asked the Secretary of State for Commonwealth Relations if he will make a statement on the re-commencement of talks between British and Rhodesian civil servants.

Our review of all aspects of the Rhodesia problem, to which my right hon. Friend the Prime Minister referred in his statement of 5th July, has not yet reached the stage when the talks can be resumed. There will therefore be some delay beyond the end of this month, but the talks will be taken up again as soon as possible. My right hon. Friend has undertaken to make a further statement before the Summer Recess.

Is the right hon. Gentleman aware that there are now only five days left in which to fulfil the Prime Minister's undertaking on 5th July that the talks would be resumed later this month? When they are resumed, can he say at what level they will be resumed?

I must ask the hon. Gentleman to await the further statement by the Prime Minister to which I have referred.

Is my right hon. Friend aware that the Rhodesia confrontation, in its direct and indirect results, is costing us over £100 million a year? Can we go on affording it?

That is a different question.

Can the Secretary of State assure us that his reply today does not in any way mean that there is any doubt that the talks will be resumed?

Yes, Sir.

asked the Secretary of State for Commonwealth Relations whether he will publish a White Paper on the informal talks between Her Majesty's Government and the illegal regime in Rhodesia.

No, Sir. The content of the talks remains confidential.

Will my right hon. Friend deny the report that Her Majesty's Government might recognise Ian Smith as Prime Minister of Rhodesia under a new constitution, still without majority rule?

As I said before, exploratory talks are being held to see whether it is possible to conduct negotiations. That is still the position.

Might it not help with these talks if, following Zambia's decision to ship copper by rail, there were to be some relaxation of sanctions?

No, Sir. I do not think that that would help at all.

asked the Secretary of State for Commonwealth Relations if he will give an assurance that he will not conclude any settlement of the Rhodesian problem while Parliament is in recess and without giving the House an opportunity to debate it.

As has repeatedly been made clear, any final settlement of the Rhodesian problem must receive the approval of the British Parliament.

Will the right hon. Gentleman bear in mind that any settlement of the Rhodesian problem is unfortunately bound to be highly controversial within the Commonwealth, and might even lead to the break up of the Commonwealth, so that the House really ought to have an opportunity to debate it?

As I have said before, the talks are informal. There can be no question of a settlement before there is a lawful Government in Rhodesia.

Will my right hon. Friend give an assurance that, if some kind of agreement is reached during the recess, Parliament will he recalled to discuss it?

That is a matter for my right hon. Friend the Leader of the House.

Will the right hon. Gentleman make a statement before the House rises so that we may be fully informed of the latest progress?

My right hon. Friend the Prime Minister intends to do so.

asked the Secretary of State for Commonwealth Relations what complaints he has received from Mr. Smith's Government about broadcasts from Zambia advocating arson and murder ; and what reply he has made.

The illegal authorities in Rhodesia have no right of complaint to Her Majesty's Government in such matters other than as private citizens. No such complaints have been received.

I am surprised at that reply. Is the hon. Lady aware that hon. Members on both sides have received these complaints? Would she not agree that it is unfortunate that the Zambian broadcasts are supervised by a British subject who was a member of the staff of the Central Office of Information?

The hon. Gentleman may have received complaints. I can only report that Her Majesty's Government have not. It is my information that no extreme broadcasts are being made from Zambia to Rhodesia at the present time.

Is my hon. Friend aware that although we all deplore murder, arson, and all the rest, as long as Africans in Rhodesia are denied their elementary human rights it will be very easy to encourage them to think that the only road is through violent means?

I think that my hon. Friend will recognise that there may be a certain inevitability about some things that occur in Africa, but that does not mean that the British Government would in any way wish to encourage them.

Nevertheless, would the hon. Lady condemn this practice in principle and unequivocally?

What the Zambian Radio puts out is a matter for the Zambian Government. I have already said that no extreme bro-adcasts are now taking place and in the past there have been only a few. I think, therefore, that the hon. Members' question is irrelevant.

asked the Secretary of State for Commonwealth Relations if, pursuant to Article 14(v) of the Licence and Agreement, he will instruct the British Broadcasting Corporation regularly to monitor programmes going out from Zambia to Rhodesia ; and if he will arrange for copies of excepts which incite to violence to be placed in the Library of the House.

No, Sir. My information is that there have been no recent broadcasts from Zambia to Rhodesia of the type which the hon. Gentleman seems to have in mind.

asked the Secretary of State for Commonwealth Relations what action he will take to ensure equitable treatment to members of Her Majesty's Overseas Civil Service who transferred from Nyasaland Government service to that of the Federal Government, on the promise that their careers would be assured, and who after the dissolution of the Federation accepted employment in Malawi under conditions inferior to those currently offered by the Malawi Government to officers recruited directly in Great Britain under arrangements subsidised by the British taxpayer.

asked the Secretary of State for Commonwealth Relations, if he will make representations to the Government of Malawi to compensate more adequately those members of Her Majesty's Overseas Civil Service who were transferred from the service of the Nyasaland Government to that of the Federal Government, and who, on the dissolution of the Federation, re-entered the employment of the Government of Malawi and what were the recommendations of the Curtis Committee in respect of these civil servants.

On the question of terminal arrangements for members of the Federal Public Service, I have nothing to add to the reply my hon. Friend gave to the hon. Member for Hertfordshire, South West (Mr. Longden) on the 14th June. Any question concerning current terms of service is a matter for my right hon. Friend the Minister of Overseas Development. The Curtis Committee was an official working party appointed by the Governments concerned and its reports were not published.

Is the Commonwealth Secretary aware that the officers concerned were not permitted to remain in the Colonial Service when their departments were transferred to the Federal Government but when the Federation was dissolved they were either dismissed without compensation or returned to Malawi to work under conditions inferior to other British expatriate officers? Is not this an unsatisfactory state of affairs, and in honour will the right hon. Gentleman do something about it?

When these servants elected to join the Federal service they did so in the knowledge that they would end their service with Her Majesty's Government Overseas Civil Service. The pensionable members of the Federal service were given the option to join one of the territorial public services or to retire on pension. If comparable pensionable employment was not available they received compensation. Those who chose to join the public service in Nyasaland did so on contract terms and have received their enhanced pensions concurrently with their other salaries.

Is it not the case that when the Federal Government was formed these people were urged to enter this service and they were assured that their careers would not suffer if they did so, yet when the Federation was dissolved that promise was not honoured?

There is something which ought to be looked into, I agree with the hon. Member, and I understand that my right hon. Friend the Minister for Overseas Development has recently considered with the Malawi Government the current terms of service of some of these officers and new arrangements are being made.

asked the Secretary of State for Commonwealth Relations what results he has achieved, following consultations with the Governments of Australia and New Zealand, in seeking to arrange low-cost charter flights for members of the Australia and New Zealand Parents and Relatives Association, who wish to visit their families who have emigrated to Australia and New Zealand.

The question of the fares to be charged on charter flights to Australia and New Zealand is entirely a matter for decision by the Governments of Australia and New Zealand.

I understand that the New Zealand Government are prepared to consider individual applications for charter flights the Australian Government have been unable to agree to such flights with fares at the low levels so far proposed.

Will my right hon. Friend pursue this matter, because in this country there are very many parents and other relatives of people who have emigrated to Australia and New Zealand who have never seen their people since, although arrangements could be made for them to do so? Arrangements are made with Canada and America for cheap flights. Would my right hon. Friend pursue the matter with the Australian and New Zealand Governments to see if it is possible to do anything on those lines? If that is not possible, will he see whether some arrangement could be made with a British flying company for charter flights? I am certain that they would not lose by doing that.

As my hon. Friend knows, I am most anxious to help. I have been in touch with the Australian and New Zealand Governments. I am sure that they are fully aware of the considerations involved.

asked the Secretary of State for Commonwealth Relations what help he has given to the new Ghana Government in the provision of uniforms, webbing equipment, and spare parts for military vehicles.

asked the Secretary of State for Commonwealth Relations whether he will give to the Ghana Government such military equipment surplus to the needs of the Territorial Army as is necessary to maintain the Ghana Army at the standard which it reached at the time of Ghanaian independence.

We are anxious to give the Ghana Government any help we can, and have considered carefully and with much sympathy their request for help in providing military equipment. We have, however, come to the conclusion that, owing to the overriding need for economy in all forms of Government expenditure, we are unable to comply with it. General Ankrah has been informed accordingly by our High Commissioner, and I am informed that the Ghana Army has now made arrangements to obtain most of these supplies from elsewhere.

Considering that the Territorial Army is being reduced to virtually half and that 19 Territorial armoured regiments are being reduced to one in an armoured role, surely some spares and some equipment could be made available?

That may be so, but the cost involved has to be met from somewhere and this additional expenditure would fall on the British Government.

Will my right hon. Friend reconsider this and, in any reconsideration, will he remember that my Question refers to the level of arms and equipment of the Ghana Army 10 years ago and not to any increase in the power of the army?

No, I am afraid that, as I have said, in view of the present economic situation there is no opportunity for me to review the matter.

May we have further clarification? If some of this equipment which is required is surplus to requirements, what possible cost across the exchanges would be involved? Is it not a matter of simply running down the stocks in this country?

The problem no longer exists. The Ghana Government themselves have taken the opportunity of getting the supplies they want in this respect locally.

asked the Secretary of State for Commonwealth Relations if he will, in order to help those Gibraltarians who wish to emigrate to Canada or Australia, make representations to the Canadian and Australian Governments not to insist that Gibraltarians wishing to emigrate must go to Canadian and Australian Government offices in Madrid, as Gibraltarians are then treated as coming from Spain, and as some Gibraltarians are not allowed to enter Spain.

I understand that there is very little interest in emigration from Gibraltar, but I am prepared to arrange for this point to be discussed with the appropriate Canadian and Australian authorities.

Now that the hon. Lady and the right hon. Gentleman are about to take over Gibraltar, will they concentrate very much on this because many people in Gibraltar are hard up and poor and cannot come to England to have themselves medically examined in order to go to Canada or Australia? Will they ask the Australian and Canadian Governments to send people from Madrid to Gibraltar, say, once a month, to study and examine the problems of those people who want to emigrate?

I suppose that this is the kind of point which will emerge during discussions with the Australian and Canadian authorities.

asked the Secretary of State for Commonwealth Relations which Commonwealth countries have since January, 1963, notified Her Majesty's Government of their intention to negotiate trade or association agreements with the European Economic Community.

Since January, 1963, Nigeria, Kenya, Uganda and Tanzania have entered into negotiations with the European Economic Community for association agreements.

Could my hon. Friend tell me what undertaking those countries have given to keep the United Kingdom fully informed of the progress of these negotiations and to consult with Her Majesty's Government before signing any agreements with the E.E.C.?

I am sure my hon. Friend will understand that I cannot disclose information which reaches us confidentially from other Commonwealth Governments, but I can assure him that there is a great deal of discussion and we are kept fully informed.

asked the Secretary of State for Commonwealth Relations whether he will make a statement on the Government's policy towards Article 3 and Protocol 2 of the Nigeria-European Economic Community Association agreement, signed on Saturday, 16th July, in view of the fact that these clauses grant the European Economic Community trading concessions denied to this country.

The British Government have frequently stated that, in their view, developed countries which grant new preferential treatment to developing countries should not demand concessions in return from the latter. Nevertheless, the Agreement provides that Nigeria shall grant certain preferences to the European Economic Community. The British Government recognise however, that the Community offers a large market for some Nigeria products.

As Nigeria grants no Imperial Preference at all to this country, may I ask whether Her Majesty's Government will now ask Nigeria to give us at least most-favoured-nation treatment in view of the fact that the NigeriaE.E.C. Association agreement is most unlikely to be accepted as a Customs union or free trade area within Article 24 of the G.A.T.T.?

That would require consideration at meetings of the G.A.T.T. I cannot say at this stage whether we would think it right to take any action on the lines suggested by my hon. Friend.

asked the Secretary of State for Commonwealth Relations whether he will take an initiative designed to bring about the resumption of diplomatic relations between Great Britain and Tanzania.

The hon. Member will recognise that we normally look to the country which has been instrumental in breaking diplomatic relations to take any such initiative.

Of course I appreciate that, but is the right hon. Gentleman aware that reports from those who have been in Tanzania in the recent past have indicated that President Nyerere would now very much like to resume diplomatic relations with us? If so, in view of the importance of our being fully in the picture of East African opinion at present, would the Commonwealth Secretary himself try to devise a mutually satisfactory and acceptable formula?

I have said that we would normally look to the country which has broken off relations to take the first step. As my right hon. Friend the Prime Minister said in this House on 27th January, this has been a very serious mistake by the Tanzanians but one which is reparable.

In view of the grave state of our own economy, would the right hon. Gentleman make clear to any self-governing former colonial territory of this country that they cannot continue to expect aid of the proportions which Tanzania is now getting?

No, Sir. I think it would be very unwise to do that.

asked the Secretary of State for Commonwealth Relations if he will make a statement regarding the talks between the Minister of State and the Zambia Government upon her visit to Lusaka.

I would refer the hon. Member to the reply which my right hon. Friend gave on 5th July to the hon. Member for Haltemprice (Mr. Wall), to which I have nothing to add.

Is my hon. Friend aware that, despite her valuable visit, there has been a steady worsening of the political climate in Lusaka? Will she state categorically that no independence will be given to Rhodesia before there is majority rule by Africans in that territory?

My hon. Friend will recognise—as he has, indeed, done by what he has said—that there is a considerable area of political disagreement between ourselves and Zambia, stretching back to the events immediately following U.D.I. He will also recognise that it would be unwise for the British Government, in advance of any further consideration of this matter, to give the kind of assurance he has asked for.

Since I understand that the Minister of State discussed with the Zambian Government the use of the Rhodesian Railways, may I ask whether, now that Zambia has decided to resume the dispatch of copper over the Rhodesian Railways on condition that the purchasers pay the freight, Her Majesty's Government will allow British purchasers to make these payments?

That raises a different question.

Is my hon. Friend aware that, during this last week, I have been fortunate enough to have talks with President Kaunda and the Foreign Minister Mr. Kapwepwe and that they are both deeply disturbed by what they consider the British Government's deception in the matter of sanctions and by the British Government's lack of zeal in finishing off the Smith regime? Is she further aware that it is this which will lead to Zambia quitting the Commonwealth?

If Zambia were to leave the Commonwealth that would be a most regrettable and serious situation not only for Zambia and Britain but for the Commonwealth as well. I hope that it can be avoided. I have had with President Kaunda and certainly with Mr. Kapwepwe frequent and full discussions about the sanctions policy and we are in no doubt about each other's point of view and the precise areas on which I would strongly disagree with some of Mr. Kapwepwe's assertions.

asked the Secretary of State for Commonwealth Relations if he will make a statement on current British plans to help Zambia in connection with financial losses incurred by the continuing unconstitutional position in Rhodesia.

The question of assistance to Zambia is still under consideration following my return from my recent discussions with the Zambian Government in Lusaka.

Can my hon. Friend give an idea of the gap between what we are prepared to offer the Zambian Government and the amount that President Kaunda considers necessary, bearing in mind the losses he has suffered because of the illegal régime in Rhodesia?

This is not a matter to be measured so much in terms of money but in terms of what is required for the development of alternative routes for Zambia in order to enable her to intensify sanctions against Rhodesia. There are immensely complicated technical problems and it is because of these that the matter is still under consideration.

Will the hon. Lady bear in mind, in considering assistance to Zambia, that the Government of Zambia have recently sacked a number of British police officers without adequate notice or adequate compensation?

A great many factors have to be borne in mind in considering all the questions relating to Zambia and the sanctions policy. That is one of them. The Zambians have a point of view that one well understands but nevertheless one is able to identify positive areas on which one would not wholly agree. Every factor is being borne in mind.

Will the hon. Lady make it clear that, since we are living on American loans, we have no right to give to these African countries aid that comes to us from countries which have not agreed to such use? Will she make it clear that there is a limit to what we can do?

Of course there have to be limits. Nevertheless, the hon. Gentleman overlooks the fact that, in order to achieve a satisfactory solution to the Rhodesian problem—a solution which would satisfy the majority of hon. Members of this House—it is necessary to enable the sanctions policy to work really effectively. That is the point at which Zambian participation can be of the most tremendous importance.

asked the Secretary of State for Commonwealth Relations when he proposes to visit Pakistan and India.

I have no immediate plans for visiting either country but greatly hope that, subject to the convenience of the Governments concerned, I may have the opportunity to do so before too long.

Will my right hon. Friend remember that many sympathetic voices in New Delhi feel that, after his visits to Africa, Canada, Australia and Malaysia, it is about time India had a visit from a representative of Her Majesty's Government?

There have been other visitors from Her Majesty's Government. Lord Walston was there recently. I have been fortunate enough to have had meetings with many Indian and Pakistan Ministers during recent weeks.

Is my right hon. Friend aware that it is important that he should take the earliest opportunity to improve relations with the Ministers of India and Pakistan?

This is a matter best left to both of them. We can only encourage where it is possible to do so.

asked the Minister of Power what steps Her Majesty's Government has now taken, pursuant to recommendation 69(v) of the Twelfth Report of the National Board for Prices and Incomes, to assume greater responsibility for identifying and critically examining the assumptions on which the forecast of yield on new investment by the National Coal Board in diversification projects is based.

This is being pursued in the course of this year's review of the National Coal Board's investment programme.

Would not the right hon. Gentleman recognise that three months ago to this date he admitted that he regarded this matter as of great importance which must be pursued as fast as possible? Is it not regrettable that 20 years after its formation the National Coal Board should still have to be told by the Government how to appraise its capital investment? What is to happen with the steel industry 20 years from now?

The steel industry will be a great deal more efficient than now. Under the Coal Industry Nationalisation Act, 1946, the responsibility of the Minister relates to the general lines of the National Coal Board's programme of reorganisation and development. Despite this it is the practice for the Government to keep the procedures within the industry under regular review.

asked the Minister of Power if he will state the number and location, by National Coal Board divisions, of profitable collieries rendered unprofitable as a consequence of manpower shortage in the year ended 26th March, 1966.

The manpower shortage has affected adversely the profitability of a large number of pits, but I am informed by the Board that information is not available in the form requested.

Is my hon. Friend aware that his reply is most unsatisfactory? Is he further aware that the argument advanced by the Government about there being a hard core of viable pits is now running very thin? Is it not the case that the manpower shortage in the East Midlands, the West Midlands and Yorkshire has been greatly accelerated by the speeded-up colliery closures programme?

My hon. Friend will be glad to hear that the reduction in manpower in the last eight weeks has been about 12½ per cent. less than in the same period last year. We all hope that this hopeful trend will continue.

Minister of Power (1) what information he has about the development of petroleum gas for use by the Scottish Gas Board; when such gas will be supplied to domestic consumers; and what reduction in Scottish coal requirements this will involve annually when in peak production; and

The extension of supplies to Scotland and other parts of the country not at present connected to the existing natural gas line is being examined as part of the studies in hand on the utilisation of gas from the North Sea. Until these have been completed and more is known about the availability of North Sea gas, it is not possible to say how other fuels or the cost of gas supplies in Scotland would be affected.

Is it not the case that experiments are being carried out in the use of petroleum gas? If natural gas and/or petroleum gas is brought into use can the hon. Gentleman say what effect on employment in Scottish mines it will have?

I apologise for any confusion in the reply. Natural gas is petroleum gas. I thought that the hon. Member was referring to liquefied petroleum gas which is sold by some gas boards. It is sold in Scotland and presumably increased supplies are possible.

asked the Minister of Power whether he will give a general direction, in the public interest, to electricity boards to consult him before making agreements to supply current to private industry below the average price per unit paid to the Central Electricity Generating Board.

No, Sir. The costs of supplying electricity vary with the pattern of consumption, and Boards should remain free to reflect this variation in the prices charged.

Is my right hon. Friend aware that a public quarrel has broken out between the electricity board and a major industrial consumer? Would it not be in the public interest that there should be some considered public policy on the price for bulk supplies which may have implications on the capital programmes of the electricity industry?

The new structure of the bulk supply tariff will encourage a better relationship between costs and prices. In the past, rebates given for restrictable supplies may have been, to put it no higher, excessive in relation to the cost of capacity for meeting peak loads.

asked the Minister of Power what duties are to be allocated to Mr. Michael Posner; and if he is to be appointed a member of the Minister's Energy Advisory Committee.

Mr. Michael Posner is expected to take up full-time duties as Director of Economics on 1st October, subject to securing release from his university; meanwhile he is giving the Ministry assistance and advice on an ad hoc basis. He will be responsible for inquiring into, and advising on, economic questions of concern to the Ministry, including those of fuel policy and co-ordination which come before my Energy Advisory Council.

Does my right hon. Friend think that this kind of temporary advice, with all respect to Mr. Posner, is good enough? Does not the importance of the decisions now being made about fuel and power make it necessary that my right hon. Friend should have available the very best all-round expert advice?

I think that my hon. Friend misunderstands the position. Mr. Posner is coming to work for the Ministry full time to head a division which will be composed of a number of people who will also be working full time on just this subject. The Ministry is concerned with two considerations—one is the short-term fuel policy to take account of some of our immediate problems, and the other is the much longer exercise to produce some form of econometric model of the fuel economy.

asked the Minister of Power if he will make a statement on the application of the Central Electricity Generating Board to use natural gas for electrical power generation and the probable effect on the coal industry and the nuclear power programme.

I have had no such application, and would refer my hon. Friend to the reply I gave to a supplementary question by the hon. Member for Barkston Ash (Mr. Alison) on 21st June.

In that case, does not my right hon. Friend agree that it would be very helpful if the House could have a new statement on fuel and power policy, as we have been promised?

My hon. Friend does not do himself justice if he thinks that we can produce a new fuel policy in a matter of two or three months. These are very important and serious decisions. In the short term they will take us certainly until the end of this year and into the first couple of months of the next. In the long term the model will take longer than that.

Is the Central Electricity Generating Board making investigations into the possibility of using natural gas in peak load gas turbines, particularly bearing in mind that this would save imports of oil?

I understand that the C.E.G.B. is looking at this question. In the first instance, it would have to put proposals to me and so far it has not done so.

asked the Minister of Power what plans he has for ensuring participation by the workers in the management of the publicly-owned steel industry.

I would refer my hon. Friend to my remarks in yesterday's debate.

asked the Minister of Power whether, in the light of Her Majesty's Government's call for a standstill on prices and services and for a standstill on wages, he will issue a general direction to the National Coal Board, in the national interest, to extend the present period of reduced summer coal prices for the period of the standstill.

No, Sir. The summer reduction in prices, which applies only to coal for the domestic market, is a deliberate discount on normal prices to encourage stocking.

But is not the hon. Gentleman aware that it is precisely for the domestic consumer that we should temper the wind to the shorn lamb? Is he aware that the pay freeze which the Prime Minister has announced is not to be matched by a price freeze because of the Government's own measures? Will he take steps to see that the price of coal is kept low for people on low fixed incomes?

Every endeavour is made to keep the price of coal low and the summer prices are deliberately reduced in order to encourage people to build up stocks. This is quite a different matter from a normal price increase.

Is my hon. Friend aware that he would make a great contribution to price stability in Scotland if he were to reduce the selective coal price increase in Scotland?

The differentiation between coal prices in various parts of the country reflects differences in production costs. The Government have taken the view that prices should correctly represent costs and the way in which we can secure cheaper coal prices in Scotland is to reduce the relative cost of production there. Every effort is being made to that end.

asked the Minister of Power to what extent he estimates that the exclusion of development areas from certain of the Government's restrictive economic measures will retard the redeployment of manpower from uneconomic pits.

I do not expect any change on this account.

Does that mean that the right hon. Gentleman expects that redeployment of manpower from uneconomic pits will continue, thus swelling the ranks of the potentially unemployed in non-development areas?

Redeployment has not so far increased unemployment in those areas, and there is no reason why it should do so in future. At the moment, there is a shortage of coal miners in some pits and a surplus in others. What we are trying to do is to move them from the one to the other.

Does not the right hon. Gentleman's Answer imply that potentially productive and profitable pits will fare worse than potentially unprofitable pits under the credit squeeze?

No, Sir.

The right hon. Gentleman has not answered this very important Question. Does he not think that the whole of recently announced Government policy will have the effect of prejudicing the position in the East Midlands and Yorkshire, where it is absolutely vital to get men?

Not at all. I should have thought that it would do the contrary. There are jobs in pits within the East Midlands and Yorkshire and we passionately want men to take those jobs.

asked the Minister of Power if the deferred capital expenditure plans for the coal industry arising from recent proposals to reduce demand in the economy will apply only to activities outside development areas.

I am expecting to receive the Board's proposals shortly for giving effect to the cut in investment but I have no doubt the Board will, where practicable, avoid cutting expenditure in development areas.

Are we to assume from that Answer that the cuts in the investment proposals of the nationalised industries, including the National Coal Board, were decided by the Government without any prior consultation with those industries?

The cuts were decided in the light of information which we received from the industries. Consultation with the industries is still continuing.

Does this mean that there will be a cut in the investment in the profitable coal mining areas of the East Midlands and Yorkshire and no cut in investment in areas where the coal industry is declining, such as Durham and Scotland?

It is not a question of using these cuts in this way. It is a question of making the economies which are necessary by agreement with the N.C.B. in ways which will not prejudice the Board's operations.

asked the Minister of Overseas Development whether he will increase the United Kingdom contribution to the United Nations Development Programme of 1966 from £4,200,000 to £5,150,000 and pledge £5,800,000 for 1967.

I am sure that my hon. Friend will appreciate that in present circumstances I am unable to contemplate any increase in the United Kingdom contribution.

Is my right hon. Friend aware that the effect of an increased contribution on our balance of payments would be more favourable than otherwise, since large amounts of this money would be spent in dollars within the sterling area?

I appreciate what my hon. Friend says, but we must keep a sense of proportion about this. Our last increase was in 1965 and was 171 per cent. and we are the third largest contributor to the funds of the United Nations Development Programme.

Will the right hon. Gentleman consider doing this out of borrowed money?

asked the Minister of Technology if he is satisfied that the data he possesses is comprehensive and reliable enough to produce an index of wage/ salary cost per unit output and capital employed per unit output for the mechanical engineering, electronic, telecommunication, computer and machine tool industries; and if he will make a statement.

No, Sir.

Would not the right hon. Gentleman agree that these indices are the necessary indicators of industrial efficiency? If he does not possess this information, how could his predecessor say in a public speech that some companies in the engineering industry were more than twice as efficient as others?

Some of the comparisons which have been published were based on particular studies in particular industries, but the information for which the hon. Gentleman asks in the Question is not in any case exactly the information in the form in which we would want it. It would be not only working capital in which we would be interested, but probably more investment in plant and investment per unit output.

Would not the right hon. Gentleman accept that in order to fulfil his sponsorship of the industries mentioned in the Question, it is essential that he should be able to obtain wage/salary cost per unit figures? Is he doing anything about getting them?

It is certainly true that a great deal more information is needed in order to be able to do the job which we have been set up to do. Good companies, of course, provide this information themselves as part of cost control and it is our job to encourage other companies to do the same. But the answer to the Question is that there is not yet sufficient information on a scale to publish an index.

asked the Chancellor of the Exchequer what is the estimated loss to the Revenue of Pay As You Earn Income Tax arising out of the seamen's strike, taking into account, in addition, refunds of tax during non-working weeks previously paid in any tax year.

It is impossible to estimate what additional tax would have been paid by seamen but for the strike.

Is there no way at all of giving even an approximate estimate of what was lost to the Revenue as a result of this strike, quite apart from other repercussions? Could not the Minister say how it is proposed to make good the short-fall in revenue from this?

It is impossible to do this, as the hon. Member will appreciate when he reflects on the different times at which ships returned to this country and consequently the different times when seamen began to lose their wages and their liability to Income Tax.

asked the Chancellor of the Exchequer if he will give details of the assurances which have been given by and on behalf of Her Majesty's Government of their intention to restrict internal demand; to whom, and on what dates such assurances have been given; what relations these assurances bear to the international monetary transactions of this country; and if he will make a statement.

No such assurances have been asked for and none has been given.

Is the Minister aware that the right hon. Gentleman the Member for Nuneaton (Mr. Cousins), in his letter of resignation to the Prime Minister, said categorically that these assurances have been given? He was speaking as a member of the Cabinet. Is the hon. Gentleman aware that the Prime Minister in his reply to that letter never refuted the allegations? Can we have the truth?

I am surprised that the hon. Gentleman asked me that question. I have already answered it. No such assurances have been asked for and none has been given. Ministers are not in the habit of giving information which is not the truth.

Would the Chief Secretary say whether he is restricting internal demand in the road programme when the Minister of Transport said only last Friday at the Severn Bridge that there would be no cuts in the road programme?

That is an entirely different question which ought to be addressed to my right hon. Friend the Minister of Transport.

Would the Chief Secretary acknowledge that the words used by my hon. Friend the Member for Louth (Sir C. Osborne) are a direct quotation from the resignation letter of the right hon. Gentleman the Member for Nuneaton? Was the right hon. Gentleman telling an untruth?

The right hon. Gentleman knows that I am not responsible for what anyone else says. I have not got the letter here and I was not asked about it. It is an entirely different matter. I was asked a Question and I have given a very full, accurate and truthful Answer.

asked the Chancellor of the Exchequer to what precise extent the fixed-price contracts existing at the time of the introduction of the Selective Employment Payments Bill between Government Departments and local authorities on the one hand and private contractors on the other will be modified to meet the new tax.

I would refer the hon. Member to the statement I made to the House on 21st July during the Committee stage of the Selective Employment Payments Bill.

Since the right hon. Gentleman has very recently expressed pride in his own integrity, may I ask him to recall that when I put a Question recently, the Chancellor said that if I tabled a Question in this form he would give me a definitive answer? Therefore, would he kindly give some sort of estimate as to what proportion firms can expect to recover on fixed-price contracts as a result of the changes due to the Selective Employment Tax? Is it to be 100 per cent., 50 per cent. or 75 per cent.? Can we have a truthful answer?

If the hon. Gentleman did not get so excited I could hear more accurately what information he is asking me for. If he is asking me what proportion this tax would represent, it represents 2 per cent. of the costs and therefore the refund which is proposed would cover all except something like one-quarter of 1 per cent. of the cost involved.

asked the Chancellor of the Exchequer what will be the cost to the North-East of Scotland in a fall year of the increase in road fuel duty announced on 20th July.

asked the Chancellor of the Exchequer what will be the cost to Scotland in a full year of the increase in road fuel duty announced on 20th July.

The additional duty on road fuel in Scotland is estimated at about £5½, million a year. Estimates cannot be made for particular areas of Scotland.

Would not the hon. Gentleman agree that this increase in duty bears particularly hard on the remoter areas of Britain, particularly on Scotland and, contrary to what his right hon. Friend the Prime Minister said in his statement last week, Scotland is by no means exempted from the effects of the Government's economic measures?

No. I would not accept that. There is no evidence that the fuel duty will bear more heavily on such areas, and the measures as a whole are designed to avoid imposing an undue burden upon development areas.

asked the Chancellor of the Exchequer what he estimates will be the effect on the balance of payments, or on the current level of demand, of the proposal to increase payments of Surtax made in September, 1967.

The additional revenue is estimated at £26 million. The effect of this upon demand cannot be accurately assessed.

Is the hon. Gentleman aware that this does not answer the Question? Is he aware that this is a measure which cannot possibly be effec- tive before September, 1967? We understand from the Prime Minister that the crisis of demand in the balance of payments is an immediate one. Could he say what effect this is likely to have on the current crisis?

It can have an effect before September, 1967, if Surtax payers reduced their expenditure in anticipation of paying the duty, but it is impossible to estimate the extent to which they will do so.

asked the Chancellor of the Exchequer why the Government have selected Surtax-payers, irrespective of their contribution to the national economic effort, as the only members of the community whose net incomes will be specifically reduced by the new economic measures.

We are all being called on to make sacrifices. It is right to ask for something extra from those with the biggest incomes.

Is it not a fact that, whereas the Government are saying to all the other members of the community that their disposable incomes may not be increased, they are saying to Surtax-payers that theirs will be specifically reduced? Is this a sensible way to give incentives to senior managers and technologists, upon whom our industrial future depends?

I am sure that the hon. Member will appreciate that some of the other measures will bear more hardly upon other people than they will upon Surtax-payers. As far as the particular class of Surtax-payers to which the hon. Gentleman has referred is concerned, I would remind him that the earned income allowance provisions will still apply to them.