asked the Secretary of State for Northern Ireland what are the regulations governing the entry of guide dogs for the blind into food shops &c., in Northern Ireland.

No regulations have been made on this matter; but a circular of guidance will be issued in a week or so to district councils. The circular will suggest that, when public health inspectors are discussing with managers of food premises the exclusion of dogs, they should recommend that an exception be made in the case of guide dogs for the blind and that notices requesting customers not to bring dogs into the premises should specifically exempt guide dogs.

I thank the Minister for his reply. Is he aware that the practice of non-admission of guide dogs for the blind is widespread in places such as hotels, restaurants, bars and food shops in Northern Ireland? Will he make a public declaration of the regulations he has just mentioned in order to encourage all those who at present refuse admittance to guide dogs into their various premises to allow them in? The blind in Northern Ireland are just as blind as the blind in Great Britain, and they need this assistance.

Our attitude towards guide dogs for the blind is the same in Northern Ireland as it is for the rest of the United Kingdom. We hope that the circular to be issued in a fortnight's time will get wide publicity and that as a result guide dogs will gain admittance to all premises.

asked the Secretary of State for Northern Ireland if he intends to make an interim statement on the recommendations of the Quigley Report.

I have already drawn attention, in my preface to the report, to the fact that it is essentially a discussion document. Arrangements have been made for a wide range of interests in Northern Ireland, including the political parties and both sides of industry, to make their considered views on the report known to the Government between now and the end of the year. At this stage, therefore, I have nothing to add to what I said in the preface.

May I be permitted, on behalf of my colleagues, to extend our congratulations and good wishes to the right hon. Gentleman and say that we look forward to working constructively with him and his ministerial team in the interests of all the people of Northern Ireland? Mindful, as we are, of the fact that the conflicting options in the Quigley Report will have no immediate effect on the serious unemployment situation in Northern Ireland, may I ask whether the Secretary of State agrees that as far as the future is concerned, expenditure of public money will not render viable that which is manifestly non-viable and, as experience has shown, will merely make the second state worse than the first?

I am obliged to the hon. Member for what he said in the first part of his question. On the second part, I am particularly keen to monitor the financing of projects in Northern Ireland to make sure that the type of mistake to which the hon. Gentleman referred does not happen again.

What will be the nature of the new forum which will discuss the Quigley Report with my right hon. Friend in January?

I do not know yet, because we have established a small working party which has now been given its terms of reference to report by the end of the year on the size of the new forum. I do not know what title it will be given or what its composition will be. I hope that the trade unions, representatives of trade and commerce and members of the political parties will have perused the Quigley Report by then and will have sent in their written observations for the benefit of the forum from its outset.

One of the points discussed in the report is the future of the Economic Council. Has the right hon. Gentleman any plans to broaden the scope of that Council to include elected or previously elected representatives of Ulster upon it? If there is to be a prolonged period of direct rule it is important, particularly in economic matters, for there to be local representation on all these groups.

I do not know whether I would agree with the hon. Member's latter point. The Economic Council has been disbanded. I chaired the last meeting 10 or 14 days ago when the Quigley Report was put before the Council. A working party has now been set up to consider the establishment of a forum to discuss economic and industrial problems in Northern Ireland. I hope that the forum will be able to sketch out the framework and strategy for the future of industry in Northern Ireland and to extract the priorities from the Quigley Report.

Is the right hon. Gentleman aware that the people of Northern Ireland, at this time of unprecedented unemployment, will think that he is stalling on this matter? As Secretary of State for Defence, the right hon. Gentleman slashed thousands of jobs in defence establishments in Northern Ireland in record time—

Order.

Will he act with equal speed in implementing the Quigley Report?

Order.

The hon. Gentleman ought to put his tongue in his cheek and be grateful for the consideration and priority that I have given from the outset to the economic and industrial problems of Northern Ireland. Anyone who has been watching the scene in the past two months will be fully acquainted with that fact. The hon. Gentleman must also be aware that, despite the fact that we had a defence review and a cut of £1,000 million in public expenditure, it was only on the third round of cuts that Northern Ireland was affected. Scotland, Wales and parts of England were affected first.

What are my hon. Friend's views on the central proposition in the Quigley Report that there must be a job stabilisation programme in the immediate future? Is he satisfied from his talks with industry that he is given sufficient notice of problems facing individual firms? Is there any prospect of regional aid from the EEC?

Regional aid is forthcoming from the EEC and goes into the national Exchequer to help sustain the regional programme. Job stabilisation is the most important aspect of the report. It is very difficult to maintain the present level of employment in Northern Ireland when many firms are subsidiaries of parent companies and, in present economic circumstances, the tentacles are likely to be cut off before the main body.

May I warmly congratulate the right hon. Gentleman on his appointment and express the hope that he will not transfer too many Questions to Ministers who are not primarily concerned with Northern Ireland? What are the right hon. Gentleman's plans for a debate on the Quigley Report? Could it be on the Floor of the House so that hon. Members from all parts of the United Kingdom may express their views?

Since the Quigley Report recommended an entrepreneurial role for the State, will the right hon. Gentleman be in a position soon to say something about Strathearn Audio, the pioneers in this field, about which there has been a great deal of concern, particularly since the Touche Ross Report?

I cannot go into the Strathearn Audio case at the moment. My right hon. Friend the Home Secretary, when he was Secretary of State for Northern Ireland, said on 2nd July that he was prepared to allow unlimited debates in the Northern Ireland Committee, and I think that that would be an excellent forum for the first consideration of the Quigley Report.

asked the Secretary of State for Northern Ireland what steps he will take to protect the food industry and farmers from the consequences of the decision of Her Majesty's Government not to revalue the green pound.

asked the Secretary of State for Northern Ireland what steps he is taking to control the situation that has arisen due to the failure of Her Majesty's Government to revalue the green pound.

The decision not to revalue the green pound led to a serious shortage of stock being presented for slaughter in Northern Ireland. After consulting my right hon. Friend the Minister of Agriculture, Fisheries and Food, my right hon. Friend the Secretary of State announced on 19th October the introduction of a scheme on the lines of the former Meat Industry Employment Scheme which is intended to protect some 3,000 jobs in the beef and pig processing and ancillary service industries in Northern Ireland. It will also reduce the prices of meat in Northern Ireland shops to levels comparable to those in Great Britain.

The scheme will initially run for four weeks, during which time it will cost about £1 million. Meanwhile, I shall be keeping the situation under review and examining other methods of solving these problems.

Is the hon. Gentleman aware that, in spite of these measures, much damage has already been done to the food and slaughterhouse industries in Northern Ireland because of the disparity? Will he make the strongest representations to see that we start to adjust the green pound not only in the interests of agriculture but, in the longer term, in the interest of consumers as well?

The hon. Gentleman took part in a debate on Friday last week when it was made clear by my right hon. Friend the Minister of Agriculture, Fisheries and Food that the maintenance of the present level of the green pound was essential to countering inflation.

Does my hon. Friend agree that the fact that the Government have not revalued the green pound means that housewives and consumers in Northern Ireland and Great Britain will be able to buy food at lower prices than if the green pound had been revalued? Does he agree that we have to change the common agricultural policy, and will he call on his right hon. Friends to work for a change for the benefit of farmers and consumers in this country?

I agree with what my hon. Friend said about prices. The maintenance of the voluntary social contract is important to Government policy. Like my hon. Friend, I wish to see the CAP revised to take account of new circumstances.

Is the hon. Gentleman aware that certain sectors of the Northern Ireland economy are at risk because cattle producers can smuggle their animals across the border and get an extra £35 or £40 per head? Is he aware that, until that situation is rectified, certain sectors of the economy in Northern Ireland will be in grave danger? What is he going to do about it?

The hon. Gentleman should know that it was because of the situation which he has described that we reintroduced the Meat Industry Employment Scheme in a modified form. The border presents grave difficulties of supervision, and we have called on all the agencies to assist us in this matter. Cattle can be apprehended on the Northern Ireland side of the border, but there are difficulties once they get over the border. We have asked the Irish Republic for help.

Is the hon. Gentleman aware that the housewives and the meat plants in Northern Ireland are grateful for the speedy intervention by the Government in this matter? Will he note that in Northern Ireland there is a strong body of opinion that the Common Market should not be a one-way street and that, if we are paying in, it is time that the Market paid something to us?

I am grateful for what the hon. Gentleman has said. I share his view.

asked the Secretary of State for Northern Ireland if he is satisfied with the degree of control of movement of persons and farm stock at the land frontier between the United Kingdom and the Irish Republic.

As long as there is any evidence of smuggling, I cannot be satisfied. As far as the smuggling of stock is concerned, I would refer the hon. Member to the answer to the Question asked by the hon. Member for Devon, West (Mr. Mills).

Is the hon. Gentleman aware that the smuggling of large numbers of live and very noisy animals is an indication of poor control at the border? Will he give an undertaking to increase the security forces on the border, as this would have beneficial effects not only in regard to cattle smuggling but in relation to the movement of arms and explosives?

My colleagues have been devising all sorts of responses to that question. The hon. Member will be aware of the difficulties of dealing with the border problem. We are aware that live pigs and dumb pigs are crossing the border. The problem is to apprehend them. It is rather like trying to catch greased pigs on a sports day. One moment they are there, the next moment they are not.

Is my hon. Friend aware that the practice of smuggling in Northern Ireland is long-standing and that the animals making the noise of which the hon. Member for Londonderry (Mr. Ross) complains are probably descendants of animals who were smuggled many generations ago?

I have no way of contradicting or admitting that.

How can there be any satisfaction with control on the movement of persons between the Republic and the United Kingdom when it is possible for a person who has been judicially deported from this country to return no fewer than 14 times, as recently happened? Is the Secretary of State aware on how many occasions Mr. Dundon returned to the United Kingdom through Northern Ireland?

With respect, I was dealing with another problem. I am sure that my right hon. Friend has heard the right hon. Gentleman's question, but it is not a matter for me.

asked the Secretary of State for Northern Ireland what is the number of prisoners in Northern Ireland prisons; and what is the range and average of sentence.

The total number of prisoners on 24th October 1976 was 2,667. This included 1,867 sentenced prisoners, of whom 1,163 were special category, 660 were untried prisoners and 140 were borstal trainees. The sentences being served ranged from two weeks to life imprisonment. The average for those serving determinate sentences at 3rd October, the latest date for which the figure is available, is 6·38 years.

Is the number of special category prisoners reducing, and what is the average length of sentence being served by that category of prisoners?

The ending of special category status has reduced the number of special category prisoners, and the number has been stabilising for a short time. If we except the 132 prisoners serving life sentences, there are 1,031 prisoners serving sentences totalling 8,565 years, an average of 8·31 years per prisoner.

Is the Minister aware that many prisoners on remand at the Crumlin Road Prison are refusing to leave their cells for fear of being attacked by other prisoners on remand? Does he agree that in Northern Ireland, although one would like to see it, it is impossible to have full integration in schools and other places? Surely the only sensible thing to do now for murderers and men who have not yet been found guilty is to provide segregation?

My remit from the House was to end special category status, and the one thing I do not recognise now is a Protestant prisoner or a Catholic prisoner. I recognise merely prisoners.

How many prisoners have applied for special category status since the ending of that form of imprisonment? How many people who would otherwise have been granted that status have gone cheerfully—perhaps that is not quite the right word—into cellular accommodation, no longer being of special category status?

It is my guess—I stress that it is my guess—that about 20 of those convicted since the ending of special category status would have claimed that status. Of those 20, I think that seven who have claimed special category status and are not receiving it are refusing to wear prison clothing. They are protesting against not being allowed special category status. There are a further four who, although conforming to prison rules and cellular accommodation, have submitted written application for such status. I should guess that about 20 is the overall total.

asked the Secretary of State for Northern Ireland what his plans are for recruitment into the RUC.

My right hon. Friend the then Secretary of State outlined to the House on 2nd July the plans for increasing the effectiveness of the police. He referred in particular to energetic steps to secure an increase in the strength of the force. Recruitment during the past year or so has been very satisfactory, and every effort is being made by the Chief Constable and Police Authority to maintain this encouraging rate of progress.

On behalf of my right hon. and hon. Friends, I extend congratulations to the Secretary of State on his appointment. I entirely accept what the Under-Secretary has said, but will he bear in mind that the Royal Ulster Constabulary is still significantly below the strength that the Chief Constable would like? Will he also bear in mind that, while the cost of training is substantial the saving that would be effected, in the light of £1 million a week paid in compensation for terrorist activities, would make very light of that cost?

Any shortfall below the full quota for the force is a matter of some anxiety and concern. I must draw the hon. Gentleman's attention to the fact that since 1970 about 3,000 recruits have been accepted into the force and that the present strength of the RUC is 5,200 men against an establishment of 6,500. Energetic steps are continuing. This is a matter for the Police Authority and the Chief Constable, but we shall certainly give whatever help we can in these objectives.

Following the point made by the hon. Member for Isle of Ely (Mr. Freud) about compensation, may I ask why £12,000 was paid to Mr. Guigan in compensation?

That is not a matter for me. There is a Question on the Order Paper.

Does the hon. Gentleman agree that if an announcement were made soon about the new training school for the RUC it would be helpful in increasing the number of recruits for the Royal Ulster Constabulary?

It would be a help, but that is a matter for the Police Authority in the first instance.

asked the Secretary of State for Northern Ireland whether he will make a statement about the security situation in the Province.

asked the Secretary of State for Northern Ireland whether he will make a statement about the security situation.

Attacks by the Provisional IRA upon the security forces have led to the deaths during the past three months of three policemen and five soldiers. Twenty-four persons have been killed by sectarian gangsters from both communities. So far this year, 1,037 persons have been charged with terrorist crimes, including 88 charged with murder and 89 with attempted murder. A growing number are being caught red-handed.

The greater efficiency of the security forces and the people's revulsion from violence are closing the net on terrorists. They know they cannot win. The police and the Army perform their difficult and onerous duties with skill, bravery, tact and compassion that could not be equalled by forces anywhere else in the world. I know that they have the full-hearted support of the House.

Hear, hear.

I join the Secretary of State in his tribute to the security forces, but will he acknowledge that serious damage was done to the morale of the security forces by the policy of his predecessor in engaging in conversations with the political representatives of terror? Will the right hon. Gentleman confirm that he on his part will give an undertaking that there will be no further discussions between him or his officials and the political representatives of the IRA?

There have been no talks for some months and there are none pending. I shall not use the words "never again" as they have been the proverbial graveyard of many politicians. Therefore, I should prefer not to use those words.

Does my right hon. Friend agree that the law on Government compensation for criminal injuries in Northern Ireland is urgently in need of review and that the 1968 Act has been shown by the case of my constituent, Mrs. Ann Maddocks, to be totally inappropriate for the purpose of effectively compensating the widows of soldiers killed in Northern Ireland?

The provisions concerning injury to persons are now under review. I hope that my hon. Friend and the rest of the House will try to separate these matters of compensation. Although the weekly amounts in many cases may seem relatively small for a soldier's widow. we must bear in mind that they stretch over a period and that with their full benefits, including pension, they can be quite large sums. Secondly, cases at home are not for me but for my right hon. Friend the Secretary of State for the Home Department. Thirdly, false analogies are being made in the Press about the 14 who were found to have been ill treated by Her Majesty's Government and who merited compensation by Her Majesty's Government. They are now 'being paid off, but we must remember that they are in a separate category.

Does the right hon. Gentleman agree that the calamitous remarks made by Mr. Jimmy Carter in the heat of the American presidential campaign are likely to encourage the men of violence and to lead to increased bloodshed in Northern Ireland? Does he agree that the men of violence are likely to be encouraged by the appointment of a leader of the "Keep The British Troops Out" movement to head the official Labour Party Study Group on Northern Ireland?

I think that it would be very dangerous for anyone, irrespective of who he or she is, to make comments that might give aid or succour to the Provisional IRA. Secondly the person concerned is a candidate in an election. He is not the President of the United States. The present Administration has always recognised the special problem of Northern Ireland. It has recognised that it is a domestic matter for this country.

Will the right hon. Gentleman explain why the supporters of the IRA were permitted last Saturday to hold an march, and during that march to attack a lawful procession held by the peace movement?

It is difficult to stop people from amassing in places like Belfast, North or West. They can easily, by word of mouth, get 200 or 300 people who in turn can fetch others from outside Belfast and thereby soon get a quite large gathering. I do not think that any permit was required. Consequently, it was a spontaneous act against the genuine and sincere peace women of Northern Ireland.

Does my right hon. Friend think that the policy now being pursued by the Government is succeeding in Northern Ireland?

Yes, I do. If I understand my hon. Friend's policy right, it would be disastrous if we attempted to operate it.

I should like to wish the right hon. Gentleman well on his difficult appointment. I am sure we all feel that we should offer him our congratulations.

What steps is the Secretary of State taking to put a stop to the activities of the top terrorists in Northern Ireland who are still walking around scot-free as members of illegal organisations, acting as godfathers to young people and hiring them to commit murder? Is he aware that we are disappointed that he did not give any undertaking to my hon. Friend the Member for Eastbourne (Mr. Gow) regarding talks with the Provisional Sinn Fein, which was a most dangerous policy and encouraged terrorism during the past 18 months?

The hon. Gentleman will recognise that there is no need for me to repeat what I said. It is on record and there it stands. I am obliged to him for what he said initially.

I am looking into the godfather law. I hope that we shall be able to find some means whereby we can use the law to put these senior criminals behind bars. However, it is not very easy to frame the law to do it.

asked the Secretary of State for Northern Ireland what is his policy in respect of special interrogation centres in Northern Ireland.

There are no special interrogation centres in Northern Ireland.

May I urge my right hon. Friend to beware of those bringing warm welcomes today in regard to his policies in future? Is he satisfied that the conditions under which prisoners are dealt with in Northern Ireland fully accord with the conventions laid down by the International Court of Justice at The Hague and other bodies?

I am always wary of politicians conveying thanks and paying warm tributes to political opponents. It would have been very nice had my hon. Friend conveyed his. Nevertheless, I know that he takes a great deal of interest in Northern Ireland affairs and I look forward to working with him.

Regarding the law and The Hague rules, I should inform my hon. Friend that the Emergency Provisions Act and the operations of the Prevention of Terrorism Act make some difference because of the special circumstances prevailing in Northern Ireland.

In view of what happened as a result of the interrogation centres in Northern Ireland, why is the right hon. Gentleman so reticent about answering the Question asked by my hon. Friend the Member for Banbury (Mr. Marten)? Why has he transferred it to the Ministry of Defence? Has the Northern Ireland Secretary washed his hands of this matter? If this is a long-standing arrangement, will he tell us what the position was when he was Secretary of State for Defence some weeks ago?

The Question has been transferred to where the prime responsibility lies. There is another Question on the Order Paper today, and, provided that the House is not too dilatory, we might reach it and get the reply to it.

asked the Secretary of State for Northern Ireland whether he will make a statement on the working of the Fair Employment (Northern Ireland) Act.

The Act comes fully into operation on 1st December 1976. Meanwhile the Fair Employment Agency has been established and the Department of Manpower Services has circulated a draft guide to manpower policy and practice to interested persons for comment.

On how many occasions has the Agency met so far, and what payment has been made to its members? Has it embarked, on a questionnaire basis, on finding out whether firms in Northern Ireland are engaging in political and religious discrimination?

I am glad that my hon. Friend is still taking an active part in this legislation. I should like to thank him for the assistance he gave us when it was going through the House. The main part of the legislation does not come into force until 1st December. All we have done is to set up the Agency. All the other aspects will come into force on 1st December, when the Agency will get down to its job. The chairman will be salaried. The other members of the Agency will be paid an attendance allowance plus expenses and travelling.

asked the Secretary of State for Northern Ireland if he will either take an independent political initiative in Northern Ireland or step up the level of activity of the security forces.

No, Sir. There is no change in our position.

Northern Ireland is part of the United Kingdom unless a majority of the population want this changed.

The Government want a devolved Government, but, as we have consistently made clear,

"no system of government within Northern Ireland will be stable or effective unless both parts of the community acquiesce in that system and are willing to work to support it." —[Official Report, 2nd July 1976; Vol. 914. c. 809.]

This means a system which will command widespread support throughout the community and in which both the majority and the minority will participate.

Until there is a devolved Government, in Northern Ireland, the Government here are responsible for ensuring that Northern Ireland is governed. They will not shirk this responsibility. But the representatives of the Northern Ireland people must find agreement. This cannot be imposed. They must find a will to work together. There is no other way.

Will the Secretary of State continue to take a positive attitude on Northern Ireland? Does he appreciate that the Government are under an obligation to try to get reconciliation and cooperation between the various warring factors in Northern Ireland?

I have been determined, since I came into office, to ensure decisive and determined direct rule. That is what we are pursuing. If the old Stormontonians feel that they can cross the divide and come together and bring forward some solution for a partnership Government, I shall be prepared to listen.

May I take it that the Secretary of State's reply this afternoon means that there has been no change in policy since the announcement on 12th January, when the then Secretary of State, in clear and unequivocal terms, said:

"We must find a way in which both communities are involved in government in Northern Ireland".—[Official Report, 12th January 1976; Vol. 903, c. 64.]

Is that the stated position of the Government? The word "acquiesce" could create some doubt.

My hon. Friend will recognise that initially I said

"There is no change in our position."

I also said that we would have the majority and the minority participating.

In government?

I think that covers the position.

Incidentally, while I am on my feet, and as my hon. Friend the Member for Belfast, West (Mr. Fitt) has risen to ask a question, I should like to praise his courage. I suppose most hon. Members are aware of my hon. Friend's act some weeks ago. It was a courageous act, an example to his party and to the people in Northern Ireland, especially now that he is prepared to stand up in court and identify those who were prepared to terrorise him.

Is the Secretary of State aware that his answer to my hon. Friend the Member for Bexleyheath (Mr. Townsend) is welcomed by the Opposition? It is very much in line with what we said on 12th January in the debate on the Convention Report and with what I have repeated recently in published correspondence. Our policy is for a devolved Government within the Province. Our position has not changed. Will the right hon. Gentleman continue to encourage inter-party talks so that all the options can be discussed fully, if possible in private?

I am obliged to the hon. Gentleman for those remarks. I shall certainly encourage the parties involved. There are seven major political parties in Northern Ireland, all of which have different viewpoints on how the devolved Government should come about. There has already been reconnaissance between the SDLP and the Official Unionist Party, and I know that members of the Democratic Unionist Party are trying to get talks going. I shall encourage them and be ready to listen to their views.

Is the Secretary of State aware that the two matters mentioned in the Question are in no sense alternatives to one another and that to take a political initiative for the sake of taking a political initiative could be very harmful to the successful development of the security situation?

I agree with the right hon. Gentleman. The security situation at the moment has not changed. There are still 14,500 troops backing up the RUC in Northern Ireland. Those troops will remain as long as the security situation exists. I hope that all the parties in Northern Ireland will use their initiative and bring their results to me.

In view of his initial answer, will my right hon. Friend bring forward such evidence as he has, particularly from the history of the last 52 years, to suggest that Ulster is governable as long as it remains an integral part of the United Kingdom?

It is governable now and it is being governed.

asked the Secretary of State for Northern Ireland how many representations he has received concerning his consultative document on the reorganisation of secondary education in Northern Ireland.

To date, some 30 letters have been received. It was recently announced that the closing date for the submission of views would be extended until Easter 1977, and accordingly the main bulk of submissions is not to be expected for some time yet.

Is the Minister aware that consciouness of his proposals is only now beginning to show on the surface in Northern Ireland? Will he bear in mind the example set by the Minister of State that when dealing with legislation of such importance to the Northern Ireland community full consultation is essention? Will he consider extending the time limit for representations until the middle of next year?

I have already said that we have extended the time limit. Most of the letters that I have received on the subject have requested an extension, which we have granted.

Is the Minister aware that we welcome the extension of the period for consultation? Since education will be a matter for the future devolved Government, will he please take care not to prejudice in any way the future of good independent grammar and other secondary schools, otherwise, a new element of discord will be introduced into an already troubled province?

The Government have no intention of foisting a new educational system on Northern Ireland. The consultative document is the result of discussion which started back in the days of Stormont. There is no intention to undermine the excellent education system in Northern Ireland.

asked the Secretary of State for Northern Ireland if he will describe the extent of the special measures taken to provide job opportunities for young persons in Northern Ireland.

The recruitment subsidy for school leavers and the youth employment subsidy have been applied in Northern Ireland as in the rest of the United Kingdom. In addition, employment for young persons is provided through the Enterprise Ulster and Young-help schemes. The effect of these measures has been to create almost 1,700 openings for young persons.

Does my hon. Friend agree that many young people are loose on the streets in Northern Ireland and are often involved in ugly situations because of the lack of job opportunities? Will he co-operate with the Department of Employment to ensure that measures such as the work swap scheme and the work experience scheme are introduced into Northern Ireland as soon as possible?

We already have special schemes in Northern Ireland, and we have had them for some time. We are, therefore, a bit in front. In the last package, £95,000 was spent on young people in Northern Ireland. I shall be looking at the job release scheme and examining other special schemes to see whether we can give more money to them.

asked the Secretary of State for Northern Ireland what major steps have been taken to extend democracy in Northern Ireland since the present emergency began.

Among the changes in Northern Ireland since 1969 have been the introduction of universal suffrage for local government elections, the lowering to 18 of the voting age at all elections, and the introduction of proportional representation in local government and provincial elections.

I thank my right hon. Friend for that answer, and I hope that he can extend the list in the near future. Important as security is—it naturally tends to dominate Question Time—does not my right hon. Friend agree that the solution for Northern Ireland must be political? May we have a full-scale debate on Northern Ireland as soon as possible?

A debate would be the responsibility of my right hon. Friend the Leader of the House. My right hon. Friend the present Home Secretary said on 2nd July that the Northern Ireland Committee could be used as many times as required for that purpose.

Is it not appropriate to welcome the support of the hon. Member for Sheffield, Hillsborough (Mr. Flannery) for the principle of decision by majority in Northern Ireland? Is the Secretary of State aware that one of the most important advances still necessary for democracy in Northern Ireland is an extension of real local government as it is enjoyed in the rest of the United Kingdom?

I recognise that the right hon. Gentleman is really referring to the Macrory gap. There are 26 local councils in Northern Ireland, and there is a gap between that level and central Government. If the right hon. Gentleman can encourage members of the old Convention and other politicians in Northern Ireland to get together to try to bridge the gulf so that all parties concerned can acquiesce in a form of partnership in government, I shall be prepared to consider their solutions.