consultative Group, will be additional to those already applicable to the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics and the countries of the Eastern bloc;

(2) if he will now define precisely the extent to which the global quotas for goods on the quantitative control list for China will represent a total quota to be shared by all countries which are members of the Consultative Group; and what safeguards he intends to introduce to ensure that the interests of British exporters are fully protected;

(3) if he expects to be in a position to report to the House on the recommendations made by the Paris Consultative Group to member Governments on the subject of export quotas for goods on the quantitative control list for China before the House rises for the summer Recess.

With permission I will answer this Question and Nos. 51, 52 and 53 together.

Surely the President is not claiming that Question No. 40 is of the same type in any way as Questions 51, 52 and 53?

I think that when the hon. Gentleman hears my Answer he will see that it covers the point.

The quotas for China will be additional to those already applicable to trade with the countries of Eastern Europe.

As I informed the hon. Member for Govan (Mr. Rankin) on 4th July, recommendations as to these quotas are due to be made in the near future by the Paris Consultative Group. Our exporters' interests are looked after by our representatives on the Group.

The recommendations of the Group and the amounts of the quotas will be confidential. Exporters wishing to accept orders for goods on the quantitative control list should submit applications to the export licensing branch.

Is the right hon. Gentleman aware that British firms are losing Chinese orders, particularly the largest orders for machine tools, turbo-generators and roller bearings, because they cannot state what quantity they may export? What is he doing about this?

All the countries of the Group are in the same position and I hope that before the end of the month we shall have the recommendations for these quotas.

If I followed the right hon. Gentleman correctly, he did not answer the last part of Question 53 in which I asked him if there would be a statement before the House rises for the summer Recess. Can he say anything about that? Further, in the allocation of these quotas, can he tell us why it is that the United States of America, which is doing no trade at all with China, should have a voice in deciding the amount of trading that we are to do with China?

If the Group does make recommendations before the end of the month I shall be in a position to make a statement. As to the second part of the hon. Gentleman's supplementary question, we work together with the United States in examining and checking on these controls, and I see no reason at all why we should not keep together.

May I take it that the presence of the United States on Cocom indicates that the United States will share in the quotas and is ready now to trade with China?

No, Sir.

asked the President of the Board of Trade whether, in view of the advice given to him by the Birmingham Chamber of Commerce, he will make a statement on the future of the British Industries Fair and on the possibility of organising an international trade fair in Great Britain.

I told the deputations from the Birmingham Chamber of Commerce that the future of this fair depends largely on the attitude of British industry towards an international fair in this country. The President of the Federation of British Industries agreed to sound his members on such a proposal. I am now waiting for this advice.

In considering the whole question of the future of the international trade fair, would the President bear in mind—and members of the Chamber of Commerce bear in mind—the need to associate the Colonies and the Commonwealth in this sort of enterprise?

I think that it probably is right that the fair, if it is to go on, must have an international character and therefore the Colonies and the Commonwealth would be associated with it; but I really must wait to get support from industry if the fair is to be continued.

asked the President of the Board of Trade whether, in view of the unfavourable balance of trade with the Argentine, and in view of our economic position generally, he will limit the importation of fruit and vegetables, since all necessary supplies can be obtained from home agriculture.

Most of the fruit and vegetables imported from Argentina are apples and pears which arrive here after the main home marketing season. Their import is already limited by a quota.

is my right hon. Friend aware that there is now no season for English apples is view of the immense number of apples which are gas stored and available during the whole of the twelve months? As we can grow these apples, is it necessary to import others?

I am inclined to agree that seasons do not matter as much as they did, and we will take that into consideration.

When taking into consideration the question of limiting the imports of this fruit, will the right hon. Gentleman bear in mind that at present the price of apples is quite outside the range of the ordinary housewife? In the tea room of the House of Commons, for example, small apples are being sold at 8d. each. In these circumstances, ought not he to allow some of this produce to come in from overseas?

We give very considerable quotas for eating apples. I imagine that this is a particularly difficult moment in the year, season or no season.

If there is any shortage world mentioned by the hon. Member for Uxbridge (Mr.Beswick), we shall be only too pleased to supply it, if he will let us know his requirements.

asked the President of the Board of Trade whether, in view of the fact that horticultural products are not taken into account at the Annual Farm Price Review and therefore do not qualify for guaranteed prices, he will increase the present tariff in order to give protection against subsidised foreign imports whether subsidised directly or indirectly.

If the horticultural industry feels there is a case for increased tariffs it can apply for them.

Is my right hon. Friend aware that since there was an increase of tariffs, horticulture has had to stand one or two increases in wages, together with increases in the price of coal, and that the industry gets no protection from the Annual Price Review such as is afforded to other products? Does he not think that horticulture, which is an important industry, should have more protection?

It is open to the industry to make a case for a particular product and that case will then be examined on its merits.

asked the Prime Minister if he has now reached conclusions on methods by which the operations of small prospectors of uranium-bearing ores in the Federation of Rhodesia and Nyasaland can be co-ordinated.

I have written to the hon. Member about this. I understand that the mining laws of the territories concerned ensure an orderly system of registration of licences and claims. Co-ordination among prospectors is a matter for the prospectors themselves.

Is the right hon. Gentleman aware that I greatly appreciate the courteous and full letter which he sent to me? Will he consult the Secretary of State for the Colonies on whether registration alone is effective in preventing chaotic competition? For example, will he look at the rather similar position of the chaos in West Africa among diamond winners and encourage co-operative co-ordination, such as that now taking place in Ghana?

I am grateful for what the hon. Member has said. I have taken a little trouble to look into the matter. The hon. Member will appreciate that mining laws are a matter for the South Rhodesian legislature. We are not responsible for them. The arrangements by which small lots are to be purchased by the Atomic Energy Authority should have some result in encouraging smaller prospectors and producers. When the hon. Member says that they should not scramble but be co-ordinated, the problem is where co-ordination approaches monopoly and where it avoids chaos, and that is one which they must try to settle themselves.

asked the Prime Minister whether he will state the chief objection of Her Majesty's Government to the proposal that hydrogen-bomb tests should be suspended for two years.

Her Majesty's Government joined with the Governments of Canada, France and the United States in putting forward proposals according to which a suspension of nuclear tests would form part of a first stage disarmament agreement. We believe that this is the best way in which to make an advance and that if such an agreement can be reached the advance will indeed be considerable. If the right hon. Gentleman means to refer to a two-year suspension of tests in isolation, without agreement on its relationship to other disarmament provisions, the objections of Her Majesty's Government to this were stated by my right hon. and gallant Friend the Minister of State for Foreign Affairs on 11th July. We have had to consider the balance of courses most likely to put an end to a nuclear arms race. We have thought it best to proceed by stages. In formulating these proposals we have considered very carefully with out allies the period which would be just long enough to show whether, as we hope, the Governments concerned will fulfil all their pledges and whether other potential nuclear powers will agree to join in the suspension agreement, without, however, holding up the advance to a further stage of disarmament if this should prove possible.

I am afraid that the Prime Minister has misunderstood the point of my Question. There has been considerable talk of a suspension for two years. Does not the Prime Minister agree that a suspension for ten months would be ridiculous, since the preparation of the tests takes all of that time, so that in fact there would be no suspension? Is he aware that because of that those of us who are anxious to see a suspension regard the proposal for a ten months' suspension as playing with the issue? Will not Her Majesty's Government agree to a suspension for two years?

I found it rather difficult to know from the form of the Question whether it was a matter of the suspension itself, or of the period of suspension. I had to make a long Answer because the matter of suspension is tied up in our proposals, rightly or wrongly—and the House will debate that next week—with a general advance to what we call the first period of disarmament—including some advance on conventional and some agreement to discuss the question of the cut-off of material. If it is a matter of two years or ten months, the reasons I have given are still valid, that ten months are a sufficient time to know whether the other negotiations are proceeding satisfactorily without putting ourselves in the position of having completely disbanded our scientific arrangements and our teams. It will be time to know whether it is a genuine move forward and, therefore, whether that ten months can be extended to eighteen months, two years, or whatever might be a satisfactory period.

The Prime Minister is well aware of my view of this matter. Does he not agree that the suggestion of a suspension for ten months is ridiculous and that anybody who knows anything about these problems knows that a ten months' suspension means nothing in these processes? What I want the Prime Minister to say is that Her Majesty's Government will agree to a two years' suspension, or state specifically why they insist on a suspension of only ten months.

Some of the right hon. Gentleman's premises are not correct.

Is not the proposal of the Western Powers for a suspension of tests for ten months cluttered up with a whole series of other proposals, including political considerations, which are regarded as objectionable by the other side? If the Government are serious about disarmament—it can be only partial disarmament, because no more can be expected at the moment or for some time—should not the Government resile from a limited proposal for ten months?

No, Sir. I think that the proposals put forward by Her Majesty's Government in conjunction with our allies, the Governments of Canada, France and the United States, have been generally regarded as wise and progressive proposals to deal with at least the first stage in this matter. However, I can see that it can be argued that we should try to deal with a still smaller stage. All that is to be debated at length next week. All I can say is that the proposal which we have agreed with our allies has been generally regarded as wise, as protecting our interests, and as testing whether there is a genuine desire by the Russian Government to move into the first stage of disarmament.

asked the Prime Minister whether he is now satisfied that an internationally agreed ban on the production of nuclear weapons can be effectively enforced.

Her Majesty's Government believe that it is practicable to enforce effectively an internationally agreed ban on future production of fissile materials for weapons purposes if an adequate inspection system has been installed.

Does the Prime Minister's reply cover the diversion of fissionable material from existing stockpiles of nuclear weapons?

No, Sir. That is why I was careful, although the right hon. Gentleman's Question referred to the production of nuclear weapons, to say in my reply that we believed it was practicable, if we could get a sufficient degree of inspection, to operate a ban on the production of fissile materials; but we must admit that it would not be possible to make a complete ban on the production of weapons, because that could be enforced only if the total past production of fissile material could be accounted for. In my view, that is not possible.

asked the Prime Minister when he expects to receive the Report of the Committee on Administrative Tribunals and Inquiries.

The Report of the Committee has now been received by my noble Friend the Lord Chancellor, who has presented it to Parliament today. Copies will be available to hon. Members in the Vote Office immediately.

I am sure that the House will wish me to express their thanks to the Committee for its work.

Is my right hon. Friend aware that his reply will give great satisfaction to very many people, both inside and outside the House? We are very grateful.

asked the Prime Minister, in view of the need for an increase in the output of coal, if he will consider making a special broadcast appeal to the youth of the nation to take up coal mining as a career.

I am grateful for the compliment implied in the hon. Gentleman's Question, but the present methods of recruiting are doing very well, and I do not think that a special broadcast is needed.

Is the Prime Minister aware that on Monday there are due to be answered at least twenty Questions from his supporters, calling attention to the need for an increased output of coal? Further, is he aware that these Members represent constituencies where the least number of recruits are coming in for the mining industry? In view of the fact that he may still have some little influence in such places as Bournemouth, does not he think that he should reconsider the position?

Yes, but I think that these Questions require rather careful handling. I am hoping that the question of the use of Hungarian refugees will be satisfactorily settled.

asked the Prime Minister what consultations were held with the Commonwealth Prime Ministers regarding the establishment of a military base in Kenya; and whether he can yet state the Government's policy regarding the establishment of this base.

It is not the practice to disclose what consultations have taken place between Commonweahh Prime Ministers beyond what is stated in the communiqué.

As regards the second part of the Question, I have no statement to make.

I thank the Prime Minister for that reply, but is he aware that there is widespread alarm in Kenya at the prospect of this base being established there, and that that alarm is not confined to any one race? Would it not be advisable, before a decision is reached upon the establishment of this base, that consultations should be held in Kenya with the representatives of all communities?

I really do not know what all this is about. As far as I know, no decision of any kind has been made. The expression "base" is altogether vague. All I know is that my right hon. Friend had discussions about the strength and disposition of our forces and that he will no doubt make an announcement when he feels that the time has come to do so.