asked the Secretary of State for Scotland whether he will make a statement about the outlook for the Scottish economy.

There is growing evidence that the world economy is beginning to recover and, together with the progress we have made in containing costs and improving competitiveness, this should improve the prospects for growth in the Scottish economy.

When will the Secretary of State step in and do something about the tragic and deteriorating unemployment situation in Scotland, with 4.000 jobs immediately threatened in Scottish shipbuilding, more than 2,000 in Scottish steel and at least another 1,000 in the Scottish coal industry? In particular, will the right hon. Gentleman now say clearly whether he approves of MacGregor's daft plan to collaborate with the United States Steel Corporation to destroy at least another 2,000 jobs in the Scottish steel industry?

I certainly agree with the hon. Gentleman that unemployment is the most serious problem facing all Western European countries, including ourselves. All the industries to which he referred have particular problems, mainly related to lack of demand for the products which they produce. As he will be aware, the Government have been doing everything possible to help, including providing large sums of public money to help those industries through the recession.

Does the Secretary of State subscribe to the view that if the Finance Bill is passed and there is no general election, one new oil field may be opened up every six weeks? That is a Government estimate, I would add, before the right hon. Gentleman puts his foot in it, which I would not want him to do as he is a very decent chap. It that happens, what effect will it have on the ordering of rigs, platforms and supply vessels?

I am grateful, as always, to the right hon. Gentleman for his advice. He is correct in his view that the Budget changes affecting oil development have been welcomed throughout the oil industry. We expect that they will lead to a revival of orders for the platform construction yards. It is too early yet to say how many others, but undoubtedly the development of these fields is bound to produce many orders for Scottish yards.

Does my right hon. Friend recall that the dispersal of Civil Service jobs to the west of Scotland was firm Government policy? Will he give a progress report on whether there are any jobs in the pipeline?

As my hon. Friend may know, my right hon. Friend the Secretary of State for Defence has this afternoon announced the full package of posts from his Department for dispersal to Glasgow. The total number currently in these units is 1,520, which is 120 more than the total of 1,400 included in the Government's dispersal plans announced on 26 July 1979. I am sure that this news will be warmly welcomed in Glasgow and in Scotland.

We are grateful for the announcement, which of course compares with the plan to transfer 7,000 jobs to Glasgow — a plan which the Government inherited in 1979 and subsequently abandoned. Is the Secretary of State aware that the three basic industries, steel, shipbuilding and coal, now face a serious crisis? Is it not a fact that, unless the Government accept the emergency programme for British Shipbuilders, the 9,000 redundancies already announced, which are being resisted by the unions, will have many thousands more added to them? Is it not therefore extremely urgent that we have a favourable response to the plans for British Shipbuilders which have been put to the Government? Is that not also true of the coal industry, because, again, unless there is emergency help for that industry, the threatened closure of the Cardowan colliery will be only the start of a further rundown of the Scottish coal industry, which will add to the disastrous toll of closures and redundancies that Scotland has suffered under this Government?

The dispersal programme of 1,520 compares well with the grand total of nil that the right hon. Gentleman produced in six years in office when he was given every facility. Of course, the right hon. Gentleman could not do it because the unions told him that he could not.

asked the Secretary of State for Scotland what is his decision in the case of Ken Murray, senior officer at Low Moss prison, further to Mr. Murray's appeal against the caution which he received following his address to the Scottish Young Liberals' conference on 29 January.

Mr. Murray twice requested an extension of the period of time allocated for the lodging of the details of his appeal against his governor's award of a caution. The appeal, which has now been received, is receiving careful consideration and it would not be appropriate for me to comment at this stage. I shall write to the right hon. Gentleman when I have reached my decision.

Is the Secretary of State aware, first, that this officer had received permission from his superiors to address the conference, and, secondly, that what he said in criticism of the Scottish prison system was not substantially different from the criticism contained in various reports from Her Majesty's Inspectorate of Prisons? Will he therefore encourage open debate on the future of our prison system?

I can reassure the right hon. Gentleman that Officer Murray did ask for permission before making this speech, but the right hon. Gentleman will not expect me to comment on the merits of the case, as it will come before me on appeal.

asked the Secretary of State for Scotland how much has so far been paid to housing authorities for remedial works against dampness; and if he will make a statement.

asked the Secretary of State for Scotland if he will undertake a Scottish house condition survey to determine the extent of the problems of dampness and condensation.

The final allocations for 1983–84 enable all schemes in authorities' capital programmes to remedy dampness and condensation to be undertaken this year if authorities accord them priority, as I hope they will. In addition to the extra information now being collected from local authorities on dampness and condensation, the EC labour force survey has a special Scottish supplement on housing matters, which will provide very useful information at a national level. This door-to-door survey is now under way.

Does the Minister recognise that his statement on 31 March about a multi-million pound allocation to fight dampness was grossly misleading? Does he agree that the promised £11 million is a deficit of £2·6 million when account is taken of the £13·6 million forfeited by 28 authorities under the housing expenditure limit system?

It is true that £13 million has been forfeited by local authorities. I hope that the hon. Gentleman will be one of the first to urge them to change their policies. The £11·4 million figure is accurate and was made possible by the outstanding success of the Government's policy of selling council houses to sitting tenants.

Does the Minister accept that, as the survey which is being undertaken covers only one third of 1 per cent. of houses, or one house in 300, it is completely inadequate for the problems that have been unearthed by the Select Committee on Scottish Affairs in its investigations into dampness? Does he agree that, as a result of these revelations, we should have a social survey combined with a house condition survey of at least 5 per cent. of dwelling houses in Scotland?

We await the conclusions of the Select Committee with interest. The information in this new survey is to supplement the substantial information that we are collecting from local authorities. The size of the sample and the number of questions in the survey are larger than in the English national house condition survey.

Does my hon. Friend agree that there is an urgent need to redefine dampness to include condensation caused by structural defects which are not the responsibility of the tenant? Does he also agree that there is a basic injustice in requiring tenants to meet the cost of such condensation when they have no control over it?

My hon. Friend raises an important point about the difference between dampness and condensation. Dampness is essentially caused by external factors, whether rising or penetrating dampness, whereas condensation is caused by a combination of factors. We look forward to the conclusions of the Select Committee on this point.

Does the Minister accept and will he admit that the £11 million of which he is talking is not new money and that to pretend that it is amounts to fraudulent misrepresentation? Would not a better way to tackle this crisis be to give back some of the f100 million that has been clawed out of local authorities' capital allocations because of their failure to meet unreasonable rent targets over the past three years? Specifically, does the right hon. Gentleman stand by the extraordinary claim by the Scottish Office that the pitifully inadequate funding made available will allow Glasgow district council, for example, to cover in full the cost of carrying through in one year its entire programme for the eradication of dampness and condensation?

The answer to the hon. Gentleman's final question is yes. That is the figure in Glasgow's capital programme and check list.

asked the Secretary of State for Scotland what priority he gives to publicising the work of his Department and to improving the availability of information and advice from his Department to the general public.

I attach a high priority to informing the public of the facts regarding Government policy and am always ready to consider suggestions for improving this service.

I am glad to hear that. Is the Secretary of State aware that the Minister for Consumer Affairs has caused considerable mischief and uncertainty among citizens advice bureaux recently? Citizens advice bureaux in Scotland deal with at least 120,000 inquiries from members of the public about functions which are the responsibility of the Scottish Office. Will the Secretary of State therefore take this opportunity to repudiate the threats and slurs that the Minister for Consumer Affairs, the hon. Members for Reading, South (Dr. Vaughan), has made against citizens advice bureaux? Does not this whole episode make a strong case for citizens advice bureaux in Scotland being funded through the Scottish Office rather than through the Department of Trade?

I do not think that any of those points arise out of this question, but I am glad to take the opportunity of applauding the excellent work done by the many citizens advice bureaux in Scotland.

Are the citizens advice bureaux in Scotland to undergo a similar inquiry to that intended for England and Wales, given that a review was carried out, I understand, last year?

I am not aware that a review was carried out last year, but, of course, citizens advice bureaux in Scotland will benefit from the inquiry that is going on.

Is my right hon. Friend aware that many of the matters with which his Department deals need much better publicity? Is he aware, for example, that many people think that there have been cuts in resources to the National Health Service, although under this Government resources have been increased? Does my right hon. Friend realise that many people do not know that there is a better pupil-teacher ratio than ever in our schools and that more money is spent per pupil? If it were not for the fact that I do not want to try your patience further, Mr. Speaker, I would ask my right hon. Friend whether many other things could be added to the list of items requiring more publicity.

I share my hon. Friend's great surprise that such obvious facts do not seem to be widely known — in particular, that there has been real growth in money for the NHS in the past four years. Not long ago a parliamentary candidate at a by-election was asked a question, to which he did not appear to know the answer, and he replied,"I am not sure of the answer to that, but it will be the Tory cuts." We do our best to put right such misinformation.

asked the Secretary of State for Scotland by what percentage the staffing levels in secondary schools in each region of Scotland are above those recommended in the publication "Secondary School Staffing" known as the Red Book.

The information requested is contained in the Scottish Education Department's statistical bulletin No. 1/B1/1983 of January 1983, a copy of which was sent to the hon. Gentleman.

I am grateful to the Minister for sending me that copy, but will he confess that the statistics included in the information that he sent me show that some authorities are already above the recommended level above Red Book standards to deal with this major change? Will he now concede that the allowance that he has made is totally inadequate? Will he increase it, and increase the rate support grant to local authorities so that they can employ more secondary teachers to carry out those reforms, thus taking them out of the dole queue and putting them into the classrooms?

We do not agree that the grant is insufficient. However, because of the reforms that have been announced, we are, as the hon. Gentleman knows, increasing the allowance. The fact that some local authorities continue to staff their schools at above the average level—6·7 at present on Red Book standards—is no reason to suggest that other authorities, including Labour-controlled authorities, are failing in their duty to staff schools properly.

Does my hon. Friend agree that Tayside region, which often attracts criticism from the Opposition, has a splendid record on Red Book standards? Its record on examination results is above average. It is a very good authority, which consistently applies the logic that the customer is always right.

My hon. Friend is absolutely right. It is the use of resources, not the amount of money spent, that matters.

Will the Minister concede that the support that he suggests for implementation of the Munn and Dunning reforms could, according to his own figures, result in some local authorities having their teaching levels cut if his argument is carried through to its logical conclusion? Does the Minister see that as a meaningful contribution towards the realisation of his ambitions for the Munn and Dunning reports? Does he think that he can carry the teaching unions and the respective local authorities with him if he imposes cuts at the same time as he asks for reforms to be realised?

Yes, I do. We are increasing the allowance. The fact that some local authorities have an over-provision and are operating their staffing levels inefficiently does not justify the hon. Gentleman's remarks. He should bear in mind the increase to 5 or 6 per cent. above Red Book standards announced by my right hon. Friend the Secretary of State and the fact that every day taken off the school year—to which we agreed—to allow teachers to prepare for the changes adds 0·5 per cent. to Red Book standards.

asked the Secretary of State for Scotland if there is a hyperbaric oxygen chamber in Glasgow.

There are two hyperbaric oxygen chambers in Glasgow, both located in the Western infirmary.

Is it not true that, because of Government cuts, those machines are lying empty? Is the Minister aware that they could be used to help sufferers from multiple sclerosis? I understand that people suffering from multiple sclerosis have to travel to Dundee to use a machine.

The hon. Lady obviously did not listen to the answer given by my right hon. Friend the Secretary of State to my hon. Friend the Member for Fife, East (Mr. Henderson) about the money that we are putting into the Health Service. There is a growing interest in the use of hyperbaric oxygen chambers to treat multiple sclerosis, and I would welcome any proposal for a fully validated double blind trial of this form of treatment. It would not be wise to spend more money on equipment or to raise false hopes until we are sure that the treatment works.

Does my hon. Friend agree that the first hyperbaric centre in Scotland should be set up in Aberdeen? As this Government have encouraged industrial, oil and health interests to co-operate in this sphere there, may we hope that Aberdeen will eventually give the lead in the whole area of hyperbaric medicine?

My hon. Friend is right. We expect to receive specific proposals shortly from Grampian health board. A new consultant in hyperbaric medicine has recently been appointed there.

As the incidence of multiple sclerosis is increasing in the north of the country, will my hon. Friend consider providing aid for research into multiple sclerosis in the Grampian area?

I am interested in all possible aids and research projects connected with multiple sclerosis. Indeed, the Medical Research Council recently awarded £50,000 to Dr. Downie, consultant neurologist with the Grampian health board, as part of a national trial of a drug called Azathioprine for the treatment of that disease. Medical people regard that as the priority research area, rather than the hyperbaric research undertaken in the Grampian area.

asked the Secretary of State for Scotland what representation he has received against the relaxation of the provision of table 17 of the Building Standards (Scotland) Regulations 1981, in respect of Barratt Edinburgh Ltd. one-apartment flats, type studio solo, proposed to be built in Kirkcaldy district; and if he will make a statement.

Because the building standards regulations do not cover flats specifically designed for one-person accommodation, the space requirements in respect of these flats have been relaxed. Representations have been made by Kirkcaldy district council.

Is the Minister aware that Kirkcaldy district council is bitterly opposed to these unjustified reductions in the standards of those houses, particularly the minimum basic standards? Although such houses may be acceptable in England, we in Scotland do not want rabbit hutches for living accommodation. Will the Minister at least remove relaxation for Kirkcaldy district council?

The hon. Gentleman has missed the key point. When the space standards were drawn up, a demand for minimum living accommodation for single people only was not envisaged. It is wrong to penalise innovations that meet modern housing needs. Indeed, I understand that the flats are selling extremely well.

Is there not a change of policy by the Government in this particular case, as similar proposals have been turned down in the past? Will the hon. Gentleman comment on the wider question of the complete relaxation of space standards? Is he aware that the Convention of Scottish Local Authorities, the district housing authorities and all the professional interests are bitterly opposed to such relaxation? The last thing that Scotland wants is many small, inadequate houses. We have enough of them already.

We have recently completed public consultation on our proposals to drop housing space standards on the basis that they are outdated restrictions on freedom of choice. A statement will be made after we have considered the responses and the advice of the Building Standards Advisory Committee. However, I would expect the right hon. Gentleman to be in favour of outdated restrictions on freedom of choice.

Will the Minister confirm that there are no technical reasons for allowing the standards laid down by the House to be relaxed and that the Government have allowed them to be relaxed not only in Kirkcaldy, but in Dunfermline, Edinburgh and Dundee? Where else will that firm be allowed to build its hutches? Is it not true that it makes very big subscriptions to the Tory party and that that is why the Minister is allowing it to get away with murder?

The answer to the hon. Gentleman's last point is, "Not to my knowledge." The hon. Gentleman has raised this point before. Following his last hysterical outburst about Barratt, I understand that he was invited to see a studio solo and he refused.

That is not true.

In any event, it is deplorable to make such unjustified attacks on a reputable company. The fact is that these houses are meeting a need.

I wish to give notice, Mr. Speaker, that I shall seek to raise a point of order at the end of Question Time.

On a point of order, Mr. Speaker. The Minister asserted that I had received an invitation from Barratt, the builders, to visit one of its houses. That is certainly not true within the past six months —(HON. MEMBERS: "Oh!"]—although in the dim and distant past it might have issued a friendly invitation that I refused. I would refuse any subsequent invitation, too.

Why?

Because these houses are hovels that are not fit to live in.

asked the Secretary of State for Scotland when he expects the improvements to the road to Mallaig to be completed.

I hope that the section into Mallaig itself can start next year, with completion in 1986. Draft road orders have been published for two further sections, but objections that have been lodged to these make any estimate of completion dates difficult.

I thank the Minister at least for doing his best at long last to give us a date. Has his Department given any thought to the consequential effect of a parallel railway line, because with large central Government expenditure on roads and no investment in the railways, we directly enable the bus companies considerably to undercut the railways as well as to provide a faster service? That is now happening on the Inverness to Edinburgh and Inverness to Glasgow routes.

I thought that the hon. Gentleman was interested in the road to Mallaig. As to the railways, the options in the Serpell report are purely illustrative and are designed to stimulate debate. With regard to the road to Mallaig, we shall do our utmost to resolve the objections.

asked the Secretary of State for Scotland whether he is satisfied with the progress being made with the sale of council houses to sitting tenants in Scotland.

asked the Secretary of State for Scotland if he will indicate the average period being taken by Scottish local authorities to finalise the sale of houses to tenants who have applied to purchase their homes under the Tenants' Rights etc. (Scotland) Act and the total number of applications outstanding at 30 March.

The average time taken by local authorities to process sales from application to completion was just under 13 months in respect of sales completed in the last three quarters of 1982. I regard that figure as unacceptable and in January my Department wrote to 19 authorities whose performances were giving most grounds for concern.

Are the local authorities that are taking longest to complete council house sales predominantly Labour-controlled, and if so will my hon. Friend list them?

I shall not take up the time of the House by listing all 19 authorities. The information is publicly available and I shall send it to my hon. Friend. Most of the authorities concerned are Labour, but I am glad to say that most have given reassurances that they will speed up the process of sales. We are determined that the aspirations of tenants will not be needlessly frustrated.

As my hon. Friend said, the average time of 13 months is totally unacceptable. As well as getting in touch with the local authorities, mainly Labour, that are causing this delay, will my hon. Friend contact the Scottish Home and Health Department, because prison officers in Peterhead have been desperately trying to get their houses for 18 months? Will my hon. Friend take some action to ensure that those prison officers are able to purchase their houses, thereby saving money?

I note my hon. Friend's concern about the prison officers. We are doing everything that we can to finalise those sales, but my hon. Friend will appreciate that some of the problems encountered, particularly with regard to unmade roads, do not apply to local authorities. As to the local authorities, my hon. Friend will be interested to know that Banff and Buchan has agreed to take on an additional solicitor, on a temporary basis, to speed up sales.

Is the hon. Gentleman trying to alter his strategy because he is dissatisfied with the sale of council houses in the sense that his right hon. Friend is responsible for encroachment into the Edinburgh planning area à la Swanston? How can the Minister justify the taking of such a decision that will blight Edinburgh's green belt?

My right hon. Friend made the position absolutely clear in his decision letter and said that further encroachment of the green belt surrounding Edinburgh should not be necessary. The position on council sales is quite different. The Government believe that the aspirations of tens of thousands of Scottish families to own their own homes should be met.

Is my hon. Friend aware of the immediate and successful response to the shared ownership scheme? Will he look at the possibility of extending that scheme to council house tenants?

Yes. I am delighted at the success of shared ownership schemes and at the fact that certain legal difficulties appear to have been overcome. I have no doubt that there is considerable scope for a further extension of shared ownership in Scotland.

If home ownership rights for sitting tenants in rented property are of such enormous, almost theological, importance to the Government, will there be legislation to give similar rights to private tenants?

As the Labour party is apparently committed to nationalising more or less everything, it is not surprising that the hon. Gentleman cannot tell the difference between public and private property rights. The hon. Gentleman, as an owner-occupier, is apparently obsessed with the desire to prevent tens of thousands of Scottish families from achieving their ambition of owner-occupation.

asked the Secretary of State for Scotland what representations he has received alleging anomalies in rating valuation in Scotland compared with England and Wales; and if he will make a statement.

I have received representations about a variety of Scottish businesses, from a number of sources. I have consulted the Scottish Valuation Advisory Council and will consult the Convention of Scottish Local Authorities about possible remedies.

Will my hon. Friend give special attention to situations where the anomalies are particularly glaring, especially when there is competition north and south of the border? Does he recognise that there are anomalies in Scotland and that at the end of the day many of the problems stem from the different expenditure policies of local authorities?

My hon. Friend is absolutely right on both points. There is no doubt that many of the difficulties are caused by the unreasonable expenditure policies pursued by some Scottish authorities.

The Minister and his right hon. Friend will be well aware that one of the most glaring anomalies now in the rating system is the valuation of race courses. Given that a major crisis is affecting the Scottish racing industry, especially the race courses at Ayr and Hamilton Park, what action are the Government taking urgently to make sure that racing in Scotland survives this crisis?

I appreciate the hon. Gentleman's point. The advisory council has specifically considered race courses. We are urgently considering the council's recommendations on that matter, together with others, and we shall reach a decision as soon as possible.

Will the hon. Gentleman consider the undesirability of rating croft houses that are let to tourists as commercial premises? Will he also consider urgently the possibility of derating peat banks?

I shall look into both matters raised by the hon. Gentleman.

Is my hon. Friend aware that the rateable value of a hotel bedroom in Scotland is about £400, whereas in England it is about £165? Is that not totally unfair and should not something urgently be done before we crucify the Scottish tourist industry?

My hon. Friend made that very point during Friday's debate on the Rating (Caravan Sites) (Scotland) (Amendment) Bill. That debate was completely ignored by the Opposition, which shows how much they really care about some of the anomalies.

I accept that anomalies exist inside the Scottish rating system, but does the Minister agree that rates are higher in Scotland because of the increased poundage forced on local authorities as a result of the Government's intention to reduce step by step the proportion of Scottish public expenditure?

The increased poundage is due to the excessive expenditure policies of many Scottish local authorities, but I accept that there is often a combination of valuation and poundage factors.

asked the Secretary of State for Scotland if he will publish a White Paper outlining his future plans for dealing with the problems of unemployment in Scotland.

I have at present no intention of publishing such a White Paper, but I shall bear the right hon. Gentleman's suggestion in mind.

That is exactly the reply that I expected, but, in view of the right hon. Gentleman's reply a few minutes ago about the dissemination of Government information, it is rather surprising that he is reticent about this. We were given to understand that, as inflation and interest rates came down, so would unemployment, but unemployment is going up. If the Secretary of State and his colleagues continue to decimate the Scottish steel industry we shall have no basic industry at all and we shall not be able to attract inward investment and jobs—

Order. This is not a time for speeches; it is a time for questions.

Very good, though.

It might be. But we are in Question Time.

I appreciate the right hon. Gentleman's point, but it would not add anything to our knowledge to publish a White Paper, although it would enable me to point out several useful facts, such as that, whereas in the United Kingdom industrial production in the year ended 1982 had fallen by 0·1 per cent., in Scotland it rose by 2·5 per cent., and in the same period manufacturing production in the United Kingdom fell by 1·2 per cent. while it rose by 1·8 per cent. in Scotland.

Is not the soundest way to reduce unemployment in Scotland to attract and encourage new industry? Is not the greatest disincentive to that, and thus the greatest blow to Scottish job prospects, the cynical practice of the Labour party in continuing to talk Scotland down and put those industries off?

I appreciate what my hon. Friend says, and if I thought that overseas investors were paying close attention to what Labour Members said I would agree. However, they are much more likely to be worried about setting up in Scotland if there were any prospect of the Labour party getting into power and trying to tear us out of Europe. That would destroy thousands of jobs almost overnight and certainly prevent any new investment.

Will the Secretary of State take my advice and accept that there will shortly be an announcement that more than 700 jobs will become vacant at the Clydesdale steelworks? Is he aware that my hon. Friend the Member for Coatbridge and Airdrie (Mr. Clarke) and myself are making strong representations to the Minister of State, Department of Employment with a view to the continuation of the short-time working payment supplement? Is he prepared to give a categoric assurance that he will add his weight to our solicitations to the Minister in an effort to save those jobs?

I appreciate the hon. Gentleman's concern. I have seen deputations from those involved who have pressed the matter on my attention and I have been in touch with my right hon. Friend the Secretary of State for Employment about it.

Would my right hon. Friend care to comment further on what he thinks the effect on unemployment in Scotland would be if the inept, inane and myopic policies of the Labour party to take Britain out of the EC were ever implemented?

I agree with my hon. Friend, but the most significant fact is that we all know that there are many members of the Labour party who think the same as we do but who are not prepared to say so.

Will the Secretary of State answer at least one question that he dodged earlier this afternoon? As we are faced with more than 4,000 redundancies in the Scottish shipbuilding industry, will the Government respond positively to British Shipbuilders' request for emergency aid, or will they simply stand idly by and allow its sections of the shipbuilding industry to collapse?

The right hon. Gentleman knows that the chairman of British Shipbuilders has to submit his proposals to my right hon. Friend and they then have to be considered carefully by the Government. I assure the right hon. Gentleman that, when those proposals are considered in detail by the Government, I shall be taking part.

asked the Secretary of State for Scotland what information he has as to which education authorities have decided to ban corporal punishment.

All but one of the Regional and Island councils in Scotland are moving towards elimination of corporal punishment in schools by the end of the 1983–84 school session.

Does my right hon. Friend really think that the abandonment of corporal punishment without any alternative measure will improve discipline in schools? Is he satisfied that the education authorities have had full consultations with teachers and parents?

As my hon. Friend knows, I have always stressed that the changes should be made in the closest consultation with the teachers and I advised local authorities to do so. I am confident, from what I have heard, that the problems are being satisfactorily dealt with. Although there are bound to be difficulties now and again, we should implement the policy in a steady and care fully calculated manner.

What assessment has the right hon. Gentleman made of the staff time that is taken up with disciplinary matters nowadays? Is that not a factor that should be taken into account in Red Book standards plus?

I have not made any calculation of any changes in staff time that this may involve, but obviously such a change of practice is bound to demand a certain amount of extra effort from teachers. However, as most of the teachers concerned support the policy, they will think that it is an advance in education.

Does my right hon. Friend agree that the real problem is that parental discipline is breaking down and teachers are being asked to do the jobs that parents are no longer doing? If parents want their children to be strapped at school, should not the headmaster have the freedom to do so?

I appreciate what my hon. Friend says and I agree that parents should play their part in disciplining their children. That must be stressed at all times. As my hon. Friend will be aware, that is one of the advantages that I believe will come once the new parental involvement in schools, which has been so carefully stimulated by my hon. Friend and others, takes effect. It will be a good thing to have much closer parental involvement in disciplinary matters.

Is it not irresponsible to require the ending of corporal punishment without adequate resources having been made available, when the right hon. Gentleman has already admitted this afternoon that there will be more work in the establishment of belt-free education in Scotland?

It probably would be irresponsible to make such changes with inadequate resources, but as the resources available are better than they have ever been, and as the money for school education is higher per pupil than it has ever been, the hon. Gentleman does not have much of a point.

asked the Secretary of State for Scotland when he intends to meet the president of the National Farmers Union of Scotland to discuss European Community aid for Scottish agriculture.

My right hon. Friend the Secretary of State for Scotland and my noble Friend the Minister of State often have discussions with the president and other union representatives on a wide range of matters.

Is the Minister aware that there is a deep sense of disappointment as a result of the Government's failure to give adequate support to the Provan report, which already has the support of many sections of the Community, not least the Community Parliament? Will he reconsider this question in the light of the disappointment that has already been expressed by those affected in Scotland?

The Commission has acknowledged that it is its responsibility to put forward the structure proposals for a plan to help the most disadvantaged areas of the Community. If and when the Commission comes forward with proposals affecting the Highlands and Islands, we shall consider them carefully. It ill-becomes a member of the Labour party, which would take us out of the EC and deprive us of any possibility of Community aid, to suggest that we have been found wanting in our support of any EC project.

Did not the European Commission say that, if the Government were prepared to respond, it could produce a proposal within six weeks?

That remains to be seen when the Commission produces the proposals. We have made it clear all along that we await proposals from it. It has to make the proposals, but in any case there is no money in the EC for any such schemes until 1984.

Does my hon. Friend agree that one of the weaknesses of the so-called Provan report was, first, that it did not detail how the money was to be spent, and, secondly, that it excluded the highland areas of Perthshire, Angus and North Tayside?

My hon. Friend raises one of the problems about giving aid to specially disadvantaged areas defined in broad geographic terms. The National Farmers Union is well aware of that problem and, if and when the proposal comes from the EC, one would expect that to be one of the problems that will be discussed between us.

asked the Secretary of State for Scotland what is his estimate of bed weeks lost because of remedial building work at the Royal hospital for sick children, Glasgow; and when he expects this work to be completed.

In the period from February 1978 to the end of March this year a total of 14,238 bed weeks have been lost. All remedial work is now virtually complete and the hospital is expected to be back in full use shortly.

Is the Minister aware that I have never considered this saga to be a party political matter, but much more a bureaucratic one? I have continually asked that there should be a public inquiry. If the Minister finds, as I think that he will, that the legal process is far too long, will he institute a public inquiry into the background of the hospital and, perhaps through that, find out a great deal more about the conditions in the building industry in Scotland?

I recognise that the hon. Member has taken a continuing and long interest in the Royal hospital for sick children, and he may be the prospective candidate for the seat that encompasses that hospital, which may be of interest to at least one right hon. Member. I think that the hon. Member knows that counsel has always advised us that holding a public inquiry could prejudice the board's legal position in seeking restitution, and as considerable sums of money are involved in the disputation between the board and the builders, it is in the interest of the taxpayer and the Health Service that we do not do anything that might damage our position in our efforts to get some of the money back.

rose—

Order. I shall call the hon. Member for Aberdeenshire, East (Mr. McQuarrie) and, to be fair, the Opposition Front Bench spokesman, and allow two minutes extra at the end of questions to the Solicitor-General for Scotland.

I am grateful for the reply that my hon. Friend gave to the hon. Member for Glasgow, Kelvingrove (Mr. Carmichael). However, may I ask him to answer the last part of the question? When does he expect the work to be completed, because, as he is well aware, the hospital has suffered for many years while being built, to the detriment of the staff employed in the hospital?

When I visited the hospital a few months ago, the last of the scaffolding was coming down. Only a few small jobs remained to be done and none of those will prevent the hospital from coming into full use.

As the hon. Gentleman said that a large sum of money was involved, how does he intend to pursue compensation?

The route is the normal route of a statement of claim and arbitration against the original main contractors, Costain Construction Ltd. That was submitted to the appointed architect in March 1980 and much detailed work and preparation have been done since then. I expect that formal hearings will start early next year.

asked the Solicitor-General for Scotland if he is satisfied that the time of advocates-depute is used as efficiently as possible.

Yes. There are 12 advocates-depute, that number having remained constant since April 1981. Since then their work load has markedly increased with no deterioration in the service provided by them and I am satisfied that their time is used as efficiently as possible.

I thank my hon. and learned Friend for that answer. May I ask whether he has ever calculated the amount of time spent by advocates-depute in preparing cases and attending at the High Court for trials that do not take place owing to last-minute pleas of guilty? Is he satisfied that the procedure cannot be altered, where appropriate, so that pleas of guilty can be heard at an earlier stage, thereby saving the time of advocates-depute and public money?

I cannot make detailed calculations on this, but a great deal of time is wasted. In view of the timetables introduced by the Criminal Justice (Scotland) Act, giving 29 clear days from the time that the indictment has to be served for the trial, there are considerable opportunities for those instructed for the defence to look into the matter and to take their client's instructions and, if they want to, as my noble and learned Friend the Lord Advocate has made clear, discuss the case with the prosecution.

Has the Solicitor-General noted the recent Appeal Court decision that allowed, or upheld, an extension of the 110-day rule when the extension was required because the Crown had taken a calculated risk, as it was described, by putting down the trial right at the end of the 110-day period? Is that a practice of which the Solicitor-General approves? Does it reflect difficulties in the administration and a shortage of advocates-depute, and does the hon. and learned Gentleman share the widespread concern that this decision has undermined safeguards surrounding the 110-day rule put into the Criminal Justice (Scotland) Act?

I am not concerned about that. If the hon. Gentleman cares to read what the Lord Justice-General had to say about it, he will see that he said that the critical factor was the expected duration of the case ahead of the one that went on appeal. That was expected to last for one and a half days, but lasted for five. In those circumstances, the Lord Justice-General made it clear that there had been no lack of due diligence on the part of the prosecution and accordingly allowed the case. It is our intention, as far as possible, always to temper the 110-day rule. If the hon. Gentleman looks through the judgment, he will see that the Lord Justice-General made it clear that only in exceptional circumstances would extension be permitted.

I appreciate that a convicted prisoner charged with another offence is not covered by the 110-day rule. However, will the Solicitor-General accept that for the prisoner awaiting trial in those circumstances, when 110 days have long since passed and he has not been brought to trial, it is a difficult time? The prisoner is entitled to justice as much as anybody else, as he is innocent of the charge until proved guilty.

The 110-day rule in Scotland means that we have a tighter timetable to bring people to trial in criminal prosecutions than anywhere else in the world. It is only in exceptional circumstances that any extension is allowed. Apart from the 110-day rule, as hon. Members will know, the other timetable provisions of the Criminal Justice (Scotland) Act make it even more difficult for the Crown to step out of the timetable.

asked the Solicitor-General for Scotland how many criminal prosecutions were awaiting trial in Scotland at the latest available date.

On 22 April 1983 there were 21,592 criminal trials pending.

I thank my hon. and learned Friend for that reply. Does he agree, in the light of the reply that he gave to an earlier question, that there is deep concern about this matter, because if justice is to be seen to be done, it is in the interests of justice that people are brought to trial quickly, and that this is not helped by those who change their plea when they appear, having held up the court proceedings and brought people, at great cost, to answer trial questions in trials that do not take place? What will be done about this?

This is a matter of considerable concern, as it wastes not only the time of the court but of witnesses, jurors and the police. A recent survey has shown that, on the day of the trial, in between 30 per cent. and 50 per cent. of cases there is a change to a plea of guilty. That is a high proportion and it is causing considerable difficulties. I can only repeat the invitation that my noble and learned Friend the Lord Advocate has already given, to the effect that if those acting for the defence wish to discuss cases with procurator fiscals before the trial diet, they are welcome to do so.

How do the figures for the number of those awaiting trial compare with those for 1979? Does the hon. and learned Gentleman agree that the figures would probable show a rising wave of crime in Scotland, which shows in turn that, despite the extra police powers and the extra policemen, the Government's policy on law and order in Scotland has failed?

I do not accept that. As to the powers to which the hon. Gentleman referred, he claimed that, once introduced, they would lead to a massive breakdown in the relationship between the police and the public in Scotland. As he knows, particularly in relation to the power of search, that has not happened, and the power has proved to be a valuable instrument used by the police in the protection of the public.

Is my hon. and learned Friend aware that, as many police forces have now been brought up to strength, a person can be charged for a second offence similar to the first one before the first one has been brought to trial, and that where this arises the law can be brought into disrepute? Will my hon. and learned Friend take special action to ensure that in such cases the first case is brought to trial as a matter of urgency?

Whenever someone is brought before the court for an offence and charged and convicted, if there has been earlier offence of the same character it is in the interests of everyone that that is known to the court when passing sentence.

asked the Solicitor-General for Scotland whether prosecutions are still being considered following complaints against consultants and specialists alleged to have been misappropriating equipment and other resources which are the property of the National Health Service for their own material gain within their private practice.

Yes, Sir. One such case is being considered by Crown counsel at present.

Is the Solicitor-General for Scotland aware that it is now over a year since I first raised the matter in the Scottish Grand Committee, and that six months have passed since I sent to the Lord Advocate prima facie evidence to the effect that five consultants within the Forth valley health board area had been breaking the law in this regard? Is it not a deplorable case of double standards, in that a hospital worker can be sacked for allegedly stealing a couple of apples from the hospital canteen while highly paid consultants seem to get away with stealing the equivalent of about £1,500 from the National Health Service?

I consider it wholly improper to make any comment on a case where investigations into alleged criminal activities are under way. It is clear that the hon. Gentleman does not have the same scruples. However, the matter has been considered by the procurator fiscal, who sent a lengthy report to Crown counsel, who are now considering it. I shall certainly advise the hon. Gentleman once a decision has been taken.

Will the hon. and learned Gentleman bring the House up to date about what is happening in the investigation into the irregularities being practised by some consultants in the Ayrshire and Arran health board area?

I do not understand the question. I wrote to the hon. Gentleman some six months ago giving him the decision by Crown counsel in that respect.

Order. I now propose to allow the two minutes extra that I promised earlier.

asked the Solicitor-General for Scotland whether he is satisfied with the present, staffing levels in the procurator fiscal service.

No. An increase in staffing levels is required and it is expected that legal staff will be increased by 2·5 per cent. in the year 1983–84 and other staff by 3 per cent.

Is the Solicitor-General for Scotland aware that certain district councils which have the statutory duty to organise the district courts are worried and disturbed by the habit of cancelling courts because the fiscal service cannot service them? That leads to disruption and to an extension of the time that accused persons have to wait for trial. Will the hon. and learned Gentleman look sympathetically at this problem to see whether anything can be done to help overcome the difficulties?

Yes, I am very much aware of the problems, particularly in Glasgow. Last Friday I went to Glasgow district court to see the difficulties for myself. The problems are that two administrations are trying to co-ordinate the system. This is certainly a difficulty, but I hope that as a result of the procurator fiscal at Glasgow working with the district councils, given their administrative problems, the worst problems will be resolved.

Is the Minister aware that many of these staffing problems in the procurator fiscal's office and in the sheriff courts go back to the Government's appalling handling of the Civil Service dispute two years ago? If it is all right for the Government to encourage district councils to appoint more people to deal with the sale of council houses, is it not time that we had an adequate number of civil servants to deal with the problems in those departments?

The problems that were caused by the strikes in the Scottish courts have now effectively passed through the system. However, there are difficulties in staffing levels and, as I have already said, there is to be a modest increase in the staff provided.