asked the Secretary of State for Wales what is his latest estimate of the date of publication of the Plan for Wales, the formulation and implementation of which was assigned to his Department in the original allocation of responsibilities in November, 1964.

My right hon. Friend has extended the field to be covered by this Plan and does not now expect to have it ready for publication before the end of the year.

Does the Minister not recognise that there must be many business decisions and local authority decisions awaiting the forecasts and recommendations to be contained in this Plan, and that there is an overwhelming case for speeding up the publication of the Plan under the present uncertainties?

It is essential that every care should be taken in drawing up this Plan. At least 15 Government Departments have to be consulted, as well as the Welsh Economic Council, the University of Wales, both sides of industry, the Welsh Tourist Board, and others.

The right hon. Gentleman will be aware that, in the National Plan last year, the Government said that 140,000 agricultural workers should come from the country as a whole, of which, I understand, 5,000 are to come from Wales. In view of the necessity for maintaining confidence in the farming industry, will the right hon. Gentleman see that a realistic figure is put in any Plan for Wales?

Just on a point of information, Mr. Speaker, I am not yet a Privy Councillor, but I am quite willing!

Is the Plan to be revised in the light of the Prime Minister's announcement yesterday and in the light of the current economic situation? If so, what changes does the Minister of State expect?

The hon. and learned Gentleman must not be too pessimistic. This will be a realistic Plan holding out good opportunities for the Principality.

asked the Secretary of State for Wales how many houses were completed by the Cwmbran Development Corporation for private sale during the last 12 months; how many of those completed now stand vacant; what are the price range and ground rents of the vacant houses; and what research into potential consumers' needs and financial means took place before these houses were built.

In the last twelve months 60 houses have been completed for sale of which 37 are vacant. Prices range from £3,800 to £4,450 and ground rents from £20 to £27 per year. The Corporation's decision to build was based on inquiries received by it.

Is it not somewhat disappointing that so many houses should be vacant, in view of the fact that private builders in the area have no difficulty in disposing of their houses? Is it not necessary that a warning should be given to the Corporation to make certain that it is investigating in depth the nature and type of house which should be put up in the area?

My hon. Friend will appreciate that there is always an element of risk in building houses for sale. The Corporation made the best assessment that it could, according to the demand. If houses cannot be sold, they will be available for letting.

asked the Secretary of State for Wales what is the present programme of the Cwmbran Development Corporation for future building of houses for sale; at what maximum price and maximum ground rent it is intended to offer houses for sale; and whether the programme is being reviewed, in view of the tardy sales of Cwmbran Development Corporation houses so far.

To provide a balanced community and to meet demand in the area, the Corporation has plans for building 118 higher-income group houses for sale. As a first stage it has proposed building 29 houses at prices of about £8,500 and ground rents of £52 per year and my right hon. Friend is considering this.

Would the Minister consider that, in Monmouthshire, we are in an ocean of obsolescent housing and that to cater for income groups of this kind is having an odd sense of priorities, particularly when he has already indicated that there are houses of very much less value unable to be sold in the area?

The Corporation is confident—and I share its confidence, following a recent visit—that industrial development in South Monmouthshire will give rise to a demand for houses for business executives, and it would be in the interests of the new town to meet some of the demand. Having regard to the reference to tardy sales, it is only fair to recognise that the total number of houses built for sale by the Corporation since its inception is 276. Of that total, 239 have been sold.

asked the Secretary of State for Wales if he is aware that persons in Wales who are in receipt of National Assistance are thereby disqualified from any rates rebates; why this is; and what steps he will take to improve the scheme.

My right hon. Friend has nothing to add to the reply which the hon. Member received from my right hon. Friend the Minister of Housing and Local Government last Tuesday.

Is the hon. Gentleman aware that there seems to be a good deal of misunderstanding about this on the part of the recipients of National Assistance who have heavily rated houses? They seem to think it strange that persons of such small resources should derive no benefit from a scheme of this kind.

Whoever has the misunderstanding, the hon. Gentleman ought to understand that when full provision for the rates is made in the assessment of the Board's weekly allowances it would be wrong to make further provision again.

asked the Secretary of State for Wales if he will list the local authorities whose urban road schemes on which forward planning and preparation could start in the near future which have a total value of approximately £81.5 million, together with the approximate value for each authority.

No, Sir. My right hon. Friend has written to the hon. Member.

While appreciating some of the difficulties of the Minister's Department, may I ask whether he can give some assurance that every attempt will be made to expedite the provision of the details?

We will move with our customary speed.

asked the Secretary of State for Wales whether he will arrange for a survey of public forms and documents in current use in Wales to be made with a view to their translation into the Welsh language as soon as possible.

I would refer my hon. Friend to the answer which I gave him on 1st July, 1966. I hope to have the result of this investigation some time next month.

Can the right hon. Gentleman give some indication of the nature of the documents and forms to be translated and of the numbers involved?

It is not possible to give this information until the results of the survey are available. I will have discussions with my colleagues who are responsible and, following this, it will be possible to determine what forms can be translated in advance of legislation and to assess which of them are in fair demand.

Is the right hon. Gentleman contemplating a Welsh edition of Erskine May?

No, Sir, but if such an edition were to be published, my hon. Friend would not be able to read it.

Is it not possible that in less than an hour from now this issue will be tied up?

asked the Secretary of State for Wales whether, in circumstances where it is necessary to await legislation to validate the use of certain forms and public documents in the Welsh language in Wales, he will authorise the preparation of adequate and suitable translations of such forms and documents in anticipation of such legislation.

I will certainly bear my hon. Friend's suggestion in mind, but I cannot at this stage anticipate the extent to which the many Ministers who issue forms in Wales will find it practicable to do so in Welsh.

I appreciate the complexity of this matter, involving as it does the mass of legislation passed since the Act of Union of 1542, but can my right hon. Friend give us any information about when this legislation is likely to be introduced?

As my hon. Friend said, this is a complex issue, but good progress is being made, and I hope that it will be possible to introduce the Bill during the next Session, and before then to make some of the administrative changes recommended by the Committee.

May I take it from that that the Government intend to bring in a permissive all-embracing Bill to give effect to the Hughes Parry Report, which is supported by all parties in this House?

Our purpose is to introduce a Bill in due course, and work on the Bill is now proceeding. I cannot give details at this stage, but it will be on the basis of the statement made by my right hon. Friend the Member for Llanelly (Mr. James Griffiths) in the Welsh Grand Committee on 14th December last.

Will the Secretary of State accept from this side of the House that we shall certainly support the Government in any legislation which they bring forward with regard to equal validity in law of the Welsh language? We will not go as far as the hon. and learned Member for Montgomery (Mr. Hooson) has gone and support everything in the Hughes Parry Report.

It is the principle of equal validity which has been accepted by the Government.

asked the Secretary of State for Wales how many houses in tender have been approved by his Department to the latest convenient date this year; how this compares with the corresponding period last year; and how the estimate for 1966 compares with last year.

Up to 16th July, 4.604 public sector houses have been approved compared with 6,304 in the same period of last year. But a number of very large schemes are on the point of being approved and my right hon. Friends expects the total for 1966 to exceed that for 1965.

Does my hon. Friend consider the target for this year to be sufficient for Wales? Wales not only has a lot of old property, but needs more houses for workers coming in because of new office development and industry.

The initial estimate for the number of houses in the public sector under construction at the end of June was 13,553, compared with 12,287 in the same period last year.

asked the Secretary of State for Wales how many housing loans have been granted by local authorities in Wales this year; what is the total amount; and whether he will extend the categories of applicants for loans in order to stimulate the sale of houses generally.

During the first four months 822 loans, totalling £1,272,000, were granted. My right hon. Friend is ready to consider any representations that authorities may wish to make about the categories of persons who may apply for loans.

Will my hon. Friend consider extending the category of applicants to those who wish to buy houses built between the wars, which is excluded at the moment?

My right hon. Friend will be pleased to give every assistance in this matter, and paragraph 4 of Circular 16 of 1966 gives an assurance that special circumstances will be considered.

asked the Secretary of State for Wales what arrangements exist for co-operation on matters of common concern between the Welsh Economic Council and the South-West Regional Economic Planning Council.

The two Councils exchange information regularly and have undertaken co-operative action on the Severn Bridge study. In addition, my right hon. Friend, the First Secretary of State ensures that there is full exchange of views and information between all Planning Councils.

In the light of the Severn Bridge, with the increased trade links between the two regions, and in the light, too, of the Severnside announcements which will straddle both regions, would not my hon. Friend agree that there is a need for more formalised links between the Welsh and South-West Economic Regions? Will my hon. Friend consider the establishment of a standing committee, composed of representatives from both regions, so that there can be co-operation laterally, rather than always going to London under the aegis of the Department of Economic Affairs?

I am satisfied that there is good co-operation between ourselves and the South-West Economic Council, just as there is between Wales and the West Midlands, and between Wales and the North-West. If the proposal recommended by my hon. Friend is thought wise, I shall not hesitate to follow it.

Will the hon. Gentleman do everything that he can to make his Welsh friends co-operate with my West Country friends?

The hon. Gentleman has been here long enough to know that cooperation is a characteristic of the Welsh.

asked the Secretary of State for Wales whether he will publish as a White Paper the account of his latest meetings with the Welsh Tourist Board.

I met the Chairman of the Welsh Tourist Board on two occasions recently, when representations were made to me about the position of the Board and I am considering these in consultation with my colleagues.

In view of the bad effect which the Selective Employment Tax will have on tourism in Wales, will the right hon. Gentleman say whether this is a matter which he proposes to discuss with the Welsh Tourist Board?

I have already had discussions with the Board. The hon. Gentleman chooses to overlook what is being done to help tourism in Wales. As he knows, the industry will be eligible for substantial assistance under the Industrial Development Bill, under which most of Wales will now be scheduled. I refer the hon. Gentleman to the statement made by my right hon. Friend the Prime Minister yesterday when he announced a new scheme under which development loan assistance can be offered for the building, expansion, or modernisation of hotels which can show that they cater for overseas visitors.

Is the right hon. Gentleman aware that a large part of the North-West of Wales is outside a development area and, therefore, will not benefit from some of the things which the Government are doing? Will he also realise that at the present time the Welsh Tourist Board is most upset about the whole position with regard to the future of tourism in Wales?

I do not agree with the hon. Gentleman that the Board is as upset as all that. Certainly it has points to make, and it has made them to me, and I am considering them in consultation with my Ministerial colleagues. I shall be meeting the Board again very soon for further discussions.

asked the Secretary of State for Wales whether he will publish as a White Paper the findings of the technical survey for the proposed Mid-Wales new town.

The report of the consultants engaged to advise on the location and feasibility of a new town in Mid-Wales is expected to be published by Her Majesty's Stationery Office on 28th July, 1966.

asked the Secretary of State for Education and Science if he will introduce legislation to increase his control over the setting up of privately-owned institutions for adult education, particularly where such institutions offer courses to Commonwealth and colonial students.

No, Sir, and I do not think that in any case it would be practicable to distinguish between institutions according to whether they might offer courses to overseas students.

I thank my right hon. Friend for that answer, but is he aware that there are a number of tutorial institutions in this country which are attracting Commonwealth and colonial students here on the basis of prospectuses which do not match performance. is not this bad both for Commonwealth relations and for education? Will he consult his right hon. Friend the Secretary of State for Commonwealth Relations to see whether increased surveillance can be exercised over these institutions?

I have no evidence to suggest that the large majority of private institutions which operate in this field have abused their position, but I will most willingly consult my right hon. Friend on the point that my hon. Friend has raised.

Will the right hon. Gentleman bear in mind the fact that there might be a good case for saying that the provisions of Part III of the 1944 Act, which is concerned with the registration and inspection of independent schools, should be extended to a number of institutions which cater for pupils above school-leaving age?

I do not agree, as of now, with what the right hon. Gentleman says, but certainly my right hon. Friend and I will take advice on it.

asked the Secretary of State for Education and Science what progress he has now made in the establishment of new negotiation machinery for reviewing the pay of university teachers.

I am in touch with representatives of the parties concerned, and hope to reach a decision soon.

Does my right hon. Friend intend to give the same status to the appropriate trade union—the Association of University Teachers—as he will give to the University Grants Committee when the new machinery is established?

I am aware that my hon. Friend is an active and notable member of the union to which he has referred. Nevertheless, I ask him to await the proposals I am putting to the A.U.T., Vice-Chancellors and the University Grants Committee. I shall be doing this in a week or two. In fact, I am meeting the A.U.T. on Monday.

asked the Secretary of State for Education and Science whether his policy of allowing local education to fix the transfer age at 11 years or 13 years from junior to senior schools was shortand long-term in its aims.

My decision to allow an age of transfer other than 11 was explained in Circular 13/66, of which I am sending my hon. Friend a copy.

Is my right hon. Friend aware that considerable anxiety exists in the minds of many local authorities in case the Plowden Council should recommend a universal transfer age? Further, will he consider writing to local authorities and advising them how to iron out the difficulties that will arise when one authority chooses 11 years and another 13 years and they make mutual or one-sided use of each other's educational facilities?

On the first point, we had better wait and see what the Plowden Council recommends. Certainly nobody would want to take a decision about a new national age of transfer until the Council has reported—which will not be for some time. The second point is precisely the sort of point that we shall look al: whenever proposals are put to us for middle schools.

asked the Secretary of State for Education and Science when he will sanction the minor building project requested by the managers of Elstead Church of England, Aided, Primary School and by the Surrey County Council for the purpose of providing places for all the children on the roll, presently 200 increasing by 1969 to over 250, other than the 140 sub-standard places now available.

Directly a site is obtained.

May I have two assurances from the Minister—first, that the lending of further mobile classrooms to accommodate the overspill pupils will in no way prejudice the speed at which sanction is granted, and, secondly, that there will be no question of any delay as a result of the statement made yesterday by the Prime Minister? The hon. Member will be aware that a site has been obtained.

I am aware that the local education authority is negotiating this purchase, and I think that the hon. Member can be assured on both points.

asked the Secretary of State for Education and Science if he will take steps by legislation or otherwise to ensure that local education authorities consider letters from his department.

No, Sir.

In view of the importance of the Minister's views and his change of attitude about the three-tier system of comprehensive education, may I ask him whether he is aware that the Socialist chairman of the Liverpool Education Authority deliberately suppressed letters from his Ministry? Is this not another example of the split personality of the party opposite?

I am aware of nothing of the sort. It would be wrong and foolish of me to try to instruct local education authorities how they should deal with correspondence coming from my Department. They are quite capable of making that decision for themselves. As for the letters to which the hon. Member has referred, these were not formal letters addressed to the authority but informal letters from one of my officers to an officer in the authority, and I have no complaint of any kind about the way in which the authority chose, in its own wisdom, to deal with those letters.

asked the Secretary of State for Education and Science whether he will make sure that he receives the considered views of the local education authority of Liverpool on middle-schools' schemes for that city before giving his consent to any plans for the reorganisation of secondary education in Liverpool.

asked the Secretary of State for Education and Science what further action he proposes to bring to the attention of Liverpool City Council the possibility of basing its comprehensive reorganisation upon transfer to secondary school at 12 or 13 years of age.

It is for the local education authority to decide on its proposals for the reorganisation of secondary education on comprehensive lines. I shall consider the authority's proposals with an open mind.

Does not the right hon. Gentleman agree that a three-tier system of comprehensive education might he very appropriate for the City of Liverpool and would be likely to save money in this time of economic crisis?

I have no intention of trying to dictate to the Liverpool authority or any other authority what type of comprehensive reorganisation it should submit to me in its plan. It is well Known, if only from Circular 13/66, that I am prepared to consider transfers at ages other than 11; and as to the scheme they choose to submit to me, they arc the people to judge, and I have no intention of influencing their decision.

I accept the Minister's view on this, but is not this an example of communication failure here, and if there are similar communication failures elsewhere it may make it less easy to put forward acceptable comprehensive schemes?

I do not think that there has been a failure of communication here; on the contrary, what has happened in this case is what I am extremely anxious to encourage in all cases, namely, that before authorities submit schemes there should be the greatest possible degree of informal consultation between officers of the authority and officers in my Department. That is what happened in this case. As far as I am concerned, there was no impropriety of any kind on the part of the authority, and I make no complaint of any kind against its behaviour.

Is the right hon. Gentleman aware that the incident of these letters caused considerable public scandal in Liverpool and led to a great loss of confidence in the local education authority?

There is no question of the suppression of any letters. A letter addressed by one of my officials to the chief officer of an authority can be dealt with by the authority in any way it chooses. There is no question ,of some formal communication of mine to them having been suppressed. It is up to the authority to decide how it deals with correspondence of this kind.

Is not there a special circumstance in this case, namely, that the Minister had to deal severely with the Liverpool scheme when it was put forward last year? Is it not, therefore, especially important that those in Liverpool who are concerned with making the best possible plans for the future should be properly informed about the full range of possibilities open to them?

They are perfectly fully informed without the contents of this letter necessarily having to be revealed. This letter was a letter from one of my officials in reply to an informal request for views about the possibility of 9–13 schools. This possibility is well known to the authority, and educationists in Liverpool, from the terms of Circular 13/66. There is no mystery of any kind about this.

In view of the unsatisfactory nature of that reply, I beg to give notice that I shall seek to raise this matter on the Adjournment at the earliest possible moment.

asked the Secretary of State for Education and Science what steps he proposes to take to ensure that those local authorities which submit middle school organisations for comprehensive education maintain the spirit and philosophy of the present junior school.

I hope that middle schools will develop a spirit and philosophy of their own. This will be mainly a matter for the local education authorities and teachers concerned, but if I feel that guidance is necessary I will give it.

Is the Minister aware that there is very real concern among primary school headmasters, particularly where an 8–12 scheme is envisaged, that some of the opportunities for self-expression which at present exist in the primary schools will be lost and that the children will join the "rat-race" much sooner?

No, Sir, I do not think that this view is very widely held. I believe that most people in the educational world who favour either 8–12 or 9–13 schools would think that these schools cannot be the same as junior schools. They are catering for a different age range and it is, therefore, important that they should become a type of school in their own right. I do not think that any experiments in this direction will lead to the ill consequences which my hon. Friend described.

asked the Secretary of State for Education and Science how many local education authorities have refused to submit proposals for comprehensive education; and what action he intends to take.

asked the Secretary of State for Education and Science how many local education authorities have now submitted plans for the reorganisation of secondary education; how many authorities have now asked for an extension of time; and if any authority has chosen not to reply at all.

Replies from the 162 local education authorities to Circular 10/65 are still coming in. It is therefore too early to give a definitive answer. But I shall make a detailed announcement before the House rises.

Is it not the case that a very small minority of local education authorities are deliberately seeking to defy and refuse to accept the policies of the democratically-elected Government of the country? What powers has he to bring them into line? Will he give a firm assurance that he will be prepared to use them if the authorities do not conform to national policy?

I should like to emphasise how very small this minority is. So far, only three authorities have declined to submit plans and a tiny handful of other authorities are submitting plans patently based on the retention of selection. This is a very small minority. I should not like to take any view on whether further action is needed, and if so of what kind, until I have been able to take stock of the full response to the circular, which I hope to announce to the House before we rise.

Is my right hon. Friend aware that, in many areas where the local education authority is refusing to submit proposals for going comprehensive, there is a good deal of concern and anxiety amongst the parents that the local authorities are behaving in such a stupid and reactionary manner? Is he aware that, for example, there is deep concern in Croydon that the local council is refusing to cooperate with the Department?

I am well aware of the facts which my hon. Friend has mentioned. It is true that, both in the very small number of areas which have declined to submit plans and even more in areas like the one which he has in mind, which have submitted plans which are patently not comprehensive, there is strong feeling, not only among parents but also very often among the teachers, at this failure to accept the policy of Circular 10/65.

Would the right hon. Gentleman not agree that such a progressive education authority as Croydon, which is often taken as an example for education throughout the country, is well capable of taking decisions for its education for the future, and that he should see that such authorities are entitled to do so?

I understand that there is a certain amount of disagreement in Croydon as to what should be done, but I propose to make no statement on the Croydon position as no Croydon scheme has yet been formally submitted.

Will the right hon. Gentleman repudiate the lack of regard—indeed contempt—shown by his hon. Friend the Member for Fife, West (Mr. William Hamilton) for the legitimate concerns of democratically elected local authorities?

I will certainly not repudiate him. What he was saying is what has been long accepted in this country—that there is an expectation that, in educational policy, when there is a declaration of national intent, this will be carried through by central and local government in co-operation.

In view of the deep concern in my constituency about this matter, may I give notice that I intend to raise this matter on the Adjournment as early as possible?

Order. I hope that notice will be given in the conventional fashion.

asked the Secretary of State for Education and Science if he is satisfied with progress being made with development of comprehensive education in the East Riding of Yorkshire; and if he will make a statement.

Yes, Sir. There are already two comprehensive schools in the East Riding and two others are being provided in current building programmes. The authority are expected to submit their proposals under Circular 10/65 by the end of this month.

asked the Secretary of State for Education and Science what representations he has received on schemes for the comprehensive development of secondary schools in the area of the Inner London Education Authority; and what reply he has sent.

The Inner London Education Authority has published Notices of nine reorganisation schemes since it came into being on 1st April, 1965. Representations have been received in four cases. Three proposals have been approved and I hope to reach a decision on the fourth shortly. There is still a month to run during which representations can be made to the Department in respect of the other proposals.

Will my right hon. Friend bear in mind, when he receives representations criticising these proposals, that there is a great number of inarticulate people who want comprehensive education in London?

I will bear that in mind, and I am happy to say that all those who want this are by no means inarticulate.

asked the Secretary of State for Education and Science to what extent universities in the United Kingdom are assisting with industrial research.

In many different directions and on an increasingly wide scale. The universities are aware that the Government greatly welcome this development, of which I am sending my hon. Friend further particulars.

Would not my hon. Friend agree that in this field the new redbrick universities are playing an invaluable part?

I certainly agree. Indeed, the newer and the older universities are taking an increasing part in research projects undertaken directly for industry, and at a regional level they are taking an important part in the deliberations of regional economic planning councils.

Would the hon. Gentleman recognise that the more work the universities do on industrial research the more important it becomes that there is an adequate relationship between the Ministry of Technology and his Department in this respect? Is he aware that there is a growing uneasiness that the present set-up is not right?

That is not so. There are the happiest and most fruitful relationships between my right hon. Friend's Department and that of the Minister of Technology. My right hon. Friend the Minister of Technology and the research stations for which he is responsible place important industrial contracts with universities. In the last year, the value of such contracts has more than doubled.

asked the Secretary of State for Education and Science what discussions he has had with technical colleges and colleges of further education on preliminary teacher-training courses.

None, Sir. There is already extensive provision in technical colleges and evening institutes for G.C.E. and other courses leading to qualifications accepted for entry to teacher training.

Would my hon. Friend bear in mind the need to encourage schemes for teacher-training for mature students with very little formal education behind them and particularly the need of such schemes for financial assistance to such students?

Where there is a demand, local education authorities are normally able to provide G.C.E. and other courses for prospective student teachers of the type my hon. Friend described, including, of course, married women during the day and those in employment in the evenings. In addition, colleges of education may, if the area training organisation agrees, admit exceptionally to teacher training, exactly the kind of aspirants whom my hon. Friend mentioned.

asked the Secretary of State for Education and Science whether he will make it a condition of grants to the Arts Council for next year that the Council earmark a sum of money to support the children's theatre.

I share the hon. Member's concern for children's theatre, and welcome the fact that the Arts Council has out of the current year's allocation already offered grants towards three of our children's theatres, the Theatre Centre, the Unicorn Theatre and the Westminister Children's Theatre. The whole question of financial support for such enterprises in the future is now being examined.

asked the Secretary of State for Education and Science what steps he is taking to encourage schools to accept visits from the Marriage Guidance Council.

It is for the local education authorities and the schools to decide whether to avail themselves of the Council's help. I am glad to note that many already do so.

Is my hon. Friend aware that this organisation does a tremendous amount of good work when it is allowed to go into schools and give pre-marriage courses? Is he also aware that a number of local education authorities seem most reluctant to allow the Marriage Guidance Council to go into schools, even though the headmasters may be in favour?

On the first point, I am of course, aware of the work of the Council in schools and other educational establishments, and I recognise that it helps to meet the needs expressed in the Newsom Report. It must be emphasised, however, that as my right hon. Friend does not direct what the schools shall teach or how it should be taught, he must leave it to the local education authorities and schools to decide, in the light of their circumstances, the extent to which use is made of the Marriage Guidance Council.

Would the hon. Gentleman take note of the fact that by no means all of us are happy about tiny teen-age mini-marriages, which are so frequently followed by early twenties divorce? Would he further note that the Marriage Guidance Council more properly has a two-pronged action—partly for engaged couples and partly for those whose marriages have gone on the rocks, neither of whom one would hope to find in schools, whose pupils can be more properly guided by the schools' medical officers?

What the hon. Lady says adds point to the fact that this is very much a personal and local business, to be determined in the light of the judgment of the local authority.

asked the Secretary of State for Education and Science whether he will increase the amount of dependant's income which is disregarded in assessing the amount of grant payable to students training to be teachers.

No, Sir.

While not expecting to receive a particularly favourable reply now that stop-go has been replaced by stop-stop, may I ask the Minister to bear in mind the fact that the f100 disregard for a wife's income has not been increased since 1962? Will he consider this, particularly for mature students, who often find that they have a substantial drop in their income when they become student teachers?

The grant arrangements for teacher training students generally are the same as those for all other students in higher education. My right hon. Friend and I appreciate the difficulties of the older student, the married man with family responsibilities, who is living on a grant. However, whereas his previous income was appreciably in excess of the total grants, he may be paid an additional grant of up to £100 a year.

asked the Secretary of State for Education and Science whether he will now state his policy regarding the future of the direct grant schools within the Greater London area.

My policy for direct grant schools, which applies to those in the Greater London area as to those in the rest of the country, is explained in Circular 10/65 of which I am sending the hon. Gentleman a copy.

Does the right hon. Gentleman recognise that he has very special responsibilities towards these schools? Will he reject the political prejudice of his hon. Friends— [Interruption.]—both in this House and across the road in County Hall, and recognise that these direct-grant schools have a unique role to play in our educational system and that they should be supported rather than suppressed?

There is no doubt that there is a good deal of prejudice on all sides in respect of this kind of argument. The policy for direct-grant schools is perfectly clear, and I have no doubt that it is the right one. I have asked the authorities on the one hand and the governors of the direct-grant schools on the other to get together and consult about how these schools might play their part in a system of secondary reorganisation. There are a number of parts of the country where this is occurring, and I am sure that this is the right way to proceed.

Would my right hon. Friend agree that the Conservative Party does not help these matters by publishing confidential documents in Conservative newspapers?

Would the right hon. Gentleman accept that there is very deep concern felt by many people who are not unsympathetic in principle to a measure of secondary reorganisation—deep concern about the future of these schools, which are mostly of very high academic standards and to which admission is in no way dependent on accident of birth? My hon. Friends and I, also, are greatly concerned about these schools.

I believe that all hon. Members are deeply concerned about the future of these schools. That is not in dispute. However, there is no possible single national solution to the problem of the direct grant schools. They differ so much within themselves. I am sure that the right way to proceed is to leave this matter for local negotiation between the schools and the local authorities.

asked the Secretary of State for Education and Science whether he will make a statement with regard to the establishment of an agricultural college for Wales.

As my right hon. Friend made clear in his reply to the hon. and learned Member for Montgomery (Mr. Hooson) on 16th December of last year, this is now a matter for the Welsh Joint Education Committee, which has not yet put a proposal to him which he could consider for a building programme.

While thanking my hon. Friend for that reply, may I ask his Ministry to give every encouragement and leadership to the deep and widespread feeling in Wales that such a national institution should be established in Wales? Can he give an indication of whether it will be centrally situated and what negotiations are taking place between the Welsh Joint Education Committee and the Department?

My Department is always very ready to assist this Joint Committee in everything it undertakes. Assistance is now being given to the Committee on this project. As to the proposal centrally to site this proposed college, I take my hon. Friend's point, but it must be part of the building programme as a whole. I am glad to tell my hon. Friend that the Welsh Joint Education Committee is due to have a meeting with the other bodies concerned on 25th July—

Hear, hear.

Order.

I am delighted that this pronouncement should receive such universal approval—or is it because my right hon. Friend the First Secretary has taken his place on the Government Front Bench? [Interruption.]

Order. The Minister must complete his answer quickly.

I was saying that the Committee will meet other bodies on 25th July, and officers of my Department will be there as observers.