asked the Secretary of State for Scotland whether he will now announce new plans for major improvements in the road programme for Scotland.

asked the Secretary of State for Scotland if he will announce his new plans for speeding up the road building programme.

asked the Secretary of State for Scotland what plans he has for increasing the progress of the road building programme.

I would refer the hon. Members to the reply which my right hon. Friend gave on 17th February to the hon. Member for Perth and East Perthshire (Mr. MacArthur).

As a fairly frequent visitor to Scotland and one who is deeply interested in industry there, may I ask the hon. Gentleman whether it does not seem that the problem of Scotland in road development is rather the same as that of England, namely, that attention will have to be given to urban road development in future? Will the hon. Gentleman give that part of Scotland's road problem special attention in future?

I am very pleased that the hon. Gentleman frequently visits Scotland. I hope that he will enjoin his English friends to do likewise. We are reviewing the whole matter in sequence. We hope that the review will be completed in July.

Is my hon. Friend aware that, since the opening of the Forth Road Bridge in September last, several towns and villages in Scotland have carried a much greater volume of traffic? Will he take cognisance of this and consider with the greatest urgency building roads in the area north of the River Forth?

I will certainly take cognisance of those points. My hon. Friend will be aware that I met the Fife authorities concerned to have a discussion on specific matters as well as on the general position in Fife. The Government are fully alive to this and have given certain undertakings to those concerned.

Is my hon. Friend aware that only seven or eight of the 15 miles of motorway on the A.74 are under construction? Will he ensure that construction of the other seven miles, which would complete this part of the motorway, is authorised fairly quickly so that the whole job can be finished before 1968?

As my hon. Friend realises, my right hon. Friend is most sympathetic about this matter. We shall certainly do what we can within the review which is presently proceeding.

This Question has been addressed to my hon. Friend by an English Member of Parliament. This presupposes that we are not getting a fair crack of the whip in Scotland. As a great deal more needs to be done to our roads, will my hon. Friend take action at an early date?

I hope that we will do very much better than our predecessors.

Will the hon. Gentleman assure my hon. Friend the Member for Twickenham (Mr. Gresham Cooke) that he will get the quickest possible service from Twickenham to Murrayfield?

asked the Secretary of State for Scotland what proposals he is considering for the drainage of the land bordering the River Spey.

None, Sir. The initiation of arterial drainage proposals lies with the owners of the land concerned. No such proposals for the Spey Valley have been put forward.

Is the hon. Gentleman aware that the land bordering the Spey represents a tremendous opportunity for land reclamation? Could he indicate whether the drainage of such land will be something which the Highland Development Board will definitely consider?

I know the area quite well, and I agree with what the hon. Gentleman says. This is a matter for the Board itself. It will be given the power to do this kind of work, or to consider these schemes and to make proposals.

asked the Secretary of State for Scotland if he will give the date at which he expects all sections of the road between Fort William and Mallaig will be brought up to A road standard.

Improvements on the 2¾ miles from the junction with A.82 to Annat should be largely completed by spring, 1966. Widening the remaining 30 miles of single carriageway will cost about £2½ million and my right hon. Friend cannot yet find a place in the road programme for this large commitment.

Is the hon. Gentleman aware that, unless the road conditions between Lochailort and Mallaig, which are at present intolerable, are soon improved, they will deter the very tourist traffic for which the car ferries were designed? May we have his assurance that the bottleneck across the Caledonian Canal at Banavie, which gives direct access to the pulp mill, will receive urgent consideration? There was no provision at all by the last Government for the replacement of this bridge.

These are all matters of priority and, as the hon. Gentleman will realise, certain improvements have been made. I confess that, in the area between Lochailort and Mallaig, all that has been done is an aerial survey over the section from Arisaig to Mallaig to try to see where active improvements can be made in the foreseeable future. It is true that no provision has yet been made for the bridge, but my right hon. Friend hopes to provide a new double width swing bridge over the canal at a cost of £150,000. But it will be difficult to find a place for this for some time to come in the trunk road programme.

Will my hon. Friend encourage all right hon. and hon. Gentlemen to see this road for themselves? It passes through some of the most beautiful scenery in the world and if hon. Members were to see it they would come back enthusiastic to supply the money.

Not only that, but the rise in traffic on this road would be so enormous that, if hon. Members responded to my right hon. Friend's plea, we would have a good case to give it even greater priority.

asked the Secretary of State for Scotland what representations he has received regarding the shortage of hospital pharmacists; and what steps he is taking to bring their salaries and conditions into line with their qualificatons.

Various associations and individuals have been in touch with my right hon. Friend's Department and he is aware there are shortages of pharmacists in the hospital service in certain areas. The Whitley Council is at present considering a claim for increases in salaries of hospital pharmacists and the problem of recruitment will be taken into account along with other relevant factors.

Is my hon. Friend aware that the shortage of fully qualified pharmacists is reaching serious proportions in certain hospitals? Is she further aware that, if pay and conditions were improved, many highly qualified pharmacists presently employed in retailing toilet requisites and pills would go into the hospital service?

I am aware that there are shortages in some hospitals, particularly in the Western Region. We are not aware of difficulties in other regions. Comparison with outside industry will be one of the criteria taken into account in the present consideration of the revaluation of salaries. There are, however, some difficulties in making this comparison because of different hours of work and different responsibilities. However, all this will be taken into account.

Would the hon. Lady use her best endeavours to persuade the Treasury to view this matter with sympathy, because there is a similar problem with regard to pharmacists in Northern Ireland?

Order. I find it terribly difficult to fit that into this Question.

Will the hon. Lady remember that there are considerable difficulties in pharmacy generally at present due to the method of payment developed as a result of the abolition of the prescription charges? Will she take this into account when seeking to recruit the maximum number of pharmacists, whether for the hospital service or outside it?

Our information is that there is no general shortage. The problem is essentially one of getting them into the places where they are most needed.

Is the hon. Lady aware that she under-estimates the problem of the Western Region by referring to "difficulties"? A survey carried out by the Advisory Committee of the Regional Hospital Board showed that out of 108 established positions there were 30 vacancies, while only two places were filled out of 32 established positions for postgraduate pharmacists. Is not urgent action called for?

We are pursuing this as urgently as we can. Once the result of the consideration of salaries is known, there will be no delay on our part. I said that we were aware of shortages. Shortages do give rise to difficulties. I hope that my use of the word "difficulties" did not particularly offend the hon. Gentleman.

asked the Secretary of State for Scotland whether, in view of the seriousness of the problem, he will authorise the increased provision of maternity bed accommodation in West Fife.

As my right hon. Friend said in reply to the hon. Member for Dunfermline Burghs (Mr. Adam Hunter) on 3rd February, the need for maternity beds in West Fife and elsewhere will be considered in the course of the review of the hospital plan which we have in hand.

Is my hon. Friend aware that, for years now, I have been trying to inject into the Department a sense of urgency in this matter? Is she further aware that there is increasing concern and growing anger locally at the way in which the Department has evaded the issue? Will she pay a personal visit to the Dunfermline Maternity Hospital at the earliest opportunity? If she does, I am certain that it will get very much higher priority after the review.

I should be glad to take up such an invitation, although I am already very much aware of the problems. I assure my hon. Friend that, in the review of the hospital building programme, they are being very much taken into account.

When will the review be completed?

I would refer the hon. Gentleman to the statement last week and to the information already given by my right hon. Friend the Secretary of State. It will take some time, but we are pursuing it as urgently as possible.

Will the hon. Lady bear in mind that, in the last two Questions, we have been told of two more reviews? There are at least 500 subjects on which the answer from the Government has been that they are reviewing the problem. Is it not now time for action?

If there had been more action in the right hon. Gentleman's time as Secretary of State, there would be less need for reviews now.

asked the Secretary of State for Scotland if he is satisfied with the present level of municipal house rents in Glasgow; and what action he proposes to take in this matter.

My right hon. Friend explained in answer to a Question on 16th December that responsibility for fixing rents is laid on the local authority. My right hon. Friend expects local authorities to adopt a reasonable attitude over rents. I am sure that Glasgow Corporation will act in a reasonable manner in accordance with changing circumstances.

Does not the hon. Gentleman agree that that is an outrageous reply? Is it not time that we saw some Wilsonian dynamism directed to removing one of the most flagrant and obvious injustices in local government in Scotland? The people of Glasgow are having to pay a massive subsidy equivalent to 3s. 6d. in rates, towards subsidising 120,000 families irrespective of need. If the Glasgow Corporation will not operate its statutory powers to review rents from time to time, will the hon. Gentleman consider sending commissioners to take over the running of the city?

It is not an outrageous Answer. It is remarkably mild. Glasgow is still actively considering a review of rents. I understand that a senior member of the Corporation announced publicly that it intended to approach the Secretary of State to discuss this problem and the related problems of housing finance. In addition, the Government are actively concerned with reviewing housing finance with the intention of taking action as soon as possible.

How can the hon. Gentleman regard himself as a responsible Minister if he allows this state of affairs to continue? It amounts to the fact that, in Glasgow, a great many citizens are supporting out of charity others who are well able to support themselves. If the hon. Gentleman is so keen on reviews, can we not have a Government review instead of allowing Glasgow Corporation to continue its review, which has been going on for two years already?

The review I referred to in the final part of my last answer was, of course, a Government review. The review I referred to in the earlier part was the Glasgow Corporation review. We would hope soon to be able to resolve the national position regarding housing finance and no doubt the House will be told of this in due course. But, for the present, it would be wrong of Ministers precipitately to insist on action when the whole matter is being considered properly and reasonably.

Will my hon. Friend say how many times Glasgow Corporation has raised its rents during the last five years?

Without notice, I regret that I cannot give that information. I can assure my hon. Friend that Glasgow has not been slow in increasing its rents.

Is not this a perfect example of the way in which a Socialist-controlled city council has been taking no action but has been reviewing and reviewing and reviewing?

It is neither perfect nor is it an example.

asked the Secretary of State for Scotland what percentage of the barley used for the production of malt whisky is grown in Scotland.

In the period from August, 1963, to July, 1964, about 26 per cent.

Well, then, can the Minister of State explain this rather extraordinary situation which causes malt distillers on Speyside not to buy barley from the Laich o' Moray and other districts of that kind, and can he say whether it is due to the poor quality being produced?

I do not know that it is poor quality. It is not suitable quality, as I understand it; because I am informed that barley of a suitable quality can fairly easily be disposed of to distillers.

Would my hon. Friend, when discussing distilling generally, convey the kind regards of hon. Members on this side of the House to his right hon. Friend the Secretary of State for Economic Affairs for reducing the cost of living by 7s. per bottle?

They will have to be conveyed in barley on this Question.

asked the Secretary of State for Scotland how the Scottish barley crop is consumed, stated in percentage terms, as between brewing, distilling and animal feeding, respectively.

Of the 1963 crop, 17 per cent. was used for brewing and malting, 7 per cent. for distilling and 67 per cent. for animal feeding. The balance of 9 per cent. was used for seed, pot and pearl barley manufacture, or was exported.

Is the hon. Gentleman aware that the percentage of barley going to the brewing and the distillery trade is probably a good deal less than it was in pre-war days? Again, can he give any reason, or say whether any advice is being given by the colleges of agriculture to growers in Scotland so as to improve their varieties to satisfy this important trade?

I have no figures for before the war, but the figures for recent years do not sum ,to show any great fall. Work in the field of improved cereal varieties is being actively pursued. I understand that in this work the effect of Scottish conditions is taken into account.

asked the Secretary of State for Scotland if, in view of the housing shortage and the need to make full use of existing houses, he will take steps to facilitate the acquisition by local authorities of houses which are empty or not otherwise fulfilling their proper function.

asked the Secretary of State for Scotland if he will take steps to ensure that houses are not allowed to stand unoccupied for long periods whilst many people remain unhoused.

Local authorities already have wide powers to acquire empty houses or other property, either by agreement or compulsorily, in order to meet the housing needs of their areas.

While thanking my hon. Friend for that reply, may I ask him if he is aware that, although they have wide powers, many difficulties are put in their way in attempting to acquire houses without going into very long procedures, and that if it were made much easier for local authorities to acquire houses which are not fulfilling their proper function this would be a very valuable contribution to the difficult housing shortage in Glasgow and in other cities?

I agree that there are difficulties which my hon. Friend has mentioned. I have looked into the actual procedures. While I can give my hon. Friend the assurance that compulsory purchase orders will be dealt with by my Department as quickly as possible, I think it is quite clear that interested parties must have a fair opportunity to put their views. If there are any particular individual cases which my hon. Friend has in mind, I shall be very happy to look into them.

Is it not a fact that very low, subsidised rents encourage under-utilisation of existing housing?

No.

There is no such evidence.

Will my hon. Friend agree that many young couples in Glasgow today feel a tremendous degree of dissatisfaction and frustration because, while they are homeless, they see many hundreds of houses lying vacant because of their owners' determination not to allow the houses to be rented at reasonable rents by these young couples?

I agree that there is some concern—some deep concern—about this matter. Perhaps the legislation which the Government are contemplating may help to alter this position, but certainly these powers exist, and if Glasgow Corporation wishes to exercise them in relation to any of these houses the Secretary of State will certainly be glad to look at propositions put before him.

If, as the hon. Gentleman said in reply to my hon. Friend the Member for Galloway (Mr. Brewis), he has no evidence, will he please ask the Scottish Department what evidence it has?

That is anticipating a later Question.

asked the Secretary of State for Scotland whether he will offer full pay and pensions to older teachers wishing to return to the service.

asked the Secretary of State for Scotland what action he is taking to induce older teachers to return to the service; and if he will make a statement.

asked the Secretary of State for Scotland what inducements he will offer to retired teachers who are prepared to return to teaching.

Ways of inducing older teachers to return to service, including the possibility of full pay and pension are being examined urgently, but my right hon. Friend is not yet in a position to make a statement.

Would the hon. Lady say what in her view are the main difficulties which apparently make it impossible to introduce full pay and pensions without once going into a long and exhaustive review?

It is not a matter of a particularly long and exhaustive review. There are, however, as I thought would have been clear to the hon. Lady, certain difficulties. The whole area of public service pension schemes is involved; and there would be certain costs. Those are two of the questions which, clearly, involve a quite considerable amount of examination before a quick decision can be made.

Is my hon. Friend aware that this problem was in the lap of right hon. and hon. Members opposite for the past 13 years? Is my hon. Friend further aware that the Knox Committee recommended in its Report in 1958 that full pay and continuing pension should be conceded? Is it not rather deplorable that the hon. Lady the Member for Aberdeen, South (Lady Tweedsmuir) and hon. and right hon. Members opposite should be wriggling out of their responsibilities when they were in office and trying to create a situation in which it would appear we are to blame?

I am grateful to my hon. Friend for pointing out what I myself thought it would be a little cruel to keep on pointing out to hon. Members opposite.

They are sunk again.

asked the Secretary of State for Scotland if he will redefine the Highland area to include those parts of the Scottish Highlands which lie outside the crofter counties.

Definitions of the Highland area are included in a number of Statutes for particular purposes, and my right hon. Friend does not propose to make any changes in these. So far as the proposed Highland Development Board is concerned I would refer the hon. Member to the relative provision in Clause 1(2) of the Highland Development (Scotland) Bill now before the House.

Is the hon. Gentleman aware that my enthusiasm for my Question has declined considerably since yesterday when I saw the paltry sum of money being made available by the Government for the Highland Development Board? Is he aware how absurd the sum appears when set against the powers which it is proposed to take and the large promises made at the General Election by the party opposite, and the fact that the last Administration was already investing between 25 and 30 times this sum in the Highlands year by year?

Most of that supplementary question was, of course, quite irrelevant to this particular Question. I have no doubt we shall be able to deal with that when we come to the Bill. Meanwhile I am quite content to rest on the knowledge that at least the people in Scotland will be happy about the Highland Development Board.

asked the Secretary of State for Scotland on what date the Scottish Planning Board is to be established.

The Board has already begun its work.

Does the Minister of State realise that that does not answer my Question which asked for the date? Does he realise that the Scottish Development Department has already done a great deal towards meeting Scotland's problems? Is he prepared to say in what ways the functions of the Planning Board will be able to add to what was already being done most effectively by the Scottish Development Department?

My right hon. Friend said on 2nd December last that the Board would be set up, and of course it was set up very shortly afterwards and has been meeting since. With regard to its functions, as has been explained before in the House at Question Time, it has been strengthened to give to the planning machinery in St. Andrew's House an economic content which it previously lacked.

asked the Secretary of State for Scotland what has been the result of the consultations he has had with the Minister of Aviation regarding the improvement of air facilities within Scotland.

asked the Secretary of State for Scotland what has been the outcome of the conversations he has had with the Minister of Aviation regarding the improvement of air communications in Scotland.

My right hon. Friend and the Minister of Aviation are regularly in touch about air facilities in Scotland, and the airlines are well aware of the many suggestions which have been made for improvement. The hon. Members will appreciate, however, that it is the airlines, not the Government, which run air services and it is the airlines which have to be persuaded that additional services are economically justifiable.

Is the Under-Secretary of State aware that the Minister of Aviation's statement last week has given B.E.A. a virtual monopoly on Scottish routes, and does he realise that, in consequence, the independent airlines are much less likely to undertake services on routes within Scotland? Is he also aware that B.E.A. is proposing to raise its fares on routes within Scotland?

I am aware of a number of these things. Although I do not accept the comment made in the first part of the hon. Gentleman's supplementary question, I think it would be wise if he were to address his thoughts to the Minister of Aviation who on occasion has answered some of the points which have been made. Nevertheless, the Secretary of State is concerned about these matters, and is in very close touch with his right hon. Friend the Minister of Aviation

How does the hon. Gentleman square his responsibility of being one of the spokesmen for Scotland with the decision of the Minister of Aviation to curtail private development and create a monopoly for the B.E.A.? The hon. Gentleman, and indeed his hon. Friends, seem to be pretty timid lions and not every good at speaking up for Scotland. Has he ever read the Toothill Committee's Report? If he has, what are his comments on the views of that Report on the need for more civil aviation?

I have read the Toothill Report, including its 81 recommendations, few of which were acted on by the previous Administration. With regard to the master plan produced by the Scottish Council, which is probably more up to date, this is the concern of the Government, and the Minister of Aviation hopes to meet the Scottish Council very soon to discuss this matter. May I remind the hon. Gentleman that he was concerned with this matter himself some time ago, and that the present policy does not permit the development of any of these air services without their being economically justifiable. The idea of subsidies was rejected by the hon. Gentleman's Government, and clearly he has no right to complain about this now.

Is my hon. Friend aware that the body for granting operating licences is the Air Transport Licensing Board, and that since its establishment in 1960 not one independent operating company in Scotland has even applied for a licence to start a new route?

I am grateful to my hon. Friend, who is very learned and experienced in these matters, for his comments. It gives me the chance to say that the decision of the independent operators to withdraw from certain routes in Scotland was made freely by them and not by the Government.

Is the hon. Gentleman aware that there is a tendency for Ministers to speak of aviation policy in Scotland as though it was handed down by God? It is in fact the result of deliberate decisions by the hon. Gentleman's predecessors, and the chosen instrument is a nationalised corporation to which this House can give new directions, or in respect of which it can bring in a new Bill any time it likes. What I find deplorable about the history of aviation in Scotland is the total failure to open up new routes in the north of Scotland, and the failure to provide enough suitable aircraft for the smaller services which are needed. Is the hon. Gentleman aware that if this increase in fares and charges is agreed to, it will be a most serious blow at the one thing which the Government undoubtedly want to do, which is to improve and cheapen transport services?

I agree with a good deal of what was said by the right hon. Gentleman. This is very much a matter which is exercising the concern of my right hon. Friend and the Minister of Aviation. Indeed, in relation to Highland air services, I am told that the Highland Transport Board is discussing this with the B.E.A. and will report to the Secretary of State in due course. I have no doubt that at that juncture my right hon. Friend will want to speak to the Minister of Aviation.

The hon. Gentleman said that he had read the Toothill Report. Will he continue to read what Sir John Toothill said, namely, that most of the recommendations which he put forward to the Government had been accepted? Will he confirm to the House that B.E.A. withdrew its request for a subsidy for the Highland areas in the north of Scotland? This was not denied by the last Government.

I cannot accept what the right hon. Gentleman says about the Government having accepted all the recommendations of the Toothill Report, even within this limited matter. But we are concerned not so much with the past as with trying to do something now to improve the situation, and we intend to proceed along these lines.

asked the Secretary of State for Scotland what were the factors which led to the recent change in the chairmanship of the Herring Industry Board.

The Government decided that it was desirable to make a fresh appointment on the expiry of Sir John Carmichael's appointment as chairman of the Board and that Mr. George Middleton was the most suitable person for the post.

Is the hon. Gentleman aware that the outgoing chairman, Sir John Carmichael, was regarded with enthusiasm an an admirable chairman by both the sea and shore sides of the fishing industry, and that both join in hoping and wishing the new chairman well in his important task? Can the hon. Gentleman confirm rumours at present afloat in the industry that the general manager of the Board is due to resign in the spring?

Order. That is out of order, unless it can be shown that the Minister is responsible for the rumour. The first part of the supplementary question is all right though.

I do not dissent from what the hon. Gentleman said in the first part of his supplementary question.

Is the hon. Gentleman aware of the importance of having a chairman for this Board who can spend plenty of time there? Can he give the House the number of other appointments which Mr. George Middleton holds, and how often he proposes to be able to look after the affairs of the Board?

If the hon. Gentleman puts down these questions, we will try to answer them. We would not have appointed Mr. George Middleton had we not been confident that he could give the necessary time to the work of the Board.

Is my hon. Friend aware that when previous Governments have appointed distinguished Conservatives to be chairmen of these boards—in one case a constituent of mine, the father of the hon. Member for Glasgow, Hillhead (Mr. Galbraith) to the Scottish Hydro-Electric Board—they have become enthusiastic about nationalisation overnight?

asked the Secretary of State for Scotland if Upper Banffshire will lie within the jurisdiction of the proposed Highland Development Authority.

I would refer the hon. Member to the relative provision in Clause 1(2) of the Highland Development (Scotland) Bill now before the House.

Is not the hon. Gentleman aware that the previous Administration had designated Upper Banffshire in the study which they were undertaking with the rest of the Highlands? Is he further aware that the miserably small amount of money which the present Administration is allocating for Highland development over and above that which the pervious Administration allocated is not sufficient to cover any other areas designated, or which may be designated under Clause 2 of the Bill?

It is a pity that hon. Gentlemen opposite did not consider the question of money before October last and make the allocation at that time. With regard to the first part of the hon. Gentleman's supplementary question, I am aware that for various purposes various areas adjoining the seven crofting counties have been included as part of the Highland area. I answered a Question about that previously. We have no intention of changing that, but for the purposes of the Highland Development Authority it is the seven crofting counties.

asked the Secretary of State for Scotland how many dairy farmers in Scotland have gone out of business in each of the past five years to December 1964.

The numbers of farmers registered with the three Milk Marketing Boards in Scotland who ceased commercial milk production in each of the five years from 1960 were 153, 127, 228, 287 and 321 respectively.

Is the hon. Gentleman aware that this shows an alarming downward trend? Will he urge his right hon. Friend, in the current Price Review with the N.F.U., to make a considerable increase in order to stabilise, if not to improve, the present position?

It shows a decline in the number of producers, but it does not necessarily indicate a serious decline in the dairy industry, because the quantity has not fallen. It would be wrong of me to comment on what is at present taking place in regard to the annual review.

Is the hon. Gentleman satisfied with the margin of production over liquid consumption, having regard to the employment there is in Scotland in creameries, cheese manufacture, and so on?

Naturally we are concerned with this and we watch the liquid milk position very carefully. There was a more than adequate reserve of milk this year to keep the liquid market and other markets fairly well satisfied.

asked the Secretary of State for Scotland what assistance he proposes to offer to the local authorities concerned in meeting increases in the estimated cost of the Tay Road Bridge.

asked the Secretary of State for Scotland what is the nature of the assistance which local authorities now receive in building the Tay Road Bridge; and what plans he has for assisting them further.

The Tay Road Bridge Order, 1962, enables the joint board to borrow £1½million from the Government towards capital expenditure of £4½ million.

Will the hon. Member try to ensure that this is treated as a matter of some urgency? Is he aware that many Members of the party opposite criticised the previous Government for failing to make a direct grant towards the cost of this bridge? If the Government pursue the same policy, is the hon. Member aware that his right hon. Friend is liable to cause considerable embarrassment to his hon. Friends?

I can assure the hon. Member that the officials of my Department are already in touch with the Board about this matter, and are trying to resolve the initial questions before my right hon. Friend meets the Board. I would point out to the hon. Member that the present Government are working within the Tay Road Bridge Order, 1962. The mechanism was devised by our predecessors and we are obliged to stay within it.

Is my hon. Friend aware that his reply will give some satisfaction? Is he also aware that the fact that some negotiation is intended is very satisfying?

I thank my hon. Friend.

asked the Secretary of State for Scotland whether he is satisfied with the working of the Glasgow overspill agreement system; and if he will make a statement.

asked the Secretary of State for Scotland if he will make a statement on the progress of Glasgow's overspill agreements; how many families have been rehoused; and by what number this has exceeded or fallen short of the estimates.

asked the Secretary of State for Scotland how many families have been exported from Glasgow to new towns and to local authority areas since 1958 under overspill agreements.

asked the Secretary of State for Scotland if he will make a statement on the working of the overspill agreement so far as Glasgow is concerned; and what steps he intends to take to expedite its working.

asked the Secretary of State for Scotland what have been the results to date of the working of the. Glasgow overspill agreement; and if he is satisfied with these results.

At the end of 1964 about 12,000 families, comprising almost 50,000 people, had been rehoused under the overspill arrangements. The review of the Glasgow development plan approved last spring assessed overspill needs at 60,000 families over a period of 20 years. An output of 3,559 houses was achieved last year, and I hope that we can do better in future.

Is the hon. Member aware that to date most of the movement in overspill has been of persons and not of industries, and that as a result of this a situation has arisen which is liable to lead to redundancy in times of stringency such as we seem to be heading for under this Government? Has the hon. Member's attention been drawn to a recent statement of the Lord Provost of Glasgow offering inducements to workers to return to work in indusstry? Does not this conflict with the whole purpose of the overspill scheme?

There is a great deal of sense in what the hon. Member says. The previous overspill arrangements were constructed by the party opposite, based on the concept of industrial overspill. It has been shown—without wishing to deprecate the achievements, particularly of last year—that while this has worked satisfactorily to some extent it has by no means made the major contribution to the problem which is vital if we are to solve Glasgow's housing position. Accordingly, my right hon. Friend is engaged in the most intense review and discussions of this matter, and we hope to propose more radical solutions as soon as these are complete.

I know that my hon. Friend is aware of the importance of the overspill agreement towards achieving a solution to the housing problem of Glasgow, and that it is necessary to give Glasgow the elbow room necessary for development. I hope that he will bear in mind the importance of industrial expansion, a fact which the party opposite forgot during their 13 years of office.

As always, my hon. Friend is right on the ball.

Is my hon. Friend aware that in 1957 the then Under Secretary of State—the present Lord Craigton—indicated this his Government would build 3,500 houses a year in the next 10 years? They actually built 1,200 a year, which is a miserable and shocking record, in view of the extent of the problem.

The criticisms of my hon. Friend are well known in the House and are accepted by my right hon. Friend and his colleagues. I can assure my hon. Friend that it is because of this feeling of dissatisfaction that we are proceeding to look into the matter afresh, with a view to taking much more energetic steps—steps which were not taken during the last 13 years.

Can the Minister assure us that adequate educational facilities have been provided in the receiving areas, and that this will not cut across the existing building programmes of the areas concerned?

That is an important but somewhat different question. Perhaps the hon. Lady will be good enough to put down a Question on the matter.

As one of the reasons why these schemes may not be working as well as they might be is the unreasonably low rents in Glasgow, which deter people from leaving to go to other areas, will the Minister use the powers which exist in the 1962 Housing Act to force Glasgow to raise rents, thereby encouraging people to move to other areas?

The hon. Member is quite wrong. I am surprised that he, with his experience in the Scottish Office, is not aware of this. If he goes round any towns which are receiving areas he will find, as my hon. Friend the Member for Glasgow, Springburn (Mr. Buchanan) said, that it was the failure of the previous Government to bring industry to Scotland which has prevented their taking in more families from Glasgow, because there are no jobs for them.

asked the Secretary of State for Scotland what steps he is taking to obtain up-to-date information about housing conditions in Scotland.

My right hon. Friend is arranging for regular surveys of housing to be made on a sample basis. The first of these surveys will be carried out in the early summer. The work will be done by the Social Survey in collaboration with the University of Glasgow. The first results should be available in the autumn.

Will my hon. Friend keep in mind the fact that the provision of houses is of the utmost importance to the people of Scotland, and that they consider that this is a major social service which should be undertaken by the Government? Is this the first time that a survey of this kind has been undertaken? Will its result be published in due course?

I agree with what my hon. Friend said in the first part of his supplementary question. This is the first time since the war that a comprehensive survey of housing has been carried out in Scotland, and its results will be published.

Will the Minister also take cognisance of such information as was sent to the Secretary of State on 12th of this month concerning vacant houses owned by British Railways? Is he aware that a similar position exists in Mallaig?

I am unaware of that problem, but I will look into the question and write to the hon. Member.

asked the Secretary of State for Scotland what immediate plans he has for the development of the north-east of Scotland pending the publication of a large-scale plan for the whole area.

I have nothing meantime to add to the reply I gave to the hon. Member on 9th December last year.

Were we to understand from the reply of the Secretary of State for Scotland to my hon. Friend the Member for Aberdeen, South (Lady Tweedsmuir) last week that the detailed study of north-east Scotland, put in train by the Conservative Government, is now ready but is held back pending completion of yet further studies by this Government?

No, Sir, that is not the case.

To what extent do the plans referred to in the previous Answer include the building of advance factories for industrial expansion in and about the City of Aberdeen? How many such advance factories are envisaged by the plans and when will the building of those advance factories be started and completed?

It depends on what my hon. and learned Friend means by "in and about". Two advance factories are being provided at Fraserburgh and Peter-head.

In view of his hon. Friend's reply to an earlier question about no industrial development having been brought to Scotland by the last Government, will the hon. Gentleman give the House in due course his reasons why his right hon. Friend claimed that the November figures—the highest on record—were due to his action?

I am not quite certain what all that means, but I am sure that my right hon. Friend is quite competent to explain his own figures without soliciting my aid.

Will the Minister of State answer the question which his right hon. Friend failed to answer the other day, as to when the North-East Study will be laid, and, secondly, whether he will consider another advance factory for the North-East, as the first one announced did not include Aberdeen City?

We do not know when the report on the North-East will reach us, but we expect that it will reach us about the middle of this year. It will be considered in the light of the national Scottish planning which is at present going on, and, of course, used in that context for the purpose of preparing other plans for Scotland.

asked the Secretary of State for Scotland what was the purpose of the official Press interview given by the Under-Secretary of State for Scotland in Perth on 28th January, 1965.

This was not a Press conference called by me. At the end of my housing visit to Perth, two reporters asked for my impressions, which I gave them.

Is the hon. Gentleman aware, that, according to these Press reports, he appeared to criticise Perth's housing achievement and to praise that of Dundee? Is he aware that since the war, Perth Council has built about one new house for every 11 or 12 of the population and now owns 41 per cent. of the houses in the City, a very high proportion; that the Council's financial management is above reproach, and that over the next four years the Council has a preliminary programme for building 1,550 new houses?

I accept that the record of house building in Perth until 1963 was good, but in 1964—it was that question which I answered—the results were disappointing, considering that only 64 houses were built and that there was a waiting list of 1,200. As a Minister, what concerned me more was the fact that no submissions were put before me with regard to further approvals. Indeed, since I assumed my present responsibilities, I have only been asked to agree to approve 10 houses, and there are only 125 houses under construction in Perth at the moment. I am most anxious to hear from the Town Council what it intends to do. I am very glad to have the information from the hon. Gentleman about the Council's intentions. I only hope that he and I together can encourage Perth to come forward with specific proposals in order to improve its housing programme in 1965 and 1966 so that it will measure up to what was the case before 1964.

I appreciate the hon. Gentleman's anxiety about this subject. Is he aware that 1964 was a year of great difficulty in Perth? Is he further aware that there has been consultation between the Council and the Scottish Office about land acquisition and that the housing proposals for the next four years exceed the waiting list in Perth at the moment? Would it not be better if he did not give Press interviews of this kind, which lead to great misunderstanding?

If the result of the question which I was asked by the Press, and which I answered truthfully, is that we get more proposals from the Town Council to build more houses, we shall all have done a good service.

asked the Secretary of State for Scotland what research is being carried out in Great Britain with a view to establishing the profitable use of larch from Scottish woodlands in the pulp industry.

I understand that tests by the pulp industry itself have indicated that larch can be used in varying proportions with other types of timber for certain pulping processes. The Forest Products Research Laboratory is also planning a research project on the pulping properties of larch.

Would the Minister of State consult urgently with his right hon. Friend the Minister of Technology about recent research in the United States which has shown that larch is considerably used and is better than spruce for certain sections of the pulp industry, as this would be of great interest to the Highlands?

I understand that research work is already being carried out on this, as I indicated in my Answer, and that the Forest Products Research Laboratory is investigating the timber properties of home-grown larch and its possible use in industries other than the pulp industry.

Will my right hon. Friend make sure that larch is not used by the pulp industry if it can be more profitably sold for pit props, telephone poles and other uses for which it commands a greater price?

That is a matter for the industry.

asked the Secretary of State for Scotland what information is now available as to the likely acreage of potatoes to be planted in Scotland in 1965.

The present indications suggest an acreage slightly below that of 1964.

Is the Minister of State aware that since farmers were asked to make returns, the complete inaction of his right hon. Friend has caused the loss of hundreds of thousands of pounds to potato growers? Is he aware that they confidence has been entirely shaken and that there is a very real need for him to give the same assurances which my right hon. Friends gave to the Potato Marketing Board if it is to ensure proper planting of potatoes in the current season?

I would not accept the statement by the hon. Gentleman in the first part of his supplementary question. We have acted over this. The hon. Gentleman knows that. We do not accept the conclusions drawn by the hon. Gentleman that there has been any substantial reduction. The reduction, if any, has been very small. We have not the figures, but we know that it will be small.

Will the Minister of State look at the question of excessive imports of early potatoes, which are damaging the Scottish early potato trade?

This is a rather different question from that asked by the hon. Member's hon. Friend.

Is the hon. Gentleman aware that this is a very real problem and that confidence in the potato-growing districts of Scotland has been greatly shaken by the failure of his right hon. Friends to accept the commercial judgment of the Potato Marketing Board earlier than they did? Is he further aware that this appears to potato growers to be quite contrary to the spirit in which these new arrangements were introduced some years ago?

I do not accept that at all.

asked the Secretary of State for Scotland whether he will seek to confer wider powers on the Potato Marketing Board in so far as it affects Scotland.

The Board's powers derive from the Potato Marketing Scheme made under the Agricultural Marketing Act, 1958. It is accordingly for the Board to consider whether its powers under the Scheme require amendment with regard to operations in Scotland or any other part of Great Britain.

Is the Minister aware that he has come to the support of the Potato Marketing Board in Scotland far too late? Will he ensure that in future he takes a much stronger line in representing the cause of Scottish farmers to the Minister of Agriculture?

I do not accept that we came to the assistance of the farmers too late.

Could the hon. Gentleman assure us that on future occasions he will not allow the interests of farmers in Scotland to be sacrificed to the First Secretary of State's pursuit of the will o' the wisp of an incomes policy?

Oh.

I do not accept that that has happened. I am quite confident that my right hon. Friend will look after the interests of the Scottish farmers.

Would my hon. Friend take into consideration the fact that a considerable amount of first-class potatoes in Scotland are now being utilised for cattle and stock feeding? In view of this unsatisfactory state of affairs, would he look into the whole question of the growing and marketing of potatoes to see that there is a more secure market for potato growers and a much lower price for the consumer than in the past?

Naturally we are concerned to see that suitable arrangements exist. The Board and the National Farmers' Union are discussing various aspects of the activities of the Potato Marketing Board with a view to seeing whether, if necessary, it should be strengthened.

Does not the hon. Gentleman agree—because nearly everybody else in the country does—that the delay of his right hon. Friend in facing up to his responsibilities in this matter has been most unhelpful to thousands of growers? Is he aware that his right hon. Friend the Minister of Agriculture said on Monday that he thought that the surplus had been exaggerated? Does he agree with that? Can he, therefore, give his idea of the actual surplus?

I do not accept the accusation that my right hon. Friend the Secretary of State has delayed in this matter. Neither do I accept the accusation made by the hon. Gentleman that my right hon. Friend the Minister of Agriculture was wrong.

asked the Secretary of State for Scotland what action he is taking to encourage local authorities to introduce council house rent rebate schemes.

Many local authorities have done so in recent years, and I hope that others will consider this means of achieving a reasonable level of rents without hardship to individual tenants.

While thanking the Under-Secretary of State for that reply, may I ask whether he is aware that high rates in Scotland are detrimental to the attraction of industry? Will he encourage councils to have a reasonable rent policy so as to help to reduce the rates?

This is entirely a matter for local authorities. There has been a steady increase in the number of Scottish authorities operating rent rebate schemes. The last published rent return showed that one in three of all authorities, covering 60 per cent. of all council houses in Scotland, operated rent rebate schemes.