asked the Secretary of State for Wales what are the latest unadjusted figures for unemployment in (a) Newport, (b) Gwent and (c) Wales; what were the equivalent figures for 1979; and what has been the percentage increase in each case.

On 9 October 1986 the total numbers of unemployed claimants in the Newport travel-to-work area, Gwent and Wales were 12,833, 28,863 and 174,105 respectively. Unadjusted figures for 1979 are not available on a comparable basis.

Has the Welsh Office been notified that we are approaching the year of the homeless? Surely this is not the time to slash £2 million from Newport's housing budget, when there are 6,000 people on the waiting list and 3,000 families in urgent need. Why does the Secretary of State not put his back into a major housing drive which could do a lot of social good, besides taking thousands out of the dole queue? Perhaps he might then not have to fiddle the unemployment figures.

We have given substantially increased allocations to local authorities, and there will be a substantial increase in housing expenditure in the year ahead, I have also announced several other major new initiatives in Wales which will help to create a large number of new housing projects in the Principality.

Is it not a fact that there has also been some increase in the number of notified vacancies in the areas that my right hon. Friend mentioned in his answer?

Not only has there been an increase in the number of notified vacancies there has been a fall during the past year in the number of people who are unemployed. Allocations of Government factories in Wales are running at about 2·25 million sq ft, which is an all-time record, and the number of jobs being provided by regional selective assistance and regional development grants is also running at record levels.

As the Secretary of State continually comes here to Welsh Questions and whines about unemployment and his inability to get it down, might I suggest that he would be well advised to advise some industrialists to get on their bikes? Some industrialists on the south-east coast might show some initiative and come to Wales and the valleys. The Secretary of State talks about the 174,105 unemployed claimants in Wales, which is the fiddled figure. The Government have taken 18 steps to reduce the unemployment figure. The true figure is nearer 250,000. Is it not time that the Government started to tell industrialists to get on their bikes and come to Wales?

A large number of industrialists are doing just that, which is why we have attracted 20 per cent. of all inward investment into the United Kingdom during the past three years, why I can announce today that Celatose is proceeding with an expansion project at Pontllanfraith, which will help to create an additional 190 jobs, and why there is such splendid activity by the private sector through the Ogwr partnership trust, which, through its initiative, is creating some 946 jobs in the hon. Gentleman's constituency. One could go on with a series of other examples.

Does my right hon. Friend agree, and do the Opposition agree, that unemployment in Wales has come down by more than 6,000 during the past few months, and that that is due to my right hon. Friend, who travels around the world, trying to bring industries to south Wales where they employ labour? Is that not a credit to my right hon. Friend and to the industries that come to Wales and provide jobs?

I am glad that there are signs of improvements and that the unemployment figures are about 8,500 down on the same time last year. I believe that the major series of initiatives that we have announced in recent weeks will help to accelerate that process.

asked the Secretary of State for Wales if he has any plans to introduce quotas on sheep production in Wales; and if he will make a statement.

There are no plans to introduce sheep meat quotas in the Community.

I welcome those excellent figures, but does my right hon. Friend agree that farming faces one of its most uncertain prospects for years because of factors outside the Government's control? Will he consider introducing quotas on sheepmeat production to protect upland farmers from the lowland farmers who are going out of cereals? Will my right hon. Friend also assure us that there will be no swingeing cuts in the milk quota?

I can understand the great concern in the industry, and I raised the question of sheepmeat quotas in my speech to the NFU at Aberystwyth only a few weeks ago. The industry ought to be considering that matter, although the issues are complicated and we are still a long way from self-sufficiency in sheepmeat. It is right that the industry should be considering the possibilities.

I am sure the Secretary of State will agree that his Government virtually abolished the dairy industry when the quota system was introduced. If things remain as they are, will he introduce, not a quota system for sheep, but measures to get rid of the surpluses in intervention in the Community?

It is all very well asking us to get rid of surpluses within the Community, but it is wrong then to pretend to the electorate that that can be done without difficulty and pain. That approach is wholly dishonest. We have listened to the ideas put forward by the hon. Gentleman's party, but they offer no solution to the problems of the industry.

Does the right hon. Gentleman accept that unless we tackle the CAP comprehensively, other sectors of farming, such as those taken out of cereal growing, will turn to sheep and those lowland areas will have a terrific advantage over hill sheep farmers in Wales?

Clearly we must look at the problems of the CAP against the background that changes in any one commodity have results on others. We must be very careful to look at the knock-on effects.

Does my right hon. Friend accept that the small farmer is the backbone of agricultural life in Wales and that there needs to be positive discrimination in favour of the small farmer in any changes made in agriculture? As well as that positive discrimination in favour of the small farmer in whatever sector, we need to take a comprehensive view of agriculture, rather than each sector being viewed separately. That will overcome the uncertainty faced by agriculture.

The Government did favour the smaller producers when the milk quota system was introduced. However, the consequences must be fully thought through, because we must remember that there are many more small producers in Europe than in this country. The hon. Member for Brecon and Radnor (Mr. Livsey) has suggested that those producing 250,000 litres or less and those with financial difficulties should be entireley sustained in their businesses, but if we reduce production that will involve even more severe consequences for the medium-size and larger farmers. I hope that that is recognised and that people have worked out what a policy of maintaining support for smaller farmers will mean for agriculture generally.

In view of the relatively greater importance of the sheep industry to Wales than to other countries in the United Kingdom, why is the Secretary of State in the Chamber today and not representing Wales with British Agriculture Ministers at discussions in Brussels? Will he at last accept our criticism that he will not be taking seriously his responsibilities as the Welsh Minister of Agriculture until he goes there?

There is absolutely no doubt that the sheepmeat regime and the support for the sheep industry has been one of the great success stories. Indeed, the reason why my hon. Friend the Member for Clwyd, South-West (Mr. Harvey) asked the question was to express concern that if the success continues and the number of sheep increases, we shall over-produce. The hon. Gentleman should be congratulating us on the success of our sheepmeat support policies.

asked the Secretary of State for Wales how many new council houses he expects will be built in Wales in 1987–88.

No reliable estimates are available. Local authorities are free to determine their own priorities for housing investment within the resources available to them.

Does the Minister agree that the current level of council house building in Wales is abominably low? Bearing in mind that 40 per cent. of council house applicants are single people without other accommodation of a reasonable sort, will he tell us what specific measures he will take to ensure that accommodation is made available for single people and for young couples who are just embarking on their life together?

Local authorities are responsible for the matters that the hon. and learned Gentleman raises, but they are not the only public sector bodies responsible for housing provision. Public sector starts as a whole were 17 per cent. higher in 1985 than in 1984.

Does my hon. Friend accept that, from whatever Left-wing party it comes, merely throwing more taxpayers' money at the problem will never be the real answer? Is not, instead, the example of Cardiff city council, in partnership with a housing association and free enterprise finance, a classic example of the right way forward?

I agree entirely with my hon. Friend. Only last week I was pleased to announce an increase in provision of 22 per cent. to the Housing Corporation. In terms of throwing money at the public sector housing stock, I am pleased to say that we have increased gross provision for 1987–88 by 19 per cent., or a total of £154 million.

Surely the Minister must be aware that council house waiting lists are shooting up in Wales for the demographic reason that there is an increase in those in the 20 to 30-year-old group? Does he say that only housing associations should be involved? My city council, for example, will have no completions on the general list next year. Is that what the hon. Gentleman wants? Surely if he looks at the facts, he must avoid his ideological distaste for local authority housing and see a role for both local authorities and housing associations in providing general housing.

The question whether any local authority has any public sector housing starts in a given financial year depends on the priorities of that local authority.

Will my hon. Friend tell the House how many Welsh local authorities are selling land to private builders for the provision of starter homes, how many authorities are entering licensing or partnership schemes with private builders, and what the Welsh Office is doing to encourage more to do so?

Private sector starts rose by almost 30 per cent. in 1985, and we have seen an increase in the provision available for new housing in the Principality over the past year.

How on earth can the Minister expect local authorities to build houses when his Government refuse to give them the capital allocations to do that and refuse them permission to use the capital that they have from the sale of council houses? Is he not misleading the House when he says that there has been an increase of 17 per cent. in public housing—yes, up to 1,400 houses—when there were 4,000 in 1979 and 9,000 in 1975? Is that not a record to be ashamed of?

I do not know where the hon. Gentleman has been for the past week, because I have just given local authorities a huge increase in housing expenditure.

Is it not the case that housing allocations return the total only to 1984–85 levels and that Ministers are involved in an electoral ruse because Wales has a housing crisis for which the Government have no strategic answer whatever?

The hon. Gentleman forgets that in 1984–85 we made a special allocation to improve the private sector housing stock. That was a special allocation for one year only. I must point out that the allocations that we have made this year are equal to the level that we had in 1984–85.

asked the Secretary of State for Wales when he next hopes to meet the chairman of the Welsh Development Agency to discuss the agency's budget for 1987–88.

I am in regular contact with the chairman of the agency and I have already informed him that the level of resources likely to be available in 1987–88 is about £85 million, which is nearly 13 per cent. higher than the agency's estimated gross expenditure in the present financial year.

Does the Secretary of State realise that the budget for the WDA next year requires a much bigger input than the one he is suggesting, especially for land reclamation and factory building? Will he tell us whether the budget makes an assumption about the sale of properties by the WDA?

Every year we include an assumption about the sale of properties. In the current year that has been a realistic assumption. I have no reason to think that the estimates are unreal. I announced last Friday that we were making provision to increase the WDA's land reclamation budget by £4 million, which is some 30 per cent. up on the present year. When we are considering the expenditure by the WDA, we should also be considering the sums being made available for other parallel public bodies. I have just announced that substantial provision will be made available for the new Cardiff Bay Development Corporation.

Is my right hon. Friend aware of the feeling that the WDA could, and should, do more in the rest of Wales, such as is being done by Mid Wales Development in mid-Wales, to help the launching of small rural enterprises? That does not necessarily involve large sums of money, but it does require the sort of leadership that the WDA could give.

I have approved an additional £2·8 million expenditure by the agency in the present financial year. Of that sum, £1 million is tied to new activity, £500,000 for additional resources for the highly successful subsidised rural loan scheme, and £500,000 for factory building. There is no doubt that the new initiatives that the WDA is taking in that sector are being successful, and we are supporting the agency and seeing that it gets adequate provision for that.

Will the Secretary of State say what proportion of the WDA's budget he expects will be spent on agriculture-related projects? I am thinking particularly of food processing and the updating of abattoirs.

The agency has only just received the provisional indications and now, clearly, has to prepare its budget for the next year. The hon. Gentleman will be aware that the agency has been giving increased priority to the sector to which he refers. It has launched a number of initiatives in that area, such as the agri-food initiative. I have no doubt that it will make provision for that important sector.

Will my right hon. Friend report on the successful conference last Friday of the WDA's urban renewal unit in Cardiff?

We dealt with urban renewal throughout Wales, especially with some of the major projects being undertaken in the valleys. The conference covered the valleys initiative, the announcement of the garden festival and the work being done in north Wales. I also took the opportunity to announce the extremely exciting and important initiative for the redevelopment of south Cardiff around Cardiff bay.

The right hon. Gentleman has announced no bonanza. We know that the agency could easily spend an extra £20 million on derelict land clearance and advance factory building. Does he agree that there is a chasm between the City of London and the industrial areas of Wales, and that there is prejudice in the City against investment in the coalfields and steel areas? What is he doing to ensure that British venture capital companies provide finance for Wales? It is a fact that those venture capital companies provide only 2 per cent. in terms of the British total for Wales, yet we know that fraudsters are making a fast buck in the City. We believe that the right hon. Gentleman has failed to get venture capital for Wales.

As usual, the hon. Gentleman asked a series of questions. The 30 per cent. increase in land reclamation is, as it happens, exactly the figure that the hon. Gentleman requested for land reclamation in comments in the newspapers last week. There has been a substantial interest in Wales by the venture capital market in the past year or two and some very encouraging support, especially for initiatives led by the Welsh Development Agency. The venture capital market is showing that it is aware of the improved financial prospects in Wales. I believe that the initiative that I announced last Friday is by far the most substantial ever announced to encourage private investment in Wales. It opens up massive prospects for private investment in the Principality. I am astonished that the hon. Gentleman did not take the opportunity to wish that very important venture well.

asked the Secretary of State for Wales what are the general principles guiding his decisions on appeals against refusal of planning permission by local authorities in Wales.

It is a statutory requirement on local planning authorities, my right hon. Friend and his inspectors, to consider each case on its merits having regard to all material considerations and the provisions of the relevant development plans.

Is my hon. Friend aware that the apparently growing tendency by Welsh Office inspectors to overturn the decisions of planning authorities is making matters difficult for local authorities, which are trying, first, to limit the seemingly inexorable spread of retirement homes and, secondly, to stop amenity land of high value being encroached upon by speculative building?

I assure my hon. Friend that there has been no change of policy on retirement homes. Planning proposals for residential homes for the elderly are considered against the background of national and local policies. The planning authority has to demonstrate the relevance of those policies in each case and show how interests of acknowledged importance would be harmed. I am confident that inspectors consider the issues thoroughly and fairly.

One such case in which the Secretary of State has overruled the local authority in respect of planning permission is the openair market at Talbot Green. Does the hon. Gentleman accept that that overruling has led to bitter and sustained local opposition? In particular, does he agree that traffic, which is already heavy, will become chaotic when the market is working? Does he agree that the matter was considered insufficiently carefully by the inspector at the appeal? Does the hon. Gentleman feel any responsibility for the dislocation caused to the lives of the inahbitants of that area by this shoddy inquiry?

As I am sure the hon. Gentleman is aware, I cannot comment on individual planning applications. I am not aware of any shortcomings in the procedures which were followed in this case.

Can my hon. Friend define any differences in the approaches of local councils and of my right hon. Friend the Secretary of State and his inspectors in respect of planning decisions which, when made by a local authority, tend to reflect social and other pressures which may not fall strictly within the definition of planning? Do the inspectors not have to work solely on the basis of a planning consideration?

Our inspectors are obliged to take account of a variety of policy considerations and circulars when considering planning appeals.

Does the hon. Gentleman accept that there is general unease in the Principality about the number of planning permissions granted on appeal against the wishes of the planning authority originally concerned with the matter? This is not restricted to quality homes, but involves all sorts of developments by people who have no connection with the area that they seek to develop. With a view to bearing that point in mind, will the hon. Gentleman review the general principles involved and the instructions which he gives to inspectors on how they should decide appeals? Will he publish the results of any such review?

Inspectors are asked to take into account all relevant considerations and material planning circulars. From time to time we review individual aspects of planning law, and we shall continue to do so.

My question follows on from that of the hon. Member for Wrexham (Dr. Marek). Is my hon. Friend aware of the concern of many local authorities, including Delyn borough council, that the Welsh Office does not attach sufficient importance to adopted local and structure plans? Will my hon. Friend ensure in future that appeal decisions are founded on those local planning policies which represent the views of the areas that they cover?

I assure my hon. Friend that structure plans are one of the material factors that inspectors are obliged to take into account.

Is it not usually better to leave the decision-making to local people in these matters? For example, in Newport there is concern about the Secretary of State's guidelines, which have been responsible for the vetoing of an enforcement order on a scrapyard near to the new leisure centre, which will have to be relocated. Why is the Welsh Office not assisting Newport borough council in its drive for tourism, especially as the royal national eisteddfod is coming to Newport in 1988?

I welcome the fact that the eisteddfod is coming to Newport in 1988. However, the implication of the hon. Gentleman's question is that we should change the planning laws. We do not have any proposals to do that.

asked the Secretary of State for Wales what response his Department intends making to assist the victims of flood damage in (a) the Cynon Valley and (b) other parts of Wales.

County and district councils for the areas concerned have wide discretionary powers to alleviate the impact of emergencies such as flooding and to provide assistance to victims. I understand that the Cynon Valley borough council has already given financial aid to householders most affected by recent flooding in its area.

As the Secretary of State knows, the Cynon Valley has been identified as one of the four most deprived areas in the United Kingdom. Is he aware that householders in Cwmamam suffered severe loss through the flooding of their houses, sometimes to a depth of 6 ft? Is he further aware that some householders lost electrical equipment, furniture, carpets and personal possessions? Many of them were not insured for household contents because they were recovering from the miners' strike.

I have every sympathy with those who were affected by the floods of 18 November. I know that considerable damage was caused. However, the district council has wide powers to provide immediate assistance for the emergency and there are well-established procedures. If the sums involved are substantial, the council can come to the Government for assistance. Indeed, I received a letter today from the council seeking such assistance from us and from the European Community.

The Minister referred to the wide powers of local authorities. What is the point of local authorities having powers without the resources to help? Why does he not realise that and get out of that money-grooved frame of mind? It is not money that is required, but alterations to the infrastructure so that flooding does not occur. Is he aware that during the past three years, as a result of considerable flooding in the Rhondda—and it is no good the Under-Secretary of State smirking—hundreds of people have been flooded every time it has rained? What is desperately needed—and I have asked for this time and time again—is for the Welsh Office to convene a meeting of the local authorities, the Forestry Commission and large riparian owners so that they can together solve the problem of flooding in the south Wales valleys. Why does the Secretary of State not chair a conference to deal with the problem and come up with some ideas?

Major work has been undertaken in the valleys since the disastrous floods in 1981, and a great deal of improvement has been achieved. I am glad that on this occasion the flooding in the Rhondda was much less severe. Indeed, the worst floods were in the Cynon Valley. On the matter of resources, the threshold for assistance for the Cynon Valley borough council amounts to about £23,000. We are not dealing with enormous sums of money before the local authority can request central Government assistance. Responsibility lies with the local authority, and it is best qualified to decide whether assistance is required in a particular flooding incident.

Is the Minister aware that the recent heavy rainfall in south Wales has again resulted in movement of the mountain at Godre'r-graig Ystalyfera and the demolition of houses? What assistance can the local authorities expect to receive from the Department to enable them to assist people badly affected by that phenomenon?

As I have said, local authorities have wide powers to provide that kind of assistance and there are well-established rules, laid down by successive Governments, to provide for central Government assistance in major incidents in which the sums involved are very large.

asked the Secretary of State for Wales what representations he has received concerning the Government's proposals for leasehold reform following the Nugee report, as they affect Wales.

We have received six representations concerning these proposals.

Perhaps I may make it seven. Does the Under-Secretary of State recall writing to me some 12 months ago saying that he and his colleagues at the Welsh Office fully understood my constituents' concern about the activities of leasehold companies such as Castle Beg and Banana Bliss? Will he confirm that there is nothing in the Government's proposed legislation to tackle the abuses suffered by my constituents and others at the hands of such companies? Why have the Government taken no further action to enfranchise leaseholders and to give people greater rights of choice in nominating their own insurance companies? Is it too late for a change of mind?

I am pleased to inform the hon. Gentleman that the position has not changed since 30 June, when he said that he was grateful for my reply and that it was

"most encouraging to the people of south Wales."—[Official Report, 30 June 1986; Vol. 100, c. 682.]

asked the Secretary of State for Wales what proportion of his Department's expenditure for 1986–87 will be devoted to the needs of children under five years of age.

Direct provision for children under five is made only through voluntary sector grants. In the current year more than £1 million has been allocated to voluntary organisations in Wales concerned with the needs of children.

As the specific initiative for the under-fives through the voluntary sector in Wales was a year and a half behind that of the DHSS in England, as only £300,000 was allocated to the scheme in Wales compared with £6·5 million in England, and as the English scheme is due to taper out next March, what is the future for the Welsh funding?

We are only halfway through the initiative, which has a three-year term. We have allocated £300,000 to 119 projects in addition to the other moneys allocated to the under-fives. We have received no complaints that that is inadequate.

Will the Minister give an assurance that, in line with the recommendations to the British Paediatric Association from medical committees and other professional organisations, the standard of training in Wales for secondary care doctors in the community will be at least as high as that of hospital consultant paediatricians doing the same work?

That is a matter for the district health authorities concerned. They are aware of the development, which is a fairly new one, of consultant community paediatricians.

asked the Secretary of State for Wales if he is satisfied with the arrangements for the treatment of prisoners in Whitchurch hospital, Cardiff.

I am not aware of any reason to be dissatisfied with the medical and nursing treatment of patients at Whitchurch hospital, including prisoners. Security aspects of the treatment of prisoners are the ministerial responsibility of my right hon. Friend the Home Secretary.

As my hon. Friend knows, I am particularly concerned about the case of Hywel Rowlands, who was sentenced 14 months ago for killing his daughter and who, more recently, is alleged to have made threatening telephone calls to his wife from the hospital. Does my hon. Friend agree that it is not good enough for the Home Office merely to tell me that when Rowlands leaves the hospital during the day he is expected to say what time he will return? Will my hon. Friend, with the Home Office, increase the efforts to find a more appropriate place for Rowlands as quickly as possible?

I can assure my hon. Friend that my right hon. Friend the Home Secretary agrees that Rowlands should be transferred. That will be effected as soon as possible.

asked the Secretary of State for Wales what facilities are available in south Wales for heart surgery and treatment for young children; and if he will make a statement.

Limited facilities are available for the assessment and treatment of children at the University Hospital of Wales, and a new paediatric cardiac unit is planned. Funds have already been made available to appoint a paediatric cardiologist.

Does the Minister agree that it is imperative that work starts on the paediatric unit in Cardiff to alleviate the fear, worry and concern of parents whose children require heart operation after-care? Will he please tell me where the matter starts?

I agree with my hon. Friend. Detailed planning is well advanced. I expect work on the site to start in the autumn of 1987, with completion about the end of the following year.

asked the hon. Member for Wokingham, as representing the Church Commissioners, what contributions the commissioners intend to make in grants or loans to the proposed church urban fund set up by the General Synod.

"Faith in the City" recommended that the commissioners should contribute £1 million per annum for 10 years. The commissioners are giving sympathetic consideration to this proposal. In November, at the commissioners' request, the General Synod considered and gave general approval to the necessary legislation to allow the commissioners to give loans or grants to the fund.

Will my hon. Friend say whether some clergy will have lower stipends and emoluments as a result of this diversion of Church Commissioners' money to the church urban fund? Bearing in mind that, according to a poll published in a newspaper yesterday, 73 per cent. of those questioned said that they believed in God but only 11 per cent. of them said that they went to church, will some of that money go into the Church's own missionary effort in the inner cities to improve on that rather low figure?

In so far as any money that is spent by the Church Commissioners on anything other than pensions and stipends diminishes the funds available for that purpose, clearly this has that effect, but the Church Commissioners see it as a development of their historic role to help the clergy, especially in the poor parishes. It could perhaps he said, although I have no responsibility for the poll, that it might have an effect in those parts of the country to which this money is directed.

Do the commissioners accept that the country might pay more attention to the follow-up of "Faith in the City" if the Church moved its staff from one of the plushiest sites in the country to an inner city area?

I would need more notice of that than a supplementary question, but it is always possible that the expense of so doing would be greater than using existing plant, especially if, in the future, it will be possible to use it even more intensively.

Is my hon. Friend aware that the defeatist attitude of closing inner city urban churches is hardly the spirit in which the Apostles originally spread the word? Will he take it from me that if the clergy spent rather less time on inane sociology and more time on teaching the scriptures they might fill the churches again?

If I may say so, that is one of those generalities that it is easy to make. Perhaps my hon. Friend and I should say that we laity have a real responsibility in that matter as well.

asked the hon. Member for Wokingham, as representing the Church Commissioners, what information he has as to the number and proportion of clergy who are in receipt of family income supplement.

The commissioners do not have that information because it is a private matter between the person concerned and the DHSS.

In paying tribute to the DHSS, which certainly looks after some of the rather poor-off members of the clergy, may I ask my hon. Friend first to compile a list of those who really are in financial difficulty? I would have thought that that should be easy to do. Secondly, will he look again at the role of expenses and the very worrying fact that many expenses are no longer being met in full by the Church Commissioners? Will he encourage the Church Commissioners to pay those expenses, because all clergymen have an onerous task? They must spend much money on hospitality and on the other duties that they perform as clergymen and they should not have to pick up the tab for it.

Dealing first with expenses, I have already given my hon. Friend the figures in relation to incumbents. In respect of assistant curates, 16 per cent. of the expenses that they incurred overall have not been reimbursed. This is too high. This is essentially a parish matter and it is being followed vigorously by the Church Commissioners by way of precept and example, in the sense of leaflets and so on, of which I will gladly send my hon. Friend an example. On the first part of my hon. Friend's question, one hesitates to interfere in personal matters just because a man is an assistant curate. Since the greater weight and emphasis has been placed on the salaries of the lowest paid, with a 67 per cent. increase during the past five years, as opposed to a 51 per cent. increase for incumbents, it must have moved a considerable number of men out of the lower brackets in which FIS is payable.

Does the hon. Gentleman accept that no one in the House is asking him to collect information or to name the individuals in the Church who are poorly paid? But since the Government collect and collate FIS data according to industrial classification, will he ask for that information in relation to the Church and publish his findings?

Of course, I shall consider the hon. Gentleman's suggestion. The weighting given to increases for assistant curates in comparison with the better paid must mean that considerably fewer of them are eligible for FIS. He and I will welcome that trend.

asked the Secretary of State for Wales whether he has had any recent discussions with British Rail concerning the electrification of the Paddington to south Wales line; and if he will make a statement.

asked the Secretary of State for Wales when he last met the chairman of British Rail to discuss rail operations in south Wales.

My right hon. Friend last met the chairman on 25 November and discussed a number of issues with him, including electrification of the south Wales line.

The Minister, who is a fairly regular traveller on the Inter-City line from Paddington to south Wales, will have seen this magazine, which I have in my hand, issued by British Rail. In that magazine, he will see proposals for the electrification of the line from the north-east by the 1990s. When will we have the same for Wales?

British Rail takes the view—I share it, as will the hon. Gentleman and everyone else who travels on the Cardiff to Paddington line—that the present diesel-powered, high-speed trains provide a fast and effective service. Electrification would not improve line speeds. However, British Rail has planned line and stock improvements, which should reduce journey time still further.

Hon. Members on both sides of the House wish to ensure that the Channel tunnel does not harm Wales. If we are to gain from investment, surely that investment should be made now. I appeal to the Wwlsh Office to initiate discussions with British Rail to ensure that the potential benefits to Wales from the consruction and use of the Channel tunnel are maximised.

I assure the hon. Gentleman that lack of electrification of that line will not affect the use of the Channel tunnel. We expect the Channel tunnel to be of considerable benefit to us in Wales. The Welsh Office has been examining further ways of improving the connections between Wales and the tunnel. British Rail will soon hold a seminar to discuss the matter further.

asked the Secretary of State for Wales if he will make a statement on the Government's pilot teacher appraisal scheme.

My right hon. Friend the Secretary of State for Education and Science has invited six local education authorities in England to form a consortium to pilot teacher appraisal. The findings of the pilot project will be made available to every authority in England and Wales.

Why will Wales not be represented in the pilot teacher appraisal scheme? Two local education authorities, Clwyd and Dyfed, applied to be included. Is it not essential that Wales be represented in view of the unique feature of Welsh education—teaching in the Welsh medium—and so as not to halt the progress already made in Wales into researching the practices and procedures of appraisal?

There is no particular advantage to the Welsh authorities participating in this project, especially when we shall get the results. It would mean diverting education support grant from other uniquely Welsh purposes for the purposes of this project. When we consulted the Welsh Joint Education Committee about the use of the education support grant next year, no request for a teaching appraisal pilot project in Wales was made to us.

The Minister has given a waffling reply. Can he tell us why he failed to stand his corner?

I am well aware that two Welsh authorities, on a mistaken assumption, did apply to take part in this pilot project. The hon. Gentleman well knows that, because it was explained to him in a written answer on 17 November. He is well aware that the Welsh authorities would not qualify for education support grant from the Department of Education and Science.

asked the Secretary of State for Wales if he will make a statement on current farm incomes in Wales.

Total farming income in Wales this year is expected to rise substantially from last year's level, but to remain below the level of 1984.

I am sure that the Secretary of State is well aware that he has full responsibility for Welsh agriculture. Will he tell the House and the Welsh nation why he is not in Brussels today defending the rights of the Welsh farming community?

I am quite confident that the agricultural interests of this country, and they include those of Wales, are best defended by having single United Kingdom representation of agricultural interests in Europe. There are already, goodness knows, enough difficulties in arriving at sensible solutions to the problems of CAP when 12 countries are negotiating, without adding to the cacophony of voices sounding off in Brussels.

asked the Lord Privy Seal what information he has as to the number of official tours of the Palace of Westminster by (a) school parties and (b) others in each of the last five years; and if he has any plans to review the arrangements for such tours.

I will arrange for the figures to be published in the Official Report. The arrangements for the line of route were reviewed by the Accommodation and Administration Sub-Committee in February this year and previously in June 1985, when additional measures to reduce congestion were introduced.

I look forward to receiving those figures, but I am already fully aware of the increasing number of visitors to the Palace of Westminster. Does my right hon. Friend consider that the time has now come for perhaps a charge to be levied on all foreign tourist parties? [Hon. MEMBERS: "No!"] Alternatively, because this is a place of work, can we not reduce the number of tour tickets issued? We must get on with our work and even our constituents find it difficult to get into the House during the day.

I think that this is something which, in the first instance, should be considered by the Accommodation and Administration Sub-Committee. I am sure my hon. Friend realises that he has raised some fairly weighty issues of principle.

Will the Leader of the House assure us that none of those visitors have access to the logging equipment that logs hon. Members' telephone calls? Will he come to the House to make a statement about who has access to that logging equipment and in what circumstances?

I think that that is very wide of the question of tours, but I shall write to the hon. and learned Gentleman.

Will my right hon. Friend confirm that this is the British Parliament, and that people are entitled to tour it, but at the moment they have great difficulty in doing so because of the very long queues? Will my right hon. Friend consider whether, for example, two sets of checking equipment can be installed to halve the time that constituents spend in queues to see around their own Parliament?

My hon. Friend raises a point that I know is a cause of concern in all parts of the House. The Accommodation and Administration Sub-Committee is aware of these factors and my hon. Friend's point will certainly be drawn to its attention. The figures for last year show that 130,000 people went round Parliament with their Members of Parliament. That is a considerable increase over what was true hitherto.

Is the Leader of the House aware that most of us hope that he will ignore the ludicrous proposition put forward by his hon. Friend the Member for Leicester, East (Mr. Bruinvels), but hope that he will give serious consideration to the point made by his hon. Friend the Member for Rutland and Melton (Mr. Latham)? Many of our parties that come a long distance face great difficulties. They often start at 6.30 am and arrive before 11 am, but have to wait outside for long periods, often in the rain, because there is only one piece of screening equipment. Bearing in mind the security problems, will the Leader of the House prevail on the Committee to look at this matter yet again?

I would not disparage the points that have been made by my hon. Friend the Member for Leicester, East (Mr. Bruinvels). They are perfectly fair points, but I consider that they raise issues of principle. Of course the Accommodation and Administration Sub-Committee will look at this matter again. It is perfectly well aware of the difficulties and I would be misleading the House if I said that I thought there was a fairly easy way to overcome them.

asked the Lord Privy Seal if he will give consideration to moving Welsh Question Time to a Wednesday for a one-hour duration on a four-weekly cycle.

The rota for oral questions has been agreed through the usual channels. I have no proposal to alter it during this Session.

I think that my right hon. Friend, who was in his accustomed place earlier, might agree that today we have had a rather cramped run at Welsh Questions, which lasted for only 35 minutes. Does he accept that hon. Members from north and north-west Wales—most obviously my hon. Friend the Member for Ynys MÔn (Mr. Best)—have about the most difficult journey to get to the House for Question Time on a Monday? If he were able to accede to my suggestion, he would only be giving Welsh Question Time deserved parity with Scottish Question Time.

Many hon. Members who live just as far away from Westminster as is the Principality were proud to stand for election on the basis that they would come here and do a day's work on a Monday. I understand the point that my hon. Friend has just made about Welsh Question Time. It has not always been made in its present form, but it is something to be considered through the usual channels when there is an opportunity to reconsider the rota.

May I press the right hon. Gentleman further on extending Welsh Question Time to an hour? Today we managed to get only as far as question 14, and two questions were chopped and not dealt with properly. After all, the Secretary of State for Wales is responsible for education, health, employment, roads and local government in Wales. Given all the issues to which I have referred, we need more than 35 minutes to deal with them adequately.

That is something that might fall to be considered through the usual channels when the rota is being reconsidered.

Before any more time is given to Welsh Questions, and bearing in mind that there are only 36 hon. Members from Wales, will my right hon. Friend note that 84 hon. Members represent London constituencies? Should there not be a London Question Time before any more time is given to Wales?

As the metropolis, I think that London would wish to be more evidently integrated into the United Kingdom than almost any other part of the realm.

As well as considering the request that has just been made, will the right hon. Gentleman also consider allocating the hour that is given to Welsh Members on a Monday to the northern group of Members, who would willingly come along to put questions about their region, which, incidentally, has as many, if not more, problems as Wales?

The hon. Gentleman merely underlines how wise I was to be so unforthcoming to my hon. Friend the Member for Cardiff, North (Mr. Jones)

asked the Lord Privy Seal what information he has as to the use of car parking spaces marked for right hon. and hon. Members by others; and if he will make a statement.

I refer my hon. Friend to the reply that I gave on 17 November to his previous question. If he has any particular point in mind I will draw it to the attention of the Accommodation and Administration Sub-Committee.

I thank my right hon. Friend for his reply. Is he aware that at the Norman Shaw buildings the car parking spaces reserved for hon. Members are frequently used by an assortment of secretaries, research assistants and others and that often the cars do not even display the car parking badge? Does he not think that the white markings on the ground stating "Members only" should mean just that? If that is not the case, should not the markings be altered?

I shall of course draw my hon. Friend's specific points to the attention of the Accommodation and Administration Sub-Committee.

Will the right hon. Gentleman note that only 12 places for the disabled are reserved in Star Chamber Court, although more than 30 Members of the House and its staff are disabled? Will he therefore consider whether more spaces in the court should be reserved for the disabled, and what action can appropriately be taken against those hon. Members who persistently and selfishly insist on parking in the disabled parking spaces, although they suffer from no disability?

I take note of what the right hon. Gentleman says. I suggest that in the first instance he writes to the Accommodation and Administration Sub-Committee giving evidence of the inadequacy of the present arrangements for the disabled. I am sure that the Committee will wish to take that up.

asked the Lord Privy Seal what steps he has taken to ensure that there are no personnel employed whole-time or part-time by hon. Members who are associated with terrorist organisations.

It is not the practice to give detailed information about security matters.

Is the right hon. Gentleman aware that one of his hon. Friends, the hon. Member for Luton, North (Mr. Carlisle), employed as a research assistant in the House a Mr. Hoile, the former vice-chairman of the Federation of Conservative Students, who has reportedly been on armed patrol with the American-financed terrorists in Nicaragua? What steps does the right hon. Gentleman intend to take to ensure that there is no repetition of such disreputable practice?

The hon. Gentleman makes a number of comments that are quite unsubstantiated. They amount to mere innuendo. The sooner that the House moves away from argument by innuendo to argument by evidence, the better it will be for us all.