asked the Minister of Agriculture, Fisheries and Food if he will make a statement on the restrictions at present affecting the import of Irish cattle into Great Britain.

As the reply is rather long I will, with permission, circulate it in the OFFICIAL REPORT.

Does the hon. Gentleman realise that this is a very valuable trade to both countries concerned and that it has a great tradition behind it? Will he say whether it is the policy of the Government to encourage or discourage it and will he make a statement on that trade in relation to the trade in Scottish cattle?

I would agree that this is an important trade. We have tried to strike a fair balance between the need to safeguard against the risk of the re-introduction of disease and the need to see that those in this country who rely on these cattle as stores get an adequate supply. I think that we have a fair balance.

asked the Minister of Agriculture, Fisheries and Food if he will state his plans for the future financial structure of the fishing industry indicating, in particular, the present and future limits for subsidies.

My right hon. Friend the Secretary of State for Scotland and I will await the Report of the Fleck Committee before coming to any decisions on these matters.

Does the right hon. Gentleman realise that this is an urgent matter and that the trade needs attention? Will he treat it as a matter of urgency?

As I have already told the hon. and learned Gentleman, I am well aware of the importance of these matters, and I know that we have an extremely efficient Committee reporting on this matter.

asked the Minister of Agriculture, Fisheries and Food how many applications have been made, in Wales and in the County of Glamorgan, respectively, at the latest convenient date under the Agriculture (Small Farmers) Act; and how long it will take his Department to deal with these applications.

Up to 3rd July, 5,649 applications had been received from farmers in Wales and Monmouthshire under the Small Farmer Scheme and 541 under the supplementary scheme. The corresponding figures for Glamorgan are 357 and 35 respectively.

Two thousand nine hundred and fifty-eight applicants have subsequently submitted farm business plans under the Small Farmer Scheme including 225 in Glamorgan. Of these 1,223 have been approved including 109 in Glamorgan. Unless they present special difficulties the remainder should be cleared within three months.

Three hundred and twenty farms have been registered under the supplementary scheme including five in Glamorgan. The remainder of applications under the supplementary scheme should be cleared within two weeks.

As Wales has proportionately a very large number of small farms, can my hon. Friend assure the House that progress in Wales is as satisfactory as elsewhere? Can he also say what proportion of the applications already put in have been rejected or are likely to be?

I would certainly say that Wales got off to a very smart start. The Welsh farmers have come forward very well with applications and I think that they are profiting by their early applications. I can assure my hon. Friend that we are going all we can to keep up to date with the scheme. As to the last part of my hon. Friend's supplementary question, I could not give the figure without studying the matter.

asked the Minister of Agriculture, Fisheries and Food what progress has been made in discussions with the appropriate organisations concerning the internal drainage boards and the problem of flooding in various parts of the country.

I regret that I am not yet in a position to add to the reply given on 8th June to the hon. Member for Goole (Mr. G. Jeger).

The right hon. Gentleman will know that last November he gave me an Answer which seemed to offer some hope of progress. Can he tell the House a little more, because we are approaching the winter flood season? We ought to try to get something done before then if it is at all possible.

I well remember the Question which the right hon. Gentleman put to me. I can tell him that the matters which he raised in that connection on 10th November are under discussion with the authorities concerned. I hope to be able to say something more later on.

Is the right hon. Gentleman aware that these matters have been under discussion now for about eight years? Can he give some indication when one or other of the several alternatives will be accepted?

The right hon. Gentleman is quite right. These matters have been under discussion for a very long time. I am happy to say that we are making very reasonable progress in these discussions.

Will the right hon. Gentleman bear constantly in mind the fact that many farmers with land in the northern Midlands, represented by my right hon. Friend and myself, suffer great loss of money and work due to the flooding of their land, and the country loses a great deal of food?

What the hon. Gentleman has said very fairly pinpoints the importance of this matter.

asked the Minister of Agriculture, Fisheries and Food whether he is aware that dissatisfaction is felt with the grading of bacon carcases in many places carried out by the graders of his Department; and whether he will see to it that instructions are issued to bring about greater uniformity in the methods adopted.

Perhaps the hon. gentleman will let me have particulars of the complaints he has in mind, as I am not aware of any general dissatisfaction. The grading of bacon pig carcases depends entirely on actual measurements, and I am satisfied that throughout the country a high stardard of uniformity has been achieved.

As there is considerable dissatisfaction in some parts of the country, of which I will certainly inform the Minister and the Parliamentary Secretary, would it not be desirable to send out instructions to graders to secure uniformity on at least two points, namely, length of carcase and thickness of fat on the back?

Both those points are covered in the instructions given. Specific lengths and depth of fat are particularly laid down. That is why I should like to see the facts. If the hon. Member will let me have them, I will gladly look into them.

asked the Minister of Agriculture, Fisheries and Food if he has yet held discussions with representatives of the bacon curing industry; and if he will make a statement.

I had full discussion with representatives of the British bacon curing industry when we met on 3rd July. I shall be sending them a considered reply.

As the new Anglo-Danish Agreement, whatever its merits, is a reversal of all the previous assurances which the Government have given, will the right hon. Gentleman say whether he discussed this matter with the industry and what the views of the industry were?

I kept the bacon curing industry informed in the process of negotiations.

Did the right hon. Gentleman also keep the British Pig Producers' Association informed as to the likely result of these negotiations? If so, can he give the House some sort of appraisal of their reaction?

During all these negotiations I kept in very close touch with the president of the National Farmers' Union.

asked the Minister of Agriculture, Fisheries and Food what action he is now taking to increase pig production.

Government action in regard to the level of the pig population is taken in the light of the Annual Review, which is conducted in consultation with the National Farmers' Union.

Is the right hon. Gentleman aware that the sow population of this country has fallen in the last twelve months from 713,000 to 565,000 and that bacon factories are working at only between 35 and 40 per cent. of their capacity? Is it the policy of the Government that this deplorable trend shall continue?

As the hon. Gentleman knows, I have answered Questions on this subject before. The figure just given by the hon. Gentleman is an exaggeration. I estimate that the bacon curing industry is working at 64 per cent. of its highest level of production. That is a fair figure, and I gave it to the House the other day.

asked the Minister of Agriculture, Fisheries and Food which of the information officers on the staff of his Department has had journalistic experience in Fleet Street.

Of the three officers in information class posts one has had Fleet Street experience.

Is it the usual practice of my hon. Friend's Department to ensure that there is one journalist with Fleet Street experience and will that continue to be the practice?

Our practice is to make these posts available for those with this experience, provided that their other qualifications are satisfactory. We want the best men we can obtain, but as far as possible they must have some agricultural knowledge because of the highly important technical questions with which they have to deal.

asked the Minister of Agriculture, Fisheries and Food whether he has completed his consultations about a Horticultural Marketing Council with the interests concerned; and if he will make a statement.

Consultations are still going on, and I am not yet in a position to make a statement.

The right hon. Gentleman will not be surprised if I press him. There has been a long delay. Is the right hon. Gentleman confident that there will be a statement before the Summer Recess?

No, I am not confident that I can give that pledge. This is a very complicated and very revolutionary suggestion. We must see that the various interested bodies are able to consult with one another. I cannot give the hon. Gentleman the pledge for which he asks.

But the right hon. Gentleman knows that the Runciman Report came out a very long time ago and it was generally accepted. We expect some action from the Government after this lapse of time.

The hon. Gentleman is far too closely associated with the industry not to realise that what I have said is good common sense. We must have consultations and ensure that all interests are in a position to be able to give their views on this very new line of thinking.

asked the Minister of Agriculture, Fisheries and Food whether he will make a statement on the food strategic reserves.

Strategic reserves of food are maintained, but it is not the practice to give information about them.

We gathered from the Estimates that the appropriation in aid has fallen. Is this because prices have fallen or because the amounts of stock have fallen? If prices have fallen, will the Minister say why the housewife does not benefit from these falls in prices?

If the hon. Gentleman looks fairly at these Estimates, he will see that there has been a very small decline in the net expenditure of about £50,000. If the hon. Gentleman looks at the OFFICIAL REPORT for 23rd July, 1951, he will see that, when he was asked a Question on these lines, he gave a very similar Answer to mine.

asked the Minister af Agriculture, Fisheries and Food (1) what proposals he has for the purchase by his Department of orange juice from the West Indies for consumption under the welfare schemes;

(2) what proposals he has for the purchase of citrus products from the West Indies.

I have a responsibility for procurement of concentrated orange juice for the welfare foods service. A ten-year contract for the purchase from the West Indies of this orange juice has still one year to run. The arrangements for future years are now under discussion with a delegation from the West Indies.

After this year has finished, the method of buying may perhaps be different and the amount of orange juice we require may perhaps be less. Despite that, will my right hon. Friend give an assurance that whatever is required for welfare schemes will be bought from the West Indies citrus industry, which was, after all, developed to help us in war-time and should not be abandoned by us now merely to assist the United States citrus industry?

I do not think that there is any question of abandoning anything. All I am saying is that these discussions are now taking place. I will certainly bear in mind what my hon. Friend has said.

Are tests made as to the vitamin content of various samples of orange juice so that we may be quite sure that they remain equally valuable for children, who need them so much?

Yes, the hon. Gentleman is quite right. The consideration which he has mentioned has to be borne very much in mind.

Will the right hon. Gentleman give a clear Answer to the Question asked by his hon. Friend, which is very important and which is supported on both sides of the House?

The right hon. Gentleman has been in responsible positions before. When one is having discussions, there is nothing one can say at the early stages before those discussions are completed.

asked the Minister of Agriculture, Fisheries and Food to what extent he proposes to encourage more imports of Danish bacon as a result of the negotiations recently concluded with the Danish Government.

My right hon. Friend the Chancellor of the Exchequer proposes, with your permission, Mr. Speaker, to make a statement on the Danish negotiations immediately after Questions this afternoon.

Is not this a black day for British pig producers and bacon producers, who are being sold down the river by the present Government? Is not the right hon. Gentleman aware that we are going, first, to lose about—

Order. The hon. Member should wait for a complete Answer to his Question until the statement is made after Questions.

asked the Chancellor of the Exchequer what total sum in service charges and in annual interest Her Majesty's Government will pay to the International Monetary Fund for the drawing of 561 million dollars, and the standby arrangement for 739 million dollars made by Her Majesty's Government in December, 1956.

On the drawing it is estimated that a total of rather less than £7 million will be paid. On the standby arrangement, a service charge of £660,000 has been paid for each of the three years of the arrangement.

Am I right in concluding that that would be a total of about £10 million as an additional sum to be added to the other costs of the Suez war?

The arithmetic of the first part of the right hon. Gentleman's supplementary question seems to be approximately correct. As for the second part of his supplementary question, I cannot prevent him from drawing deductions, true or false, from my purely factual Answer.

asked the Chancellor of the Exchequer how much is paid annually in taxation from profits by private industry; and how much by the nationalised industries combined.

I would refer the hon. Member to the figures given in the Blue Book on National Income and Expenditure 1958. Table 54 gives estimates of the tax paid by companies and public corporations; but I regret it is not possible to separate the element of tax on trading profits from that on other sources of income.

Public corporations extend beyond those commonly called the nationalised industries, but a further breakdown is contained in table 42. I regret that it is not possible to give a still further breakdown without infringing the rule against disclosure of the tax position of individual taxpayers.

May I ask my hon. and learned Friend why, instead of giving such a long-winded reply, he did not give the two simple figures for which I asked? Would he confirm the impression that about £1,500 million a year is obtained in taxation from private industry and that nothing is drawn in taxation from the nationalised industries? What extra source of revenue does he think he could produce if private industry were nationalised and no taxation were produced by it?

If I could have given my hon. Friend two simple figures, of course I should have done so. It is true that the great bulk of the revenue of public corporations is produced by private companies.

As the Financial Secretary is in a long-winded mood, which I welcome, will he tell us what is the total of subsidies paid by the Exchequer to private industry at present? Am I not right in thinking that it is running at rather over £400 million a year?

I must ask the right hon. Member to put that question on the Order Paper, since it in no way arises out of the original Question.

If the hon. and learned Member is in a mood to furnish information on these matters, can he say what amount of compensation has been paid by the nationalised industries to the previous owners?

The right hon. Gentleman must put down a Question about that to one of my right hon. Friends.

Has the Minister noticed a recent tendency in company balance sheets to show a fraudulent valuation of certain assets, for instance, where valuations have not been conduced since 1929? If these had been shown at their correct valuation there would have been an accretion to the revenue of the country. Should not this fraudulent practice receive the Government's attention?

Questions as to fraudulent practices by company directors and their accountants should be put to my right hon. Friend the President of the Board of Trade.

asked the Chancellor of the Exchequer whether he will amend his Order concerning the repayment of postwar credits so as to permit Mr. Tomlinson, a disabled miner of Tamworth, to receive payment, bearing in mind that, although he is not a 100 per cent. disability pensioner, he does not qualify for National Assistance and would not be entitled to Unemployability Supplement.

I regret to say that Mr. Tomlinson does not qualify for his postwar credit under existing Regulations. As my right hon. Friend and I explained in the debate on the Income Tax (Repayment of Post-War Credits) Bill on 15th April, the categories for the first time made eligible for repayment on the ground of hardship are the most that can be managed at the moment. My right hon. Friend regrets therefore that he cannot at present propose any extension of the Regulations.

While it is obviously impossible to cater for all the permutations and combinations, are not post-war credits a useful instrument to cover this sort of hardship case? Here we have a very serious hardship, and I ask the Minister whether he will have another look at this problem.

Successive Chancellors of the Exchequer refused to repay post-war credits on the ground of hardship, precisely because of the difficulty of drawing a line and the feeling of those who were on the wrong side of the line that they ought to have been included. The House in general, and right hon. Gentlemen opposite in particular, however, welcomed my right hon. Friend's courage in making a start with the solution to this problem, and undertook not to press him this year to extend the Regulations.

That does not apply to me in respect of my constituents.

asked the Chancellor of the Exchequer whether he will present to Parliament a report on the progress since 1953 of all iron and steel companies which are still wholly-owned subsidiaries of the Iron and Steel Holding and Realisation Agency, indicating particularly for each one the annual output, earnings, interest and surplus paid to the Agency, investment in capital equipment, and numbers employed in management and otherwise.

I would refer the hon. Member to my reply to the right hon. Member for Middlesbrough, East (Mr. Marquand) on 6th July.

Since these companies have been in the possession of the Agency for a number of years, is not Parliament entitled to know what is happening? Why should there be this secrecy? Will the hon. Member explain?

The reasons are fully set out in the Answer which I gave earlier in the week. One of the reasons for not giving further information is that we do not wish to damage their competitive position vis-à-vis other companies.

Have the Government this information? If they have, are not the taxpayers, the public and the workers in the industry entitled to have it? If they have not, are they not neglecting their duty to the large public sector in the steel industry which is still owned by the nation?

The Question relates to information about individual companies. We feel that the amount of extra information which they volunteer should be left to the discretion of the individual companies. It might not be in their interests to give more information than they wish.

Is the Minister not aware that the Written Answer to my Question suggested that the British public is not entitled to know the facts about the companies it owns, whereas private companies are required to publish the information in full and can be questioned by their shareholders at annual meetings. Is not the public of Great Britain represented by its representatives in the House and cannot we have the information for which we have asked?

A private company is not required to publish information which goes further than that required by the Companies Act, 1948. A private company may volunteer further information provided that it does not damage its own position and standing in the industry. We think that the same discretion ought to be allowed to the directors of these companies, who are working in competition with other companies which are privately owned.

asked the Chancellor of the Exchequer to what extent his Department has studied the effect of Purchase Tax on the pottery industry, particularly in the first quarter of the year; and if he will take steps to diminish the harm done.

I am aware that the home sales of pottery in the first quarter of this year were low, but in this connection the seasonal pattern of the trade must be borne in mind. The tax reductions made in the Budget and the now very moderate rate applying to its products should be of benefit to this industry.

Has not the Economic Secretary studied the representations made to him, which give clear evidence that there is a considerable withholding of orders from the industry in anticipation of Purchase Tax changes and that this takes place during the first quarter of the year? While we want the complete removal of Purchase Tax from pottery, will he not seriously consider the effects of the present position as they are felt between Christmas and the date of the Budget?

A deputation explained their point of view to me fully. While I recognise that this may be a minor factor, I think that they would do well to consider the essentially seasonal nature of their industry.

asked the Chancellor of the Exchequer if he will give in table form the internal purchasing value of the £ sterling, taking October, 1951, as 20s., and for October in each subsequent year, and to the nearest convenient date.

As the Answer is long and contains a number of figures, I will, with permission, circulate it in the OFFICIAL REPORT.

Why have the Government deliberately allowed the internal purchasing value of the £ to decline so heavily?

I did not catch the first part of the hon. Member's supplementary question, but I think that this will probably answer it: he would do well to examine the Index of Retail Prices over the last fifteen months, and he might derive benefit from comparing it with the index for the last twelve months of the Socialist Government.

Would it be true to say that the Government have raised the cost of living to the highest level ever known and are now boasting of having kept it there?

As the occupant of my position in 1951, the right hon. Gentleman is in no position to ask that sort of supplementary question.

asked the Chancellor of the Exchequer if he will show in table form by what percentage and amount the retail prices of food have increased in each year since 1951, and, to the nearest convenient date, and for each year, the amount by which prices have increased since 1951.

I thought that this Question had been answered with Question No. 19.

I was told that it would be answered with Question No. 19, but the Financial Secretary, in answering No. 19, did not say so.

Perhaps I might explain that the Answer to Question No. 21 is also long and contains a number of figures and that it will, with permission, be circulated in the OFFICIAL REPORT.

Why is it that the Government have permitted food prices to rise so high, without making any effort to restrict them?

I think the hon. Gentleman ought to look at the table of figures.

As there is now such confusion between the Economic Secretary and the Financial Secretary, will the Economic Secretary now answer the question which the Financial Secretary was unable to answer two minutes ago?

I thought my hon. and learned Friend answered it quite brilliantly.

Is the hon. Gentleman not aware that since 1951 import prices have dropped 14 per cent. and that export prices have risen 9 per cent.; yet, in spite of that very important improvement in the terms of trade, the retail prices have risen over the same period by 25 per cent.? How does the hon. Gentleman explain the discrepancy?

Perhaps the hon. Gentleman, in fairness, would quote the comparable increase in wages during the same period.

asked the Chancellor of the Exchequer by what amount Income Tax and Surtax have been reduced for a married man with two children having a gross income of £500, £1,000, £5,000 and £20,000, respectively, in the year 1959–60 as compared with the year 1951–52.

As the answer contains a number of figures, I will, with permission, circulate it with the OFFICIAL REPORT.

Will the hon. and learned Gentleman give an assurance that when

asked the Chancellor of the Exchequer if he will consider taking powers to require the joint stock banks to transfer to the Treasury all balances of accounts in which no transactions have taken place for twenty years, subject to repayment of any claim if made later the Government are in a position to reduce taxation they will equitably distribute the effects amongst the whole of the population, including the lower income groups as well as the higher income groups?

The substantial reductions in taxation which the Government have effected have been distributed equitably. In the case of a man earning £500 a year, to which the hon. Gentleman referred, the whole of his 1951 tax bill has been remitted. One cannot do more than that.

I can see no need or justification for legislation on these lines.

Should not these steadily accumulating balances, which were mostly owned by depositors long since dead, and which are being used by the banks for their own purposes, be treated as other property left by people without sons or heirs, so that the British taxpayer can benefit?

The matter is not such a big one as possibly the hon. Gentleman imagines. The dormant balances in the clearing banks were estimated in 1949 to be under £6 million, the same as the figure for the Post Office Savings Bank. There is no reason to suppose that the figure has been substantially increased since then.

asked the Chancellor of the Exchequer if he will give an approximate estimate of the extent to which the balance of payments has been affected by the inflow of short-term funds in the first quarter of 1959 as compared with the last quarter of 1958.

The first quarter's balance of payments figures are as yet only provisional, but the available information indicates that the movement of short-term funds in that quarter was much the same as in the preceding quarter if allowance is made for the arms purchase prepayment deposit by the Federal German authorities in March.

Is it not the case that the apparently favourable state of the gold and dollar reserves is due largely to the inflow of these short-term funds and that they will also flow outwards with embarrassing rapidity at the first unfavourable turn of circumstances?

No, there is no such evidence.

asked the Chancellor of the Exchequer to what extent he proposes to enlist the support of persons who are neither members of the Government nor in the Government Service in his proposed inquiry into Treasury control of expenditure.

This will not be an inquiry into Treasury control, but a review of the principles and practice which govern the whole control by the Executive of public expenditure. My right hon. Friend hopes before the Recess to be in a position to make a further statement about how it will be conducted.

Will the hon. and learned Gentleman undertake to make this inquiry as broad as possible and to bring in as many unofficial persons as possible in order to obtain a full report? An inquiry of the Government, by the Government and for the Government will not be so beneficial as a fuller report.

I would ask the hon. Gentleman to read the Treasury observations to the Select Committee on Estimates, and to await my right hon. Friend's statement.

Speaking as a member of the Select Committee on Estimates, may I express my appreciation of the receptive attitude of the Treasury and ask my hon. Friend whether the Committee of Inquiry will be willing to receive evidence from Members of Parliament or outside persons which may bear upon its inquiries?

I think I would prefer to draw my right hon. Friend's attention to the observations of my hon. Friend, and perhaps he will be able to deal with the matter when he makes a statement.

asked the Chancellor of the Exchequer what form of contact is maintained between the Treasury and the Arts Council.

The Treasury maintains constant official contact with the Arts Council, as with other graint-aided bodies of similar important. A senior Treasury official attends Arts Council meetings as an assessor.

As the Arts Council exists entirely on public money granted by the Treasury, is there any attempt made by the Treasury to control or advise or influence the Arts Council in the way in which it allocates this money as between one specific object and another? Is there any means by which the Arts Council can be made responsible or accountable for the money that it spends?

The system which I think has commended itself generally is that the Arts Council is responsible for the allocation of the funds which Parliament places at its disposal. There are, of course, discussions and official contacts. So far as the Covent Garden allocation for this year is concerned, the Arts Council was content that it should be dealt with in the way that it has been dealt with, and my right hon. Friend made extra funds available specifically for that purpose.

As my hon. and learned Friend will presumably agree that Parliamentary control exists, will he explain how, when the Arts Council issues a report with gross inaccuracies in it, we are to control the Arts Council and enable it to issue a report which is, in fact, accurate?

The publications of the Arts Council are in this respect in the same position as reports of any other outside body.

asked the Chancellor of the Exchequer the conditions governing the annual grant to the Arts Council of Great Britain.

No formal conditions are attached to the grant. The Arts Council is, of course, required by its Charter to use its funds solely towards the promotion of the objects of the Council as set forth in the Charter.

Does the hon. and learned Gentleman consider that it is in accordance with the policy of promotion of the arts that the Secretary-General of the Arts Council should have recently stated that it intends to reduce the grant to provincial theatres and to cut down considerably and remove the majority of provincial repertory theatres from its benefits? Is it not a disastrous thing for provincial theatres that this should be done by the Arts Council without any responsibility whatever to the Treasury or to Parliament?

As I told the hon. Member in reply to an earlier Question, the allocation of the funds placed at its disposal is a matter for the Arts Council; but, so far as I know, no decision has been taken.

Is my hon. and learned Friend telling the House quite seriously that neither the Government, the Treasury, this House nor anybody else has any power of even advice, much less direction, as to whether all the funds at the disposal of the Arts Council shall or shall not be concentrated in the major centres? Is he aware that there is strong feeling throughout the country that there should be a wider dispersion of these funds?

The accounts of the Council are audited by the Comptroller and Auditor-General. The Council submits detailed estimates and produces a widely read Annual Report and I am answerable to Parliament for the grant in aid and, indeed, have frequently been called to question.

Does the hon. and learned Gentleman realise that many people will support him in refraining from exercising too detailed Treasury control over how the Arts Council spends this money?

asked the Chancellor of the Exchequer if he will make a statement on the future of the Normanby Iron Works, Cargo Fleet, in the possession of the Iron and Steel Holding and Realisation Agency.

The Agency announced recently that, on the recommendation of the directors of the company, it had decided with regret that the furnaces should be permanently blown out on Friday, 24th July.

Is the hon. Gentleman aware that this works, which employs many hundreds of men, has been closed down at almost indecently short notice? Notice was given yesterday without any consultation with the trade union, and in spite of many proposals for modernisation having been put forward by the directors to the Agency. Is not this a most extraordinary state of affairs?

No, a representative of the trade union was informed in confidence in advance. As regards redevelopment of the works, the trouble is that the demand for haematite iron has not been increasing and that there is existing a surplus capacity. Redevelopment would not, therefore, be an economic proposition.

Is the hon. Gentleman aware that the trade union representatives have said publicly that they were not consulted?

I am aware of that report, and I am looking into it.

Is it not a fact that more than once this firm has been refused permission by the Agency to modernise its works? Would he confirm or deny the rumour that it is now to be sold to its principal competitor in the industry which was sold back to private hands only last year?

No, I can neither confirm nor deny that rumour concerning the sale of the assets, but I would point out that any reconstruction of the Normanby Iron Works would be very expensive and would not be economically justifiable.

As this works is in my constituency, and in view of the unsatisfactory nature of the reply, I beg to give notice that I shall raise the matter on the Adjournment.

asked the President of the Board of Trade what steps he is taking to increase the export of machine tools to the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics in accordance with the recent trade agreement.

We have given wide circulation to the Soviet purchasing programme, which includes machine tools, and we are now discussing with a team of Soviet representatives detailed arrangements which I hope will include machine tools.

Can the President of the Board of Trade explain how it is that in the first five months of this year exports of machine tools to the Soviet Union fell from a level last year of nearly £64,000 to a level this year of just over £7,500? Can he say whether that is due to lack of initiative on the part of firms exporting to the Soviet Union or because their designs are not sufficiently advanced? Can he also tell the House what Mr. Khrushchev said to the three representatives of the industry who lunched or dined with him in Leipzig during the Fair?

I cannot answer the last part of that supplementary question, but I can tell the hon. Member that the Soviet authorities appeared in Moscow very ready greatly to increase their purchases of machine tools, and this is one of the subjects which the delegation is now discussing with the Board of Trade.

asked the President of the Board of Trade if he is satisfied with the response of British manufacturers to the facilities offered by the Design Centre.

Yes, Sir. There is convincing evidence that manufacturers are placing an increasing value on the work which the Council does. At the same time there is plenty of room for more support from industry.

Could my right hon. Friend say by how much receipts have risen since the establishment of the Centre?

Receipts have risen from £20,000 in the year 1954–5 to £53,800 last year.

asked the President of the Board of Trade in how many exhibitions overseas the Design Centre participated in 1958 and is participating in 1959; and in which places such participation has taken or is taking place.

The Council of Industrial Design gave advice about overseas exhibits on five occasions in 1958 and will do so on fourteen such occasions in 1959. The Council's help is most valuable and much appreciated.

Does my right hon. Friend feel that participation in these overseas exhibitions is of real help in the promotion of the export drive?

Yes, I am sure it is, but we have to be careful that the right kind of goods are exhibited.

asked the President of the Board of Trade what are the functions of the location rooms in his Department; and how many are employed there.

The location rooms at Board of Trade headquarters, the regional offices and the offices for Scotland and Wales are designed to provide information on all matters connected with the distribution and location of industry. They are continually used by industrialists and officials seeking information on location problems. No staff is specially employed in location rooms.

Is the Department really instrumental and effective in inducing industries to go to areas where they are really needed? How many industries have gone to Wales and Scotland, for example, as a result of the work of these location rooms? Will the right hon. Gentleman look again to see whether the location rooms are carefully organised?

The location rooms seem to me to be very well organised. If the hon. Member would like to pay a visit to one, we shall be glad to show it to him.

asked the President of the Board of Trade what steps he is taking to encourage the diversification of the jute industry by attracting a paper bag-making firm to establish itself in the Dundee Development Area.

The Government are prepared to build factories and to give financial assistance for suitable projects in Dundee, including paper bag manufacture.

While thanking the President of the Board of Trade for that Answer, may I ask if he is aware that two Dundee jute firms have decided to diversify themselves by going into the manufacture of paper bags, but have announced that they are to set up a factory in England to do so on the ground of transport costs? Can the right hon Gentleman tell the House what efforts these firms made to persuade him to give the necessary Government help to establish a factory in the Dundee Development Area? Will he do his best to persuade these firms to refrain from this unfortunate decision?

My office in Scotland has been in touch with these two firms, who said that they had given full consideration to the possibility of setting up in Dundee, but that all the same, they had decided against it.

asked the President of the Board of Trade whether he is now able to call industrialists' attention to the possibilities of a site at Douglas, Lanarkshire, where there are subsidised houses standing empty, good road and rail communication, abundant water, coal and electricity, surplus sewerage capacity and a labour force which has been virtually strike-free for years.

We will be able to tell firms which sites in Douglas are available for industrial use as soon as the development plan is approved. If in the meantime an industrialist should want a particular site, the Board of Trade and county council would deal with that case in advance of and apart from the development plan.

Would my right hon. Friend be prepared to try to interest industrialists in the area in general and then, if they bite the bait, lead them to a particular site which could be cleared by the county council instead of waiting for the county council to prepare an overall development plan which, I gather might take some time, so that, therefore, we might miss opportunities which exist of trying to interest firms in general in the area where, as my right hon. Friend knows, there are particular sites which could be made available if necessary?

I do not wish any opportunity to be missed and I am doing what my hon. Friend has asked.

asked the President of the Board of Trade when permits were granted for the export of eighty Saracen armoured vehicles to the Union of South Africa.

No permits were required for the export of military vehicles to South Africa.

Is the right hon. Gentleman aware how shocked many of us have been by the fact that armoured vehicles provided from this country have been used by the Union of South Africa against the African people struggling for equality? In future, will he take steps to prevent such arms being exported to South Africa for this purpose?

That is not a question for me. If he wishes to pursue it, perhaps the hon. Member will do so with the Secretary of State for Commonwealth Relations.

Before he allows the export of these machines, does the right hon. Gentleman take into account the use to which they are likely to be put? Is he aware that the vast majority of progressive opinion in this country deeply deplores the use to which these vehicles are so obviously to be put? Will he take some steps to stop any further consignments to South Africa?

There is no question of allowing or not allowing these vehicles to go, because no export permits were required and, therefore, the Board of Trade does not come into the matter.

asked the President of the Board of Trade whether he will seek powers not already given him either in the Merchandise Marks Acts or in the Prevention of Fraud (Investments) Act, 1939 in order to safeguard the interests of individuals against the kind of commercial activities about which the Member for West Fife has written him.

asked the President of the Board of Trade if he will introduce legislation to protect the citizen from the kind of trading activities, details of which have been supplied to him by the hon. Member for Dundee, East.

In the particular case the hon. Members have in mind, my information is that the purchasers believed on the basis of oral statements that the machines would be profitable and this has proved not to be the case. It is not easy to see how legislation would be a protection in such circumstances, but I will consider any suggestion the hon. Members have to make.

Would the right hon. Gentleman be prepared to say that if a Bill were introduced under the Ten Minutes Rule to provide a model set of regulations to govern this kind of practice, he and the Government would push it through before the General Election? Is he aware that many hundreds of humble people have been robbed of their savings by this company which, as I have said before in this House and say again, is run by scoundrels? Is he prepared to consult with the Home Office to bring back Mr. Levine to this country so that the Official Registrar might ask the questions to which he referred when the company was wound up?

Consideration would have to be given before any legislation was introduced. In answer to the second part of the supplementary question, the imports for which I am responsible do not extend to this gentleman, out I will consult my right hon. Friend the Home Secretary.

Is the President of the Board of Trade aware that the sales methods used by this company—the Master Vending Machine Co. Ltd.—and the abuses perpetrated on a number of my constituents have revealed grave inadequacies in the law? Will the right hon. Gentleman look at this matter again in order to protect ordinary citizens from these "Smart Alec" sales tactics?

It is by no means clear to me that the kind of statements which lead purchasers to buy these machines are fraudulent. One has to look at all the evidence, and that, I think, is not very clear yet.

asked the President of the Board of Trade how many schemes for the clearance of derelict sites under Section 5 of the Distribution of Industry Act, 1945, whether by his Department or by grant, have now been approved this year; and what is the total cost of such schemes.

Two, Sir. Grants to the local authorities in these cases are estimated at £20,500, representing 75 per cent. of the cost of clearance. Many more are under consideration and I am doing my best to reach decisions on them as soon as possible.

As we were promised in March that this Section would be reactivated in a vigorous way, can the President of the Board of Trade assure us that some of the further schemes under consideration will be approved fairly soon?