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Written Answers

Volume 668: debated on Friday 30 November 1962

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Written Answers To Questions

Friday, 30th November, 1962

Royal Air Force

Retired Civil Servants (Employment)

asked the Secretary of State for Air (1) if he will publish a list of the administrative, executive and technical officers of his Department with salaries of more than £2,000 per annum who on resigning or retiring over the past ten years have taken up posts with industrial firms, signifying which of these have done so within two years of leaving the Civil Service, in cases requiring the approval of his Department;(2) if he will publish a list of the administrative, executive and technical officers of his Department with salaries of more than £2,000 per annum who on resigning or retiring over the past 10 years have taken up posts with industrial firms, stating the firms which they joined within two years of leaving the Civil Service, in cases requiring the approval of his department.

The following is a list of the officers by grades for whom applications to take up posts with industrial firms have been approved in the last 10 years:—

YearGrade
19551 Permanent Under-Secretary of State.
19611 Director of Works.
19621 Mechanical and Electrical Engineer.
The firms involved were:

  • Hoare, Lea & Partners.
  • John Blackwood Hodge & Co. Ltd.
  • Short Bros. & Harland Ltd.
  • William F. Rees Ltd.

Officers are not required to consult the Department about posts which they wish to take up more than two years after retirement from the public service.

Royal Navy

Retired Civil Servants (Employment)

asked the Civil Lord of the Admiralty (1) if he will publish a list of the administrative, executive and technical officers of his Department with salaries of more than £2,000 per annum who on resigning or retiring over the past ten years have taken up posts with industrial firms, signifying which of these have done so within two years of leaving the Civil Service, in cases requiring the approval of his Department;(2) if he will publish a list of the administrative, executive and technical officers of his Department with salaries of more than £2,000 per annum who on resigning or retiring over the past 10 years have taken up posts with industrial firms, stating the firms which they joined within two years of leaving the Civil Service, in cases requiring the approval of his Department.

The following table lists the number of officers by grades for whom applications to take up posts with industrial firms have been approved in each of the last 10 years:

YearGrade of Officer
19521 Director of Naval Construction.
19541 Civil Engineer-in-Chief.
19551 Deputy Director of Stores.
19571 Senior Principal Scientific Officer.
19581 Inspecting Officer of Naval Ordnance.
1 Director of Naval Construction.
19591 Warship Electrical Superintendent.
19601 Director of Electrical Engineering.
19611 Director of Naval Construction.
1 Director of Dockyards.
19621 Assistant Director of Naval Construction.
1 Assistant Director of Dockyards.
The firms and undertaking concerned in these applications were as follows:

  • Denny Brothers Limited.
  • Fairfield Shipbuilding and Engineering Company.
  • Gibson and Company (Shipbrokers).
  • R. & H. Green and Silley Weir Limited.
  • Hall-Thermotank Limited.
  • Livesey and Henderson Limited.
  • Rye-Arc Limited.
  • Sankey and Company.
  • J. Thorneycroft and Company.
  • Underseas (Bermuda) Limited.
  • J. S. White and Company.
  • Yarrows (Shipbuilders) Limited.

There is no record whether the appointments for which approval was given were actually made, and there is no requirement for officers to obtain approval to take up posts when they have been retired from the public service for more than two years.

Ministry Of Aviation

Retired Civil Servants (Employment)

asked the Minister of Aviation (1) if he will publish a list of the administrative, executve and technical officers of his Department with salaries of more than £2,000 per annum who on resigning or retiring over the past ten years have taken up posts with industrial firms, signifying which of these have done so within two years of leaving the Civil Service, in cases requiring the approval of his Department;(2) if he will publish a list of the administrative, executive and technical officers of his Department with salaries of more than £2,000 per anum who on resigning or retiring over the past 10 years have taken up posts with industrial firms, stating the firms which they joined within two years of leaving the Civil Service, in cases requiring the approval of his Department.

The following table shows the numbers of officers by grades for whom applications to take up posts with industrial firms have been approved over the last ten years.

YearGrade of Officer
19531 Permanent Secretary.
1 Assistant Secretary.
3 Principal Executive Officers.
19541 Senior Chief Executive Officer.
1 Deputy Chief Scientific Officer.
1 Chief Scientific Officer.
1 Director (Engineer).
19551 Assistant Secretary.
1 Principal Executive Officer.
1 Senior Chief Executive Officer.
2 Chief Scientific Officers.
1 Deputy Chief Scientific Officer.
1 Senior Principal Scientific Officer.
1 Assistant Director (Engineer).
19561 Permanent Secretary.
1 Chief Scientific Officer.
2 Deputy Chief Scientific Officers.
3 Senior Principal Scientific Officers.
2 Principal Scientific Officers.
2 Directors (Engineer).
1 Assistant Director (Engineer).
3 Engineers I.
1 Engineer II.
19571 Senior Principal Scientific Officer.
1 Director General (Engineer).
3 Directors (Engineer).
1 Assistant Director (Engineer).
19581 Chief Scientific Officer.
2 Principal Scientific Officers.
1 Assistant Director (Engineer).

19591 Deputy Secretary.
1 Chief Executive Officer.
1 Chief Scientist.
2 Chief Scientific Officers.
2 Assistant Directors (Engineer).
19601 Chief Scientific Officer.
1 Deputy Chief Scientific Officer.
1 Director General (Engineer).
19611 Permanent Secretary.
1 Deputy Chief Scientific Officer.
1 Principal Scientific Officer.
1 Assistant Director (Engineer).
19622 Deputy Chief Scientific Officers.
1 Senior Principal Scientific Officer.
1 Senior Experimental Officer.

This includes 17 officers in former Ministry of Supply posts no longer part of the Ministry of Aviation.

The names of the firms concerned at the time of application are as follows:

  • Aberdare Cables Ltd.
  • Aero Jet General Corporation of America.
  • Air Trainers Ltd.
  • Albright & Wilson Ltd.
  • Aldis Bros. Ltd.
  • Appleby and Ireland Ltd.
  • Armstrong Siddeley Motors Ltd.
  • Blackburn & General Aircraft Co. Ltd.
  • B.R.D. Ltd.
  • Briggs Motor Bodies Ltd.
  • Bristol Aeroplane Co. Ltd.
  • Bristol Aircraft Ltd.
  • British & French Bank.
  • British Communications Corporation Ltd.
  • British Motor Corporation.
  • British Oxygen Ltd.
  • British Thomson-Houston Co. Ltd.
  • Brockworth Engineering Ltd.
  • S. G. Brown Ltd.
  • Cogswell & Harrison Ltd.
  • Collins Radio Co. of England Ltd.
  • Constable Hart & Co. Ltd.
  • Coventry Gauge & Tool Co.
  • Canadian British Aluminium Co. Ltd.
  • Dowty Group.
  • B. Elliott & Co. Ltd.
  • Ferranti Ltd.
  • W. J. Fraser & Co. Ltd.
  • Garringtons Ltd.
  • General Tire and Rubber Co.
  • General Precision Corporation of New York.
  • Glass Developments Ltd.
  • Glass Yarns & Deeside Fabrics Ltd.
  • Guest, Keen & Nettlefold Ltd.
  • Hawker Siddeley Group, Ltd.
  • Hecht, Levis & Kahn.
  • Hispano-Suiza Group.
  • Hobourn Aero Components Ltd.
  • Hunting Engineering Ltd.
  • International Computers & Tabulators Ltd.
  • Legal & General Assurance Society Ltd.
  • J. Langham Thompson Ltd.
  • Manicouagan Power Co.
  • Massey Harris Ferguson Ltd.
  • Maudslay Motor Co. of Coventry.
  • Microcell Aircraft.
  • Mullard Equipment Ltd.
  • Mullard Ltd.
  • Nathan Agran Ltd.
  • Newman Industries Ltd.
  • Jack Olding.
  • Painton & Co. Ltd.
  • Pena Copper Mines Group.
  • Petters Ltd.
  • Projectile & Engineering Co. Ltd.
  • Pulsometer Group.
  • Reynolds T.I. Aluminium Ltd.
  • Saben Hart & Partners Ltd.
  • Scottish Aviation Ltd.
  • Serck Radiators Ltd.
  • S.F.I.M. (G.B.) Ltd.
  • J. E. Shay Ltd.
  • Siemens Bros. & Co. Ltd.
  • Silentbloc Ltd.
  • Simons Equipment Ltd.
  • Standard Telecommunications, Laboratories.
  • Taycorn Engineering Co. Ltd.
  • F. Taylor & Sons (Manchester) Ltd.
  • Tube Investment Research Laboratories.
  • Urquharts (1926) Ltd.
  • Venesta Foils Ltd.
  • Vickers-Armstrong, Ltd.
  • S. G. Warburg & Co. Ltd.
  • Westland Aircraft Ltd.

There is no record of whether the appointments for which approval has been given were actually made.

Hong Kong

Typhoon Damage (Relief)

asked the Secretary of State for the Colonies what assistance Her Majesty's Government have given to Hong Kong for the repair of damage and the relief of distress caused by a typhoon on 1st September.

As a token of sympathy Her Majesty's Government have contributed £10,000 to the Colony's Community Relief Trust Fund. An advance has been made from the Civil Contingencies Fund pending the submission of the necessary Supplementary Estimate.

Ministry Of Defence

Retired Civil Servants (Employment)

asked the Minister of Defence (1) if he will publish a list of the administrative, executive and technical officers of his Department with salaries of more than £2,000 per annum who on resigning or retiring over the past ten years have taken up posts with industrial firms, signifying which of these have done so within two years of leaving the Civil Service, in cases requiring the approval of his Department;(2) if he will publish a list of the administrative, executive and technical officers of his department with salaries of more than £2,000 per annum who on resigning or retiring over the past 10 years have taken up posts with industrial firms, stating the firms which they joined within two years of leaving the Civil Service, in cases requiring the approval of his Department.

The following table lists, by grades, the officers for whom applications to take up posts with industrial firms have been approved during the last ten years:—

YearGrade of Officer
19611 Permanent Secretary.
19611 Recruiting Adviser.
The firms concerned in these applications were as follows:—

  • International Computors and Tabulators Ltd.
  • John Lewis & Co. Ltd.

There is no requirement for officers to obtain approval to take up posts when they have been retired from Public Service for more than two years.

Education

Retired Civil Servants (Employment)

asked the Minister of Education (1) if he will publish a list of the administrative, executive and technical officers of his Department with salaries of more than £2,000 per annum who on resigining or retiring over the past ten years have taken up posts with industrial firms, signifying which of these have done so within two years of leaving the Civil Service, in cases requiring the approval of his Department;(2) if he will publish a list of the administrative, executive and technical officers of his Department with salaries of more than £2,000 per annum who on resigining or retiring over the past 10 years have taken up posts with industrial firms, stating the firms which they joined within two years of leaving the Civil Service, in cases requiring the approval of his Department.

The attention of senior officers is called before retirement or resignation to the rules about the acceptance of business appointments in order that the Minister may consider whether approval can be given. The Department's records are not complete for the past 10 years, but no case requiring the approval of the Department can be found of an officer with a salary of more than £2,000 per annum who within two years of resigining or retiring has taken up a post with an industrial firm.

National Finance

Post-War Credits

asked the Chancellor of the Exchequer if he will consider the repayment of post-war credits to registered disabled persons.

I have noted my hon. and gallant Friend's suggestion, but I am not satisfied that inclusion in the register of disabled persons of itself indicates a degree of disablement that would justify singling out the persons concerned for a priority payment of postwar credit.

Farm Buildings And Improvements (Allowances)

asked the Chancellor of the Exchequer if he will state the annual cost to the Exchequer of relief granted by capital expenditure claims for farm buildings or farm improvements for the last three convenient years.

The cost of investment and other allowances in respect of expenditure covered by Section 314 of the Income Tax Act 1952 was in 1959–60, 1960–61 and 1961–62 £3 million, £4 million and £4 million respectively.

Motor Cars (Purchase Tax)

asked the Chancellor of the Exchequer whether he is aware that when Purchase Tax on motor cars was reduced recently many dealers had in stock new cars on which, under the terms of their agreements with the manufacturers, they had to pay tax at the old higher rate; and whether he will authorise on this occasion a refund or waiver of the difference in tax.

In the motor trade "consignment" or "sale-or-return" agreements provide that the property in any motor vehicle sent out on these terms by the manufacturer passes to the buyer when the buyer adopt the transaction by buying or otherwise appropriating the vehicle; for example, by retaining it beyond an agreed time limit. Purchase tax is payable by the manufacturer at the rate in force at the date of adoption of the transaction. This rate may be higher or lower than that in force when the vehicle was first sent out, but there must a firm date for tax changes, and there is no legal provision for any surcharge or rebate on vehicles appropriated before the operative date of the change in taxation.This matter was exhaustively considered by the independent Hutton Committee (Committe on Tax-paid Stocks) who reported in 1953; their Report (Cmnd. 8784) was accepted by the Government. Their firm conclusion was that when rates of tax or duty are reduced compensation should not be paid at the expense of the Crown to traders holding tax-paid stocks, nor, in the converse case of tax increases, should additional tax be charged. My right hon. Friend cannot therefore consider a refund or waiver of tax on this occasion. I am sure, however, that any immediate losses which may be sustained will be more than offset by the continuing long-term benefits to the motor industry of the tax reduction.

Ministry Of Health

Retired Civil Servants (Employment)

asked the Minister of Health if he will publish a list of the administrative, executive and technical officers of his Department with salaries of more than £2,000 per annum who on resigning or retiring over the past ten years have taken up posts with industrial firms, signifying which of these have done so within two years of leaving the Civil Service, in cases requiring the approval of his Department.

Home Department

Retired Civil Servants (Employment)

asked the Secretary of State for the Home Department (1) if he will publish a list of the administrative, executive and technical officers of his Department with salaries of more than £2,000 per annum who on resigning or retiring over the past ten years have taken up posts with industrial firms, signifying which of these have done so within two years of leaving the Civil Service, in cases requiring the approval of his Department;(2) if he will publish a list of the administrative, executive and technical officers of his Department with salaries of more than £2,000 per annum who on resigning or retiring over the past ten years have taken up posts with industrial firms, stating the firms which they joined within two years of leaving the Civil Service, in cases requiring the approval of his Department.

During the last ten years applications from two officers to take up posts with industrial firms were approved. In 1958, the Chief Inspector of Explosives retired and joined Vickers Armstrong Ltd.; in 1961, a Deputy Under-Secretary of State retired and joined John Lewis Partnership Ltd.

Cruelty To Animals Act, 1876 (Committee Of Inquiry)

asked the Secretary of State for the Home Department whether he has yet received from the Chairman of his Advisory Committee on questions arising under the Cruelty to Animals Act, 1876, the report on the matters concerning the administration of the Act on which he was asked to give his advice.

The Chairman of the Advisory Committee, Lord Morris of Borth-y-Gest, has consulted the Advisory Committee and has reported their views to me. The suggestions which were referred to Lord Morris were those raised in the course of the Supply Day debate on 10th May last, namely that:

  • 1. There should be an inquiry into the administration of the Cruelty to Animals Act.
  • 2. The number of Inspectors under the Act should be increased.
  • 3. The possibility should be considered of reducing the number of places registered under the Act.
  • 4. Members of Parliament or experts in zoology should be allowed to visit registered places from time to time.
  • 5. A woman should be appointed to the Advisory Committee.
  • 6. The annual return of experiments should be enlarged to give information about the beneficial results of experiments.
  • The following is the reply which I have received from Lord Morris:"Dear Home Secretary,In July last Mr. Butler wrote to me and informed me in regard to certain suggestions which had been made during a debate in the House of Commons on the 10th May last concerning the question of experiments on animals. Having summarised the suggestions which had been made during the debate he said 'I do not know how far you will feel able to comment on these proposals, or to what extent you may feel that it would be worthwhile consulting the Committee as a whole on them.' I replied that I would be happy to consider whether I could offer any helpful comments on these proposals. I felt that it would be desirable that the Advisory Committee should be consulted. As a result the members of the Advisory Committee have been good enough to attend three meetings in order to give consideration to the matters raised. The observations that I submit in regard to the six suggestions summarised by Mr. Butler in his letter to me represent the general consensus of the opinions of the members of the Advisory Committee.1. The first suggestion concerned the question whether there should be some kind of inquiry into the administration of the Cruelty to Animals Act. 1876. The question is, I think, the most difficult question that has been raised. Recent debates in Parliament have shown that there is some measure of concern. It can, I think, be recognised that such concern arises from the genuine and natural desire of well-meaning and humane-minded people to ensure that defenceless animals should not be subjected to any unnecessary suffering. Whether there is public disquiet which is very wide-spread is a matter which it is very dfficult to assess. It would appear, however, that some of the concern that has been expressed arises from the fact that the annual returns to Parliament show what at first sight seem to be very high numbers of 'experiments'. Thus the return of August, 1961, shows a total of 3,701,187 experiments during 1960. The return of August, 1962, shows a total of 3,896,581 experiments during 1961. These numbers, of course, exceed very greatly the numbers in the early years after the passing of the Act of 1876. It may be difficult for many members of the public to have an adequate appreciation of the necessary extent of present day research, or to have full understanding of the nature of many of the 'experiments'. It may not be widely or fully appreciated that a very high proportion of these 'experiments' do not constitute vivisection in any real sense of the word. In many instances they are perhaps only technically to be regarded as covered by the word 'experiments'. The increase in the number of experiments has been inevitable in view of the great advances which have been made in recent years both in science and in medicine, and experiments are necessary in order to increase medical and scientific knowledge. Very many are also necessary in order to safeguard the public from the ill effects that might result if untested products were placed on the market. It should also be appreciated that certain tests are required under the Therapeutic Substances Act, 1956. The recent return of August, 1962, records that over a million experiments were performed in the course of preparing and testing substances intended for use in the treatment of disease in man or in animals, these including 1,113,874 experiments for standardisation of sera, vaccines, or drugs as required under the Therapeutic Substances Act, 1956. It is felt that there may he misunderstanding about these experiments because they are performed under the Cruelty to Animals Act, 1876, and under Certificates A. The Act was passed to control the performance of 'Experiments calculated to give pain'; and Certificate A was provided to deal with exceptional cases, in which, in the interests of science, it might then have been considered important and proper to exempt a licensee from the necessity of using such anaesthesia as was then available, in the performance of the kind of experiments then contemplated. The legislators of 86 years ago could certainly not have had in view the present need for large numbers of experiments involving no procedure more severe than hypodermic injections, but still requiring the exemption, provided by Certificate A for essentially different purposes. The view of members of the Committee is that the advances in science and in medicine since 1876 have been so rapid and so numerous that the increase in animal experimentation is not to be regarded as startling or excessive. In 1876 occasion had not arisen for the inevitably large use of tests which are now necessary in order to ensure the safety of modern remedies.The question as to whether there should or should not be some kind of inquiry is to some extent a question of policy. Is it thought that there is such a measure of disquiet as by reason of its very existence warrants the holding of an inquiry? Such members of the Advisory Committee as can draw upon personal knowledge and experience have no reason to think that the Act is not being administered properly and do not consider that there is either callousness or carelessness in the treatment of animals. The fact that the number of experiments is now very high does naturally prompt the inquiry whether too many people are conducting investigations or whether too many investigations are being conducted. As to this it must be recognised that different people or different bodies may be conducting research on parallel lines and this may be inevitable and, indeed, may be desirable as increasing the likelihood that answers may be found to certain medical problems that are still stubborn and baffling. The members of the Committee have no reason to suppose that experiments are being wantonly or lightly or unnecessarily undertaken. The Committee have had discussions with the Chief Inspector and they do not suppose that the Inspectors would be likely to be tolerant of any failures to comply with the requirements of the Act.It may, of course, be that the holding of an inquiry could be the means of allaying any public disquiet that there may be, but if an inquiry were to be held it would have to be thorough and it would inevitably be protracted. The fullest opportunity would have to be given for every anxiety to be expressed and examined and for every viewpoint to be ventilated, explored and considered. If there were to be an inquiry it would probably be most usefully conducted by persons with medical and veterinary and scientific knowledge. No one can, of course, express any definite view as to whether an inquiry would or would not bring to light any undesirable practices or as to whether any proposals as to improved or altered procedures or administration might be recommended. Short of holding an inquiry no one could be expected to give any assurance as to the present state of affairs and the most that the members of the Committee can say is that they are not themselves aware of failures to administer the Act properly and effectively.This is not to say that there are no improvements in the machinery of the Act that could be made. Having regard to the advances in medicine and science since 1876 it might or might not be that a modern Act would adopt a different structure in the classification of experiments from that contained in the 1876. The Act imposes requirements of obtaining the signatures on applications of the Presidents of various medical and scientific societies. These requirements may under modern conditions be very burdensome for those concerned. A modern Act might contain some different machinery. The existing Act does not make provision for the housing, maintenance and welfare of the animals, nor does it deal with any questions relating to the procuring of animals. These and similar matters are however we conceive not those which are now primarily raised. Furthermore, whether an inquiry is or is not held, other questions can be independently considered. One such question is that with which we next deal.2. Should the number of Inspectors under the Act be increased?Whether there is or is not any widespread public anxiety at the present time the Committee consider that it must be the public wish that there should be adequate and effective supervision to ensure that only necessary "experiments" take place and to ensure that they take place in compliance with the requirements of the Act. The size of the Inspectorate is such that doubt may well arise as to whether so few Inspectors can do all that is needed The Inspectors have many responsibilities in regard to the applications for licences and they cannot in the nature of things observe very many experiments. It may well be that the Inspectors' most valuable work is to ensure that only the right kind of people are doing only the right kind of work in the right kinds of places. The Committee understand from the Chief Inspector that he has not felt that the Inspectors have been unable to discharge their responsibilities. The Committee nevertheless feel that public confidence would be fortified if by an increase in the number of Inspectors still more frequent contacts between the Inspectors and licensees and still more visits to licensed premises could be provided. The Committee consider that these contacts and visits provide the best means of ensuring a constant measure of conscientious concern on the part of all persons who are in any way involved. It is further to be observed that the Act requires "all registered places to be from time to time visited by inspectors". There are some 529 registered places. It is understood that it has already been decided to appoint an additional inspector and that it is hoped to appoint someone who has both medical and veterinary qualifications. This is all to the good but the Committee feel that further additional appointments could with advantage be made and that those with either medical or veterinary qualifications should be eligible for appointment. Frequent visits by Inspectors with the consequent opportunities to consult them, would probably be welcomed by those working in the various laboratories and research departments. The perfectly legitimate wishes of all animal-lovers and other well-intentioned people would furthermore be met. The fact that the demand for licences is more likely to increase than to diminish and the fact that there are so many laboratories and research departments, form further reasons why it is desirable to have adequate numbers of Inspectors.3. The general opinion of members of the Committee is that it would be undesirable to contemplate reducing the number of registered places. Such a reduction might inevitably impede the progress of scientific and medical research.4. In regard to visits by Members of Parliament or experts in zoology, there are one or two considerations to be had in mind. Some who have genuine anxiety in regard to experiments on animals often feel that there is a shroud of secrecy covering the whole subject. If there is such an impression it may lead to the view that there is something wrong. It would seem highly desirable, therefore, that every reasonable facility should be given to enable visits to be made by persons who are competent to form judgment and who would be prepared to make visits without having formed any settled or predetermined views. If fair-minded people who are competent to form opinions are given facilities to visit registered places it would be highly satisfactory. If as a result they found that there was something wrong, then the sooner attention was given to such a state of affairs the better. It must be remembered, however, that registered places are private property and that those who are engaged upon experimental work are entitled to do their work in reasonable privacy and without undue disturbance. If, however, any arrangements can conveniently be made which might remove the suspicions of genuine seekers after truth that would be a good thing.

    5. The Committee know of no reason at all why a woman should not be appointed to the Advisory Committee provided she possesses the qualifications which are considered to be the helpful ones. The mere fact that this point has been raised suggests there may be some misconception both in Parliament and in the minds of the public as to the work of the Advisory Committee. Many may think that it is a body that frequently meets, whereas being advisory it only meets when its advice is sought and, as a general rule, that is only when there is some specific application for a licence to consider which appears to the Inspectors to raise some new question of principle. Thus apart from meeting to discuss the matters now being considered the Committee has only been summoned twice in about the last four years.

    6. It would not appear to be practicable to make any annual assessment of the year's achievements resulting from experiments carried out in the particular year. Any significant information of this kind might be contained in the annual report of the Medical Research Council. It is usually impossible to assess the beneficial results of experiments even some years after their completion. At the same time it may well be that further annual returns could be drafted in such a way as to be not merely statistical, but so as to give rather more indication as to the nature of the experiments that have taken place.

    Yours sincerely,

    MORRIS OF BORTH-Y-GEST."

    Having given careful consideration to the whole position, and in the light of Lord Morris's letter, I have decided to appoint a Departmental Committee to inquire into the working of the Cruelty to Animals Act, 1876. I hope shortly to announce the composition of this Committee and its terms of reference. I have also decided to accept the views of the Advisory Committee on the other matters referred to them. The strength of the Inspectorate under the Act will be increased from six to eight as soon as suitable candidates can be found, and persons with medical or veterinary qualifications will be eligible for appointment to these new posts, and to any vacancies which may occur in the future.

    Ministry Of Power

    Retired Civil Servants (Employment)

    asked the Minister of Power, (1) if he will publish a list of the administrative, executive and technical officers of his Department with salaries of more than £2,000 per annum who on resigning or retiring over the past ten years have taken up posts with industrial firms, signifying which of these have done so within two years of leaving the Civil Service, in cases requiring the approval of his Department;(2) if he will publish a list of the administrative, executive and technical officers of his Department with salaries of more than £2,000 per annum who on resigning or retiring over the past ten years have taken up posts with industrial firms, stating the firms which they joined within two years of leaving the Civil Service, in cases requiring the approval of his Department.

    In the last ten years approval has been given for officers in my Department in the following grades to accept appointments with industrial firms after retirement:

    YearRank of Officer
    1953Deputy Chief Inspector of Mines.
    1954Chief Scientist.
    Under Secretary.
    1955Deputy Secretary.
    1959Chief Scientist.
    The firms concerned in these apointments were as follows:

    • Dowty Mining Equipment Company Limited.
    • Harris Lebus Limited.
    • The Metal Box Company Limited.
    • National Carbonising Company Limited.
    • The Shell Group.

    Ottawa Agreements

    asked the Lord Privy Seal whether he will approach other Commonwealth Governments with a view to re-negotiating and bringing up to date the 1932 Ottawa Agreements.

    I have been asked to reply.Almost all the 1932 Ottawa Agreements with other Commonwealth countries have been re-negotiated at various times. It would be premature to seek to re-negotiate the existing agreements before the outcome of the Brussels negotiations is known.

    British Army

    Retired Civil Servants (Employment)

    asked the Secretary of State for War (1) if he will published a list of the administrative, executive and technical officers of his Department with salaries of more than £2,000 per annum who on resigning or retiring over the past ten years have taken up posts with industrial firms, signifying which of these have done so within two years of leaving the Civil Service, in cases requiring the approval of his Department;(2) if he will publish a list of the administrative, executive and technical officers of his Department with salaries of more than £2,000 per annum who on resigning or retiring over the past ten years have taken up posts with industrial firms, stating the firms which they joined within two years of leaving the Civil Service, in cases requiring the approval of his Department.

    During the last ten years one Permanent Under-Secretary of State and one Deputy Under-Secretary of State had their applications approved to take up posts with industrial firms within two years of retirement from the Civil Service.The firms concerned in these applications were:

    • Messrs. Goodyear Tyres (Great Britain) Ltd.
    • Messrs. Stothert and Pitt Ltd.
    • Pulsometer Engineering Co. Ltd.
    • Ether Langham Thompson Ltd.

    Employment

    Stoke-On-Trent

    asked the Minister of Labour if he will set out in tabular form the numbers unemployed, with percentages, for the years 1961, 1962 and on the latest date, for the whole country, for the city of Stoke-on-Trent, and for the North Staffordshire area, respectively; and if he will give the figures for the same areas for men and women under 18 years of age.

    The following table gives the information required:

    NUMBERS OF PERSONS REGISTERED AS UNEMPLOYED IN STOKE-ON-TRENT, NORTH STAFFORDSHIRE AND GREAT BRITAIN AT THE UNDERMENTIONED DATES
    Stoke-on-TrentNorth Staffordshire (excl. Stoke-on-Trent)Great Britain
    Total unemployedPercentage rateBoys under 18 included in TotalGirls under 18 included in TotalTotal unemployedPercentage rateBoys under 18 included in TotalGirls under 18 included in TotalTotal unemployedPercentage rateBoys under 18 included in TotalGirls under 18 included in Total
    16th January, 19612,1001·474331,1681·85429418,8991·914,35710,741
    13th February, 19611,9771·332271,0441·6187389,6801·710,6198,139
    13th March, 19611,9361·323229891·5152350,8381·67,9696,553
    10th April, 19611,9761·366421,0721·67855340,0611·512,6238,692
    15th May, 19611,8801·231188801·373299,2761·37,0645,301
    12th June, 19611,7711·220218501·356265,912125,6654,009
    10th July, 19611,7921·216138541·31916258,5501·17,9975,431
    14th August, 19611,8771·294941,5592·3415356305,2431·426,41417,715
    11th September, 19611,9681·388721,1101·7110122317,0331·417,22211,385
    16th October, 19611,9801·333279381·41818365,7451·610,9468,158
    13th November, 19611,9161·323139761·51013387,3541·710,1547,620
    11th December, 19612,0351·324149421·495389,4091·79,3546,811
    15th January, 19622,3361·589601,3012·07352461,0362·021,08713,892
    12th February, 19622,2571·540471,1051·7527453,7972·015,94011,906
    12th March, 19622,1641·439261,1101·71215441,8012·013,31810,176
    9th April, 19622,1841·433301,0311·51710438,7622·012,7479,507
    14th May, 19622,1591·467461,0551·63728423,8001·917,27811,729
    18th June, 19622,1081·446411,0091·52518397,1831·813,2908,680
    16th July, 19622,1821·452341,0351·63720400,4181·816,40111,389
    13th August, 19622,3891·61601501,9252·9518396464,3762·144,76132,006
    10th September, 19622,5561·71641551,5042·3198142465,1382·134,90324,453
    15th October, 19622,7061·8971031,3692·17357501,3782·223,01817,313
    12th November, 19622,7901·875671,4722·23932544,6672·421,13415,431
    Notes:
    1. The figures for Stoke-on-Trent include Stoke-on-Trent, Burslem, Hanley and Longton Employment Exchanges and the Stoke-on-Trent Youth Employment Office.
    2. The figures for North Staffordshire include Biddulph, Cheadle, Kidsgrove, Leek, Newcastle under Lyme and Stone Employment Exchanges and Youth Employment Offices.

    Wages (Payment By Cheque)

    asked the Minister of Labour whether he will now name the day authorising the payment of wages by cheque.

    Yes. After consultation with interested organisations, I now propose to appoint 1st March, 1963, as the day from which the payment of wages by cheque will be authorised under the Payment of Wages Act, 1960.

    Scotland

    Road Programme (Expenditure)

    asked the Secretary of State for Scotland what is the estimated expenditure on the road programme for the five years ending 1967–68.

    Approximately £80 million for Scotland, of which the Exchequer will contribute about £71 million.

    Post Office

    Retired Civil Servants (Employment)

    asked the Postmaster-General, (1) if he will publish a list of the administrative, executive and technical officers of his Department with salaries of more than £2,000 per annum who on resigning or retiring over the past ten years have taken up posts with industrial firms, signifying which of these have done so within two years of leaving the Civil Service, in cases requiring the approval of his Department;(2) if he will publish a list of the administrative, executive and technical officers of his Department with salaries of more than £2,000 per annum who on resigning or retiring over the past 10 years have taken up posts with industrial firms, stating the firms which they joined within two years of leaving the Civil Service, in cases requiring the approval of his Department.

    The following table lists the number of officers by grades for whom applications to take up posts with industrial firms have been approved within the last 10 years:

    YearGrade of office
    19551 Assistant Engineer-in-Chief.
    19571 Deputy Director General.

    19601 Director General.
    19621 Regional Director.

    The firms and undertakings concerned in these applications were (in alphabetical order) as follows:

    • Aberdare Electric Co. Ltd.
    • English Electric Co. Ltd.
    • Ericsson Telephones Ltd.
    • Fisher and Ludlow Ltd.

    There is no record whether the appointments for which approval was given were in all cases actually made, and there is no requirement for officers to obtain approval to take up posts when they have been retired from the public service for more than two years.

    Office Facilities, South Knowsley

    asked the Postmaster-General if, in view of the large number of retirement pensioners living in the area, he will now agree to sanction a sub-post office in the Hillside Avenue area of South Knowsley, as recommended by the Knowsley Parish Council and the Whiston Rural District Council.

    My right hon. Friend is looking into this matter and will write to the right hon. Member as soon as possible.

    Trade And Commerce

    Retired Civil Servants (Employment)

    asked the President of the Board of Trade (1) if he will publish a list of the administrative, executive and technical officers of his Department with salaries of more than £2,000 per annum who on resigning or retiring over the past ten years have taken up posts with industrial firms, signifying which of these have done so within two years of leaving the Civil Service, in cases requiring the approval of his Department;(2) if he will publish a list of the administrative, executive and technical officers of his Department with salaries of more than £2,000 per annum who on resigning or retiring over the past 10 years have taken up posts with industrial firms, stating the firms which they joined within two years of leaving the Civil Service, in cases requiring the approval of his Department.

    Portsmouth

    asked the President of the Board of Trade what assistance he is giving to find a suitable firm to take over the De Havilland factory site at Portsmouth.

    This is a privately owned factory and its disposal is a commercial matter.

    asked the President of the Board of Trade if he aware of the increased unemployment in Portsmouth; and what steps he proposes to take to reduce it.

    I realise that unemployment in Portsmouth, as in the country generally, has risen recently. But there are prospects of substantial additional employment in the Portsmouth area over the next few years, and I do not consider that in the circumstances any special steps to introduce further new developments are necessary.

    Industrial Development Certificates

    asked the President of the Board of Trade whether industrial development certificates are required, in areas not designated development districts, for advance factories built for unspecified purposes.

    Yes, if the industrial floor space amounts to more than 5,000 square feet.

    Shipping

    Nuclear Propulsion

    asked the Minister of Transport when he expects to have the first commercial nuclear ship at sea.

    I cannot say when the first commercial nuclear ship will be at sea. It depends, among other things, on progress with research.

    Local Government

    Retired Civil Servants (Employment)

    asked the Minister of Housing and Local Government and Minister for Welsh Affairs (1) if he will publish a list of the administrative, executive and technical officers of his Department with salaries of more than £2,000 per annum who on resigning or retiring over the past ten years have taken up posts with industrial firms, signifying which of these have done so within two years of leaving the Civil Service, in cases requiring the approval of his Department;(2) if he will publish a list of the administrative, executive and technical officers of his Department with salaries of more than £2,000 per annum who on resigning or retiring over the past ten years have taken up posts with industrial firms, stating the firms which they joined within two years of leaving the Civil Service, in cases requiring the approval of his Department.

    There is in my Department no record of any instance of the kind to which the hon. Member refers. The rules concerning outside employment are brought to the attention of senior officers who are about to resign or retire, but their obligation to seek permission does not go beyond the first two years after leaving.

    Radioactive Substances Act, 1960

    asked the Minister of Housing and Local Government and Minister for Welsh Affairs what progress he has made towards bringing the Radioactive Substances Act, 1960, into operation.

    An Order in Council has been made, bringing the Radioactive Substances Act, 1960, into operation on 1st December, 1963. I expect to lay before Parliament next week a number of orders exempting from control under the Act certain minor uses of radioactive materials. A memorandum for the guidance of users of radioactive materials will be published early in the New Year; it will explain how to submit applications for registration under the Act and for authorisation to the disposal of radioactive waste.

    Public Works And Buildings

    Retired Civil Servants (Employment)

    asked the Minister of Public Building and Works (1) if he will publish a list of the administrative, executive and technical officers of his Department with salaries of more than £2,000 per annum who on resigning or retiring over the past ten years have taken up posts with industrial firms, signifying which of these have done so within two years of leaving the Civil Service, in cases requiring the approval of his Department;(2) if he will publish a list of the administrative, executive and technical officers of his Department with salaries of more than £2,000 per annum who on resigning or retiring over the past ten years have taken up posts with industrial firms, stating the firms which they joined within two years of leaving the Civil Service, in cases requiring the approval of his Department

    One Deputy Secretary who retired in 1959 was given permission to take up a part-time post with Messrs. John Mowlem and Company.