To ask the Secretary of State for Wales what is his policy on the future of community hospitals. [5208]

I can do no better than refer to the report "Community Hospitals Wales—The Future" which we published on 2 October.

I am grateful to the Minister for his suggestion that the Government attach significant importance to community hospitals. Will he undertake to provide additional funding for Dyfed Powys health authority, with special reference to the needs of mid-Wales as a whole and the Ceredigion and Mid-Wales NHS trust in particular? He should bear it in mind that unless he does, that trust will be placed a terrible position next year; it will have to choose between protecting the quality of the range of services currently available at the district general hospital and protecting the three community hospitals. Would not it be disastrous if the decision to close community hospitals was forced on the trust when we should be emphasising the availability of health services that are close to people in their own community?

After yesterday afternoon's experience, I had rather thought that the hon. Gentleman might have changed his focus to concentrate on my concern—trying to ensure adequate sight tests for referees north of the border.

I accept that problems involving hospital facilities and transport exist in mid-Wales and in rural communities throughout Wales, but will the Minister also look at the problems in the coal mining valleys of south Wales? People in the Rhondda face difficult transport problems when attempting to travel to general hospitals, and the area contains some of the highest morbidity rates in the United Kingdom. When will the Minister make money available for the second Rhondda hospital?

I think that the hon. Gentleman and I share common ground in wanting to ensure the best locally provided provision of health care, particularly in the Rhondda—we have discussed the subject before. Such issues have to be taken forward carefully as the new hospital at Ynys y Plwm is commissioned, in light of what could, or might, be provided at the Rhondda NHS trust.

To ask the Secretary of State for Wales if he will make a statement about recent projects relating to inward investment in Wales. [5209]

Wales is enjoying an exceptional year for inward investment.

I thank my right hon. Friend for that answer, which shows that we are part of the enterprise centre of Europe owing to the fact that we have sensible industrial relations, low corporate taxes, no minimum wage and an opt-out from the social chapter. Will my right hon. Friend confirm to Finnish industrialists that they are welcome in Wales even if Finnish nurses are not welcome in Hackney?

My hon. Friend is quite right. Investment from all over the world, and nurses of any origin, are welcome in Wales. He is right to say that the United Kingdom is now the enterprise centre of Europe. Wales is an important part of that enterprise centre, and it is a particularly attractive place to live and work. In light of that record, it is extraordinary that Opposition Members want to copy the labour market policies of continental Europe, which have left millions of people out of work.

The Secretary of State will know that one of the key drivers in attracting inward investment has been the Welsh Development Agency. All of us congratulate the agency on its great work. Is he also aware of the fears throughout south Wales that, because of the money needed to attract jobs to places such as Newport, jobs in some of the key land reclamation schemes in Wales are now on stop? In my constituency, at Coedely, such a scheme has been on stop for well over a year; in the constituency of my hon. Friend the Member for Cynon Valley (Mrs. Clwyd), a scheme at the former phurnacite plant is also on stop; and there are others in Merthyr and Treharris, for example. Will the Secretary of State ensure that those vital projects—some of which involve contaminated land—will be completed soon?

I join the hon. Gentleman in congratulating the agency. I believe that it will have several more pieces of good news about inward investment to announce before the end of the year. The agency's recent record is certainly a cause for congratulation.

Does the Secretary of State agree that home-grown industry and commerce in Wales should be allowed to regard themselves as at least equal partners with inward investment projects? Will he say some words of encouragement to the Development Board for Rural Wales, to ensure that it looks as closely at the development and expansion of indigenous businesses, which sometimes feel neglected, as it does at inward investment?

I agree that that is an important part of the role of the Development Board for Rural Wales, and of the Welsh Development Agency. In the past 10 years, payments of regional selective assistance to overseas-owned companies have totalled £213 million, and payments to UK-owned companies have totalled £215 million. We have, therefore, given much more assistance to UK-owned companies—including home-grown companies from Wales—than is often recognised. That assistance will continue, as will our small firms training schemes, small firms loan guarantee schemes and the SMART and SPUR—small firms merit award for research and technology and support for products under research—schemes, all of which help small businesses. The importance of encouraging indigenous enterprise is at the heart of the work of the development board and the WDA.

May I assure the Secretary of State of our continued support for the inward investment projects that he mentioned earlier? Is he aware, however, of increasing concern among existing and prospective employers about the growing skills shortage in Wales and the failure of the Welsh Office to ensure an adequate response?

Skills are critical in continuing to attract inward investment. That is one of the reasons why I attach such importance to modern apprenticeships, to which I directed additional resources last year. It is also why we are assisting the LG investment by helping to set up a semiconductor training centre in the vicinity of the investment. Much of the package of assistance for LG involves help with training. We have also asked further and higher education institutions to bear in mind the new industries that are coming into Wales when planning their courses over the next few years, so that they will be able to respond to the ever increasing demand for people in the ever growing high technology employment sector. I agree with the hon. Gentleman about the need for those measures; we are taking them.

To ask the Secretary of State for Wales if he will make it his policy to commemorate the 100th anniversary of the birth of Aneurin Bevan. [5210]

No.

That is surprising from a Minister who was born in Tredegar. He is aware that next year will be the centenary of the birth of Aneurin Bevan, the founder of our national health service and a great Welshman. Does he believe it would be a fitting tribute to Aneurin Bevan to rename the Neville Hall hospital in Abergavenny, which covers the old Ebbw Vale constituency, the Aneurin Bevan hospital, especially as that hospital was built with the pennies of Monmouthshire miners?

I am indebted to the former leader of the Labour party, Mr. Michael Foot, who many years ago gave me a biography of Aneurin Bevan, which he had written. The book revealed the deep and personal hostility of Herbert Morrison towards Bevan. It is interesting that, today, his grandson, as a Member of the House, may be behind the new disciplinary code for Labour Members that is to be adopted. It might be an interesting commemoration of the 100th anniversary of the birth of Aneurin Bevan if the hon. Member for Blaenau Gwent (Mr. Smith), who steadfastly follows the principles and policies of Aneurin Bevan, were to find himself deselected, as some believe may happen.

I am sure that the event will not go unnoticed by the media. Does my hon. Friend agree that the best commemorative contribution that the Opposition could make would be to match the pledge given by my right hon. Friend the Prime Minister to increase funding for the NHS year by year? Might their reluctance to do so be associated with the fact that the last savage cuts to be imposed on the NHS were imposed by the last Labour Government?

My right hon. Friend is absolutely right. He knows that most of the years that the national health service has been in existence have been years of Conservative government. The 50th anniversary of the NHS will be commemorated by the Government because we are very proud of our record on the national health service which, as my right hon. Friend says, we have added to with the pledge made by my right hon. Friend the Prime Minister. We are still waiting for the Opposition to match that pledge.

What a cheap and silly answer the Minister gave my hon. Friend the Member for Torfaen (Mr. Murphy). Would not an equally good way to commemorate the tremendous contribution that Nye Bevan made be to ensure that services in the communities that he represented, including Rhymney, were of the best? In that context, will Ministers read the Caerphilly commissioning team's report on community health services in the community of Rhymney and find how many of them are non-existent or very inadequate? Will not the best way for Ministers to commemorate the anniversary of Nye Bevan be for them to ensure that those services are brought up to the highest possible standards?

The hon. Gentleman has come to represent the valleys, whereas I am a child of the valleys. I can see the marked improvement that has taken place in the valleys of south Wales during the past 17 years of Conservative government; the hon. Gentleman should have been able to see it too.

As Aneurin Bevan was an architect of the welfare state, is it not outrageous that Wales should lag behind England in provision for disabled people, especially powered wheelchairs? In view of today's lobby of Parliament by disabled people, if the Welsh Office wants to be different from England in any direction, will it choose to be different by setting up a commission to ensure that disabled people have someone to fight on their behalf when they fight discrimination, and do not continue to miss out badly?

I am disappointed that the hon. Gentleman did not take the opportunity to welcome the coming into force today of the Disability Discrimination Act 1995. That is a marked step forward. Moreover, it is one in which my right hon. Friend the Secretary of State played a leading part, as has been recognised on both sides of the House. The matter to which the hon. Gentleman drew attention is under review.

Does the Minister accept that another way of commemorating Nye's life would be to ensure that we have a health service that responds to communities such as mine in Blaenau Gwent—Nye's home? It has some of the worst health problems in England and Wales—cancers, respiratory diseases and heart disease. If the Minister agrees, will he investigate the actions of Gwent health authority, which have resulted in a cut in the number of doctors serving communities such as Cwm, near Ebbw Vale?

The hon. Gentleman has never wavered in his support for the principles and policies of Aneurin Bevan. I may not agree with those policies, but I readily admit that he has always taken a principled stance on them—by contrast with so many on the Benches beside him. It will be very interesting to see where the new Bevan on those Benches comes from, given what we have learnt about future disciplinary action.

May I ask our blonde and blue-eyed—if not exactly Finnish—Secretary of State and his balding brown-eyed junior Minister responsible for health in Wales—

Order. Personal remarks like that do nothing to enhance the quality of our debates. Never mind personalities: get on with the policies.

We have passed not just the 50th anniversary of the Bill that set up the NHS; we are also within a year of the centenary of the birth of Aneurin Bevan—and of the founding of the Tredegar Medical Aid Society, whose ideas eventually led to the setting up of the NHS. Do the Secretary of State and his assistant agree that it is one of the ultimate ironies that the south Wales valleys, whose ideas gave rise to the origins of the NHS are, by common agreement, among the areas worst served by the NHS and by our social services? So, by the time the centenary of Nye Bevan comes along, would it not be a good idea to guarantee to the people of the south Wales valleys that their services will be at least equal to the best in the country?

That is clearly our objective. On a more personal note, I might add that my grandfather sat on the Tredegar Medical Aid Society committee. He would have been amazed to find, over the 50 years since the establishment of the NHS, that hospital admissions have increased fivefold and that the services that have developed are the envy of the world. As a supporter of the Conservative party, I am proud to know that most of the years of that success have been years of Conservative Governments.

To ask the Secretary of State for Wales what new proposals he has for improving the value for money achieved by Welsh NHS trusts. [5211]

The question of appropriate value for money will never be ignored by this Government.

What were the Government doing during the long series of calamities involving the South and East Wales Ambulance NHS trust—calamities of waste, mismanagement and financial chaos? The term "Dunkirk spirit" was given a new meaning by the organisation of a trip to Dunkirk to buy cheap alcohol on a day when all the shops were shut in France. Why have the culprits who have been sacked—including some indians, and some chiefs in the shape of executive directors—not included the non-executive directors, who were appointed for their financial genius and business acumen and who are still in place? Are not they the people who should be blamed?

I know that the hon. Gentleman likes to display his green credentials by recycling old news, but he is fearfully out of date. We acted a year ago; we required changes to be made. The chairman and chief executive have gone, the trust has been turned around, and I understand that it is now performing better than expected in its recovery plan.

To ask the Secretary of State for Wales how many representations he has received on a referendum for a Welsh Assembly; and if he will make a statement. [5212]

Three since the beginning of January.

While I fully respect Welsh public opinion because I believe that there is a slight edge in the opinion polls for this proposal, it was rejected by 4:1 originally. In view of the muddle, will my right hon. Friend explain to my untutored mind the policies of the various parties? Is not there every indication that both a referendum and an assembly would be a colossal waste of money?

My hon. Friend does not need much tutoring if he has worked that out already. An assembly would be a ridiculous and time-wasting distraction from the real job of continuing to attract new investment and more prosperity into Wales. It must be said that Opposition Members have been confused about this question: they were against such a referendum a few months ago and are now in favour of one. Their colleagues in Scotland were originally against one and were then in favour of one with two questions; they were then in favour of two referendums with one question and have now gone back to the policy before that.

Has the Secretary of State noticed the proportion of Conservative Members who do not represent Welsh constituencies who are asking questions this afternoon about constitutional change in Wales? Is it not the height of arrogance for the Secretary of State and the amen chorus behind him to tell us in Wales how we should govern our own country? Is that not a matter for the people of Wales to decide? If he and his colleagues behind him are so confident about their position, he should put it to the test and call a referendum now.

The hon. Gentleman should understand that this is a United Kingdom Parliament and my hon. Friends take part in the activities of the United Kingdom Parliament. Indeed, the hon. Gentleman and his hon. Friends often take advantage of their membership of a United Kingdom Parliament. It is hugely in the interests of Wales to be fully part of the United Kingdom. The last time the people of Wales were consulted about that matter in a referendum, they told the hon. Gentleman in no uncertain terms that they wanted to continue to be part of the United Kingdom and not to have a Welsh Assembly. After all,

"the trouble with a pre-legislation referendum is that it creates more questions than it answers."

Will my right hon. Friend give his latest estimate of how much a Welsh Assembly would cost the people of Wales? Will he comment on the effect on representation at Westminster if such an assembly were set up?

In its report earlier this year, the constitution unit pointed out the possible implications for Wales of setting up an assembly in terms of the loss of extra representation in this House, the possible loss of a seat in the Cabinet, and a possible change to the formula that brings higher public spending per head than in England. All those factors have brought tremendous benefits to Wales in recent decades and they should not be given up for the sake of a roomful of hot air.

I noticed with interest that the Secretary of State did not reply to the question about the cost of an assembly. Perhaps he is embarrassed by the figures and the fact that we now know that the top 10 quangos in Wales account for some £54 million a year in unnecessary and bureaucratic administrative costs.

The hon. Gentleman should not presume on the outcome of the next election. The last senior Welsh Labour Member of Parliament to do that in the previous Parliament is now living in Brussels. Any Government who propose to set up a Welsh Assembly should put it to a referendum, but they should do so after legislation has been passed, as was done in 1979, so that people can see the proposals that are being put before them. The hon. Gentleman himself has pointed out the trouble with a pre-legislative referendum. It is a pity that he has not stuck to his guns over that, rather than take orders from the Leader of the Opposition or the hon. Member for Hartlepool (Mr. Mandelson). On the last part of the hon. Gentleman's comments, I am allying myself with the hon. Member for Blaenau Gwent (Mr. Smith)—I am sorry to pick him out for special attention again this afternoon—because he said that, in a referendum, he would campaign for a No vote; I would be right there alongside him.

To ask the Secretary of State for Wales if he will make a statement on his proposals for the government of Wales. [5213]

We believe that the interests of Wales are best served by the direct representation provided in Westminster by hon. Members in this House and a Secretary of State in the United Kingdom Cabinet.

Does my right hon. Friend agree that by taking the Welsh Grand Committee round Wales, he is bringing the government of Wales closer to the people, whereas the Opposition's proposals for a devolved Welsh Parliament in Cardiff would lead to calls for a reduction in the number of Welsh Members of Parliament in this House, for the abolition of the post of Secretary of State for Wales, and for the differential in expenditure on the English and the Welsh people to be reduced?

My hon. Friend is right, especially when he points out the difficulties that may arise for expenditure if an assembly were established. That may be one of the reasons why the Opposition cannot match my commitment to increase health service spending in Wales over and above the rate of inflation each year of the next Parliament. Perhaps they have so many other spending plans that they cannot meet that promise, or perhaps they fear that an assembly would not be able to deliver on that promise. It is time that they told us which of those explanations is correct.

Does the Secretary of State understand that the Opposition are no longer prepared to allow Wales to continue to be governed by quangos—those entirely unrepresentative bodies largely filled by Tory placemen? The sooner most of them are swept away, the better. Those that are left should be directly accountable to a Welsh Assembly.

As the hon. Gentleman knows, there are clear procedures for appointing people to such bodies. I have recently announced our proposals in line with the Nolan recommendations, so that an independent element is included in the appointment of senior figures. As he also knows, all those bodies are accountable to this House, through me and my fellow Ministers. That is the way in which they should be held accountable. The hon. Gentleman's constituency is one of those that benefit most from all that has been achieved in Wales in the past few years, which I hope he will bear in mind.

Will the Secretary of State be prepared to meet representatives of local government soon, after he makes his Budget announcement? The 2.6 per cent. increase that has been broached is nothing like enough for local government in view of the statutory duties imposed on it, such as community care. The figure is really slightly more than 1 per cent. more, and will never provide the finance needed to run local government in Wales. Will the Secretary of State please keep an open mind when he examines the subject and meets people to discuss it?

That 2.6 per cent. increase represents £64 million of increased expenditure which the Welsh block will finance in local government in the coming year. I will certainly meet representatives of local government, and I am due to meet the Welsh consultative council on local government finance two weeks today, and will be able to hear its views.

To ask the Secretary of State for Wales if he will make a statement about the progress of urban regeneration in the towns and cities of south Wales. [5215]

A large number of public and private sector partnerships are contributing expertise and resources to assist regeneration in south Wales—with considerable success.

Regardless of the somewhat bilious question from the hon. Member for Ynys Môn (Mr. Jones), and as this is the first—and possibly the only—time that I have attended Welsh questions [HON. MEMBERS: "Hear, hear."], may I tell the House that I was a full partner of the city of Swansea to get inward investment in urban regeneration? Will my right hon. Friend tell the House what the Government are doing to publicise the amazing success of our urban regeneration programme? In the case of Cardiff bay, for example, we invested £350 million of Government money to get £500 million of private money. What is my right hon. Friend doing to publicise our success in Wales?

I thank my hon. Friend for asking that question because, in doing so, he calls attention to the Government's urban regeneration success. I know of his role in that process as a former chairman of the British Urban Regeneration Association and the close interest that he takes in such matters.

While every penny spent on urban regeneration partnership agreements is welcome, will the Minister acknowledge that local authorities in Wales will find it harder to participate in urban regeneration programmes this year because, of the money made available through the revenue support grant, once spending on police and community care is stripped away, the increase is only 1.6 per cent.—considerably less than the rate of inflation? Will the Minister find more money to promote further success for urban regeneration?

What an extraordinary claim by the hon. Gentleman on behalf of the local authorities. As part of redefining the relationship with local authorities, my right hon. Friend the Secretary of State has arranged for the strategic development scheme to be taken forward by local government. Therefore, this year local government has the opportunity to play an ever more central role in taking forward urban regeneration—I rather hoped that the hon. Gentleman would welcome that fact.

To ask the Secretary of State for Wales what representations he has received about the future development of Mynydd Mawr hospital and the funding of such development. [5216]

Letters have been received from the right hon. Gentleman; from Mr. Andrew Hayes, the prospective Conservative parliamentary candidate for Llanelli; Dyfed Powys health authority; and the Llanelli and Dinefwr national health service trust.

In view of that answer, I think that the Minister will appreciate the united support for a campaign to provide extra funds for the development of Mynydd Mawr hospital. Is he aware that the hon. Member for Clwyd. North-West (Mr. Richards) promised that approximately £3 million would be spent on the hospital's future development, but the Welsh Office seems to have reneged on that promise and is breaking faith with all the campaigners?

I am pleased that the right hon. Gentleman echoes the views of Mr. Andrew Hayes, the Conservative parliamentary candidate for his constituency. However, there is no question of reneging upon any promises.

Who is he?

For the hon. Gentleman's benefit, his name is Mr. Andrew Hayes.

To ask the Secretary of State for Wales if he will make a statement on the costs of motoring in rural areas. [5217]

The rural White Paper, "A Working Countryside for Wales", published in March this year, represented a wide-ranging review of the Government's policies that affect rural Wales, including transport. The cost of motoring in rural areas is, of course, one of the factors considered when attempting to strike the right balance between increasing mobility, encouraging economic development and protecting the environment.

Is my hon. Friend aware that, while the recent increase in petrol tax was not universally welcomed, the Liberal Democrats propose a carbon tax that would increase the price of a gallon of petrol by 20p? In the light of the new Lib-Lab pact, does that not mean a new threat to the rural way of life by the new brothers opposite?

My hon. Friend is aware that, from 1993, my right hon. and learned Friend the Chancellor of the Exchequer has made it clear that it is part of the Government's fuel duty strategy to arrange for there to be a 5 per cent. a year, on average, real terms increase in the price of fuel. That is a contribution to the balance to which I referred.

To ask the Secretary of State for Wales how many representations he has received on tax-raising powers for a Welsh Assembly; and if he will make a statement. [5218]

None.

Has my right hon. Friend considered the words of the hon. Member for Caerphilly (Mr. Davies), who says that a Welsh Assembly would not initially need tax-raising powers? Might that be a recognition that Wales would be enormously disadvantaged by losing a Cabinet Minister to argue its case at the Cabinet table? Indeed, it would be losing a UK Parliament representing the whole of the United Kingdom, which is therefore happy to allocate UK taxes to the people of Wales. In other words, a Welsh Assembly could be a financial disaster for Wales, forcing it to raise its own money within Wales. Is there a recognition by the hon. Member for Caerphilly that what he is suggesting would be disastrous for every taxpayer in Wales?

My hon. Friend is right. The words of the hon. Member for Caerphilly (Mr. Davies) have been shrouded in mystery, but I think that he has lifted some of the veil with his speculations this afternoon. A Welsh Assembly could certainly be disastrous financially for the governing of Wales. A tax-raising assembly would also be disastrous financially because it would be a major disincentive to further economic investment and increased prosperity in Wales. It is time for Opposition Members to clarify what they mean by not initially having tax-raising powers, by explaining whether they mean that it would have them after five years, 10 years or after another referendum. Would they have a Welsh version of the tartan tax? Why do they not propose having a referendum straight away so that the people of Wales can rule out an assembly?

In respect of finance for a Welsh Assembly, will the Secretary of State explain why his predecessor estimated a cost of the assembly that was three times the figure that he is putting forward? Did both right hon. Gentlemen employ the same group of teenage scribblers to estimate a figure, or did the current Secretary of State merely close his eye and pick a figure? In either instance, the cost that the right hon. Gentleman is putting forward, just as much as that of his predecessor, the right hon. Member for Wokingham (Mr. Redwood), is incredible.

It is hardly incredible because it is closely in line, after allowing for inflation, with the figures used by the Labour Government to cost their proposed assembly in the late 1970s. The figures that I have produced are for costing a different thing when set against the costing produced by my predecessor. I was solely concerned with costing the bureaucracy, the civil servants required and the space required to set up such an assembly. The basic cost of setting up such an assembly came to £52 million in the first year. Opposition Members have not been able to explain where they would get that money.

To ask the Secretary of State for Wales what recent representations he has received from the business community in relation to inward investment. [5219]

The business community in Wales is delighted with the record-breaking success we have enjoyed this year.

Will my right hon. Friend confirm that overseas investment in Wales has amounted to 75,000 jobs? Does he agree that those jobs, which have brought undoubted revival to Wales, will be at risk as a result of the burdens that will be introduced by over-regulation through the Welsh Assembly and, if a Labour Government ever came into being, by signing up to the social chapter and the minimum wage? Is that not a cruel trick on the people of Wales?

My hon. Friend is right. Seventy-five thousand people in Wales now work for overseas-owned companies, and, as was announced recently, many thousands more jobs are already in the pipeline. That has been instrumental in bringing unemployment in Wales—last month's figures show that it is down—below 100,000 for the first time in many years. We wish to continue that record, but it could not continue if this country were to sign up to a minimum wage, the social chapter and every other job-destroying measure advocated by the Labour party.

When the Secretary of State and his colleagues give vent to negative and carping criticism of the European Union, will they stop and consider that one of the major reasons why industrialists come to this country is that we are a launching pad for the European Union? The Secretary of State and his colleagues should stop and consider the damage that is done to Wales by their criticisms [Interruption.]

I have no doubt the hon. Member for Bolsover (Mr. Skinner) will have heard the hon. Gentleman's remarks, since he is sitting so close to him. The Government are fully committed to making a resounding success of our membership of Europe. It is a factor in bringing new jobs and new investment into this country. Access to a huge market and to the prospering market that we have in the United Kingdom certainly helps to bring inward investors in. There is no doubt about that whatever.

To ask the Attorney-General if he will make a statement about the current work of his office in applications for extradition. [5199]

Extradition is primarily a matter for the Home Office, but the Crown Prosecution Service is currently assisting in the implementation of extradition proceedings in respect of some 380 cases involving a substantial number of the 120 countries with which we have extradition arrangements.

In recalling to the House that the Government were instrumental in reforming the 1870 and 1967 legislation on extradition, may I ask my right hon. and learned Friend to assure the House that extradition law is important as a priority in his work as Attorney-General?

Yes, I can certainly give my hon. Friend that assurance, in relation to the great diversity of extradition cases, both inward and outward, seeking to bring people back to this country and assisting other countries to obtain extradition in proper cases, and in relation to cases in respect of the Republic of Ireland.

Like the Attorney-General, the Opposition are anxious that our extradition arrangements with Ireland work properly. Can he give an assurance that there is full co-operation between his office and that of his counterpart in Ireland, and that in individual cases we meet the requirement of the Irish courts?

I can indeed give the right hon. and learned Gentleman that assurance. He is well aware of the sensitivities in that difficult area, but I am able to assure him that there is a constructive working relationship between those for whom I am responsible and their counterparts in the Republic of Ireland.

To ask the Attorney-General if he will discuss the legal aspects of possible future changes to the laws on privacy with the Secretary of State for National Heritage. [5200]

The collective Government position was set out in their response to the report of the National Heritage Select Committee on privacy and media intrusion, published on 17 July 1995.

I thank my hon. and learned Friend for that answer. Will the Government look at this continuously, bearing in mind the sad hopelessness of the Press Complaints Commission? In view of the sensible suggestions made by—among others—Mrs. Norma Major in September about illegitimate intrusions into children's privacy and the family privacy of people in public life, should we not look again at the strict laws that exist in France and other countries to see whether we can possibly draft appropriate future legislation?

I am obliged to my hon. Friend, but he should not write off the Press Complaints Commission quite so speedily. We believe that, since the appointment of Lord Wakeham, we have the best chance in years for effective self-regulation. The commission has a lay majority and is independent of the industry. If we are to go the way of legislation, we need law that is clear, intelligible and enforceable, and, as our paper makes clear, we are not persuaded that we have been able to find such criminal offences. There was no unanimity that a civil tort should be introduced.

The Press Complaints Commission is a wash-out, and no one takes it seriously. Is it not of interest that the late President of France had a private relationship, out of which a child was born, but not until his dying days—when he clearly wanted it to be known—was that made public in the newspapers? It may be argued that public figures should be subject to press intrusion, but there is no justification for the private lives of individuals who are not involved in public life and are not engaged in criminality to be investigated by, and exposed in, the press, causing them embarrassment. They are not politicians, so why should they be subjected to such intrusion?

The duties of the Law Officers are many and various, but we are not responsible for what goes on in France, nor for French law. The law in each country reflects its culture and domestic attitudes. A number of criminal cases each year are launched on the back of investigative journalism. Investigative journalism plays an important part in disclosing wrongdoing and hypocrisy. Before we start to lay down the law, we should ensure that we do not do more harm than good.

Does my hon. and learned Friend realise that many people in the House and outside will find his answer bordering on the complacent? They thought that the White Paper response to a serious situation last year was wholly inadequate. Will he promise to think again, and even to convene a meeting of hon. Members who are concerned about this matter?

I am well aware of my hon. Friend's interest in this matter and of the Bill that he introduced, which exemplified the difficulties. With the greatest respect, I say that it was a disproportionate response to a particular problem. I will see to it that his comments are passed on to the Secretary of State for National Heritage, who is responsible for policy in this area.

To ask the Attorney-General what new plans he has to improve the financial accountability of his Department to Parliament. [5201]

The Treasury Solicitor's Department, which became an executive agency in April, has produced its first business plan for the year 1996–97 and will publish an annual report and accounts, in common with the Government property lawyers. The Crown Prosecution Service and the Serious Fraud Office already produce statutory reports.

Why did the bill for hospitality and promotion in the Attorney-General's Department and in the agencies increase this year by 10 per cent.?

I shall have to ask the hon. Gentleman to table a specific written question on a matter of that detail. If he does so, I will answer him.

Does my right hon. and learned Friend agree that, in his Department, as in all others, it is red tape that clogs speedy processes and makes financial accountability to the House so difficult? Will he congratulate Derbyshire police on having shown how they can process a juvenile shoplifter in under three and a quarter hours, when other far less efficient police forces are unable to do so in under three days?

My hon. and learned Friend raises an important point. To be fair to the other police forces, Derbyshire police showed that there had been a misunderstanding the previous Saturday when a journalist wandered into a police station in London, and was under the impression that it required 41 forms to cause a guilty juvenile shoplifter to be brought to court. That turned out to be wholly fictitious. The 41 forms were the total number of forms that could be used in that police station for any reason. To deal with a guilty plea of that nature requires five forms for an adult and an extra form for a juvenile. That point was helpfully brought out by my hon. and learned Friend and by the Derbyshire police.

Does the Attorney-General agree that the proper financial accountability of his Department will depend in part upon it being shown that the Crown Prosecution Service is able to provide good value for money? How can that be provided while swingeing cuts continue to be made in the number of lawyers who are employed by the CPS so that it is not able to deal with all the cases that come before it with due dispatch?

Uncharacteristically, the hon. and learned Gentleman is wide of the mark on the facts. He will realise, if he examines the matter, that there are currently more than 2,000 Crown prosecutors, which is double the number that there were when the CPS was established, and that that figure is not far short of the maximum. While the current budgets are demanding, they are also realistic and I am confident, given the work load that is coming forward for the CPS, that it has the resources to do the job.

To ask the Attorney-General how many people were employed in his Department in each of the past three years; and at what cost in current prices. [5202]

Total staff in the four departments for which the Attorney-General is responsible were 7,117 in the year 1995–96, at a cost of £184 million. In the previous two years the number of staff was 7,346 and 7,322 and costs at current prices were £179 million and £184 million respectively.

Will my hon. and learned Friend confirm that that seems to represent an improvement in productivity? Did any of his officials play any part in granting legal aid to the two young men of 19 to take their former schools to court with a view to suing them for damages for their lack of achievement? Should not the officials have looked at whether those young men worked hard at school and whether there is any explanation in that respect for their lack of achievement, or has my hon. and learned Friend no responsibility at all?

I can confidently acquit my officials of being involved in any such exercise. The allocation of legal aid is a matter for which the Lord Chancellor, not the Law Officers, has ministerial responsibility. All departments for which the Attorney-General is responsible show increased output, and that applies particularly to the Crown Prosecution Service, which we regularly visit at branch level. More lawyers at branch level are putting in more court appearances than ever before.

It is not surprising that, in the year that Asil Nadir was due to go before the court, the 7,000 people in the Department were incapable of keeping him in Britain. He was able to get out on a flight to Cyprus and has never been brought back. Is that not connected to the fact that this same Asil Nadir gave £440,000 of somebody else's money to the Tory party? The party will not disclose those funds, but as they were fraudulently obtained, we would expect the Attorney-General's Department and his 7,000 staff to see to it that Tory central office handed that money back to the shareholders and the customers.

The hon. Gentleman's question is shot through with error—unsurprisingly and as usual. The department responsible for the prosecution of Mr. Nadir was the Serious Fraud Office, which has a total complement of 170 out of the 7,000 plus staff in the Attorney-General's departments. What is more, Mr. Nadir was able to leave the country because he had been granted bail by the court, notwithstanding objections by the SFO and by counsel briefed on its behalf.

To ask the Attorney-General what representations he has recently received about prosecutions for racial harassment. [5205]

I frequently receive representations concerning the enforcement of the law relating to incitement to racial hatred. During 1996, to date, the Law Officers have received 10 applications for consent to prosecute for such offences. Nine have been granted, and one is under consideration.

My right hon. and learned Friend will be well aware of the campaign of hatred and intimidation waged by Hizb-ut-Tahrir on university campuses, which culminated in its, fortunately unsuccessful, attempt to close down the Jewish Society in Manchester. There is a feeling of surprise that that campaign has not yet resulted in one prosecution. Would my right hon. and learned Friend be willing to meet a deputation from the Union of Jewish Students to explain the position?

I am not sure that my hon. Friend is entirely right on his last point, because there was a prosecution related to HUT or to a very similar group of activists. However, I remind my hon. Friend that that prosecution was stopped on certain grounds by the trial judge. My hon. Friend may have noticed that the Committee of Vice-Chancellors and Principals has established a working group to consider what advice can be given to universities faced with groups that incite racial, religious or political hatred. If that assists the police in bringing cases to the Crown Prosecution Service, I assure him that those cases will be most carefully considered.