asked the Minister of Housing and Local Government and Minister for Welsh Affairs how many people are on council housing waiting lists in county boroughs, boroughs, and urban districts, respectively, in the north-west of England.

I do not have this information, and it would serve no useful purpose to collect and aggregate the totals of the individual lists, since these are compiled by the local authorities on bases which differ with particular local circumstances and requirements.

Is it not most astounding that after all the time that has elapsed since the publication of this Question or the Order Paper the Minister has found fit to tell the House that he has not got this information? Is not this a shocking indictment of the Minister and of the failure of his duty to the House of Commons? There are hundreds of thousands of people living in diremisery—[HON. MEMBERS: "Speech."]—I am asking the Minister for these figures. I am appealing to the Minister to get this information now and I ask him to provide some incentives to local authorities to build more houses and to make money available through Government services at cheap interest rates so that houses can be built for the people instead of propaganda.

The need is acknowledged; the pace of housing building is accelerating, but I am asked to find waiting list details for 150 housing authorities none of which is comparable on the bases they use, and I think that it would be a waste of time of my Department and of the local authorities concerned.

asked the Minister of Housing and Local Government and Minister for Welsh Affairs why he has not collected statistics of the numbers of back-to-back and back-to-earth houses, houses sharing outdoor lavatories and twilight houses in the Colne Valley Constituency; and, in view of the desirability of obtaining such information in order to assess the housing needs of the area, if he will take steps to discover these figures.

Local authorities have a statutory duty to assess the housing needs of their district and it is their responsibility to collect the information they require for this purpose.

Is the Parliamentary Secretary aware that the inherited nineteenth century industrialism weighs very heavily on areas like the Colne Valley constituency and that in referring to such areas I have in mind all the old industrial districts of Britain where there is a real need? Is he aware that the need does not always correspond to the expressed demand? Will not he agree that the Department must conduct factual investigations of this kind in order to establish real need?

With respect to the hon. Member, I do not agree with him. The important thing, surely, is to have the assessment of the total number of houses requiring to be replaced because they are unfit. The reason why particular houses are unfit is, in my submission, of very much less importance.

asked the Minister of Housing and Local Government and Minister for Welsh Affairs how many houses he estimates are now occupied by Commonwealth immigrants; what percentage is slum property; how many have been rehoused in new council houses; and if he will make a statement.

I regret that I do not have the information.

May I ask two questions? In view of the fact that in recent weeks there have been three disastrous fires in overcrowded tenement dwellings where Commonwealth immigrants have lost their lives, will my right hon. Friend look at the possibility of having outside fire escapes provided in such tenements? Secondly, in view of the enormous problems which are being created, would he not consider it advisable to prohibit all such immigration to this country for the next five years until these problems are settled?

These problems of overcrowding are a by-product of a housing shortage which we are overtaking as quickly as we can. As for the fire risks, both the 1961 Housing Act and the present Housing Bill which is being discussed give power, which I hope will be used, to local authorities to require fire escapes to be provided in multi-occupied property.

It is not so much a question of giving local authorities power to provide these things. Will my right hon. Friend see that local authorities have to provide them in view of the risk which arises from fire in these very overcrowded tenement dwellings?

I have no evidence that local authorities with a lot of multi-occupied property are not using, or trying to use, their powers as much as they can. If my hon. Friend, or any hon. Member, has evidence that a local authority is not using its powers, I shall be glad to receive information about it.

asked the Minister of Housing and Local Government and Minister for Welsh Affairs if he will take steps to extend the statutory period of a notice to quit to tenants from one month to three months.

No, Sir. I have no doubt that the Committee under Sir Milner Holland will be considering the effect in London of the present arrangements. It would be wise to await the Report before deciding whether any changes should be made.

Does the Minister realise that four weeks is much too short a time for tenants to contact local authorities, estate agents, advice bureaux and other possible sources of help, particularly when they have to do so outside their working hours? Since the Milner Holland Committee is concerned only with London and this is a national problem, will the right hon. Gentleman look at it again and consider at least giving local authorities power to suspend notices to quit for a few weeks in cases where they themselves are trying to help dispossessed tenants?

If the tenant does not go at the end of four weeks' notice, normally the landlord seeks a court order. That provides a further period of grace. I have to balance the advantage to the tenant of which the hon. Lady has spoken with the possible danger that landlords, burdened with further restrictions, may be unwilling to let and might sell. That would be a net disadvantage to tenants and potential tenants. We have to bear that in mind. The Milner Holland Report, although limited to London, will perhaps have lessons for the whole country.

Where the landlord does not seek a court order but seeks—as he can—to get the tenant out, the period of grace does not apply. Is not this an argument for supporting the Bill introduced by my hon. Friend the Member for Paddington, North (Mr. Parkin) to forbid evictions except by court order?

I have advised hon. Members that this is part of a very big question and that we should await the Milner Holland Committee's Report.

asked the Minister of Housing and Local Government and Minister for Welsh Affairs why information about average weekly interest charges on council dwellings in Great Britain and in Salford for 1951 and 1963 is not available to him, in view of the fact that he possesses the corresponding information for Slough.

My only regular source of information is the epitomes of accounts submitted by local authorities. These show the total interest charges borne on housing, account, but not the cost of new borrowing in any year.

If the Minister could go to this trouble in the case of Slough, why can he not do it in the case of Salford? I hate to suggest this, but surely he was not trying to avoid disclosing damaging information showing, as in the case of Slough, that the interest charged for an average three-bedroomed house has gone up from £1 a week to £2 10s. a week in this period? If I have understood the right hon. Gentleman, I think he is above that kind of thing.

The hon. Gentleman appears to be a bit of a pace setter. A large number of his hon. Friends have been putting down Questions of his sort. I suggest that if they are interested in detailed information which is not available to me, they should ask their own local authorities for it. I will publish all the information I have of the sort that is available in published accounts.

If I table for other boroughs questions similiar to that which I tabled for Slough, and to which I got an answer, will the right hon. Gentleman provide the answer for those other boroughs as well?

I am anxious to extend to all hon. Gentlemen the courtesy that I show to any, but the point is that what I did in one case would be a waste of administrative resources—[HON. MEMBERS: "No."]—if I did it for all local authorities.

Surely there is no great trouble caused to the Minister in asking for this information? If any trouble is caused, it must be to the local authority in answering. Has the Minister received any complaint from Slough about its being put to unnecessary trouble? If there are to be complaints that this is too much bother, surely the local authorities rather than the Minister would be entitled to make them?

It is my job to defend the officials both of the Ministry and of Local Government. [HON. MEMBERS: "Oh."] What I am asked for by a number of hon. Members is detailed figures for each year from 1951 for each authority. 'This would involve a very great deal of administrative work.

asked the Minister of Housing and Local Government and Minister for Welsh Affairs if he will introduce legislation to protect house owners from the failure of builders to carry out adequately the instructions and decisions of planning authorities.

:No, Sir.

Is the right hon. Gentleman aware from information that we have given him in regard to a local case that there is not only local concern but national concern about this matter? Does he not consider that it is entirely wrong that where a builder fails to carry out the decisions of the planning authority, the occupiers of the houses should have to meet the cost involved?

There are two points here. First, the planning authority can lay down as a condition of planning permission any requirements that it wishes, and it can enforce those requirements. Secondly, the purchaser must satisfy himself that what the builder purports to sell to him he is, in fact, buying.

Is my right hon. Friend aware that many purchasers of houses are far from satisfied that their builders are carrying out the instructions of the local authorities? Will he look at this matter seriously again with a view to protecting young persons when buying their first house?

I wonder whether my hon. Friend is on the same point. The Question was about the decision of planning authorities. If it was a question of byelaws or standards, that is a different matter. The House will be aware that the housebuilders themselves, with co-operation from my Department, are looking into the whole question of raising standards of housebuilding.

asked the Minister of Housing and Local Government and Minister for Welsh Affairs what was the annual cost of interest charge repayments on housing loans in 1951 and 1963 in Blyth, Seaton Valley and Bedlingtonshire.

As the Answer involves a table of figures, I will with permission circulate it in the OFFICIAL REPORT.

I am grateful to the right hon. Gentleman for undertaking to provide these figures, and after examining them, we shall be able to make comments. However, may I ask whether he is also aware that the financial part of housing is the one most crippling to local authorities and that their ability to go ahead with housing plans is restricted by the nature of the interest charges that they have to pay? Will the right hon. Gentleman undertake to look into the matter much more closely than appears to have been the case in recent years?

A review of housing subsidies so that local authorities can plan ahead with confidence is going on at this moment.

asked the Minister of Housing and Local Government and Minister for Welsh Affairs if he is aware that the average loan charges for a three-bedroom dwelling in East Ham were £1 9s. 0d. per week in 1951 and £4 0s. 0d. per week in 1963; and what steps he proposes to take to relieve local authorities and their tenants of such interest burdens.

Without knowing the basis on which the figures were calculated, I cannot comment on them. The Government have said that, on the assumption that proper rents are charged, subject to rebates for those who need them, they will see that local authorities receive whatever subsidies they need to carry through their housing responsibilities. The current review of housing subsidies will take account of the financial outturn for the whole housing stock provided over the years, of which loan charges on new houses is but one element; the financial needs of local authorities in the light of an accelerating programme; and the capacity of tenants to pay rent.

Is the Minister aware that East Ham is a progressive housing authority which does what it can to protect its tenants? Yet, as a result of the increased interest charges, it has been necessary for East Ham to double its rents in a decade. In view of the right hon. Gentleman's party's borrowing of many Labour Party ideas on social matters in this General Election year, will not the Conservative Party borrow just one more and go in for special interest rates for housing?

I am also aware that the average net rent for three-bedroomed post-war houses in East Ham is now 35s. 2d., that East Ham operates a very small rent rebate scheme indeed, and that East Ham receives nearly £200,000 subsidy from the taxpayers and £50,000 from the ratepayers, and with all this East Ham should certainly be able to keep the rent reasonable if it has a proper rent rebate scheme.

Is it not remarkable how much detailed information the Minister can get from a local authority when it suits him to do so?

If the hon. Gentleman had asked me for the same information for every housing authority in Great Britain, I should have resisted him on the same grounds as I resisted his hon. Friend the Member for Salford, East (Mr. Frank Allaun).

asked the Minister of Housing and Local Government and Minister for Welsh Affairs in view of the details which have been supplied to him by the hon. Member for Lambeth, Brixton, regarding the owner of 30, Groveway, London, S.W.9, who has publicly stated that he is exploiting racial tension to dispossess controlled tenants, what discussions he has had with the Lambeth Borough Council regarding a compulsory purchase order for this property.

None, Sir. I understand that the Council is to be recommended at its next meeting to make a compulsory purchase order on the property, and in these circumstances it would not be proper for me to discuss the matter with the Council.

Does not the right hon. Gentleman think it is quite wicked that a white landlord should seek the liberty to foment racial ill-will for the purpose of dispossessing white controlled tenants by introducing coloured tenants into his property? [HON. MEMBERS: "Race distinction."] I am responsible for the accuracy of the statement I am making. In those circumstances, will the right hon. Gentleman give an undertaking that he will not take his usual eight months to make up his mind about whether he should confirm the compulsory purchase order in this case?

We have pledged ourselves to keep rent control until the end of this Parliament and have further pledged ourselves that in the next Parliament we shall not extend block decontrol but shall continue the policy of creeping decontrol. Nevertheless, there are certainly large numbers of good landlords who are penalised in the public interest by this policy—

What about this one?

I am not for a moment defending those landlords who seek to foment, by racial or any other trouble, unhappiness among existing controlled tenants, but the letting of a flat to a person of a non-English race is not in itself any evidence of such a policy.

asked the Minister of Housing and Local Government and Minister for Welsh Affairs whether he will amend the model standards affecting permanent residential caravan sites issued in accordance with Section 5(6) of the Caravan Sites and Control of Development Act, 1960, to include a prescribed form of rent book which will also record the tenancy conditions between the site operator and the caravan dweller, stipulate a minimum period of notice of one month for a caravan to quit a licensed site, and make provision for six- monthly inspections of such sites by the local medical officer of health and fire prevention officer or their staffs.

I do not think matters of this kind can appropriately be included in the model standards.

Is not the Minister aware that these permanent caravan sites scattered over the countryside account for many thousands of families and that there is a general feeling that it is not good enough to discard this question on this kind of basis? There is no special mechanism other than private prosecutions for enforcing licences and, even so, the licences are often not sufficient in many major regards.

As far as licences go, the local authority, of course, has not only power to lay down the conditions but to enforce them. However, I am not going to pretend to my hon. Friend that I think that the regulations are entirely perfect. If he would like to talk to me about any particular case, I shall be delighted to do so.

Is the hon. Gentleman aware that there is a good deal of complaint from caravan dwellers about the unsatisfactory behaviour of licence holders and that this part of the legislation needs looking at? Will he and the Minister also do something to encourage local authorities to develop sites of their own in cases where caravan dwellers do not get a fair deal from a private site owner?

I agree that in many cases the answer lies in sufficient sites, and, if necessary, sites provided by local authorities. We put no obstacle in the way of the latter; in fact, we encourage it.

asked the Minister of Housing and Local Government and Minister for Welsh Affairs if he is aware of the increasing number of car owners who dump their unwanted worn-out cars on waste ground in cities, so creating an eyesore and a danger to children, and that these have to be removed at public expense; and if he will now introduce legislation to make it an obligation on all car owners to dispose of their unwanted vehicles through a municipal depôt established for this purpose.

I am aware that many cars are so dumped. I do not think the hon. Member's suggestion is practicable but local authorities can cer- tainly help with this problem and my right hon. Friend hopes to offer them some advice on it in the near future.

Is the Parliamentary Secretary aware that in almost every town I visit I see these ugly, unsightly and offensive heaps of scrap caused by people who have discarded their cars? Is he aware that I am not blaming the car owners—[HON. MEMBERS: "Why not?"]—because they have no place to put their cars. Is he aware that if the local authorities would establish depôts, even though a charge were made to car owners, this, in my opinion, would be a great saving to the ratepayers? Will he ask local authorities to adopt the principle of establishing local depôts?

As I said, I have no doubt that the local authorities have a part to play. I ask the hon. Gentleman and the House to await a circular which will be based on detailed discussions with the local authority associations and the scrap metal merchants' association to find the best answer to this problem.

Is the Parliamentary Secretary aware that during the past six months I have seen a Volkswagon standing in a side street with a notice on the windscreen, "Licence applied for"? Is he aware that the notice has now gone and that the vehicle is causing a nuisance and obstructing the traffic? Will he do something about this problem?

When the hon. Gentleman sends out a circular, will he also ask local authorities whether they can do anything to help with the collection of old mattresses, bicycles and prams which, if they are dumped, cause quite a considerable nuisance in many parts of the country?

That is a different question. It is a matter which is very much under consideration, but I cannot guarantee that it will be dealt with in the same circular.

asked the Minister of Housing and Local Government and Minister for Welsh Affairs why he allowed the Central Electricity Generating Board and the Southern Electricity Board's appeal to pull down their existinig building in Pope's Lane, Ealing, and six houses in order to construct a new storage depôt; and if he will reconsider his decision.

As explained in the decision letter of 24th January, a copy of which was sent to my hon. Friend, my right hon. Friend allowed this application in the interests of maintaining an essential public service. My right hon. Friend's decision, which accorded with the views of the local planning authority and of the inspector who took the inquiry, is final and he has no power to reconsider it.

Does not my hon. Friend think that psychologically it is not a good thing to pull down six perfectly good houses to make way for a storage depôt and car park, particularly when there is a housing shortage? Is he aware that this is a good residential area and that my constituents who live on the other side of the road will suffer a considerable loss of amenity value as a result of this decision?

My hon. Friend is right to the extent that we should never come to a decision of this sort, which involves the demolition of houses, in present circumstances unless we had checked and counter-checked the availability and suitability of other sites for this essential service.

asked the Minister of Housing and Local Government and Minister for Welsh Affairs why he allowed the establishment of a licensed club at the Strand Shipyard, Grove Park Road, Chiswick, despite the objections of the local authority and the majority of local residents; and if he will reconsider the matter.

My right hon. Friend's reasons were given in the decision letter, a copy of which has been sent to my hon. Friend. My right hon. Friend accepted his inspector's conclusion that this was an appropriate use in these premises but he has limited the permission to three years, so that the practical effect on the surroundings can be assessed. Having given his decision, my right hon. Friend has no power to reopen the case.

Is my hon. Friend aware that the majority of the people who use this drinking club are not residents of the area? In view of the valid objections raised by the local council and about 200 local residents, does not he think that their views ought to have been given greater consideration than was the case? Is he aware that there is a tremendous parking problem here and that this, above everything else, ought to be taken into consideration?

As my hon. Friend will be aware—I am sure that he has read the inspector's report—the inspector who saw the site and heard the evidence came to the conclusion that parking problems generally were likely to have a very slight effect on the amenities. He had also to take into account the views of the very many people who were in support of this scheme.

In view of the unsatisfactory nature of the Answer, I beg to give notice that I shall endeavour to raise the matter on the Adjournment at the earliest possible opportunity.

asked the Minister of Housing and Local Government and Minister for Welsh Affairs whether, in view of the greatly increased population in the south and south-east of the United Kingdom, he will reconsider the traditional practice of discharging sewage effluent into the sea.

The discharge of untreated sewage to the sea is normally a satisfactory method of disposal if the sewers are properly designed and the outfall can be suitably sited. There is no reason why this method should not meet the needs of increased population in many coastal areas. Where local conditions make some form of treatment desirable, my right hon. Friend always considers applications for loan sanction sympathetically.

I thank my hon. Friend for that very comprehensive Answer. Is he aware that under certain circumstances the result of this practice has been nauseating in the extreme in some of our shallow coastal waters? With the prospect of a large increase in the population in the South, does not he think that this is a matter which ought to be reconsidered in the light of possible developments?

With due respect to my hon. Friend, I do not think that population has a direct bearing on the problem. I admit that local conditions vary, and where there are grounds for feeling that some treatment is necessary our technical officers are always available to give advice. We have a Committee of the D.S.I.R. studying the best possible design of outfalls and to assess the problem generally.

Does not the hon. Gentleman believe that no local authority should deposit untreated sewage in the sea anywhere, and does not he agree that very often it is not the authority concerned which feels the effect, but some authority further along the coast? Should not it be the job of the Ministry of Housing and Local Government to see that every local authority treats its sewage in some way before disposing of it into rivers or into the sea?

I do not agree that it is the job of the Ministry to force local authorities to spend money when there is no evidence that this is an unsatisfactory arrangement. I have explained that where there is evidence that it is unsatisfactory, help, both financial and technical, is available.

Is my hon. Friend aware that this is a national problem? May I ask what action his Department has taken as a result of the recent report of the Committee on storm water overflow?

As I have already explained to the House the matter is under consideration by the Water Pollution Research Board of D.S.I.R. and we have had an expert report relatively recently from the Medical Research Council.

asked the Minister of Housing and Local Government and Minister for Welsh Affairs when he expects to receive the seventh report of the Standing Technical Committee on synthetic detergents.

By the end of July.

Is the Parliamentary Secretary aware that this Committee has been sitting since 1st May, 1953, a matter of 11 years, and that it has not yet found a long-term or a short-term solution to the problem? Is he aware that in Castleford, a town in my constituency, where the river runs right through the middle of the town, the position is deteriorating rapidly, and that not only the inhabitants are complaining but the members of the National Farmers' Union have said that this is affecting the feed of cattle on the grasslands? In view of the fact that the volume of synthetic detergent has increased by over 300 per cent. during this period, will the Minister see that something is done similar to what has been done in West Germany, and introduce legislation to compel manufacturers to use a soft-based material in the perfecting of these detergents so as to eliminate this problem of foam in the rivers which is causing such wide concern, particularly in my constituency?

I think that that supplementary question has gone a long way from the date of the report of the Committee. The hon. Member is wrong in saying that the Committee has been established since 1953, for it was established in 1957. A very considerable amount of progress has been made. The introduction of soft-based detergents has reduced the trouble by about 50 per cent. Further experiments are going on. There are signs that even softer bases can be produced. The response of the manufacturing industry has been such that something like 70 per cent. of the total supply is now on the soft-based detergents.

asked the Minister of Housing and Local Government and Minister for Welsh Affairs how much land lying within the urban district of Shildon and excluded from the growth zone it is proposed to include in the current plan for extending Newton Aycliffe, which is within the growth zone.

Approximately 700 acres of the Urban District of Shildon all outside the growth zone is included in the area on which I have invited the comments of the local authorities concerned.

Will the Minister use his influence to ensure that a fair balance is kept between the legitimate aspirations of Newton Aycliffe and Shildon? Does he appreciate that if this acreage is taken it is possible that it will cripple the industrial and social development of Shildon? Will he see that this does not happen?

These questions are primarily for my right hon. Friend the Secretary of State for Industry, Trade and Regional Development and President of the Board of Trade. My job is to consult the local authorities about the proposal to extend Newton Aycliffe.

asked the Minister of Housing, and Local Government and Minister for Welsh Affairs why the village of Middridge, for which the urban district of Shildon had development plans, is now scheduled for inclusion in the expanded town of Newton Aycliffe.

Middridge is within the area on which I have invited the comments of the local authorities. It was included because any expansion of the new town would have to be in that direction and, if expansion goes ahead, it seemed right that the planning of the village should be considered in relation to the new town development.

Why does the expansion of Newton Aycliffe have to go in that direction when there are plenty of other areas in which the town could expand without spoiling the development of Shildon? Has the Minister that in mind, because it is very important for the town of Shildon?

It is in order to consider these things that I am at present in consultation with the local authorities.

asked the Minister of Housing and Local Government and Minister for Welsh Affairs what special studies his Department has undertaken on the water resources available to meet the commitments envisaged in paragraph 14 of Command Paper No. 2308.

One of the Department's senior engineering inspectors conducted a special water survey of the area covered by the South-East Study. Appendix I of the Study is based on his findings.

Surely the recommendations in the Study itself emphasise the need for advanced planning? Surely my hon. Friend is aware that there is considerable delay between planning and executing a major water undertaking? In the area the water resources are already under pressure. In view of the rising consumption per head, is it not vital that planning should be performed well in advance of the provision of water resources for the rising population of the district?

Of course that is so, but nevertheless there was a great deal of information that the potential water supplies are available before the South-East Survey was undertaken, and it is clear from the conclusions which were reached that there are no insuperable obstacles to providing the necessary water in these circumstances.

In view of the estimate that capital works amounting to £68 million will be needed for water in South-East England, what estimate has the hon. Gentleman made of the reduction which might have been possible if a further 1 million people from other regions of Britain were not to be accepted there?

I am sure the hon. Member appreciates that this expected immigration is not confined to other regions of Britain. The question he poses is a different question, but if he puts it on the Order Paper I shall do my best to answer it.

asked the Minister of Housing and Local Government and Minister for Welsh Affairs what steps he now proposes to take to prevent excessive profits from land speculation consequent upon the publication of plans for development in the South-East Region.

No further steps are needed because in every case where planned expansion in an area specifically identified in the South-East Study does take place the land needed will be bought in advance as necessary by a public authority just as is done for new towns.

Do not these powers to which the Minister referred extend only to new towns and expanded towns? Is it not the case that two-thirds of the development envisaged in the South-East Plan will be outside such new towns and expanded towns? Therefore, is it not necessary to have some idea how to stop speculation in the two-thirds which are not covered at present?

Yes, but there is a great difference. The one-third is proposed by the South-East Study to be housed in places which are identified and where, therefore, speculation could occur. The remaining two-thirds are left to the local planning authorities with discretion, subject to the Minister's overall final word, to place them in any part of their county which makes sense. Therefore, the speculator, if there be large numbers of such people, and I doubt it—[HON. MEMBERS: "Oh."]—I doubt it—are not led by the South-East Study to any identifiable place.

Does not the Minister appreciate that that is the whole mischief? The whole thing becomes a gamble on which way the planning authority will jump. This is one of the major causes of speculation and uncertainty. There will be an attempt to anticipate or even to persuade the planning authority to move in the direction where their interests lie.

Our main job is to get on with the development of land for houses. We believe this is going on at an accelerating rate under the present procedure. We depart from that only when the Government by their own initiative designate a planned expansion. That is where we use the new town procedure.

Does the right hon. Gentleman recognise that this is going on now, that towns like Slough in the south-east of England are becoming the slaves of great new feudalists, the property combines, and that these are sending up the price of land, which will make impossible his own housing associations or any other housing development designed to provide houses at rents which are within the ability of occupiers to pay?

The hon. Gentleman is, I know, a keen supporter of the Green Belt. The problem of towns like Slough, which are encircled by it, is one that involves the housing of some of the population who need houses outside the Green Belt in planned expansions. The question that I was asked was about the South-East Study.

asked the Minister of Housing and Local Government and Minister for Welsh Affairs whether he will call in the planning application made on behalf of Allied Ironfounders Ltd. to the Ealing Borough Council on 2nd April, 1964.

I understand that this application relates to industrial development in an area zoned for industry. On the information before me, I can see no reason why it should not be dealt with by the local authority in the usual way.

Is not the Minister aware that the company concerned paid £150 to the North Ealing Conservative Party in the last week in February and five weeks later, on 2nd April, submitted a planning application to the Conservative-controlled Ealing Borough Council—

Order. That would appear to involve an imputation. All imputation in Questions is out of order.

asked the Minister of Housing and Local Government and Minister for Welsh Affairs if he will circulate in the Official Report the names of the local authorities which have still not removed the turnstiles from their public lavatories.

Yes, Sir.

While thanking the hon. Gentleman for that reply, may I ask him whether it is not a fact that included in the list are a number of seaside resorts such as Blackpool, Morecambe, Cleveleys and Southport? Therefore, what does he intend to do to ensure that the turnstiles will be removed before the holiday period and, thus, that women visiting those towns will be saved from the acute embarrassment, not to say danger, which is involved in negotiating these infernal machines?

None of the places the hon. Lady has mentioned is included in the list. However, I can tell her that since I last answered a Question on this subject three further local authorities have removed all their turnstiles and five others expect to do so in a matter of weeks. One of these has only one turnstile, and it is in a lavatory which is closed.

asked the Minister of Housing and Local Government and Minister for Welsh Affairs what portion of the £40,000 of Government money allocated to the Welsh tourist industry has been earmarked by him for expenditure on hospitality to visiting sporting teams from overseas countries.

None. The money will be put towards the cost of a programme of research.

Is my right hon. Friend aware that the Socialist-controlled Cardiff City Council has recently refused to extend a civic welcome to a visiting team of South African bowlers? Without condoning apartheid in any way, would not my right hon. Friend agree that this brings Wales into ridicule and disrepute—[HON. MEMBERS: "Non-sense."]—and besmirches her good name for hospitality? Does not he further agree that it is ridiculous to involve sporting teems in party politics in this way—

Order. The hon. Gentleman appears to be asking the Minister to express a view on a matter of opinion. That is out of order. The last part of the supplementary question would seem to be more appropriate to the Secretary of State for Commonwealth Relations and for the Colonies.

On a point of order. In view of the—

—unsatisfactory nature—

On a point of order.

I am already on a point of order.

I cannot receive two points of order at once. Mr. Thomas.

Mr. Speaker, since you were almost bound to allow, and did allow, the hon. Member for Cardiff, North (Mr. Box) to make some very serious statements about my friends on the Cardiff City Council, which has a Labour majority, would it not be fair if we were allowed—

That is not a point of order.

It is a point of order. Mr. Speaker I know that you try normally to hold the balance in debate. I only appeal to you that you might possibly hold tie balance here at Question Time. Since the hon. Gentleman has got away with it—

The hon. Gentleman is very optimistic. I tried to stop it. If, because I hail been a little slow, perhaps, out of kindness to find out what the hon. Gentleman was really saying, I then allowed a counter-attack further out of order, I am afraid we would be further lost in the depths of disorder.

asked the Secretary of State for Commonwealth Relations and the Colonies if he will place in the Library a copy of the Report of the Constitutional Council of Southern Rhodesia on the Land Apportionment Act.

Yes, Sir.

In view of the fact that the Constitutional Council, of which an ex-Supreme Court judge is chairman, has unanimously condemned the Land Apportionment Act, does not the Commonwealth Secretary have anything further to say? Cannot he also condemn it?

I do not quite understand the right hon. Gentleman. He asked whether I would arrange for a certain document to be put in the Library, and I said that I would arrange for that. I should have thought that this was a wholly satisfactory Answer.

The Secretary of State, like myself, has had the opportunity of reading the document. I want others to do so. In the light of his having had that experience, has the right hon. Gentleman no comment to make?

No, Sir.