asked the Secretary of State for Scotland when he hopes to make a statement on safety for school pupils and others in the mountains.

I hope to issue early in the new school session a circular giving fresh guidance to education authorities on all aspects of safety in outdoor pursuits.

Will the circular be more than simply an expression of virtuous intent?

I certainly hope so. My right hon. Friend and I are determined that while we want to see an increase in outdoor activities at school, we do not want any unnecessary loss of life. Besides this circular, at my request the three sports councils, with the co-operation of my hon. Friend who has responsibility for sport in England, and the Welsh Office, will co-operate in a publicity campaign this autumn indicating the dangers of mountaineering.

asked the Secretary of State for Scotland if he will make a statement on the level of fishing vessel grants and subsidies.

A revised subsidy scheme for the inshore industry was approved by the House yesterday. My right hon. Friend has no plans at present to change the arrangements for grants and loans for the construction of fishing vessels.

Does the Under-Secretary remember that in the flush of enthusiasm for killing off lame ducks the Government cut the development grant to the industry for new building by 10 per cent.? Now, having recanted in every other field of investment decision, why have the Government left the white fish industry as the only disadvantaged industry with the cut not restored?

The hon. Gentleman is casting a very unfair reflection on the industry, bearing in mind that more applications have been received and approved in the first six months of this year than in the whole of 1970. The kind of picture which the hon. Gentleman presents is not true of the Scottish industry.

Is the hon. Gentleman aware that my hon. Friend did not paint a picture of the industry? He said that in every other industry these grants have been restored and no argument has been advanced for maintaining the present cut. This is what the Under-Secretary has to defend—not the fact that thanks to our subsidy basis in the past the industry is flourishing.

I am surprised at the hon. Gentleman, particularly as he is a former Minister. There has never been a direct relationship between grants for fishing vessels and those available for development areas. It would be to the detriment of the fishing industry as a whole if the grants were on the same basis as for the development areas. The fishing industry is important on its own account; it is given its own treatment and it is not necessarily tied to other things.

asked the Secretary of State for Scotland if he will conduct a survey in the industrial part of Scotland, using his Alkali Inspectorate, to inquire into plants which are emitting dust and grit which are proving a danger to health or causing physical irritation, with a view to establishing the size of the problem and therefore determining to what extent his Alkali Inspectorate needs to be strengthened to deal with the problem.

All works registered under the Alkali Acts are already subject to continuous inspection by the Inspectorate of Industrial Pollution. In addition, my right hon. Friend's Department has been joining in a comprehensive review of air pollution monitoring in Britain, and an announcement will be made when the results of the review have been considered.

I thank the hon. Gentleman for that reply, but I have met the alkali inspector in my constituency along with the management of a certain plant belonging to the British Steel Corporation and I wish the Minister to note that virtually in Lanarkshire as a whole we are much bothered by this problem. Irrespective of what the alkali inspectors, the public health inspector and the medical officer of health may say, none of the things we want are being done. Has the Scottish Office any power to do something about this problem, which is causing a great deal of irritation and, most important of all, is injurious to the health of people in the various localities affected?

I am well aware of the hon. Gentleman's close interest in this matter and of the problem of his constituency. It is the policy of alkali inspectors to contact the firms concerned when there are problems of this kind and to press them as hard as they can within reason to take action. I think that the hon. Gentleman will agree, in the case of the Clydesmill Works, that special efforts have been made by the people running the plant. After this winter, when the intermediate pressure boiler capacity is taken out altogether, things should improve there. I shall keep the matter under very close watch.

asked the Secretary of State for Scotland if he will seek to make an official visit to the Scandinavian countries.

I have no plans at present to do so.

I hope the right hon. Gentleman will concede that that is an unfortunate reply. Will he make plans to go to Norway to examine, in particular, Norway's regulations in respect of North Sea oil and its Continental Shelf which clearly show that the Norwegian Government have plans for keeping a part of their Continental Shelf within governmental control and also for ensuring that Norwegian producers have proper treatment from the firms which operate on their Continental Shelf?

I am already aware, without going there, that there are no formal conditions laid down by Norway about the use of Norwegian equipment and that the present Norwegian rate of royalty is 10 per cent. as opposed to 12½ per cent. in this country.

Is the right hon. Gentleman aware that considerable changes are at present being made by Norway, and that in one case it has increased the royalty to 12½ per cent.? Would it not be a good idea if the Secretary of State went? Ministers have gone to various Scandinavian countries in the past in respect of our fishing interests. We now have a new and potentially very great interest. Will the right hon. Gentleman think about it again?

I have not ruled out going to Norway, and I should very much like to go. I have been somewhat occupied in the House in recent weeks and have certainly not been able to go. We should like to hear from the right hon. Gentleman about the statement in the policy discussion document called "Labour's Programme for Britain" to the effect that the present licences would all be taken away as soon as possible by a Labour Government, especially since many of them were issued during the period of the last Labour Government in 1969, and the statement threatens to bring to a grinding halt the whole process of exploration and deprive many people of jobs.

asked the Secretary of State for Scotland if he will arrange for the Scottish Development Department to study the feasibility of allocating Gov- ernment development contracts to Scottish firms to help them acquire the expertise required for the manufacture of equipment for the North Sea oil industry.

One of the intentions of the current Government study into the opportunities for British industry arising from the oil developments is to ascertain in what way it would be possible to encourage and assist British firms to participate.

Will the Secretary of State agree that the major challenge facing the Government at present in relation to North Sea oil is to do everything they possibly can to ensure that Scottish firms make the maximum contribution to the hundreds of millions of pounds worth of equipment and services now being purchased by the oil companies? If the Government can provide substantial support in the form of development contracts to the computer industry and the aircraft industry, is it not reasonable to urge in the case of the oil industry that Scottish firms should obtain similar development contracts to enable them to acquire the expertise as quickly as possible?

I agree on the first point. It is one of our prime objectives. The good example which some Scottish firms have shown and are showing of going out vigorously seeking business in North Sea oil developments should be followed by others, and I entirely agree about that. Scottish industry has told us that the best way in which the Government can help is by quickly providing the infrastructure, and this is what we are doing.

Is it not ironical that the expertise of Scottish engineers is well known in operations abroad yet the oil companies tend to think they have no experience in this sphere because they have not done this particular work before? Will my right hon. Friend see what he can do to encourage developments in this way, not only by Government contracts but by encouraging those who have licences to use Scottish firms?

Yes. Sir, I can promise my hon. Friend that. I have said this before. The drilling of the sea bed is a particular kind of operation which the Americans have been doing for 20 years or more and they have become experts at it, but we can co-operate with them and then ourselves specialise in the techniques which are required for the North Sea.

Surely this is the whole point. The experience of the Americans has hitherto been in fairly shallow waters. We are now moving into deeper waters and a new technology is developing. Would it not be worth while, through a system of development contracts, or additional support to universities, for Scotland to get into this work? This kind of experience and work may be even more lasting than the oil itself.

The right hon. Gentleman is repeating some of the words that have used in recent months, which is a change, because last year I was pointing out that the depth of water and the formidable conditions in the North Sea required an advanced technology, some of which has not yet been developed. The right hon. Gentleman will have seen the report today about Heriot-Watt University holding a symposium on the subject later this year.

But what are the Government going to do about it?

The Government are already doing something about it, as the right lion. Gentleman would know if only he would listen to some of the things that we have said during debates, for example during last Thursday's debate. All he does is to be hypnotised by his own words.

asked the Secretary of State for Scotland what was the estimated cost of constructing the new sheriff court in Glasgow on a cleared site; what is the estimated cost of construction if the church at present on the proposed site is to be preserved; and what is the proposed date for starting construction.

Estimated costs of alternative ways of siting the new sheriff court house are being prepared by the Glasgow Court House Commissioners. The starting date depends on the resolution of the planning issues and the speed of negotiations for acquisition of the land.

The hon. Gentleman will be aware from Written Answers given earlier this week that this is probably the busiest sheriff court in the country, dealing with 34,000 cases last year, for example, and that there is a waiting period of three to four months for an accused person to come to trial. Will the Minister make himself fully aware of the urgent need to press ahead with the construction of the new sheriff court as quickly as possible?

I share the hon. Gentleman's concern for the need to provide a new sheriff court in Glasgow, though I think it fair to say that any delays which take place in Glasgow are not related only to the question of accommodation. During last year, as the hon. Gentleman knows from figures given to him, a considerable effort was made to try to clear the backlog of cases. I share the hon. Gentleman's concern and, in so far as we can help, we shall do all we can to speed up the process.

In his plans to rebuild the sheriff court on a new site, will my hon. Friend resist any attempt to destroy the church which is at present on part on the site, since it would be a most valuable feature of the scenery of Glasgow, which needs to have this sort of building preserved?

I note what my hon. Friend says. Since formal application for a listed building consent may be made, it would not be appropriate for me to comment at this stage on the merits of retaining the church or its tower.

I appreciate what the hon. Gentleman said in the latter part of his reply, but will he bear in mind that the court commissioners are now the responsibility of the Scottish Office and that the appointment of sheriffs substitute some years ago in an effort to clear the backlog of cases has not met the need? It is now 10 years since some of us were pressing for more accommodation in this area. Despite the assurance which has been given, will the hon. Gentleman take the matter up with the local authority at the earliest possible moment?

What the hon. Gentleman says is not entirely correct. Part II of the Sheriff Courts (Scotland) Act, 1971, does not come into effect until 1st April, 1973, and it is not till then that responsibility passes to my right hon. Friend.

This is an important building on an important site in the centre of Glasgow. Will it be possible for the public to make comments on the plans when they are produced? Second, will particular attention be paid to the need in the new court building for decent accommodation for witnesses, since the existing conditions are quite abominable?

There are issues other than that concerning the church. For example, there are plans to divert a sewer and major questions of land acquisition. However, I note what the hon. Gentleman says. As regards accommodation for witnesses, I could not agree more that it is essential in a modern court house that proper provision be made, and throughout Scotland, where we are able to do so, we are trying to improve it.

asked the Secretary of State for Scotland if he will make a statement on the meeting his Department had on 6th July with the Scottish Pre-School Playgroups Association.

As a result of this meet-my right hon. Friend has authorised a capital grant of £2,500 to the association and an increased grant towards current expenditure at the rate of £8,000 for a full year. I welcome the association's plans for the expansion of playgroups.

Is the hon. Gentleman aware that his announcement of a further allocation of resources for pre-school education will be welcomed by mothers of young children and all the people interested in education? Can he tell the House to what extent the Opposition assisted him in getting this further financial allocation by choosing one of their Estimate days for a debate on pre-school education in the Scottish Grand Committee?

I am grateful to the hon. Gentleman for his interest in this subject and the speeches he has made in the House. The present Government listen to all shades of opinion.

asked the Secretary of State for Scotland how many social work departments and education authorities have now replied to his request for information on proposals they have for further development of pre-school playgroups; and if he will make a statement.

So far three local authorities have sent my right hon. Friend their proposals and he expects to receive the remainder by the autumn. The first indications are that local authorities will give increasing support to the provision of playgroups.

In the light of the hon. Gentleman's reply, will he consider issuing a fresh circular to local authorities giving them advice on how to assist in increasing the number of pre-school playgroups, with particular emphasis on providing premises for the groups?

When all the authorities have replied, which should be by the autumn, we shall look at the matter very carefully to see whether further information would be of benefit to them.

asked the Secretary of State for Scotland what further information he has now received from local authorities in Scotland regarding the effect of the implementation of the Housing (Financial Provisions) (Scotland) Act.

asked the Secretary of State for Scotland what further consultations he now proposes to hold with local authorities regarding the implementation of the Housing (Financial Provisions) (Scotland) Act.

I met representatives of the Scottish local authority associations on 31st July to discuss aspects of the implementation of the Act. Further consultations will be held as necessary.

When the Under-Secretary has these further consultations will he discuss this matter with local authorities, and particularly with Stirling Town Council, which on balance is an anti-Labour local authority, which has decided to include in its rent books a notice that the rents are being increased, not on the will of the council but as a direct result of the Tory Government's legislation? Will he recognise that concern is felt by local authorities in Scotland about the impact which this Measure will have on their tenants?

It is not for me to say what Stirling Town Council should or should not do in the terms of what it says to its tenants, but I am glad that the council has succeeded in agreeing that it will implement the Act, as the vast majority of local authorities in Scotland have done.

Does my hon. Friend agree that every responsible tenant and every sensible local authority will welcome the implementation of this Act, which gives much help to those in need?

Yes, Sir. My hon. Friend is correct. I am sure that many local authorities will have realised the benefits being given for the first time to people by way of rent allowances which they have never had before, better slum clearance, a universal rent rebate scheme and the saving on the rates which will be worth while. All these things will be attractive to many people in Scotland.

asked the Secretary of State for Scotland how many housing authorities have now informed him that they will not implement the Housing (Financial Provisions) (Scotland) Bill when it becomes law.

A small number of authorities expressed opposition to the Bill before its enactment. Since it received Royal Assent I have received no intimation that any local authority intends not to implement its provisions.

Is the right hon. Gentleman aware that the fact that he has not so far received representations does not mean that opposition to this Act among the local authorities has lessened in any way? Will he undertake to have further discussions with the local authorities to see whether it is possible to postpone the application of the Act and in any event, before he decides to take any default action under the Act, will he be prepared to report to the House of Commons?

My hon. Friend the Under-Secretary had a meeting only the day before yesterday with local authority representatives about the working of the Act. I and all my hon. Friends will do all we can to help local authorities in understanding and operating the Act. I cannot give the undertaking about reporting to the House because the House is supposed to be in recess as from the end of next week.

Will my right hon. Friend try to find out how many tenants, whether of private accommodation or local authority housing, living in areas controlled by such authorities stand to have their rents reduced by the Act? Will he publicise that information so that if there should be any delays in the receipt of those reductions those concerned will know who is responsible?

I will certainly consider that. It is well known that a large proportion of public authority tenants will benefit from this Measure. Those who are most in need will have their rents reduced or rents will not go up, or there will be special rebates. Those private tenants who never had a rebate scheme before will have a rent allowance scheme. It would be folly to deny them the benefits of the scheme. This is hypothetical, however, because no such situation has yet arisen.

Is the right hon. Gentleman aware that some of the people affected are not paying any rent at present because of the provisions of other Acts? Is he further aware that over 90 per cent. of councils already have a rebate scheme and in many cases the Government's rebate scheme is very much worse than many of these? Bearing in mind that the Act has been in force for only six days, does the right hon. Gentleman agree that it is not surprising that he has not received any representations? Many local authorities will also be on holiday. Will he tell us whether it is his intention to send out circulars about this to local authorities, telling them how he will construe his duty under the Act and what he proposes to do? Will he send copies of all such circulars to every Scottish Member?

As regards the right hon. Gentleman's last point, we are sending out circulars to supplement the information already passed to the local authorities and I will certainly consider sending copies to Members of Parliament. As regards the entering into force of the Act, I have already made special arrangements by a commencement order that it enters into force tomorrow so as to give local authorities about four weeks' notice before 1st September, which is the date when notice would have to he given about rents to tenants. As regards rents, not only will there be the same number of people—probably more—who do not pay rent because of supplementary benefits, but under the Act there will be nil rents and there will be rent rebates on a standard scale throughout Scotland, not limited to those local authorities which at the moment have miscellaneous and various schemes.

asked the Secretary of State for Scotland if he will take steps to amend the housing improvement grant scheme so as to direct it towards the provision of help to those who are in need; and if he will make a statement.

The purpose of the improvement grant scheme, since its introduction in 1949, has been to secure the modernisation of as many houses as possible, and my right hon. Friend has no proposals for amending it.

Is the hon. Gentleman aware that the housing improvement grant scheme is being abused? Is he not aware that old or derelict houses can be purchased and improved for use as a second home or a holiday home and then sold for a substantial profit? Does he not know of this practice? Will he look at the matter with a view to curbing this kind of activity and allow those who require a better home to get the substantial assistance that is available?

Local authorities have discretion to refuse grants if they think it is unreasonable that they should be granted, perhaps for some of the reasons which the hon. Gentleman has mentioned. I prefer to look at it this way: that every house improved is a house that is there to help the housing problems of those who are homeless, and that is very much to be welcomed.

Has my hon. Friend noticed the wording of the hon. Gentleman's Question? Is it not totally contrary to the policy of the Labour Party that assistance in matters of houssing should be concentrated on those in need?

I could not hope to be regarded as an authority on the policies of the Labour Party, but it appears to me that the reference to those in need shows that the Labour Party is at last being converted to the principle which we have brought in in our Bill.

Will the hon. Gentleman explain the Tory Party's policy in applying a means test to council tenants but applying no means test to the people who apply for and get housing improvement grants?

There are no means tests either for council tenants or for private owners in the matter of improvement grants. If the hon. Gentleman does not like that, he should have pressed his right hon. Friends who introduced the improvement grant scheme to introduce that element into it. My view is that every house improved is a house to help the housing shortage, and I should have thought the whole House would have welcomed that.

asked the Secretary of State for Scotland if he will now seek to introduce legislation to prevent local authorities from refusing to give 75 per cent. house improvement grants for other than owner-occupied property.

It is the Government's desire that as many homes as possible should be improved with the higher rate of improvement grant, whatever their ownership. If I saw any widespread evidence that tenants were being denied this benefit I would of course consider what action to take.

Is my hon. Friend aware that there is indeed such evidence? Is he aware that thousands of tenants in Aberdeen are being denied the chance to improve their homes through a recent decision of the Aberdeen Council housing sub-committee and that it is the poorest tenants who are hardest hit? Will he undertake to examine the legislation closely to see how it can be amended to ensure that the council does not abuse the Government's intention to have people improve their own homes?

I shall certainly look very closely at the evidence my hon. Friend has sent me, for which I am grateful. I should deprecate it if it were the case that any local authority is denying the benefits of improvement grants to all tenants purely because they are tenants. That would be a heartless idea.

Will the hon. Gentleman undertake to see how the excellent improvement grant scheme is working under different local authorities? Is he aware that in my area houses and cottages in villages and towns are tending to be bought up as holiday cottages while houses in remote areas, which would be perfectly good holiday houses but which will never be occupied by local people, are not coming on to the market? Is there not a need to see how the scheme is operating and how local authorities could be encouraged to improve it?

I note what the hon. Gentleman has said. As I said in answer to an earlier Question, local authorities have discretion not to give discretionary improvement grants if they think that the circumstances do not warrant them. I hope that that discretion will be used in a sensible manner.

Is the Minister aware that what Aberdeen Town Council is doing is protecting tenants in Aberdeen from the avaricious landlords who are buying up streets of houses, converting them and then letting them at exorbitant rents or selling them, totally abusing the system of improvement grants? Such landlords have no concern for the tenants but are concerned solely to make the fastest buck possible. The decision of Aberdeen Town Council has the widest possible support in the City.

I will not comment, without making inquiries, on whether the hon. Gentlemen's highly-coloured description of what is going on in Aberdeen is correct. It occurs to me that the only thing from which the corporation is protecting tenants is receiving the benefits of having their houses improved. I should have thought that to be very unfortunate.

asked the Secretary of State for Scotland what is the total number of dwellings below the tolerable standard in Scotland at the latest convenient date; how many of these are intended for demolition; and how many for improvement.

I estimate that there are about 200,000 houses which do not meet the tolerable standard, and that about one-quarter of them might be improved.

In the middle of June when I last asked a Question on this subject the hon. Gentleman said that about 70 housing authorities in Scotland had not completed the first surveys under the 1969 Act. When does the hon. Gentleman expect the surveys to be completed so that he will no longer work on estimates but on figures?

It would be misleading to suggest that we could ever get to the point where we had complete and absolutely accurate up-to-date figures for this from the whole of Scotland, because the situation is changing all the time. As I said on the last occasion, most of those who had not replied represent the smaller authorities which do not have the same scale of problem as the main authorities. It is our policy to encourage all housing authorities to work as quickly as possible either to improve or, if that is impossible, to demolish all houses below tolerable standards, and we are giving quite a lot of help to local authorities to do this.

Does my hon. Friend agree that the shocking number of houses in Scotland below the tolerable standard is one of the strongest proofs of the need to introduce the new Housing Bill?

I have always felt that the housing problem in Scotland, which has been tackled by so many people with so many good intentions, needs a new look, and I am grateful that the new Measure enables us to do that.

asked the Secretary of State for Scotland whether he is satisfied with the ratio of the investment of public funds by the Highlands and Islands Development Board in the hotel industry, and the number of jobs resulting.

Yes, having regard to the indirect contributions to local employment which hotel projects also make.

I appreciate that argument, but is my hon. Friend really satisfied that instances such as the presentation of a cheque for £130,000 to Sir Charles Forte in respect of one hotel, which in all probability would have been built anyway, is really a good way in which to spend taxpayers' money?

There are two points on that. First, I understand that the Forte organisation was statutorily entitled to that money, and it was therefore not up to me or anyone else to criticise the organisation for getting it. Secondly, one has to look not only at the jobs given by such items as hotel projects but at their general effect on the local economy, and the effect on some of the remote areas of an hotel which might be comparatively modest in the City of London is very great indeed.

When the hon. Gentleman is considering making these grants for hotels, will he by some means institute some protection or clause to ensure that an hotel in the Highlands can give a hot meal of some kind so long as the bar in the hotel is open?

That is a very entertaining suggestion. If the hon. Gentleman takes it up with the Scottish Tourist Board, the board might be willing to discuss it with him.

asked the Secretary of State for Scotland why he appointed a retired naval officer to the vice-chairmanship of the Highlands and Islands Development Board.

Because he was the best available person for this full-time post, on leaving the Navy last month at the age of 51. Rear-Admiral Dunbar-Nasmith will be the youngest of the seven members of the board and 14 years younger than the person he is succeeding.

Is it true that the Secretary of State never even interviewed the rear-admiral before sending the letter inviting him to take up the appointment, according to what the rear-admiral him- self has said in a public statement? Is not this a scandalous and disgraceful way to handle an extremely important appointment in Scotland?

That is incorrect. I saw the admiral several times in the period before appointing him and spoke to him also about the appointment. There is no dispute among those who know him about the ability he has shown over a wide field and in Scotland in the past three years, when he has been Flag Officer. The Highlands and Islands Development Board is doing better now and is held in higher regard in the area than ever before.

Do not such questions and the remarks made in a recent debate show a desire by the Opposition to denigrate ex-serving officers?

I completely reject the contention that someone from the North of Scotland who has excelled in a profession which has taken him further afield should be disqualified from serving the North of Scotland.

In view of the Secretary of State's last remarks, will he now confirm that the Government intend to appoint a former chairman of the board to be Admiral of the Home Fleet?

That would be a co-incidence which I believe would have a probability of about one in a million.

asked the Secretary of State for Scotland if he will cause the Scottish Development Department to make a study of the future employment patterns in Central and West Scotland and their impact on the Scottish economy.

This is already an integral part of the studies being carried out by the West Central Scotland Plan Steering Committee.

Is the right hon. Gentleman aware that, although at the last election his party promised to reduce unemployment in Scotland, in June, 1970, unemployment in my area was 4·7 per cent. but is now 9 per cent., almost double the figure of two years ago? Can he tell my constituents when it is likely that unemployment will fall to the level at which it was when the present disastrous Government took office?

Although the hon. Gentleman has not been a Member of the House very long he should know by now that no Government or Minister makes forecasts about unemployment. When we came into office we drew attention to the fact that unemployment was rising and that we intended to tackle it as one of our major purposes. We have been doing so.

It has nearly doubled.

Does my right hon. Friend agree that the present Government have done more than any previous Government to try to steer industry to the West of Scotland, and to aid it there, but that we have a serious problem with administrative offices in that the nationalised industries tend to close down their offices in the West of Scotland, or to reduce their status, and to centralise activities down South? Will he take up the matter with the boards of the nationalised industries?

The answer to the first part of my hon. Friend's question is "Yes". As regards offices, I know of my hon. Friend's concern about the nationalised industries. I am also concerned about the matter and am taking appropriate action. As regards offices in general, my hon. Friend will welcome the fact that offices are being moved to Scotland. Not only the Forestry Commission but the White Fish Authority are going to Scotland, and only recently the proposal for a Government office employing about 1,000 people was announced for Cumbernauld.

Has the right hon. Gentleman noticed or heard about the position in Glasgow, where about half the office development is still unoccupied? Is not this an indication of the Government's failure to achieve the expansion in Scotland that we expected? The right hon. Gentleman says that the Government have made the problem of unemployment one of their first tasks, but it has risen to 138,000, an unheard of figure during summer. When shall we see some results from the Government's so-called action?

The right hon. Gentleman knows that the Industry Bill, which has just passed through this House, is specially designed to help—

The Government have had two years.

The Bill is to meet the present situation. We are introducing measures to meet the situation as it exists. It changes from year to year. The right hon. Gentleman should know that Glasgow is a special problem. It is affected by the high rates which commerce bears in Glasgow. That is something we are trying to do something about.

asked the Secretary of State for Scotland if he will make a further statement on his discussions with interested parties regarding the future of Hampden Park.

I have nothing to add to the answer I gave to my hon. Friend the Member for Edinburgh, South (Mr. Clark Hutchison) on 24th May, 1972. I understand that the discussions referred to in that answer are proceeding but no proposals have yet been put to my right hon. Friend. [Vol. 837, c. 372–3.]

Will my hon. Friend make it clear that he regards as a real priority that Hampden Park should be developed as a great international football stadium? After the discussions between the Queen's Park Football Club and the Scottish Football Association, if they bring a proposition to him to develop and improve the stadium, will he not close his mind to Government financial assistance?

I know of my hon. Friend's interest, and the interest of all the people of Scotland, in Hampden Park. If Queen's Park, the SFA and perhaps even Glasgow Corporation come together to talk to me about the matter, my mind will be open to anything they wish to say.

Is the hon. Gentleman aware that the introduction of VAT and the implementation of the Wheatley Committee proposals will place Hampden Park in an impossible financial position? Is he aware that many of the clubs in Scotland have contributed to the upkeep of Hampden Park and to bringing it up to the status required for an international stadium in Scotland? On that basis, is he not prepared to make representations to the Treasury to ensure that Hampden Park gets the necessary money and that it receives a contribution from the central Government to ensure that it is a focal point for football in Scotland?

The points the hon. Gentleman has made were considered very fully during the passage of the Finance Bill, so the Treasury is well aware of his views. I have nothing to add on the question of VAT in relation to Hampden Park.

asked the Secretary of State for Scotland if he has now received the report from the Scottish Council of Social Service about the need for registration of charities in Scotland; and whether he accepts its recommendations.

My right hon. Friend received this report in May and is studying its implications.

Can the Under-Secretary go a bit further and say whether the Government are aware of the difficulties confronting the general public and social workers in discovering information about these trusts because of the absence of a central register? Is it proposed to do anything for Scotland by way of extending to Scotland the 1960 England and Wales Act dealing with charities?

We have to appreciate that this report raises very big questions and it would be premature to say anything further at this stage until the study is completed. Not only are a large number of charities involved but the rating and taxation authorities are also involved and this warrants very deep study.

asked the Secretary of State for Scotland in view of the hardship of low income group tenants in the new towns as a result of recent rent increases, if he will instruct the development corporations of the new towns to submit modified schemes of rent rebate to conform with the Government's policy that rent increases shall not be more than £39 in any one year.

No tenant will have his standard rent increased by more than £32 in the first year or £39 in subsequent years; and because of the protection given by the rent rebate scheme no tenant whose household income is low should have to pay actual rent increases higher than these amounts.

Does the Under-Secretary realise that in practice new town tenants in the lower income group will be asked to pay higher figures than he has given?

If the hon. Gentleman can produce to me any more evidence of this I will be glad to look at it. As he knows from the provisions in the Act, these are the limits laid down and they should be observed. I am sure he will have noticed that under paragraph 16 of the Second Schedule to the Act there are transitional relief arrangements to limit increases for people who find the new scheme less advantageous than the old to amounts of 30p per week during the transitional period. Altogether this amounts to a very fair protection for those on low incomes.

asked the Secretary of State for Scotland if he will inquire into the background leading to the appearance of Robert Glendinning in the High Court at Edinburgh on 26th July, 1972, particularly having regard to his previous history and the need to protect the public.

Robert Glendinning appeared before a children's hearing in East Kilbride on 9th November, 1971, on charges of assault and was placed under the supervision of the local authority social work department. I understand that a full psychiatric report was available to the hearing, and it was one of the conditions of the supervision requirement that he should attend a psychiatric clinic. On 28th March, 1972, the supervision requirement was reviewed by a hearing which decided that it should be continued. My inquiries have shown that the boy was given the supervision and treatment required by the decision of the hearing.

Is the hon. Gentleman aware that that reply raises as many questions as it answers? Will he confirm that after this boy had appeared on no fewer than four occasions on charges involving violence, one of them I am told involving brandishing a knife, an assessment was made that this boy was a danger to the public? If he can confirm that, will he take steps to consult his right hon. Friend and the Lord Advocate to see whether amendment of the law is necessary to give the Lord Advocate greater discretion to order proceedings on indictment?

I note what the hon. and learned Gentleman says and I will report it to my right hon. and learned Friend the Lord Advocate. From the information in my possession, I feel that the hon. and learned Gentleman has somewhat exaggerated the situation. We deeply regret the murder that took place, but at the same time I want to stand up for the system of children's hearings. Look at it in a hypothetical way. If the children's hearing system had not been in force, the boy would have gone to a juvenile court and in all probability would have been placed on probation. I do not think that what occurred was the fault of the children's hearing.

Is the hon. Gentleman aware that that last point is the relevant one? Would he agree that this case has brought unfortunate publicity and some bad attacks on the system of children's hearings? Will he take this opportunity to confirm the Government's confidence and to accept an expression of our confidence in the system of children's hearings?

I am grateful to the hon. Gentleman for putting that point and I am glad to accept it.

asked the Secretary of State for Scotland what was the average price of a new house in June, 1970; and what is the average price for the latest convenient date.

The average price of new private houses in Scotland mortgaged with building societies was £5,438 in 1970 and £5,846 in the 12 months to 31st March, 1972.

Does the hon. Gentleman agree that it is now becoming impossible for young people to get the money to buy their own homes? Follow- ing the introduction of the Housing (Financial Provisions) (Scotland) Act, will he now agree that the Government should be seeking to ensure that young people can get the necessary mortgage, bearing in mind that once the Act is in operation local authorities will not be able to build houses for those in need?

I could not accept the last part of the hon. Gentleman's question. We are expecting to see an acceleration of local authority building in the next two years. As for the mortgage point, I have been assured by the building societies, and I have no evidence to the contrary, that they have adequate funds to meet all requests of a reasonable nature within Scotland.

On low wages?

There is a strong demand for private houses in Scotland coupled with a very high level of building. Hon. Gentlemen may have noticed that in Paisley, although there are a number of council houses lying empty, there is strong demand for houses put up for sale by the corporation.

Is the hon. Gentleman aware that building land in Edinburgh is now selling at the outrageous price of over £40,000 an acre? For how long will the Government tolerate land owners and land speculators holding the community to ransom in this way?

It would be misleading to suggest that all building land in Edinburgh or anywhere else is that price, and it is well known in every country that the most attractive sites command higher prices. But it does not do to exaggerate the question of house prices in Scotland because, according to the latest figures given by the Nationwide Building Society, the price of houses in the United Kingdom as a whole has been rising by about 17 or 18 per cent. whereas the rate of increase in Scotland has been only about 10 per cent.

asked the Secretary of State for Scotland if he will list the planning authorities in Scotland which are preparing to schedule land for planning purposes as suitable for oil refinery development and allied industries.

I am aware that Ayr and Stirling County Councils are considering this. Ross and Cromarty County Council has already zoned land for this purpose at Invergordon.

Does the Secretary of State concede that the local authorities are playing their part in scheduling land for oil refining purposes? Is it not up to the Government to enter into discussions with companies, particularly those which are likely to produce oil from the North Sea, in order to get oil refining capacity increased in Scotland?

The Regional Development Division of the Scottish Office particularly has been and is in touch with companies which have approached it with this interest in mind. We have also been preparing the kind of general information which will be of help to them.

asked the Secretary of State for Scotland what criteria he has applied in making appointments to public bodies since he took office.

When making an appointment to a public body I have regard to any statutory requirements and to the suitability of the person for the post. My object is then to obtain the services of the best available person for the post.

Is the Secretary of State aware that some of the appointments he has made since he came to office have caused widespread concern in Scotland? I refer not merely to the appointment to the Highlands and Islands Development Board: I refer also to the appointment of the Chairman of the Countryside Commission. There is a feeling in Scotland—and it will do the Secretary of State no good to ignore it—that something like "jobs for the boys" is going on. Can the right hon. Gentleman say who recommended the recent appointment to the Highlands and Islands Development Board and what sort of advice he takes in making these appointments?

The appointments should be judged by the results, and the appointments which I have made since coming to office have proved successful. As regards the Chairman of the Countryside Commission, this was the appoint- ment of a lady and it was a very popular appointment. This, too, has been successful. We dealt in an earlier Question with the appointment to the Highlands and Islands Development Board. I expect hon. Members opposite either to eat their words in a year or two's time or wish to forget that they had ever uttered them.

The Secretary of State will know that my right hon. and hon. Friends who represent constituencies in the Highlands and Islands Development Board area have, without reflecting concern on the personal qualities of the individuals concerned, expressed concern about both the appointments he has made. Why does not the right hon. Gentleman think of consulting Members of Parliament, among other people, before making appointments to public bodies?

There is a limit to the amount of consultation one can make, which must be private on occasions like this. However, the hon. Member for Inverness (Mr. Russell Johnston), in criticising this appointment, was reported in the Press as advocating a younger person. But at the same time he proposed for this appointment Mr. Shaw Grant, who is 10 years older than the man I have appointed. I am glad that he nevertheless approved of Mr. Shaw Grant because he was one of my appointments of 1½ years ago, all of which were criticised at the time but which have now been approved because they have been successful. Moreover, Mr. Shaw Grant—an admirable appointment of mine of 1½ years ago—is not available for this post because he is full-time Chairman of the Crofters Commission.

Since there is a certain amount of concern about this matter, would it not be a good idea if the Secretary of State were to publish in the OFFICIAL REPORT all the changes he has made? He will be aware that the Highlands and Islands Development Board is rapidly becoming known as the Inverness Harbour of Refuge.

Perhaps the right hon. Gentleman is not aware that on 28th June in answering a Question, I gave the appointments which I had made and the names of people who had not been reappointed. They are therefore already in HANSARD.

asked the Secretary of State for Scotland if he will give an assurance that in the new Borders district hospital, all departments at present in Peel Hospital will be included, and that the addition of tonsillectomy and maternity units will be considered.

The announcement of the inclusion of the new Borders District Hospital in the major building programme enables the South-Eastern Regional Hospital Board to put the planning of the project in hand and, when the appropriate stage of planning is reached, the points the hon. Gentleman makes will of course be taken into consideration.

Is the hon. Gentleman aware that there is some concern in the area, not only that the specialties I have mentioned may not be included but that it is rumoured that the children's ward at Peel may not be included? If that were so, it would be a thoroughly retrograde step. Will the hon. Gentleman give the assurance for which I have asked in the Question?

All the options are open at this stage. The early stages of planning are being considered by the regional hospital board. I can assure the hon. Gentleman that all the points which he and his colleagues in the Borders who have shown particular interest in this matter have raised will be considered most carefully.

asked the Secretary of State for Scotland what discussions he has had with local authorities with a substantial proportion of council houses standing vacant regarding possible action to remedy this situation.

Responsibility for remedying this situation rests with the local authority concerned, but my right hon. Friend is prepared to have discussions with any council which approaches him.

Where it can be shown that local authorities have substantial numbers of council houses standing vacant because they were built in the wrong place or were of a wrong type in response to pressure from the Labour Party when it was in government, will my hon. Friend consider the possibility of arranging special financial assistance for the local authorities affected and preferably debit it to and recover it from Transport House?

That is certainly a very lucrative source of funds to be tapped, but I do not think I have any power to tap it. The local authorities involved are very concerned about the question of houses which are standing empty and I am willing to discuss with them the problems which it raises. However, I take into account the number of empty houses in an area when considering applications for new building.

asked the Secretary of State for Scotland if he will make a study of how the attachment of earnings order legislation is helping women who have been granted aliment by court order.

I expect that the Scottish Law Commission, in its current review of the law of diligence, will take account of any improvements in procedure effected by the Attachment of Earnings Act, 1971, which applies only to England and Wales.

If the legislation is satisfactory, why is it that the flow of these wretched women to all our "surgeries" continues unabated?

Because, as we repeatedly say to the hon. Gentleman, these matters are under deep study by the Scottish Law Commission and the Finer Committee. This is a problem which affects human beings and we must therefore get the answer right.

asked the Secretary of State for Scotland if he will cause the Scottish Development Department to make a study on the consequences for the Scottish economy changes in the pattern of employment in the British steel industry.

The Scottish Economic Planning Board, on which the British Steel Corporation is represented, is reviewing all questions arising from the prospective changes in the pattern of employment in the steel industry in Scotland.

Does the right hon. Gentleman appreciate that in a county like Lanarkshire, where we have 9 per cent. unemployment, the announcement of 7,500 redundancies throughout Scotland in the steel industry has caused mounting fear and despair for the future? Is it not time that the Government stopped restricting the expansion plans of the British Steel Corporation and allowed it to expand properly in Scotland and elsewhere?

I do not accept that the Government are restricting in the way that the hon. Member mentions. We discussed this at length on Thursday in the debate. I would point out that in the hon. Member's area a factory is being extended to 120,000 sq. ft. with almost 700 employees affected, and also that Cummins Engines Ltd. has announced an increase in employment of about 180 workers. As I announced last week there is the new motorway which will greatly assist the hon. Member's constituency.

While these investments are greatly to be welcomed, would my right hon. Friend say whether, in the event of a decision not being taken on the proposed steelworks at Hunterston by the end of the year, it will be necessary for the Government to obtain the consent of the European Coal and Steel Industry before a decision is taken?

My hon. Friend knows that the option is open as regards the steelworks at Hunterston. I cannot answer the second supplementary question without notice.

Will the right hon. Gentleman make it perfectly clear that the onus for finding work, as the work goes out and is phased in, rests to a very large extent upon the Government themselves and not just upon the British Steel Corporation? Will he endeavour, in the changes which are being brought about in the steel industry, to see that the Scottish steel industry retains a substantial measure of variety and does not become simply a two-product industry and nothing else?

The hon. Member could have heard me say in the debate on Thursday that the corporation wished to give the unions notice of this; it thought it was right to give to Scotland and to the unions notice of what was to start happening in about two years' time No individual closures have been announced. These are matters which will be announced by the corporation with the usual notice but the Government, as I said last Thursday, are concerned about the question of alternative employment where redundancies occur.

On a point of order, Mr. Speaker. May I draw your attention to the fact that despite your efforts to speed up Scottish Question Time—[HON. MEMBERS: "Oh."]—we have not managed to reach Question No. 35 to the Lord President of the Council? Should not this be looked into in the interests of all hon. Members?

I hope that that fact will be noted by those responsible in these matters.

Further to that point of order, Mr. Speaker. I would point out for the benefit of the hon. Member for Derbyshire, South-East (Mr. Rost) that we lost eight minutes of Question Time because of two petitions presented by English Members.

That introduces the possibility of injury time.

I have a statement to make. In the course of debates on the Local Government Bill indications were given that I had agreed in principle to preside over a conference to consider various matters of electoral law. The Prime Minister has now formally invited me to preside over such a conference and I have agreed to do so.

To examine, and, if possible, submit agreed resolutions on, the following matters relating to parliamentary elections—

1. The franchise, particularly in relation to British subjects normally resident in the United Kingdom but temporarily living abroad.

2. Electoral registration, particularly—

(a) the registration timetable, and the frequency of publishing the register;

(b) multiple registration and the definition of "residence";

(c) registration of Servicemen.

3. Minimum age for election.

4. Election expenses, other than candidates' expenses.

5. Conduct of elections, particularly—

(a) candidates' descriptions;

(b) problems relating to committee rooms;

(c) absent voting;

(d) polling hours;

(e) marking of electoral numbers on ballot paper counterfoils.

6. The cost of election petitions.