asked the Secretary of State for Education and Science how many plans for comprehensive systems of education she has now received; and how many she has rejected.

I informed the House in April, 1971, that I had discontinued the practice of approving non-statutory plans for the re-organisation of secondary education; before then I had approved three plans and rejected none.

The Minister may or may not be approving general plans. Is she aware that by refusing to sanction plans for specific schools she is sabotaging general plans? Will she therefore try to look at plans through a telescope rather than inspecting specific schools through a microscope?

I have a legal duty to look at individual proposals under the Education Acts. The precise figures are that of 2,300 Section 13 proposals I have rejected only 92.

My hon. Friend's point is valid. The right hon. Lady has approved thousands of projects but in many cases, by deleting one proposal, she makes nonsense of the whole scheme. Perhaps I might quote Kidderminster as an example. Her decision there made nonsense of the whole area scheme.

The hon. Member for Stoke-on-Trent, South (Mr. Ashley) may have a valid point, but the answer is equally valid. I have to carry out my duties under the terms of the section.

asked the Secretary of State for Education and Science if she will make a statement on the progress of consultations on the James Report.

asked the Secretary of State for Education and Science if she will make a further report on the consultations on the James Report.

My consultations are almost complete. I hope to announce Government decisions on the issues raised in the report before the end of the year.

I am obliged to my right hon. Friend for that reply. Realising that she received this important report only 10 months ago and that it contained 133 specific recommendations, may I ask whether she would be prepared to go a little further this afternoon and say what is in her mind concerning Recommendations 10 to 12 about the right of teachers, after seven years' service, to have release with pay for in-service training for courses of at least 12 weeks?

I hope to say something about in-service training when we give the decision on the whole report. I agree that that is a part of the report which has received almost universal acclaim. We hope to do something in that sphere.

Whilst the right hon. Lady is considering her conclusions, will she realise that we have largely lost the impetus of the James Report and that she would be well advised now to concentrate on those parts of the report which were generally accepted and to seek their speedy implementation?

I do not believe that we have lost any impetus at all. It is quite remarkable that we took only a year to get the report and have acted fairly quickly in having extensive consultations upon it. I still have two more organisations to see either next week or the week after. As soon as those are clear, I hope to put recommendations before the House.

Will the right hon. Lady confirm that the future of teacher training will be set out in the White Paper on higher education, which is being prepared, and thus remove all doubt that teacher training is in fact part of higher education?

I am not sure that a White Paper on higher education is being prepared. We hope to announce extensive decisions, including the James Report and, of course, the quinquennial settlement, which to some extent will include decisions about the polytechnics programme; and the future of teacher training colleges will be included in those decisions.

asked the Secretary of State for Education and Science whether she is in a position to make a further statement on the reform of student unions.

Discussions with the parties mainly concerned are not yet complete, and I expect further talks to take place this autumn.

Do not the recent disgraceful events at Stirling University, involving a tiny minority of students, and the subsequent inability of the student council, as reported today, to take any action, show that the decent, law-abiding majority need protection from the militant minority and that the best way of doing it is by appointing an impartial registrar of student unions?

I do not think that I shall comment on individual sug- gestions relating to this matter while consultations are going on, except to say that I slightly doubt whether they would have assisted in the events at Stirling. In respect of Stirling University, however, I feel sure that I express the views of the vast majority of the House when I say that what occurred there was a disgrace and ought never to have occurred, and that one of the most regret table feaures of all is that the present leadership of the National Union of Students has not felt able to condemn it out of hand.

Although I represent Stirling and Falkirk, Stirling University is not in my constituency. Nevertheless, it has to be said—and I trust that the Minister will be aware of this—that the events at Stirling University highlight the problem not of student unions but of university administration, not only at Stirling University but at all universities. Will the hon. Gentleman give his attention to this problem when he is considering questions which are biased and distorted by Members speaking from a background of ignorance rather than of fact?

I hope that I have not got the correct inference from the hon. Gentleman's question, which seemed to have some element of support for what occurred. If that is the position, I do not support it in any way. I must make it clear that, as has been properly said, what occurred involved a minority of students, but I think that the rest of us are entitled to expect that the majority, who would always wish to show good manners to any visitor, would make their views very definitely heard.

Is my hon. Friend aware that there is a demand among the great majority of moderate students for a registrar? As we are to look forward, we are told, to a lighter legislative programme, will my hon. Friend and his right hon. Friend take over the Bill which I introduced last Session?

I am not sure that there is all that widespread support for one particular solution, but, as I have said, while consultations are in progress I do not think it would be right for me to come down firmly in respect of one solution or of another. It is impossible for me to forecast the legislative programme for the next Session.

Is the hon. Gentleman aware of an even more reprehensible development in student politics? I am referring to the recent plan of the Monday Club to prepare dossiers on Left-wing militant students, which presumably will be made available to prospective employers. What has the hon. Gentleman to say about that?

The only thing I know about it is what I have read in the Press. Certainly no action by my Department will encourage that kind of activity.

asked the Secretary of State for Education and Science when she now expects to receive the report of the working party on school transport.

I cannot forecast how long it will take the working party to complete its work and submit a report to me.

When the working party reports, will the right hon. Lady treat any recommendations which it makes as a matter of great urgency in order to remove both the dangers and the hardship faced by many scholars and parents, such as those living at Old Goole in my constituency?

I shall certainly do so, because I know of the widespread interest in this topic on both sides of the House.

May I draw attention to the school transport situation in my constituency? Bedfordshire is in the process of going comprehensive, and certain parents in the Houghton Regis and Dunstable area have experienced difficulties in getting their children to school. Will my right hon. Friend have talks with the Bedfordshire Education Authority and local bus companies to see whether the difficulties can be overcome?

I think that local education authorities have sufficient discretionary powers to deal with transport. problems, but if my hon. Friend has any particular query in mind and raises it with the Department we shall do what we can to help.

Will the right hon. Lady give her assessment of the effect of VAT on school transport, in view of the fact that it will be levied on certain means of school transport?

The discretionary powers of local education authorities will, I think, still be sufficient to deal with the matter if there were any increase.

asked the Secretary of State for Education and Science what proposals she has for approving financial grants towards improving nursery schools in the London Borough of Wandsworth.

Proposals submitted by the Inner London Education Authority under phase 7 of the urban programme include additional nursery schools and classes in the Wandsworth area. The list of approved projects has not yet been announced.

I thank the hon. Gentleman for that reply. Such replies will be extremely welcome in Wandsworth, where we face many of the social problems which exist throughout inner London, such as poor housing and lack of social amenities, and any help that we can get from the Department or from the Inner London Education Authority will be warmly welcomed. I look forward to the publication of the help that is to be given.

I am obliged to the hon. Gentleman. He will be aware that announcements in respect of the urban programme will, as always, be made by my right hon. Friend the Home Secretary.

asked the Secretary of State for Education and Science whether she will now arrange through the school medical service for teaching aids required for sex education, including the danger of venereal disease, to be made available to local education authorities.

Information about teaching materials suitable for use in schools is circulated to local education authorities by the Health Education Council, and authorities can draw upon the services of school medical officers as appropriate.

is the right hon. Lady aware of the appalling increase in the incidence of venereal disease, as revealed today in the report on the nation's health? Does she not think that the best way to combat this is through further health education in schools? Will she take steps to make suitable films and other aids available to schools and ensure that these are used so that young people are aware of the dangers they face?

I think I have already made clear that this is done by way of the Health Education Council. I am aware of the seriousness of the problem, but I think the hon. and learned Gentleman will agree that it is an easier problem to pose than to find precisely the right solution for it. It is a very sensitive problem, and in anything that one does through the schools one has to be careful not to do more harm than good.

Is my right hon. Friend satisfied with the way in which sex education is conducted and also that the rights of parents who have expressed concern at different times are properly protected?

In the vast majority of cases, with very rare exceptions, if parents and teachers get together on this problem the rights of parents are respected.

Is there not a case, as in some other advanced countries, for eventually working towards a system whereby sex education becomes compulsory in the State school system?

There may be a case, but it is not one that I should support immediately.

asked the Secretary of State for Education and Science how many Nature Conservancy establishments she has visited officially during the recess.

None, Sir.

Is not this a bit of a pity when such radical alterations are being made to the Nature Conservancy? More constructively, what institutional arrangements will be made to ensure co-operation on a scientific basis between the Nature Conservancy and the National Environment Research Council?

I believe the hon. Gentleman is well aware that Mr. Heaton has been appointed to advise upon the changes that will take place. We expect his report next month or the month after. When we have received it, we shall look at the institutional arrangements to ensure the kind of co-operation which I know the hon. Gentleman wishes to see.

Will my right hon. Friend bear in mind that the Government's statement of policy on the Nature Conservancy as contained in the White Paper commenting on the report of the Select Committee on Science and Technology is a great departure from the attitude when this matter was looked at by the Select Committee investigating the National Environment Research Council? Will my right hon. Friend consider issuing a White Paper separately setting out the real arguments why the change was thought wise?

I think that all possible changes in responsibility for the Nature Conservancy had some drawbacks to them, and some opponents. It was therefore thought, for reasons which have been set out, that it was best to keep the research functions with the National Environment Research Council—which I think my hon. Friend will support—and to put the Nature Conservancy element with the Department of the Environment. I think that that will work well provided we get full co-operation between those at the conservancy end and those responsible for research both in former Nature Conservancy laboratories and environmental matters in general in NERC itself.

Does not the right hon. Lady agree that to a large extent the high standing of the Nature Conservancy is due to the high personal quality of the management and research workers who have been attracted to it over the years? Does not the right hon. Lady fear that if this research work is taken away from the Nature Conservancy its credibility will he severely damaged and it may become not much more than a glorified organisation concerned with the keeping of parks?

No, Sir. I should not wholly agree with that. If we get the degree of co-operation that we want, all will be well. I hope the hon. Gentleman will appreciate that there would be quite severe consequences if we were to separate the Nature Conservancy research from NERC itself. That, too, would meet with a good deal of opposition from many quarters.

asked the Secretary of State for Education and Science when she intends to publish her advice to schools and youth groups concerning the dangers of mountain and moorland visits in winter.

A departmental pamphlet entitled "Safety in Outdoor Pursuits" has been sent for printing and will be published early in November.

Does the right hon. Lady realise that there has been one tragic accident already this season although we have not reached the most inclement weather, and will she do all in her power to try to issue the document to the schools as soon as possible? Will she also try to arrange as much publicity as possible to parents and teachers about the absolute need for safety on the mountains?

Yes, certainly. I have done my best to hurry up the printing process. I should like to say how sorry we all were to hear of that tragic accident. The pamphlet has taken a long time because we felt it necessary to have the maximum consultation with all the organisations which could give advice and contribute towards a very good pamphlet.

Does the pamphlet make clear that even the simplest mountain can become extremely dangerous in certain weather? Therefore, does it advise that schoolchildren, particularly the younger ones, should not be taken out without someone experienced to accompany them?

The pamphlet makes clear absolutely the necessity for qualified leadership and proper equipment. I think my hon. Friend will be satisfied with the pamphlet when he sees it.

Will the right hon. Lady ensure that the pamphlet goes to independent schools as well as to others, because the recent accident involved boys from an independent school which has had two serious accidents in the last few years? Before she finally decides on the pamphlet, will the right hon. Lady look at the statement by Dr. Ogilvie, the leader of the Patterdale mountain rescue team which went to the rescue of the boys in the recent accident?

The pamphlet has already gone to the printers and to get it back now would, I am afraid, retard its publication, which I do not think the right hon. Gentleman would wish. I shall look at the statement to which he has referred.

asked the Secretary of State for Education and Science if she will seek to ascertain how many vacancies for full-time training for the specialist qualification in the education of the deaf there are at the Department of Audiology and Education of the Deaf at Manchester University, the University of London Institute of Education and the University of Oxford Institute of Education: and how many applicants there have been in the last three years.

There is at present only one vacancy left for such training and that is at the University of London Institute of Education. Applications for the courses at London, Manchester and Oxford together numbered 250 in 1970, 230 in 1971 and 276 in 1972. Some candidates applied to more than one of the institutions.

Those figures are interesting, but does my hon. Friend agree that there have been instances when, in spite of the shortage of these valuable people in the schools for the deaf, there have been vacancies at the courses which have not been filled even though there have been suitably qualified candidates for them? Is not that a serious situation?

I would be helped if my hon. Friend would give me details, because the provision of teachers in this specialist field is one about which we are deeply concerned. I have, by the figures my hon. Friend asked me to give, shown that there is one vacancy. That does not entirely seem to show, at any rate in the current year, that qualified people have been turned away.

Would not this be an opportunity for the Under-Secretary to announce on behalf of his right hon. Friend that she was setting up a central advisory council for handicapped children under the 1944 Act so that the council could conduct an inquiry into special education and teacher training therefor, as was promised by the Prime Minister before the last election? That is one of the Prime Minister's pre-election promises that we would not like to see reversed.

It would not be a suitable opportunity because it would overtake the fulfilment of that pledge in the way in which I think the hon. Gentleman knows, a way which covers a wide range of handicaps with which we are all concerned.

asked the Secretary of State for Education and Science what progress has been made in the review of teachers' superannuation schemes.

The working party has completed its review. My right hon. Friend the Secretary of State for Scotland and I have accepted its report. I have made the first of the new set of regulations, with effect retrospective to 1st April, 1972.

asked the Secretary of State for Education and Science if she will make a statement concerning her proposals to adjust financial arrangements with direct grant schools.

Subject to parliamentary approval of the necessary amending regulations I propose to increase the annual capitation grant to the schools by £9 with effect from April, 1972. This sum is about one-third of the average increase in cost per pupil that the schools are having to meet from that date.

I thank the right hon. Lady for her answer. Can she now state the totals which are involved as well as the increase? Does she agree that in making this increase she is doing her best to encourage the direct grant sector which, rather than providing simply parental increase of choice increases the choice of the schools and parents alike?

I agree that I am encouraging the direct grant sector and I believe that there is a great demand for such encouragement. The net cost to the Exchequer, if that is what the hon. Gentleman is seeking, is £600,000 in a full year. The net increase in public expenditure is very much less.

Will my right hon. Friend agree that the move by the Labour-controlled Bradford Education Authority to do away with free places at the local direct grant school is a direct blow at educational opportunity for the less privileged children in that part of the country?

Yes, I agree. It can do no good whatever to deprive a few children of the very best education which they can receive in the name of some egalitarian principle. The parents can apply directly to the direct grant school for a free place or an income-assisted place and they do not have to go through the local education authority.

Does not the right hon. Lady feel that she could change the title from "direct grant school" to "select grant school"?

As the hon. Gentleman will be aware if he has followed the Press recently, children have to be selected upon some basis or another and selection for comprehensive schools has caused as much trouble as selection for other schools.

Will my right hon. Friend consider giving still further encouragement to the direct grant schools by reopening the list?

I have to say "No" for the time being to my hon. Friend.

Is the right hon. Lady aware that her figure of £600,000 is certainly not chicken-feed? I could tell her of educational priority areas in the north of England which with £600,000 could provide long-overdue facilities for children who have no choice in the school they attend.

The cost of the State taking over the direct grant schools would be very much greater and, therefore, I would expect the hon. Member to welcome the increase in grant.

asked the Secretary of State for Education and Science what steps she has taken to ascertain the long-term needs of the educational priority areas.

Through the urban programme, the increased allowance for teachers in schools of exceptional difficulty and through the school building programmes we have already made a positive contribution towards meeting the needs of educational priority areas. I am now considering the recommendations in Dr. Halsey's book "Educational Priority" published at the beginning of October.

I am glad that the right hon. Lady has considered the report, but does she not agree that, whatever is written in research institutions or by researchers, in the end success depends upon the people in the schools? Can she assure us that when considering the future of teacher training and teacher supply she will ensure an adequate supply of teachers to go to educational priority and other areas which will very shortly need more than one teacher per class in order that basic educational standards can be maintained?

I agree that the key to solving the problems of these areas lies in the teachers in the schools and parents in the home. The co-operation of both is required, with the co-operation of the social services, if the best is to be done for the children. As the hon. Gentleman knows, we are not short of teachers to go to these areas at the moment and I am delighted to see a number of dedicated teachers operating in the primary schools in those areas.

Will the right hon. Lady take into account that some areas of educational priority still have some very old schools? One school in my area, the Swinton Fitzwilliam Junior Mixed School, was built in, I think, 1853. It has no hall in which the children can take their meals and they have to travel about 400 yards each way in very inclement weather to take their meals in another place. Will the right hon. Lady do something to make certain that a new school is built as soon as possible?

Perhaps the hon. Gentleman will put that school to me and tell me what priority the local education authority has accorded to it in its recommendations, because that influences the decisions we make.

asked the Minister of State for Defence what further steps he is taking to protect British vessels fishing on the high seas off Iceland.

I would ask my hon. Friend to await the statement which my hon. Friend the Under-Secretary of State for Foreign and Commonwealth Affairs will be making later this afternoon.

I welcome that reply. Can my right hon. Friend confirm that this means that Her Majesty's ships will be available to intervene in any further incident? Does he agree that the recent action of the Icelandic gunboats has been dangerous to life, irresponsible and against international law?

I can certainly confirm that British naval vessels are available and can be ordered to the assistance of British trawlers if needed. I condemn very vigorously the action of the gunboat, which was a serious hazard to life and property. There is widespread parliamentary and public concern about the resumption of harassment of British trawlers. But I ask my hon. Friend to await the more comprehensive statement that my hon. Friend the Under-Secretary will be making later.

asked the Minister of State for Defence if he will make a further statement on the operation of the short take-off and landing or vertical short take-off and landing aircraft by ships of the Royal Navy.

We are examining as quickly as possible the implications of operating V/STOL aircraft from ships. The project definition study has now been authorised work is being carried on and the study should be completed in a few months.

Can my right hon. Friend say whether the study will mean adapting the existing Harrier for naval operations or a new and modified aircraft, and whether the study is investigating the operation of the aircraft from "Blake" and county class cruisers as well as the new through-deck command cruisers?

The project definition study is to take account of the fact that the present Harrier is designed for a ground support role and that it needs modifying for the maritime role by adding appropriate weapons systems, avionics and other equipment. The implications of these modifications are being studied, but certainly the through-deck cruiser is designed to carry the aircraft should it be decided to use them.

Can my right hon. Friend tell us whether the project definition study includes an improved engine for the aircraft, the Pegasus 15, which is essential, first, if the aircraft is to perform successfully for the Navy, and, secondly, as a sales potential for the United States Navy, which is very interested in several hundred of the aircraft if it has that engine in it?

My hon. Friend will appreciate that the Pegasus 15 would be too large to be fitted to the existing Harrier without a substantial framework modification, because the Pegasus 15 proposal is significantly different from merely uprating the existing engine.

asked the Minister of State for Defence what progress has been made in controlling the Irish border and preventing its violation for hostile purposes.

The security forces continue to control the border as effectively as is practicable. The requirement for further measures is kept constantly under review.

Is my right hon. Friend aware that I was on the Fermanagh border at the time of the murder of Mr. and Mrs. Bullock and was made aware of the intense resentment at the absence of a localised security force? May I also ask him why cars such as those used by the murderers are free to cross the border along main roads without the authorisations which were required in previous troubles?

I was aware that my hon. Friend visited the area. He expresses concern about a murder which is shared throughout the House. I think he will appreciate that a total of more than 240,000 cars were searched in September, compared with an average of about 100,000 per month until April. This is a substantial increase in the number of searches which take place at the border, but my hon. Friend will understand that 50,000 vehices cross the border every day and the searches are a major task.

the right hon. Gentleman aware that only last week extreme Unionist forces, the UDA, crossed the border in the other direction and planted explosives in the Republic? Will he pay some attention to preventing that sort of crime from taking place?

The task of the security forces is to confront terrorism or lawlessness, from whatever quarter it might come, with the utmost determination. That has been their task in the past and it will continue to be their task as long as they are required to undertake it.

Will my right hon. Friend give his assessment of the extent of the movement of men and materials across the border. Is he fully satisfied that the Republican Government in Southern Ireland are giving the maximum support in dealing with the question.

Certainly there is a passage of explosives illegally across the border, and the security forces do their best to diminish it as far as possible. The Government of the Republic have taken steps to improve the security situation on their side of the border, but we should welcome yet greater co-operation from them.

Reverting to the question of security on the border and the point raised by my hon. Friend the Member for Belfast, West (Mr. Fitt), can the Minister of State say whether in the discussions which took place between representatives of Her Majesty's Forces and of the UDA any reference was made to claims by the UDA that it had gone across the border, and whether part of the equation for bringing peace is that they also undertook not to put British troops at risk in border areas by excursions into the Republic, in the same way as our troops have been put at risk by excursions into the North from the Republic?

It would not be right for me to select certain parts of a discussion which took place, but the main points of the representations made were to emphasise that Protestant violence represented a serious change in the security situation, serious in that it means a new dimension of disorder and also because it diverts the security forces from their task of ending IRA terrorism.

Is it not becoming daily more obvious that it is the existence of the border which is preventing our winning this war? What advice do the military authorities give to my right hon. Friend about sealing it? There is a much longer border running across the length of Europe which is so impenetrable that it is known as the Iron Curtain.

As I have explained on numerous occasions in the House, the Government consider it impracticable to seal the border, which is over 300 miles long. Sealing it would involve such a major dislocation in the life of the community that it is not regarded as practicable. It would also mean the diversion of security forces in large numbers from those places where it is considered their prime duty lies.

Is there any liaison between the British security forces and the increased Irish Army forces which have recently moved up on to the border?

When an act of terrorism is suspected of having been perpetrated from across the border, there are communications from the security forces in Northern Ireland to the police on the side of the Government of the Republic.

asked the Minister of State for Defence when he proposes to proceed with the building of HMS "Newcastle" on the Tyne at Swan Hunters.

Prefabrication work is already in hand and it is planned to lay the keel of this vessel within the next few months.

May I thank my noble Friend for that very satisfactory answer and say how delighted and proud the north of England will be that we are to have a new HMS "Newcastle"? May she sail the seas with the credit that that name always has earned for many years.

I am grateful to my hon. Friend for those words. May I reciprocate by assuring her that the Royal Navy is very proud once again to have a ship bearing the name HMS "Newcastle".

On a point of order. The Serjeant at Arms is blushing.

asked the Secretary of State for the Home Department if he will extend the protection offered by rule 23 to police officers of borough forces involved in amalgamation schemes to police officers affected by the amalgamation of the county forces or the division of an existing county force; and if he will make a statement.

Yes, Sir. My right hon. Friend has told the police representative organisations and the local authority associations that he intends to extend the protection of regulation 23 to all those affected by the forthcoming reorganisation.

Is the hon. and learned Gentleman aware of the great satisfaction that will give to police officers, who have waited a long time with a great degree of uncertainty about what their future would be as a result of the Government's reorganisation proposals?

I am sure the police are glad about the decision that has been taken. There has been no delay about it at all. As the hon. Gentleman knows full well, the Police Federation was not anxious to enter into detailed discussion with the Home Office on the matter until after the Local Government Bill left this House. Immediately after that, the negotiations started and we were able to announce this in the Committee stage in the other place.

asked the Secretary of State for the Home Department what steps he is now taking to control the entry of citizens of States openly harbouring or encouraging acts of terrorism, piracy and murder abroad, and in particular citizens of Syria, Lebanon and Egypt.

I shall not hesitate to use to the full my powers to keep out or to expel any alien who seems likely to engage in acts of violence or to encourage or incite such acts. It would not be in the public interest to give details of all our precautions. But I can say that immigration officers have been instructed to exercise special vigilance.

Will the right hon. Gentleman go further and make it crystal clear to Governments that harbour air pirates and terrorists and encourage air piracy and terrorism that there will be no alternative in those cases but to impose restrictions such as visas on their nationalis? I know from personal experience that the security now in operation at Heathrow is frighteningly inadequate and needs tightening up.

I would rather not comment specifically now on the first pant of the hon. Gentleman's question but I will certainly look at the second part. I think it is true to say that precautions at Heathrow are receiving far more atten- tion than they used to, and I will see that that improvement continues.

May I ask my right hon. Friend not to overlook that a country much closer to us that the countries mentioned by the hon. Member for Manchester, Blackley (Mr. Rose)—the Republic of Eire—has been harbouring and assisting criminals making constant attacks across the border into Northern Ireland? Will he control the entry of those citizens, who, remarkably, receive far better treatment than the citizens of the oldest members of the Commonwealth?

As I made clear in my answer, my concern is to use my full powers against anybody who seems likely to exercise violence, and that I do. I do not bear any favour or otherwise towards anybody of any nationality.

The right hon. Gentleman will recognise that the House has supported him and his predecessor on occasions in the past in permitting legitimate political organisations to establish themselves in this country, but will he confirm that a very close watch is kept on any organisations which might be associated in any way with illegal actions?

Yes, indeed I can. It is difficult, as the hon. Lady knows, to talk about these things in as much detail as one would wish, but I can assure her and the House that we are doing our best to do the job properly and are especially on the alert at present.

asked the Secretary of State for the Home Department how many citizens from Uganda have now been accommodated in private homes and how many individuals have offered such accommodation.

The great majority of the refugees not in resettlement centres have made private arrangements to stay with friends or relatives. The Uganda Resettlement Board had by last weekend received offers of accommodation in 1,476 private households, many of them for short periods only.

Is the hon. Gentleman aware that in addition to the valiant efforts he has made there is a great deal of good will on the part of the British people, voluntary organisations and individuals, that can be tapped? Could he not make greater efforts to make people aware of the way in which they can fit into the plans for accommodating the refugees? Is he aware that there is a somewhat uneasy feeling that many of the refugees may have to stay in camps for an unacceptable period?

Yes, Sir, there is the good will to which the hon. Gentleman refers. May I take this opportunity of thanking the very many individuals who have already made offers of private accommodation? I expect to see a steady increase in the number of these offers being taken up from now on. As my right hon. Friend the Secretary of State made clear yesterday, our first objective, and the board's first objective, is to get the refugees out of the resettlement centres into permanent homes and jobs as soon as possible.

There is great sympathy and concern for the Ugandan Asians, but there is also general unease in the country about the position of other Commonwealth citizens who hold similar passports. What action are the Government taking to ensure that the Uganda episode is not considered a precedent for some similar action?

We are aware of that concern. All I can say now is that there is no prospect whatever of this episode being repeated elsewhere.

asked the Prime Minister whether he received an invitation to address last month's annual conference of the Trades Union Congress.

asked the Prime Minister if he received an official invitation to address the September, 1972, conference of the Trades Union Congress.

I have been asked to reply.

Is it not a pity that my right hon. Friend the Prime Minister was not invited to address the TUC conference in order that he could lend support to Mr. Feather and other reasonable trade union leaders who are anxious to co-operate with the Government's initiative to curb inflation because they, like my right hon. Friend, realise that the country will no longer tolerate the sabotaging of the national prosperity by sectional selfish interests?

I am sure that my right hon. Friend the Prime Minister would have warmly welcomed the opportunity to address the TUC and to explain to it the important opportunities that we have as a result of the economic growth which is now beginning to be achieved.

How does the right hon. Gentleman interpret the Prime Minister's remarks at Blackpool last week that the parties must tell each other all the facts? Does this mean that we can expect legislation on the disclosure of business interests, as is wanted by the TUC?

My right hon. Friend the Prime Minister pointed out at the Conservative Party conference last week the novel fact about the present tripartite discussions that they are taking place on the basis of a much fuller exchange of basic economic information and forecasts than has ever been the case before.

Will the right hon. Gentleman let the Prime Minister know that many of us are very sorry that he was not invited to address the TUC because this would have afforded the opportunity to him to hear from the trade union leaders that they are not alone responsible for the inflationary tendencies? Will the right hon. Gentleman also tell the Prime Minister that Lord Stokes has made it indelibly clear that he would do this country a great deal of credit if he talked about the misdemeanours of other countries and put our own country into proper perspective?

As I have said, I am sure that my right hon. Friend would have welcomed the opportunity to address the TUC. It is fair to point out that neither he nor any other member of the Government has ever claimed that pay is the only cause of inflation. What cannot be denied, and was never denied by the Labour Government, is that it is the biggest element in maintaining or failing to maintain stable prices. There is also a direct connection between controlling inflation and employment. One of the reasons that we have at last got the very much better unemployment figures this month, with a rising number of vacancies, is that with inflation coming under some control and expansion going forward we now have an opportunity such as we have not had for many years.

asked the Prime Minister whether he will state the number of official meetings he has had with the Trades Union Congress and the Confederation of British Industry since the end of June.

asked the Prime Minister if he will make a statement on his latest meeting with the Trades Union Congress.

asked the Prime Minister whether he will state the number of official meetings he has had separately with the Trades Union Congress and with the Trades Union Congress together with the Confederation of British Industry since the end of June.

asked the Prime Minister if he will state the number of official meetings he has had separately with the Trades Union Congress and with the Trades Union Congress together with the Confederation of British Industry since the end of June.

I have been asked to reply.

Can my right hon. Friend assure us that despite the unhelp- ful reaction of some of the electricity unions and also of some hon. Members on the Opposition side, who apparently gave Mr. Feather a rough ride last night, the Government will press on in the national interest with their policy lot prices and incomes? Can he also tell us something about the machinery that is intended to monitor it?

I will deal with the last point first. There are meetings going on not only between the principals on the announced dates but also between their staffs on these questions, particularly including the machinery which might be devised for monitoring both prices and pay. That is recognised by all as being a very important part of the problem. I assure my hon. Friend that the Government will press on. We believe, as Mr. Feather said of the TUC representatives also, that it is right to make a determined and constructive effort to reach agreement, and I am sure that, from whatever quarter it might come, the public would not take kindly any attempt to get in the way of that agreement.

Will the right hon. Gentleman ask the Prime Minister before the next meeting to work out a simple piece of arithmetic—that £2 less tax is only "30 bob", that many trade unionists have had to pay £1 extra in rent, and that the other "10 bob" is not enough to cover value added tax, increased food prices and all the extra inflation which the Government have caused?

It cannot be denied that pay in the last year, for example, has risen substantially more than prices in almost every sector of the community. As to the arithmetic, I think the hon. Gentleman can be content that the trade union representatives will be doing their arithmetic together with the Government and the CBI. I think the House will be well advised to leave the parties to do the arithmetic until the talks come to a conclusion, and then we must judge the results at that stage.

Mention has been made of some help for retirement pensioners. While appreciating that they have more to gain than any other section of the community from stable prices, may I ask whether my right hon. Friend is in a position to quantify the benefit contemplated for them?

I am not in a position to quantify the benefit at this moment, but I remind my hon. Friend that, apart from these talks, we have undertaken to make an annual review of pensions. In the context of these talks and the Government's proposals resulting from them, pensioners were specifically mentioned. No one has more to gain from a better control of inflation than the pensioners and all others on small incomes.

Have the Government had discussions at Chequers concerning the implementation of the Equal Pay Act in view of the fact that the Act embodies a statutory incomes policy for women? Will the right hon. Gentleman bear in mind that one-third of the labour force consists of women, the majority of them falling into the category of the low paid?

I assure the hon. Lady that the implications of the Equal Pay Act are very much part of the discussions that are going on. Of course, as she will realise, in any policy which is deliberately designed over the next 12 months to help the lower paid, women are an important part of that category.

Will my right hon. Friend spell out clearly what would be the results of the alternative policy that is sometimes advocated—the restriction of the money supply? What effect would that have on investment and the unemployment figures?

The Government rightly feel that there is no simple answer to these problems. Those who put forward what they regard as simple answers—restriction of money supply is not by any means the only one, because others have been put forward—do not take account of the realities of life or at least of the severe short-term effects of putting such policies into operation.

Will the right hon. Gentleman make clear that he does not concur with the mischievous remarks made by the hon. Member for Chelmsford (Mr. St. John-Stevas) about the electricity supply workers? Will the right hon. Gentleman inform the House that the reason why the electricity workers are contemplating action is that the electricity boards, under instructions from the Prime Minister, as they say, refuse to negotiate on a legitimate claim?

I certainly cannot accept what the hon. Gentleman said in the latter part of that supplementary question or, indeed, that what my hon. Friend the Member for Chelmsford (Mr. St. JohnStevas) said was intended to be mischievous. What I do know is that the unions in the electricity supply industry have agreed to meet again on Friday of next week, which is after the next tripartite meeting. I believe that is the wise course to take. In their action yesterday, the electricity council's management representatives were of course complying with a request by the Government in a communique issued with the general agreement of all parties to the tripartite talks—namely, an appeal to everyone in the public and private sectors to take no action on wages and prices, and to make no offers or settlements, pending the results of the talks, which might prejudice their successful outcome.

asked the Prime Minister if he will make a statement on his official talks with President Pompidou.

asked the Prime Minister whether he will make a statement about the European summit conference.

I have been asked to reply.

Is the right hon. Gentleman aware that the Heads of Government are meeting at the old Gestapo headquarters and that, to add insult to injury, they are flying the Union Jack upside down? Will the right hon. Gentleman, wearing his Home Secretary's hat, consider that perhaps a good question which the Prime Minister could put to President Pompidou is why, after all his claptrap about European co-operation, France has not lifted a finger to accommodate a single Ugandan Asian? The old Commonwealth has had to dig the old country out.

I did not know that the hon. Gentleman of all people was so punctilious in his concern for the Union Jack. It is something that we all welcome. I am not, any more than my right hon. Friend the Prime Minister, answerable for the actions of another Government, but when one talks about France and coloured immigrants one should remember how many coloured people live in France and go quite freely there. There are not many countries in which there are so many coloured people as in France. That should also be taken into account.

Will my right hon. Friend send a signal to the summit asking the Heads of Government whether they cannot do something about the Eurotechno-bureaucrat Mr. Mansholt, who, not content with interfering in British party politics not so long ago, has been sounding forth about a European Government in controversial federalistic and unacceptable terms?

I note what my hon. Friend says. I am not sure whether the Home Office carries the right signalling equipment.

Will the right hon. Gentleman ask the Prime Minister at these talks firmly to repudiate the proposal by Lord Carrington for a joint military nuclear force with France and Germany, as most of us can imagine nothing more likely to prejudice and kill the prospects of an east/west détente?

My right hon. Friend the Prime Minister has made his views known on this subject on a good many occasions and I will draw to his attention what the hon. Gentleman has said.

Would my right hon. Friend—or, in default, the Prime Minister—give us some information as to the political position and status of members of the European Economic Commission, since we read that Dr. Dahrendorf has recently participated in a conference of Liberal leaders—one would imagine a select and esoteric body?

I hope that my right hon. and learned Friend will have some tolerance with me in my lack of knowledge of these strange goings on.

Referring back to the demand by my hon. Friend the Member for Salford, East (Mr. Frank Allaun) for repudiation of the statement by the Secretary of State for Defence, about which I pressed the Prime Minister on Tuesday, is not the right hon. Gentleman aware that we got no clear answer at all from the Prime Minister and that he seemed to suggest that it was a personal view of the Secretary of State for Defence? Will the right hon. Gentleman now say whether the statement of the Secretary of State is the policy of the Government or not?

I am afraid I certainly have nothing to add to what my right hon. Friend said.

On a point of order. Because of the importance of the machine tool industry and the danger to future investment if trained teams are allowed to disband, could you, Mr. Speaker, use your influence and power to allow the Minister to answer Question 22?

That is not a matter for the Chair.