asked the Secretary of State for Education and Science what increase or decrease in staff there was in the Department under his control in the period 16th October 1964 to 15th October 1965; and what increase or decrease he anticipates in the period up to 15th April 1966.

The answer to the first part of the question is an increase of 373, including 200 former staff of D.S.I.R. whose functions were transferred to my Department on 1st April, 1965. I shall shortly be discussing staffing for the year 1966–67 with the Treasury in accordance with normal procedure.

Will the Minister tell the House why the increase of the last six months has been 30 more than he forecast in April this year?

I think that the exact figure is 27 more, which seems to me to be miraculously close to the forecast which I made. The major reason why our staff has increased by this comparatively small amount, apart from D.S.I.R., is the fact that a number of fresh responsibilities have been put on the Department in the last year or so.

asked the Secretary of State for Education and Science what definition his Department gives to the term, Immigrant Child, used in his Circular 7/65 on the Education of Immigrants.

The term "immigrant child" in Circular 7/65 was intended to cover children who, because of differences in their cultural and social background and, sometimes, their inadequate knowledge of English, need special attention in school.

Will my hon. Friend therefore undertake an inquiry in his Department as to why an answer was given to people inquiring from my area, including myself, by a civil servant in the Ministry that a child born of immigrant parents within ten years of their coming to this country was to be defined as an immigrant child?

I will certainly look into any answer given to my hon. Friend. I am staggered that if he were seeking information from my Department he did not communicate with Ministers.

asked the Secretary of State for Education and Science upon what statistical or other evidence based on social and educational studies he concludes that there is a need for organised dispersal of immigrant children by local education authorities, as would be required by the implementation of his Circular 7/65.

The Secretary of State is in constant touch with the local education authorities who are carrying the main responsibility for the education of immigrant children. Detailed information and advice about the educational and social considerations which apply is also available to him from H.M. Inspectorate of schools. He has concluded from a close study of this information, and on the professional advice of those most closely associated with this problem, that the difficulties in both schools and classes are manageable where the number of immigrants is generally not in excess of 30 per cent. of the total number of children. Practical experience in the schools shows that when this figure is exceeded the proportion of immigrant children tends to increase rapidly and such a situation militates against a policy of integration which is the main aim of the Government.

Is my hon. Friend aware that in fact this is not the general experience in all areas—and I choose my words carefully—where there are immigrants settling in this country, while it may be true in certain specified areas. Are we to take it from my hon. Friend's reply that there have been no properly designed social surveys and studies made as a basis for this circular?

My hon. Friend is quite wrong to say that. There is the overwhelming evidence of the professional people involved—and I know this from my own practical experience of sending my own children to such a school. These problems are manageable up to a certain percentage, after which a considerable difficulty arises. It is interesting to note that the London headmasters have just produced a report and that the teachers of Birmingham are saying exactly the same thing. Both those authorities are not pursuing the Government's policy. The teachers, professionally, on educational grounds and not on any political or racialist grounds, are saying from practical experience that the Government are right in this matter. I believe that we should take note of what people are saying who are in the trade dealing with the problem.

That answer was too long.

Is the Joint Under-Secretary aware that many experts, particularly in the United States, consider that his figure of 30 per cent. is unduly high? Would he not be well advised to look at the evidence on this figure again to ensure that he avoids the dangers which he is trying to avoid?

I believe that there is some evidence on which to say that some people believe that the figure is too high. However, others think that it is too low. Therefore, I think that we are right in thinking that it is about correct.

asked the Secretary of State for Education and Science which local education authorities have introduced programmed teaching machines into schools and other educational institutions; and to what extent.

There are at least 73 local education authorities in England and Wales which are making use of programmed learning in varying degrees, and the number is steadily growing.

Is it no longer true, despite the shortage of teachers, that the education authorities and the teaching profession are showing less interest in these machines than are the Armed Forces and industry?

I do not think that one should draw that conclusion from any Answer. Teaching machines provide only one means of presenting programmed learning. There are other methods, and research has not gone far enough to establish the superiority of machines.

asked the Secretary of State for Education and Science to what extent independent and direct grant schools are making use of programmed teaching machines.

I regret that this information is not available.

asked the Secretary of State for Education and Science whether, in order to encourage the development of music in schools, he will give a grant to maintain the National Youth Orchestra.

I understand the Executive Committee of the council of the orchestra is to meet next month and I shall be glad to consider any suggestions which may then be put to me.

I thank the Joint Under-Secretary for that helpful reply. Will she give an undertaking that after there has been such a meeting the whole position of the National Youth Orchestra, with all the support that it receives from various sources, will be made known to the public so that we may know how much support the Government are giving to this very useful and important movement?

I assure the hon. Lady that I share her admiration for this orchestra. It is very distinguished and I am deeply concerned about it, but because I am concerned I do not want to say any more just now.

While sharing the Minister's admiration for this orchestra, will she do everything she can to encourage local authorities to see what they can do to keep school orchestras of this kind together after children have left school?

Certainly. Indeed, I am working on a survey covering the whole sphere of what we are doing in drama and music, relating to those of school age and school leavers.

asked the Secretary of State for Education and Science whether he will allow widowed mothers to receive their pension without deduction in the case of those undergoing teacher training.

I would refer my hon. Friend to the Answer given to her on 29th July by my right hon. Friend when he announced alternative arrangements for the assessment of grants to widows training as teachers. Under these arrangement a widow may, if it is more favourable, relinquish her claim to dependants' grants in respect of her children and claim instead an allowance against income of £300 for the first child and £100 for each subsequent child. This would leave her pension untouched.

While thanking my hon. Friend for that Answer, may I say that this was one of the difficulties which had arisen—

Order. The hon. Lady must not say. She must ask.

May I ask my hon. Friend whether he is aware that the removal of the widows' earnings bar created an anomaly in this sphere, and may I thank him for the changes which have been made?

asked the Secretary of State for Education and Science if he will give an assurance that, on receipt of local education committees' plans on their future educational structure, no attempt will be made by his Department to make those committees reconsider their plans.

No, Sir. There would be no point in the submission of plans to my Department if my views were not to be made known to the authority and this may involve reconsideration of the plans.

Could I have an assurance from the right hon. Gentleman that if a local authority, after consideration, decides to put forward its educational development against the comprehensive system, his Department or he himself will exercise no pressure on the free decision of that or other local education authorities? Would the right hon. Gentleman also express a view—

Order. I will allow this one, but there should be only one question in a supplementary.

Would the Minister please say whether he believes in the freedom of local education authorities or whether he seeks to dictate to them?

I have no desire to dictate and I believe in the freedom of local authorities. The fact is—and there are many precedents for this under all Administrations—that the Government have now said that it is their national policy to move towards comprehensive reorganisation. I do not propose to dictate this policy to local authorities, mainly because I am certain, from the response we have had so far, that we shall move in this direction by co-operation and agreement.

Will my right hon. Friend bear in mind that were he to accept the request of the hon. Lady the Member for Tynemouth (Dame Irene Ward) he would be acting in a very irresponsible manner? Does he appreciate that if a local authority submits plans which are inefficient, cumbersome or inequitable as between people or districts he would have a public duty to make recommendations for their alteration?

That is absolutely true. And since almost all plans involve powers which the Secretary of State has under Section 13 of the 1944 Act, he is not in any position to divest himself of this responsibility.

asked the Secretary of State for Education and Science what action he is taking in the light of the views expressed to him by the Swimming Teachers Association of Great Britain and the Commonwealth in their recent correspondence with him about state registration of full-time and part-time professional swimming teachers; and if he will make a statement.

I regard the teaching of swimming as a matter of importance, and good qualifications should certainly be encouraged. But I do not consider that it would be appropriate to introduce legislation requiring the registration of professional swimming teachers.

Does the Minister not realise that the science and art of swimming in this country compares very unfavourably with that of other countries? Should we not try to emulate the help which is given to teachers of swimming in other countries, which realise that swimming is good for the health and physique of the nation as well as for life saving?

Although we in this country broadly accept the proposition which my hon. and learned Friend has put to me, we think that it is extremely important that teachers should be educationists first and specialists second.

asked the Secretary of State for Education and Science what progress is being made by the European Space Research Organisation; what percentage of contracts so far let by the Organisation has gone to British contractors; and if he will make a statement.

E.S.R.O. came into being in March, 1964, and has made considerable progress in recruiting staff and in creating its establishments. It has already launched eight sounding rockets, Skylarks and Centaures, and will launch several times that number in the next 12 months. Contracts for its first two satellites have been placed. These are scheduled for launching in 1967. Contracts for four more satellites are likely to be let by next summer.

In view of the probably widespread importance of these experiments to British industry in future, would the right hon. Gentleman arrange for as much publicity as possible to be given to these experiments?

Yes, Sir. This is being discussed inter-departmentally now.

asked the Secretary of State for Education and Science what progress has been made in the establishment of a university of the air.

A study of the educational scope and functions of a university of the air has been completed, and the Government are now considering the financial, organisational and technical questions involved.

Is my hon. Friend completely satisfied that it is a practical proposition and when will she be publishing a White Paper on her findings?

I am completely satisfied that it is a practical and deeply desirable proposition. A White Paper may very well be produced, but only when the questions which are now being examined, financial and organisational, have been settled.

Would the hon. Lady not agree that the present title is somewhat misleading as to the scope and possible methods of implementing this suggestion? Could she not find a better title and has she consulted the University Grants Committee on the project?

I have looked into this matter carefully. We think that the title is appropriate and I had a representative of the University Grants Committee on the very distinguished educational committee which advised me in its unanimous report.

asked the Secretary of State for Education and Science to what extent the Universities Building Programme is being delayed by the recent financial restrictions; and what reduction in the previous plan of capital expenditure is anticipated for the year 1965–66.

In general, all university building projects planned to start since 27th July, other than those in development districts, are subject to six months' deferment. A number of exemptions have, however, been made where exceptional circumstances apply. The present estimate is that about three-quarters of the current fifteen-month programme of starts will be fulfilled, and about one-quarter will be deferred until 1966–67. But the Chancellor and I are keeping the position under review.

Will the Minister indicate what this means in terms of money and in terms of student places? Has he consulted the U.G.C. about the effect of these cuts, and does he still seriously believe that the Robbins target for 1967 can be achieved?

My Answer was couched in terms of value, so that answers the first part of the hon. Gentleman's supplementary question. In terms of numbers of students, it is impossible to say what the exact effect might be, partly because we do not yet know the admission figures for 1965–66—that is, for this autumn; partly because we do not know what the result of the constant review between the Chancellor and myself may be, and partly because we do not know what possibilities might be open to the universities in achieving a relatively higher admission figure with a relatively lower figure of building starts. It is, therefore, not possible to give an exact student number projection, but it is my hope to keep to the Robbins figure.

Cannot the right hon. Gentleman, whatever the effect on availability of student places, give an explicit assurance that the Robbins figures still remain the Government's intention, and that they intend to keep it?

Yes, Sir, I can give that assurance.

asked the Secretary of State for Education and Science how many young people in Scotland, and in England and Wales, respectively, were unable to obtain admission to university this session although possessing the minimum qualifications for entry.

I regret that this information is not available.

Would not the right hon. Gentleman agree that the figures here are very substantial and represent an appalling loss of potential science teachers and doctors which the nation cannot afford, and does he not feel that a responsible Minister should resign rather than accept these cuts?

I agree that the nation cannot afford any avoidable waste of any talent at any point and this is why this Government—and, to be fair, their predecessors—are doing everything to achieve their programme of expansion. The reason why figures are not available is partly because what information there is does not distinguish between applicants resident in Scotland and those resident in England and Wales; and partly because of the difficulty of distinguishing between applicants possessing minimum qualifications for entry to the course of their choice, and applicants not so qualified.

asked the Secretary of State for Education and Science (1) what action he intends to take in the matter of the salary claim of university technicians;

I am anxious to see an amicable settlement of the pay claim for university laboratory technicians, which will provide a fair result in line with the Government's prices and incomes policy. But I do not think that it would be appropriate for me to intervene at present.

Since one of the universities has stated that the delay has resulted from the Ministry wanting longer to consider the claim, can my right hon. Friend now state what his own attitude is, particularly as many of these highly skilled technicians are receiving £12 2s. a week, before stoppages, when they could be earning far more than that packing cornflakes?

No, Sir. I should not like to state what my position is because, as Minister, I do not have any part in these negotiations. They are negotiations between the Committee of Vice-Chancellors and the unions.

Is the right hon. Gentleman satisfied with the adequacy of the negotiating machinery in this particular dispute?

I should prefer not to make a comment on that. I am perfectly well aware that the union—the Association of Scientific Workers—has some very strong complaint against the machinery, as well as against the offer made to them on 24th August by the Vice-Chancellors, but while the matter is to so large a degree sub judice I would prefer not to be drawn further.

asked the Secretary of State for the Home Department what is his policy regarding the operation by shops of a five-day week; and if he will make a statement.

It is for the individual shopkeeper to decide whether to operate a five-day trading week. Some difficulties in the way of doing so have been removed by the provisions of the Shops (Early Closing Days) Act 1965.

In any future legislation, will the Home Secretary and his Department have regard to the small shopkeeper who might desire to give to the public a more adequate service than five days a week? Will the hon. Gentleman see that no restrictions are placed on this desire?

When the views of the trade on our booklet "Retail Trading Hours" are known we will, of course, take into consideration what the hon. and gallant Gentleman has just said.

But will the Under-Secretary make it absolutely plain that, subject to the proper control of working hours of individual shop workers, the longer shops keep open and the later shops keep open for the benefit of the customer, and the more they compete, the better?

It is up to the shopkeeper to decide for how many hours he keeps open, as long as the assistants are protected.

asked the Secretary of State for the Home Department what plans he has to encourage a wider dispersal of immigrants throughout the United Kingdom.

I have been asked to reply, since this is a matter for which I have a special responsibility.

Can my hon. Friend saw what consultations he has had on this subject with local authorities throughout the United Kingdom, and would it not have been better to have given in the White Paper issued a short time ago some indication of the response of local authorities?

There have been discussions with the local authority associations, and these are continuing. If my hon. Friend has any particular suggestion to make, I would be delighted to hear from him.

asked the Secretary of State for the Colonies how many terrorist attacks have taken place in Aden during the past year; and how many people have been killed and injured as a result of them.

There have been 255 terrorist incidents in Aden State since 1st October, 1964, resulting in 29 persons being killed and 201 injured.

Can the Secretary of State say whether there has been any improvement that he can detect since the suspension of the Aden Constitution? In view of the really rather grave figures he has announced, and the reprehensible activities of the so-called National Liberation Front, will he accept that we on this side fully understand that he really had no alternative but to suspend the Aden Constitution, which action has the support of the Opposition?

One does not want to be over-optimistic too early, but it does appear that since the date to which the hon. Gentleman has referred there has been a reduction in the number of terrorist attempts. They have continued, but, so far, fortunately, the recent attempts have been abortive, and a number of leaders of the terrorist movement have now been put into detention, and we consider that there is reason to believe that the improvement will continue.

Will the Minister also take into account that there are hon. Members on this side of the House and in his own party—his Parliamentary Private Secretary, indeed, resigned when he saw what the Labour Party policy—

Order. The hon. Gentleman is getting on to a Question which is on the Order Paper, addressed to the Prime Minister.

Very well.

asked the Secretary of State for the Colonies if he will make a statement on the constitutional proposals for Mauritius.

The report of the Constitutional Conference in September was published on 21st October as Cmnd. Paper No. 2797. The main proposal is that, if the conditions set out in the White Paper are met, Mauritius will achieve independence about the end of 1966. With permission, I will publish in the OFFICIAL REPORT a summary of the proposals.

While congratulating the Secretary of State on the result of this conference, and particularly on the degree of safeguards there are for minorities, may I ask him to bear in mind that when a country changes from a monarchical to a republican constitution, these safeguards can be swept away? This has happened in other Commonwealth countries in the past. Will the right hon. Gentleman bear this in mind with regard to Mauritius?

I am grateful to the hon. Member for his remarks. This Constitution is unique, I think, among constitutions in the number of safeguards it contains. We are satisfied that, as far as practicable, everything has been done to safeguard the basic freedoms. I know of nothing to suggest that any of the main political parties would wish in any way to depart from the spirit of the Constitution.

Is my right hon. Friend aware that all parties in the island want the electoral commission to go out as quickly as possible? Can he say when the commission will go, and what its composition will be?

If my hon. Friend will put down a Question at a later stage, I will tell him the membership of the commission. I anticipate that it will include three Members, and I am already having discussions with a view to deciding exactly who those three representatives shall be.

asked the Secretary of State for the Colonies whether he will make a statement on the recent visit of the Under-Secretary of State to Gibraltar; and what action is now being taken to sustain the economy of the Colony.

Accompanied by my hon. Friends the Parliamentary Under-Secretaries of State for Defence for the Army and for the Navy, I visited Gibraltar from 14th to 16th September to examine with the Governor and others concerned questions of land and housing which affect both the Ministry of Defence and the civil economy of Gibraltar. We also met members of the Study Group who are preparing a comprehensive development plan for the Gibraltar Government and discussed the possible implications for the Services of the Study Group's proposals for development.

Is my hon. Friend aware that there is a considerable amount of feeling in Gibraltar that there has been a year of dithering over the protection of the people of this loyal Colony and that they have a right to expect protection and support from the Government? Will she speed up the work of the Study Group?

As I should suppose my hon. Friend would know, the Study Group was appointed by the Gibraltar Government and is working on their direction. It would be foolish for us to intervene until the Gibraltar Government had had an opportunity to discuss the proposals.

asked the Secretary of State for the Colonies if he will make a statement on Gibraltar.

There has been no change in the general nature of the restrictions imposed by the Spanish authorities at the frontier with Gibraltar from those set out in the White Paper presented last April. Since mid-July delays to vehicles entering and leaving Gibraltar have been reduced from approximately one hour for each vehicle to an average of between 10 and 30 minutes for each vehicle.

Can the Minister say what steps Her Majesty's Government are taking to initiate talks with Spain? Can she also say when it is proposed to give constitutional advances to Gibraltar from the present interim constitution which will guarantee that Gibraltar and the Gibraltarians will remain forever British?

The hon. Member has a Question down to my right hon. Friend the Foreign Secretary for answer today. On the second part of his supplementary question, he will have seen the statement of 7th October, by the elected members of the Gibraltar Legislative Council which recognises that precipitate action at present would not be in the interests of the people of Gibraltar.

Is the hon. Lady aware that this is not good enough? The Gibraltar crisis has gone on now for a year. Is it not time that Her Majesty's Government, which through the actions and speeches of the Prime Minister were in some measure responsible for precipitating this crisis, should at least take some action to bring it to an end?

As the hon. Member, who has come rather recently to this field, will be aware, his own Government when in office had a ten-year crisis in Gibraltar and it was very largely their actions and the tactless way in which they introduced the present Constitution which was responsible for the crisis we are in now.

asked the First Secretary and Secretary of State for Economic Affairs if he will now authorise the National Board for Prices and Incomes to select the price arrangements and wage settlements it wishes to examine.

No, Sir.

As the right hon. Gentleman, I think rightly, has confidence in the Prices and Incomes Board, would it not be logical to give them the right of choice as well as recommendation and to produce an atmosphere of greater impartiality and independence for the Board?

In view of the hon. Member's use of the word "rightly" in commending what I have been doing, may I ask him to convey that to some members of his own Front Bench? On the second part of his supplementary question, the answer is still "No" because the whole policy right from the beginning, agreed by everyone except the Opposition Front Bench, has proceeded on the basis that the Government in the end should decide which cases should go to the Board.

asked the First Secretary of State and Secretary of State for Economic Affairs if in the context of the National Plan he will take steps to ensure that the provision of colour television has a very low priority.

I will see it gets the priority it deserves.

Would my right hon. Friend not agree that it shows an odd sense of priorities to speed the bringing in of colour television while limiting the growth of public expenditure in the field of education and the social services and in particular, as shown by the National Plan, limiting aid to underdeveloped countries?

I do not know who has this odd sense of priorities.

asked the President of the Board of Trade what reports he has had as to the success or otherwise of changing the Bank Holiday week to the end of August; and if he will make a statement.

The change resulted in some easing of the pressure on transport and holiday accommodation at the beginning of August, but seems to have had little effect in replacing earlier main holidays with main holidays in September.

Will the hon. Gentleman keep an open mind on this question? Does he visualise the possibility of reverting to the original practice if there is a failure in the years ahead? I ask this with the full knowledge that he may have no responsibility in the matter within 12 months.

Oh.

In keeping with our promises in October, 1964, we have planned for the extension of the Bank Holidays for the next four years.

asked the President of the Board of Trade whether he will take steps to control the import of refrigerators, in view of the present threat to the home market and consequently to the United Kingdom export potential.

No, imports of domestic refrigerators are subject to a duty of 4½ per cent. from European Free Trade Association countries and 12 per cent. from other countries outside the Commonwealth Preference Area, and all imports are at present subject to the 10 per cent. temporary import charge. Imports still amount to only about 8 per cent. of the home market and are less in value than our exports.

Is the hon. Gentleman aware that imports amount to £1½ million for the present year? Is he further aware that exporters' rebate in their own country amounts to 11 per cent. in the field of compressors and 6·6 per cent. for domestic refrigerator cabinets? Does he not think this excessive and will he undertake to re-examine the matter?

The hon. Lady is referring to imports of Italian refrigerators. The British Government have made known to the Italian Government our doubts about the level of export rebate on goods containing iron and steel. This is now subject to the result of a case brought by the Commission of the European Economic Community before the Community's Court. We are awaiting the outcome of that consideration.

asked the President of the Board of Trade whether he will consult Great Britain's European Free Trade Association partners with a view to altering the position whereby under Article 6 of the Stockholm Convention certain countries have retained customs duty for revenue purposes, thus making difficult the export of British motor vehicles to a number of markets.

The action taken by these countries is permissible under Article 6 of the Convention. But my right hon. Friend agrees that it is contrary to the spirit of E.F.T.A., and we have made our dissatisfaction clear. We shall continue to pursue this issue as the opportunity arises.

Would the hon. Gentleman agree that 30 per cent. of the possible benefit from the E.F.T.A. Agreement is lost by the operation of Article 6? Has he pressed for an improvement in this position to be reached at an early date to improve our own export position?

On every opportunity this is being done.

Does not the Minister agree that there is very little likelihood of getting this sort of co-operation while we still have a temporary—I repeat ternporary—10 per cent. import surcharge on our imported goods?

No. This does not directly concern this Question and has not been brought to our attention when we have made our dissatisfaction clear on the matter.

asked the President of the Board of Trade if he will now take steps to apply to British shipowners building new tonnage in the United Kingdom the special credits at five and a half per cent. granted to foreign owners ordering new tonnage in this country.

No, Sir. But I am well aware of the attitude of the shipowners on this issue and I expect that they will refer to it in the general submission they are making to the Government.

Does the hon. Gentleman agree that the British Merchant Navy is engaged in an industry in which we lead the world? Does he think that the long-term implications which this will have will mean that British shipowners will be denied something which is given to foreign interests in the nature of cheap credit?

This does not affect the competitive position of British shipowners. Credit on these terms was available in foreign countries before these easier and cheaper credit terms were introduced in Britain.

Is it not anomalous that foreign shipowners should receive this very useful benefit and British shipowners be deprived of it?

I must remind my right hon. Friend that these credits were available in foreign countries before we introduced them. What this has done is to enable our industry to capture some of these orders which previously were going abroad.

asked the President of the Board of Trade if agreement has been reached on the import of cotton textiles for 1966 onwards; and if he will make a statement.

Our proposals for the regulation of imports of cotton textiles after the end of this year were sent formally to overseas countries early in September. Discussion of these proposals cannot be completed in time to bring agreed arrangements into operation from the beginning of 1966. My right hon. Friend has, therefore, informed other countries that an interim scheme will be necessary in order to keep trade moving. This, of course, is without prejudice to the eventual settlement.

Will my hon. Friend bear in mind the possibility of unilateral action at the Hong Kong end of the negotiations? Will he ensure that, if there is any unilateral action, his Ministry will have firm proposals ready to deal with any torpedoeing of this sensible plan of gearing imports to the efficiency of the whole industry?

Yes. We have all these considerations in mind.

Will the Minister of State think again about the reports that there will be a built-in or automatic increase for foreign and Commonwealth imports in future years? This is something which the cotton industry and the Cotton Board dislike very much.

Yes. I would prefer not to say anything more at this stage, but we certainly have that matter in mind in the considerations which are now under way.

asked the President of the Board of Trade if he will state his plans to increase trade between Aberdeen and Northern Europe.

The steady increase in trade within E.F.T.A. between the United Kingdom and Northern Europe should offer ample opportunities for exporters in Aberdeen. The export services of the Board of Trade are always available to help them. I hope that they will take full advantage of the British Trade Fair to be held in Oslo next year.

Does not the Minister of State realise that the southeast of England in the matter of exports to Europe is very much better treated than the northeast of Scotland, which is penalised? Will my hon. Friend take steps to remove this disparity and to increase trade, industry and commerce from the north-east of Scotland to Europe?

I remind my hon. and learned Friend of what I said in my original Answer, that a British Trade Fair is to be held in Oslo in the spring of 1966 in which it is hoped that Scottish industries will play a full part. It is already known that three firms from the Aberdeen area engaged in the shipbuilding industry will be prominently exhibiting.

asked the Minister of Transport to what extent restrictions on motorway and trunk road schemes will make idle road-making equipment and thus lead to the increased cost of such schemes.

Only to a relatively small extent, which is unlikely in itself to influence road construction prices.

Have not lessons been learned from the stopping of the M.1 and of the railing programme on roads? Is it not dangerous to do this?

We want to maintain continuity of work. In fact, contracts to a higher value than last year had already been placed before the deferment programme. In spite of the deferment programme, we reckon we shall maintain continuity of work and we have no evidence of the point made by the hon. Gentleman.

asked the Minister of Transport under what circumstances Lord Hinton resigned his post as Special Adviser on Transport Planning.

Lord Hinton left the Ministry when he had completed the work my right hon. Friend had asked him to undertake.

The Minister should realise that the reception of that Answer proves how doubtfully we regard it. Is it not a fact that Lord Hinton's report was thoroughly unsatisfactory to the Government? Is it not time that the Minister made a statement in the House about where the Government stand?

If the Answer is received with any doubt, it is only because hon. Members have not been following what has been going on. When my right hon. Friend announced the appointment of Lord Hinton, he announced that he would be appointed as a temporary civil servant for a limited period. That was what was said at the very beginning. That is what has happened. Lord Hinton has completed his studies and my right hon. Friend will make a statement shortly.

asked the Minister of Transport what report on the integration of transport was submitted by Lord Hinton before his resignation; and what is the Government's policy towards it.

My right hon. Friend has received a number of reports from Lord Hinton, which are being taken into account in the development of policies for the co-ordination of transport.

That is a lot better. We are getting nearer the truth. I must press the Minister and reaffirm that we want an early statement. May I ask him a related question? We are given to understand that Lord Hinton will still serve on the Transport Advisory Council. This has been announced in public. How can Lord Hinton do that in his present employment?

Lord Hinton remains a member of the Transport Advisory Council. Like other members of the Transport Advisory Council, he has other occupations and he will be attending from time to time. He has completed the full-time study for which he was appointed as originally announced and, as has been repeated by my right hon. Friend in the House half a dozen times to the right hon. Gentleman, a statement will be made shortly.

Surely this is most unsatisfactory? Does not the Parliamentary Secretary realise that the House was promised a statement founded on what Lord Hinton had to say about the integration of transport? As the Government have sacked Lord Beeching and are now disowning Lord Hinton, where has the problem of the integration of transport now got to?

There are some limits to the inaccurate and untrue statements which can be made. The hon. Gentleman knows perfectly well that the Government did not sack Lord Beeching. Lord Beeching asked to be relieved of his duties—

Oh.

Order. We are getting a little wide of the Question.

My right hon. Friend has promised a statement, and he will make a statement. That statement will come very soon.