asked the Minister of Transport if he will institute a technological inquiry into the feasibility of standardising safety features in motor vehicles to harmonise with the safety requirements of other countries where car manufacture is concerned; and if he will also initiate talks on this subject with his counterparts in other major car-producing countries, with a view to reaching international agreement.

The United Kingdom is participating fully in the work of an Economic Commission for Europe Working Party which is drawing up internationally agreed regulations on motor vehicle safety.

Is it not vital for our export performance to have car safety standardisation? When does the Parliamentary Secretary expect these negotiations to reach a fruitful conclusion?

I agree that there should be common standards for car safety. The E.C.E. Working Party has already introduced eight international regulations for lighting equipment, and four more international safety regulations concerning steering columns, anti-burst door latches and hinges, brakes, and padding of passenger compartments, have been completed. Many others are being prepared. We are not standing still.

asked the Minister of Transport what plans he has to publicise the need for parents to ensure that children wear safety belts in cars.

An important theme in our road safety publicity is that drivers and front seat passengers should always wear seat belts. This applies to older children as well as adults. Our Road Safety Publicity Unit is also arranging publicity for our advice that young children are safer in the back of the car preferably in a safety harness.

I am obliged for that Answer. But is the hon. Gentleman not aware that there is still some doubt among medical opinion and other experts as to whether safety belts are the right answer for smaller children because of the state of their bones? Will he give an urgent decision in the matter and redouble his efforts, at the same time looking into the danger of small children being carried on parents' laps? This is something which many of us, including myself, are tempted to do; it is pleasant, but it is very dangerous.

Clearly, the safest place for a small child is on the back seat of a car, wearing a safety harness. For very young children there are special safety seats with built-in harnesses.

asked the Minister of Transport if he will make a statement on the progress of the further studies he is conducting on the cost of a Channel link.

The British and French Governments have already concluded that among fixed Channel links only a rail tunnel is a practical proposition. New estimates of the cost of such a tunnel will be prepared during the final period of studies which will begin when a financing group has been chosen.

Is my right hon. Friend aware that the results of those studies will be looked at with considerable interest? Is he further aware that the quality of the previous White Paper was not as high as we had a right to expect, and will he improve on the fact finding which goes into these reports?

Certainly, it is intended that these studies shall be very comprehensive and sophisticated because large sums of money are at stake.

asked the Minister of Transport how many of the 32,900 road freight vehicles and trailers transferred to the National Freight Corporation on the 31st December, 1968, have been now submitted for testing under his Department's scheme; and how many he expects will be submitted in the near future.

As indicated to the hon. Member on 21st April, compliance with the regulations governing the testing of heavy goods vehicles is a matter for the National Freight Corporation. I have nothing further to add to the Answer given to the hon. Member on 2nd April.—[Vol. 782, c. 121]

Will the hon. Gentleman agree that his earlier Answer to a Question of mine was highly misleading when he said that only 1 per cent. of vehicles submitted for testing had failed? Will he confirm what I believe is correct, that the £5 million loan to the National Freight Corporation is for one purpose alone, and that is to replace vehicles which have been badly maintained by British Railways in the past?

I have given the hon. Member the figures on a number of occasions before and I have no reason to doubt the accuracy of those figures; I per cent. of the 12,000 vehicles failed the test. We expect that of roughly 32,000 vehicles taken over, at least 30,000 will go for test. But it is unreasonable to ask the National Freight Corporation for detailed information on this subject which is basically a subject for management.

asked the Minister of Transport if he will give a general direction to British Railways that they should provide every day a sailing during daylight hours of car-carrying ships from England to Ireland throughout the year.

No, Sir.

Is the Parliamentary Secretary aware that British Railways, apart from three months in the year, do not run any day services for carrying cars to Ireland? Is he aware that, as in the case of Southampton to Le Havre, they may lose the business of carrying cars and then competitors will step in and take over from them?

This is a matter for the commercial judgment and management of British Railways. During the main season there are frequent services from Stranraer, Holyhead and Fishguard. British Railways are very well aware of the demands of the public and they try to cater for them.

asked the Minister of Transport if he proposes to alter his method of publishing road accident statistics during holiday periods following representations by the motoring organisations.

No, Sir.

Is my right hon. Friend aware that some organisations have expressed the view that the publishing of road accident figures for holiday periods serves no useful purpose and have made an appeal that new methods should be tried?

I am aware of a recent speech made on this subject. There are two arguments here. First, this practice gives us the opportunity four times a year to get over to people just how important this issue is. We are talking about the large numbers of people who are killed and injured on the roads. When we look at the figures for 1968 we see that the daily average was 261 and, apart from Easter, the number was higher at holiday weekends. At Whitsun it was 291 and at the Summer Bank Holiday 337. This gives a convenient opportunity to get across to the public this serious problem and it is worth taking advantage of the opportunity.

Does not the right hon. Gentleman agree that by focussing attention on the figures at peak weekends he may give the impression that driving standards are markedly different then—[HON. MEMBERS: "They are."]—whereas in fact the overall number of fatalities is much the same throughout the year? By concentrating on peak weekends, is it not possible to give an impression of a degree of complacency about other parts of the calendar about which figures are not published although they are much the same?

Fatal and serious casualties tend to be higher on the occasion of holiday weekends when there are many people on the roads and these weekends tend to be a drinking time. The driving tends to leave something to be desired. People should not be at all complacent about the toll of the roads. They need take only 30 seconds to think of this. We are talking about close on 400,000 people killed or injured every year. There is certainly nothing to be complacent about.

asked the Minister of Transport what were the total road casualties in England and Wales between the hours of 10.30 p.m. and midnight for the first quarter of 1969; and how these figures compare with the same period in 1968.

Figures are not readily available in the precise form requested. Between 10 p.m. and midnight fatal and serious casualties in Great Britain totalled 960 in January, 1969, and 686 in January, 1968. I will send my hon. Friend the figures for the whole of the first quarter when they are compiled.

Is my right hon. Friend aware that the deterrent effect of the Road Safety Act is now wearing off? Will he therefore ask the Home Secretary to issue new advice to chief constables about the use of the breathalyser test?

I think one should pause before trying to form conclusions from these figures, because in January there were big increases in areas not normally associated with drinking. Also, while this is not a satisfactory position, late-night casualties are still 20 per cent. lower than they were in 1967. Police enforcement has increased and there were nearly 40 per cent. more breath tests in the first quarter of 1969 than in the same months of 1968.

Is the Minister aware that one should be very much on guard about drawing too much in the way of conclusions from these figures? Can he give some idea of what weight we should attach to them by saying how many hours were travelled in these times, because it is not only the number of casualties but the number of casualties in relation to the number of hours travelled?

We want to go even further than that. January was a very bad month for accident figures. The February figures seem to be better. We must first establish how far these figures are typical. We cannot take one month on its own; we need a longer experience of this. It was always thought that there would be some wear-off from the initial impact, but we still remain about the only country in the world that has reduced road accidents in two successive years.

asked the Minister of Transport what discussions he is having with the motor-cycle industry and motorcycling associations about his proposal for compulsory passenger insurance.

The Kent Committee took evidence from the motor-cycling interests, and its subsequent Report was circulated widely for comment. I considered all the comments received, including those from the motor-cycling interests.

The Kent Committee sat several years ago, and the situation has changed since then. Will the right hon. Gentleman consider receiving representations from both the industry and the users when he is framing the Bill and take due note of the up-to-date situation from both sides?

The Kent Report was circulated in February, 1968. If there is anything new since then I shall be only too happy to hear it.

asked the Minister of Transport what proposals he has to improve co-ordination between transport services covering Greater London and particularly the commuter services; and if he will make a statement.

The Transport (London) Bill now before Parliament provides that the Greater London Council shall have a duty to plan for integrated, efficient and economic services. It provides also that the main operators shall co-operate directly with one another to co-ordinate their services.

Is the right hon. Gentleman aware that the passage of the Bill does not end his labours? Will he consider giving to a junior Minister special responsibility for transport services covering Greater London and the surrounding commuter area? This area, after all, covers about 30 per cent. of the population and has the most intensive and dense traffic system in the world.

I have some interest myself in London Transport and I assure the hon. and gallant Member that the situation is watched very carefully. The purpose of the Bill is to make the G.L.C. responsible for its own transport services. A joint transport planning group has already been set up under the chairmanship of the G.L.C. and is at work on a provisional basis. The Bill's purpose is to enable the elected representatives of Londoners to determine the traffic.

asked the Minister of Transport what conditions he laid down before agreeing to the fares increases proposed by London Transport to be brought into effect in the autumn of this year.

None, Sir.

Will the right hon. Gentleman try to convince the London Transport authorities, whoever they are, that the way to show a profit is not necessarily to raise prices? Would he not agree that, if an efficient and profitable public transport service is provided, people will be glad to leave their cars at home or at the station and use it?

It is not quite as simple as that, and in any case the basis of this decision was that the Government agreed with the G.L.C. that the undertaking would be viable on hand-over. It was that, of course, which gave rise to the fares increase and that proposition was, I believe, supported not only by the G.L.C. but by right hon. and hon. Members opposite.

Will my right hon. Friend tell the G.L.C. that to expect a public transport undertaking not only to cover costs but to make £2 million profit a year is flying in the face of traffic experts across the world?

The agreement was that the undertaking would be viable on hand-over. I do not think that a relatively small transfer to reserves is unreasonable in an undertaking of that size. It is important to point out, however, that the G.L.C. may find that subsidising public transport can be cheaper than incurring congestion costs.

asked the Minister of Transport whether he will alter the regulations governing the use of horns by motor vehicles so as to prohibit the use of two-tone horns by the police, fire and ambulance services and restore the use of bells by drivers in the emergency services.

No, Sir. Experience has shown that in modern traffic a two-tone horn is more effective than a bell in clearing the way for emergency vehicles.

Must we always copy the worst features of other countries? Is the hon. Gentleman really satisfied with this competition in noise he has described? Would it not be better if his Ministry were to press forward far more vigorously in reducing general noise of urban traffic so that some less strident signal would be adequate for emergency vehicles?

The hon. and learned Gentleman must realise that the advent of the trafficator has meant that people do not need to have their windows wound down so often in order to give hand signals. In addition, more motorists are listening to radios, which makes it much more difficult to hear warning signals.

asked the Minister of Transport what response he has from the Liverpool City Council to his proposal contained in a letter to local authorities urging that training areas be set up for learner drivers.

I assume my hon. Friend has in mind the Department's circular of 25th April to local authorities which gave general guidance over the whole field of road safety. Among the local tasks listed in the circular was arranging for the use of suitable training grounds, for example for cycle and motorcycle training. We did not expect immediate responses on detailed points, and have had none on this point from Liverpool City Council.

My hon. Friend's assumption is absolutely right. Has he had any response from local authorities? Will he continue to press them to establish such training grounds, which are essential for the proper training of drivers?

Offhand, I could not say what reply we have had from local authorities, but, as the circular went out only recently. I do not expect that we have had many. Over the next few months we shall ask local authorities what progress they have been able to make in their local road safety activities in the light of the circular.

asked the Minister of Transport how many trains were derailed in 1968; and what were the comparable figures in each of the previous three years.

The provisional total number of reportable derailments on all railways in Great Britain in 1968 is 370. The comparable figures for 1965, 1966 and 1967 are 260, 289 and 311 respectively.

Are not these figures disturbing? As Colonel McMullen expressed concern about the trend in his report over a year ago, can the Parliamentary Secretary give any indication of what steps are being taken to endeavour to identify the causes?

I remember Colonel McMullen's Report. It is in the Library. The steps that have been taken are a reduction in the speed of freight wagons, including short wheelbase wagons, improved training of drivers, action to check the observance of speed limits, including radar checks, the replacement of jointed track by continuous welded rails, and modification of braking systems. I will write to the hon. Gentleman if he wants fuller details, because I know that he is very concerned about this matter.

Did some of the derailments occur at places where jointing of the long rails did not have sleepers underneath? If so, what action is being taken?

I could not say. It is unlikely that there would be many rails welded without having proper support, but I will look into this point.

Is not the Parliamentary Secretary aware that there have been a large number of derailments on the most modern stretch of track in Britain—the electrified line out of Euston? Is the hon. Gentleman satisfied that the signalling and track maintenance are up to the very high speeds of the trains using this stretch of track?

Colonel McMullen stressed in his report the difficulties arising in the case of short wheelbase wagons. This is the main problem. Speeds of trains with wagons such as these have been reduced twice, but modern conditions of longer runs and various other matters give rise to difficulties which are only now becoming apparent. Every effort is being made. The Railway Inspectorate is kept fully informed of all derailments and makes a detailed examination of them.

asked the Minister of Transport if he will issue a general direction to British Railways instructing it to formulate a more equitable basis for the refunds of unused portions of season tickets.

No, Sir.

Is the Minister aware that one of my constituents bought a monthly season ticket for £6 8s. and on surrendering it with nine days unused was offered a refund of just 1s. 4d.? Is not that an example of the way in which British Railways' calculations in these matters are weighted against the passenger to an almost fraudulent extent?

I am aware of the case of the hon. Gentleman's constituent and the reason behind this Question. The question of how to deal with unexpired portions of season tickets is a management matter for British Railways. Whilst my right hon. Friend has power to give a general direction, this is only if in his opinion it is necessary to do so in the national interest. I do not believe that this is a matter in which such a direction would be appropriate. I am sure that the Railways Board will read the Questions and Answers and will be aware of the hon. Gentleman's displeasure.

asked the Minister of Transport if he will give a general direction to British Railways that they should re-examine the speed limits on sharp curves on all main-line routes with a view to ensuring that trains travel at speeds which do not involve the risk of causing derailments and other mishaps.

No, Sir. The regulation of the speed of trains is a matter for the Board and it would not be appropriate for my right hon. Friend to issue a general direction.

Surely, if it is a matter for the Board, it is also a matter for the general populace? Will my hon. Friend give a direction so that science can be used to re-lay the tracks and make them more consistent with the age of speed in which we live, and so save life?

Safety is the statutory responsibility of the British Railways Board. On the questions of track, experimenting and generally studying the question of speed, British Railways are as far ahead as anyone in the world with their continuously welded track, and there is the possibility of a high-speed advance passenger train, which is exciting railway people all over the world. The basis of all this is safety.

Whilst I appreciate the action that is being taken, in view of the figures the Minister gave a short while ago of train derailments increasing by about 40 per cent. in four years despite the reduction in track mileage, will the hon. Gentleman give an assurance that this matter is regarded as one of great urgency by all concerned?

Of course it is, but while there have been accidents we must keep the matter in proportion. There are roughly 1 million train miles per derailment and 100 million passenger journeys for each fatal accident caused by derailment. Whilst this is not something which we should ever forget or over look, we should get it into perspective.

asked the Minister of Transport whether, as a result of recent inquiries, he has found a common cause in the recent fires in the diesel trains of British Railways.

No, Sir, but I am writing in detail to the hon. Member.

Is it not alarming that there should be a diesel fire almost every year on British Railways? Is the hon. Gentleman aware that the recommendations of the report of the inquiry into the Radlett disaster in February, 1966, have not yet been implemented by British Railways?

More than three-quarters of the fires in diesel multiple unit trains occurred in under-floor traction equipment for a variety of reasons, including the ignition of oil leaks by defective exhaust systems, mechanical failures, etc. By the end of 1968, about 2,500 out of 4,000 planned individual modifications had already been made and the target for the completion of the modifications recommended following various inquiries, both public and private, is the end of 1970. I am writing more fully about this to the hon. Gentleman.

asked the Minister of Transport when he expects to receive proposals for the extension of the Fleet Line into South-East London.

I understand that London Transport hopes to put forward detailed proposals within a few weeks.

I am grateful to my right hon. Friend for that reply. Is he aware that Press reports in South-East London state that no action can be expected for 10 years on this line? Will he undertake to follow up these proposals as quickly as possible with action on the ground?

The proposals will have to be discussed both with the British Railways Board and the G.L.C.

asked the Minister of Transport if he will make a further statement on his plans to nationalise the ports.

No, Sir.

In view of our difficult economic situation and the fact that it is almost certain that the present Government will not be in power after the next General Election, would it not be wise to abandon this plan for the nationalisation of the ports?

No, it would not. The hon. Gentleman's arguments are based, as frequently happens, on a number of false premises. The reorganisation of the ports is regarded as long overdue and is welcomed by many people both inside and outside industry. Indeed, about the only people who still seem unable to understand it are hon. Members opposite.

Will my right hon. Friend take it from me that we on this side of the House believe that we should encourage the nationalisation of the ports at the earliest possible moment? Will not my right hon. Friend also agree that it is utter nonsense for hon. Members on the other side of the House to suggest that there will be a Tory Government after the next election?

I agree with my hon. Friend. The only thing which concerns me is that my hon. Friend still seems to be surprised when hon. Members opposite make these glaring errors. I agree that it is inconceivable that there will be a change of Government.

Will the right hon. Gentleman tell the House whether his plans will follow the principle of the centralisation of decision making or the principle of the decentralisation of decision making?

The hon. Lady will find this fully set out in the satements which have been made and in the White Paper. It is not intended that the management of these ports should be centralised.

Of the number of ports which my right hon. Friend intends to nationalise, could he say how many are privately owned?

One, Sir.

asked the Minister of Transport what talks he had with the Mersey Docks and Harbour Board recently when he visited Merseyside; and what future plans are being prepared for the port.

The object of my visit to the Mersey Docks and Harbour Board was to see something of the port facilities and to meet informally the members of the Board and representatives of the workers in the port. The preparation of future plans for the port is a matter for the Board.

Is my right hon. Friend aware that there is some disquiet amongst workers in the port who believe that some of the work that has been traditionally carried out by the Mersey Docks and Harbours Board is being sublet to private enterprise at a stage just before port nationalisation? Will he take a look at this problem, particularly in relation to dredging, since it appears that the only dredgers able to do the work in the Port of Liverpool at the moment are made in Germany, which seems a serious reflection on the position in this country?

This point was made to me by some of the men who work in the port. I had to explain to them that I have no powers in this direction in relation to what is still a port outside national control.

asked the Minister of Transport if he will send a circular to county councils and other local authorities giving guidance with a view to ensuring that all towns, villages and hamlets in England and Wales are adequately signposted.

Modern traffic signs to the standards recommended by the Worboys Committee are being provided by highway authorities as quickly as possible, within the limits of the funds available. We are consulting organisations concerned about target dates for the completion of the conversion programme.

Is the hon. Gentleman aware that it is almost like being in wartime Britain when leaving the main roads in some parts of the country? Is he aware that the popular pastime of vandalism has extended to road signs in rural areas, and that very often the local authorities neglect to replace them? Will the hon. Gentleman remind local authorities of their responsibilities?

I agree that it is the responsibility of local authorities, but the hon. Gentleman is rather exaggerating the amount of vandalism and also the lack of signs. Our side roads are reasonably well sign posted. The Worboys Committee, which reported two years ago, recommended a complete new set of signs more in keeping with the speed of modern travel and of traffic generally. However, it is an expensive business to complete these new signs and it is being done in stages throughout the country.

asked the Minister of Transport how many miles of motorways he now expects to be completed during 1969.

Nearly 44 miles, Sir.

Is not that a very disappointing figure? It is well below the average of the last few years. Surely we should be increasing the figure each year? Have cuts been made in the programmes during the last three years for the main motorways such as the M3 and M5, and is there a shortfall programme for this year?

I do not know why the hon. Gentleman should say that it is disappointing. The target figure announced in January was "about 45 miles", and 44 miles is about 45 miles. We expect to complete the target that we have set ourselves.

Would the right hon. Gentleman answer the second part of the question, whether there have been cuts in the programme this year? Could the right hon. Gentleman explain why the British Road Federation has claimed that of 37 schemes published for starting in 1969 by his Ministry, 18 have been delayed within six months?

In reply to the latter point, there is a subsequent Question, and in answering that I shall be able to answer the hon. Gentleman's point.

May we have the section of M4 around the south of Reading completed as soon as possible?

I give my hon. Friend my undertaking that that section and all the others will be completed as soon as possible.

In view of the unsatisfactory nature of the reply, I give notice that I shall raise the matter on the Adjournment at the earliest opportunity.

asked the Minister of Transport, in view of the Report on Accidents on the M4 1965–67 showing a better accident record and a superior braking force coefficient on the concrete as opposed to the asphalt sections, whether he will now construct all new motorway and primary route sections with a concrete surface.

No, Sir. General conclusions cannot be drawn from isolated tests on an exceptional motorway. Good roads with acceptable skidding resistance can be built with either asphalt or concrete, and it is my policy to use whichever will achieve and maintain the required standards more economically in each particular case.

Does not the Road Research Laboratory's Report on accidents on M4 clearly show that the braking force coefficient was superior on the concrete sections and that the asphalt sections were below the minimum standard required by the Road Research Laboratory? Does not this fact indicate that motorways should be constructed in deeply textured concrete as has been done in the last five years?

No, Sir. The point is that adequate roads can be built with either substance. The M4 is a quite exceptional motorway with very dense traffic on it. The problem is a common one of polishing over parts of it. This is not an argument for one form of covering as opposed to another.

My right hon. Friend referred to the economics of the situation. Should not safety rather than economics be the guiding line? In those circumstances, should not preference be given to reinforced concrete?

Only if there were evidence that concrete was of itself a better and safer form of surface than asphalt, but this is not the case. There is no evidence on this one way or the other. There can be safe roads on either.

asked the Minister of Transport how many miles of motorway originally planned for 1968–69 were carried over to 1969–70; how many miles planned for 1969–70 he now estimates will have to be carried over to 1970–71; and what amount of investment these deferments represent.

asked the Minister of Transport (1) what factors have caused the delays in the implementation of the motorway programme during the current year;

Of the 36 motorway schemes which it was expected in January, 1968, would be ready to start in 1968, eight totalling about 74 miles were carried over into 1969: of these 25 miles were started before 31st March, 1969, leaving five schemes totalling about 48 miles and costing about £50 million to be started in 1969–70. Of these five schemes about 35 miles have been delayed for six months or more. Delays have been due to a variety of factors, including the time required to deal with objections during the statutory procedures, difficulties of land acquisition and unexpected constructional problems.

Is not this rather unsatisfactory? In view of the continued growth of motor traffic, should not there be a steady increase in motorway construction instead of constant delays?

This is the whole point. Far from a steady growth, there has been a very rapid growth, and that is why at present the road programme is twice as big as it was when hon. Members opposite left office and six times as big as it was 10 years ago.

Does the right hon. Gentleman agree that whatever other cuts are necessary in public expenditure the motorway programme should not be cut but expanded? Will he give an answer now to the question asked earlier by my hon. Friend the Member for Tavistock (Mr. Michael Heseltine)?

The roads programme has been expanding ever since the present Government have been in office. It is considerably higher than it was when hon. Members opposite were in office. The basis of the Question was a report of the British Road Federation's statement that 18 motorway and trunk road schemes which should have begun this year will be delayed by an average of six months each, and that is not so.

Will the Minister therefore call for an inquiry to discover how it is that the British Road Federation should have in its possession information of this sort—how it can claim that in October, 1968, 37 schemes were published in detail for commencement in 1969 and that of the same schemes listed only six months later 18 have been delayed by an average of six months.

It is not for me to carry out inquiries into the statements of the British Road Federation. One would have thought that if hon. Members opposite wanted to inquire they would have asked the Ministry before putting down the Questions. The mistake that the British Road Federation made was that its statement was based on the assumption that lists of schemes issued to contractors for forward planning purposes, with estimated starting dates, constituted the Ministry's firm programme. It was made clear to contractors at the time that the lists issued were purely tentative, and I think that it is true to say that the first list published was clearly more than we could have constructed anyway.

Does not my right hon. Friend agree that it is rather strange to hear the nature of some of the complaints from the benches opposite not only because of our own expanded programme but also because the main reason for the delays is defending the individual, making sure that proper inquiries are held, that land is acquired properly, and that people have a proper opportunity to put forward their objection?

This is inevitable. One of the biggest causes of delay is the statutory procedures, and it is difficult to know how one can avoid them. I have great sympathy with hon. Gentlemen opposite and the hon. Lady, because the problem they face is the one we have seen before where one drafts the supplementary question before hearing the Answer to the Question.

asked the Minister of Transport if he is aware that inconvenience is caused to residents of towns on the periphery of London by commuters from more distant parts who ignore local authority car parks and park their cars in residential streets before taking trains to London; and if he will seek to provide against this practice.

The regulation of traffic and parking in London is primarily a matter for the Greater London Council. The Council is aware of this problem and is taking action as enforcement staff become available.

While thanking my hon. Friend for his two very helpful letters on this subject, may I ask whether he will consider circulating in HANSARD details of the London boroughs which already have schemes for residents' parking permits in their own streets?

I will consider that point. I shall decide later whether I shall write to my hon. Friend or circulate the information in HANSARD.

asked the Minister of Transport whether he is aware that internally illuminated bollards designed in accordance with British Standard 873/1959 constitute a road hazard; and if he will take steps to secure the design of improved bollards which would constitute less of an accident hazard.

We have little evidence to suggest that such bollards constitute a road hazard. The 1959 standard is, however, being revised to meet modern road and traffic conditions.

Is the Parliamentary Secretary aware that, following the removal of a number of bollards in my constituency, the number of accidents at the relevant junctions has declined substantially? To quote his hon. Friend the other Parliamentary Secretary, is there not some evidence that bollards constructed to 1959 standards are in fact unsafe?

I should need to have evidence of the type of accident concerned. I should need to know, for instance, whether it was caused by collision with a bollard, in which case the position rather than the design would be to blame. There is little evidence to suggest that the design of bollards constitutes any hazard.

asked the Minister of Transport whether, in the light of the report of the East Anglia Economic Planning Council and of the recent Ministerial decision affecting Cambridge roads, he will now give higher priority to the northern and western bypasses projected for Cambridge.

Preparations are going ahead on the Western bypass and being considered for the proposed Northern bypass as a preliminary to future programming. This preparatory design and other work is necessary before decisions can be taken about priorities.

Will the Parliamentary Secretary do his best to make an early announcement about the Northern bypass, which is needed just as urgently, if not more urgently, than the Western bypass? If he intends to visit East Anglia during the Summer Recess, will he bear in mind that he will be very much welcomed in Cambridge to see the situation for himself?

I am grateful to the hon. Member for his kind invitation to look at the situation in Cambridge. My right hon. Friend expects to make an announcement in the next few weeks relative to the Northern bypass.

While welcoming what the hon. Gentleman has said, may I ask him to bear in mind the importance of the A.45 road from Birmingham to the docks at Ipswich and Felix-stowe? This is a main highway which is particularly important in view of the fact that more goods are being taken from Hayes Wharf, such as in the Polish bacon trade, and sent to Ipswich and Felix-stowe.

We are aware of this and it was mentioned in the Green Paper on Strategic Routes.

asked the Minister of Transport what machinery exists for the co-ordination and planning of bridge building and repair work between British Railways, British Waterways, local authorities and his Department.

Under the special programme of bridge strengthening announced by my right hon. Friend's predecessor both boards are reconstructing or strengthening several hundreds of their bridges.

Is my hon. Friend aware that the failure to co-ordinate the work on Stanton Bridge in Derbyshire is causing considerable inconvenience to my constituency and the constituency of Derbyshire, South-East? I think he is aware that this bridge serves a major steel works. Cannot he get better co-ordination between the British Railways Board and local authorities?

I am aware of this problem. When two adjacent bridges are known to require reconstruction, such as these two bridges, the boards concerned are asked to liaise closely to ensure that they can prevent disruption to commercial and industrial establishments. The boards are doing this, but the problem before them is quite gigantic. British Railways has something like 13,000 substandard bridges and of the Waterways Board's 1,200 bridges about 500 are substandard. They have to spread the work of reconstruction and make the best job of it that they can.

Is not my hon. Friend aware that considerable delays and confusion are caused by questions of demarcation and by the buck being passed from one authority to another? Could he not streamline the co-ordination he has started on in order to make it more effective?

The job of the Ministry is basically to lay down the conditions and standards to which bridges must be kept, but I am sure the respective boards, having heard this Question, will take note and will co-operate together. If they have not been doing so already it would surprise me. I am sure they will do so in future.

asked the Minister of Transport what steps he intends to take next winter to minimise underbody corrosion caused by the spreading of salt on roads in icy weather.

We have insufficient knowledge of suitable all-purpose inhibitors which would effectively reduce the risk of underbody corrosion caused by salt, and direct action in the coming winter will not be possible. The Road Research Laboratory will, however, be testing two of the most promising types of inhibitors under field conditions next winter. Future policy on their use will depend on the results of this research, which are not likely to be available before 1970 or 1971.

I thank the Minister for that reply. Can he say what will be the extent of the experiments? Is it not a fact that we could have nation-wide experiments at a cost of about £1 million and could then see how much we are saving the motorist as regards corrosion, and, more important, perhaps increasing road safety as a result?

The Road Research Laboratory test will take place next winter with about seven new cars on the test circut at Crowthorne.

asked the Minister of Transport if he will take steps to ensure that all advance warning triangles carried by vehicles of this country comply with the appropriate British standard specification; and if he will make a statement.

We still have no evidence of non-complying triangles causing damage, but we feel it is desirable to have an agreed international standard and we are discussing this at present.

What is the meaning of the Government urging the Vienna Convention to insist that these triangles ought to be manufactured to a certain standard when they do not insist on that standard being observed in this country?

I said that we were working towards an agreement. An international standard is being prepared by the Economic Commission for Europe's Working Party on the Construction of Vehicles.

asked the Minister of Transport what steps he is taking towards ratification of the Vienna Convention on Road Traffic; and, in particular, what steps he is taking to ensure that advance warning triangles are carried by all motor vehicles in this country, other than two-wheelers, and used.

The Convention was laid before Parliament by my right hon. Friend the Secretary of State for Foreign Affairs on 3rd June. I hope that we shall later be able to ratify both this and the related Convention on Signs and Signals.

As 34 countries have signed the Convention, and as 11 European countries already require these advance warning triangles to be carried, would it not set an admirable example if we translated words into deeds and became the twelfth?

No, Sir. The Convention recommends countries to require their vehicles to carry these triangles. It is a recommendation and not a requirement.

asked the Minister of Transport when he estimates the Basingstoke motorway will be completed.

The section of the M3 between Popham in Hampshire and Lightwater in Surrey will be completed in 1971. Subject to satisfactory completion of statutory procedures we would hope to complete the remainder of the route to Sunbury Cross by the end of 1972.

Will the hon. Gentleman do all he can to speed this up? It is urgently needed not only for communications with the South-West but for the important Southampton-Bournemouth area as well.

I can give the hon. Gentleman that assurance.

asked the Minister of Transport what will be the total expenditure in the current financial year on the A30 and A303 roads to the South-West.

About £2½ million.

Is the hon. Gentleman aware that the roads are increasingly insufficient to deal with the very great volume of traffic there, particularly at this time of year? Will he go and take a look for himself?

I have been in the area and I am fully aware of the problem, which is to be found not only there but all over the country. But I agree with the hon. Gentleman that it is rather worse there at this time of the year. The total estimated value of improvement schemes for the area in progress or likely to start during 1969–70 is about £6¾ million, so that the hon. Gentleman will see that we are taking the matter seriously.

asked the Minister of Transport what is the normal interval between service areas on motorways.

About 12 miles, but usually only alternate sites are developed initially.

In that case, would it not be unnecessary, in the regrettable event of the M11 going down the Roding Valley, to put a service area in Chigwell, where it would ruin the amenities of a beautiful place?

We consider that when the M11 is complete three service areas will be needed—at or near Chigwell, near Harlow and near Newport.

Will the hon. Gentleman consider introducing service areas on the A1? This road is now almost a motorway, but has hardly any service areas and it is very difficult for motorists driving along it to get service or even refreshment.

The provision of service areas on trunk roads is not a direct responsibility of the Ministry.

asked the Minister of Transport when it is his intention to give approval to the scheme for the South Docks Road in Hull.

We do not at present consider that this scheme has sufficient priority to justify approval.

I thank my hon. Friend for that reply. Does he agree with me that any future benefits which we may get in Hull with better communications between the Al and the docks south and east of Hull may be largely nullified or negatived by delay and congestion in the centre? The road for which we are asking is parallel to the north bank of the Humber and would direct traffic out of the city centre around to the docks.

I appreciate the need for good communications from the Al to the Hull docks, but I am sure that my hon. Friend will agree that the land use transport study of the Hull area which is now going on will establish where the priority for this road lies.

asked the Minister for the Civil Service (1) whether he is satisfied with the terms on which established civil servants are being retired early with the offer of another job at a lower salary; and if he will make a statement;

A civil servant who is retired early and takes another job in the Civil Service at a lower salary may draw sufficient of any pension due to him to raise his income by way of salary plus pension to the level of the salary he was receiving on his retirement. He may refuse reemployment in a lower-paid job without loss of pension. I consider these to be satisfactory terms.

Does the right hon. Lady agree that there is some discontent with these provisions in the Civil Service and that it is important that people should be encouraged to do this without any feeling of loss of status?

The present arrangements are not unreasonable. However, as we look at the whole question of Civil Service superannuation in the course of the current review we shall be looking at this point in the light of recent circumstances.

Does not my right hon. Friend agree that there is considerable disquiet in the Foreign Service as a result of the fact that many senior Foreign Service officials have had to be retired through no fault of their own but simply because of a contraction in the size of the Foreign Service and the considerable recruitment when they joined? Is it not important that everything possible should be done to provide suitable alternative employment for these people?

I entirely agree with my hon. Friend, but I do not think that the present pension arrangements are any kind of deterrent to achieving this entirely sensible objective. But we are undertaking a review in the course of looking at the whole of the Civil Service superannuation arrangements and we shall bear this point very much in mind.

asked the Secretary of State for Foreign and Commonwealth Affairs whether, since 1969 is the 50th anniversary of the founding of the International Labour Organisation, he will now ratify those International Labour Organisation conventions which relate to hours of work.

It has been the policy of successive Governments only to ratify International Labour Conventions when our law and practice are in complete conformity with their provisions.

Is my hon. Friend aware that many people regard that as simply an escape route from facing up to the real problem? Is it not disturbing that in a British colony today people should be working in service industries for 15, 16 or 17 hours a day at a time when we are celebrating this great anniversary? Will he not think about this matter again?

As I informed my hon. Friend on 12th May, the United Kingdom, the Member State concerned, has not ratified the I.L.O. conventions which relate to hours of work; therefore, the question of applying those conventions to the dependent territories does not arise.

asked the Secretary of State for Foreign and Commonwealth Affairs what requests Her Majesty's Government received from Malaysia for military assistance in connection with the restoration of law and order after the recent disturbances and what replies were given.

None, Sir.

Is it the case that no request for arms was made? Secondly, can the hon. Gentleman say whether the whole question of Commonwealth assistance, particularly against subversion, will be fully discussed at Canberra?

The Malaysian Government recently asked us if we would supply some items of military equipment and we have told the Malaysian Government that we would be willing to supply the items requested subject to their being available and to there being an agreement on the method of payment.

Is it not very important that we should avoid giving any appearance of taking sides in this Malaysian problem, particularly having regard to the legitimate sensibilities of Singapore? Secondly, if there is to be any real and lasting settlement inside Malaysia, is it not very important that the Malaysian Government should be under no illusion but that it is Her Majesty's Government's opinion that it can be achieved only on the basis of a truly multi-racial society?

I fully agree with my hon. Friend on the latter point. Britain is the traditional supplier of military equipment to Malaysia and the Malaysian armed forces already use mostly British equipment.

asked the Secretary of State for Scotland if he will make a statement on the progress of the negotiations about the increases in wages proposed for the crewmen employed by the Caledonian Steam Packet Company; and when a settlement can be expected.

I understand that a settlement has now been reached.

I warmly welcome that reply and hope that good relations will soon again be established.

asked the Secretary of State for Scotland if he will take steps to reinstate forthwith teachers who were dismissed from teaching for failure to register with the General Teaching Council in respect of 1968–69, pending the outcome of his investigation into the number of teachers who are currently employed in schools and who have failed to reregister since 1st April, 1969.

No, Sir.

Will not the hon. Gentleman now recognise that unless these teachers who were dismissed last year are reinstated forthwith and unless the attempt to bully others into registration by threats of dismissing them is abandoned, the General Teaching Council itself is in danger of collapsing?

No, I would not accept either of those propositions.

asked the Secretary of State for Scotland (1) if he will make a further statement about the position of teachers in teaching posts who have failed to re-register with the General Teaching Council;

I have at present nothing to add to the Answer I gave to the hon. Gentleman on 21st May except that, according to the announcement of the General Teaching Council on 2nd June, 43,898 teachers had by then registered for the year starting on 1st April.—[Vol. 784, c. 85–6.]

Will not the hon. Gentleman now review the whole position? Will he consider simplifying the re-registration procedure and will he also consider the inequitable position of those teachers who were dismissed earlier this year?

The hon. Gentleman's first point could be taken up and no doubt will be taken up during the course of the review. Last year's registration is a separate matter and I have already given an answer about that.

Will not the hon. Gentleman now simply admit that the dismissal of qualified teachers who did not register was a mistake, and will he not have the courage to say so to everyone and get these teachers back where they are very much needed?

I do not think that it was a mistake.

asked the Secretary of State for Scotland what is his latest estimate of the date of publication of the report of the Royal Commission on Local Government in Scotland.

I have nothing to add to the Reply my right hon. Friend gave the hon. Member on 15th April.—[Vol. 781, c. 229–30.]

Since the Redcliffe-Maud Commission for England is supposed to be reporting on Wednesday, why is there such a hold-up with the Report of the Royal Commission in Scotland? Why is it not yet ready? Do the Government realise that a great deal of work is being held up in Scotland because many people are waiting for Wheatley?

The question of the finalisation of the Report is not a matter for the Government, it is a matter for the Royal Commission.