asked the Secretary of State for Wales whether he will now publish the comments sent to him by the Welsh Hospital Board about the report prepared for his Department on the hospital service in Pembrokeshire.

I do not propose to publish the detailed comments I have received on the report. I am studying these comments and I will write to the bodies concerned as soon as possible.

I thank my right hon. and learned Friend for that reply. Is he aware that there will be disappointment that the comments will not be published, and that it is now more than two and a half months since the report was prepared and one and a half months since those comments were received? When can we expect action on the recommendations of the report?

The recommendations and the report as a whole have been well received, and I know that people are anxious to hear my views, which I hope to make known very soon.

asked the Secretary of State for Wales if he will make a statement about the provision of port medical facilities at Milford Haven.

The port medical facilities at Milford Haven were discussed recently between the Port Health Authority and the Chief Medical Officer of the Welsh Office. I understand that further discussions are planned.

Is my hon. Friend aware that the port medical officer of health cannot fulfil the obligations laid on him by the Public Health (Ships) Regulations, 1966, or by the World Health Organisation without the co-operation of the Welsh Hospital Board and his Department, and that there is disappointment at the result of the discussions to which he has referred? Will he assure the House that he will give this matter his earnest consideration?

Yes, indeed. That was why I was able to say to my hon. Friend that further discussions are planned in the reasonably near future.

asked the Secretary of State for Wales when he next intends to visit West Flintshire.

On llth June.

I assure my right hon. and learned Friend that when he comes to West Flintshire—always assuming that he is able to get there along the A55 in the summer months—he will be a familiar and popular figure as he walks around the streets. Will he draw the attention of his right hon. Friends the Secretary of State for Trade and Industry and the Secretary of State for Employment to the unusually high unemployment figures, which may not be visible to him in the summer months but would be if he came in the winter, and ask them to consider what has happened to Oswestry and whether the same should not happen to West Flintshire?

Yes, I am well aware of the figures which my hon. Friend has mentioned. The area is subject to considerable seasonal variations, and a high percentage of those registered as unemployed in the Rhyl area are elderly retired people who have come to the area. I assure my hon. Friend that the coverage of assisted and non-assisted areas will be kept under review.

asked the Secretary of State for Wales what comments he has received from Flintshire County Council on his proposals for local government reorganisation in Wales; and what replies he has sent.

None, so far, Sir.

May I assure my right hon. and learned Friend that there will be a general welcome in Flintshire for his decision to follow one of the few wise recommendations bequeathed to him by the right hon. Member for Cardiff, West (Mr. George Thomas), to resist suggestions that there should be an enormous, cumbrous county spanning the whole of North Wales, and, on the contrary, to provide two smaller counties? Wherever else he may lack friends in his proposals for the reorganisation of local government, he will find a great deal of support in Flintshire.

Yes, Sir. Although I have received no official comments from the Flintshire County Council, I have had many comments from officials, councillors and people in Flintshire, and I am fully aware that the majority of people support the division of North Wales into two counties.

asked the Secretary of State for Wales if he will publish a list of the informal discussions which he had prior to publishing his proposals for local government reform in Wales.

No, Sir. I know of no predecent or reason for doing so.

Is the right hon. and learned Gentleman aware that the boundaries in his gerrymandering proposals appear to be based not on local government needs but upon last June's Conservative Party's canvas cards, and seem to have as their ultimate objective the aim of robbing the Labour Party of up to seven parliamentary seats in Wales? Will the right hon. and learned Gentleman explain why he was given the twin posts of Chairman of the Conservative Party and Secretary of State for Wales?

That sort of exaggerated language has already been condemned by the Welsh newspapers in the matter of local Government reorganisation. Many of the objections that I have received to local government reorganisation have come from people whom the hon. Gentleman would identify with the Tory Party. I only wish that all the supporters of the Conservative Party in Wales were 100 per cent. behind the local government reorganisation proposals. Before these proposals were put forward, I obviously had a large number of discussions with a wide variety of people of all political complexions, and it would be absolutely pointless to try to list them all.

On a point of order, Mr. Speaker. In view of the inadequate answer and the inability of the Secretary of State to give assurances of considerable constitutional importance, I give notice that I shall endeavour to raise the matter on the Adjournment at the earliest possible opportunity.

asked the Secretary of State for Wales what representations he has received from dental organisations regarding the manning of the dental service in Wales; and what reply he has sent.

None, Sir.

Did not the hon. Gentleman receive representations from the secretary of the chief dental officers of Wales in December last to the effect that the Answer given by the right hon. Gentleman to me that there were 120 dental officers employed in the school dental service of Wales was misleading to this House because there are, in fact, only 81? Will he now take the opportunity to correct this misleading statement, as he should have done months ago?

I was aware that the hon. Gentleman had asked a Question of my right hon. and learned Friend and had received an Answer. I was not aware that there was any difficulty about the Answer. If the hon. Gentleman will see me afterwards about this matter, I will most certainly look into it.

asked the Secretary of State for Wales when he now proposes to initiate the Dee Crossing Scheme.

I have nothing at present to add to my reply to my hon. Friend the Member for Liverpool, Waver-tree (Mr. Tilney) on 1st March.—[Vol. 812, c. 1202–3.]

Will the Secretary of State deny the statement that for the foreseeable future the Cabinet will not give the go-ahead to this grandiose scheme for this crossing of the Dee because it will not, or cannot, obtain the necessary financial support? Will he also deny the statement that, if there is to be any priority in regard to barrages across estuaries or bays, it will be Morecambe Bay that should have priority rather than the Dee Estuary?

This is a very important proposal, and a decision will be taken jointly by the Secretary of State for the Environment and myself after consultations with other Departments. It is a matter of considerable complexity, and, as I said previously, it would be wrong to rush into a hasty decision.

asked the Secretary of State for Wales what consultations he has had with Denbighshire and Flintshire County Councils about a new road bridge over the River Dee at Bangor-is-y-coed.

My Department has been in regular touch with bath county councils and remains willing to give any further help it can in resolving the disagreements between them.

Is the Secretary of State aware that there has been need for a bridge at Bangor-is-y-coed for many years, that the present bridge is frequently closed causing considerable inconvenience to people in the area, and that the Denbigh County Council is now in process of considering its seventh or eighth proposal on this matter? Would the Minister consider taking direct action to move the two county councils into action to make sure that the inertia of the two county councils is not regarded as having been laid down by divine ordinance? Cannot the authorities get a move on and get the bridge built?

Yes, this is a principal road bridge and the responsibility rests entirely on the two county councils. If I can be of any help in settling the problem, I shall be glad to do what I can at the request of both county councils.

asked the Secretary of State for Wales if he will call for reports from a sample of Welsh local authorities regarding their implementation of the Chronically Sick and Disabled Persons Act, 1970, to date; and if he will make a statement.

It is too early to seek to survey progress. Two Sections of the Act are not yet in force and several others have been in operation for only four months.

I am disappointed with that answer. Considering that the Act has been on the Statute Book since last August, having passed through the House without a Division and having been accepted by both sides, should it not now be implemented?

With respect, that may be the view of the hon. Gentleman, but the matter is one of some complication. The hon. Gentleman will see that on 11th February my right hon. Friend the Secretary of State for Social Services gave an answer to my hon. Friend the Member for Tynemouth (Dame Irene Ward) on similar lines to that which I have given today.

Will the hon. Gentleman not accept that little encouragement is being given to local authorities to try to do anything about the Act, and, indeed, the Government's attitude is a positive disincentive to action. If the Government will not activate Part I of the Act, does the hon. Gentleman not agree that little or nothing can be expected from local authorities other than what has been done by local authorities in my area, which have paid regard to this matter by starting to compile registers?

I understand the hon. Gentleman's concern, but I cannot accept everything he says. I would expect the recently formed social services committees of local authorities to be considering the needs of the physically disabled as a matter of priority and the provisions of the Act to be given full weight when competing priorities have been settled.

Would the hon. Gentleman bear in mind that the chronic sick and disabled regard the Secretary of State as their watchdog on the provisions of the Act and that they look to him for guidance and the necessary financial assistance to enable local authorities fully to implement the legislation which so affects the people concerned.

I am grateful for what the hon. Gentleman has said.

asked the Secretary of State for Wales if he will make a statement on the implementation of Section 1 of the Chronically Sick and Disabled Persons Act, 1970, in Wales; and if he will give guidance to Welsh local authorities regarding the collection of information about Section 1 of this Act.

The Order which is to be introduced shortly to bring Section 1 of the Act into operation on 1st October will apply to Wales. My Department will distribute to Welsh local authorities guidance on the use of survey techniques prepared by the Office of Population Censuses and Surveys.

Is the Minister aware that a survey will not identify one disabled person? Is he further aware that we want to identify actual disabled people in constituencies in Wales and in England and that a survey will not carry out this task? Will he not set an example and let Wales take a lead in this matter?

The first need is to assess the size and nature of the demand for services under the Act, and, in our view, the use of sampling and survey techniques is the better way to do this.

Is not the Minister aware that this cumbersome method of taking sampling surveys is easily got over by enlisting the voluntary help of the Boy Scout movement, which can accomplish the same thing at a cheaper rate and in a shorter time? Will he not urge other local authorities to do what has been done in my area; namely, to prepare leaflets informing all disabled people of their rights under the Act and leaving room for notification on the form of any person in a household so affected? Does he not agree that it is not the compilation of a register but the actual identification of people that matters in this respect, and that the best way to achieve these ends is to harness the help of the many bodies which are willing to undertake this work if they are given a lead by the Government?

I know full well the hon. Gentleman's interest in this important matter, and I can assure him that the Government are anxious to press on with it. Although I cannot add to my original answer, I will look further into the matter.

asked the Secretary of State for Wales how many of the 23 teachers in Wales who have received training in educational counselling are in a full-time post of school counsellor, in a part-time post, or not counselling at all, respectively.

I understand that, of the 23 teachers referred to, one has taken a post outside Wales, five are not employed on counselling work at present and 17 spend part of their time on this work.

Is the Secretary of State aware that the state of affairs revealed by his answer is even more unsatisfactory than that revealed by his answer on St. David's Day, when he said that 23 teachers had received training in counselling? Would he apprise local authorities of the importance of this subject in order to ensure that those who are trained educationally are able to undertake counselling?

I agree that there is a lot of room for improvement in the provision that is made. I read the hon. Gentleman's speech on the Adjournment on the subject and I agree with much of what he said. Certainly, a great deal of advice and many publications are available to the Welsh Office, and we shall see that they are distributed even more than they are at the moment.

Will the Secretary of State try to introduce into the programme of school counselling a system whereby counsellors could explain to school-leavers how to claim dole, since this year in a number of areas of Wales this problem will confront young people before they even get a job?

The hon. Gentleman would not expect me to say that that matter should be part of the function of school counselling.

asked the Secretary of State for Wales whether he will now publish the report of the public inquiry into the proposal to locate the Shoeburyness Gunnery Range at Pembrey.

asked the Secretary of State for Wales whether he will announce the findings of the court of inquiry into the proposed establishment of an artillery range at Royal Air Force, Pembrey, before a decision is made on the question of a third London airport.

I have already indicated that the inspector's findings will be published when the matter has been fully considered.

The right hon. Gentleman's reply is most disappointing. Does he not recollect that on St. David's Day, a month ago, he said that he would announce his decision very soon? Could he now say what is the reason for the delay, and, in particular, assure the House and the people of Wales that this delay is in no way caused by the deliberations which are now taking place on the location of a third London Airport?

There are many factors which have to be taken into consideration, and one must give very careful and detailed consideration to this matter. One of the factors which the Government must take into account is the siting of the airport.

Would the Secretary of State agree that, unless this decision is published before a choice is made about a site for the third London airport, people not only in Wales but in the country as a whole will think that skulduggery is afoot, since these are essentially separate issues and the question of amenity concerning the coastline in South-West Wales should not be muddled up with air traffic and air transport issues for the South-East of England?

I can assure my hon. Friend that there is no skulduggery afoot, but we have to take into account all the many important considerations. I hope to announce a decision as soon as possible.

asked the Secretary of State for Wales (1) to what extent, at his meeting with the Welsh Council on 29th March, 1971, he discussed unemployment as a problem of social and industrial imbalance between the various areas of Wales;

My dinner with the Council on 19th March afforded me the opportunity of reviewing generally its work over the past three years and of commenting on current problems in Wales. I understand that the Council will shortly be formally sending me its latest views on the economic situation, including problems of unemployment and investment.

Putting two Questions together when they are not related is a very bad thing. Is the right hon. and learned Gentleman aware that it is desirable, if we are to assist in solving unemployment in Wales, to minimise the amount of migration of all types of skilled workers from the Principality, the loss of whom could cause serious industrial imbalance? Is the right hon. and learned Gentleman aware that as a result of the high level of unemployment any further migration of skilled workers from Wales would place a serious strain upon Welsh local authorities, in that they would have to provide social services and amenities while at the same time suffering from the serious imbalance caused by a falling rate yield? Is not the Minister's duty, given the difficulty of obtaining investment in Wales, to see that a financial injection is given to Wales, where the policies of his party and the inattention of his party have resulted in things crashing around their ears? Could not he persuade the hopeless Government of which he is a member to do something about it?

I am just as concerned as the hon. Member about the high incidence of unemployment in Wales, which has persisted for many years. I am anxious to do all that is possible to bring that level down. But unemployment in Wales and the economic position of Wales cannot be isolated from that of the United Kingdom generally. As soon as the United Kingdom has an expanded economy and a reasonable rate of growth which is not being overrun by inflationary wage claims or undermined by industrial unrest, the unemployment rate will come down.

Is the right hon. and learned Gentleman aware that the new feature that is causing alarm in Wales is the fact that new industries brought into the country are beginning to close down, even though there is no rundown in the basic industry of coal? Is the Minister further aware that his complacency, as shown in the reply that he gave me when he said that he would discuss the economic situation with the Welsh Council only if the matter was raised by others, is appalling, and that he needs to pull his socks up if he is to do his duty by Wales?

The right hon. Gentleman knows full well that when I went to see the Welsh Council it was in order to have dinner at the end of its meeting. I did not attend its meeting. I had some informal discussions with members of the Council. I addressed them, as I have told the House. I have already said that I am very concerned about unemployment in Wales. The right hon. Gentleman has heard of the policies of this Government. I am satisfied that they will pay dividends, and that unemployment in Wales will decrease.

The Minister says that he is concerned about the high rate of unemployment in Wales. I want to know what he is doing about it. Does he agree that since 18th June no new decisions for further dispersal of Government establishments in Wales have been made? Will he confirm or deny that since that day action to bring 1,500 Ministry of Defence jobs to the Cardiff area has been stopped?

If the right hon. Gentleman wants to ask me a specific Question perhaps he will put one down. I should like notice of the matter before giving a firm answer.

Is my right hon. and learned Friend aware that the reasons for unemployment are varied, and that at this moment 250 people are losing their jobs in my constituency because of the cancellation of defence contracts by the previous Government?

There are many reasons for unemployment in Wales. The inheritance which this Government had has caused the difficulties that we are in at the moment. The right hon. Member for Cardiff, West (Mr. George Thomas) knows—I shall give him a figure anyway—that from 1964 to when we took over in June, 1970, there were 68,000 fewer males in employment in Wales.

Is the Secretary of State aware that the time is running out when he can rely on those foolish excuses? He has been in power for nine months and the day has come when he must take responsibility for the mounting and dangerous unemployment in Wales. Is he further aware that it is absolutely staggering that he cannot tell my right hon. Friend the Member for Aberavon (Mr. John Morris) what has happened in terms of the Government's decision about defence employment in Cardiff?

The unemployment situation in Wales is of considerable concern to all of us, but the right hon. Gentleman must not exaggerate the situation or try to cause unnecessary despondency. The differential between the respective unemployment rates of Wales and Great Britain is less than it was a year ago. It was 1·3 points for the first quarter of this year, compared with 1·5 points for the first quarter of last year.

On a point of order. Mr. Speaker. In view of the unsatisfactory nature of the reply, I beg to give notice that I shall raise the matter on the Adjournment at the earliest possible opportunity.

asked the Secretary of State for Wales, what representations he has received regarding the March figures relating to Welsh unemployment; and what replies he has given.

asked the Secretary of State for Wales what representations he has received about the trend towards heavier unemployment in Wales.

Representatives of the South Wales Advisory Committee of the T.U.C. raised this matter with me on Friday. Representatives of the North Wales Advisory Committee made similar representations to my hon. Friend the Minister of State earlier this month. We expressed our concern about the high rates of unemployment which have prevailed in Wales for several years and discussed the current economic and industrial policies of the Government with them.

Is the right hon. and learned Gentleman aware that the policies of which he seems proud—although he should not be—are the very reasons why the unemployment rate is accelerating? Will he now be candid with the House and admit that the substantial number of 68,000 lost jobs in Wales between 1964 and 1970 arose from the policies envisaged by the previous Conservative Government, for which they took no remedial steps?

The hon. Member talks about accelerating unemployment. The number of wholly unemployed in Wales was virtually unchanged between February and March, although in Great Britain as a whole it increased. In par- ticular, the number of males wholly unemployed in Wales declined. The hon. Member talks about the reasons for unemployment. The increase in Wales was due largely to a rise in the temporarily stopped. That was the aftermath of the postal strike, and the repercussions of other industrial disputes, particularly the Ford dispute.

Is the Minister aware that the answer that he has given does not conform to the facts, and that there has been a considerable increase in the underlying figures of wholly unemployed? Should he not be alarmed instead of complacent that, despite the fact that we have had an abnormally mild winter—one of the mildest winters since the war—and that the National Coal Board's pit closure programme is virtually completed, redundancy in Wales for the first 10 weeks has been running at a rate two-and-a-half times that of the annual rate in previous years, while the number of jobs in the pipeline has fallen alarmingly? Does he not realise that the people of Wales will not forgive his complacency and inaction at a time when the underlying unemployment figures are, if anything, being underestimated in Wales?

I am by no means complacent. I am very anxious to see the figures in Wales considerably improved, and I have every confidence that they will be. But the hon. Gentleman, who has a facility for bringing forward selected figures—[HON. MEMBERS: "Oh!"]—might be interested to know that since the June election the percentage increase in unemployment in Wales has been rather less than it has been in Great Britain as a whole.

Is it not a fact that, quite regardless of the lamentable inheritance from the previous Government, if the policies now being advocated from the benches opposite—if they are policies which are being advocated—were followed, they would make it quite impossible for anyone to build up profitable industry in Wales, on which future employment prospects must be based?

It was quite clear when we took over office in June, 1970, that the policies which had been pursued by the Labour Party had failed, and that a change of direction was needed. That is what we are doing.

On a point of order, Mr. Speaker. The Secretary of State has made an allegation that I have in some way selectively misled the House. What protection does a back bencher have against such an allegation, and am I able to ask the right hon. and learned Gentleman to explain that allegation?

That is not a point of order, and I am afraid that it is not in my power to give the hon. Gentleman protection.

Is the right hon. and learned Gentleman aware that the unemployment situation is now so grave that he can no longer fall back on bromides and platitudes to explain it? Is he not losing credibility in the Principality because of his absurd and continued suggestion that the situation is the fault of the Previous Government? Is he not aware that the time has now come for his Government to produce an unemployment policy?

I have already told the House that I am concerned about the high level of unemployment in Wales—[Interruption.]—as I am about the high level of unemployment in the United Kingdom. I have no doubt that the Government's policies will have the effect of bringing down this high rate of unemployment. [HON. MEMBERS: "When."] As I have said, a lot of factors must be taken into account. If we can have growth which is not overrun by inflationary wage claims or industrial disputes, unemployment will go down.

asked the Secretary of State for Wales if he will now make a ministerial broadcast explaining the effects of Government policies on unemployment and prices in Wales.

No, Sir.

Will the Chairman of the Tory Party not agree that, whilst the people of Wales have never had any reason to be grateful to the Tory Party, he could at least have taken this opportunity to make a Ministerial broadcast, and explain how the people now unemployed in Wales—and the figure is the highest March figure for many years— can benefit from the income tax reduction when it comes to meeting the increased prices which this Government are deliberately forcing on the people of Wales?

A Ministerial broadcast would be without precedent and would not be appropriate. I shall explain to the Welsh Grand Committee on 28th April.

I understand the Secretary of State's reluctance to go on Welsh television to defend the Government's record in Wales, but will he now tell the House why he is so coy about debating the matter? Will he now be prepared to debate the matter with me on Welsh television, as he was not prepared to do when invited, so that the Welsh people can hear?

The proper place for such a debate is in this House—[Interruption.]—or in the Welsh Grand Committee, and there will be an opportunity—[Interruption.]—for this debate on 28th April. I have discussed the Welsh economic scene on both Welsh radio and television.

Is not the problem of dealing with unemployment in Wales, which is a serious problem, rendered even more difficult by the fact that the Government also inherited a runaway inflation? Is it not appalling that hon. Members opposite should now be exaggerating the position, and so rendering the task even more difficult?

The Government inherited not only runaway inflation but short-term and medium-term debts to the extent of £1,500 million and the worst industrial relations scene since 1926.

asked the Secretary of State for Wales whether he expects a rise or fall in the level of male employment in Wales up to the end of 1972.

I expect further new industry to be attracted to Wales as a result of the measures being undertaken by the Government. But, as the previous Administration's experience fully proved, detailed forecasts of changes in employment for a period nearly two years ahead are not possible.

Putting shallow debating points aside, does not the right hon. and learned Gentleman agree that after nine months of Tory Government there is an increase in the level of unemployment in Wales, that investment is stagnant and that the interest of industrialists outside Wales in Welsh industry is declining? Is it not perfectly clear, therefore, that the policies pursued by the Government are irrelevant to the problems of Wales?

The policy of investment grants must not be considered in isolation. One must look at the whole package. I have no doubt that the changes which were announced by the Government will in the long run prove of benefit to Wales.

asked the Secretary of State for Wales when it is intended to begin the continuation of a new comprehensive secondary school in the mid-Rhondda area.

I cannot say. I understand that because of more urgent projects, the local education authority is not likely to make a formal submission in respect of the proposal for some time.

Will the Secretary of State indicate that this project is not being held up by the existence of the old Naval Colliery tip, and that if the existence of the tip is restricting the construction of the school he will call on the derelict land unit of the Welsh Office to give the advice necessary to ensure that the tip is cleared so that the comprehensive school can come to that area?

I understand that if the proposed school were built it would require some tip removal to provide the site, but that, I understand, is not the reason for the project being held up. The Glamorgan Education Authority itself decides priorities, and makes submissions to me which, presumably, reflect priority, but the project to which the hon. Gentleman refers has not commanded sufficient priority for submission to me by the authority.

Will the right hon. and learned Gentleman tell the House that he regards it as his duty to provide capital funds for the provision of new comprehensive schools in Wales as soon as possible in order to accord with the opinion of the vast majority of the Welsh people?

In this matter I have to pay attention to submissions which are made to me by the local education authorities.

asked the Secretary of State for Wales what changes he proposes to make in the terms of reference of the Welsh Council; and whom he has appointed as the new Chairman.

I shall make a statement as soon as possible on the terms of reference and membership of the Welsh Council. I announced on 23rd March that Mr. Melvyn W. Rosser had accepted my invitation to succeed Professor Brinley Thomas as Chairman of the Council.

Is the Secretary of State aware that he keeps the House waiting an inordinate time for his decision? When will he make this statement about the terms of reference of the Welsh Council? He is getting a reputation for causing the longest delay in Whitehall.

I am studying the terms of reference in detail to see whether they need any slight amendment in the interests of greater clarity, but I do not envisage that there will be any substantial changes. As to delay, I have got in touch with the T.U.C., the C.B.I., local authority associations and county and county borough councils, and am now considering their nominations.

asked the Secretary of State for Wales what recent discussions he has had with the British Steel Corporation concerning its investment policies in Wales.

asked the Secretary of State for Wales what proposals he has for safeguarding the interests of the steel industry in Wales.

asked the Secretary of State for Wales what recent discussions he has had concerning the investment policies for the steel industry in Wales; and with whom.

My senior officials have had discussions with members of the Corporation very recently, and I have arranged to meet the Deputy Chairman later this week. I also keep in close touch with my right hon. Friend the Secretary of State for Trade and Industry on all questions regarding the steel industry in Wales.

Has the Secretary of State indicated to the Corporation that he supports the decision to hold up the major investment scheme at the Spencer works after the matter had been thoroughly gone into by the Labour Government, and the go-ahead given? Does he appreciate that on 4th March the general manager at the works gave a categorical assurance that this scheme was to go ahead? What effect does he expect this turnabout to have on the morale of the work people? Does he support the idea of keeping a great industry dangling in mid-air? Why does he not stand up for Welsh interests, or else resign and make way for someone who will?

I certainly intend to stand up for Welsh interests and the steel industry in Wales. I am very conscious of the fact that it is the largest single industry in Wales, employing about 70,000 people, and that it should prosper.

Is the Secretary of State aware that on 18th March we not only heard what he has described as the revelations of the Secretary of State for Trade and Industry, but we also heard the Secretary of State for Trade and Industry say that he would hold up the Llanwern C development scheme? If he, as Secretary of State for Wales, has Welsh interests closely at heart, should he not go to the Secretary of State for Trade and Industry and ask him to make haste with releasing the money required for developing this great industry in Wales?

My right hon. Friend the Secretary of State for Trade and Industry explained why it was necessary for Llanwern C to be deferred.

Will the Secretary of State take this opportunity to repudiate those who suggest that Britain's steel needs should be met by importing steel from abroad? Further, will he impress upon his Cabinet colleagues the absolute need for the British Steel Corporation's investment plans to be restored to what they were under the Labour Government? Will he also impress upon the Cabinet the need for Britain to build three new integrated steel plants for the 1980s?

The Labour Government created this enormous organisation of the British Steel Corporation. The Corporation is obviously in some difficulty. My anxiety is to see that there is a steel industry in Wales which is viable and can afford proper and lasting employment opportunities for those who work in it.

; Does the Secretary of State really mean that he gave his approval to the hold-up in the Llanwern development scheme? Did he say "Yes" on behalf of his Department to the proposal from the Secretary of State for Trade and Industry that this development should be held up? What did the right hon. Gentleman say to the Secretary of State for Trade and Industry when it was proposed to abolish the investment grants? What effect does the right hon. Gentleman think that has had upon the steel industry of Wales? When will he make a statement in the House which can give some confidence to those who work in the biggest industry in Wales? Does he realise that every decision taken by the Government has done the gravest injury to the steel industry in Wales?

The hon. Gentleman is just repeating what he said in the debate on 18th March. I have nothing to add to what my right hon. Friend the Secretary of State for Trade and Industry said at that time. The decision on the deferment was a Government decision. I am a member of the Government and I share the responsibility for it.

In that case will the Secretary of State take care never again to refer in such terms to his inheritance from the Labour Government? The inheritance he had from the Labour Government in the steel industry was a go-ahead on capital investment, and that is what he is reversing.

The full inheritance by the Government in the steel industry will be known only after the deep-seated review has been conducted.

Has the Secretary of State received any representations from the North Wales trade unions about the need to construct an integrated steel works on the bank of the River Dee?

The answer to that is "Yes", Sir.

On a point of order, Mr. Speaker. In view of the unsatisfactory nature of that reply, I beg to give notice that I shall seek to raise the matter on the Adjournment at the earliest possible moment.

asked the Secretary of State for Wales what discussions he has had with the Welsh Hospital Board concerning the development programme at the Royal Gwent Hospital, Newport, Monmouthshire; what was the outcome; and if he will make a statement.

I would refer the hon. Gentleman to the answers given to him on 1st March. My Department has regular discussions with the Welsh Hospital Board about its development programme for the Royal Gwent and other hospitals in Wales.—[Vol. 802, c. 1204.]

Does not the Minister of State think that he is treating this matter in a rather dilatory fashion, particularly as consultants have indicated that they are taking calculated risks in sending patients home before they are properly fit, and that certain general practitioner emergency cases cannot be admitted at all because of shortage of beds? Does he want a major tragedy at this hospital before he takes any urgent action?

I have not been dilatory, and I fully realise the problem. I assure the hon. Gentleman that my Department is in very frequent touch with the Welsh Hospital Board on this matter.

asked the Secretary of State for Wales what representations he has received from National Health executive councils in Wales regarding increased charges for spectacles.

None, Sir.

I am rather surprised at the Minister's reply, because I have been receiving representations from all quarters both on the subject of increased charges for spectacles and on the whole range of increased charge for health services. The Minister received a letter from me last week from one authority, but I have others which will arrive on his desk in due course. The Minister and his right hon. Friend—

Question!

Order. The hon. Gentleman must put this in an interrogatory form. He must ask the Minister whether he is aware of these interesting facts.

My apologies, Mr. Speaker. Does the Minister think that these increased charges will lead to an improvement in the health of the Welsh people or a deterioration, because he keeps referring to inflationary wage claims? He is inviting inflationary wage claims with the proposed charges.

The letter which the hon. Gentleman sent to me did not come from the executive council, although it came on executive council paper signed by an ophthalmic optician. On the hon. Gentleman's second point, children under 16 and those over 16 who are still attending full-time at school will still be exempt from charges for standard lenses, and children's standard frames will be provided free.

asked the Secretary of State for Wales what is the number of redundancies, of which he has been notified, in the counties of Brecon and Radnor since 1st January, 1971; and what is his estimate of the number likely in the next three months.

Notification of redundancies is made to my right hon. Friend the Secretary of State for Employment. I understand that since 1st January this year the Department of Employment has been notified of redundancies involving the loss of 715 jobs. It is not possible to make any estimate of the number likely to be notified to the Department in the future.

In that case I wonder whether the right hon. Gentleman can help me by saying whether this includes the figures expected for Teddington Aircraft Controls, which will close on 9th April. I want the Minister to tell the House what he is prepared to do to help in this instance, particularly as this is a factory in a special development area, and the firm intends to transfer operations to Streatham, which is outside a development area. In that case, will the Secretary of State tell the House what he is prepared to do to intervene?

The increase in the redundancies since the reply which was given to the hon. Gentleman by my hon. Friend is due to the closure of Teddington Air Controls. Apart from that, there would be a total of 63 redundancies since 1st January of this year. The hon. Gentleman will be aware of the special circumstances in which it was announced that Teddington Air Controls was to be closed. It is a matter of concern, and my Department is in touch with the company.

asked the Secretary of State for Wales what was the date on which he received the Welsh Council Report on Investment Incentives; whether he discussed this report with the Welsh Council when he attended its meeting on 19th/20th March; and whether he will make a statement.

The report was formally submitted to me immediately before Christmas, but I had previously discussed the conclusions with the Chairman of the Council. The contents of the report were not raised with me on 19th March. I am grateful to the Council and to the Panel for their thorough study of a complex issue. I shall be replying to the Council in due course.

Is the Secretary of State aware that this ill-considered report was very fiercely contested within the Welsh Council by our leading Welsh industrialists—I know my facts on this—and that this report—[Interruption.] I let my guard drop then. Is the Secretary of State aware that, despite this report, unless cash is provided for firms in their first two years whilst they are waiting to make their profits, we can expect far greater disaster amongst the new industries in Wales?

I am very interested to hear the right hon. Gentleman's views that this was an ill-considered report and also to hear his expressions of what went on at the Council. I do not believe that he is a member of the Council or of the Panel. The report, as the right hon. Gentleman knows, is extremely well thought out, and I found it very useful. I am considering it very carefully.

rose—

Mr. Kinnock, Question No. 23. I am sorry to be cutting down on the supplementary questions, but I should like to get to the end of Welsh Questions today, if possible.

asked the Secretary of State for Wales what discussions he has had with local authorities on the subject of promoting industrial growth in Wales.

Industry and employment questions have been raised at nearly all the meetings I have had with local authorities or their representatives since I took office.

Is the right hon. and learned Gentleman aware that this brings no puzzlement to hon. Members on this side of the House, since, in answer to a Question by my right hon. Friend the Member for Cardiff, West (Mr. George Thomas) earlier this month, we were told that, in response to a request for help from the large projects pool, local authorities received £2,195,000 instead of the £10,468,000 which they had requested? On the basis of such figures, how can anyone be expected to give credibility to the claim that the Government have made that they would improve the infrastructure of Wales?

The hon. Gentleman will know that a large number of the applications to be included in the large projects pool have been agreed.

Could the right hon. and learned Gentleman publish and circulate to local authorities a paper on the exact functions that he performs in relation to industrial development in Wales? Is it not a fact that he has no responsibility for the allocation of advance factories? Is it not the case that he has very few facilities within his Department to obtain proper advice about the industrial state of Wales, and that he has now given up intervening in any Government decision which is adverse to Wales?

The hon. Gentleman knows that the last part of his supplementary question is untrue. I have my responsibilities in so far as many of the matters to which he has referred are responsibilities of overall functioning. When my right hon. Friend the Secretary of State for Trade and Industry is doing something in relation to Wales he always lets me know and takes my views into account. It is true that I have no executive functions; neither did the right hon. Member for Cardiff, West (Mr. George Thomas) when he was in office. But there is no doubt that the Welsh Office is very much concerned with all matters relating to unemployment and growth opportunity in Wales.

asked the Secretary of State for Wales what is his policy on nursery schools.

It is as outlined in Circular 8/60.

First, would the Secretary of State not agree that, subject to parental approval, it would be a desirable objective that children of two years of age should have part-time nursery schooling? Secondly, could the Secretary of State tell us when he intends to visit his first Welsh nursery School? Has he visited one?

I visited a nursery school in Newport a few months ago. As the hon. Gentleman knows, I give priority to the improvement of old and inadequate primary schools. We shall re-examine our policy on nursery education when this programme has taken effect.

asked the Secretary of State for Wales what alterations he proposes in plans for the improvement of primary schools in Wales.

None. The Government's policy announced in 1970 is designed to replace or improve within the next five years all inadequate pre-1903 schools for which there is a long-term need. I intend to press ahead with this policy as quickly as resources will permit.

While thanking my right right hon. and learned Friend for that reply, may I ask him whether he will also look at some of the schools which were built between that date and the 1920s? Does he not agree that some of those need some modernisation?

Certainly. These schools are looked at, but the priority is to complete the replacement of all the old pre-1903 primary schools, for which there is a long-term need.

asked the Secretary of State for Wales what further plans he has for the improvement of the infrastructure facilities in Wales.

The Government's objective is to improve infrastructure in the older industrial areas. The term covers a wide range of services including roads, housing, land reclamation, on all of which the Government will pursue vigorous policies.

Is my right hon. and Learned Friend aware that there is a great deal of evidence that the greatest need for infrastructure in some parts of Wales is still the improvement of our mad communications? Will he give some heavy weight to this consideration?

I agree, and very heavy weight is being given to the improvement of roads.

As the Secretary of State says that heavy weight is being given to the provision of infrastructure, will he not accept that we on this side of the House and the people in Wales find that difficult to believe? Is he not aware that in the first two months of this year, according to the Department of Employment, 3,695 redundancies were notified in Wales alone? Will the right hon. and learned Gentleman lend extra weight, if possible, to the provision of new jobs in Wales?

If the hon. Gentleman finds it hard to believe that great emphasis is put on our infrastructure in Wales, it shows that he has not read the figures published or listened to the answers that I have given.

Could the right hon. and learned Gentleman say, in the matter of land dereliction, that the Lower Swansea Valley project, in Swansea, will now be financed out of the special projects pool?

No, I cannot say that without notice. If the hon. Gentleman would like to get in touch with me, I will certainly give him an answer.